Guild Wars 2

When they are asexual? Apart from the fact that players need the ability to pick one in order not to feel shafted vs the other races?

They are made in the image of humans. Humans have genders. Thus, Sylvari also have genders. (They also behave in a similar fashion; eating, drinking, having sex, etc…)

This^.

They are the Pale Trees version of a human being but she only knew what they looked like from the outside so Sylvari is what we get

Flowering plants do have genders.

It’s weird.

Garsid.9516:

Flowering plants do have genders.

It’s weird.

All plants have genders for as far as I know. There could possibly be some asexual reproducing female-only plants that I don’t know of.

Yeah, that too. All plants have genders (even if they are both genders). For example, some plants must be separated by gender so that the males don’t pollinate the females and impregnate the buds, creating seeds. Likewise, some plants require a male to be grown in close proximity in order to achieve pollination when it is desired.

Sylvari are not plants in the sense that they do not reproduce through pollination.

Sylvari don’t reproduce period, they aren’t even asexual. That being said, the are TECHNICALLY genderless, according to multiple sources. To add there are plants who have members that are either male or female (dioecious) but most plants have both reproductive organs, but the sylvari have only one each based on their gender obviously. And its useless in reproductive terms since two sylvari cannot make another sylvari.

Olaf, my theory is “So they can wear the game’s shared, but gendered, armor”, combined with “Marketing told us that players wouldn’t relate to a species of androgynous neuters”.

Gender =/= Sex. The Sylvari have no sex, but they do have genders as gender is a cultural construct.

Sylvari aren’t even plants in the sense that they may or may not have genders. They are more like the fruit of the Pale Tree. They have functional sexual organs to mimic humans but it is only to mimic humans. They do not have the internal organs required to carry children.

They are a collection of abstract notions the Pale Tree had about what made up the human, as she really only saw the surface. They are a tree’s interpretation of humans.

http://www.talktyria.net/2011/08/11/sylvari-lore-interview-with-ree-soesbee-kristen-perry/

Martacus.4085:

Gender =/= Sex. The Sylvari have no sex, but they do have genders as gender is a cultural construct.

I would argue that they have sexes as well, since they have bodies that biologically differ. They can’t reproduce, but it’s been stated that they otherwise have all the appropriate parts. Because apparently this:

Cato.5970:

“So they can wear the game’s shared, but gendered, armor”, combined with “Marketing told us that players wouldn’t relate to a species of androgynous neuters”.

Which makes me sad.

Well, sex implies reproduction. They can’t be said to have sexes if they can’t reproduce. I agree though, the dimporphism is there…but no sex. Day weerd doe.

sex
[seks] Show IPA

noun
1. either the male or female division of a species, especially as differentiated with reference to the reproductive functions.

2. the sum of the structural and functional differences by which the male and female are distinguished, or the phenomena or behavior dependent on these differences.

3. the instinct or attraction drawing one sex toward another, or its manifestation in life and conduct.

it’s not thin ice if it refers to the species in general.

“especially as differentiated with reference to the reproductive functions.”

Maybe it’s a backup system; in case the pale tree ever dies they may possibly be able to develop a fun way to make a new tree.. ;3 That and it makes it easier for my Sylvari to pee.

But outside of lore, it has to work either way. There’s too many guys who love playing female characters and they’d all rage if there were no female Sylvari. FFXI also showed the world gender locking SUCKS. Nice that they’re putting an end to that in the 14 remake.

Doggie.3184:

Maybe it’s a backup system; in case the pale tree ever dies they may possibly be able to develop a fun way to make a new tree.. ;3 That and it makes it easier for my Sylvari to pee.

As the Pale Tree has more interaction with the other species of Tyria, ‘She’ may evolve her children to become reproductive. None of the Sylvari players are “First Born” so it may be possible that the evolution has already begun.

Or Sylvari may gain the ability to reproduce later in life. As it is, none of them have actually been alive long enough to experience adolescence.

Cherokeewill.7504:

Or Sylvari may gain the ability to reproduce later in life. As it is, none of them have actually been alive long enough to experience adolescence.

The oldest are 25 years.

Dustfinger.9510:

Sylvari aren’t even plants in the sense that they may or may not have genders. They are more like the fruit of the Pale Tree. They have functional sexual organs to mimic humans but it is only to mimic humans. They do not have the internal organs required to carry children.

They are a collection of abstract notions the Pale Tree had about what made up the human, as she really only saw the surface. They are a tree’s interpretation of humans.

http://www.talktyria.net/2011/08/11/sylvari-lore-interview-with-ree-soesbee-kristen-perry/

This is a pretty sensible explanation. I’m not sure what else there is to say. Thanks for the link!

meow well i just have a stick sooooo…

This raises a whole bunch of creepy questions of just how exactly the Pale Tree could know how human genitals would look like…

If you look up the word Asexual, technically it doesn’t apply. I think the word people are looking for is ‘pansexual’.

I think this all comes down to the question: Do Sylvari have sex?

Obviously Sylvari would only be able to have sex for fun and not for reproductive purposes but that’s not really important here. If they can and do have sex, that means there gender has meaning.

They do have sex but the “gender” of their partner is inconsequential. It really comes down to a philisophical matter.

1. either the male or female division of a species, especially as differentiated with reference to the reproductive functions.

By this definition they, as a race, do not have a reproductive gender.

2. the sum of the structural and functional differences by which the male and female are distinguished, or the phenomena or behavior dependent on these differences.

By this definition they do have structural genders.

So the answer can be yes or no but it really doesn’t matter which one we choose because it would still amount to a description of the same idea. that sylvari can’t sexually reproduce, they have sex for fun but their sexual organs are not a factor in determining who it will be with.

Personally I might be inclined to believe that as the Pale Tree grew she observed the world around her and created children that would be at least in some ways familiar to the world around them.

By giving Sylvari the appearance of gender the other races aren’t left feeling as though they’re strange and different.

As an extension of that Sylvari then perform gender as it is dictated/enacted by the other races of Tyria, integrating them further in with the other races. It all works well towards her goal of defeating Zhaitan, which her children end up playing a pretty pivotal role in.

Oglaf.1074:

This raises a whole bunch of creepy questions of just how exactly the Pale Tree could know how human genitals would look like…

Have you seen any public restroom constructed in Ventari’s Sanctuary during GW1 days?

Yep, that’s how the Pale Tree knows when they thought they had the big roots to cover them during their private time…

Just to clarify do you mean Gender as in the social construct or Gender as in their biological Sex?

I think have a gender as in the construct, their physical appearance is purely aesthetic, which is why they have so many “same-sex” partnerships.

Gender as a social construct. As they have no sexes, genders don’t make any sense ( at least to me).

Maybe the pale tree found a way to determine the appearance by the psycological gender an individual develops during the dream. They learn about the concept of gender other races have and feel rather driven to a female or male side. So if a Silvary has a self concept as a female the Silvary who awakens will become an at least femal looking individual.

Wait… how do you guys know whether the Sylvari have sex? Was that actually in the lore??

schizandra.4587:

Wait… how do you guys know whether the Sylvari have sex? Was that actually in the lore??

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Sylvari
Romance and sex is practiced among the sylvari, disregarding gender between those involved. To a sylvari, love is about inspiration, and it has nothing at all to do with the physical form.

schizandra.4587:

Wait… how do you guys know whether the Sylvari have sex? Was that actually in the lore??

Word of god:

“Physically, sylvari are male or female, and the relevant external biology is accurate on both […]” – Ree Soesbee, Dream and Nightmare

Also as food for thought (hidden in multiple spoiler tags due to being a rather long text):

Credit where credit is due: http://guildwars2roleplay.wikispaces.com/A+Comprehensive+Guide+to+All+Things+Sylvari#

Oglaf.1074:

Gender as a social construct. As they have no sexes, genders don’t make any sense ( at least to me).

Was what I was thinking, so yeah they don’t really have genders, no gender roles, etc. Their appearance is just for show, so they can fall in love with whom ever they like, and not be in a homosexual relationship

“and not be in a homosexual relationship”

What about Caithe and Faolain?

Because we’re human I guess and ‘naturally’ think of things/beings in the term of gender, tis how we make sense of the world.

When i study biology i learn that plants have genders too, but the gender is in same plant is like the plant have the two genders, one part is male an other is female, but some plant are only females or only males, and i think that when that happen they need help of other animals and insects like bees and birds to transfer the ’’eggs’’ to the male

The Sylvari have only been around for 25 years. Some trees and plants take a very long time to start producing flowers and seeds, for example we have fruit trees that are still less than ten years old, and whilst the apples have been producing (very bitter and inedible) fruit since they hit a year old, the pears haven’t even started to flower yet and won’t for another few years.

Maybe the Sylvari just aren’t old enough for their genders to produce offspring.

I am of course ignoring the fact that the world-builders said they can’t, but they recently gave Eir a seventeen year old son out of thin air so they may possibly change their mind on this too :P

Doggie.3184:

That and it makes it easier for my Sylvari to pee.

Best explanation ever.

I was wondering because when I filled in the biography I chose the Green Knight for my dream. When I started a quest line a male sylvari said ‘a brute is attacking my beloved’, I got there and saw the green knight beating down a male sylvari. Are sylvari gender less or are those to just gay?

Arkon, Sylvari aren’t ‘gay’ (the correct term to that would be homosexual, by the way, gay is just an older term for being happy) they don’t make difference between genders in relationships. It’s been stated in this thread before too.

Sylvari have structural genders but not social genders because they have no reproductive genders.

FlamingFoxx.1305:

Personally I might be inclined to believe that as the Pale Tree grew she observed the world around her and created children that would be at least in some ways familiar to the world around them.

While it doesn’t debunk the explanation, this theory is unlikely for three reasons.

Firstly, Malyck. A Sylvari supposedly from a tree seperate to the Pale Tree, he has no memories of the dream or his grove and seems to be good natured, like our Sylvari. It might not seem like much, but this means there's more than one Sylvari grove and that unless that grove also based Sylvari on humans, their form is naturally what it is. In the personal story for Sylvari characters who believe most in Ventari’s teaching that “Where life goes, so two should you”.

Next, if the Pale Tree WAS basing the Sylvari on existing life, why not centaurs?

Finally, if she designed plant people based on humans, why make them drastically fairer than them?

A-Net confirmes sylvari are the Pale trees interpretation of people she saw around her. Not neccesarily a conscious interpretation but definatlly an interpretation.

However, because the race tightly relates to the essence of human due to the Pale Tree’s influences from Ronan, the overall form has a human silhouette. But if you look more closely, you’ll see the forms are really quite alien. They are a collection of abstract notions the Pale Tree had about what made up the human, as she really only saw the surface. They are a tree’s interpretation of humans.

http://www.talktyria.net/2011/08/11/sylvari-lore-interview-with-ree-soesbee-kristen-perry/

smeen.4237:

Arkon, Sylvari aren’t ‘gay’ (the correct term to that would be homosexual, by the way, gay is just an older term for being happy) they don’t make difference between genders in relationships. It’s been stated in this thread before too.

Gay in reference to homosexuals actually means “good as you” as in “we are as good as you”.

Of course, the obvious question in my mind is that, given the fact that sylvari have the external organs, why is it that they haven’t made the obvious gender pairing due to how the parts “fit together”.

Other parts may also fit together and in a society where their lack of reproductive function promotes loving the personality, then pairing off based on mechanical function would be a purely philosophical choice. And probably not one that a large portion of society would adopt. It would be like humanity in a completely integrated society just deciding to pair off based on hair color. Or height.

Dustfinger.9510:

This^.

They are the Pale Trees version of a human being but she only knew what they looked like from the outside so Sylvari is what we get

Also, the Pale Tree was planted as a sapling on a graveyard of Humans, after a centaur massacre 250 years ago (During GW1 time). Hence why they look so much like Humans only plant form.

Martacus.4085:

Gender =/= Sex. The Sylvari have no sex, but they do have genders as gender is a cultural construct.

Wrong. Sylvari do not have genders, for they live in a truly gender-neutral society.

oh they have genders just like plants do. only difference is that unlike other races they don’t care about it. if you listen in on some conversations in the story and outside you’ll notice a decent number of same sex pairs. I think anet made sylvari with the mind set that sylvari view everyone equally and don’t judge on appearence by who they are as a person.

Wow, there are a lot of semantic problems in this thread. I guess to make sure people who know the heck I’m talking about, I’ll stick to this standard.

Sex – In reference to biological/physical structure, i.e. Male vs Female vs Intersexed
Gender – In reference to social/behavioral structure, i.e. Masculine vs Feminine vs Genderless
Sexuality – In reference to romantic/sexual interest – Heterosexual vs Homosexual vs Bisexual vs Asexual.

Sylvari have physical sex, but the form itself is rather arbitrary. As per lore, they have the shape of Man and Women, but that serves no reproductive purpose. It can be argued either way, I think. You can say that Sylvari have a designated sex because they mimic the biological sex of men and women. You can also say that Sylvari are a “sex-less” race, in the same manner that you don’t consider individual leaves of a tree to be of distinct sex even if they look different.

In reference to gender, Sylvari certainly do have gender. They express feminine and masculine traits, and there is a fuzzy line between them. Remember that gender is a social construct. The definition of what it means to be masculine and feminine changes with the culture. However, you can take note that they use gendered pronouns, and have distinct gender identity. I don’t think we can really assume that Sylvari gender is associated with a Sylvari’s physical form, though. We don’t have any evidence either way about this, honestly. Especially since lore shows Sylvari have some form of control over their physical form (growing leaves to simulate clothing), a Sylvari’s gender identity may have a direct effect on his or her physical form.

In reference to sexuality, as per lore, the Sylvari seem to have no qualms over gender preferences/orientations when it comes to romance or sex. The preference for a male Sylvari over a female Sylvari seems to be equivalent to liking blonds over brunettes. Pansexuality (basically a step beyond bisexuality, claiming to enjoy relationships with all forms) is probably what is considered “normal”. I’m sure there are Sylvari who are exclusively heterosexual or exclusively homosexual, but I think they are considered atypical within the culture (considering how open-minded and curious they are). Because of this, I would think that Sylvari wouldn’t be too concerned with interspecies relations, either. Since sex serves no purpose than to enjoy each others companionship, I don’t think it’s much of a stretch for a Sylvari to consider romance with another race.