Guild Wars 2

Besides the fact we have no idea the true extent of Shining blade or Order of whisper knowledge, and thus cannot even attempt to guess at what they do or do not know.

Also, there is nothing making the Charr “the best race evar and no other group can compete!”…

Kalavier.1097:

Besides the fact we have no idea the true extent of Shining blade or Order of whisper knowledge, and thus cannot even attempt to guess at what they do or do not know.

Also, there is nothing making the Charr “the best race evar and no other group can compete!”…

It’s generally assumed the sylvari are currently the “bestest race evarrrr!!!!!!”.

Ascalon is now an even more barren wasteland than it was before. All of the great human structures lie in ruins, and have been pathed over by grotesque metal bases by the Charr. And between it all, the Brand and it’s creatures terrorize the area. If Queen Jenna decided to have a big Charr massacre, good for her. I have little to no sympathy for those oversized horned cats. But Kryta is my home away from home, and I frankly couldn’t care less for Ascalon. It’s a ruin of a dead kingdom, full of dead people, and soon to be dead Charr. There is no glory to find there, but rocks and bones.

I don’t see how Ascalon is a barren wasteland now. You’ll have to explain that to me.

It has farms, rivers, lakes (of clean water bar one or two which the Iron legion actively clean of Tar), forests, grassy plains, etc.

How is that a wasteland? And it’s nowhere close to being ‘soon to be full of dead charr’. Yes there are lots of threats in Ascalon (flame legion, ghosts, renegades, ogres, etc), but they aren’t THAT seriously threatening to the legions as it stands given they all fight each other. Now true if they all teamed up, but that’ll never happen.

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

Ascalon is now an even more barren wasteland than it was before. All of the great human structures lie in ruins, and have been pathed over by grotesque metal bases by the Charr. And between it all, the Brand and it’s creatures terrorize the area. If Queen Jenna decided to have a big Charr massacre, good for her. I have little to no sympathy for those oversized horned cats. But Kryta is my home away from home, and I frankly couldn’t care less for Ascalon. It’s a ruin of a dead kingdom, full of dead people, and soon to be dead Charr. There is no glory to find there, but rocks and bones.

……….How in the hell can you say Ascalon is worse off now then it was just after the searing?

kitten I’m still not even sure how Ascalon survived as long as it did with what looked like tar where water should have been.

It was tar. See . . . ? It was all over the place where water used to be due to, I’m guessing, all the ash runoff over time and the intense heat from the Searing.

Celestina.2894:

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

Ascalon is now an even more barren wasteland than it was before. All of the great human structures lie in ruins, and have been pathed over by grotesque metal bases by the Charr. And between it all, the Brand and it’s creatures terrorize the area. If Queen Jenna decided to have a big Charr massacre, good for her. I have little to no sympathy for those oversized horned cats. But Kryta is my home away from home, and I frankly couldn’t care less for Ascalon. It’s a ruin of a dead kingdom, full of dead people, and soon to be dead Charr. There is no glory to find there, but rocks and bones.

……….How in the hell can you say Ascalon is worse off now then it was just after the searing?

kitten I’m still not even sure how Ascalon survived as long as it did with what looked like tar where water should have been.

There was tar there. As my brother said, if the Charr hadn’t killed almost everybody in Ascalon city before the foefire, starvation and disease would’ve finished the job.

I’d sign up right then and there to reclaim the glory of Ascalon as my warrior (hails from Ebonhawke, ancestors were my chars from GW1 and were Ascalonian) and if any one of those walking carpets tried to stop him, he’d turn them into a new rug.

I think if humans reclaimed Ascalon, the ghost problem would be gone. Adelbern’s ghost CLEARLY has communication skills for a phantasm, and the only reason you fight him in AC is because you are with a scumbag Charr, and a drunkard Norn.

Reassert Human Dominance, and Adelbern will tell the ghosts to lay down arms. Ghosts are just mad because Charr are kittening everywhere!

Also stop talking, because if we’re having a serious discussion here, Jennah nor any Krytan has any kittening business in Ascalon, so if an army were to be raised, it should be by the Player Character, and other dominant descendants of Ascalons. Thackarey counts.

Ascalon is for Ascalonians. kitten your jungle-dwelling, primitive, wishy-washy, ex-Mursaat worshipping rats.

Omar Aschi Popp.7496:

I think if humans reclaimed Ascalon, the ghost problem would be gone. Adelbern’s ghost CLEARLY has communication skills for a phantasm, and the only reason you fight him in AC is because you are with a scumbag Charr, and a drunkard Norn.

Reassert Human Dominance, and Adelbern will tell the ghosts to lay down arms. Ghosts are just mad because Charr are kittening everywhere!

Also stop talking, because if we’re having a serious discussion here, Jennah nor any Krytan has any kittening business in Ascalon, so if an army were to be raised, it should be by the Player Character, and other dominant descendants of Ascalons. Thackarey counts.

Ascalon is for Ascalonians. kitten your jungle-dwelling, primitive, wishy-washy, ex-Mursaat worshipping rats.

The ghosts attack everybody, including humans in the open field.

The only way to stop them is to end the foefire.

Also, Ascalonians can’t retake Ascalon. Not without Krytan Aid.

Amusing how Ascalon doomed itself by following Adelbern. If Rurik had been in power, Ascalon may have withstood the years. Or at least lasted far longer. Kryta offered military and other aid to them during the civil war, but Adelbern refused and likely murdered the ambassador.

The combined might of Ebonhawke and Kryta couldn’t even take Ascalon. It’s stated in Sea of Sorrows that Kryta simply doesn’t have that kind of power. They were sacrificing hundreds of soldiers at a time simply to defend Ebonhawke. It’s stated that to beat charr in battle they need to be overwhelmed with expected high loss. That’s why using tactics that work on charr didn’t work on the Risen. The loss ofso many soldiers only strengthened the Risen.

Humanity would need more allies than just the two kingdoms. Defense almost always takes less resources than offensive campaigns. Espescially one big enough to defeat 4 separate nations. (The Flame legion wouldn’t stand idle after working so hard to beat Ascalonian humans). And as Kalavier said, the human alliance would still be committing to fighting the enraged ghosts of Ascalon as well.

They’d have to fight off the ghosts, flame legion, and ogres for sure.

And the counter attacks from Ash, Blood, and Iron legion. We know Blood legion has their own citadel somewhere, so effectively the Charr could simply relocate their main headquarters there and charge back.

Humanity’s ONLY hope of reclaiming Ascalon would be swiftly taking EVERYTHING south of the wall, and plugging the holes in the wall and using it to take the brunt of the counter attack. But the brand throws a knot in that plan.

The ghosts especially. You can bet that Adelbern will see the “Krytans” as another enemy to kick out of Ascalon, and the ghosts will continue to attack them.

Zaxares.5419:

The ghosts especially. You can bet that Adelbern will see the “Krytans” as another enemy to kick out of Ascalon, and the ghosts will continue to attack them.

ESPECIALLY the ghosts, for your reasons exactly. He still holds onto some understanding of his surroundings. Seeing Krytans holding Ascalon? He would not be happy.

Omar Aschi Popp.7496:

I think if humans reclaimed Ascalon, the ghost problem would be gone. Adelbern’s ghost CLEARLY has communication skills for a phantasm, and the only reason you fight him in AC is because you are with a scumbag Charr, and a drunkard Norn.

Reassert Human Dominance, and Adelbern will tell the ghosts to lay down arms. Ghosts are just mad because Charr are kittening everywhere!

Also stop talking, because if we’re having a serious discussion here, Jennah nor any Krytan has any kittening business in Ascalon, so if an army were to be raised, it should be by the Player Character, and other dominant descendants of Ascalons. Thackarey counts.

Ascalon is for Ascalonians. kitten your jungle-dwelling, primitive, wishy-washy, ex-Mursaat worshipping rats.

Wowsers! And I thought I was bad lol.

Kalavier.1097:

Omar Aschi Popp.7496:

I think if humans reclaimed Ascalon, the ghost problem would be gone. Adelbern’s ghost CLEARLY has communication skills for a phantasm, and the only reason you fight him in AC is because you are with a scumbag Charr, and a drunkard Norn.

Reassert Human Dominance, and Adelbern will tell the ghosts to lay down arms. Ghosts are just mad because Charr are kittening everywhere!

Also stop talking, because if we’re having a serious discussion here, Jennah nor any Krytan has any kittening business in Ascalon, so if an army were to be raised, it should be by the Player Character, and other dominant descendants of Ascalons. Thackarey counts.

Ascalon is for Ascalonians. kitten your jungle-dwelling, primitive, wishy-washy, ex-Mursaat worshipping rats.

The ghosts attack everybody, including humans in the open field.

The only way to stop them is to end the foefire.

Also, Ascalonians can’t retake Ascalon. Not without Krytan Aid.

Amusing how Ascalon doomed itself by following Adelbern. If Rurik had been in power, Ascalon may have withstood the years. Or at least lasted far longer. Kryta offered military and other aid to them during the civil war, but Adelbern refused and likely murdered the ambassador.

Now now Kav, let’s not make silly assumptions. Ascalon didn’t doom itself, The Charr and Titans did through Abaddon resources. If you go back far enough you could legitimately argue the 5 gods themselves doomed Ascalon when they both transplanted the humans there, and royally kittened off Abaddon enough to get back at them by trying to destroy humanity. There wasn’t a nation alive back then that could have withstood Searing magic. If they had all followed Rurik, there wouldn’t even be an Ebon Vanguard or Ebonhawke for that matter. Don’t forget Adelbern’s Foefire vaporized 99% of the Charr in the Ascalon Basin at that time. And like I’ve said before, White Mantle(Krytan) aid back then would have been at the price of slavery for Ascalon(whether Adelbern knew that or not is irrelevant). Also, there’s zero evidence that he murdered that ambassador, nor(before someone says it) Evennia either.

Obsidian.1328:

Also, there’s zero evidence that he murdered that ambassador, nor(before someone says it) Evennia either.

Of course not, at the time of when Adelbern called down the flame, Evennia was currently alive and well and sipping fruit-flavored drinks with little umbrellas in them with Jurah somewhere on a beach in Istan.

Obsidian.1328:

Now now Kav, let’s not make silly assumptions. Ascalon didn’t doom itself, The Charr and Titans did through Abaddon resources. If you go back far enough you could legitimately argue the 5 gods themselves doomed Ascalon when they both transplanted the humans there, and royally kittened off Abaddon enough to get back at them by trying to destroy humanity. There wasn’t a nation alive back then that could have withstood Searing magic. If they had all followed Rurik, there wouldn’t even be an Ebon Vanguard or Ebonhawke for that matter. Don’t forget Adelbern’s Foefire vaporized 99% of the Charr in the Ascalon Basin at that time. And like I’ve said before, White Mantle(Krytan) aid back then would have been at the price of slavery for Ascalon(whether Adelbern knew that or not is irrelevant). Also, there’s zero evidence that he murdered that ambassador, nor(before someone says it) Evennia either.

A: I never said they’d prevent the searing. I’m talking post-searing.
B: I’m saying if Rurik was king, he’d accept the aid from the white mantle, which could have changed things drastically.
C: No evidence that they’d be ‘enslaved’ by the White mantle. Or that the white mantle would go after them much. Do recall they basically left Ascalon settlement entirely alone until the Krytan Civil war.
D: He didn’t murder the ambassador we met early in proph. RURIK stopped that one. Evannia however, was barred from Ascalon City, and her last time seen EVER was outside the city waiting for Adelbern to see her. Then she disappeared. Given how LAST time a Krytan ambassador was standing outside the City offering Aid, and Adelbern went after the man to arrest and make him stand trial for TREASON (Likely a death penality)… and ONLY Rurik stopped that, I fail to see how it’s NOT the most reasonable assumption that Adelbern murdered Evennia.

Basically, had Rurik been in charge post searing (or maybe even Barriden), Ascalon likely would’ve gotten aid, even if it was just food and medicine.

And that would’ve changed the prospects. Hell, in the Civil War Kryta basically sent Evennia there with a message of “Let the EbonVanguard aid us, and we will provide support to Ascalon, INCLUDING MILITARY AID.”

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Obsidian.1328:

Also, there’s zero evidence that he murdered that ambassador, nor(before someone says it) Evennia either.

Of course not, at the time of when Adelbern called down the flame, Evennia was currently alive and well and sipping fruit-flavored drinks with little umbrellas in them with Jurah somewhere on a beach in Istan.

Yeaaah I’m with Tobias here, given our knowledge of Adelbern’s increasingly addled brain combined with the lack of Rurik to stop him, I think it’s very likely he at least did something with Evennia.

Celestina.2894:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Obsidian.1328:

Also, there’s zero evidence that he murdered that ambassador, nor(before someone says it) Evennia either.

Of course not, at the time of when Adelbern called down the flame, Evennia was currently alive and well and sipping fruit-flavored drinks with little umbrellas in them with Jurah somewhere on a beach in Istan.

Yeaaah I’m with Tobias here, given our knowledge of Adelbern’s increasingly addled brain combined with the lack of Rurik to stop him, I think it’s very likely he at least did something with Evennia.

Did . . . something? Or did nothing?

These are the hard-hitting questions for which ANet has no answers. What’s there to hide? Huh? What’s there to hide?

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Celestina.2894:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Obsidian.1328:

Also, there’s zero evidence that he murdered that ambassador, nor(before someone says it) Evennia either.

Of course not, at the time of when Adelbern called down the flame, Evennia was currently alive and well and sipping fruit-flavored drinks with little umbrellas in them with Jurah somewhere on a beach in Istan.

Yeaaah I’m with Tobias here, given our knowledge of Adelbern’s increasingly addled brain combined with the lack of Rurik to stop him, I think it’s very likely he at least did something with Evennia.

Did . . . something? Or did nothing?

These are the hard-hitting questions for which ANet has no answers. What’s there to hide? Huh? What’s there to hide?

Boils down to basically either Adelbern personally murdered/imprisoned Evennia (murdered by treason charge basically. or he stabbed her), or she was killed or captured by something else while she was waiting outside of Ascalon city or when she tried returning to Kryta. Charr, bandits, Stone Summit remnants, who knows.

Firs of all, Kalavier & Co, you aren’t really hearing me; When I said humans, I really meant Ascalonians, and said as much when I wrote that only Ascalons have the right to raise an army to reclaim Ascalon.

All you people talking about ghosts aren’t listening; If ASCALONIANS made amends with Adelbern, who clearly is able to have a conversation, the ghosts would not be a problem.

Do I have to spell it out? No Charr, no Krytans, no anything not from Ascalon! I believe the spirits will rest, or at the very least be amicable if Ascalon is under Ascalonian control.

Because funfact; Krytans are the enemy! Last time I checked, Adelbern was the last sovereign Ruler of Ascalon, and his standing policy with Kryta never went away, so as an Ascalonian citizen, you have to respect that. It doesn’t matter if he murdered Evennia himself or not, it’s his bloody prerogative! Why is it okay for Shining Blade assassins to murder people but not okay for a legitimate Ruling sovereign power?

Get off you high horses people.

Omar Aschi Popp.7496:

Firs of all, Kalavier & Co, you aren’t really hearing me; When I said humans, I really meant Ascalonians, and said as much when I wrote that only Ascalons have the right to raise an army to reclaim Ascalon.

So, Krytans have no right to reclaim Ascalon because they were born in a place not ruled by the charr this last generation or so? I mean, those in the Ascalon Settlement who have been living in Kryta aren’t welcome either?

Totally legit.

All you people talking about ghosts aren’t listening; If ASCALONIANS made amends with Adelbern, who clearly is able to have a conversation, the ghosts would not be a problem.

I am not so sure. Adelbern was able to hold a conversation even way back before Nightfall happened. He was still just as unreasonable, so I don’t know what you’d expect.

I would fully expect there to be no reasoning with him by anyone, even if somehow we got the spirit of Rurik to return somehow and talk to him the conversation would descend into “this is why I banished you in the first place”.

Do I have to spell it out? No Charr, no Krytans, no anything not from Ascalon! I believe the spirits will rest, or at the very least be amicable if Ascalon is under Ascalonian control.

It’s good to believe something like that. On the other hand, I want to point out there are no reasons to believe it and every reason to believe the Foefire ghosts will continue to (attempt to) chase out everyone and anyone.

Because funfact; Krytans are the enemy! Last time I checked, Adelbern was the last sovereign Ruler of Ascalon, and his standing policy with Kryta never went away, so as an Ascalonian citizen, you have to respect that. It doesn’t matter if he murdered Evennia himself or not, it’s his bloody prerogative! Why is it okay for Shining Blade assassins to murder people but not okay for a legitimate Ruling sovereign power?

A few things. First, it’s not said where the last round of Guild Wars started except that Orr, Kryta, and Ascalon were all fighting each other through the guilds. Adelbern was leader of one of the guilds, so it’s likely he may have been the aggressor and not the victim. Of course, we don’t know but we do know he was happy to keep the Guild Wars rolling right up until the Searing happened.

Secondly, if I’m not an Ascalonian citizen (I checked my passport) I don’t have to respect anything. And considering if we’re talking about my character . . . he exiled my ancestor along with a whole bunch of people. We’re probably considered descended from traitors to the crown. Same with those in Ebonhawke, who were sent away for being too popular with the people (which is how Adelbern became king).

Third, I don’t say he murdered Evennia or had her killed. (Much as I kid, there’s just no proof of it. I’d say the White Mantle Ambassador had it done before thinking Adelbern would bother himself with it.) And even if so, it’s less it being his privilege/right and more about murdering someone who was operating under a flag of truce. There are rules about that kind of thing, and you don’t shoot someone who came to discuss terms of peace because they happen to be from the other side.

Lastly. The Shining Blade was a known, and avowed terrorist organization before it became legitimized as the bodyguard of the Krytan royal line. (If you want to split hairs over “freedom fighter vs terrorist”, get your own topic please.) A legitimate ruling power doesn’t do assassinations. They do executions. In various lovely ways!

Get off you high horses people.

There aren’t any horses and centaurs won’t let me ride after that incident with the ice cream.

And to say it again – I’d welcome taking back Orr more than Ascalon. It’s a holy land, where the Six Gods first entered Tyria and also lived for a time. It’s meant to be in human hands once more, restored to even a fraction of its former glory. And all you would need to do is tell the Pact to restrict their presence to Fort Trinity until they could acquire or build their own independent facility elsewhere.

. . . and deal with the leftover Risen, but that’s easier than killing off Foefire ghosts. At least Risen don’t reform endlessly.

Nit-pick, there aren’t horses ingame but there are in the lore. It’s how the founder of the white mantle ended up with the Mursaat, they rode him out of Kryta and dumped him :P

And yeah, Almost all of the ghosts can’t see anything living as something but an enemy. Hell, IIRC, Warmaster Grast inside ascalon catacombs still thinks it’s around the time of the foefire (or before), and doesn’t know so long as passed.

First off, whenever I say “Ascalonian” I mean anyone with blood-lineage. I was born in Germany, I’ve been living in Canada since I was 6 for the last 22 years. I do not Identify as Canadian. I am German. So the descendants of the Settlement, and those of all Vanguard are by right Ascalon citizens.

Tobias, your entire reasoning is based on the massive assumption that I didn’t fully support with Adelbern to begin with, from day 1.

Get off your moral trip and humor me for one minute; You go to AC with a party of human characters, all direct descendants of people from Pre-Searing, meet with your ancestral King and say “Hey Lord Adelbern, we are here to bring back Ascalon, and destroy the Charr, what do you need done?!”

From there all you have to do is unify and rally Ebonhawke, which would be EASY since at least half the population are Seperatists!! The ghosts of Ascalon, which at the very least almost number 2/3rds of the Charr. Krytan Ex-Pats under your own leadership(Because Logan is a weak piece of kitten who kittens to that slag Jennah and doesn’t think for himself or the people who bore him). Then you have all the Champions of Old Ascalon! Oh the glory!

And hell, murder Rytlock, it would be so easy! With Ruricks sword in hand AND Ascalon blood, you are legitimized to lead the living detachment of the combined army, after all that’s how Adelbern became king.

Also kittening MAGIC guys, Magic! The foefire, the Searing, all that kitten was magic. Implying you actually need manpower to destroy your enemies.

Also the whole question of this thread is “Would you fight to reclaim Ascalon?”

Not “would you fight in a sure-thing winnable land war that you can plan meticulously on this thread and never have to worry about the possibility of utter annihilation?”

But I guess the OP was vague about who you’d be fighting for to “reclaim” Ascalon.

Omar Aschi Popp.7496:

Tobias, your entire reasoning is based on the massive assumption that I didn’t fully support with Adelbern to begin with, from day 1.

You support a madman willing to see his entire nation die rather then ask for help and have hope? A man who banished people because they spoke out against him (and that’s it). A man who literally on the day the Ebon Vanguard left to go south, had dozens of families pack up and leave, and only two options were given for it. “Pride of the unit” or “Fear of the king” and it’s implied to purely be the latter.

Get off your moral trip and humor me for one minute; You go to AC with a party of human characters, all direct descendants of people from Pre-Searing, meet with your ancestral King and say “Hey Lord Adelbern, we are here to bring back Ascalon, and destroy the Charr, what do you need done?!”

A: Adelbern would see humans, not Ascalonians. I doubt he could just look at you are be able to figure it out.
B: Implies he reforms and is at all reasonable given his sword is now gone and there is a priory camp inside the catacombs. Note he openly attacked the two Ascalonian’s in “Ghosts of Ascalon” and in order to Reach him (or draw him out), they’d basically have to slaughter their way through the ghosts.

[/quote]From there all you have to do is unify and rally Ebonhawke, which would be EASY since at least half the population are Seperatists!! The ghosts of Ascalon, which at the very least almost number 2/3rds of the Charr. Krytan Ex-Pats under your own leadership(Because Logan is a weak piece of kitten who kittens to that slag Jennah and doesn’t think for himself or the people who bore him). Then you have all the Champions of Old Ascalon! Oh the glory![/quote]

Proof seperatists = half of Ebonhawke’s population? I never even got that indication.

I also doubt the ghosts are equal to 2/3rds of the charr population, given their numbers are entirely stagnant and were outnumbered back then.
Also, nothing implies Logan grew up in Ebonhawke instead of Kryta. Infact given how his brotherjoined the Seraph when Logan was a kid, it implies he lived in Kryta first.

And hell, murder Rytlock, it would be so easy! With Ruricks sword in hand AND Ascalon blood, you are legitimized to lead the living detachment of the combined army, after all that’s how Adelbern became king.

YES, because it’d be so easy to murder Rytlock Brimstone, TRIBUNE of the blood legion, member of the Edge of Destiny, wielder of an ancient blade which is one of few that can actually cut dragon scales…

Also kittening MAGIC guys, Magic! The foefire, the Searing, all that kitten was magic. Implying you actually need manpower to destroy your enemies.

Foefire happened once. It also ruined the ‘manpower’ as almost all of them are stuck ‘repeating’ the same moments (in their minds at least), if not are mindless in attacking the living. Also the fact both blades which could stop or possibly cause it again are kinda not in human hands at all.

Also the whole question of this thread is “Would you fight to reclaim Ascalon?”

Not “would you fight in a sure-thing winnable land war that you can plan meticulously on this thread and never have to worry about the possibility of utter annihilation?”

But I guess the OP was vague about who you’d be fighting for to “reclaim” Ascalon.

It’s a what if situation. What’s wrong in actually talking about the details of the what if and having an intelligent discussion about it?

Omar Aschi Popp.7496:

Tobias, your entire reasoning is based on the massive assumption that I didn’t fully support with Adelbern to begin with, from day 1.

Oh? No, that’s not the assumption. The assumption is that my character is in some way descended from the guy who got kicked out of Ascalon with Prince Rurik, and therefore has some stake in remembering the old histories.

Heck, the only thing I assumed about you was that you weren’t aware Adelbern went coocoo for Quaggan Puffs some time close after the Searing.

Get off your moral trip and humor me for one minute

Firstly, King Adelbern isn’t my ancestral king since he threw Tobias Trueflight (first of his name) into the wilderness for supporting Prince Rurik. That makes my liege Rurik instead. Alas, he sort of caught a case of the death.

As for the concept of asking him that? Hm . . . no. I don’t think it would work. Frankly, I expect he’d see it as a transparent trick to weaken him or his forces and kick you out.

From there all you have to do is unify and rally Ebonhawke, which would be EASY since at least half the population are Seperatists!! The ghosts of Ascalon, which at the very least almost number 2/3rds of the Charr. Krytan Ex-Pats under your own leadership(Because Logan is a weak piece of kitten who kittens to that slag Jennah and doesn’t think for himself or the people who bore him). Then you have all the Champions of Old Ascalon! Oh the glory!

Relies on too many variables to actually happen. Firstly it relies on rallying a populace to war which may not be suited for field combat. (They’ve been fighting on a defensive front, not on offense.) Then it also relies on the charr not being agile enough with their forces to turn around and drop a defense line. Finally, it really relies on the Separatists actually being willing to submit to a leader who is not known to them.

And hell, murder Rytlock, it would be so easy!

If it was so easy, it’d be done already.

With Ruricks sword in hand AND Ascalon blood, you are legitimized to lead the living detachment of the combined army, after all that’s how Adelbern became king.

Here I thought you hadn’t known that detail. But I’m also fairly sure Adelbern remembers that too, and that’s why he wouldn’t let someone else get close to that potential outcome.

Also kittening MAGIC guys, Magic! The foefire, the Searing, all that kitten was magic. Implying you actually need manpower to destroy your enemies.

The Searing’s most important magical effect was breaking the Great Northern Wall, and permitting all that “manpower” of charr warbands to break through en masse rather than sneaking in a little at a time through the catacomb caverns.

Also, there’s another few little details which you lost track of – the charr have armored vehicles. The charr also have the current Tyrian equivalent of ‘greek fire’. Magic is less a force to be reckoned with when it is still wielded by very . . . very vulnerable flesh.

Also the whole question of this thread is “Would you fight to reclaim Ascalon?”

Not “would you fight in a sure-thing winnable land war that you can plan meticulously on this thread and never have to worry about the possibility of utter annihilation?”

But I guess the OP was vague about who you’d be fighting for to “reclaim” Ascalon.

As a commander in the Pact, I’d fight to reclaim it for Tyrians from Kralkatorrik’s Dragonbrand.

As a descendant of Ascalon, I’d fight for it to remain safe for humans to live there, in whatever arrangement is given.

As a ranger, I’d probably leave the fighting to the warrior and guardian zerg.

Kalavier.1097:

. A man who literally on the day the Ebon Vanguard left to go south, had dozens of families pack up and leave, and only two options were given for it. “Pride of the unit” or “Fear of the king” and it’s implied to purely be the latter.

Oh come on, Kalavier, we’ve been on this before. I believe Nicholas would have to chime in: “That lore doesn’t count because reasons.”

A: Adelbern would see humans, not Ascalonians. I doubt he could just look at you are be able to figure it out.

Or believe whatever you had to say about it.

B: Implies he reforms and is at all reasonable given his sword is now gone and there is a priory camp inside the catacombs. Note he openly attacked the two Ascalonian’s in “Ghosts of Ascalon” and in order to Reach him (or draw him out), they’d basically have to slaughter their way through the ghosts.

Exhibit A for why he would probably not believe you loyal sons/daughters of Ascalon.

YES, because it’d be so easy to murder Rytlock Brimstone, TRIBUNE of the blood legion, member of the Edge of Destiny, wielder of an ancient blade which is one of few that can actually cut dragon scales…

I could see it being done, there are many ways to make it happen from “accident” to “round up a few dozen people and tell them he drops guaranteed precursors”.

. . . but the chances are slim you’d actually survive the attempt and get out with Sohothin and your hide intact.

It’s a what if situation. What’s wrong in actually talking about the details of the what if and having an intelligent discussion about it?

Well, it’s wrong to actually discuss it and disagree with details rather than just stand up and say “yes” or “no”. I mean, what kind of people actually consider things both IC and OOC for why something would or would not work out?

Oh, and the fact pretty much all surviving Ascalonians, in Adelberns eyes are traitors (Those who followed Rurik), or ones he exiled for being too popular/speaking out against him (Ebon Vanguard and the civilians that went with them).

Not the people I see him eagerly working with.

I dunno you guys, I just did Twilight Arbor 1st time yesterday, and I could have backstabbed him in the neck like 7 times before he got mad and left. And I’m not even a theif! (badum-tisss)

It’s easier when they trust you.
Also you could totally dupe that idiot Logan into helping you. That guy…

Yeah, there is a thing called armor. And if you approached from behind Caithe would’ve seen you swinging and warned him.

I’m starting to think you sound suspiciously a lot like a Charr-loving sympathizer.

Or I understand somebody like Rytlock is not going to be easy to kill unless you are a dragon or a giant.

Kalavier.1097:

Or I understand somebody like Rytlock is not going to be easy to kill unless you are a dragon or a giant.

One does not have to be a dragon or a giant to kill one Charr (unless game mechanics turn him into a Legendary). Rytlock is a big bulky Charr, they always were rather easy to kill.

Omar Aschi Popp.7496:

I’m starting to think you sound suspiciously a lot like a Charr-loving sympathizer.

I’m starting to think you’re sounding a lot less like someone who wants to reclaim a homeland and more like someone who wouldn’t be satisfied until all charr were wiped out.

What you pictured happening in your post? Isn’t going to happen. King Adelbern is not a trustworthy ally, the charr have locational advantage in a war trying to invade Ascalon, and Ebonhawke isn’t suited for an offensive campaign.

Short of both asura and norn deciding to support such an effort? It’s not going to happen. Given either race don’t have much of an interest in the proposal? Give it a few generations, then talk about it again.

Frosch.7809:

Kalavier.1097:

Or I understand somebody like Rytlock is not going to be easy to kill unless you are a dragon or a giant.

One does not have to be a dragon or a giant to kill one Charr (unless game mechanics turn him into a Legendary). Rytlock is a big bulky Charr, they always were rather easy to kill.

Technically, anything is easy to kill with five people stacking in a corner . . .

Dave.1534:

If Queen Jennah suddenly waged war against the Charr to reclaim Ascalon, would you resist or fight for the cause?

(and of course discuss on ‘why’)

Personally I would. Ever since the searing happened in GW1 I yearned for revenge but never really got it :/

I would definitely, at least on my human character, be willing to fight to retake Ascalon. I share the same sentiments as you, I’ve always wanted to retake Ascalon ever since I played through the Searing in the original Guild Wars. Problem is, I don’t see it happening in Guild Wars 2 simply due to how the lore works at the moment.

In Guild Wars 2, the five races (meaning human, charr, asura, sylvari, and norn) are supposed to be allied together in order to fight the Elder Dragons. In addition to that, there’s also the way the game is designed right now. To make it viable for such a thing to happen, the races would have to be somehow divided into factions.

But then how would that work? Three factions? One for sylvari, asura and norn, one for humans, and one for charr? Maybe they could divide them up more evenly somehow, but how? There’s five races, that’s an odd number, and even if they added tengu for example, the racial relations involved wouldn’t make sense for it.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Omar Aschi Popp.7496:

I’m starting to think you sound suspiciously a lot like a Charr-loving sympathizer.

I’m starting to think you’re sounding a lot less like someone who wants to reclaim a homeland and more like someone who wouldn’t be satisfied until all charr were wiped out.

What you pictured happening in your post? Isn’t going to happen. King Adelbern is not a trustworthy ally, the charr have locational advantage in a war trying to invade Ascalon, and Ebonhawke isn’t suited for an offensive campaign.

Short of both asura and norn deciding to support such an effort? It’s not going to happen. Given either race don’t have much of an interest in the proposal? Give it a few generations, then talk about it again.

Yeah, as I said, the only way for humanity to stand a chance is to take everything south of the wall in a blitz campaign, taking out charr camps and settlements below the wall so quickly a call can’t be raised. But Black Citadel throws a serious knot in that plan (with the wall at smokestead… and how the Heros canton can basically become a fort/fire base with zero effort), as well as some other areas.

Disregarding the brand though, which would ruin any army movements and slow it down drastically. Either slow it down or gut it as they rush.

Simply put, west of the brand the Charr could mobilize a crushing counter attack once they got wind of it.

Frosch.7809:

Kalavier.1097:

Or I understand somebody like Rytlock is not going to be easy to kill unless you are a dragon or a giant.

One does not have to be a dragon or a giant to kill one Charr (unless game mechanics turn him into a Legendary). Rytlock is a big bulky Charr, they always were rather easy to kill.

Not always. And Rytlock is a very skilled adventurer, alongside being a skilled and experienced Charr warrior and tribune. He also wears what is surely high quality heavy armor and wields a powerful blade.

Simply going “HEY LET’S KILL RYTLOCK, IT’LL BE EASY!” Is like saying a human can walk up and kill Knut Whitebear no problem.

My point was unless you are a giant or a dragon, I don’t see it being an easy fight to take Rytlock out.

Ehh, I dunno about that. Rytlock keels over after only a couple of slaps from the ghosts in AC Story. He can’t even handle a few gravelings by himself!

Then again, Logan also got his rump handed to him by Councilor Zamon and I basically had to defeat both enemies by myself. :P

Zaxares.5419:

Ehh, I dunno about that. Rytlock keels over after only a couple of slaps from the ghosts in AC Story. He can’t even handle a few gravelings by himself!

Then again, Logan also got his rump handed to him by Councilor Zamon and I basically had to defeat both enemies by myself. :P

If going by that method, almost all friendly forces/characters are useless idiots who can barely take on a single enemy of similar level :P

Kalavier.1097:

Zaxares.5419:

Ehh, I dunno about that. Rytlock keels over after only a couple of slaps from the ghosts in AC Story. He can’t even handle a few gravelings by himself!

Then again, Logan also got his rump handed to him by Councilor Zamon and I basically had to defeat both enemies by myself. :P

If going by that method, almost all friendly forces/characters are useless idiots who can barely take on a single enemy of similar level :P

Except Tybalt, who strangely is always awesome despite being the most useless secret agent which exists in Tyria.

And Warmaster Forgal, who has the amazing power to self-res himself from death as soon as no enemies are within aggro range. XD

Zaxares.5419:

And Warmaster Forgal, who has the amazing power to self-res himself from death as soon as no enemies are within aggro range. XD

He’s a warrior, of course he can do that.

Zaxares.5419:

And Warmaster Forgal, who has the amazing power to self-res himself from death as soon as no enemies are within aggro range. XD

He never dies, he simply takes a nap. :P

Reclaim? Is more violence what you want? Ascalon is nobody’s true homeland. It was unsettled, then settled by charr, then humans, then charr. Getting rid of the separatist movement and the ghosts are the only true priority, really.

War is never really the answer, despite what people seem to think. If the humans and charr just get over themselves and understand that the extreme violence that they’ve enacted upon one another was childish, and subsequently act towards peace and reparations, that would be the way to go.

Good gods folks, they say violence begets more violence but there’s a point where it’s stupid and people start to sound like teenagers who just want to get back at other teenagers over petty squabbles. Grow up folks.

Way to go, Buzz Killington.

100% yes! Lets take back our lands!!

I See No Tomorrow.7302:

Reclaim? Is more violence what you want? Ascalon is nobody’s true homeland. It was unsettled, then settled by charr, then humans, then charr. Getting rid of the separatist movement and the ghosts are the only true priority, really.

War is never really the answer, despite what people seem to think. If the humans and charr just get over themselves and understand that the extreme violence that they’ve enacted upon one another was childish, and subsequently act towards peace and reparations, that would be the way to go.

Good gods folks, they say violence begets more violence but there’s a point where it’s stupid and people start to sound like teenagers who just want to get back at other teenagers over petty squabbles. Grow up folks.

In the Guild Wars universe, war is an answer. It’s not Earth, it’s not real-life, stop acting like our own ideologies and morals pertain to a fantasy setting. They exist independent of our own world, not subjective to it. That’s kind of the point of these games, ya know…we get to do and be things that we can’t do and be in real life. Violence can be as right as rain in a fantasy setting. And it is(or at least used to be) in Tyria.

Kalavier.1097:

Obsidian.1328:

Now now Kav, let’s not make silly assumptions. Ascalon didn’t doom itself, The Charr and Titans did through Abaddon resources. If you go back far enough you could legitimately argue the 5 gods themselves doomed Ascalon when they both transplanted the humans there, and royally kittened off Abaddon enough to get back at them by trying to destroy humanity. There wasn’t a nation alive back then that could have withstood Searing magic. If they had all followed Rurik, there wouldn’t even be an Ebon Vanguard or Ebonhawke for that matter. Don’t forget Adelbern’s Foefire vaporized 99% of the Charr in the Ascalon Basin at that time. And like I’ve said before, White Mantle(Krytan) aid back then would have been at the price of slavery for Ascalon(whether Adelbern knew that or not is irrelevant). Also, there’s zero evidence that he murdered that ambassador, nor(before someone says it) Evennia either.

A: I never said they’d prevent the searing. I’m talking post-searing.
B: I’m saying if Rurik was king, he’d accept the aid from the white mantle, which could have changed things drastically.
C: No evidence that they’d be ‘enslaved’ by the White mantle. Or that the white mantle would go after them much. Do recall they basically left Ascalon settlement entirely alone until the Krytan Civil war.
D: He didn’t murder the ambassador we met early in proph. RURIK stopped that one. Evannia however, was barred from Ascalon City, and her last time seen EVER was outside the city waiting for Adelbern to see her. Then she disappeared. Given how LAST time a Krytan ambassador was standing outside the City offering Aid, and Adelbern went after the man to arrest and make him stand trial for TREASON (Likely a death penality)… and ONLY Rurik stopped that, I fail to see how it’s NOT the most reasonable assumption that Adelbern murdered Evennia.

Basically, had Rurik been in charge post searing (or maybe even Barriden), Ascalon likely would’ve gotten aid, even if it was just food and medicine.

And that would’ve changed the prospects. Hell, in the Civil War Kryta basically sent Evennia there with a message of “Let the EbonVanguard aid us, and we will provide support to Ascalon, INCLUDING MILITARY AID.”

A) The Foefire is GW2
B) Yes, Mantle aid might have helped
C) All the evidence in the world that they’d be enslaved. Kryta proper wasn’t overtly “under the whip” during Mantle control. They let people go on with the day-to-day lives. But make no mistake, the Mantle called the shots. And if they wanted to rip your “chosen” baby out of your arms they would. And probably kill you, or at least imprison you, if you tried to stop them. It was akin to a totalitarian theocracy.
D) That is also GW2

A: That changes my statements, how?
B: And that affects the survivability of Ascalon, so point A.
C; Nope. I highly doubt the White mantle would care enough to hike all the way over there, since it’s such a far hike to the bloodstone. That and the fact they pretty much left the Ascalon settlement almost entirely alone during prophecies, and the first time I recall we hearing about them causing trouble for it was during the war in Kryta, when the White Mantle control was failing. Oh, and your statement doesn’t match up to prophecies either since the white Mantle WERE villians, but there were very good about keeping a friendly face forward, to the point where the heroes only believed it after seeing the White mantle slaughter chosen on the bloodstone really. People thought their kids were being sent off to study in a great temple, not be murdered. They believed it too, and given how it was only 2 or so years after the Mantle came to power, there wasn’t reason to doubt it yet.
D: That is Guild Wars Beyond, Gw1. How is it GW2?