Guild Wars 2

Cool i was not aware of this achievment part.
I must go to Obsidian Sanctum now and start killing people
I can be entertained for hours with just the log trap

ShAdY.7586:

Obsidian Scantum Achievement made me report 20 people, at that point I stopped counting and I am still lieing on the ground, reporting everyone who lays a hand on my mates.

Sorry what? Hahah now this is totally kitten, really reporting for DA BAD GUY KILLED ME! PUNISH ‘EM! =’(

Please, grow up.

I’m going to preempt all the L2P (cuz I have more game experience than all but a select few other players), go away carebear (I have several thousand badges I have no idea what I’m going to do with), etc. I do know how to play. I love WvW and sPvP.

That said, as soon as I saw the dungeon on the achievement list, I knew there was going to be a problem…specifically because I do love WvW and I know that dungeon very well. However, I held my tongue because I wanted to make sure I was right before giving feedback (I’m weird like that).

Obsidian is built for small groups to be able to hold strategic locations against much larger enemy forces. The map is littered with choke points and knockoffs. There is no L2PNUB that’s going to overcome that. A small group of good players getting into the dungeon can make it impossible for anyone not on their server to get past.

Within every group of gamers online, there is a tiny, tiny percentage of griefers. There are also players who are normally decent human beings, but when beaten over the head with an easy opportunity to grief, will take it. ANet didn’t just beat them over the head with the chance, they lit it up in neon and promised an all-you-can-eat seafood buffet with your choice of free drinks and a nice after dinner mint to cleanse the palette afterwards.

So that’s what’s happening. In some cases, it’s not even that small of group. Given that WvW almost always comes down to population (be honest), and the shiny new code that pits slightly lower pop worlds against higher ones, and it’s not just difficult, it can become flat out impossible to get the achievement.

Now, you’re prolly thinking, “You don’t need them all to get the <insert name of shiny here>,” right? Except what if that shiny is completing every single achievement? Just because you might not think that has value doesn’t mean the other million or so players concur with your assessment. I know I don’t. I like knowing I have more worthless achievement points than all but a tiny percentage of the entire playerbase. I like having my achievement page tabs completely filled out.

Luckily for me, I have a tank thief who can sneak to the fountains and from their sneak through the dungeon. Oh, ya, also helps that I know where the fountains are. Also, while my world is currently getting splattered in this week’s matchup, I have hope that we’ll get something a little more even Friday. I’m patient.

But there are players who don’t have my knowledge of the map, a handy thief, nor any chance that their server won’t be running the jump puzzle with the outmanned buff. They’re juvenile felined.

Now, I’m not big of complaints without suggestions for improvement, so here goes a few:

1. Never, ever put a limited time achievement in a WvW area again. Seriously. This problem should never have come up if any of the devs had thought through even a few of the “what if” scenarios.

2. Move the cache to the start of the jump puzzle. It’s not like Obsidian is actually that challenging. The only tricksy part is the dark room, and you kinda get the same experience in Sharky’s in LA. So it’s not like you’re really letting people that much off the hook.

3. This is from another thread, but put an NPC that gives an invuln buff. Players who take the buff cannot remove it except by leaving the puzzle entirely, and players with the buff cannot open the final chest.

4. Turn off the PvP in the map for the duration of the event. Hey, y’all screwed up sending PvE players here, might as well let them play the way they get to play the rest of the game.

5. NEVER EVER PUT A LIMITED TIME ACHIEVEMENT ON A WVW MAP AGAIN. I don’t think I can stress that enough.

But it’s fun killing people in obsidian without even having to do any damage to them :<

Silver.3284:

Anyone seriously offended by people pvp-ing in a pvp zone needs to take a step back and calm down.

We aren’t offended with PvP people PvP-ing ina PvP zone. We’re offended with having to deal with PvP in the middle of a PvE content. Mixing those two is never a good idea.

I’ve done the puzzle several times, and consider it one of the best puzzles in the game, but checked it today and nearly did a spit-take at all the groups camping various portions. Most people will not be fortunate enough to find a friendly mesmer already at the top, like I did. This is really silly. I’ve always advocated to make the JP an armistice zone, but now I think at least for the duration of the event it should be done without question

PvP in a PvP area is not griefing.
it is called playing the game as it is intended.

achievements are not entitlements.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

PvP in a PvP area is not griefing.

it is called playing the game as it is intended.

Its called “getting this achievement depends from on which server you are playing”.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

PvP in a PvP area is not griefing.

PvPing PvE players wanting to do a PvE content is.
And if the game intends you to grief, then it’s a problem with the game (unless it is a game purely for griefers, of course, but GW2 is not one of those).

Astralporing.1957:

We’re offended with having to deal with PvP in the middle of a PvE content. Mixing those two is never a good idea.

this is anet’s way of telling people to do more PvP.

anet creative team discussion:
“lets put PvE content in PvP area, that will motivate them to PvP!”
“good idea!”

now if 10 PvE carebears unite, surely they can take out 1 PvP, right?
if they are 10 PvPers in there, then gather up 20 PvE carebears ! or more!

strength in numbers !!!

before anet made it impossible to build siege weapons in obsidian sanctum, my last run, we had an arrow cart built in a place which is impossible to take down.

them SBI just keep on coming in while the arrows just kept on bombarding them. in the end we had to stop because our members are logging off and the SBIs at the bottom kept on pouring in non stop.

i did a naked dance to congratulate them on reaching the top.

if the PvE carebears want the achievement so badly, what is stopping them from banding together to fight?

there is strength in numbers!

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

Astralporing.1957:

We’re offended with having to deal with PvP in the middle of a PvE content. Mixing those two is never a good idea.

this is anet’s way of telling people to do more PvP.

anet creative team discussion:
“lets put PvE content in PvP area, that will motivate them to PvP!”
“good idea!”

Lol. Frankly, i doubt if there is a better idea to scare people away from ever entering WvW again.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

PvP in a PvP area is not griefing.
it is called playing the game as it is intended.

achievements are not entitlements.

The issue is that a large amount of PvE’ers etner attempting to get a PvE achievement. Knowing this, players will sit (having already finished the puzzle themselves) WILL SIT at the top of the arena or in other areas and ambush players. They don’t put in effort. They literally sit and farm people because they can’t get their badges in a fair fight, or perhaps just like to make other people’s lives miserable. If this is intended play, then Anet is more sadistic than I previously thought.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

if the PvE carebears want the achievement so badly, what is stopping them from banding together to fight?

there is strength in numbers!

Again. You underestimate server imbalances. I spent enough time in WvW to know that on some weeks you “simply cant”. This was already battle-tested in WoW where on some servers faction X could never win Wintergrasp or Tol Barad (and get access to unique PvE content) becouse faction Y on that server outnumbered them 10 to 1.

ShAdY.7586:

Obsidian Scantum Achievement made me report 20 people, at that point I stopped counting and I am still lieing on the ground, reporting everyone who lays a hand on my mates.

Being killed in a pvp zone designed for ganking is not cause for reporting. The only thing it could accomplish is you getting a temporary ban to reconsider abuse of the report feature.

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

PvP in a PvP area is not griefing.
it is called playing the game as it is intended.

achievements are not entitlements.

Okay, I need to clarify griefing as it pertains to my post.

I don’t mean PvP in a PvP area. That’s perfectly acceptable. If this was about fighting for control of the map, your comment would be relevant.

That’s not what’s going on. There are people camped in the jump puzzle who care not a whit for PvP. All they care about is getting in the way of people completing the achievement.

They are deriving their fun not by the fighting or or challenge or whatever (cuz 20 vs 1 is just not fun via competition). They are deriving their fun entirely based on the knowledge that they are juvenile felining over other players. That’s griefing. And that is what is happening.

I run this puzzle almost daily and usually I’ll see maybe a half dozen other players total in the thing. Right now in my Obsidian, you’ll see about 40 from one server and 6-7 total from the other two. I’m fairly confident it has absolutely everything to do with that achievement, and nothing at all to do with WvW.

(side note: I have the achievement. I am a very sneaky thief)

Valento.9852:

ShAdY.7586:

Obsidian Scantum Achievement made me report 20 people, at that point I stopped counting and I am still lieing on the ground, reporting everyone who lays a hand on my mates.

Sorry what? Hahah now this is totally kitten, really reporting for DA BAD GUY KILLED ME! PUNISH ‘EM! =’(

Please, grow up.

Yes, because when a group of people just standing at one point doing nothing but keeping people away from content sounds so very grown up. Like I said in the other thread, it has nothing to do with actual WvW, where you take and defend objectives for points. Both of these groups take up valuable spots from the actual WvW’ers. The gankers don’t help their server one bit, and the ones the’re ganking aren’t doing much either. Why not just let people get their achi so they can move on. The gankers might want to try fair fights instead and join the battlefield, much more fun.

Astralporing.1957:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

PvP in a PvP area is not griefing.

PvPing PvE players wanting to do a PvE content is.
And if the game intends you to grief, then it’s a problem with the game (unless it is a game purely for griefers, of course, but GW2 is not one of those).

PVP content in a PVP area is not PVE content in a PVE area.

Wanting to play PVP content as PVE content does not make it PVE content. Can’t get slayer or yakslapper achievements through PVE either …

marnick.4305:

Astralporing.1957:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

PvP in a PvP area is not griefing.

PvPing PvE players wanting to do a PvE content is.
And if the game intends you to grief, then it’s a problem with the game (unless it is a game purely for griefers, of course, but GW2 is not one of those).

PVP content in a PVP area is not PVE content in a PVE area.

Wanting to play PVP content as PVE content does not make it PVE content. Can’t get slayer or yakslapper achievements through PVE either …

You can’t get yakslapper period

At least not in a normal human lifetime…

Xavori.3768:

marnick.4305:

Astralporing.1957:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

PvP in a PvP area is not griefing.

PvPing PvE players wanting to do a PvE content is.
And if the game intends you to grief, then it’s a problem with the game (unless it is a game purely for griefers, of course, but GW2 is not one of those).

PVP content in a PVP area is not PVE content in a PVE area.

Wanting to play PVP content as PVE content does not make it PVE content. Can’t get slayer or yakslapper achievements through PVE either …

You can’t get yakslapper period

At least not in a normal human lifetime…

That’s what people said about GW1’s hero r12 too.

And remembering HA Rank … PVE’ers whined for years they wanted a non-pvp way to get that emote. I just kittened up and got it legit. I’m 90% PVE but I won’t complain about PVP content being PVP content.

Cuz I’m bored just before bedtime…

Let’s say you are an awesomesauce yak killing machine. You make it your entire focus to kill those furry burgers-in-waiting. Even still, you’re stuck with only a handful available for roadkill at a time which means that even a bovine mass murderer such as yourself is prolly only going to get 6 per hour (some hours you’ll get lucky and get a bunch of camps with two yaks just waiting for you, some hours, you’re awesome server will own so much of the map there just aren’t any yaks anywhere). 6/hr is being hypergenerous.

So, 6/hr.

Let’s also say you are a no-life loser living in your mom’s basement able to play GW2 for 12 hours a day every day. The rest of your time is divided between sleeping, eating pizza, and posting on internet forums about how the latest popular cutie doesn’t meet your exacting standards for a relationship because his/her knees are too sharp, chest is too flat/not flat enough, hair is too blonde, whatever.

So, 6 yaks/hr * 12 hours a day = 72 yaks per day.

You need 1,000,000 yakburgers.

1,000,000 / 72 = 13,888.8 days

13,888 / 365 = 38 years

I’m not gonna be holding my breath waiting.

Pro tip: Try to do it fast after a hotfix(if you are playing and noticing they are bringing a hotfix). Cause WvW gets shut down a lot of players were there shortly after hotfix and WvW up again… if you are lucky you find a huge group of people from your own server and others are slower…

If not wait until your own server pwns really big(also you could join to a very unbalanced matchup stronger server but will cost gems).

Lastly: You could wait until tons of you server got lucky and hold the position and a mesmer can port you.

Of course you can have bad luck now that tons of PvE players want to do this and people there laying AoE traps so even invisibility from the fountains won’t help… the only way is to group up…. there are bigger enemy groups to be expected so go with an own group… try using stability.

At the very top stairs I run up with elite Elixir engineer(sometimes I get the tornado).

And if you really can’t get it: Don’t worry there are still enough other achievements to get the Meta without WvW.

And talking about “completionists” that want all the achievements: I’m sure some day there will be a time where you are for some reason not able to play and miss something… to get everything should not be the goal… just to get “as much as you can do”.

Others wine about the dungeon cause it is too hard and they are not dungeon players. Others whine about totally other stuff.

Why should ArenaNet now nerf this? This is a good way to get more players into the JP – some people already complained it was dead because of the seperation to an own map and no one wanted to go there.

Also might get some players to try WvW.

It’s not a bad move. I know psychologically it might be a problem if you can’t get everything… I have the same problem.. always want everything which makes me also do the boring stuff and then complain it is boring… a lot of people work like this.

But after all the random stuff where you can’t even get all the skins not even with paying 1000+ dollars I just accepted the fact that you can’t get everything in this game.

You need to train yourself to be able to do the same – then you will have much more fun… without the pressure to do everything.

Now I want yakburgers.

I’ll tell my cutie to make me one tonight. While doing the jumping puzzle. Because I’m baws.
She may not be blond, she may not have the flattest chest (and her tummy may be too flat) but she sure makes good burgers.
Forums for the win.

The only servers I really allow complaints from are Vabbi and the other one(I think name was Fissure of Woe) and US servers in the same position(don’t know how it is there).

Other servers should at least at some times of the day get enough players to go in bigger groups giving you some nice fights.

Also: You don’t need it to get the metaachievement. And if you just want “all” the achievements: Deal with it. Other’s also have to do the dungeon and might be some dungeon noobs having trouble there.

Just learn to play for the fun and do as much achievements as YOU can do… and leave the others. I already started some time ago… did not want to try my luck with for Moa Race with my few coints(I’m not a dungeon farmer and low on money cause I don’t farm dungeons 24/7).

It is totally okay to not get every achievement. I mean: You also won’t get every skin… with all the random where there is stuff you can’t even get with paying 1000+ dollars if you have bad luck.

Edit:

Xavori.3768:

2. Move the cache to the start of the jump puzzle. It’s not like Obsidian is actually that challenging. The only tricksy part is the dark room, and you kinda get the same experience in Sharky’s in LA. So it’s not like you’re really letting people that much off the hook.

Actually dark room is one of the easier parts if you know the shortcut to avoid the 2nd sets of heads that shoot fire(they are harder to dodge without running in the next one). I always use swiftness… don’t know if it is possible without swiftness to do the jump. But everyone should use that shortcut.

Xavori.3768:

5. NEVER EVER PUT A LIMITED TIME ACHIEVEMENT ON A WVW MAP AGAIN. I don’t think I can stress that enough.

Yes. And never make time limited dungeon achievements please. Cause I don’t like to do dungeons. I’m a noob. I don’t feel good doing there with my non full exo level 80 engineer with glasscannon equip(where I can max change the traits but not buy new equip cause I don’t have tons of gold). They all will think I’m experienced cause they see the star from map completion(even if I tell them I’m a noob) and then they will flame me because I die every 5 seconds.

Piogre.2164:

Deimos Tel Arin.7391:

PvP in a PvP area is not griefing.
it is called playing the game as it is intended.

achievements are not entitlements.

The issue is that a large amount of PvE’ers etner attempting to get a PvE achievement. Knowing this, players will sit (having already finished the puzzle themselves) WILL SIT at the top of the arena or in other areas and ambush players. They don’t put in effort. They literally sit and farm people because they can’t get their badges in a fair fight, or perhaps just like to make other people’s lives miserable. If this is intended play, then Anet is more sadistic than I previously thought.

For the record, I’m dreading doing this myself. That said, if a losing server is struggling I guess they will have to be a little more tactical about it. Leave a zerg at the start to halt opponent’s backup and send another zerg through the puzzle, eventually get a Mesmer to the end, and Bingo. As is usually the case with WvW, 90% of winning depends on who has the bigger zerg.

In addition to the above – people have to sleep, surely. Maybe if you can stay awake longer than the person guarding the way up you’re in with a shot!

Completely agree. And found this out the hard way. The majority of the players understood that the majority of people going through there were trying to get the cache and the achievement.

They let well-enough be left alone.

And then there were the others. The ‘others’ is the specific reason PvE content should never be placed in a PvP environment. It’s grossly unfair to the ‘carebears’, as some will no doubt say, because pretty much turns them into lambs for the PvP slaughter.

While I have no doubt the PvPers love it, that’s not the game the PvE crowd spec’ced for nor desired in the first place.

And if the intend was purely to kill, I could almost understand it. Getting pushed off from someone with just the intent to frustrate their fellow players is nothing more than griefing.

Period.

6 / hr ? It’s not a no-life loser, it’s a slacker :p

Xavori.3768:

2. Move the cache to the start of the jump puzzle. It’s not like Obsidian is actually that challenging. The only tricksy part is the dark room, and you kinda get the same experience in Sharky’s in LA. So it’s not like you’re really letting people that much off the hook.

Seriously? Not challenging? That is one of the harder and longer jumping puzzles in the game. Sure with practice everything gets easier, but the first time I had to do that JP, it took us forever.

But I do agree that putting the cache at the end of such a long JP makes the players extremely reliant on a kind opposing team. Fortunately that was the case with the German players on Aurora Glade last night. Everyone just left each other alone, so everyone could get the cache.

I guess I had pure luck.. When I did the JP last night there where like 10~15+ blacktide players around. I got to the dark bit with stealth and learned you can no longer use backpiece or sword for light source >.> (when did that change? lame..) so was forced to do the dark bit with them around. Which went well. They did not attack me (neither did I attack them.. would be so dead since I was alone). Decided to continue into arena hoping I got past most of them in the dark bit. Well some were in the arena.. Failed with jumping, got into combat mode and did not got out.. had to kill some mobs some of them triggered above to get out.. figured they would kill me they still didn’t (was like 5min in the arena already with them!!!) got out of combat mode.. one of the guardians did an aoe that hit me.. we both fell >.> and had to run to the other side to get out of combat mode (same for him I guess) and then things started to go well. I never got attacked despite being in there for 10 min with loads of them around me. And I am pretty sure they saw me as an idiot or something. After that things got easier for me, learned where the cache was, went for chest first, got hit by an aoe or something in stealth, did not leave stealth, they were celebrating at the chest with all sort of aoe and fireworks. I got the chest while avoiding red circles and went for cache. Which you can take while in stealth and not triggering the mobs. Which was easy heh. So yes it can be done but require some sort of luck.

TL;DR : got extremely lucky with 10~15 blacktide+ around me and never attacking me in the JP dark area and the arena despite eternal combat mode and crap like that while solo. So it can be done.

Luthan.5236:

Also might get some players to try WvW.

More likely to do the exact opposite.

Kilgorn.1463:

Valento.9852:

ShAdY.7586:

Obsidian Scantum Achievement made me report 20 people, at that point I stopped counting and I am still lieing on the ground, reporting everyone who lays a hand on my mates.

Sorry what? Hahah now this is totally kitten, really reporting for DA BAD GUY KILLED ME! PUNISH ‘EM! =’(

Please, grow up.

Yes, because when a group of people just standing at one point doing nothing but keeping people away from content sounds so very grown up. Like I said in the other thread, it has nothing to do with actual WvW, where you take and defend objectives for points. Both of these groups take up valuable spots from the actual WvW’ers. The gankers don’t help their server one bit, and the ones the’re ganking aren’t doing much either. Why not just let people get their achi so they can move on. The gankers might want to try fair fights instead and join the battlefield, much more fun.

Sooo what you’re saying is having people defend a tower is wrong? I mean they are keeping other people away from that PoI, and it’s needed for map completion, so they are effectively blocking other players from game content. Yeah, very childish. How dare they.

Or, we can just be sensible about this and realize that Obsidian Sanctum has been a terrible addition to WvW as it has only been a source of grieving since day one. You cant blame the PvE players for going there because they want to get it for achievement reasons, you cant blame the PvP players because killing other players is the core of WvW. That leaves you with the option of blaming Anet for either not having the fore-sight to predict this would happen, or having the bad idea of thinking this kind of grieving would be fun.

I haven’t had a chance to try this yet, but due to my whacked out sleeping schedule I’ll probably be okay with getting in at odd hours when not too many people are around.

Is it in Eternal Battlegrounds, or something?

Sieg.8439:

I haven’t had a chance to try this yet, but due to my whacked out sleeping schedule I’ll probably be okay with getting in at odd hours when not too many people are around.

Is it in Eternal Battlegrounds, or something?

Yeah it is. With the portal(s) to the jp being in each keep.

Dedlaw.9130:

Sooo what you’re saying is having people defend a tower is wrong? I mean they are keeping other people away from that PoI, and it’s needed for map completion, so they are effectively blocking other players from game content. Yeah, very childish. How dare they.

Or, we can just be sensible about this and realize that Obsidian Sanctum has been a terrible addition to WvW as it has only been a source of grieving since day one. You cant blame the PvE players for going there because they want to get it for achievement reasons, you cant blame the PvP players because killing other players is the core of WvW. That leaves you with the option of blaming Anet for either not having the fore-sight to predict this would happen, or having the bad idea of thinking this kind of grieving would be fun.

Interesting interpretation to say the least.
Defending a tower is an actual part of WvW, unlike just standing around with the sole purpose of ganking people in the jumping puzzle. That’s just being an kitten . The point I was trying to make is exactly that, that the gankers and the ones getting ganked take spots on the map from those who actually do want to defend and attack the towers.
And the map completion isn’t a temporary part of the game, so you can’t really compare those two.
And I do agree with you there that the JP should never have been put there in the first place. But I guess I’ve been a fortunate one with that so far and never had to deal with gankers there before. Just some fights where the winner moves on with the puzzle.

If this was done to get PvE players into WvW, I guarantee they did it exactly the wrong way. It will have the opposite effect, as it just illustrates perfectly how frustrating WvW is when you’re outnumbered.

Comparing griefing pve players in the JP to defending a tower is preposterous on the face of it. All you get is cheap kills, which does zero to help your server gain WvW points. In fact it hurts your server, since you’re in there instead of actually doing productive fighting in the real WvW. 50 of you in there ganking non WvW players means 50 fewer out there defending or taking map objectives.

I blame Anet for putting a PvE achievement into a WvW area, and I blame WvW players who are grieving for the sake of grieving. Schadenfreude is an extremely ugly character trait.

I was pretty upset yesterday when I spent an hour or so trying to finish this JP only to die over and over again to griefers.

But then I took a step back from my computer and remembered where I was.

If you’re not allergic to dungeons, you can actually get the mini without doing this JP, as long as you can kill the first boss in the dungeon (if my math is correct).

Why do all living story events have to be 100% for pve. Have wvw players gotten ANY events since launch? Why is it so bad that 1 out of 15 achievements is geared towards pvp players for once, after almost a year?

Astralporing.1957:

Silver.3284:

Anyone seriously offended by people pvp-ing in a pvp zone needs to take a step back and calm down.

We aren’t offended with PvP people PvP-ing ina PvP zone. We’re offended with having to deal with PvP in the middle of a PvE content. Mixing those two is never a good idea.

Then feel free to be offended by whoever put the content there, which is an entirely different matter than reporting attacking players for grieving. Large part of this thread is based on the (entirely PvE) misconception that attacking someone (even in a PvP zone) is somehow nasty and mean, instead of the very purpose of a PvP zone.

“Rude to start a fight in a PvP zone”. Seriously?

Furthermore – exactly why is this PvE content? I could as easily argue that since it is in a PvP zone and apparently you need to kill people and avoid being killed in order to achieve it, it is very much PvP content. Being in an achievement tab does not in and of itself make it PvE content.

I also beg to differ with your assessment that this type of content is never good. Keeping your opponents away from a valuable objective (farming spots, lvling spots, bosses) is not a new concept at all in PvP gaming – the purpose of it is to stimulate and sustain fights around said objectives.

Now, this particular implementation of the concept might be crap. However, this is because the players who are naturally in that zone (WvW-ers) and who would be able to initiate and sustain these fights do not really consider the objective valuable and therefore do not really bother fighting over it. It’s not because a bunch of self centered completionists who never visit this zone otherwise cannot have their achievement by walking in the park.

Luthan.5236:

Others wine about the dungeon cause it is too hard and they are not dungeon players. Others whine about totally other stuff.

Why should ArenaNet now nerf this? This is a good way to get more players into the JP – some people already complained it was dead because of the seperation to an own map and no one wanted to go there.

I don’t want the JP nerfed.

I spent over an hour getting through the entire thing, only to find 10-15 people camping at the end. It was very disheartening, because when I die there, no one can rezz me, and then I have to start back at the beginning again, and spend yet another hour.

MOVE the cache. If you want it to still be there, fine. MOVE the cache to the middle, or someplace hidden… like at the fountains? In the dark room? I don’t really care where, but NOT at the very end. Give us the option to complete the puzzle which rewards us with WvW rewards that most of us won’t use.

Give me the CHOICE to do the full puzzle. (Several other caches were found at the beginning, or part way through. Why choose this one to be at the very, very end?)

Also, having ONE achievement for WvW doesn’t mean it’s geared for the WvW players. Most of the WvW players I know don’t honestly care about the new stories because they are WvW players. If it doesn’t effect them, they don’t care. Sure, the WvW changes are great for them, but that’s what they care about. So, essentially, the one WvW achievement (and technically two, since black cache is one, and the 7/7 is a second) for the STORY is NOT a good idea.

Stop trying to merge us! WvW crews hate PvE bunnies messing up their strategies!

…and I did that dungeon… and it is beatable. To do it again without getting hit though? Ha… that… um. That may to lead people not to rezz others. That’ll be fun. Pit everyone against each other, whoo! But that’s a discussion for another time, and one that isn’t really that worthy of a full post by me.

Yasashiku.8275:

I admit, it was probably rather crass, rude, and mean to start a fight in a PvP area, yet everyone seemed to enjoy it, not just myself. For quite a while it was just me and a couple guildies trying to hold off easily 8+ people in the arena while most of our own server watched.

Was what I did kind of a kitten move? Probably, yet this is a PvP zone. People attack me on sight everywhere else. Normally I leave people alone when I see an unofficial truce going on out of respect anyway.

Yeah, it’s a PvP zone. Still a kittenr move in my opinion. If you want real PvP, go somewhere where everyone wants it. Pretty weak, picking on people just trying to finish some content and move on. At least you guys got to feel like bad*sses for a little bit.

OMG! Anet wants us to do something challenging to complete the achievement! Why have they done that? We want achievements for pressing F around LA, nothing more!

Lil Deviant.9218:

I know it was mentioned to using the Mystic Fountains, there is a problem with that. #1 there is no Mystic Fountain for the Chandelier Room and #2 whoever controls the Chandelier Room controls the puzzle until you get a big enough force.

You should not be able to control the Jumping Puzzle by sitting at the top of a room with range weapons that’s what needs to be changed.

The fountain before the well lasts long enough to take you past the chandelier room.

Problem is you can’t see anything… because you can’t take one of the torches. Or does it work to set gamma higher in that dark room? Last time I tried it did not work. I think this might hurt especially new players… with experience maybe it is possible to do it without torch and invisibility?

Did the achievement today, walked past a bunch of stormbluff isle people who let me pass and I got it. A lot of these people are decent human beings. Try it before crying please.

It is possible yes, mostly you learn how many steps it takes for you to reach the ledges/jump spots. I’ve cleared the JP with no speed buff using invis, it’s tricky, but doable.

If anybody in Darkhaven needs a portal up, I’ll gladly port you up, toss me a pm or e-mail. Tell your guild, I’ll do full groups

OTHERWISE, I’ll be ganking NSP. I’ll be the Mesmer with Sunrise and Infinite Light.

Don’t be bad, it’s far from impossible. You assume all people want to toss you off the puzzle.

Xavori… thank you. You said it a lot better than I did.

Granted, I’m pretty sure I was angry about it all, so it would make sense that your cool-headed, sneaky-thief ways said what I was trying to say a lot clearer.

Much love. <3

RobinotX.1604:

Brewbeer.8239:

Not in WvW, it’s not. The entire puzzle is BUILT to make people fight eachother in it. It has lots of traps to activate, and chokepoints players can use to screw with people.

It is grieving the moment you kill people who want to get everything they can. For example there are people who make their hobby getting every achievement. I also want most of the achievements. They wanted to make it difficult. Well they did, they made it so hard the fun is gone. People who just want to finish their achievement are left out.

This is grieving. Even if you are in WvWvW. There is a difference when there is a certain achievement to be earned at some point and they make it so that you MUST join WvWvW to get it. Even if you don’t like it.

So what i need to ask "hey m8 can i kill you or are you doing achivments? " Really its a PvP map, if you dont like pvp dont do it, if anet makes a achivment there well its their fault.

Kilgorn.1463:

Interesting interpretation to say the least.
Defending a tower is an actual part of WvW, unlike just standing around with the sole purpose of ganking people in the jumping puzzle. That’s just being an kitten . The point I was trying to make is exactly that, that the gankers and the ones getting ganked take spots on the map from those who actually do want to defend and attack the towers.
And the map completion isn’t a temporary part of the game, so you can’t really compare those two.
And I do agree with you there that the JP should never have been put there in the first place. But I guess I’ve been a fortunate one with that so far and never had to deal with gankers there before. Just some fights where the winner moves on with the puzzle.

Well whether the ganking is considered as part of WvW or not is debatable. Consider the possibility of a cliff-side path to a camp that players need to pass through, with a high vantage point where another player can camp and attack from range or even knock other off the cliff. And yet doing this would not be thought of as a kitten thing to do. Cowardly, maybe, but that’s also debatable.

In the same way camping at the JP can be considered helping the team, as you are denying the opposition players, not only by keeping those in the JP off the battlefield, but by denying them reinforcements due to your targets taking up a number of finite slots available on the map, meaning actual WvW combatants are waiting in queue to get it.

What pushes this type of action into the kitten category is the fact that the reason people do the JP is something completely unrelated to WvW. I could compare it to people trying to do a dungeon and WvW players storming in and killing you before you get to finish it.

So in the end I think camping and gangking is fine, I don’t begrudge players that. It’s the fact that people are forced into WvW territory for something unrelated to WvW that is the problem, and that is solely Anet’s fault.