Guild Wars 2

First off, Anet, you guys did a pretty darn good job. I really like the event. I love the concept, I love the design team’s burning chaotic city, and I love hating you guys for demolishing all that is Lion’s Arch. I love having the chance to take my stealthy thief out in PvE. I also like you’re taking a proactive step with breaking up mindless zergfest.

…The problem is that most people don’t know that.

We still have players tagging up shouting, ‘Stack on me to win this event!’ People are still zerging for peanut loot bags, and people bypass the dead and terrified citizens. No one seems to understand that saving the citizens of LA is a map-wide effort, and best done by actually saving its citizens. On the first day, my server managed to save close to a thousand people, but I haven’t seen that since. It’s usually stuck around 500.

I get bored of zerging, and have had at more times struck out on my own, or with small groups of players. But there have been one or two times where I’m fighting alone, and someone just runs past without assisting because they’re trying to get to the next zerg event.

Zerging is counter-productive. It scales up events, and it distracts people from saving the scared citizens. Breaking up the zerg needs to be more obvious. There is more loot gained based on the citizens you saved, but everyone will keep zerging because 1) they don’t know there’s a chance to get better loot, or 2) they know, but since too much don’t know/don’t care they’ll just go back to zerging. Basic zerg loot is better than solo loot, if only 500 people are gonna get saving.

I know these events are meant to be ’don’t need an instruction manual and everyone figues it out in five minutes’….but no one’s figured it out.

Yep. People are even staying put until another event starts if there is no event going on. They should use that time to save the citizens ._.

They should give more rewards for saving citizens. Multiple loot bags for rezzers to equalize the gain with staying in zerg. Or better yet, something unique.

Gabby.3205:

Yep. People are even staying put until another event starts if there is no event going on. They should use that time to save the citizens ._.

Exactly and I feel that with the event set up as it is, even dedicated commanders will be unable to achieve the “event win” target. The whole thing is set up to make it look like the lootbag zerg train is all that there is and my guildmaster said this wasn’t the fight for him, as he didn’t plan an aoe class.

Really, it should be, as I found going into the isolated areas and rescuing civilians to be exciting, dangerous and well fitted to single target classes. Regrettably, he has already given up on it. The event mindset is excluding people and limiting them to being in large groups and in predictable parts of the map.

The upper inns and that shady cave in the north west are chock full of civilians….but most of them are ignored.

It never crossed my mind that there was anything to this event other than auto staff the red mobs blob, soooo yeah your point is pretty much correct.

Invictus.1503:

They should give more rewards for saving citizens. Multiple loot bags for rezzers to equalize the gain with staying in zerg. Or better yet, something unique.

I agree entirely.

Brizna.5612:

It never crossed my mind that there was anything to this event other than auto staff the red mobs blob, soooo yeah your point is pretty much correct.

That’s what is so frustrating….that we can go into the event and constantly “miss the point” and thus the decent reward opportunities. Especially as it offers items from old events, that are theoretically invaluable as their like should not have ever dropped again.

Totally agree. One time have I seen a great effort only to find out the counter was bugged. Majority of the time we hit around 5-600 citizens saved.

I think the zerg:
1. doesn’t know about end rewards
2. don’t care about end rewards.

Seen this sort of thing during the Scarlett Invasions. “Let’s get to the aetherblades so we can farm champs”, instead of actually getting to the end to complete the event.

Might have something to do with the rewards and of course gold per hour. I bet if there were a event end only armor skin, this wouldn’t be an issue.

The one thing treadmill games have going for them, guaranteed loot. RNG still plays a role, but you still have ample shots at getting upgrades/sidegrades/alt gear/role gear and the focus is on actually completing the things you do with gold being the lowest thing to worry about.

I wonder sometimes about this game.
GW1 had horizontal progression. skins and skills
Treadmill games like EQ/WoW/Aion/Rift/Swtor have vertical progression.

GW2 pretty much has neither. It’s all about gold. Don’t get me wrong, I like gold in most games as it gives me the freedom to get some of the things that require it, but I don’t want it to be the only reason I play outside of fun.

I hope in the future anet designs content that is meant to be completed. Marionette I think is a pretty good example even though the end reward there was pretty crappy on the whole.

I’m thinking that if you had a counter working backward things would shape up a little better and faster.
Example: Lions Arch Citizens still alive. 5000. the more citizens die, the less rewards you get. You can rez them and help them escape, but if they are dead/downed at the end, that counts for a death.

The best or worse part, depends on how you look at it, you don’t need many people in one area rescuing NPCs. If a map would have about 20-30 people spread out all over the map escorting, then you could reach 1k mark easy.

I know one thing. I don’t care and we can’t change the zerging community, but I can have fun with 2-3 people escorting, because I find it more fun then spamming 1 all the time. In the end for this event we still need many zergs doing events, all can’t escort, but we could use more people thou…

Can’t change the past and Escape from L.A. will stay the way it is, but let’s say there’s a similar event in the future LS.

What do you think about removing the bags from enemies (maybe remove all the loot?) and reward a player with one bag for saving a refugee, which would mean either coming to refugees and setting them free so they can run or killing the enemies that are in refugees’ way.
I guess that rewarding a player for simply setting them free would not be a good idea as most people would just run to every NPC, set them free and run to the next one, hoping that others would escort them. Maybe in some circumstances it would be a good thing to do.

To make it work, there should be many more indicators for players, like “Get the hell outta here, we don’t need you!” when a player comes to an event which already has more players that are needed, and “We could use some help at <insert place>!”. But that’s another topic.

Do you think this would diminish the zerg mentality a little bit? How would you improve the idea?

Anet is rolling out a new system of rewarding based on the progress done in the event overall, it’ll take awhile for it to get through a zergs head.

On the other hand theres an event in orr to weaken risen and then drag them to an npc, that has existed since launch, and people still don’t get it.

Props where props are due, the system is a good idea, and well executed on their end, the zerg mentality just hasnt learned to take advantage of it yet. Anet should go the route of neverwinter, atleast for event zones, the max player cap in zones is lower so there isnt people for a proper zerg and it’s more about everyone knowing what they’re doing.

Anet won’t do this…it’s been a pattern for living stories. Look at queen’s jubilee, nightmare tower, Scarlett’s invasions. Anet is just so set minded on mega zergs to do anything in this game.

Rainbow Sprint.3215:

Anet is rolling out a new system of rewarding based on the progress done in the event overall, it’ll take awhile for it to get through a zergs head.

On the other hand theres an event in orr to weaken risen and then drag them to an npc, that has existed since launch, and people still don’t get it.

Props where props are due, the system is a good idea, and well executed on their end, the zerg mentality just hasnt learned to take advantage of it yet. Anet should go the route of neverwinter, atleast for event zones, the max player cap in zones is lower so there isnt people for a proper zerg and it’s more about everyone knowing what they’re doing.

They did that for Crown Pavilion(or was it something else, I know there was a thing where they capped the map to 70 people each). Didn’t seem to have any meaningful result.

Anyway I knew about the different tiers other people in map chat have mentioned it too. I just don’t care. The usual ‘chance at ____’ have such bad odds that it is not worth the gamble. Sure someone might get something it just won’t be me therefore no reason to care.

O.o. I didn’t even know that was the goal.

Came across this, and it’s kind of annoying.

They have patrolling mobs that traverse the map: 1 vet and 2 regular mobs. There was a zerg farther up north, and I assume when this patrol respawned, they up-scaled with an elite.

I’m going solo, and I can’t exactly pick a fight with those guys…

What do you mean by big reward? Back when the event was bugged and counters on server main maps didn’t reset, Blackgate got the citizens saved to well over 2000. Once the miasma maxed, I got a chest with 25 bags of alliance supplies. While that is more than I was getting at lower levels, it certainly isn’t that much. Am I missing something? Is there another big reward past 1500 citizens saved?

RyanThomas.4182:

What do you mean by big reward? Back when the event was bugged and counters on server main maps didn’t reset, Blackgate got the citizens saved to well over 2000. Once the miasma maxed, I got a chest with 25 bags of alliance supplies. While that is more than I was getting at lower levels, it certainly isn’t that much. Am I missing something? Is there another big reward past 1500 citizens saved?

The bugged instances weren’t giving out proper rewards from what I understand.

Do you have to actually guide them to an exit? I could swear the counter ticked up each time I rezzed or encouraged, and thought it was nice design that we didn’t have to get them alive all the way out through endless veterans and champs.

Donari.5237:

Do you have to actually guide them to an exit? I could swear the counter ticked up each time I rezzed or encouraged, and thought it was nice design that we didn’t have to get them alive all the way out through endless veterans and champs.

They have to either reach a portal or an agent of the Order of Whispers. Luckily, the agents are everywhere, so that citizen that you rezzed or encouraged will probably find one.

Buffy.9246:

Anet won’t do this…it’s been a pattern for living stories. Look at queen’s jubilee, nightmare tower, Scarlett’s invasions. Anet is just so set minded on mega zergs to do anything in this game.

Why would you not mention Tequatl, the Marionette and the wurms, though?

It astounds me that even though it flashes in big red letters across your screen “IGNORE THE MIASMA -FOCUS ON THE CITIZENS” that people don’t get the point of the event.

Anet should really have added a personal “save 500/1000 citizens achievement” to encorage people to save some as they walk past.

People zerging around after a few champ bags when the real rewards are at 1500 citizens is quite sad.

AnnieGYG.6842:

People zerging around after a few champ bags when the real rewards are at 1500 citizens is quite sad.

“Real reward” doesn’t mean anything to me. I don’t know what it is, or if it’s even worth the effort.

Problem is: If u farm citizens no stop. U get 25 bags and 5 whatever it is for 100 300 600 1000 1500.

If I farm dolly events non stop, I get 225 bags and 5 whatever it is.

Basically, u work, and I get reward for your work.. I dont like this way of rewarding.

Sergoros.4398:

Problem is: If u farm citizens no stop. U get 25 bags and 5 whatever it is for 100 300 600 1000 1500.

If I farm dolly events non stop, I get 225 bags and 5 whatever it is.

Basically, u work, and I get reward for your work.. I dont like this way of rewarding.

1000 civies is 100 bags

Charak.9761:

Sergoros.4398:

Problem is: If u farm citizens no stop. U get 25 bags and 5 whatever it is for 100 300 600 1000 1500.

If I farm dolly events non stop, I get 225 bags and 5 whatever it is.

Basically, u work, and I get reward for your work.. I dont like this way of rewarding.

1000 civies is 100 bags

Nope. Completed 1000 today. It was 20 bags.

I am going to offer what I know ahead of time is an unpopular opinion.

This should have been a zerg event.

I think the big problem with this event is not necessarily just the zergs not knowing what to do, but that the objective is contrary to the instinctive reaction. Lion’s Arch is a major focal point for the game, both from a lore standpoint and a gameplay standpoint. It is one of the touch stones to the fiction of the original Guild Wars, many character story and living story events take place there, and its the central economic hub for just about every server.

Then comes the big update where it gets blown to smithereens. A lot of our favorite side characters are either displaced or missing. Battle is raging across the city as the Lion Guard dukes it out with Scarlet’s army to the tune of orbital death rays. Fires rage everywhere, buildings lay toppled in heaps, and a giant drill is obliterating our heritage with each passing moment as invaders loot and murder.

And our job is…show people to the door? Walk up to NPCs and shout at them until they feel better? Nursemaid a bunch of racing birds?

We’re the main characters of our own stories. We’re the heroes of the piece. We should be leading the charge to take back the city and kick Scarlet’s motley band of losers into the harbor, not just nodding our heads and going, “Yup, its all over, best get the civvies out while her folk run amok.” Sure, there should be escort missions such as rescuing the kids or the lighthouse workers, those make sense to evacuate from the front lines. Lawson Mariner though? We should be running him to his mansion, to show that the city hasn’t given in yet. Those pack dolyaks? We should be running them to Trader’s Plaza, so that we can set up an actual rallying point from which to retake other sections of the city. The racing birds can become krait feed, because we’ve got bigger problems to tackle.

Now, there are a couple of arguments against this that can be made. The first is that saving people is equally heroic. And this is true. But when was the last time you watched an action flick where the heroes spent all their time looking for wayward souls instead of confronting the villains? Look at the Avengers. Captain America didn’t personally escort every last noncombatant out of the city, he passed it to the NPCs while he dealt with the source of the problem.

The second is that the final chapter will “obviously” involve us retaking the city somehow. This one I doubt; the story has been pushing that Scarlet has been searching for something, which reads to me like we’re looking at another boss fight on par with Tequatl or the Marionette. That means any – if any – events to retake the city will most likely play second fiddle to that encounter. Which would mean it comes off, at least in my opinion, as us giving up the city without much of a fight.

Hmmm, this got a bit longer than I intended, but ah well.

the reward should be personal based on the amount of positive things YOU did while being in the map…

Killing of an Enemy = 1 Point
Killing of an Enemy Veteran = 2 Points
Killing of an Enemy Champion = 5 Points
Find Rubble = 1 Point
Reviving a dead NPC = 2 Points
Encouraging living NPCs to flee and they flee successfully: 3 Points
Defending successfully a Miasma Event/Escort: 5 Points
Doing a Jumping Puzzle: -50 Points (you’re there to defend, not to jump around)
Doing a Vista: -10 Points (you are there to defend, not to look around in the Sky)

This way would be everyone enouraged to do everything there is to defend the town as effectively as possible to be reward individually at the ent as best as possible knoweing, that the reward at the end matters as a result of 100% of your own influence and not less then 1%…

Cutting down the required points from 1500 needed to 500 or so as a sum for the individual points needed to receive the max reward.

Arikyali.5804:

Came across this, and it’s kind of annoying.

They have patrolling mobs that traverse the map: 1 vet and 2 regular mobs. There was a zerg farther up north, and I assume when this patrol respawned, they up-scaled with an elite.

I’m going solo, and I can’t exactly pick a fight with those guys…

That is probably not what happened. If they got scaled up that mob would be lv83. There are just some elites that are around “naturally”. There is one guarding the rubble pile near where the moa event starts.

Valor Singus.7049:

…Captain America…

I didn’t want to quote your whole post as its quite large, but I did want to reference it as I feel you make some very good points. I agree on the captain America one and I too am desperate to get up into that drill thing to challenge scarlet at the controls.

I think the main problem is one of time difference, between the game and our experience of events. This part of the story is, from what I understand, actually the initial, sudden attack and a few hours afterwards, where citizens are evacuated in haste with anything they can carry. It makes sense for even the great heroes to get directly involved at this point, because they are still scouting and getting in whatever means (likely those teleporter things dotted about) that will help them get inside.

Unfortunately, with “game time”, those hasty, desperate few hours become two whole weeks in which we all do a groundhog day over and over. For two weeks, Roxx, Marjory and so on will still be saying “wow, its an attack on the city, omg giant drill”, when the rest of us will be thinking “can we stop evacuating people and get on with it”.

The karka event happened in a much more realistic timeframe, with an initial attack and then us going out to kick some crab behind. The problem with that, though, was that a lot of people missed the event. We were either there on the day of the attack or we missed it forever and it was the same for the defeat of the karka queen. I distinctly remember staying up into the early hours to see the mad king burst out of the fountain as well and after that…..he didn’t burst out again.

I can understand why it is that we get these “2 hours becomes 2 week” time situations. It allows all players to take part in the event and it justifies what is a heck of a lot of development effort that would be wasted if it lasted a mere eyeblink. It does, however, stretch the story to breaking point unless one takes into account these limitations.

On the topic of the “final battle”, we do know that certain parts of scarlets armour are dropping as future items. We know we will be fighting her. I suspect, however, that we will not be fighting whatever comes out of the drill hole. Scarlet’s use to that is at an end and we will surely defeat her soon, only to ponder the future arc of dealing with whatever it is she manages to dig up. I`m unsure quite how epic a fight she will be though.

Half of me thinks that we will get to the controls of the drill only to find her a burned out, mindless shell, disgarded by whatever it is that is urging her on.

The event itself screams in big, bold letters to focus on saving citizens.

The freakin’ event UI has a “citizens saved” counter.

If you honestly don’t understand what the goal of the event is, I don’t know what else to tell you that you won’t ignore as well.

I can even stand afk whole event and would still get same reward as a player, who saves citizens. So yeah…they have to change it though.

chronometria.3708:

To make it happen we need – some sort of individual reward and encouragement to get players away from the zergs and those tempting, but ultimately pointless blue loot bags. The event design needs a slight change so that players are given a strong incentive to go off and grab those civilians and to ensure that they make it back in one piece.

Cutting down on veterans and elites everywhere, and on Sudden Orbital Barrage Spams of Doom would immensely help in that regard. There’s just no point in helping to get civilians get through chokepoints if in those chokepoints mobs respawn faster than you are able to kill them, or if anytime you attempt to do that you get targetted by chains of knockdown aoes (in addition to elites popping out of thin air to pound upon you when you try to keep your stability up).

Basically, rescuing civilians is also a job for bigger groups. Individual players can help, but only up to a point. And that point is reached quickly, and discourages people from further attempts.

Didn’t even know I was meant to be doing this!

Thought all I had to do was hit 11111111111 with staff and ffffffffffffffff on downed players.

I like this dynamic though, tbh.
In the Scarlet Invasion event, the way the event asked you to pit success vs maximizing bag loot was a pretty interesting social experiment, but ultimately doomed to fail.

Here however, the event needs to be continued either way, and especially Molten and Aetherblade become lethal as hell in zergs (while really easy with ~5 people).

It’s still a social education experiment. “Do players realize that they’re making things harder for themselves by zerging up needlessly? Do they improve?”

It’s important in a way. Just like the Marionette, I suspect ANet needs to establish their lowest common denominator. Basically they need to figure out whether they need to account for LFG- or LFR-levels of stupid, to use WoW terms.

Orpheal.8263:

the reward should be personal based on the amount of positive things YOU did while being in the map…

Killing of an Enemy = 1 Point
Killing of an Enemy Veteran = 2 Points
Killing of an Enemy Champion = 5 Points
Find Rubble = 1 Point
Reviving a dead NPC = 2 Points
Encouraging living NPCs to flee and they flee successfully: 3 Points
Defending successfully a Miasma Event/Escort: 5 Points
Doing a Jumping Puzzle: -50 Points (you’re there to defend, not to jump around)
Doing a Vista: -10 Points (you are there to defend, not to look around in the Sky)

This way would be everyone enouraged to do everything there is to defend the town as effectively as possible to be reward individually at the ent as best as possible knoweing, that the reward at the end matters as a result of 100% of your own influence and not less then 1%…

Cutting down the required points from 1500 needed to 500 or so as a sum for the individual points needed to receive the max reward.

This! I tried spending 40 minutes reviving and escorting npcs but it’s useless if the other just want to zerg and loot the bags.

Hmmmm…. looks like the save the citizens rewards are broken.

I’ve gotten a standard Citizen’s Rescue Bag for the 100, 300, and 600 rewards…. but these appear to exist according to the wiki.

?Standard Citizen’s Rescue Bag
?Lesser Citizen’s Rescue Bag
Superior Citizen’s Rescue Bag
?Greater Citizen’s Rescue Bag
Ultimate Citizen’s Rescue Bag

So I suppose you are supposed to get lesser for 300 and superior for 600… but it ain’t working right.

Is this going to be fixed?

If there had been an achievement with X refugees aided that counted towards the meta people would surely have known about it and be helping those poor cowering refugees!

I bet you’d really see the numbers climb if it had a title attached. Something like, Guardian Angel or Saint comes to mind. (would go nicely with that halo)

It would also be neat if /rescue would have given a personal count of how many npcs were helped out of LA by a player, I know I’d have really enjoyed seeing how many my pc had aided.

should be a archievement like the endless salvage thing with 1500 rescues and every step give 1 point

Just managed to get 1500 with TTS and Darkhaven (not sure if world’s first non-bugged one) just now and we got a Ultimate Citizen’s Rescue Bag which seemed to get everyone at least one item from a previous update. Though it varied in quality. I also was just rescuing citizens the whole time and I got around 148 scarlets bags from clearing the way.

So take what you will if it’s worth it.

Personally I find it more fun then just zerging around everywhere and swinging my lootstick.

EDIT: O ya and some dragonite…. you get some dragonite… but I get dragonite from everything these days.

I think anet are smart, the whole point is that you will succeed more if you are selfless and avoid the massive loot of the zergs.

I think it’s story through game mechanics, and it’s genius.

guardian.6489:

Just managed to get 1500 with TTS and Darkhaven (not sure if world’s first non-bugged one) just not and we got a Ultimate Citizen’s Rescue Bag which seemed to get everyone at least one item from a previous update. Though it varied in quality. I also was just rescuing citizens the whole time and I got around 148 from clearing the way.

So take what you will if it’s worth it.

Personally I find it more fun then just zerging around everywhere and swinging my lootstick.

What do you mean by an item from a previous event? Like the weapons skins etc?

Doodakoff.5246:

guardian.6489:

Just managed to get 1500 with TTS and Darkhaven (not sure if world’s first non-bugged one) just not and we got a Ultimate Citizen’s Rescue Bag which seemed to get everyone at least one item from a previous update. Though it varied in quality. I also was just rescuing citizens the whole time and I got around 148 from clearing the way.

So take what you will if it’s worth it.

Personally I find it more fun then just zerging around everywhere and swinging my lootstick.

What do you mean by an item from a previous event? Like the weapons skins etc?

Anything from anything scarlet related it seems. I heard everything everything from Dragon coffers, the Monocle, an infinite beserker tonic recipe Celestial recipes, Zealot recipes. Personally just got a zealot’s recipe…… it’s not like I got a ton of those from the Marionette.

There are rumors you can get a molton backpack as well.

^ Fair enough.

If that’s the case, imo the greater incentive is to join the zerg and collect the loot!

It is a typical prisoner’s dilemma. The best outcome for me is: 30 people work their behind off with saving prisoners and I go with some friends guardstaffing mobs and doing events. That way I get everything: big reward, blue loot bags and achievements. The next best solution for me would be to actively help saving children. But only if enough think the same way. Wouldn’t other people take advantage of that? Can I trust them?

There is a lot of literature on that subject. While it can make a powerful concept for board games it is a very cynical concept which should not be incorporated in GW2.

I know that we are still in the infancy of this chapter, but we need to get some of this on lock.
Right now, we get in the city, fight some mobs, a Commander WP to another location and the zerg starts to scatter and dies off.
ANet has been specifically making releases that require more cooperation and coordination. The “Edge of the Mist” release was the final test run for us on this.

The zerg is not enough anymore and and we know it.

We have some time for coordination to get squads together, relay the plan of attack and strategy before going back in. We have the advantage of knowing this map better than any other we have had. Its rough after an entire day of playing and just becoming discouraged seeing players trying to keep up with all of this and just getting downed. We have figured out most of this and just need to apply it.
For folks not following a Commander’s squad for other goals (piles of rubble, map completion ) for goodness sake, can we party up!
Speed runs in dungeons are the thing these days, but these are relatively smaller mobs that we can handle.
Having skills and weapons that are able to help in group situations should go without saying.

This game is still fun for me, and the Living Story has been ramping up to be epic. The idea that we concoct a precision effort to drive Scarlet’s forces from OUR city is far more appealing than zergs at them to die scattered in the suburbs.

tl;dr We can do better. FOR LION’S ARCH!

Here’s a suggestion related to this
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/escape/Hero-of-Lion-s-Arch-Title/first#post3669378

The new LS-Events would be a lot more fun if more Players would actually try to rescue 1500 citizens.

Problem is that just following the zerg feels far more efficient reward-wise than anything else, even if its counter-productive. Even worse, It feels like there is a penalty for coordinated small-groups in that you’re getting less loot and achievements.

This also creates unnecessary Conflict between Players who archieve the objective of rescuing citizens and Players who want rewards.

There should also be more instant gratification for working towards Completing those Events. I guess, I would reduce regular Loot and hand out a LootBag for every 20 Citizens saved…

One problem with this release is that the achievements run counter to the objective of rescuing citizens. All kinds of things are awarded with achievement points, but not rescuing citizens, or being part of reaching a higher rescue tier. Very odd.

Invictus.1503:

They should give more rewards for saving citizens.

This.

I looked at the rewards for saving the citizens and no. The absolute 0.000% chance to get an ascended something or something from an old LS story (since I participated in LS and got what I wanted already and I’m not doing ascended gear treadmill) is not enough to stop me from just wanting to tag as much as possible for the most loots. My first run I nailed over 250 bags. 2nd run over 200. Not to mention the decent loot from tagging. Why should I take the time to do something else that has less reward?

When I did the event to today there were two commanders on the map and as always 90% of the people were following them. One of the commanders was even demanding that everybody follows him. We ended up saving a mere 550 citizens.

I tried to convince people, that zerging is counter-productive when it comes to saving citizens, but most just cared for simple loot. Unfortunately I did not have any arguments against that, because encouraging citizens does not give you rewards right away (neither loot nor experience). Kind of proves once again that most people are selfish.

Edit: My point here is that saving citizens should give some instant gratification. Be it a Found Belonging, experience or something that counts towards an infinite achievement giving a loot bag every time its completed. This is what gets people to do the event the way it’s intended (because most people are looking for maximum loot).