Guild Wars 2

2000 GS = 0 pre-legendery

So Dawn just shot up 40g overnight. At what point will A-NET address this issue? Will we have to wait for precursors to hit 500-600g? I know there is a massive update coming in November Linsey but can you please tell us if this is going to be addressed in the update? Its been almost 3 weeks since we last heard anything.

Still people refuse to see our point. Not one single person wants a precursor weapon handed to them on a silver platter who has posted in this thread.

We want an alternative way to get these weapons THAT IS ACTUALLY FUN AND DOES NOT RELY ON RNG. In what way does that say we want it to be easy to get? I honestly don’t get it. It doesn’t need to be easy to get. It doesn’t need to be quick to get. It just needs to be fun to get. That’s the only requirement we want in our legendary grind.

I get tired of seeing posts like that and also people who admit they’ve only been playing for 2 days and think they have a clue how much effort people have been putting into getting their weapons.

For the hundredth time I ask; what is legendary about throwing items into a magic blender with the hope that your luck is in that day so it shoots out a precursor weapon or buying one on the market like it’s a common loaf of bread? And why are you so against changing the system for the better?

I agree that what we are all looking for is fun method of acquiring a legendary precursor. Something that feels legendary.

I think back to Torment Weapons in Guild Wars 1. These could only be acquired by doing one of the hardest areas in the game numerous times (or buying the needed item for a LOT of platinum or ecto from another player). When I saw someone with a Torment Weapon, I had some respect for them, because I knew what they had to do to acquire it.

My hope is that the search for the precursor becomes like more like that. Like others have said, many people don’t have respect for people with legendary precursors right now, they just consider them lucky.

I personally like the idea that’s been posted by others to require a certain number of each dungeon token, maybe even the Dungeon Master title. Add in jumping puzzles to give them some more value. There are a number of fun things that could be done with this. And if done right, players will feel like the journey to get the legendary was truly legendary. In turn, other players may have more respect for their accomplishment.

In light of the concern over the part the Mystic Forge plays in removing exotics from the game, this could be addressed by simply making a MF recipe that requires you to put in 3 exotics plus some other item in order to get a precursor shard or something like that. A certain number of these shards could be used in the precursor recipe. Heck you could even make it random to some degree like the Mystic Clover for all I care. Personally, what I, and it sounds like many others would like to see, is slow but steady progress toward our goal. Like fellyn said, you can make it hard, but please make it fun.

ArenaNet, we’re all looking to you in hope. Please consider all of our remarks very carefully and make some much needed changes.

IMO the potential fix to this problem is super simple.

Here is my suggestion;

If a player has worked hard enough; in this case by the amount of legendary sub components they have (make it all 3 except the precursor) then they should have the highest chance for a precursor to world/chest drop for them whilst playing the game. With 0 MF required. Of course there may be times when the wrong precursor would drop – which the user could then just TP or trade to get their required legendary precursor. The amount of times this could happen per character should be limited by a finite number to avoid oversaturation.

This eliminates 99% of the frustrations and also gives incentive for working towards your legendary weapon and sub-components. Problem solved with 0 RNG needed and achieved in a way that’s natural and fun for everyone.

Can this system be implemented devs?

Drebi.1875:

In relation to the previous post, I just wanted to drop by and confirm that 74 rares work just as well and are capable of producing a precursor. They’re also the best option in terms of cost efficiency – if you’re buying instead of crafting yourself.

Sell the exotics (the conversion rate for me was more like 1 in 4, which was a bit surprising) and recycle rares; you have a chance to recoup most of your losses this way.

Signed,
Owner of a Bitfrost

4x Lv.74 Rares or some of them are Lv.80 Rares? Please confirm this, i want to try this method tonight. Thanks a lot!!

Only problem I see with that Azelroth is if they have all the components for the legendary which gives them a huge increased chance of getting precursor, whats stopping them from waiting on creating the legendary & just farm precursors & selling on TP? Only way this would work is if they were account bound.

@ A-NET team. Another day, no information. When will you recognize this is a major issue? Right now GW2 endgame is isolated to lottery winners. Meanwhile other legitimate players with 700+ hours cannot begin their quest for a legendary because they cannot obtain the most important component. If you don’t have the precursor you might as well have nothing or be a million miles away. Current cost precursor > cost of all mats combined.

Drunkyduck.3275:

after a week of hard work (grind) i decide to give a go !!

Shortbows

Rare – 500+
Exotic – 32
The Lover – 1

I got lover on my 10-15th craft of rares but i crafted at the end all of em but thats it only 1 precursor, i used evrything, u can see on SS all buffs i have, no idea is it worthy (MF) or not but at the end i came to my goal…..

Amazing thanks for your contribution.

I have only been keeping track of my results post-halloween patches… and so far:

Mystic Forge Combines:

4 lvl 80 Greatswords (rare) x 24 combines

RESULTS

= 6 exotics (carrion tribal greatsword of rage x 2, berserker’s pearl broadsword, naga fang, skybringer,traveler’s orian longsword of rage)

= 18 rares (valkyrie krait slayer, berserker’s greatsword of hobbling x 2, cleric’s krait slayer x 2, rampagers krait slayer, carrion flame greatsword of air, cleric’s greatsword of venom x3, cleric’s greatsword of debility, rampagers greatsword of grawlslaying, berserker’s greatsword of air, traveler’s aureate highlander sword of air, rampagers greatsword of ice x2, carrion verdant greatsword of air)

4 Exo lvl 80 GS = Shaman’s Etched Avenger of Rage

And interestingly 3 x (exotic) lvl 80 GS + 1 Mystic Stone = Shaman’s etched pistol (exo) which is totally unrelated to GS hahaha

I will keep a running update as time goes on.

EDITED: Due to updating my data

The way to fix that Snow is by limiting the amount of times it could happen for that character by a finite number (as suggested) or alternatively, it could just be dropped as Soulbound On Acquire.

I’m sure no one would complain about that

14 dusk in ah and still 280g+ I miss only it and Lodestone (i m farming lodestone like a korean GS on elemental 6h at day -.-’) But later how i can buy a dusk? Arena plz fix it and make skill based no pay to win plz…

@Azelroth.6801 : As far as i know, Mystic Forge Stone also increase the exotics to appear. Tried 5 times with only rares, got 3 exotics out of 5 tries. On the next day, got 1 exotic out of 3 tries. Don’t know if im just lucky…

Drunkyduck.3275:

@Grezko no u must use rares 76-80

PS m going for greatswords now) 50% chanse more for precursor (dawn or dusk)

I created bolt with lvl 74 rares. I am a happy person now

I’m pretty sure the chance to get an exotic from 4 lvl 80 rares is NOT 20%

Its somewhere between 12-15% chance. My sample size is high enough that i’m fairly confident in this (i recorded every attempt i made for this, and for crafting clovers using 1 clover recipe as well)

On the plus side, mithril ore prices have been dropping a bit these days, which makes crafting them a bit cheaper. Elder wood has been rising though which is sad, because i would rather throw in hammers to try to get collosus of rage, but exotic hammers are worth way less on TP than exotic gs.

Update:

260 rare hammers = 60 rare hammers + 5 exotic non named hammers.

0 precursor.

Back to farming.

EDIT: I’ve been throwing what the mystic forge spits out back in to it, too, but it’s given similar results. I almost always end up with a rare as the result of four rares. It’s a phenomenal waste of money.

20 rare GS = 1 exotic / 0 precursors
1 lvl 70 exotic dagger, 1 lvl 78 exotic dagger, 1 lvl 78 exotic warhorn + 1 Mystic Forge Stone = 1 Dawn
Well I didn’t expect to get any precursors from this, I only hoped that I’d get 1 exotic which would be worth more than these 3 combined. All exotics I used in this try were exploration rewards.

I wonder if anet could finnaly tell us if there are any changes planned. I dont want to gamble 100s of gold now only to find out next week the chances got raised or a fixed recipe appeared.

At this point players are not equal. Those who cheat exploit and bot get the legendaries plain and simple. I have 0 respect for most of those who have one now cause they didnt earn it plain and simple. It is a very sad case in deed.
If all are equal and all deserve a chance at obtaining a legendary then pull the RNG otherwise we are not equal.

In one of your posts you stated that this is one of our goals. Well at this point I can quit the game and bad mouth it. Buy gold off of 3rd party to purchase the precursor. Simply run a bot to help with things and offset the RNG.
There is no endgame right now – Orr sucks, WvW is a mess,Spvp is unbalanced, and Dungeons are a waste of time.
The only thing left is getting a legendary weapon your most epic of ideals. Well guess what – even if I grind day in and day out do everything right I may never get one. Why RNG. DO you want people to keep playing?
Why not treat us all equal and not force people to use exploits/gold sellers to obtain your epic ideal.
Hard work and dedication to the game does not equal the goal. The other options are not good ones. Your move Anet.

TLDR:I in no way want anything handed to me – I am happy to grind away day after day but RNG is BS and will kill the game.

I used about 370 rares = 23 exotic [ No Precursor ]

@above:

Narkosys

Nothing about a farmed item like the “legen-dairys” will ever truly be impressive to many so believe me when I say whilst it’s merely your opinion, it’s one I agree with and share.

There is no point in telling it like it is however I feel, because in the end many players are leaving due to bots and the entire R.N.G farm-fest for legendary weapons is promoting the third party gold selling market. In fact, and this is pure speculation mind you. I wouldn’t at all be surprised if that isn’t intentional and the ill gotten gains from botters are being used to purchase and create precursors, which are then priced higher and higher due to their demand so early on from desperate players.
But that’s the risk you run when your “endgame” is for many dependant on RNG and the trading post.

I don’t think this will kill the game, but I do think that eventually players will realise that calling something legendary, doesn’t in any way, shape or form make it legendary and that it’s just a skin that’s promoting horrendous greed and sweatshop mentalities with grinding and fail… can’t stop players from trying though, but one sympathises

I would love to see:

- Hardmode for Dungeons: Make it really hard ( if your done with all in hardmode you can craft / get a precourser
- Some JP like the Clocktower

I really hope that the game will get harder with some rewards ( I have the feeling they already nerfed loads of dungeons who were really hard to make ( path 1 of cof for example ) no runned by ppl I had about an hour for endboss till we got it( it’s fun to achieve such things ) and it’s really said they are takken out of game because some ppl can’t get it.

Great would be to have the firsttime a Skillbased game where wealth besides trading is actually depended on your Skill→ you get big award for hardmode Dungeons Like several gold ect..

At the moment as in Other games you get lucky or smart at trading on TP or you farm pretty mutch. I’d like to see to get money like you get skilled or good enough to complete things.

Btw most ppl running around with legendary ( I happen to have speaken to some of those ) Really did basicaly not achieve Dungeonmaster or anything they just have found the best farmspot to farm and farmed:)

;) and waited till dungeons get nerved so their ain’t fun:P

Please A-Net: KEEP THINGS HARD OR GET EM HARDER! TY

Here is my suggestions to Anet how to try to make people happy/happier… (not that anyone cares or Anet will listen/respond..)
At least I have suggestions and not simply complaining about how much I don’t like this. So here it goes in hope I make any change..

- A fixed recipe in the mystic forge. The ingredients can be anything (example: 4 exotic staffs from dungons or 250 ancient staff heads and shafts + ectos and a gift) as long as its something to work for without the RNG, and a guaranteed precursor as a result. Something like the Halloween recipes.
- A recipe for crafting. Like the one we have seen for the Halloween exotics. I like this one the most because people can still sell it on the TP and get money for it if they so which.
- Sell the precursors for badges/karma/ own currency from a vendor.
- Sell for money at a vendor, this gives Anet the control of the prices of these precursors.
- A real way to get a steady money income. More money for daily/monthly achievement, or just remove the DR all together.
- Always drop one from a chest after the Orr temples/dragons/world bosses. More precursors in the system will hopefully lower the prices to something more reasonable.
Also this gives more instinctive to even do these events for other reasons then “fun”.
Right now they are often avoided because many feel there is no real reward of doing them more then once.

I don’t expect any of the changes suggesting making the precursors non trade-able to go trough, because that will make all those who spent 400g on one precursor feel screwed. But I hope Anet does remember that there is still a majority suffering because of these outrageous prices on the TP. Because there are no real good way to even make that kind of money in this game except playing “Tradig Post: the game”.
Not fun at all.

And IMO one element already does include horrid RNG… the mystic clovers.
And I think many will agree that they will happily farm wherever as long as they know they will have an guaranteed result. Remember that this precursor is still only one of many elements of making a a legendary.

And as many have said, legendary is one form of end-game, and this whole RNG thing for something end-game related just goes against Anets philosophy.
RNG is NOT fun.
Not when you have 1/10000 chance to get what you want. People need to feel its still rewarding enough to continue.

And stop with the crap and say hurr durr its optional, we all know that. But just because you might feel its not that important to you or you don’t want one, doesn’t mean others don’t.

I still have faith in that Anet are working on something, but how can we know? They are so silent about this

Close to 800 rares. Got Dawn today. Sold for 333g, bought Dusk for 318g. Happy as hell:)

Recently.1043:

I’m pretty sure the chance to get an exotic from 4 lvl 80 rares is NOT 20%

Its somewhere between 12-15% chance. My sample size is high enough that i’m fairly confident in this (i recorded every attempt i made for this, and for crafting clovers using 1 clover recipe as well)

How high is that sample size?

The 20% figure is well supported by someone who got ~600 exotics from ~3000 combines earlier in the thread; it’s also in line with many other types of item forging (e.g. sigils), which also tend to have ~20% rates.

Got a Dawn at around 60~80 attempts.

Excellent posts by many here – any of the suggestions put forward by Yooms.4015 in the post above would be excellent as a solution to the current RNG issue with precursor.

The complete silence and lack of any feedback other than “We are watching” is incredibly frustrating for many players – Even another thread below discussing the RNG issue the only recent reply is with regards to the Bot issue which is also completely out of control at the moment.

Like many others after several xxx hundred rares, multiple exotic attempts with 0 to show for it the current system is completely flawed and does need immediate attention or at very least some actual signs by a developer indicating a plan of action posted on the forum.

Debating on taking a break from GW2, kinda lost a lotta zeal after weeks of trying to get my precursor. Sure there are people who get it first try, others who spent around 20g, then people like me up to around 200g. You can’t get that money back and with the RNG you could easily spend another 200g.

I really enjoy this game, which is a surprising admission after being swearing off MMOS (forever as far as I was concerned) after a brief 3 month dalience with WoW.

I enjoy grinding out map completions, WvWvW, crafting, PVE, Dungeons. I even enjoy doing 1-2 hour karma grinds on the cursed shore.

I can see that with regular low level play over the next 6-12 months, I could earn a Legendary Weapon. The cost is extraordinarily high, and will mean that I play basicaly no DOTA2 (the greatest game available to mankind), I will watch less Anime, and possibly even give up other “nerdy” hobbies.

What I find frustrating int he extreme is the horrednus cost of the precursor weapon and the RNG ways we need to rely on to find them. I am having to resort to playing the trading post and considering real life gold investment to obtain one.

I agree legendary weapons should be difficult to obtain, but I dont think 1 component of them should rely soley on a massive gold cost, that other people are pushing the price up, it doesn’t seem fair that people were able to buy them intially for 20 gold and now to obtain one you need upwards of 300. this cost of 300 gold seems far less obtainable than all the other extremely difficult but fair costs associated with a legendary weapon.

Please reconsider how precursors are obtained, the majority of players I believe would be grateful if this aspect was changed so that those of us with jobs and families could actually realisitically grind towards a Legenday of out own.

Anet would rather appease the Bots than the players.
They don’t want to make the Bots mad by doing something about the Precursors because then the Bots wouldn’t keep buying (“stealing”) tons of accounts from Anet to keep on Botting.

Who would be mad if Anet did something about the precursor issues.
1) Bots
2) Exploiters who exploited the bug with low level rares
3) The select few who actually got lucky enough to get a Precursor for 20g (and even then the ones they bought were probably created because of the bugs)
4) The super select few who actually got a legendary post bugs fix by getting their precursor from a drop or the MF and actually aquired it the right way (Probably less than 10 people world wide)

Who would be happy if Anet did something about the precursors.
1) Everyone Else!

If you were a dev what would you do?

Silverghost.4192

Anet would rather appease the Bots than the players.
They don’t want to make the Bots mad by doing something about the Precursors because then the Bots wouldn’t keep buying (“stealing”) tons of accounts from Anet to keep on Botting.
Who would be mad if Anet did something about the precursor issues.
1) Bots
2) Exploiters who exploited the bug with low level rares
3) The select few who actually got lucky enough to get a Precursor for 20g (and even then the ones they bought were probably created because of the bugs)
4) The super select few who actually got a legendary post bugs fix by getting their precursor from a drop or the MF and actually aquired it the right way (Probably less than 10 people world wide)
Who would be happy if Anet did something about the precursors.
1) Everyone Else!
If you were a dev what would you do?

you forgot the select “many” who lost hundreds of gold they will never get back like me. i will be angry no matter what x.x arggghhh

So today I decided to give it a go.
Crafted 400 (GS) rares and used every one, also the rares and exotics I got out of the 400, so i don’t know exactly how many attempts. No Dusk/Dawn. Got about 18 exotics out of the 400 crafted rares.

Sad face. :/

Edit: I only wish that they put in a some max failed attempts trigger, if after 1000 attempts you don’t get it you get it on attempt 1001.

Well in the last 2 weeks I’ve been able to aquire 7 Precursors in the mystic forge with minimal gold considering you’re filtering alot – 2 Dusk, 2 Zaps, 1 Spark, 1 Legend, 1 Storm by putting in stones + 3 76 exotics or 80 rares.

What I’m actually more concerned about then the price of precursors is the insane prices of jack alop…. how am i ever going to get a cute rabbit pet!

Besides that anet needs to be fair and keep the other precursors high in demand by making other combinations of eternity like 2 incinerators to make inferno/ ifrit!

Just dropped 50gold into mystic forge gambling (not as much as some i know but i have spent plenty of my 5 other level 80 characters, including level 400 on all crafts and i haven’t injected real life cash into the forge).

No i don’t want some mad pre-req like “dungeon master” because i’m here for WvW not to grind dungeons over and over (pre-cursor should be available to all types of players, though pure SPvp duders will be a bit different (maybe give them there own Spvp legendary)).

No i don’t want an exact recipe because the farmers/botters win.

BUT, this forge gambling feels meaningless, no sense of accomplishment, no feeling of making progress, even IF I DO GET LUCKY, the sense of achievement is severely diminished because others got there legendary in illegitimate ways.

>.<

Keep things the way they are. Loving it.

Ignore all the rage. Finally an end game that requires effort instead of an end game that’s dead and gone 1 month into a game. ( Diablo 3 anyone? )

Idc if it’s RNG. It’ll feel like more of an accomplishment when you get it.

Hate this “new generation” who expect everything to be handed to them on a silver platter.

Do you really want to get this as a freebie and then be like.. "okay..so I have this. Now what? oh right. I have nothing left to accomplish.. Better quit the game anyway. “ARENANET.. Y U NO MOAR ENDGAME?”

@ Zetoshi

I honestly hope you are trolling. “Expect everything handed to us on a silver platter.” You do know players trying to acquire their precursors now have to pay up to 30 times what they were initially going for right? Your aware that the other prerequisites not even including the precursor will legitimately take you up to 200-300 hours of game time to acquire unless your converting gems-gold via cash right? The entitlement argument has gotten so so old.

@Snow

I’m not trolling. It’s a Legendary weapon but you’re willing to take away anything that is Legendary about it. YES, it is expensive as hell. But that should be the point. It should be near impossible or very unlikely to obtain.

Luck is always a factor, in life, and what is an RPG if not an interpretation of life.
The boring grind, we see in life daily. The same should go with other aspects. Else you would not feel any real statisfaction other than instant gratification which quickly disolves into nothing more than a “meh”.

I would much rather earn a Legendary item now, with the way things are, then in the end have one and admit “oh I only managed to get this because they made it easy, all I had to do was put in some time and BAM. Pretty shiney thingies.”

@Zetoshi

I could swipe my Visa right now & get a precursor. What is legendary about that experience? Nothing. What is legendary about a person who throws in 5000 weapons into the forge & comes out empty handed, meanwhile someone standing next to him throws in 4 & gets precursor? Nothing.

We are not asking for them to make it easier. If anything we are asking them to make it harder. We want the experience to amount to more than "Empty your pockets into the mystic forge, bow & pray to the mystic forge, worship the mystic forge, & maybe..just maybe you will get what you desire.

There is no reason everything in this game needs to revolve around the mystic forge.

Zetoshi.5803:

Keep things the way they are. Loving it.

Ignore all the rage. Finally an end game that requires effort instead of an end game that’s dead and gone 1 month into a game. ( Diablo 3 anyone? )

Idc if it’s RNG. It’ll feel like more of an accomplishment when you get it.

Hate this “new generation” who expect everything to be handed to them on a silver platter.

Do you really want to get this as a freebie and then be like.. "okay..so I have this. Now what? oh right. I have nothing left to accomplish.. Better quit the game anyway. “ARENANET.. Y U NO MOAR ENDGAME?”

Did you even bother with reading the thread? I’m gonna go with no, you didn’t.

Not one single person has asked to be handed a precursor on a silver platter like you’re claiming. For the thousandth time. We just want a way to get one that doesn’t rely on RNG. Why is that so hard to understand and what in that simple sentence says “we want it to be easy to get”?

Try reading the thread before you post thinking you have even the slightest clue what people are asking for or are talking about. Because if you had you’d realize we’re actually asking for more complex ways to get them that are actually fun and don’t involve lazy game mechanics like rng.

Besides that how on earth can you think getting anything through rng is an accomplishment when 1 person can get it first try and for another it takes 300? That doesn’t even begin to make sense.

@Snow

That is the company’s perogative. They are a company. They do need to take their profits somewhere. If someone is stupid enough to spend that much on a virtual item that offers cosmetics mostly, that’s their choice.

@Fellyn

Everything relies on RNG. Your damage rolls, are randomly generated. All drops are randomly generated.
That said, it would make more sense for it to be less reliant on luck. Still, I like the RNG for the fact that not everyone will get it.

Let’s not discuss whether chasing a Legendary is silly or not. People set goals for themselves in a game and they get satisfaction from pursuing these goals. Whether you think a goal is silly is a matter of personal preference.

What we can discuss, however, is whether the road to these goals makes sense. In particular, we can discuss the amount of luck involved. How people evaluate rewards largely depends on how these rewards relate to the efforts they put in. On one end of the scale there is no correlation between effort and rewards and rewards completely depend on luck. On the other end of the scale, rewards totally depend on effort and no luck is involved. How do people evaluate these different reward systems?

When everything depends completely on luck, people may feel that much of their effort goes unrewarded. When they do get a reward, it doesn’t satisfy them because it is completely unrelated to the effort they put in (although some are quick to come up with rationalizations why they ‘deserved’ the reward). Moreover, this system leads to feelings of unfairness as some people get rewards without putting any effort in, while others get nothing and put in a lot of effort. In conclusion, random rewards are not satisfying at all.

At the opposite end of the scale -where rewards totally depend on effort- people also tend to be unsatisfied. In this scenario, rewards often feel like a grind, like working if you will. People then tend to go about and make a plan, grind and cross things of their list. This system often feels like it lacks excitement.

In the end, rewards therefore need to be a combination of effort and luck ( alot of research supports this finding by the way). It’s this combination that is crucial. When we look at Legendaries, part of it is a pure grind (i.e., karma, tokens), part of it is a grind with some luck involved (i.e., lodestones) and part of it is pure luck (precursors). Unfortunately, the precursor part has turned out to be the most important obstacle in obtaining a Legendary, dwarfing all other components. In my opinion (and I think many agree here) this is simply bad game design.

This could easily be cured by reducing the luck factor involved in obtaining precursors and increasing the effort factor. For example, instead of getting the precursor (or not) with a 0.01% chance one could implement a system with shards. In such a scenario one would have a 0.1% chance on a shard and 10 shards combine into a precursor.

Note that the overall chance to get a precursor stays the same (so they do not necessarily become more common), but the system allows one to ‘work towards’ getting a precursor. It will feel more rewarding and also reduces the unfairness between players.

Zetoshi.5803:

@Snow

That is the company’s perogative. They are a company. They do need to take their profits somewhere. If someone is stupid enough to spend that much on a virtual item that offers cosmetics mostly, that’s their choice.

@Fellyn

Everything relies on RNG. Your damage rolls, are randomly generated. All drops are randomly generated.
That said, it would make more sense for it to be less reliant on luck. Still, I like the RNG for the fact that not everyone will get it.

You still miss the entire point completely. Go back and read the thread and then post again when you understand what we’re after.

Morrar.1764:

Let’s not discuss whether chasing a Legendary is silly or not. People set goals for themselves in a game and they get satisfaction from pursuing these goals. Whether you think a goal is silly is a matter of personal preference.

What we can discuss, however, is whether the road to these goals makes sense. In particular, we can discuss the amount of luck involved. How people evaluate rewards largely depends on how these rewards relate to the efforts they put in. On one end of the scale there is no correlation between effort and rewards and rewards completely depend on luck. On the other end of the scale, rewards totally depend on effort and no luck is involved. How do people evaluate these different reward systems?

When everything depends completely on luck, people may feel that much of their effort goes unrewarded. When they do get a reward, it doesn’t satisfy them because it is completely unrelated to the effort they put in (although some are quick to come up with rationalizations why they ‘deserved’ the reward). Moreover, this system leads to feelings of unfairness as some people get rewards without putting any effort in, while others get nothing and put in a lot of effort. In conclusion, random rewards are not satisfying at all.

At the opposite end of the scale -where rewards totally depend on effort- people also tend to be unsatisfied. In this scenario, rewards often feel like a grind, like working if you will. People then tend to go about and make a plan, grind and cross things of their list. This system often feels like it lacks excitement.

In the end, rewards therefore need to be a combination of effort and luck ( alot of research supports this finding by the way). It’s this combination that is crucial. When we look at Legendaries, part of it is a pure grind (i.e., karma, tokens), part of it is a grind with some luck involved (i.e., lodestones) and part of it is pure luck (precursors). Unfortunately, the precursor part has turned out to be the most important obstacle in obtaining a Legendary, dwarfing all other components. In my opinion (and I think many agree here) this is simply bad game design.

This could easily be cured by reducing the luck factor involved in obtaining precursors and increasing the effort factor. For example, instead of getting the precursor (or not) with a 0.01% chance one could implement a system with shards. In such a scenario one would have a 0.1% chance on a shard and 10 shards combine into a precursor.

Note that the overall chance to get a precursor stays the same (so they do not necessarily become more common), but the system allows one to ‘work towards’ getting a precursor. It will feel more rewarding and also reduces the unfairness between players.

In your example, 10 × 0.1% chance doesn’t equal 0.01% chance. That’s mathematically incorrect. But I see where you’re trying to go with this. It’s a more reasonable solution.

From my perspective, you already have the grind element that’s prominent in the other parts of legendary items. I would hate it if that was all there was to it. There has to be more to it for you to gain something that’s referred to as “end game” for most.

I’ve read people say that their “last” objective in the game was to get a legendary item. Threatening with quitting the game because it’s seemingly impossible. But why? They’re essentially saying that once they get the legendary, their goal will be completed. They won’t have anything left to do and they’ll quit for that very reason.

What is the difference to them if they quit now, or after they obtain it?

But back on topic ( apologies for rambling ) I like the way you phrased things.
Personally I feel like I can accept the way things are now. But obviously, in every game, balancing needs to happen regularly.
Perhaps implementing a surefire recipe, that’s made up of multiple parts with low odds of obtaining, that ultimately add up to the same, will give players the sense of progress they need to keep going.

I can imagine that putting that much time and effort into something without a glimpse of achievement would be anguish to some. Might be different if you feel you’re a bit closer to your goal when you get that 1 out of however many shards or what not you need to build your precursor.

Threw in about 100-150 level 80 rare greatswords, got about 20 exotics, but no precursor.

edit: Just threw in another 50. 7 exotics, no precursor.

What about tieing achievement points to precursors? Make precursors account bound, but increase chance to find precursor stuff with each achievement point you earned. Then my 3.2k points finnaly had a use.

Status quo-supporters ignoring the argument about how precursors can be obtained with RMT, hm?

Such a great system! All you havek to do is shell out $200 to the gold seller of your choice and you too shall enter into the elite circle of skilled, hardcore gamers!

People are still saying not everyone should have a legendary cause it won’t feel special enough? When I get my legendary I’m going to feel good about it because I have it.

But apparently some people can only feel good about themselves when other people don’t have the things they have. Kind of a kittened up mentality when you think about it.

I’m sorry to say people, but Arena Net just DOESN’T CARE when it comes to hard working legit players as they’ve demonstrated in this thread.

A friend of mine dropped a precursor from TA chest (i m farming it full day for lodestone). He was at 3rd 4th run and dropped it…. i finished TA like 60 70 times and never see a exotic…. Bad design -.-

Malediktus.9250:

What about tieing achievement points to precursors? Make precursors account bound, but increase chance to find precursor stuff with each achievement point you earned. Then my 3.2k points finnaly had a use.

Achievement as a currency or you have to have lets say 1000+ points to purchase the precursor? And the precursor is soulbound. I’m sure a lot of people out there are just taking some off their paycheck hitting up a gw2 gold site and purchasing the 300-500g weapon. From the spams I see in Lions Arch compared to the gem-to-gold ratio it appears the Gold Sellers they want to get rid of are winning when the average player fights against this abomination known as the RNG.

Instead of precursors they should give items that let you go on a terribly hard quest chain that could possible even involve going into extra hard dungeons which would actually feel like a legendary archievment to finish. This Quest should reward the precursor.
Like “Broken Blade of Dusk”
Throwing money into the TC or items into the forge feels als legendary as getting rid of athlete’s foot.
Even the other stuff isn’t legendary, just grinding, a lot.

Part 1
Currently legendaries are meant for certain playstyles only.
Pure PvE = no map completion + no mists tokens = no legendary
Pure PvP = no map completion + a number of other stuff = no legendary
PvE + PvP = legendary
Part 2
Find someone who has leveled up the required crafting to 400 or buy gifts from TP
Part 3
Grind required mats
Part 4
Then the 3rd group of players need to go through RNG (i.e. gamble) to get a pre-cursor in order to use it to craft the legendary.

Part 1 already managed to cut down on the number of players going for legendary (I know I’m not. I’m a PvE player with no interest in PvP.) Part 2 and 3 involves alot of grind, either for mats or for money. So why make part 4 a random drop? To mimic real-world?
Hello, this is a game. I know there are supposed to be challenges and games are supposed to be fun. Some people find gambling fun (if you do, might I suggest a casino, instead of GW2, you get better returns, i.e. actual money as opposed to pixels on the screen and electrons in your silicon chips,) but not everyone does.
I also do not buy into this inane nonsense that you should take RNG out else everyone will have a legendary. So what if everyone who wants to work for a legendary gets one? Might not be good for your kitten, but that person put in the time and effort for it. Does it mean that it then looses the title of legendary? Just because it takes a legendary amount of effort to get one without the legendary amount of luck?

If I wanted something to resemble the “real-world” I would jump ship and play this extremely cool, highly addictive, free-to-play, extreme cash shop, alot of RNG, extreme full loot world PvP, super hard-core (cause if your character dies your account gets wiped, and you can’t create a new account), single-server, non-instanced world, but with quiet a number of instanced dungeons, MMMMORPG called “LIFE” (developer: God/Inteligent Design, publiser: The Universe.) Currently with about 10billion subscribers.