Guild Wars 2

As many of us have noted, documented, informed, complained, requested response on this system that is currently in force that has impacted gameplay.

There was a statement that this was a glitch but now we get patch notes and there is nothing stated on this issue. This is a major major issue for the game.

We have posts already stating that this is still in force. Each person that still experiences this I would like them to do the following:

1. state how long you were on in a zone when the impact hit as well as a rough amount of the number of dynamic events or chains you did.

2. put down the scaling you experienced.

3. imput your thoughts on this matter on the seriousness of the impact.

We need to keep this organized on this so that we can get this resolved. We need this to be cohesive and clean so that they do not underestimate the impact on the game.

Many thanks all.

Other thread here https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/events/Stealth-Patch-More-diminishing-returns-for-DE

Zones effected in, Cursed Shore, Malchor Leap, Shattered Straits. But I’m guessing this will happen in all areas, this is just where I have been.

1) Kicks in after about 30 mins of farming DE, didnt stay much longer after that, about 8 events before it kicked in.

2) Rewards were halved continuously down to pretty much nothing. Just got 18 karma for an event in Malchor Leap because it diminished so much.

3) Pretty dire, this is feeling more like travel wars and how can I be social when I’m only in a zone for 30 mins then hop to another.

Finished 2 hours run in Cursed Shore today. Did at least 10 events and after the last event I did I saw that I got reduced rewards. After the whole 2 hours it was scaled down to like 1000-2000 exp and poor 30-40 karma and very small amount of money. When I was doing the same run yesterday everything was alright. It’s starting to get annoying how they “fix” stuff..

Thank you both for putting the information in. This keeps things cleaned and organized. I know there are other threads out there but I am trying to keep the information in a clean and organized manner.

Re-logging resets DR. Common knowledge in Isle where zerging is popular on Sorrows Furnace.

Yesterday after the patch i logged in and intentionally tried to reproduce why this was happening to me as i dont cheat, use known exploits or leave DEs mid course to do another DE that just popped..

I went from logging in and doing the pertinent point DE circuit one time to going to sparkfly fen to play with my lower level wife..
I tried for hours to get this anet induced ridiculous game ruining annoyance to occur without success by doing the 2 main DEs repeatedly and even leaving one midway through to do the other one in the gorge in order to attempt to trigger this penalty but it didnt trigger..

However later on i did trigger the diminishing garbage but because of a set of circumstances i had absolutely no control over..
What happened was i protected the asura base..
Then went and cleared the gorge as usual..
However this time i somehow got a gold for protecting the quaggan dudes that i wasnt aware had even occured..
This still did not trigger the penalty however the sunless popped within seconds of the quaggan DE completion and it was after downing the dragon the penalty kicked in..

This code in my honest opinion is very flawed due to the awesome sometimes spontaneous nature of this game and the fact anet wont come clean adds insult to injury and leaves us trying to figure out how to avoid it on our own instead of just playing and enjoying this remarkable game as we should be able to..

At this point in time im not worried about the bots ruining this game as anet is doing a far better butcher job on their own games concepts and freedoms than the bots ever could..
Stopping exploits is a necessary function but anet needs to re-evaluate the people they have left in charge and rekindle the question..
If we do this to the game will it still be fun for our players?
Because there is nothing fun about being penalized/punished for simply playing the game as it unfolds in front of you with no word or explanation from anet as to why..

IMSOMANIAC.8954:

Re-logging resets DR. Common knowledge in Isle where zerging is popular on Sorrows Furnace.

Thanks this works, still breaking my immersion but at least I can play how I want now and see event chains to the end.

The diminishing is definietly broken or at least I hope this is not how the devs intended it to work. I played in Plains of Ashford today and after 3 hours (from which actual playtime was around 2 hour – other times the character was parked in a settlement while I cooked lunch and such), all event rewards got reduced to 17 exp, 2 karma and 1 whole whopping coin. It’s important to note that I did not farm the same event.

I was running around the map, collecting materials to craft an armour later on and if I saw an event nearby I participated. There were maybe two or three events I did twice and everything else only once. Yet, I’m getting punished as if I were a bot.

Not cool, Anet. Not cool. Until this is fixed I’m not buying any booster either as they’re pretty much worthless if the rewards are diminishing at such rate.

Today I was in Cursed Shore farming only Penitent and Shelter’s camp defense DEs. After 14 minutes I went from Yellow/Green/Blues to junk, whites and hardly any loot drop at all. Re-logging did not resolve this for me. I went to trolls in frostgorge and still did not get a single drop until I relogged once more at the farm site.

The re-logging shows how flawed their logic is. If we as general users use it the bots will simply program that as well.

Yes I find their DR system heavy handed, poorly done, poorly thought out, and simply against the premise of what they touted this game to be about.

The fact that their company hasn’t spoken on this simply shows how little they care about the matter.

It is certainly a bit heavy-handed and reminds me vividly of back when I played FFXIV and their “Fatigue” system. Only here, I can’t just swap to a different class and continue getting xp and silver. Nope.

Yesterday I joined the Straits of Devastation zerg as it roamed from each (non-broken) temple DE to another. After about 30-40 minutes DR hit me hard. I went from getting about 12-13k xp and 350 karma per event to dropping below 5k xp and 70 karma per event – after only about a half hour of game time!! And this just so I can try to get that quarter of a million karma I need to buy a set of Orr exotics.

It’s a little disheartening to have my gameplay and gametime corralled along a certain path because the devs want to punish a select few from farming for RMT. But many others like myself are farming (as we’ve done in many, many other MMOs) for the “end-game” equipment and fancies.

What’s even more frustrating is that the DR system was implemented without a whisper and then commented on in the most evasive manner by any dev that is forced to address an issue pertaining to DR.

As much as I love GW2 and ArenaNet as a developer, this whole thing puts a damper on my enjoyment and my respect for them and their game – just like it did (funny enough) with Square Enix with regard to FFXIV and their heavy-handed nature towards xp gain there with “Fatigue”.

I log in this morning pop a karma booster play for 40 minutes in Orr (Cursed Shore) and I’m only getting 28 karma with the booster 19karma without and after only playing 40 minutes ridiculous!! (I was farming 5 different events in fairly close proximity to one another).

When I noticed I wasn’t getting any more karma from all 5 DE I logged out (hopefully will save the remaining time on my boosters).

Pretty dumb punishing the player for doing DE that you guys at Arena Net were going crazy about and saying how much fun they are and how some DE are chains and the more you do the more your rewarded, well I’m not being rewarded that is for sure.

I’m so confused where is the Arena Net that made GW1 were is the thought of the player and the players fun, what happened? This isn’t the game I wanted to purchase anymore.

Today I was on Cursed Shore, maybe an hour, and all of all sudden my karma rewards from DE’s started dropping, like by half for each event, 301, 151, 71. At this rate, you can’t play the game normally without getting hit.

This whole anti farming stuff is getting ridiculous, why have karma boosters and magic find when we’re not allowed to farm basically? What’s the sense in having the boosters in the cash shop when we can’t even get the full duration before the anti farming codes kick in.

This game is loaded with gold sinks, but yet they don’t want people to make gold.

Just had this happen as you guys are describing it.
This is pretty much ruined the game for me and made running around in a zone punish you for trying to do events and get rewarded or collect karma so you can get the armor.

So the developer’s take time to push out this rushed heavy handed diminishing return system that feels flawed and bugged and ruins the game for regular players…. yet they can’t fix the broke and bugged npc’s for events and the skill points?

Serious Anet get your act together before people end up stop playing and go find a fun mmo to play.
EQ2 and LoTRO and AoC are all F2P and still plenty fun.

I’ve recently been in Straits of Devastation with me being sometimes the only person attempting to progress DE’s and succeeding for the most part. There are 3 chains I like to keep an eye on. 1 that goes for quite a while to take Lone Post but the last part to take the door down requires more then one person by far. Then the Quaggan chain and the Submarine team. So I’m completing them and wondering why nobody else is helping me take Lone Post when I notice I’ve started to only get 17 Karma for a Solo Gold medal of a DE.

Now I know why nobody is doing DE’s…. whats the point.

So for 2 weeks (looking at older threads) we have been asking and waiting for a response on the DR system that’s in place on Dynamic Events….

Even though Moderators are aware of the issue, there hasn’t been any comment on the system in place.

This seems to send a message that this system is not a glitch but rather it’s the system they want in place.

It would be really professional for the company to respond to this so that customers can know how they are supposed to play in the game system.

yes we know that we can log out and log back on to reset but that seems both a bogus and stupid system to prevent botters as they too can program that. All I can see that this prevents is FUN which is supposed to be the core purpose of a GAME.

As of today’s patch re-logging no longer fixes the karma reduction problem. I cannot express how livid I am. I bought 10 karma boosters with USD from the Gem Store and 40 minutes into my first one I received the reduction. I could deal with it when it only took 30 seconds to log in and out, but now this? I couldn’t get dungeon rewards because of the dungeon reward bug the past 6 days, and after setting my sights on the legendary (which we all know takes over 1 MILLION KARMA) now Arenanet doesn’t want me to get karma? Please, Arenanet, what do you want me to do in this game, exactly?

We need answers, now. Is this bug? Is this code to limit player’s karma earning to prevent botting? Is this a temporary solution to some other exploit not mentioned. Please, Arenanet, TALK TO US. I’ve bought your game and $30 in Gems ALREADY, I just want to know what is going on.

Think it’s time to find another free game to play.
Not gonna put up with such heavy handed tactics that go against the very design and mechanics of the game.

You really missed the boat with this Anet and are failing your player base.

Very disappointed.

This new set up goes against playing the game. I feel bad for buying all those gems now.

Why should I bother playing when my XP/Karma is capped to some low arbitrary setting when I want to play a lot? Are we not allowed to play at our pace? Or is it: “You can play, but only when we tell you to” type of deal.

So disappointed.

I bet there’s a lot of people kittengret that gem store about now and wish they had a monthly fee to vote with. I do.

Why should I bother playing when my XP/Karma is capped to some low arbitrary setting when I want to play a lot

If you are playing for XP/Karma rewards, then you are by definition not enjoying yourself, but instead just seeking rewards. So why are you playing in the first place?

The DE karma reduction system is a stroke of genius. It has no effect whatsoever on people who play because they enjoy playing, but it has a huge negative effect on reward chasing behavior.

Wildclaw.6073:

Why should I bother playing when my XP/Karma is capped to some low arbitrary setting when I want to play a lot

If you are playing for XP/Karma rewards, then you are by definition not enjoying yourself, but instead just seeking rewards. So why are you playing in the first place?

The DE karma reduction system is a stroke of genius. It has no effect whatsoever on people who play because they enjoy playing, but it has a huge negative effect on reward chasing behavior.

I want the gear from the melandru temple in Orr, because it has the stats that I cant get anywhere else (power, toughness and vitality), and I kind of need this set to do WvW, as my gear at the moment is all MF gear only with no vitality/toughness. I don’t want to get 2 shotted in WvW, and the set bonuses for the armour are a nice bonus. I don’t exactly farm karma, but after doing around 2 chain DE’s I hit the DR…..that is pretty laughable.

I’ve been playing games on PC’s since the Apple II+ was the newest thing on the market, and actually even before that. I’ve been keeping up with the games online since around 1990-91. I’ve never seen a game company try so hard to stop people from playing their game. Nor have I ever seen such rabid, anti-gamer fans as the GW1 people. I never played GW1, just felt terribly clunky, so I can only guess at the synergy between the company and those fans, but it does not translate well into a well-publicized, modern MMO. That said, a lot of work obviously went in to GW2, so it’s terribly sad to see this play out this way, but it’s just a game. There’ll be many more.

I approve of diminishing rewards. It pretty much derails the gains of botting.

Frosty and Frosty Law Firm.4981:

I approve of diminishing rewards. It pretty much derails the gains of botting.

If you knew how botters operate in this game, you’d know the DR system isnt working against them.

The DR system as it’s implemented now does nothing to stop bots.
They stand or stay in one place so they’re not hitting the time limit of doing to many events to fast.

@Wildcat, who are you to say how people should enjoy playing? Some do enjoy farming, others don’t.

I think a lot of this is because of the cash shop, never trust a game that has the option to convert rl money to in game money

“Play the way you want to play… unless it’s not the way we want you to play” Anets new official motto.

You want to earn karma… do it at a slow slow pace or otherwise we will take it away from you.

You enjoy doing events, great do them, but we will take the rewards away from them quickly.

Need a bunch of mats to craft exotic gear don’t worry we borked the farming for that consider it Fixt. So don’t go farming those high level blue crafting mats. It’s been Fixt with our new system.

Need exotic gear and you have to pay with amazing amounts of karma, don’t worry we borked earning karma. It’s been Fixt with our new system.

We are trying to teach you all you don’t need exotics.

We simply put them into the game so that people as false glowing carrots.

Just play the game the way you want to play…. as long as it’s the way we want you to play.

Shoot for the middle everyone. It’s the way we want you to play.

@ “Play the way you want to play… unless it’s not the way we want you to play”

It’s more like: Play the way you want provided it isn’t detrimental to the community. That’s a very worthy aim in my opinion.

You might ask yourself why people don’t farm in single player games such as Skyrim – and the answer is likely that in MMOs farmers are trying to earn a reward that is valued by the community. But, what they don’t seem to appreciate is that they devalue the rewards by the methods they are using to acquire them.

Detrimental to the community? So, would you like to hand me (just one set) of the 40 or so blue mats I need to level (just one) of my professions? What’s that? I should buy them off the TP? That would be great, if I could generate some cash to do so.

Take away the resource and the reasonable ability to purchase it otherwise in one BS design “aim” at the expense of my time? You sure are naive.

Here’s an idea – in a game where loot and a reward mechanism are fairly central, don’t place artificial “you’ve had enough fun for today” restrictions unless you want to drive away a fair chunk of your player base.

This karma penalty doesn’t affect bots, only players.
Both get the same relative uptime and relative value of karma/drops. The player gets angry when he plays normally and has to log out, the bot doesnt care and just logs for xx min (not sure how long is needed).

But the whole problem exists because defense events are wayyyyy too easy (imo they should be near impossible, else players never get to even see the “real” event for that spot.. a defense event should be possible, but only if an organized group of players really really makes an effort, not because 5 ppl stand afk and autoattack. Most defense events should simply be too hard, or have a 50% chance to spawn a near impossible boss or whatever).

The second reason is that gold participation is so trivial. do 1% damage on a champion, leave, gold. Help kill 4 mobs in 5 sec on a 5 minute escort, gold.

These are the problems, nothing else.

(edit: i can also add that the downtime in karmafarming made me install diablo3 to have something to do while logged.. that’s not a good system.. but i only need 45k more for sunrise, and have farmed around 1.4 million total (really bad luck of 21% droprate on the 77 clovers + 5set karmagear, so personally i don’t care anymore about karma after this

roqoco.4053:

@ “Play the way you want to play… unless it’s not the way we want you to play”

It’s more like: Play the way you want provided it isn’t detrimental to the community. That’s a very worthy aim in my opinion.

You might ask yourself why people don’t farm in single player games such as Skyrim – and the answer is likely that in MMOs farmers are trying to earn a reward that is valued by the community. But, what they don’t seem to appreciate is that they devalue the rewards by the methods they are using to acquire them.

No you are dead wrong on the concept of what I am saying. Karma cannot be changed into gold. Karma is used to buy Karma gear. You need 42k per piece. For how many sets of armor? 1 set will cost you 252,000 karma. If you are working at this in a legitimate method of simply going across a zone and doing events. NOT REPEATING an event! You still get hit with this stupid system. Me earning a legitimate amount karma is not hurting the community.

What I find ridiculous is that as a company they put this system in a very hidden method while they state they try to be as transparent as possible. They haven’t once commented on this and continue to stonewall on a response. I find that incredibly hypocritical.

It’s crazy to me that they set up a game with so much stuff you have to grind out to get anywhere…then punish those trying to do just that.

It’d actually be an acceptable practice in a monthly subscription game because they’d clearly be trying to extend the amount of time you play (and thus, pay). But here? Doesn’t make any logical or financial sense to me.

Seeing posts like these really disheartens me. I really really want to log in and play bug if I can only get in 45 mins of farming in before I’m forced to stop then whats the point? My pace is exactly as being described here and It’s super easy to chain events in Orr, so I know i’ll hit it if I log in and start farming.

My issue is why even bother? I don’t want to be forced to take a break when I choose a game I want to play. Right now i’m having issue with motivating myself to log in to progress on my farming, because I WILL hit the DR system.

And the fact that the only DR system being recognized is the dungeon one really grinds my gears. I don’t have an issue with that one since tokens drop in greater quantities now, nor the item drop one since it keeps the economy stable. Karma on the other hand is needed in vast quantities and can’t be traded, so there is NO reason to have a limiting system on it.

Beat me at it,

Zone: Cursed Shore
Events: 2 defense, Broodmother, 1 escort, 1 defense.
Last event karma gained: 78.

All those complaining-have you considered for a moment the effect you experience might be just bugs of implemented system?Not a "farmer"but already have 4 crafting professions at 400 with little to no “grinding” and enough karma for 3 temple pieces.I dont know how much time it takes -but doing like yesterday whole Dwayna chain,risen champions in the labyrinth and after defending WP near Cursed Shore portal all net me gold participation and normal 300+ karma per event without any side effects.Did twice in a row path 2 in HoTW and second time got much more “teddy bears” and exp than i`ve expecting after reading all the complains in dungeon section of the forum.Going through Frostgorge Sound/Malchor`s Leap/Cursed Shore while collecting all ore/ancient wood spawns and doing all available DE give really lots of karma without being “hit” by any DR.You are getting all karma points for temple gear in a reasonable time.You do not get one-shotted in Wv3 or explorable instances if wearing less than excellent items-as we all know no items will help you survive when tens of people are hitting you or instance boss put his attention at you.I think being able to farm karma points for 1 piece of temple gear every few days is a good enough.Blame botters/exploiters/cheaters/farmers for putting such system in place not Arena Net.Actually it is not enough-still seeing botters and tens of people constantly AoE-ing while doing those 2 sad defending DEs in Cursed Shore.

If DR was for stopping boots why curb the karma at all? It’s not like the boots can ruin the economy with surplus of karma.

Well my thread was deleted. I wont say what it was about as I dont want this thread to be deleted too.

It seems they are content to not comment on the DR on DE’s, which doesn’t really send a good picture to their playerbase, but hey, its their game. I haven’t touched the gem store, and I have no intention of doing so after today. I wonder how many others feel the same way.

Lol morgoth I commented in your post then they took it down. So I made one and guess what…post deleted. I’m goona guess that means no comment.

Bots still going strong – check
Punished the GW2 community – check
kitten off the GW2 community – check
Ignore mass requests for reasons by GW2 community – double check

Yeah, its kinda sad the way its all just being swept under the carpet at the moment. Its like they hope it will just go away or something.

Bet those karma boosters are selling really well right about now, huh?

Arena dont care at all….i want to play the way i want but i cant…19 karma for event killed all the fun for me..

I’ve pretty much lost total interest in playing this game, logged in the past two nights and stood in an outpost in Orr doing nothing, no desire to do the events knowing the karma/loot DR’s will kick in.

In the process of loading MOP and waiting for Rift’s expansion next month. Instead of buying gems, I’ll pay a sub for a DR free game.

The days keep passing and not a thing from the developers. Simply a pathetic handling of the situation

I agree that this issue is huge and ANet should deal with it, or at least communicate. But I think we shouldn’t speak so harshly either. Yes, they are responsible and need to respond but at the same time I’m sure they don’t intend to hurt their customer base… what company would like to do that?

Can we just have some faith that they will fix this or respond accordingly? They are also still dealing with a lot of other big bugs and issues in the game. (This is a major one of course) Not to mention a billion of other requests from players and so forth.

Yes it sucks, yes it needs to be fixed, yes we can’t farm as effectively but let’s keep informing them but not be negative or hold all this hatred. An item a few days later won’t kill you. Sometimes the game can be stressful too if you’re constantly farming, can’t we take a breather and take it slow?

And like others said, there are other games, and other things we could do with our time as well. But I say that with a spirit of let’s wait, continue to express our concerns and have faith that it will be better in the future.

It’s still relatively new game, they still need to work on a lot of stuff. I for one am sticking by them for a long long time, no matter what problems we may face. We can face it together, rather than point fingers as if it was done on purpose to disappoint us.

takatsu.9416:

Yes, they are responsible and need to respond but at the same time I’m sure they don’t intend to hurt their customer base… what company would like to do that?

Lots of them. Take DRM used by the music, film, and video game industries for example. Look how much pirating it took before we got Netflix and Steam and iTunes. I can absolutely accept that ANet is doing this to hurt us for some stupid ignorant or lazy reason.

Whether its intentional (my bet is extremely poor planning) or not this new DR system effects everyone. A level 20 necro gets shafted just as hard as an 80 farming a legendary. So address the community and fix the DR or watch GW2 turn into just another MMO that didn’t cut it. I love the game but I loose a little love every 30 minutes when I’m penalized for just playing it.

Btw I watched 30+ bots farming a spot yesterday. I’m still convinced that this DR system does nothing to them, just hurts the real community.

Surprised this thread hasn’t been closed like the multitude of others.

Swept under the carpet.

takatsu.9416:

I agree that this issue is huge and ANet should deal with it, or at least communicate. But I think we shouldn’t speak so harshly either. Yes, they are responsible and need to respond but at the same time I’m sure they don’t intend to hurt their customer base… what company would like to do that?

Can we just have some faith that they will fix this or respond accordingly? They are also still dealing with a lot of other big bugs and issues in the game. (This is a major one of course) Not to mention a billion of other requests from players and so forth.

Yes it sucks, yes it needs to be fixed, yes we can’t farm as effectively but let’s keep informing them but not be negative or hold all this hatred. An item a few days later won’t kill you. Sometimes the game can be stressful too if you’re constantly farming, can’t we take a breather and take it slow?

And like others said, there are other games, and other things we could do with our time as well. But I say that with a spirit of let’s wait, continue to express our concerns and have faith that it will be better in the future.

It’s still relatively new game, they still need to work on a lot of stuff. I for one am sticking by them for a long long time, no matter what problems we may face. We can face it together, rather than point fingers as if it was done on purpose to disappoint us.

If this had been a day or possibly even a week I would agree with you. This has been WEEKS and NO response. NONE. They haven’t spoken on this issue for WEEKS. They will respond to other much smaller issues quickly and promptly and yet they haven’t spoken a word on this.

Why should we continue to have faith when they show such little response to this.

This means that they approve of this system and feel that this is the proper way the game should be handled.

I had faith in this company. I defended this company but now… I do not feel that they deserve it based on their complete and utter lack of response and transparency on the matter.

Unless they make some changes on how this is handled (ie: respond with some sort of logic or actual acknowledgement on the system and why it’s here) then I believe they will lose customers and also spawn a bad press.

Bad press spreads quickly.

This entire thread is just /facepalm

c/mon guys you really thought loggin in/out was intended?? 0.0 I think one person here even complained about having to relog to reset DR LOLOLOL.

they created DR on karma and then on their dungeon token nerf update something went wrong and affected the DR on karma. Everyone knew it would get fix thats why the zerg at orr was gigantic. also you can get powr/tough/vit gear through dungeons very fast and easy.