Guild Wars 2

The Silver Doubloon Debacle

THIS IS NOT A SUGGESTION THREAD!
Although I will post possible solutions to this supposed problem here, suggestions to change the functionality of silver doubloons should be posted in the Suggestion Forum found here: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions !

THIS IS NOT A FLAMING/COMPLAINING THREAD!
As many know, something is up here and we are here to discuss fact/opinions and opposing facts/opinions. Complaining alone is not constructive and attacking the way people play or what they discuss here will only further the problem. Posting facts and how you feel this affects players or the market in the long run goes a long way. Thanks for your discussion!

FOR OUR MODERATORS!
These threads have everything to do with Silver Doubloons and the supposed problem. Also, some are suggestions but the discussion still pertained to the problem or may lead to a possible solution. Please merge if you can and thank you!

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/crafting/Silver-Doubloons-4
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/crafting/Suggestion-to-fix-silver-doubloons-issue
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/crafting/Silver-Doubloons-is-this-for-real/page/3#post2963943
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/crafting/please-make-a-recipe-for-the-silver-doubloons
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/crafting/Silver-Doubloons-3
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/crafting/Silver-doubloons-2
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/crafting/Silver-Doubloons-Sort-it-out-Anet
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/crafting/Silver-Doubloons
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/crafting/Silver-Doubloons-hints-on-getting-them
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/crafting/Silver-Dubloon
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/crafting/Vial-of-Quicksilver-Recipe-Fix
This post will update any new threads which may come to light or have been missed.

OUTSIDE RESOURCES!
This is some information outside of the forums about silver doubloons.
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Silver_Doubloon
http://www.gw2spidy.com/item/24502

Please let me know if there are any other good resources out there on silver doubloons and I will add them!

WHAT ARE SILVER DOUBLOONS?
This is a general but very good question which needs to be answered in full so we as players have a base subject to work from. Silver Doubloons are part of the Doubloon Family which includes Copper, Silver, Gold, and Platinum and all are considered universal upgrade components. They, like all universal upgrade components, do not have an individual collection spot in your bank.

Silver Doubloon: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Silver_Doubloon
Use: Double-click to apply to an item with an unused upgrade slot.
Buff: +2% Boon Duration
Type: Doubloon
Rarity: Rare
Required Level: 20
Merchant value: 24 copper
Game chat link: [&AgG2XwAA]

WHAT IS IT USED FOR BESIDES APPLYING TO ITEMS? It is also a crafting ingredient.
Artificer:
(Crafting level) Item
(175) Minor Sigil of Luck: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Minor_Sigil_of_Luck
Jeweler:
(125) Gold Doubloon: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Gold_Doubloon
(400) Vial of Qucksilver(Quicksilver): http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Vial_of_Qucksilver
Leatherworker:
(125) Minor Rune of the Adventurer: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Minor_Rune_of_the_Adventurer
Tailor:
(50) Minor Rune of the Pirate: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Minor_Rune_of_the_Pirate
(150) Minor Rune of the Pirate: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Minor_Rune_of_the_Pirate

WHERE CAN I FIND OR FARM SILVER DOUBLOONS?
This is where it gets complicated, difficult, or tricky and probably why we have the thread to start with but this is what has been found so far.

Chests:
Any character level 20-39 can find them from any chest in the world including World Boss Chests, Jumping Puzzle Chests, Mob Guarded Chests found throughout the world, Guild Puzzle Chests, Dungeon Chests, and even Mini Dungeon Chests. These chests will drop 0-4 upgrade components and other items, weapons, and armor. However, level 21-35 characters experience better results to receive a Silver Doubloon, while level 20 and 36-39 rarely receive any Silver Doubloons. Any of these chests found in the level 20-39 map areas may reward a silver doubloon to higher leveled (level 40+) characters.
You cannot get them from any chest that appears on the right side of your screen in which you have to accept the reward such as your daily achievement chest.

Containers:
Containers are bags and sacks which can be opened to receive some random items. The containers can be farmed; however there is only a small chance to receive the item you are looking for. These bags can contain Silver Doubloons and any bag or sack that gives Copper AND Gold Doubloons have a chance to give Silver Doubloons. Some containers which have been proven to have Silver doubloons include:
Small Miner’s Bag: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Small_Miner%27s_Bag
Light Bag of Booty: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Light_Bag_of_Booty
Bag of Pilfered Goods: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Bag_of_Pilfered_Goods
Light Miner’s Bag: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Light_Miner%27s_Bag
Heavy Bag of Skritt Shinies: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Heavy_Bag_of_Skritt_Shinies
Please tell me if there are any others that should be added to this list!

Mystic Forge:
The Mystic Forge converts any four of the same type of item into an equivalent or one tier higher. Since Silver Doubloons are considered universal upgrade components, this means throwing four upgrade components of the same level or one tier lower may results in giving back a Silver Doubloon. (Note: Doubloons can only be put in the forge with this recipe: Copper + Silver + Gold + Platinum = Chance at a level 50 or higher upgrade component; they cannot be put in any other way for a result)
Marks, Pebbles, Pearls, and Nuggets can result in giving a Silver Doubloon. Any combination will work but four Pebbles will give the best results at a 5% chance.
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Gemstone
http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Universal_upgrade

THIS POST IS SPECIFICALLY FOR LISTING FORS AND AGAINSTS FOR CHANGING SILVER DOUBLOONS!
We will also use this post to add possible solutions which Anet can use to achieve a better in-game economy, player cooperation, and overall satisfaction of Silver Doubloons. If I miss anything or something seems biased or misinterpreted please let me know and I will do the best I can to change it. Thank you!

FORS:
*Silver Doubloon prices are driving lower upgrade components prices too high
*Silver Doubloons in general are much harder to farm or receive than other equivalent items
*Silver Doubloon supply is much too low
*Silver Doubloons have caused the Juggernaut to no longer be on par with all the other legendaries
*Silver Doubloons are time consuming
*Players should not have to use alts to achieve Silver Doubloons
*Increasing Silver Doubloon prices hurting player moral
*Silver Doubloons are not end game or level 80 material so therefore should be changed to something else

AGAINSTS:
*Silver Doubloon prices are improving the economy
*Lower level players can profit off the market because of Silver Doubloons
*Silver Doubloons are easy to farm if you know how to do it
*Charged Lodestones are more expensive so should all expensive things be cheaper?
*Reducing Silver Doubloon prices hurts my way of playing

SOLUTIONS:
*Add loot drops of just Silver Doubloons
*Transmog Copper Doubloons into Silver Doubloons
*Change it from Silver Doubloons to Platinum Doubloons
*Lower the amount needed to make the Vial of Qucksilver(Quicksilver)
*Make all Doubloons forgeable with all the other upgrade components
*Add more level 20-39 chests to the world
*Add chests to the jumping puzzles in Diessa Plateau
*Add Silver Doubloons to the level 80 drop table

sorry, I had to point it out:

Zorric.5704:

THIS IS NOT A SUGGESTION THREAD!

Zorric.5704:

SOLUTIONS:
*Add loot drops of just Silver Doubloons
*Transmog Copper Doubloons into Silver Doubloons
*Change it from Silver Doubloons to Platinum Doubloons
*Lower the amount needed to make the Vial of Qucksilver(Quicksilver)
*Make all Doubloons forgeable with all the other upgrade components
*Add more level 20-39 chests to the world
*Add chests to the jumping puzzles in Diessa Plateau

that said, I do agree something should be done about them. we should be able to craft silver doubloons from copper doubloons the same way gold doubloons are made.

Please sticky this so we don’t have to see a new thread pop up every few days.

Mystic.5934:

sorry, I had to point it out:

Zorric.5704:

THIS IS NOT A SUGGESTION THREAD!

Zorric.5704:

SOLUTIONS:
*Add loot drops of just Silver Doubloons
*Transmog Copper Doubloons into Silver Doubloons
*Change it from Silver Doubloons to Platinum Doubloons
*Lower the amount needed to make the Vial of Qucksilver(Quicksilver)
*Make all Doubloons forgeable with all the other upgrade components
*Add more level 20-39 chests to the world
*Add chests to the jumping puzzles in Diessa Plateau

This is more for those who are still unhappy with it being boon duration now and not something else. Also the Solutions can be suggestions but this thread is not set in stone so they may change over time making them unreliable suggestions. Changing how the silver doubloons are acquired or the price of said doubloons among other things is the goal here. Changing the silver doubloon straight up is not what this thread is for. Thanks for the response!

Zorric.5704:

The Silver Doubloon Debacle

+1 from me because it is a great post and you obviously put alot of effort into it.

I reported your post, so a mod gets aware of it and merges the other topics that you mentioned.

Personally, i already said enough on the various topics concerning silver doubloons.
I already have my Juggernaut and I know I can generate Silver Doubloons through opening the right bags at the right prices and through the mystic forge while making a profit, even though i rarely do it these days because i have better ways to make a profit than clicking away for 10g/hour.

I would vote for transmogrifying Copper into Silver Doubloons because i have 15 stacks of Copper Doubloons in my bank.

Copper → silver doubloons is a great idea.

That makes sense considering there is transmogrify of Gold to platinum as a Jeweler. It’s still not guarantee … copper isn’t easy to get either but at least it’s yet another way to get Silvers.

I’ve made this suggestion elsewhere before. I’d suggest implementing the following changes:

1. Add a Copper → Silver Doubloon transmogrify recipe.

2. Gift of Quicksilver now requires Platinum Doubloons instead of Silver Doubloons.

+1 and reported for sticky!

I’d love to see a solution on that topic although I will probably set some buy offers in the next days.

The simplest solution would to be: allow transmogrifying of coppers to silvers (especially since this lack was just likely overlooked, instead of intentional), and add silver doubloons to the level 80 drop tables.

I’m flipping these, why don’t you just pay the high price? I invested a considerable percentage of my gold into this asset.

It would be extremely unfair to me and my fellow speculators should Arenanet change the supply IN ANY WAY.

Thank you all for your posts! This is really helpful to see what the players want.

Svarty.8019:

I’m flipping these, why don’t you just pay the high price? I invested a considerable percentage of my gold into this asset.

It would be extremely unfair to me and my fellow speculators should Arenanet change the supply IN ANY WAY.

Svarty, can you explain why flipping is important to the market or player base so we can make a fair argument of why it would be unfair for the price to change? I’m sure some players find it extremely unfair to pay your prices just based on speculation and other players’ bottom dollar.

Zorric.5704:

Thank you all for your posts! This is really helpful to see what the players want.

Svarty.8019:

I’m flipping these, why don’t you just pay the high price? I invested a considerable percentage of my gold into this asset.

It would be extremely unfair to me and my fellow speculators should Arenanet change the supply IN ANY WAY.

Svarty, can you explain why flipping is important to the market or player base so we can make a fair argument of why it would be unfair for the price to change? I’m sure some players find it extremely unfair to pay your prices just based on speculation and other players’ bottom dollar.

Flipping is the market verifying the true value of an item. If a flipper jacks up the price and nobody buys or he is undercut, he takes a loss(listing fee) and the market rejects his proposed value for the item. Flippers make money because the effort to aquire the items otherwise is too much for the average person so they prefer to just pay more for the labor of the person who doesnt mind. It all comes back to RNG, if the price is too much for you just go buy up pebbles and get to forging or hope for deus ex anet to add them to some future loot bags the way they did with lodestones and champion bags.

Svarty.8019:

I’m flipping these, why don’t you just pay the high price? I invested a considerable percentage of my gold into this asset.

It would be extremely unfair to me and my fellow speculators should Arenanet change the supply IN ANY WAY.

“Past performance is no guarantee of future results.”

You said it yourself, you “invested” in them, you are “speculat[ing]”. This is an inherently risky thing to do. Anet changing loot tables is just the risk you take when you play in this market.

Zaxares.5419:

I’ve made this suggestion elsewhere before. I’d suggest implementing the following changes:

1. Add a Copper -> Silver Doubloon transmogrify recipe.

2. Gift of Quicksilver now requires Platinum Doubloons instead of Silver Doubloons.

…Vial of quick platinum? People who’ve been saving up gold by gold with silver doubloons might feel a little kitten ed when it starts requiring platinum instead. Not that I’m complaining of course.

Thanks again for the posts!

Solo.9027:

Flipping is the market verifying the true value of an item. If a flipper jacks up the price and nobody buys or he is undercut, he takes a loss(listing fee) and the market rejects his proposed value for the item. Flippers make money because the effort to aquire the items otherwise is too much for the average person so they prefer to just pay more for the labor of the person who doesnt mind. It all comes back to RNG, if the price is too much for you just go buy up pebbles and get to forging or hope for deus ex anet to add them to some future loot bags the way they did with lodestones and champion bags.

Thank you for this post it as allows me to see this side of the market.

SeNoZinD.9874:

Zaxares.5419:

I’ve made this suggestion elsewhere before. I’d suggest implementing the following changes:

1. Add a Copper -> Silver Doubloon transmogrify recipe.

2. Gift of Quicksilver now requires Platinum Doubloons instead of Silver Doubloons.

…Vial of quick platinum? People who’ve been saving up gold by gold with silver doubloons might feel a little kitten ed when it starts requiring platinum instead. Not that I’m complaining of course.

I think the sooner they do this(if they do) the better it would be. How would you feel if the value of doubloons were 3g or 5g versus where they are now? So by doing something like this now the heartache or the complaining would be less.

Zorric.5704:

Thanks again for the posts!

Solo.9027:

Flipping is the market verifying the true value of an item. If a flipper jacks up the price and nobody buys or he is undercut, he takes a loss(listing fee) and the market rejects his proposed value for the item. Flippers make money because the effort to aquire the items otherwise is too much for the average person so they prefer to just pay more for the labor of the person who doesnt mind. It all comes back to RNG, if the price is too much for you just go buy up pebbles and get to forging or hope for deus ex anet to add them to some future loot bags the way they did with lodestones and champion bags.

Thank you for this post it as allows me to see this side of the market.

SeNoZinD.9874:

Zaxares.5419:

I’ve made this suggestion elsewhere before. I’d suggest implementing the following changes:

1. Add a Copper -> Silver Doubloon transmogrify recipe.

2. Gift of Quicksilver now requires Platinum Doubloons instead of Silver Doubloons.

…Vial of quick platinum? People who’ve been saving up gold by gold with silver doubloons might feel a little kitten ed when it starts requiring platinum instead. Not that I’m complaining of course.

I think the sooner they do this(if they do) the better it would be. How would you feel if the value of doubloons were 3g or 5g versus where they are now? So by doing something like this now the heartache or the complaining would be less.

Lets say someone buys 100 gold worth of silver doubloons, and this patch rolls along. What happens then. Is the 100 gold gone because silver doubloon demand is gone too?
Reimbursing would probably have to take place, and Arenanet doesn’t reimburse people that are associated with the market.

SeNoZinD.9874:

Lets say someone buys 100 gold worth of silver doubloons, and this patch rolls along. What happens then. Is the 100 gold gone because silver doubloon demand is gone too?
Reimbursing would probably have to take place, and Arenanet doesn’t reimburse people that are associated with the market.

Any change to Silver Doubloons or changing from them will have losses. Players who buy them are already losing money so flipping the market would not be immune either. I understand players play for profit off the market but not all players do. This means players will lose out while others will feel less restricted in this debacle.

With that said, you are opposed to the change but we as a player base need more pegs on the against side to make a more valid argument. The feeling of “I will be cheated” does not argue against the opposing side’s “I feel cheated” debate. As some of the other threads have said, flipping hurts the economy and is a risk while others say(as you have) it is required to make items the true price and build a stronger economy. There will be risk and there will be losses but nothing is stopping you from speculating on the platinum doubloons either. Thank you and good luck!

SeNoZinD.9874:

…Vial of quick platinum? People who’ve been saving up gold by gold with silver doubloons might feel a little kitten ed when it starts requiring platinum instead. Not that I’m complaining of course.

Quicksilver is an archaic term for mercury, which has absolutely nothing to do with silver either. I just think Platinum Doubloons would suit better for a Legendary recipe as it has more chances to drop from high level content, which is what the vast majority of people will be doing as time goes on.

As to the second part, I acknowledge that it will probably make a lot of people (both flippers and savers) upset, so perhaps ANet should give advance warning that this change is going to take place.

On the other hand, ANet have come in before and made sweeping changes that ruined certain markets without any warning (e.g. destroying the Southsun skin market). It’s part of the risk of speculation; sudden changes to the market can devastate your investments, and it’s something you always have to be aware of. The percentage of people who make Legendaries is tiny compared to the global player base, and of those, only a fraction of them will be making the Juggernaut. They might very well decide that the market is big enough to absorb such a change without too much impact. (It’s not like the karma change where EVERYBODY uses karma.)

SeNoZinD.9874:

Lets say someone buys 100 gold worth of silver doubloons, and this patch rolls along. What happens then. Is the 100 gold gone because silver doubloon demand is gone too?
Reimbursing would probably have to take place, and Arenanet doesn’t reimburse people that are associated with the market.

Therein lies the risk(well, some of it). Without that risk you would not be entitled to your profit as a speculator. The trading post is not walmart, there is no return policy or money back guarantee.

SeNoZinD.9874:

Lets say someone buys 100 gold worth of silver doubloons, and this patch rolls along. What happens then. Is the 100 gold gone because silver doubloon demand is gone too?

They didn’t take away money from people that bought 100g of doubloons before ascended rolled out and everyone went for legendaries, resulting in doubloons increasing in price 10-fold. If you can profit big on major market changes, then it follows that you should be prepared to lose big as well, if you fail to predict the shifts in prices in time.
So yes, if Anet were to introduce some of the proposed changes and doubloons went down hard, the money invested in them would be gone.

SeNoZinD.9874:

Lets say someone buys 100 gold worth of silver doubloons, and this patch rolls along. What happens then. Is the 100 gold gone because silver doubloon demand is gone too?
Reimbursing would probably have to take place, and Arenanet doesn’t reimburse people that are associated with the market.

That’s just not true. I never got reimbursed for my TP losses. I sold my unidentified dyes before they shot up in price, but that doesn’t mean anet should reimburse me because I made a bad decision. The person that bought the doubloons still has the doubloons, they just paid more than they needed to for them. I paid more than I needed for lots of things, because I do take risks and make mistakes. There’s nothing wrong with it and there is not way anet should be reimbursing people.

Consider one more example. I buy gems right before they shoot up in worth. Does that mean anet needs to take some of those gems away? No! Let people take risks and play the market. The winners make gold, the losers lose gold. It’s all good.

You are missing something here:
A new character running around in the world stumbles across one of these things and checks the market and suddenly doubles his net worth. I think that is a good thing. If older characters have to pay exorbitant prices for a legendary, then so be it.
This new character, if he plays the game casually and doesn’t farm, will probably never be able to get a legendary, and that is the way it is supposed to be.

Making a change to have all the legendary items have more expensive components will just make people complain about grind

I say leave it alone, so one legendary costs more ….. young characters have a way to make some money in game.

I like that your ways of acquiring the doubloons drop after you hit 40 or so. Too bad they cant drop the chances to 0 and force higher level characters to buy them off the market

Ralph, I don’t quite understand what your post is saying. We are not trying to change all legendary ingredients to another more expensive ingredient nor trying to say that legendaries will not be more expensive in the future. We did not miss the new character entry as stated here:

Zorric.5704:

AGAINSTS:
*Silver Doubloon prices are improving the economy
*Lower level players can profit off the market because of Silver Doubloons
*Silver Doubloons are easy to farm if you know how to do it
*Charged Lodestones are more expensive so should all expensive things be cheaper?
*Reducing Silver Doubloon prices hurts my way of playing

The Juggernaut cannot be more expensive than the others because there are zero of them on the market. I believe the prices of Silver Doubloons may have something to do with this. Should players past the range of 21-39 with all characters be punished for not being able to farm them from jumping puzzle chests? Legendaries are level 80 weapons and the ingredients all reflect this except for the Silver Doubloons.

Again, thanks for the posts and keep them coming!

This is the one eyebrow raising thing about juggernaut…. All other legendary mats can be farmed easily by level 80 characters yet juggernaut requires you to level someone just to 21-30 range and park them at a JP just to get silver doubloons….

Simple solution if it is really going to be apart of legendaries then swap the In game value with platinum doubloons as well as the stat bonus. Or just simply add silver doubloons to the level 80 loot tables.

parking at the JP isn’t the only way to get silver doubloons though…

Obtena.7952:

parking at the JP isn’t the only way to get silver doubloons though…

Oh? Outside of buying them or throwing randoms in the mystic toilet what do you suggest? Unlike lodestones which have a very decent drop rate in their respective dungeons (onyx for TA, Charged for COE, Molten/Destroyer in COF/SE), Silver Doubloons are completely RNG dependent and the only mat that requires a character to NOT be in end game mode….

You just mentioned the ways … Buy, convert in MF and as we know, the chests. How many more are needed? 2 of those 3 methods are accessible by ANYONE at ANY level.

Lodestones are completely RNG dependent as well and you DON’T require an endgame character to get those either … So far your points are not making doubloons sound worse than getting lodestones. In fact, it’s proving equal.

The main difference is that you can get lodestones to drop by doing (the proper) endgame content. In otherwords, Silver doubloons don’t favour people that don’t want to make the effort to get them.

Obtena.7952:

You just mentioned the ways … Buy, convert in MF and as we know, the chests. How many more are needed? 2 of those 3 methods are accessible by ANYONE at ANY level.

Lodestones are completely RNG dependent as well and you DON’T require an endgame character to get those either … So far your points are not making doubloons sound worse than getting lodestones. In fact, it’s proving equal.

The main difference is that you can get lodestones to drop by doing (the proper) endgame content. In otherwords, Silver doubloons don’t favour people that don’t want to make the effort to get them.

If they are so much easier to obtain then why is it that silver doubloons are more expensive than all but one type of lodestone? And lodestones aren’t necessarily completely RNG dependent as usually people get 1-2 cores per three paths they do in a dungeon and those have a SET recipe to turn into a lodestone should the player choose to do it. Silver doubloons are the only gem/rare item used in crafting legendaries that doesn’t have a set recipe to make if you get something that is one tier down from it.

jportell.2197:

If they are so much easier to obtain then why is it that silver doubloons are more expensive than all but one type of lodestone?

There could be lots of reasons. Easy to obtain doesn’t mean they are available in abundance. Maybe it’s exactly for the reason you point out … they don’t just fall in your lap doing content. Even though it’s easy, you still have to do something exceptional to get them and people might be lazy or just not know how to do it.

As someone who has been farming silver doubloons in the JPs for about 6 months now(I am a little over a 100 now with four alts farming) , I would be extremely kitten ed if Anet suddenly decided to change the requirement to be Platinum doubloons.

I think just allowing us to upgrade copper doubloons will be the easiest and least jarring approach for them to take.

BladeDVD.6234:

Svarty.8019:

I’m flipping these, why don’t you just pay the high price? I invested a considerable percentage of my gold into this asset.

It would be extremely unfair to me and my fellow speculators should Arenanet change the supply IN ANY WAY.

“Past performance is no guarantee of future results.”

You said it yourself, you “invested” in them, you are “speculat[ing]”. This is an inherently risky thing to do. Anet changing loot tables is just the risk you take when you play in this market.

As you say, it is already inherently risky. We should not have to guess how benevolent John Smith is feeling at any particular time (i.e. we should not have to speculate on supply as well as demand).

I made 3 last night in the Mystic Toilet
I did some web research, bought pebbles off the market + some I had in storage
total spent about ….. well I didn’t really look but I have less than 2 gold on my account, and the pebbles I bought didn’t break me
(ya the pebbles I already have are free)
I did end up standing in front of the Toilet for about an hour …. so just the time and research makes it ineffective for people that can farm 30G / hr to do

that seems a much better way of getting them than parking someone at a jump puzzle
I’m sure older characters have stacks of low level stones, so people just aren’t trying very hard.
When lots of people learn that you can throw say 10C worth of stones in the Toilet and get 1.5G back the prices will come down. They do have to pray to the great RNG god tho
(10C is a guess as i didn’t really look at costs of pebbles)

Ralph

I was looking through my sell transactions last night… a year ago I sold a silver doubloon for 2s19c. ahhhhh, what times!

CHARGED LODESTONES AND THE COMPARISON TO SILVER DOUBLOONS.
Charged Lodestones are constantly being thrown into the Silver Doubloon Debacle due to their price. I believe this argument is missing the information it deserves.

WHAT IS A CHARGED LODESTONE?
Charged Lodestone: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Charged_Lodestone
Type: Tier 5 crafting material of the Lodestone Family
Rarity: Rare
Merchant Value: 48 copper
Game chat link: [&AgHxXgAA]

WHAT IS IT USED IN?
Since Charged Lodestones are a crafting material they are used in a variety of crafting recipes.
ARMORSMITHING
(Crafting level) Item
(400) Gift of Light: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Gift_of_Light
(400) Gift of Weather: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Gift_of_Weather
(400) Superior Rune of the Guardian: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Superior_Rune_of_the_Guardian

ARTIFICER
(400) Potion of Ghost Slaying x10: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Extended_Potion_of_Ghost_Slaying
(400) Gift of Lightning: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Gift_of_Lightning
(400) Infinite Aetherized Tonic: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Infinite_Aetherized_Tonic
(400) Watchwork Portal Device (x2): http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Watchwork_Portal_Device

HUNTSMAN
(400) Superior Sigil of Bursting: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Superior_Sigil_of_Bursting
(400) Superior Sigil of Speed: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Superior_Sigil_of_Speed
(400) Superior Sigil of the Night: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Superior_Sigil_of_the_Night

LEATHERWORKER
(400) Superior Rune of Speed: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Superior_Rune_of_Speed

TAILOR
(400) Superior Rune of the Air: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Superior_Rune_of_the_Air
(400) Superior Rune of the Scholar: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Superior_Rune_of_the_Scholar

MYSTIC FORGE
The Mystic Forge currently has two recipes that use Charged Lodestones and both recipes use the most Charged Lodestones of any recipe. Infinite Light requires 250 Charged Lodestones while Mjölnir requires 350 Charged Lodestones total.
Infinite Light: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Infinite_Light
Mjölnir: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Mj%C3%B6lnir

Market Information: http://www.gw2spidy.com/item/24305
To make everything on this post it would cost you a grand total of 957 Charged Lodestones. 600 of which is Infinite Light and Mjölnir and each Gift will cost you 100 Charged Lodestones.

WHERE CAN I FIND CHARGED LODESTONES?
Charged Lodestones can be found in several places and ways. They can be found as loot drops, from chests in Crucible of Eternity, World Chests, from Fractal Chests, Containers, and from salvaging. They can also be made in the Mystic Forge.

LOOT DROPS
Air Elementals and Sparks level 78-80 can drop Charged Lodestones. They can be found in Cursed Shore and Malchor’s Leap when their respected Cathedrals are uncontested.

DUNGEONS AND FRACTALS
All chests in Crucible of Eternity may reward Charged Lodestones.
All chests in any of the Fractals may reward Charged Lodestones. This includes the Jade Maw chest.

WORLD CHESTS
Completing both Lyssa’s and Dwayna’s meta events will reward a World Chest. Both chests have a chance to give a Charged Lodestone. Also, these events, when completed successfully, are what spawn the Air Elementals and Sparks.

CONTAINERS AND SALVAGING
(Salvage) Salvageable Twisted Watchwork Scrap: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Salvageable_Twisted_Watchwork_Scrap
Bag of Alchemical Materials: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Bag_of_Alchemical_Materials
Heavy Bag of Booty: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Heavy_Bag_of_Booty
Heavy Bag of Skritt Shinies: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Heavy_Bag_of_Skritt_Shinies
Heavy Loot Bag: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Heavy_Loot_Bag
(Buy with Karma) Lost Orrian Jewelry Box: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Lost_Orrian_Jewelry_Box
Resplendent Watchwork Box: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Resplendent_Watchwork_Box

MYSTIC FORGE
The following recipes will make you one Charge Lodestone.
2 Charged Cores + 1 Pile of Crystalline Dust + 1 Crystal + 1 Bottle of Elonian Wine = 1 Charged Lodestone
2 Charged Cores + 1 Pile of Crystalline Dust + 1 Crystal + 1 Mystic Binding Agent = 1 Charged Lodestone

Bottles of Elonian Wine can be bought from Miyani by the Mystic Forge along with the Crystals.
Mystic Binding Agents can be bought from Laurel Merchants.

THIS POST WILL SHOW THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN SILVER DOUBLOONS AND CHARGED LODESTONES!
With the two posts above providing the information we need, we can now properly show the difference between the two. Please let me know if I have missed anything or provided the wrong information. Thank you!

SILVER DOUBLOONS COMPARED TO CHARGED LODESTONES
*Silver Doubloons and Charged Lodestones are both considered Rare on the Rarity chart.
*Silver Doubloons are considered a Tier 2 material while Charged Lodestones are considered Tier 5
*Silver Doubloons can be found effectively among the levels of 20-39 while Charged Lodestones are found among levels 78-80
*Silver Doubloons are worth half as much to Merchants than Charged Lodestones
*Silver Doubloons are universal upgrade components while Charged Lodestones are a crafting material
*Four crafting professions use Silver Doubloons while five crafting professions use Charged Lodestones
*Silver Doubloons are used in six different crafting recipes with one being a legendary component; Charged Lodestones are used in 13 different crafting recipes with three being legendary components
*Silver Doubloons cannot be found as a loot drop from enemies while Charged Lodestones can
*Silver Doubloons cannot be salvaged from anything while Charged Lodestones can be salvaged from one item
*Silver Doubloons are rewarded randomly from the Mystic Forge while Charged Lodestones have a definitive recipe
*Silver Doubloons demand on the market is twice as much as the supply while Charged Lodestones demand is 5-6 times more than the supply
*Silver Doubloon supply changes by the thousands in a week compared to Charged Lodestone supply which changes by the tens of thousands in a week
*Silver Doubloon prices have steadily increased on the market while Charge Lodestone prices spiked but have steadily fallen to a flat rate
*Silver Doubloon prices have surpassed Charged Lodestone prices in the past
*A Vial of Qucksilver(Quicksilver), made with Silver Doubloons, is worth more than two fully made Gifts made from Charged Lodestones
*250 Silver Doubloons are required to achieve the Gift of the Juggernaut while only 100 Charged Lodestones are required for each of its three Gifts

This post may be an eye opener to some but after writing all this I can say that there are some major differences here. Feel free to debate this but please keep in mind that not all players play the same. So is it fair or honest to compare these two?

Not fair that doubloons have actually passed lodestones in value on the market… Not fair that while lodestones may be slightly more expensive individually the investment for the legendaries is overall less. :/

Part of the reason why Lodestone prices are cheaper now too is because of Champ loot bags. Lodestones drop occasionally from them, and the sheer amount of people doing Champ trains in Queensdale and Frostgorge has basically depressed prices.

Some interesting thoughts in this thread. Here’s my take on it. Bear in mind that I happen to believe that while it’d be lovely if making a legendary was entirely independent work, as other legendary recipes show, there are components such as lodestones and t6 materials which are both farmed and bought from the TP.

Lodestones and other materials are gained by playing the game at a high level, completing tasks that the majority of the player base completes regularly, for example, dungeons and champions. A huge number of people are doing these things regardless for their inherent rewards (and fun of it), and lodestones dropping is a nice bonus to thousands of players every day.

The number of players at the 21-40 (correct level for silver doubloons) to drop is far lower than the number of level 80’s. I know there are plenty of players of that level – I run around with alts as much as the next person, but it’s far fewer than the number of 80’s. That results in far less supply, pushing up the price. Given the inflation of silver doubloons, and that players feel compelled to waste character slots on alts at jumping puzzles, that should be obvious (I’ve outleveled characters intended for farming and completing jump puzzles getting no more than 20 out of 250).

Furthermore, while I agree that it’s wonderful for new players to find one of these things and feel like they’ve won the lottery, the amount one of these is worth is really overkill. It’s clearly out of kilter; a legendary component found strictly from low level materials, and is choice made strictly to crowbar the meaning for the weapon’s appearance (one I actually enjoy), but without consideration for how these will be obtained.

Nobody is asking for silver doubloons to be free, or even necessarily ‘easily’ obtainable. But they should be obtainable by players of the appropriate level, going around and playing the game. Parking alts at jumping puzzles, upgrading t1 materials, and opening thousands of low level bags is not that.

Svarty.8019:

BladeDVD.6234:

“Past performance is no guarantee of future results.”

You said it yourself, you “invested” in them, you are “speculat[ing]”. This is an inherently risky thing to do. Anet changing loot tables is just the risk you take when you play in this market.

As you say, it is already inherently risky. We should not have to guess how benevolent John Smith is feeling at any particular time (i.e. we should not have to speculate on supply as well as demand).

You can’t be serious. This is part of the inherent risk of market speculation. Everyone who does this kind of speculation is subject to these kinds of worries about demand AND supply.

High reward does not come without high risk.

Ralph.7859:

I made 3 last night in the Mystic Toilet
I did some web research, bought pebbles off the market + some I had in storage
total spent about ….. well I didn’t really look but I have less than 2 gold on my account, and the pebbles I bought didn’t break me
(ya the pebbles I already have are free)
I did end up standing in front of the Toilet for about an hour …. so just the time and research makes it ineffective for people that can farm 30G / hr to do

that seems a much better way of getting them than parking someone at a jump puzzle
I’m sure older characters have stacks of low level stones, so people just aren’t trying very hard.
When lots of people learn that you can throw say 10C worth of stones in the Toilet and get 1.5G back the prices will come down. They do have to pray to the great RNG god tho
(10C is a guess as i didn’t really look at costs of pebbles)

Ralph

When I looked at the cost of pebbles and nuggets and marks and the approximate success rates shown on the wiki, it worked out to about the same as just buying the doubloons. FYI, pebble sell prices range from 1.38 to 1.78 silver on gw2spidey as I type this.

Yeah just tried the mf way of getting them, got copper, platinum and gold doubloons but not a single silver one. I think I’ll just sell the rest of my gemstones and let others gamble on that.

Heavy Skritt bag of Shinies or something (its in my thread https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/crafting/Suggestion-to-fix-silver-doubloons-issue) is worth 16 s or so per bag, only drops from skritt areas in wvw, and is the only high level option for silver doubloons.

My suggestion was by far the most comprehensive and also made uses for excess blood stone dust (new legendary ideas/new higher level doubloons)

SuLor.2840:

Yeah just tried the mf way of getting them, got copper, platinum and gold doubloons but not a single silver one. I think I’ll just sell the rest of my gemstones and let others gamble on that.

If you got gold or platinum ones, you were doing it completely wrong. Zomorros only spits those out if you use materials way over the target level. Copper means you were combining stuff that was too low in level. The recipes are quite specific.

So T2 gems and marks/talismans?

Mystic.5934:

…..
that said, I do agree something should be done about them. we should be able to craft silver doubloons from copper doubloons the same way gold doubloons are made.

I agree, but keep in mind when they “turn on” this recipe, Copper Doubloon prices will SKYROCKET (at least until Silver Doubloon prices reach a normal level).

Svarty.8019:

I’m flipping these, why don’t you just pay the high price? I invested a considerable percentage of my gold into this asset.

It would be extremely unfair to me and my fellow speculators should Arenanet change the supply IN ANY WAY.

Nobody is taking anything you currently have away from you. If you feel this change is possible….dump your stock of these NOW….that is part of “flipping”.

I’m sure your other speculators cringed when they saw your post….vampires should not be protesting at the blood bank….shut up and drink in the shadows.