What sets the Gold->Gems price?

What sets the Gold->Gems price?

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Posted by: Lankybrit.4598

Lankybrit.4598

Hi,

I was able to get 112 gems for 10g a while back. Then, last time I did it, it was 106 gems for 10g. Now I look and would only get 96 gems for 10g.

What sets the price? Not just my buying history, right? Is it to do with the overall ratio of buying Gold with Gems vs Gems with Gold?

Thanks.

My Life in Tyria: http://lankygw2blog.blogspot.com/
Updated every Monday

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Posted by: Healix.5819

Healix.5819

The price is determined by the amount of gems in the pool. As more people trade gold for gems, the quantity reduces, causing the price to increase. As more people trade gems for gold, the quantity increases, causing the price to decrease.

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Posted by: Lankybrit.4598

Lankybrit.4598

The price is determined by the amount of gems in the pool. As more people trade gold for gems, the quantity reduces, causing the price to increase. As more people trade gems for gold, the quantity increases, causing the price to decrease.

Phew, I was worried it was just related to my own history, and gradually, I would get less and less. I guess I can continue playing

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Updated every Monday

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Posted by: tigirius.9014

tigirius.9014

The price is determined by the amount of gems in the pool. As more people trade gold for gems, the quantity reduces, causing the price to increase. As more people trade gems for gold, the quantity increases, causing the price to decrease.

Phew, I was worried it was just related to my own history, and gradually, I would get less and less. I guess I can continue playing

No but it’s a great way of seeing just how many people are trading gems for gold and kinda destroys the notion people have that this game is run on fairydust and cinnamon bark instead of hard earned cash.

I try to wait until 3 am server time on odd times of the weekdays it tends to drop then.

Balance Team: Please Fix Mine Toolbelt Positioning!

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Posted by: Astral Projections.7320

Astral Projections.7320

At the start of the game ANet set up 2 pools. One was a pool of gems and the other was gold. When people buy gems with gold they pull gems out of the gem pool and put gold into the gold pool. When they sell gems, they put gems into the gem pool and pull gold out of the gold pull. ANet’s computers keep price ratios between each pool, based on how many gems there are versus how much gold. When more people pull gems out, the price of gems rise and vice versa.

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Posted by: Azhure.1857

Azhure.1857

Supply and Demand.

Isle of Janthir Megaserver

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Posted by: Sakri.7234

Sakri.7234

Gem price is becoming intolerably high. Clearly Anet needs to tweak their algorithm so that you could get at least 15 gems with one gold. Beyond that, you need to be a super-rich tp player to be able to afford the gem store prices. And let’s not talk about using real money, as the $-to-gems ratio is even more absurd.

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Posted by: Steel Fenrir.2791

Steel Fenrir.2791

I’ve “convinced” people to buy gems one time, and just after 30 minutes, the price of gems → gold spiked, so conversely, the gold → gems probably dipped as an effect. That confirmed that it’s based on people buying and selling gems en masse.

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Posted by: Equinox.4968

Equinox.4968

Gem price is becoming intolerably high. Clearly Anet needs to tweak their algorithm so that you could get at least 15 gems with one gold. Beyond that, you need to be a super-rich tp player to be able to afford the gem store prices. And let’s not talk about using real money, as the $-to-gems ratio is even more absurd.

There is no “algorithm.” It’s solely based on supply and demand. The reason why gem prices are so high today is because everyone wants to get gems for “free” by buying them with gold rather than with real-world money. Thus, the supply of gems is steadily shrinking, since more people buy gems with gold rather than buy gold with gems.

If you want to actually lower the price of gems purchased with gold, then buy LOTS of gem cards or use your credit card to buy some through the in-game store. Then sell those gems for gold. That will put more gems into the game and lower prices all around. But you probably don’t want to do that, do you? You’d rather have someone else do that, since all you’d be getting out of the deal is gold, and even if you bought gems with the gold you earned from selling gems, you wouldn’t (by virtue of the exchange rate) get as many gems as you had originally purchased with real money. So good luck convincing everyone to buy gems with real money to reduce inflation. Unfortunately, that’s the only option I can think of that would accomplish anything. Anet has no influence over gem prices whatsoever, so the burden is on the players to change things.

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Posted by: Avascar.9237

Avascar.9237

What happens if… I buy 15,000 gems and convert them all to gold? What’s going to happen to the market?

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Posted by: Equinox.4968

Equinox.4968

What happens if… I buy 15,000 gems and convert them all to gold? What’s going to happen to the market?

The supply of gems would probably increase slightly (considering the vast number of gems out there) and thus the price of buying gems with gold would lower slightly.

Note that 15K gems isn’t really a lot in light of how many gems must be out there in total. You’d likely have to spend hundreds if not thousands of dollars in real money to really cheapen the price of gems bought by gold, and even then, the low prices would entice a lot of people to buy them while they’re cheap, thus forcing the price back up towards where it is now.

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Posted by: Sakri.7234

Sakri.7234

Gem price is becoming intolerably high. Clearly Anet needs to tweak their algorithm so that you could get at least 15 gems with one gold. Beyond that, you need to be a super-rich tp player to be able to afford the gem store prices. And let’s not talk about using real money, as the $-to-gems ratio is even more absurd.

There is no “algorithm.” It’s solely based on supply and demand. The reason why gem prices are so high today is because everyone wants to get gems for “free” by buying them with gold rather than with real-world money. Thus, the supply of gems is steadily shrinking, since more people buy gems with gold rather than buy gold with gems.

If you want to actually lower the price of gems purchased with gold, then buy LOTS of gem cards or use your credit card to buy some through the in-game store. Then sell those gems for gold. That will put more gems into the game and lower prices all around. But you probably don’t want to do that, do you? You’d rather have someone else do that, since all you’d be getting out of the deal is gold, and even if you bought gems with the gold you earned from selling gems, you wouldn’t (by virtue of the exchange rate) get as many gems as you had originally purchased with real money. So good luck convincing everyone to buy gems with real money to reduce inflation. Unfortunately, that’s the only option I can think of that would accomplish anything. Anet has no influence over gem prices whatsoever, so the burden is on the players to change things.

Anet could easily influence the price by adding more gems to the supply everytime gem price went higher than e.g. 15 gems per gold, which was the last time that they were reasonably affordable.

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Posted by: Piogre.2164

Piogre.2164

Beyond that, you need to be a super-rich tp player to be able to afford the gem store prices. And let’s not talk about using real money, as the $-to-gems ratio is even more absurd.

Really? Because I’m a weekend warrior who doesn’t farm all that much, has only ever lost money on the TP, but by saving my gold as I earn it I can easily afford to dump gold for gems for stuff on occasion…

[VIG], SoR
Main: Asuran Engineer — Alt 80’s Ra-T-M-G-El-N-W-En-En-Re-Ra
Doctorate in Applied Jumping

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Posted by: Xiahou Mao.9701

Xiahou Mao.9701

Anet could easily influence the price by adding more gems to the supply everytime gem price went higher than e.g. 15 gems per gold, which was the last time that they were reasonably affordable.

Why should they? What do they gain from that?

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Posted by: Equinox.4968

Equinox.4968

Gem price is becoming intolerably high. Clearly Anet needs to tweak their algorithm so that you could get at least 15 gems with one gold. Beyond that, you need to be a super-rich tp player to be able to afford the gem store prices. And let’s not talk about using real money, as the $-to-gems ratio is even more absurd.

There is no “algorithm.” It’s solely based on supply and demand. The reason why gem prices are so high today is because everyone wants to get gems for “free” by buying them with gold rather than with real-world money. Thus, the supply of gems is steadily shrinking, since more people buy gems with gold rather than buy gold with gems.

If you want to actually lower the price of gems purchased with gold, then buy LOTS of gem cards or use your credit card to buy some through the in-game store. Then sell those gems for gold. That will put more gems into the game and lower prices all around. But you probably don’t want to do that, do you? You’d rather have someone else do that, since all you’d be getting out of the deal is gold, and even if you bought gems with the gold you earned from selling gems, you wouldn’t (by virtue of the exchange rate) get as many gems as you had originally purchased with real money. So good luck convincing everyone to buy gems with real money to reduce inflation. Unfortunately, that’s the only option I can think of that would accomplish anything. Anet has no influence over gem prices whatsoever, so the burden is on the players to change things.

Anet could easily influence the price by adding more gems to the supply everytime gem price went higher than e.g. 15 gems per gold, which was the last time that they were reasonably affordable.

They won’t. Anet is deliberately leaving it a free market in the players’ hands. I’m pretty sure that John Smith, the resident Anet economist, said something to that effect on these forums some time in the past. Whether the gems are “affordable” or not isn’t Anet’s concern, and they’re not going to make them more “affordable”—they’re leaving the prices up to us. If people want to change things, they should do what I said above. Otherwise, the way things are going, the price of gems is going to keep increasing. That’s the end of the story, and I can virtually guarantee you they’re not going to intervene.

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Posted by: Becka Williams.4978

Becka Williams.4978

There’s no way they’re leaving the price up to us. There’s NO way for us to set the price we want to pay for gems. How can it be up to the free market?

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Posted by: Elothar.4382

Elothar.4382

There’s no way they’re leaving the price up to us. There’s NO way for us to set the price we want to pay for gems. How can it be up to the free market?

Individually, no, I cannot decide what the price for gems will be whether I be a seller or a buyer. But, as I make my buy/sell decisions at given prices, I am part of the “market.” The aggregate of all of our buy/sell decisions impacts the supply that sellers are willing to provide at any given price and the demand of buyers at any given price. So, individually we cannot, by ourselves, “set the price.” As an aggregate, though, we all set the price.

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Posted by: Wanderer.3248

Wanderer.3248

Gold is being “printed” by the game all the time – every time a monster or bag drops a few copper or silver.

I don’t know whether or not ANet also prints gems, or whether all gems are generated by players selling them for gold. Printing gems would be a good way to control gold price inflation (so the evidence would suggest that ANet isn’t printing gems).

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Posted by: laokoko.7403

laokoko.7403

I think they said something like it’s set by supply and demand, which is how many people want to buy gem with gold, and how many people want to buy gem with cash.

Which is probably just how much would max Anet’s profit to be honest.

many games use a similar system. They just don’t go through a trade exchange which have a heavy tax. I suppose it’ll give Anet more money instead of people selling gem themself with the tax.

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Posted by: Zaxares.5419

Zaxares.5419

What happens if… I buy 15,000 gems and convert them all to gold? What’s going to happen to the market?

The supply of gems would probably increase slightly (considering the vast number of gems out there) and thus the price of buying gems with gold would lower slightly.

Note that 15K gems isn’t really a lot in light of how many gems must be out there in total. You’d likely have to spend hundreds if not thousands of dollars in real money to really cheapen the price of gems bought by gold, and even then, the low prices would entice a lot of people to buy them while they’re cheap, thus forcing the price back up towards where it is now.

I remember there was a player on these forums once who used to spend cash on gems every month. One time he did a binge and bought up something like 20,000 gems and converted them all to gold. Apparently even that big an injection of gems didn’t even cause a twitch in the exchange rate. The velocity of gem-gold trades must be incredibly high.

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Posted by: Becka Williams.4978

Becka Williams.4978

There’s no way they’re leaving the price up to us. There’s NO way for us to set the price we want to pay for gems. How can it be up to the free market?

Individually, no, I cannot decide what the price for gems will be whether I be a seller or a buyer. But, as I make my buy/sell decisions at given prices, I am part of the “market.” The aggregate of all of our buy/sell decisions impacts the supply that sellers are willing to provide at any given price and the demand of buyers at any given price. So, individually we cannot, by ourselves, “set the price.” As an aggregate, though, we all set the price.

Sorry, no. Someone has to set the price in the first place. If you’re the only seller in town (And anet is) you can set whatever price you want. The gold to gems price is obviously manipulated, else why would it go up? Because the players want to pay more? No, it’s because it’s set to go up when demand is higher/there’s more gold in the economy (which is what I think the real answer is.) It’s hard to believe there’s more demand now than there was when the game started, and there were more players (and less gold).

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Posted by: laokoko.7403

laokoko.7403

There’s no way they’re leaving the price up to us. There’s NO way for us to set the price we want to pay for gems. How can it be up to the free market?

Individually, no, I cannot decide what the price for gems will be whether I be a seller or a buyer. But, as I make my buy/sell decisions at given prices, I am part of the “market.” The aggregate of all of our buy/sell decisions impacts the supply that sellers are willing to provide at any given price and the demand of buyers at any given price. So, individually we cannot, by ourselves, “set the price.” As an aggregate, though, we all set the price.

Sorry, no. Someone has to set the price in the first place. If you’re the only seller in town (And anet is) you can set whatever price you want. The gold to gems price is obviously manipulated, else why would it go up? Because the players want to pay more? No, it’s because it’s set to go up when demand is higher/there’s more gold in the economy (which is what I think the real answer is.) It’s hard to believe there’s more demand now than there was when the game started, and there were more players (and less gold).

the price probably resembles what would max Anet price anyway. For example a high exchange could also mean people spending less real life cash, since they get more money for cash spend.

obviously with 100 million US dollar involved(GW2’s anual sales), I’m sure Anet is paying close attention to it.

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Posted by: Woljnir.7810

Woljnir.7810

I remember the good old days. I got a total makeover kit, 350 gems, for 6g. I forget when those came out. Anyway, after deals like that it’s tough to convert to gems anymore. I’ll spend real money when I feel like something is really sweet, and don’t mind supporting the game here and there, but gold->gem exchange is just a disaster anymore. But that benefits Anet in the end, doesn’t it xD.

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Posted by: Equinox.4968

Equinox.4968

What happens if… I buy 15,000 gems and convert them all to gold? What’s going to happen to the market?

The supply of gems would probably increase slightly (considering the vast number of gems out there) and thus the price of buying gems with gold would lower slightly.

Note that 15K gems isn’t really a lot in light of how many gems must be out there in total. You’d likely have to spend hundreds if not thousands of dollars in real money to really cheapen the price of gems bought by gold, and even then, the low prices would entice a lot of people to buy them while they’re cheap, thus forcing the price back up towards where it is now.

I remember there was a player on these forums once who used to spend cash on gems every month. One time he did a binge and bought up something like 20,000 gems and converted them all to gold. Apparently even that big an injection of gems didn’t even cause a twitch in the exchange rate. The velocity of gem-gold trades must be incredibly high.

Maybe 2 million gems might affect the market in a noticeable way, but considering that most things on the gemstore that people buy often are between 800 and 1000 gems each, 20K is about 20 peoples’ worth of expenditures. So yes, you’d need a lot more than that.

Sorry, no. Someone has to set the price in the first place. If you’re the only seller in town (And anet is) you can set whatever price you want. The gold to gems price is obviously manipulated, else why would it go up? Because the players want to pay more? No, it’s because it’s set to go up when demand is higher/there’s more gold in the economy (which is what I think the real answer is.) It’s hard to believe there’s more demand now than there was when the game started, and there were more players (and less gold).

Anet isn’t the only seller in town. The only gems they “sold” were the ones injected into the market when things first got started out. Since then, gems DO NOT EXIST IN THE GAME except where people buy them with real money or earn them through achievements. Anet has NO CONTROL over the supply of gems, and hasn’t had any control since launch. They don’t add or remove gems from the overall supply, and only we can create gems. If nobody ever bought a gem card or used a credit card on the TP ever again, and nobody got the 400-gem achievement reward ever again, there simply would be no more gems. Gem supply is ENTIRELY controlled by players/consumers. We determine how many gems are out there by buying/earning them and thereby creating them, and there is no other source for them outside of such actions.

The only “manipulation” that’s going on is that the rate at which people put gems into the market by buying them with real money and selling them for gold is somewhat lower than the rate at which people buy gems with gold. The other factor is that the gems to gold rate and the gold to gems rate have a “tax” involved. If you buy gems with real money, sell them to get gold, and then use that gold to buy gems, you’ll have fewer gems than you started with. Right now, the price of gems bought with gold is about 9.5 gold per 100 gems. The price of gold bought with gems is about 7 gold per 100 gems. See what I mean? It’s never going to be “you sell 100 gems for 10 gold” and “you buy 10 gold with 100 gems,” the system was set up so that you’ll never see a profit or an equal exchange rate. But that rate hasn’t been changed since launch—the system is exactly the same now as it was then, and unless a dev or John Smith confirms there were changes (and I highly, highly doubt they’d make such a statement), the fact of the matter is that it really is in our hands, and Anet hasn’t touched the market, and never will.

EDIT: I happened to find a statement by one of the devs:

ArenaNet will set the initial exchange rate for gems to gold when the servers first open for headstart, but after that the rate will fluctuate based on supply and demand of the players using the Currency Exchange. The gems and gold players get from the Currency Exchange are supplied by other players, not ArenaNet. As supply of gems goes up, the price will go down and vice versa. While we do not expect prices to fluctuate wildly, smart traders will be able to get good deals by watching the exchange rate closely and waiting for it to favor gems or gold, whichever they are looking to purchase.)”

(edited by Equinox.4968)

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Posted by: thaooo.5320

thaooo.5320

“gems in the pool”?

Sorry to the break the news to you.

The ‘gems’ are a fictional/virtual currency which does not have, and will never have, any kind of tangible quantity associated with its existence.

The ‘gems’ are infinite.

The ‘gems’ will never run out.

The ‘gems’ will never be in low supply, or high demand.

“Gems” and the stories they told you surrounding their incarnation are nothing but a marketing ploy.


But I’ll have some fun.

Lets entertain the notion that ‘gems’ DO have a limited quantity.

Even if they do have a limited quantity in existence at any given time, the quantity is a virtual figure. And an irrelevant and useless and meaningless one at that.

This virtual figure is nothing more than a number in a text box which can be edited by the company at any time.

Even if ‘supply’ of this virtual and invisible resource miraculously hits 0, do you think the company controlling their very existence would sit there and say “sorry, we have no more gems to sell! We can’t take your money!”

No. They would manipulate (increase) the non existent quantity, and business continues as usual.


As for the cost of gems?

It was a well thought out marketing ploy.

Start them out cheap, to get people used to their existence and role within the game. And as time goes on, slowly make them more expensive, until their cost becomes grossly unrealistic in terms of playing for/earning them.

A scare/intimidation tactic.

“Why play for countless hours to generate 70 gold for 800 gems for skin or quality of life improvement you want, when you can give us $10 and receive it instantly?”

Marketing. Marketing. Marketing.

ALL IS VAIN.
PvP modes are the “endgame” in all MMOs.
Stop failing at PvE, and fix WvW/SPvP. Thank you.

(edited by thaooo.5320)

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Posted by: Equinox.4968

Equinox.4968

“gems in the pool”?

Sorry the break the news to you.

The ‘gems’ are a fictional/virtual currency which does not have, and will never have, any kind of tangible quantity associated with its existence.

The ‘gems’ are infinite.

No. Read the dev statement listed above. Gems are NOT infinite, we create them—and we’re the only source through which they can be created.

Even if they do have a limited quantity in existence at any given time, the quantity is a virtual figure.

This virtual figure is nothing more than a number in a text box which can be edited by the company at any time.

Even if ‘supply’ of this virtual and invisible resource miraculously hits 0, do you think the company controlling their very existence would sit there and say “sorry, we have no more gems to sell! We can’t take your money!”

Anet could inject gems into the market. But will they? I severely doubt it. Instead, they’ll leave it to us players to buy gems with real money and create more gems to put into the market. They WILL take our money—indeed, real money is the only way that gems can be created, aside from the paltry 400 gems per 10000 achievement points. They’re not selling gems, they’re selling us the means of creating gems. THE GEMS DO NOT EXIST UNTIL WE BUY THEM WITH REAL MONEY. This is a simple fact, and I don’t care if you believe it or not, but the devs have explicitly said so, and there is nothing that creates gems outside of gem cards, credit card purchases on the TP, and AP rewards. Period.

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Posted by: thaooo.5320

thaooo.5320

“gems in the pool”?

Sorry the break the news to you.

The ‘gems’ are a fictional/virtual currency which does not have, and will never have, any kind of tangible quantity associated with its existence.

The ‘gems’ are infinite.

No. Read the dev statement listed above. Gems are NOT infinite, we create them—and we’re the only source through which they can be created.

Even if they do have a limited quantity in existence at any given time, the quantity is a virtual figure.

This virtual figure is nothing more than a number in a text box which can be edited by the company at any time.

Even if ‘supply’ of this virtual and invisible resource miraculously hits 0, do you think the company controlling their very existence would sit there and say “sorry, we have no more gems to sell! We can’t take your money!”

Anet could inject gems into the market. But will they? I severely doubt it. Instead, they’ll leave it to us players to buy gems with real money and create more gems to put into the market. They WILL take our money—indeed, real money is the only way that gems can be created, aside from the paltry 400 gems per 10000 achievement points. They’re not selling gems, they’re selling us the means of creating gems. THE GEMS DO NOT EXIST UNTIL WE BUY THEM WITH REAL MONEY. This is a simple fact, and I don’t care if you believe it or not, but the devs have explicitly said so, and there is nothing that creates gems outside of gem cards, credit card purchases on the TP, and AP rewards. Period.

Take a walk, get some fresh air, lose the naivety.

Then read the reality of my post again.

Do not let their marketing ploy trick you.

‘Gems’ could have 0 or 987133701337013370133701337013375423687458697412 next to its name. What does it mean?

Nothing. It is meaningless. There is no quantity, players do not make it, arena net do not make it. It is an infinite existence like outer space.

ALL IS VAIN.
PvP modes are the “endgame” in all MMOs.
Stop failing at PvE, and fix WvW/SPvP. Thank you.

(edited by thaooo.5320)

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Posted by: Equinox.4968

Equinox.4968

“gems in the pool”?

Sorry the break the news to you.

The ‘gems’ are a fictional/virtual currency which does not have, and will never have, any kind of tangible quantity associated with its existence.

The ‘gems’ are infinite.

No. Read the dev statement listed above. Gems are NOT infinite, we create them—and we’re the only source through which they can be created.

Even if they do have a limited quantity in existence at any given time, the quantity is a virtual figure.

This virtual figure is nothing more than a number in a text box which can be edited by the company at any time.

Even if ‘supply’ of this virtual and invisible resource miraculously hits 0, do you think the company controlling their very existence would sit there and say “sorry, we have no more gems to sell! We can’t take your money!”

Anet could inject gems into the market. But will they? I severely doubt it. Instead, they’ll leave it to us players to buy gems with real money and create more gems to put into the market. They WILL take our money—indeed, real money is the only way that gems can be created, aside from the paltry 400 gems per 10000 achievement points. They’re not selling gems, they’re selling us the means of creating gems. THE GEMS DO NOT EXIST UNTIL WE BUY THEM WITH REAL MONEY. This is a simple fact, and I don’t care if you believe it or not, but the devs have explicitly said so, and there is nothing that creates gems outside of gem cards, credit card purchases on the TP, and AP rewards. Period.

Take a walk, get some fresh air, lose the naivety.

Then read the reality of my post again.

Do not let their marketing ploy trick you.

It’s not a marketing ploy. It’s a system they’ve set up. If you don’t like it, go somewhere else and play some other game. They made their decision to make the gem supply entirely player-generated. They don’t fudge the numbers or interfere with the market. If the gold price of gems goes up—that’s on us. If it gets cheaper—that’s on us. You don’t have to buy gem cards, but if you do, that’s your decision. If you think gems purchased with gold are too expensive, that’s fine too.

Are gems a virtual currency? Absolutely. But Anet made the decision not to “print money.” They’ve decided to essentially make gems a physical currency, minted by gem cards rather than generated by the game itself. So it doesn’t matter what gems are, it’s how Anet decides they’re going to work that matters. If you think that the natural consequences of the actions of us players—namely buying more gems with gold than selling gems for gold—under this system is raising prices too much, you’re entitled to your opinion. But it’s not a “marketing ploy.” Gems are still perfectly purchaseable with gold, so long as you have enough to afford them. Feel free to take it or leave it.

But whatever you do, don’t ignore objective facts. The devs have specifically said that players create gems, and nothing else can. The way the market has worked since launch, it seems that they’re sticking with that statement. They’ve put the gem market in our hands, and even if gems are a virtual currency, they’re making this system different from any other system I know of that’s existed now or in the past.

EDIT: Consider precursors. Could Anet magically create thousands of precursors for us to buy? Absolutely. Will they? No, they decided that supply will be limited to what drops for us players. Same with gems. Precursors are no less of a virtual currency, yet like gems, they don’t exist until we players do something to create them—namely killing and looting enemies, or using the Mystic Forge. People have complained since day 1 that Anet is manipulating the drop rate, we can’t get precursors through non-RNG methods, etc. Don’t like it? Play another game. This one is the way it is.

(edited by Equinox.4968)

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Posted by: thaooo.5320

thaooo.5320

So it doesn’t matter what gems are, it’s how Anet decides they’re going to work that matters.

Yes! This! You understand that ‘gems’ are nothing but a word that a company created a story behind.

But as for there being a player/company controlled ‘market’ or ‘supply’ of these ‘gems’ is entirely up to you to believe in or break free of.

I added a small edit to my last 2 posts (I usually do, it’s a bad habit of hitting post before finishing).

Well actually they did manipulate precursor drop rates (not direct quantity, but their actions do affect quantity), they increased the drop chance for precursors by a very very very miniscule amount.

Precursors are an unfair comparison though. Precursors are equipment on a loot table with an impossible odd of rolling. The item serves many purposes, but currency is not one of them.

Gems are a currency used to purchase things, and serves no other purpose.

ALL IS VAIN.
PvP modes are the “endgame” in all MMOs.
Stop failing at PvE, and fix WvW/SPvP. Thank you.

(edited by thaooo.5320)

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Posted by: Lankybrit.4598

Lankybrit.4598

Wow. This sparked quite a bit of debate.

Anyway, the price seems very volatile, and fluctuates a lot. Fortunately, it was back up to 105 gems for 10g on Sunday, so I bought 40g worth.

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Posted by: Rauderi.8706

Rauderi.8706

I’m less concerned about the overall inflation and more concerned at the gulf between the highest sell and lowest buy prices. Those values should be a LOT closer together to make me feel I’m getting my money’s worth for my gems.

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Posted by: Algreg.3629

Algreg.3629

“gems in the pool”?

Sorry the break the news to you.

The ‘gems’ are a fictional/virtual currency which does not have, and will never have, any kind of tangible quantity associated with its existence.

The ‘gems’ are infinite.

No. Read the dev statement listed above. Gems are NOT infinite, we create them—and we’re the only source through which they can be created.

Even if they do have a limited quantity in existence at any given time, the quantity is a virtual figure.

This virtual figure is nothing more than a number in a text box which can be edited by the company at any time.

Even if ‘supply’ of this virtual and invisible resource miraculously hits 0, do you think the company controlling their very existence would sit there and say “sorry, we have no more gems to sell! We can’t take your money!”

Anet could inject gems into the market. But will they? I severely doubt it. Instead, they’ll leave it to us players to buy gems with real money and create more gems to put into the market. They WILL take our money—indeed, real money is the only way that gems can be created, aside from the paltry 400 gems per 10000 achievement points. They’re not selling gems, they’re selling us the means of creating gems. THE GEMS DO NOT EXIST UNTIL WE BUY THEM WITH REAL MONEY. This is a simple fact, and I don’t care if you believe it or not, but the devs have explicitly said so, and there is nothing that creates gems outside of gem cards, credit card purchases on the TP, and AP rewards. Period.

Take a walk, get some fresh air, lose the naivety.

Then read the reality of my post again.

Do not let their marketing ploy trick you.

‘Gems’ could have 0 or 987133701337013370133701337013375423687458697412 next to its name. What does it mean?

Nothing. It is meaningless. There is no quantity, players do not make it, arena net do not make it. It is an infinite existence like outer space.

Keep your condescendence to yourself as it is unfounded. You do not possess any special insight. Your whole point is the axiomatic assumption that anet could be manipulating gem prices/numbers. Yes, that is a possibility. But you are giving no indicator at all of that actually being the case. So, the assumption that the gem price is following the ratio of gem/gold pools is as viable as your claim. Which is based on the assumption that anet is an insincere, dishonest company being after its costumers money with false marketing/product description. Let´s forego the fact that claiming this in here is very probably not only breaking rules of conduct, but possibly also an actionable case of libel – it begs the question: If you harbor such deep mistrust for a company, why the heck are you using their product?

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Posted by: Astralporing.1957

Astralporing.1957

Which is based on the assumption that anet is an insincere, dishonest company being after its costumers money with false marketing/product description.

Actually, no. It is an assumption that Anet is a dumb company that voluntarily manipulates the system in order to lower their income.

As it is now (the gems you buy are the gems that were put into the pool by the players), every shop item bought is in fact bought with real-life money. This is true whether you bought gems with money, or whether you bought with gold gems that someone else obtained with money.
If Anet were to induce new gems to the pool in any significant quantities (quantity of gems from achievement rewards is not big enough to affect the exchange ratio), the above would no longer be the case. This in effect would lower income from gemshop.

Actions, not words.
Remember, remember, 15th of November

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Posted by: anzenketh.3759

anzenketh.3759

Anet could easily influence the price by adding more gems to the supply everytime gem price went higher than e.g. 15 gems per gold, which was the last time that they were reasonably affordable.

It has not risen that much. Currently 15 Gems cost 1 Gold 43 silver 15 copper. At the time of this writing.

The thing that likely sells the most is the Skins on the Gem store. That currently goes for 76g 40s 0c (800 Gems) at the time of this writing. I do think some things need a price adjustment however. Upgrade extractors, Black Lion Keys, Black Lion Salvage kits are a example in my opinion.

In Game: Storm Bluff Isle — Anzz, Anzenketh Kyoto

(edited by anzenketh.3759)

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Posted by: Nash.2681

Nash.2681

Well, I think there are three major issues with the gem prices and how buying / selling them affects the gold/gem ratio.

1. Spending gems for gem shop items don’t seem to refill the gem pool and thus lowering the prices. Instead it seems they simply vanish after being spent.

2. As in RL, the majority of gold is owned by a small percentage of players, either earned by massivly playing the TP or by a hilarious amount of luck leading to find several precursors. I’m talking about those ppl sitting on thousands of gold, not knowing what to spend it on. For them, gold to gem ratio is completly irrelevant since it doesnt matter if you have to pay 8, 10 or 12 gold for 100 gems. If they want some, they get some, thus rising the gold to gem ratio slowly but steady.

3. Gemstore prices are mostly completly nuts.
Example: 800 gems equal 10 €. Now let’s see what you get for that:
- additional character slot – fair deal imo
- full armor skins – outch, that’s pretty much on the edge, at least now they’re account-bound
- prices for single armor pieces, additional bag slots (since they’re still char-bound) several boosts, black lion keys, infinit gathering tools (though now account-bound still have to be handed from char to char which is anything but comfortable)- common, are you kidding me?!

What does this lead to? To me it seems, as if we got a little group that can buy anything from the gemstore by exchanging gold to gems at will (ironically most of those are the ones complaining most about the game, I assume) on the one side.
On the other side, we got the majority regular players (you know, those with a full time job, families, hobbies beside GW2) those who mainly still enjoy the game despite everything that could use some improvement and that will probably still stick with the game even though TESO and Wildstare got/get launchend, simply can’t keep up with the gold to gem prices and thus are forced to either spend real money if they find something pleasing in the store or bite the bullet, if they’re not willing to spend the gold they earned within a month or two for just one skin or a reasonable amount of black lion keys.

Yeah, gem shop items are totally optional, still it feels kinda frustrating that playing the game on a regular basis (let’s say 4 days a week for an average of 3-4 hours each; normal playing [this being considered leveling some Alts, doing some Dungeons and FotM (not speed running, just playing with friends), some guild activites, may be some WvW now and then) leaves you that much behind concerning comfot features and optical customization possibilities.

XMG U716 (i7 6700, 16GB DDR4@2133Mhz, GTX980m, Samsung 850Evo 250 GB, Seagate SSHD 500GB)

Leader of “Servants of Balance” [SoB], a small guild endemic to the FSP.

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Posted by: Sakri.7234

Sakri.7234

Yes, that was my point exactly. At the moment, the gold to gems ratio is affordable only to the super rich players. It used to be that even only a moderately-active player could convert gold to gems and buy some neat stuff from the store, but no more. The 1% have it now. Middle-class is dead in GW2.

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Posted by: mtpelion.4562

mtpelion.4562

As long as the average player prefers to convert gold into gems rather than buy gems and convert them to gold, the gold per gem price will tend in increase.

Once we reach the point where the average player goes either way, the gold per gem price will plateau.

If we reach the point where the average player prefers to spend real money on gems and converts gems into gold, the gold per gem price will decrease.

The fact that gold to gems is trending up in price indicates that the average player still prefers to trade gold for gems.

Server: Devona’s Rest

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Posted by: Lankybrit.4598

Lankybrit.4598

As long as the average player prefers to convert gold into gems rather than buy gems and convert them to gold, the gold per gem price will tend in increase.

Once we reach the point where the average player goes either way, the gold per gem price will plateau.

If we reach the point where the average player prefers to spend real money on gems and converts gems into gold, the gold per gem price will decrease.

The fact that gold to gems is trending up in price indicates that the average player still prefers to trade gold for gems.

There’s no trend. It was 106, then 96, now 105. Who know what it will be tonight?

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Posted by: mtpelion.4562

mtpelion.4562

There’s no trend. It was 106, then 96, now 105. Who know what it will be tonight?

http://www.gw2spidy.com/gem

Look at the long term graph…

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Posted by: Rauderi.8706

Rauderi.8706

As long as the average player prefers to convert gold into gems rather than buy gems and convert them to gold, the gold per gem price will tend in increase.

Once we reach the point where the average player goes either way, the gold per gem price will plateau.

If we reach the point where the average player prefers to spend real money on gems and converts gems into gold, the gold per gem price will decrease.

The fact that gold to gems is trending up in price indicates that the average player still prefers to trade gold for gems.

There’s no trend. It was 106, then 96, now 105. Who know what it will be tonight?

Considering it used to be 22s for 100, I’d say it was trending upward. Seems like a pretty safe investment, to be honest. :P

Many alts; handle it!
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Posted by: Lankybrit.4598

Lankybrit.4598

There’s no trend. It was 106, then 96, now 105. Who know what it will be tonight?

http://www.gw2spidy.com/gem

Look at the long term graph…

OK, But it seems to have stabilized and over the last month has been just moving up and down within a pretty narrow range. And yeah, I had no idea that gems used to be way cheaper.

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Posted by: mtpelion.4562

mtpelion.4562

It is definitely slowing down and may be in the “plateau” area now.

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Posted by: Shpongle.6025

Shpongle.6025

Next year it will be 1g = 1 gem

Are you Shpongled?

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Posted by: Lankybrit.4598

Lankybrit.4598

Next year it will be 1g = 1 gem

Anything less than 100 gems for 10g and I’m not buying. If everyone else does the same, the price will adjust back up. So, I expect it to stay in the 90-110 range.

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Posted by: Behellagh.1468

Behellagh.1468

It has nothing to do with how many gems or gold is “out there” among the general population. All that matters is the number of gems and amount of gold in the exchange. That’s it. A simple ratio between the two, nudged up and down 15% based on the direction of the exchange so gold is sunk twice.

Want gem shop items for free, then you are stuck driving the mechanism that raises the price for those that want gem shop items for free. Want to reverse the trend? Buy gems with cash and convert them to gold. It’s not rocket surgery.

We are heroes. This is what we do!

RIP City of Heroes

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Posted by: Lankybrit.4598

Lankybrit.4598

It has nothing to do with how many gems or gold is “out there” among the general population. All that matters is the number of gems and amount of gold in the exchange. That’s it. A simple ratio between the two, nudged up and down 15% based on the direction of the exchange so gold is sunk twice.

Want gem shop items for free, then you are stuck driving the mechanism that raises the price for those that want gem shop items for free. Want to reverse the trend? Buy gems with cash and convert them to gold. It’s not rocket surgery.

OK everyone. Listen up. There are some great items in the Gem Shop and you need them NOW! So get out your credit cards and start buying up Gems. You know you want to!!

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Posted by: laokoko.7403

laokoko.7403

It has nothing to do with how many gems or gold is “out there” among the general population. All that matters is the number of gems and amount of gold in the exchange. That’s it. A simple ratio between the two, nudged up and down 15% based on the direction of the exchange so gold is sunk twice.

Want gem shop items for free, then you are stuck driving the mechanism that raises the price for those that want gem shop items for free. Want to reverse the trend? Buy gems with cash and convert them to gold. It’s not rocket surgery.

I think that makes sense since if many people are converting gold to gems, they need to raise the price, so people’ll spend real life money. If the reverse happen, they need to lower the price, so people need to spend more real life cash for the amount of in game gold they want.

But the question is do you believe the number of gems being converted from real life cash to ingame gold = the number of gems being bought up by ingame gold?

The reality is there are 100 million US dollar a year at stack, and I think Anet do make sure they max their profit, so I’m not sure if that is the case, and there is no law say that have to be the case.

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Posted by: Behellagh.1468

Behellagh.1468

I don’t think that day where gold to gems and gems to gold will even out.

It’s because the “I want gem shop stuff for free” crowd is getting more and more frustrated that they can’t. This is why we have loads of threads about drop nerfs or how the TP is unfair or that ANet is directly ratcheting up the price. At some point they will start leaving in droves.

Ascended is too much of a grind to get. All the new shiny skins are at the Gem Shop and although this game doesn’t have a monthly fee, many players feel that they shouldn’t have to pay anything as if this was just another F2P MMO. Have they not ever played a F2P MMO? Don’t they realize that so much more of pain it is to have just about everything behind a paywall? They want the items and content of a P2P at the price of an F2P. Never going to happen.

We are heroes. This is what we do!

RIP City of Heroes

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Posted by: Wanderer.3248

Wanderer.3248

It is definitely slowing down and may be in the “plateau” area now.

Once the TP prices for all blues and greens are higher than the vendor prices it will slow down a lot.

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Posted by: Zaxares.5419

Zaxares.5419

The previous plateau was around the 7 – 8g range for 100 gems. Following the Apr 15th update, it briefly spiked up to more than 10g for 100 gems, but has since settled back down to 9g. It’s so far resisted falling back down below 9g, which suggests to me that there must be a lot of players buying gem store skins for their Wardrobe.