Guild Wars 2

People, in general, are fairly lazy and crave the dopamine fix that comes from instant gratification. While some players may be mad enough to leave the game, those players are not only a minority, they also tend to be the same players who don’t buy many things with real money.

There is little to zero dopmine gratification from GW2, more like Tryptophan induced zerg gameplay. I digress though….
Stating that losing players is “ok” since they are the minority screams of a poorly devised business model.
The business decisions at ANet are becoming bolder and more morally ambiguous by the day.
Long gone are the great designers and customer support teams that MADE GW1 what it is.
Le Gems, buy them….$12.50 or more every two weeks please

munkiman.3068:

The mist forge in PvP is only for pvp items. .

Really, then it is broken, I just tried forging some PvE sigils and it worked 3 times in a row.

Stormcrow.7513:

There is little to zero dopmine gratification from GW2, more like Tryptophan induced zerg gameplay. I digress though….
Stating that losing players is “ok” since they are the minority screams of a poorly devised business model.
The business decisions at ANet are becoming bolder and more morally ambiguous by the day.
Long gone are the great designers and customer support teams that MADE GW1 what it is.
Le Gems, buy them….$12.50 or more every two weeks please

Not every decision made by a company is going to liked, the trick to having a successful business is to make decisions that are profitable, even if that means kicking some customers out.

I’m not saying I agree with the decision, I’m just saying that from a business perspective it is often “ok” to lose customers if the decision results in higher profits overall.

It is decisions like these though that make me NOT want to buy gems, ever again. Sacrificing morals for the almighty dollar is an EA move and not something that I expected from Anet to be honest.

Stormcrow.7513:

It is decisions like these though that make me NOT want to buy gems, ever again. Sacrificing morals for the almighty dollar is an EA move and not something that I expected from Anet to be honest.

It’s a business move, and should be expected from all businesses since their exclusive purpose is to generate profits for the shareholders.

Trust me, you’ll be a lot happier if you go through life expecting business decisions from businesses because that way the surprises you get in life are always pleasant.

Liston.9708:

Fact is, la was the most convenient one stop shop for many.

Which is truly mind boggling since the tradepost and bank are a mile apart.

Blanger.3162:

munkiman.3068:

The mist forge in PvP is only for pvp items. .

Really, then it is broken, I just tried forging some PvE sigils and it worked 3 times in a row.

Perhaps they changed it? I tried awhile ago and i could only put in pvp stuff. Regardless, the mists isn’t a good place for all your pve needs. If anything the best place aside from buying the pass, is the borderlands. Although there isn’t the same Laurel vendor there either…

munkiman.3068:

Blanger.3162:

munkiman.3068:

The mist forge in PvP is only for pvp items. .

Really, then it is broken, I just tried forging some PvE sigils and it worked 3 times in a row.

Perhaps they changed it? I tried awhile ago and i could only put in pvp stuff. Regardless, the mists isn’t a good place for all your pve needs. If anything the best place aside from buying the pass, is the borderlands. Although there isn’t the same Laurel vendor there either…

No problem, I use the one in WvW most of the time, but I also went back and forged the blue prints gotten from the LS and it worked fine for them also.

munkiman.3068:

Blanger.3162:

munkiman.3068:

The mist forge in PvP is only for pvp items. .

Really, then it is broken, I just tried forging some PvE sigils and it worked 3 times in a row.

Perhaps they changed it? I tried awhile ago and i could only put in pvp stuff. Regardless, the mists isn’t a good place for all your pve needs. If anything the best place aside from buying the pass, is the borderlands. Although there isn’t the same Laurel vendor there either…

The point wasn’t to fulfill all your needs, it was to remove a possible jump from where you were to get to the forge.

I understand both sides of this debate; however, from my experience, I’m on the side where it can’t be an intentional cash-grab.

Why?

Because in one week of playing, I have accumulated over 20 of the two-week passes from opening the alliance supply bags. Since I have no way to get rid of these two week passes except to use them, it is actually pointless to buy either the individual or life-time pass at this point.

The people that should be complaining are the ones that bought the pass and, now, are awash in free two-week passes that they have no use for.

Anyone notice they haven’t sold special RNG boxes on the TP for a while?

brittitude.1983:

I understand both sides of this debate; however, from my experience, I’m on the side where it can’t be an intentional cash-grab.

Why?

Because in one week of playing, I have accumulated over 20 of the two-week passes from opening the alliance supply bags. Since I have no way to get rid of these two week passes except to use them, it is actually pointless to buy either the individual or life-time pass at this point.

The people that should be complaining are the ones that bought the pass and, now, are awash in free two-week passes that they have no use for.

Exactly, if you do the content by the time you get all the achievements you should have plenty of the free passes unless the RNG gods decide to frown on you, if it was intentional on Anet’s part then it was very poorly thought out and implemented, kinda’ like shooting yourself in the foot.

Yes, but none of the other cities offer the same level of convenience as Lion’s Arch (in terms of number of services offered and proximity of services to each other, not to mention gate travel)

This is a fairly inaccurate statement. The layout of Rata Sum is much more convenient than LA. Besides, the airship has an even more optimized dense layout of NPC’s than both LA and Rata Sum…

The cash shop ticket is probably OK if it isn’t limited to one character… for its price, it should be usable for all characters within the account.

brittitude.1983:

I understand both sides of this debate; however, from my experience, I’m on the side where it can’t be an intentional cash-grab.

Why?

Because in one week of playing, I have accumulated over 20 of the two-week passes from opening the alliance supply bags. Since I have no way to get rid of these two week passes except to use them, it is actually pointless to buy either the individual or life-time pass at this point.

The people that should be complaining are the ones that bought the pass and, now, are awash in free two-week passes that they have no use for.

All the ones I got were single use consumables……

$12.50 for convenience of LA?

For me, $12.50 was for the elegance of the crafting stations and the view.
I love the view from up there, and the craft stations are so pretty.

Yes, I bought the perma pass before the sale ended last night because I want to be able to ride on the airship even after the event ends, when I’m totally out of my one-time passes.
As a fan of Final Fantasy series, being able to ride on an airship is a must~

By the way, LA was not convenient enough for me.

Slippery slope?

Relevant xkcd comic . . .

Moving on.

The OP is 100% correct.

There is no way the Airship introduction was incidental to the destruction of LA and the loss of it’s conveniences. In all likelihood, the Airship was spawned as a way to profit from said destruction.

The old Arenanet would have given everyone a free pass for the airship for the duration of the disruption and then sold passes for those who wanted to keep the Airship access even after the disruption had ended, for novelty, prestige, etc… the new Arenanet, well, this is just another example of why they just aren’t the same studio any longer.

Oh no, I have to walk though an additional Asura gate a few feet away from the Asura gate I just went in to get from Divinity’s Reach to another city. How dreadful!

crystalpink.2487:

I want to be able to ride on the airship even after the event ends, when I’m totally out of my one-time passes.

what makes you think the airship will still be here after the event ends?
they sold infinite continue coins for the adventure box then removed adventure box from the game. who knows if / when itll be back maybe youll get the airship back the next time LA is attacked, but theres no guarantee its permanent.

to people defending anet, how far do they have to inconvenience you and then charge you to get that convenience back before its too far?

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Slippery slope?

Relevant xkcd comic . . .

Moving on.

+1

I will kittening laugh my kitten off when Anet starts removing convenience en mass and all you white knights start to figure out somethings wrong.

Fiontar.4695:

The OP is 100% correct.

There is no way the Airship introduction was incidental to the destruction of LA and the loss of it’s conveniences. In all likelihood, the Airship was spawned as a way to profit from said destruction.

The old Arenanet would have given everyone a free pass for the airship for the duration of the disruption and then sold passes for those who wanted to keep the Airship access even after the disruption had ended, for novelty, prestige, etc… the new Arenanet, well, this is just another example of why they just aren’t the same studio any longer.

They did give us free passes. If you want one just do the content that was introduced with the patch.

Wait, you don’t want to do the content which was the whole point of the thing, but you still want to get into the airship for free? That’s kind of chincey.

Windwalker.2047:

I will kittening laugh my kitten off when Anet starts removing convenience en mass and all you white knights start to figure out somethings wrong.

I look forward to your impending Armageddon Sir Tinfoil Hat.

Shadow Blade.1324:

crystalpink.2487:

I want to be able to ride on the airship even after the event ends, when I’m totally out of my one-time passes.

what makes you think the airship will still be here after the event ends?
they sold infinite continue coins for the adventure box then removed adventure box from the game. who knows if / when itll be back maybe youll get the airship back the next time LA is attacked, but theres no guarantee its permanent.

Answer: See Royal Terrace.
Royal Terrace is the only thing that can be compared very closely to Airship, not the infinite continue coins for Adventure Box.

crystalpink.2487:

Shadow Blade.1324:

crystalpink.2487:

I want to be able to ride on the airship even after the event ends, when I’m totally out of my one-time passes.

what makes you think the airship will still be here after the event ends?
they sold infinite continue coins for the adventure box then removed adventure box from the game. who knows if / when itll be back maybe youll get the airship back the next time LA is attacked, but theres no guarantee its permanent.

Answer: See Royal Terrace.
Royal Terrace is the only thing that can be compared very closely to Airship, not the infinite continue coins for Adventure Box.

Except the Royal Terrace had no value, unless you absolutely had to use the Forge while you were doing the Jubilee, since everything else was already available in Divinity’s Reach which you were currently in.

Not a single person claimed that Royal Terrace was a cash grab, even though the only way to gain access it was 100% with gems. People called the Coin a cash grab because you apparently died so much and getting coins was considered hard, I guess.

It is the answer to that particular question, though, you’re right. The Royal Terrace is the exact same physical thing as the air ship and it’s still around, so there’s no reason to thing the airship won’t stick around. Besides, what’s the good of a lifetime pass for something that only exists for a couple weeks?

Cant buy the 20% MF infusions at the other Laurel venders!

Windwalker.2047:

I will kittening laugh my kitten off when Anet starts removing convenience en mass and all you white knights start to figure out somethings wrong.

Ooooh, name calling. Are you 12?

I don’t really blame or resent Anet for a bit of a cash grab, and honestly they could always do much worse. Lion’s Arch (or a free equivalent city, depending on what they want to do) will come back once this story wraps up.

I recall reading that in order to churn out these Living World releases every two weeks that Anet has four full development teams working on 2 month cycles. FOUR. The vast majority of MMOs can only dream of that, and definitely only the top few MMOs at any given time can actually have it… WoW, LoL (yes they count) and so forth. Don’t cry and complain if it looks like they are trying to get a little extra cash. They’re a business, as is NCSoft above them. They have bottom lines and revenue goals and massive overhead on top of that to maintain this level of production quality and release frequency. Their goal of player enjoyment, in the end, is to make money, and it takes a lot of money to keep the GW2 boat afloat. Be very happy that they recognize that player enjoyment is an integral part of their cash-earning strategy. I’m happy to drop a few dollars here and there to get a nice item that I will actually use. I managed to get a Royal Terrace pass as a drop during the Jubilee and you bet I used the hell out of it for the 2 weeks I had it. I know that I’ll use this one too.

Just be happy that you’re getting content that you don’t actually need to pay for, that the game isn’t P2W, and the (slight) convenience that you do need to pay for is entirely optional and not even remotely necessary to progress your game.

brittitude.1983:

Because in one week of playing, I have accumulated over 20 of the two-week passes from opening the alliance supply bags.

In the same time, farming heavily, i have accumulated only 4. And those do not seem to be of two-week kind, but one-use only. I haven’t seen any two-week pass drop yet at all.

Windwalker.2047:

I will kittening laugh my kitten off when Anet starts removing convenience en mass and all you white knights start to figure out somethings wrong.

. . . when it reaches that point, and not before, I’ll start writing well-worded and polite letters to the developers illustrating “this is the point you went too far”, and after deleting the game from my hard drive I will not look back.

This would not be the first time either, and I did have some correspondence with some devs once before about games and “why”. It was enlightening and a big reason I defend the people more than the game. Or I tend to focus on the game more than the people (in the case of despised companies).

And once more, worth pointing out, those Vigil Keep asura gates can get you where you need to go with a minimum of fuss. I recommend Rata Sum or Divinity’s Reach, where crafting stations are relatively close to the inbound gates. Edge of the Mists has Laurel Vendors and Trait Retrainers right there at the entrance and it’s not unavailable due to being full.

There is every indication this is a “temporary” disruption, and we’ll be taking Lion’s Arch back to be resettled after March 18th. Hopefully they’ll put the bank, Black Lion agents, and Mystic Forge closer together than they were before.

I’m through repeating that though, because there’s no absolute proof everything will be back. Much like there’s no absolute proof it won’t be, but hey, who minds a little actual application of deductive reasoning when it comes to this sort of complaining?

Astralporing.1957:

brittitude.1983:

Because in one week of playing, I have accumulated over 20 of the two-week passes from opening the alliance supply bags.

In the same time, farming heavily, i have accumulated only 4. And those do not seem to be of two-week kind, but one-use only. I haven’t seen any two-week pass drop yet at all.

Those 4 should be enough, if you take time and lay out what you want to do for the best efficiency. I’m still scratching my head on what to do with my “express” items which summon a merchant or trading post representative to my location when I have no need for them . . .

Kal Spiro.9745:

Jett.1239:

UrbanEMP.2654:

I’m not even surprised anymore how such ignorance and entitlement can warrant such a mundane topic for discussion.

Do you really not see an issue with a company selling solutions to artificially imposed problems? It may not be a problem for you, but surely there are droves of players who acted to buy the pass — it begets more content like this on the gem store, and that’s not good for any of us in the player base.

Where are these droves? I know for a fact that when there is a legitimate problem the forums drown in outrage. Where is it? A handful of people? Hardly droves. The droves realized it’s not a big deal and adapted to the new situation.

Providing a solution for an artificially produced problem also isn’t very meaningful when the artificially produced problem was the loss of an artificially produced convenience. This is a game, designed an built by a company. They put everything where it was and made it so things worked the way they did.

They created the convenience that you so lauded. Then they took it away. They gave ample warning that things would change. They didn’t change quite as much as expected, but knowing that some people would not be satisfied with the change they added a pay service. A pay service that already exists, identically, in Divinity’s Reach. They just added a new instance of it.

So the people who absolutely needed to have everything and can’t live with the minor delay of portals could have it for a price. Those that want that convenience, but don’t need it immediately at their fingertips can play the content and get access for free. Everyone else can go about their business as usual and ignore that any such things even exists.

Kal ill give you a hint , it all gets deleted , more common then you will ever acknowledge , im amazed this thread still hasnt been deleted yet actually.

Enundr.9305:

Kal ill give you a hint , it all gets deleted , more common then you will ever acknowledge , im amazed this thread still hasnt been deleted yet actually.

It’s probably going to get locked, like the other one, for off-topic and personal attacks et cetera, et cetera. Every topic like this gets dragged there by all parties involved, and then Godwin’s Law gets invoked for the capper.

I’ll say this . . .

They do aggressively delete “I’m quitting!!!!!!!!!” threads, because it’s both against the TOS for the forums and most people never stick around after posting it. If the OP isn’t going to take part in the discussion, they tend to lock/delete them as nonproductive.

Alas, this is why moderating forums is one of the rougher jobs on the internet. As kittenifting through the junk mail filter for a company to see if any legitimate mail got caught in there.

When Anet does something like this….

http://arstechnica.com/gaming/2014/02/world-of-warcrafts-60-level-boosts-reflect-important-economic-reality/

Then we should be very upset.

Liston.9708:

brittitude.1983:

I understand both sides of this debate; however, from my experience, I’m on the side where it can’t be an intentional cash-grab.

Why?

Because in one week of playing, I have accumulated over 20 of the two-week passes from opening the alliance supply bags. Since I have no way to get rid of these two week passes except to use them, it is actually pointless to buy either the individual or life-time pass at this point.

The people that should be complaining are the ones that bought the pass and, now, are awash in free two-week passes that they have no use for.

All the ones I got were single use consumables……

Ah, well, I haven’t used them, just going by what others have said. I’m not sure it matters since I don’t plan on using them.

Astralporing.1957:

brittitude.1983:

Because in one week of playing, I have accumulated over 20 of the two-week passes from opening the alliance supply bags.

In the same time, farming heavily, i have accumulated only 4. And those do not seem to be of two-week kind, but one-use only. I haven’t seen any two-week pass drop yet at all.

I’m not sure what you consider heavy farming. Maybe I’m extra lucky with these bags. Either way, I haven’t used the passes, so I don’t know whether they are one use, one day, two week, or eternal. I doubt I’ll find a reason to use them.

Enundr.9305:

Kal Spiro.9745:

Jett.1239:

UrbanEMP.2654:

I’m not even surprised anymore how such ignorance and entitlement can warrant such a mundane topic for discussion.

Do you really not see an issue with a company selling solutions to artificially imposed problems? It may not be a problem for you, but surely there are droves of players who acted to buy the pass — it begets more content like this on the gem store, and that’s not good for any of us in the player base.

Where are these droves? I know for a fact that when there is a legitimate problem the forums drown in outrage. Where is it? A handful of people? Hardly droves. The droves realized it’s not a big deal and adapted to the new situation.

Providing a solution for an artificially produced problem also isn’t very meaningful when the artificially produced problem was the loss of an artificially produced convenience. This is a game, designed an built by a company. They put everything where it was and made it so things worked the way they did.

They created the convenience that you so lauded. Then they took it away. They gave ample warning that things would change. They didn’t change quite as much as expected, but knowing that some people would not be satisfied with the change they added a pay service. A pay service that already exists, identically, in Divinity’s Reach. They just added a new instance of it.

So the people who absolutely needed to have everything and can’t live with the minor delay of portals could have it for a price. Those that want that convenience, but don’t need it immediately at their fingertips can play the content and get access for free. Everyone else can go about their business as usual and ignore that any such things even exists.

Kal ill give you a hint , it all gets deleted , more common then you will ever acknowledge , im amazed this thread still hasnt been deleted yet actually.

Actually, they’re more likely to get merged. That happens all the time. I am active enough during a given period of time to see most new thread and if I posted in one thread on a theme I’ll post in another. Therefore if any of them get delete or merged I get an automatic PM letting me know about it.

The reason there isn’t any in this case is because the outrage just isn’t there.

Honestly I hated the concept of centralizing everything into one tiny place. I like my MMOs to feel like there are specialized towns and areas for different things, not huge major cities that are abandoned save for a few people trying to do their living story. Why spend so much time on making DR look as beautiful as it does if your intention was to cram everyone into a place 1/5th the size of it by consolidating literally every service possible?

I haven’t played much the past couple months due to non game related problems. But seeing that they are selling a “Lifetime pass” to the ship means they most likely will never bring Lions Arch back.

This game has become way to centered around the stupid store. Its going to end up being the Achilles heel that destroys this game. I’ve already seen it happen to LOTRO.

Its hard to get motivated to play this game when they ONLY true rewards are those you buy from the store. All mob drops anymore are worthless vendor trash. They also destroyed one of the dragons.

Timothy.7204:

I haven’t played much the past couple months due to non game related problems. But seeing that they are selling a “Lifetime pass” to the ship means they most likely will never bring Lions Arch back.

So you mean to say that living stories from now on will loop with “we’re taking the Lion’s Arch back”? Because that’s what is happening on Tuesday.

Timothy.7204:

They also destroyed one of the dragons.

Destroying dragons is kind of the point of this MMO.

Timothy.7204:

I haven’t played much the past couple months due to non game related problems. But seeing that they are selling a “Lifetime pass” to the ship means they most likely will never bring Lions Arch back.

This game has become way to centered around the stupid store. Its going to end up being the Achilles heel that destroys this game. I’ve already seen it happen to LOTRO.

Its hard to get motivated to play this game when they ONLY true rewards are those you buy from the store. All mob drops anymore are worthless vendor trash. They also destroyed one of the dragons.

Lions Arch and all your vendors will return. This is only temporary,

Rangersix.1754:

Since the EoTM patch, there’s also a button (on the bottom right) to leave WvW on the WvW menu. It’ll teleport you back to where you were before entering WvW. So you don’t even need to relog anymore.

OMG that’s fantastic! I even read release notes… obviously not well. Thanks R6!

Stormcrow.7513:

It is decisions like these though that make me NOT want to buy gems, ever again. Sacrificing morals for the almighty dollar is an EA move and not something that I expected from Anet to be honest.

Your definition of “moral” and mine differ widely. There’s no morality around convenience in an MMO. Had they removed all teleport capability to anywhere remotely near services, that could be arguably unethical/sneaky/shady. They gave an ADDITIONAL convenience to those that existed minus one service-too-spread-apart-already city.

Hyperion.4638:

CrockD.8257:

Yes this is another complaint thread on the Captain’s Airship Pass.

For those who didn’t read the other thread: A lot of people got upset that the loss of Lions’s Arch represented the loss of the most useful and convenient hub for BLT, Bank, Crafting Stations, Mystic Forge, Skill Trainers and Vendors. It also had Asura gates to all the major cities. In its place we got two things, Vigil’s Keep (which does not have crafting stations, gate travel and far less vendors) and Havoc’s Heir Airship. The airship is a one stop shop for everything BUT costs 1000 gems for a lifetime pass, 1000 gems equals $12.50 in USD.

Those who (rather sycophantically) defended Arenanet made some of the following arguments:

You can just go to other cities:
Yes, but none of the other cities offer the same level of convenience as Lion’s Arch (in terms of number of services offered and proximity of services to each other, not to mention gate travel) , that’s why LA was consistently the most visited location. If you do a lot of crafting, or are trying to make a legendary or use the BLT a lot you absolutely know what I mean. Time is money and you will be losing a lot of time from this loss of convenience.

It’s part of the story/times change/you fear something new:
No. I love what they are doing with the story BUT when you take that convenience away and ask for money for its replacement, it is an OBVIOUS bait and switch.

Cashing in is not Arenanet’s intention:
Really? Then why did the 1,000 gem lifetime pass come with this new content as a “promoted item” in the gem store? To think otherwise is naive.

Look, I love this game and there’s much to praise Arenanet for, but i’m not just going to drink the Kool Aid either. Removing LA’s conveniences and charging $12.50 to get it back is wrong. It’s something I expect from Electronic Arts, not from Arenanet who by and large are the good guys.

Will I stop playing? Of course not! This represents an annoyance and a fairly pricey one at that but overall the game is still fantastic. I just offer this thread as a venue for people to raise their hand politely and say they don’t agree with this move and that they think Arenanet is better than this. Aside from this, the new content is awesome, love that they shook the game up this way, keep up the rest of the good work!

… what am i suppose to tell my friends that wana buy this game? “Well they made a change recently and now you gotta spend gold or money or travel to other cities wait all the loading screens spend report money for something that was there for free, and no i have no idea why they did that, well ok for the money”

So you’re saying you never had to spend gold to travel to Lion’s Arch?

Windwalker.2047:

I will kittening laugh my kitten off when Anet starts removing convenience en mass and all you white knights start to figure out somethings wrong.

It is at that point I find another pastime.

KarateKid.5648:

So you’re saying you never had to spend gold to travel to Lion’s Arch?

Gold? No.

A couple silver which was made back through one trip through Urmaug’s Secret? Yeah

Hyperion.4638:

I honestly do not know why something like that can happened, i mean what am i suppose to tell my friends that wana buy this game? “Well they made a change recently and now you gotta spend gold or money or travel to other cities wait all the loading screens spend report money for something that was there for free, and no i have no idea why they did that, well ok for the money”

Here’s what you tell your friends who might want to buy GW2

" Man…they did something really cool and totally unexpected, they destroyed the main gathering hub for players, yea it was epic, no other game would have the kittens to do that! and the update they left us with is totally cool, we get to fight our way into the city, beat back the hordes of baddies, save the citizens from certain death, it is truly totally rad! and the loot! man the loot is just plain awesome!

Yeah they did destroy my favorite place to stand around, chat and go afk, but it was totally worth it!"

As you see it’s all in the delivery.

Haven’t read the whole thread, but keep in mind that ArenaNet are still the good guys. It’s the money they need to make for NCSoft that’s er… having unwilling intercourse with our freedom in-game.

Blanger.3162:

Yeah they did destroy my favorite place to stand around, chat and go afk, but it was totally worth it!"

Except it wasn’t…

Astralporing.1957:

Blanger.3162:

Yeah they did destroy my favorite place to stand around, chat and go afk, but it was totally worth it!"

Except it wasn’t…

Nah, it will never be worth it. I mean, to some it will always be equivalent to punching a puppy in the face.