Guild Wars 2

The first two parts ok. The respawn there is really annoying, especially in the bomb run, which is the most broken part of this fractal.

For the clown car I would say. Just kill the Champ and 4 of his adds and be done with it, so you don’t have to end the fractal after the clown car and still can enjoy the last boss

Part 1 is good. No respawns for bomb room or sonic gun room and tone down the number of enemies. Speed up bomb timers and also adjust which dredge will actually pick up the bombs. 20 enemies with Greg Popovich are good enough. He’s a fun fight. More enemies don’t equal good mechanics. Last boss fight is a blast so don’t change it, but lower health of Elementalist. Get rid of enemies in walkway to last boss from Popovich(I know it’s Rabsovich, but I like calling him by the name of the coach for the Spurs).

+1’ed for truth.

They need to play through this fractal and time it. Then compare it to the other tier 3’s. It’s ridiculous.

I would probably keep the final boss though. That is an interesting fight.

The fractal is fine. It does not need to be split up. People who know what they’re doing can beat it in about 30 minutes on average.

However, there are a couple of points in this thread that I do agree with to an extent. The respawn timer for the bombs should be reduced. Having a 60 second timer is more reasonable than the 2-3 minutes. By the timer a bomb explodes, and everyone regroups, the bombs would then be ready to be placed again.

The dredge car should stay as I see it more of an endurance challenge than anything else. Adding a progress bar (I don’t remember there being one) may alleviate some of the issues. Shifting the ‘event’ to focus on the dredge car instead of the waves of dredge could be another way to go.

Ayrilana.1396:

The fractal is fine. It does not need to be split up. People who know what they’re doing can beat it in about 30 minutes on average.

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Show me those people.

quaniesan.8497:

Ayrilana.1396:

The fractal is fine. It does not need to be split up. People who know what they’re doing can beat it in about 30 minutes on average.

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Show me those people.

I think those people that they are referencing are lower levels, there is no way that the clown car is fine at 40s. Just there alone is like 20~15 min.

Nebilim.5127:

quaniesan.8497:

Ayrilana.1396:

The fractal is fine. It does not need to be split up. People who know what they’re doing can beat it in about 30 minutes on average.

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Show me those people.

I think those people that they are referencing are lower levels, there is no way that the clown car is fine at 40s. Just there alone is like 20~15 min.

maybe dredge at lvl 1 is 30 minutes?? but im still gonna say no lol. try it with the lvl 33 debuff. you wont even be past the first room in 30 minutes, rather, youll be wondering what toons all your repair kits are on. lolz

I really hate respawning enemies. It is inconsistent and illogical. Just allow us to kill the annoying dredge, and be done with it. Leave them dead.

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

I really hate respawning enemies. It is inconsistent and illogical. Just allow us to kill the annoying dredge, and be done with it. Leave them dead.

exactly. this fractal should just be taken out until they can fix it. honestly…depending on the debuff if you get dredge its like this…. 2 fractals + maw ( or equivelant ) takes the same amount of time as the 1 dredge fractal. its insanely bad

I think what annoys me the most, is that some dredge can be killed, and don’t respawn, and some respawn infinitely. And these groups are mixed. Like at the part with the bombs, most Dredge respawn, but not all of them. It just doesn’t make any sense, because where are all these endless hordes of Dredge coming from? They just pop up out of nowhere. They don’t emerge from a carrier, like those at the boss. Same with those Dredge at the button room, where are they respawning from? Do they just materialize out of the gratings on the floor?

I understand that the designer of this Fractal was trying to do something interesting with the players having to stay alive, but it just doesn’t work. It’s not fun, it’s annoying. This Fractal would instantly be fixed if all respawning Dredge no longer respawned. That’s it. That’s the only thing that would need to be changed, to make this Fractal work. In fact, I would probably enjoy the Fractal if this was the case.

I think many players would agree with me that this Fractal does not challenge us, it just tries our patience.

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

I think what annoys me the most, is that some dredge can be killed, and don’t respawn, and some respawn infinitely. And these groups are mixed. Like at the part with the bombs, most Dredge respawn, but not all of them. It just doesn’t make any sense, because where are all these endless hordes of Dredge coming from? They just pop up out of nowhere. They don’t emerge from a carrier, like those at the boss. Same with those Dredge at the button room, where are they respawning from? Do they just materialize out of the gratings on the floor?

I understand that the designer of this Fractal was trying to do something interesting with the players having to stay alive, but it just doesn’t work. It’s not fun, it’s annoying. This Fractal would instantly be fixed if all respawning Dredge no longer respawned. That’s it. That’s the only thing that would need to be changed, to make this Fractal work. In fact, I would probably enjoy the Fractal if this was the case.

I think many players would agree with me that this Fractal does not challenge us, it just tries our patience.

+1 for you. well said. no respawning and this would indeed be enjoyable. or atleast flirt with enjoyable lol

Nebilim.5127:

quaniesan.8497:

Ayrilana.1396:

The fractal is fine. It does not need to be split up. People who know what they’re doing can beat it in about 30 minutes on average.

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Show me those people.

I think those people that they are referencing are lower levels, there is no way that the clown car is fine at 40s. Just there alone is like 20~15 min.

About six minutes for a high DPS group at the old scale 48.

Here’s a video I was able to find of a level 48 run. They engage at 3:06 into the video and end at 9:33.

It takes much less time at lower level fractals where the majority of players sit at.

Here’s a group doing the entire fractal in 20 minutes.

And one more of a lower level fractal in a pug group of random classes doing it in 23 minutes.

The point of these links is to show that the fractal length is not completely unreasonable. It’s only when you have unskilled and/or players unfamiliar with the mechanics who don’t work as a team where you’ll have a much longer fractal. This is not the fault of the design of the dungeon.

fixxxxxx dredge((((

the dredge in the car room is great for farming.

the car room is so buggy. I swing at the dredges but no numbers are appearing and I’m not doing any damage. I get invulnerable, but this is a whole different bug.

Other than the real boss being removed, I approve. As I see it, to balance it off fairly in time and difficulty compared to the other fractals, one of these things must be removed (or be heavily adjusted in difficulty)

1. Remove the entire first section, the cages and the buttons. You will now instead start right at the mini golem veteran boss in the fractal.

2. Remove the clown car

The Dredge fractal has one of the toughest mobs in the game (Dredges). It has one of the hardest spots in the game after the “fix”, the button activation part. And it has one of the most “time gated (for whatever the reason that is)” parts of all fractals, the part where you enter one of the two tunnels and especially the clown car.

No matter from which perspective you might be looking at it from, the Dredge Fractal is far in difficulty and time compared to any fractal out there.

blakkrskyrr.7413:

the dredge in the car room is great for farming.

Trust me, if you go in fractals for farming, you are doing something very wrong.

Astralporing.1957:

blakkrskyrr.7413:

the dredge in the car room is great for farming.

Trust me, if you go in fractals for farming, you are doing something very wrong.

you get a +1 cuz waaaat? lol the best response to infinite spawning dredge is that its a good farm? ugh. no. missing the point a tad. but to each their own

wow, its not that hard. there are fewer here and there now, and the bomb run is actually doable now. I don’t mind the long reset timer on the bombs either.. it allows our portal and sanctuary to recharge

please do not reduce the numbers of enemies here. I dont want to have to farm orr for my T6 mats. one good run here will net me 40-60 bags of fine materials

Ayrilana.1396:

The fractal is fine. It does not need to be split up. People who know what they’re doing can beat it in about 30 minutes on average.

However, there are a couple of points in this thread that I do agree with to an extent. The respawn timer for the bombs should be reduced. Having a 60 second timer is more reasonable than the 2-3 minutes. By the timer a bomb explodes, and everyone regroups, the bombs would then be ready to be placed again.

The dredge car should stay as I see it more of an endurance challenge than anything else. Adding a progress bar (I don’t remember there being one) may alleviate some of the issues. Shifting the ‘event’ to focus on the dredge car instead of the waves of dredge could be another way to go.

30min avarage? good one… maybe if u go with a premade experinced team on 40+ … as a pug gl doing it alot less then 1h…
They can make it even harder for all i care but all this trash clearing is pointless…
Reduce trash by 50% in all the silly spots where u just “farm” them , reduce clown car by 50% as well , i dont have any issue with buttons bombs etc… there are good tactics for each case… but all this pointless farming btw …. GG

I don’t know if Dredge fractal is “fine” or “not fine”. It’s just pretty darn boring. It requires tuning. That’s all.

Learn to use spy kits or bring a mezmer. It is only a 30-45min fotm and isn’t hard at all. No reason for it to be fixed.

Wait…spy kits still work?

Kresa.1859:

Ayrilana.1396:

The fractal is fine. It does not need to be split up. People who know what they’re doing can beat it in about 30 minutes on average.

However, there are a couple of points in this thread that I do agree with to an extent. The respawn timer for the bombs should be reduced. Having a 60 second timer is more reasonable than the 2-3 minutes. By the timer a bomb explodes, and everyone regroups, the bombs would then be ready to be placed again.

The dredge car should stay as I see it more of an endurance challenge than anything else. Adding a progress bar (I don’t remember there being one) may alleviate some of the issues. Shifting the ‘event’ to focus on the dredge car instead of the waves of dredge could be another way to go.

30min avarage? good one… maybe if u go with a premade experinced team on 40+ … as a pug gl doing it alot less then 1h…
They can make it even harder for all i care but all this trash clearing is pointless…
Reduce trash by 50% in all the silly spots where u just “farm” them , reduce clown car by 50% as well , i dont have any issue with buttons bombs etc… there are good tactics for each case… but all this pointless farming btw …. GG

Read the rest of the thread. I made another post with videos on people completing it in 20-25 minutes at various fractal levels. I believe two of them were pug groups.

Dredge are just cheap.
Immu to blind → quite a lot of CC in pve is based on it → it sucks.
perma protection
perma regen
dazing mobs
hard hitting ranged mobs
shockwaves which from last part I can’t reflect with WoR.

+ there are hundreds of them always.

Button event is stupid. This game does not have aggro managment skills, so how on earth we should really do it? How on earth can I force those tunneling mobs go elsewhere and not attack this player on gate?
Get thief/mesmer/ stealth? Really? So now we have content which requires stealth?
Anet guys can’t even show this to us. Why? Because they suck in their own game badly. They have dev pillow for that type of content.

Lucky.9421:

Wait…spy kits still work?

Yes, but only for 10 secondes as there is now a 60 seconds cooldown.

Here are some simple fix for this fractal:
1) Remove bomb suicide part
2) Reduce a bit the amount of dredge in the fractal globally (but mostly on the clown car).
3) Remove the first 2 switch that open the big room with the console (but keep the big room with the console). It’s overall a waste of time in my opinion but I kinda like that big room. No wonder people were skipping to this part using various glitches.

Then we’d have a fun dredge fractal ! I hope Anet sees this. Please, pretty please?

Stability helps from getting dazed. Several classes can steal/remove boons from enemies. My advice is for people to ignore all the current guides and take a serious look into how to quickly and efficiently do each fractal. A lot of the current guides were done by a few people that the community then accepted as the norm. These may or may not be the best way to do things.

The only problem I have is with the bomb door room. Without having specific classes with your group, it really is a suicide room even with trying to clear some of them out.

And maybe having a slower respawn timer with the button-gate switch room.

1. They should really change the 2-button part, so you only ever need to stand on 1 at a time, not BOTH. Many classes defense is based on mobility.

2. The bomb part is just painful, it’s run in, drop bombs, die. Repeat till doors open. That’s a terrible mechanic.

3. The clown-car is just stupid. Change it so we have to first fight the waves of dredge, AND THEN the boss pops out at the end! As it stands, all everyone does is glitch the boss so the group de-aggros, and you fight the boss solo anyway. And less dredge in that clown car, maybe like 25 or 30, instead of the 100+ that seem to pop out….

But honestly??? The ENTIRE Dredge fractal can be fixed with this simple change…

NO MOTHERkittenING GODkitten DREDGE RESPAWNS.
All fixed.

quaniesan.8497:

Ayrilana.1396:

The fractal is fine. It does not need to be split up. People who know what they’re doing can beat it in about 30 minutes on average.

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Show me those people.

Hi. The name’s Penguin. Nice to meet you. Here’s a tip to speed up the Dredge Fractal: Thieves have Stealth, and can run bombs without getting hurt.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

quaniesan.8497:

Ayrilana.1396:

The fractal is fine. It does not need to be split up. People who know what they’re doing can beat it in about 30 minutes on average.

.

Show me those people.

Hi. The name’s Penguin. Nice to meet you. Here’s a tip to speed up the Dredge Fractal: Thieves have Stealth, and can run bombs without getting hurt.

Hello. I don’t have a thief in my party, what do i do?

Vissarion.6509:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

quaniesan.8497:

Ayrilana.1396:

The fractal is fine. It does not need to be split up. People who know what they’re doing can beat it in about 30 minutes on average.

.

Show me those people.

Hi. The name’s Penguin. Nice to meet you. Here’s a tip to speed up the Dredge Fractal: Thieves have Stealth, and can run bombs without getting hurt.

Hello. I don’t have a thief in my party, what do i do?

I suggest playing as a Thief. It’s a great profession that has access to extended-duration Stealth.

Dand.8231:

As it stands, all everyone does is glitch the boss so the group de-aggros, and you fight the boss solo anyway.

I am pretty sure that not everyone does this.

Mainly because there are no glitches involved and the group doesn’t drop aggro.

Feel free to share your secrets.

yah not aggro’ing isnt a glitch dewd. its just not aggro’ing.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Hi. The name’s Penguin. Nice to meet you. Here’s a tip to speed up the Dredge Fractal: Thieves have Stealth, and can run bombs without getting hurt.

I wonder if panther-form’d Norns can pick up bombs…? Will have to test this…

Smooth Penguin.5294:

quaniesan.8497:

Ayrilana.1396:

The fractal is fine. It does not need to be split up. People who know what they’re doing can beat it in about 30 minutes on average.

.

Show me those people.

Hi. The name’s Penguin. Nice to meet you. Here’s a tip to speed up the Dredge Fractal: Thieves have Stealth, and can run bombs without getting hurt.

I believe the original discussion was about the fractal that is, without skipping/bypassing parts of it. Because, you know, if you do skip/bypass those parts as a matter of course, then they can be safely removed without losing anything.

I say the only things that maybe need changed are the following:

1. Lower the respawn rate in the first room.
2. Make the bombs respawn faster.
3. Make it so the dredge in the bomb room only respawn when the bombs do.

Otherwise, it’s fine as is.

They don’t seem to test their own content. And also they can’t really play it as the last developper thingy on Twitch showed. It was a diefest.

There are many indicators that they don’t test their own content properly like the dungeon rewards inappropriate (SE2 1g and CoF1 1g, WTF!?!?)

I was sure they would fix the dredge fractal with this update, seeing how people hate it so much. I’m honestly kinda surprised they didn’t.

Things I want to add :

• I wish the pressure plates on the first part were bigger, maybe covering the whole corner where they are located. Standing still and not dodging is generally a really bad idea in GW2, and expecting people to do just that, while having to survive respawning waves of enemies who are also all immune to blind, feels like a bad idea. It would be much better if they make it so that even if you dodge and move around, as long as you don’t leave that small corner of the room the switch is pressed down.
• Make condition damage more useful on the final boss. Maybe make it take 0 damage from all attacks and immune to conditions when it’s not heated, instead of magnifying damage when it is.
• I agree Bomb room seriously needs to change, but making dredges not respawn at all is kinda defeating the purpose I think. If you can just kill all the dredge, why have a door at all? I think there should be other ways to fix that room(options including a complete redesign).
• I know dredges are immune to blind for lore reasons, but blind is such a big part of many play styles and builds, rendering them completely useless for a fractal this long is a bit too much, and doesn’t really add much to the experience in my opinion.(same can be said about Defiance mechanic, but another topic) Maybe mix up the monster composition a bit, so only a part of the enemies are immune to blind? Or make them resistant to blind, not immune?

Not sure if anyone already noticed this or if it’s just a bug:
We were lucky to get dredge 3 times in a row on 40+ today.
Well, two times we got the controller in the first room to 90% when one died.
Panel closed I stepped on the platform again and we got 20% of the controller again.
Both times we activated the next checkpoint. If its that way, I can live with that.

I hate the dredge fractal as it is now, but I think it would be fine with three minor changes:

1. Slightly increase the time between respawns in the switch/cage area
2. Reduce the total number of dredge in the bomb room
3. Halve the number of dredge that spawn from the “clown car”

Up this. It’s interesting that Anet has been suspiciously quiet about this. Yes, I’m calling you out. I know for a fact that you probably struggle to provide an explanation right now, but at least say something.

For the Control panel room, here’s how you should do it:

Two players per side. Each side has a heavy stand on the plate, while the other player fends off attacks. The 5th player, a Theif, Stealths and activates the control panel.

Thieves are the single best profession to have when you roll the Dredge Fractal.

Well, I’d love to see a Dev team on dredge at lvl 40+ beating it in a time comperable to other fractals at the same tier like aetherblade^^

I disagree:

1. Button room: Remove entirely
2. Bomb room: Remove entirely, replace with already-implemented cannon-room.
3. Keep clown car boss the same.
4. Keep end bosses the same.

Boom! Fixed. Skillful play is rewarded (as in most of the game), and the honest difficulty is retained while removing the gimmicky trash mechanics.

Basically removing the whole level? That would be a waste. The fractal really isn’t that bad, but if you want to improve it, you have to tackle the problems directly. Not by removing each problem section entirely, but by fixing what’s wrong with it. And the answer to that is all the respawning. That is why the button room is so annoying, and that is why the bomb part is so annoying.

Neither of those sections would be hard if you could just clear the enemies and be done with it. Just ridding this fractal of all the nonsense respawning, would instantly shave a lot of time from the fractal as well. For the clown car, just reduce the number of dredge, and reduce the health on the dredge boss. That fight outstays its welcome quickly.

I don’t see a problem with the clown-car fight now that they’ve reduced the boss’ damage. The main problem stems from the infinite spawning mobs by a gimmick troll mechanic instead of actually a challenging and entertaining mechanic.

Toroxus.9256:

I don’t see a problem with the clown-car fight now that they’ve reduced the boss’ damage. The main problem stems from the infinite spawning mobs by a gimmick troll mechanic instead of actually a challenging and entertaining mechanic.

I kind of feel it takes too long to kill him still. And the constant dredge waves coming out of that clown car are just stupid. Just yesterday me and my team drove the dredge boss in a corner and killed him (which took a very long time and was pretty boring). Next we waited outside the clown car till dredge spawned, and killed them. Then we waited… more dredge, we killed them too. Wait again…. more dredge.

I think I lost count how many waves of dredge we got. But every single time it was the same deal. Dredge spawn in the same spot, we kill them instantly, and then you wait. It is as if none of the other dredge in that clown car looked out the window and thought to them selves “Boy, that didn’t seem to go very well, maybe we should get out of here”. For me they could easily half that number of waves. One or two waves is more than enough. This isn’t even the main boss. Why make it take so long, and introduce no new mechanics at any point?

What they could do, is give the dredge boss some sort of new dangerous attack when he reaches <50% HP. Then at least something happens.

Agreed that the respawning is the main issue. Players have a tendency to skip mobs as it is (and from past experience, ANet doesn’t like skipping). Making it so that clearing out the Dredge so people can activate buttons/run bombs unmolested would solve both problems.