Guild Wars 2

DeathPanel.8362:

Kirbyprime.2645:

Meh, to be honest I think it’s fine… I mean, I did this with a D/D bunker Ele, a condition necro, a zerker war, an engie and a thief. The setup is a bit everything so it’s not like it’s DPS heavy, just need to learn to target the assassins asap while dancing around the regular mobs.

It’s more about your gear than your class, although your class is a big part of it too. (Fyi, your team is a very good setup except for maybe dd bunker ele.)

From my experience it’s almost undoable if you have 2 or 3 sub geared people in team because they will drop dead quickly.

There is so many mobs with leap type attacks that knock you down, archers and shamans that gear(dmg mitigation and hp through gear) becomes a deciding factor in whether or not you can survive. (There’s only so many times you can evade with clumps of mobs spamming attacks constantly on you, no matter how “skilled” you are.)

Just wanted to jump in on the gear bit as I’ve done this with a lvl 76 mesmer in blues. Frequently I’ve had teams complete without full exotics, but they’re skilled players, generally on alts.

I think too often we get a combination of New Player + Character w/o Exotics, and while the lack of exotics may be easy to identify, the lack of experience isn’t…. and the gear gets blamed.

Don’t get me wrong, it got notably easier when I dinged 80 and cleared out stacks of dungeon tokens on exotics for my mes, but it’s possible @ dungeon level, with gear at dungeon level.

Did CoF path 2 today with 2x Mesmer (me being one), 2x Guards, 1x Ranger, only hiccupped on the Magg Bomb part once. Note, this is with a few sub-geared fellows.

What changed in the second attempt?

I pulled out a couple Frost Guns after summoning my Phantasm/Clones, and started hitting everything I could with it. Freeze an Assassin in place for death, splash all the adds with the Chilled effect, and occasionally either launch a shotgun blast of ice & bleeds into a group or leave behind a chilling area of effect. That, combined with the Reflects, helped keep Magg alive long enough to finish.

I love that consumable.

CassieGold.7460:

Just wanted to jump in on the gear bit as I’ve done this with a lvl 76 mesmer in blues. Frequently I’ve had teams complete without full exotics, but they’re skilled players, generally on alts.

I think too often we get a combination of New Player + Character w/o Exotics, and while the lack of exotics may be easy to identify, the lack of experience isn’t…. and the gear gets blamed.

Don’t get me wrong, it got notably easier when I dinged 80 and cleared out stacks of dungeon tokens on exotics for my mes, but it’s possible @ dungeon level, with gear at dungeon level.

That’s because mesmers have numerous evasion type skills. My mesmer is all berserker glass cannon but I typically have the highest survival rate.

Try blue gear on other classes without much evasion skills like a warrior or maybe ranger and you’ll see what I’m talking about.

It’s not only about survival it’s also about dps. Not only do you need to survive against the new waves you need to kill the old ones before the new ones stack up and overwhelm you. That’s something you can’t achieve with too many players in team with blue/green gear.

That’s why I liked the old way, where even people with no gear can beat the event through kiting as long as they listen.

The new way has added a certain level of gear/build check into the event which makes it impossible for certain team/gear setups to beat it.

Just another point of view here…

I find the new Magg event much harder than before, and I don’t mean compared to kiting. I was never a big fan of 1-2-2, so any chance the group would listen to me, I’d have them fight instead. Whether PUGs, or the subpar group of guildies I run with (18 minute Path 1s, for point of comparison), it would be a hectic fight, but very doable. For groups who could do Path 1 in 14 minutes or less, it was even quite easy. I’m willing to go on a limb and say a lot of the people who claim it was too hard before either 1) didn’t have someone calling targets, or 2) had never bothered to really give fighting a try, and simply relied on everyone else’s opinion that it was impossible without kiting.

Whereas I’d have a 80-90% success rate before (even with groups who had never tried before), it’s probably closer to 30% now with the change. I don’t know if it’s just an unusually bad streak of PUG groups (haven’t tried it with my guild yet), but speaking from my own experience, I’m taking a lot more damage than before. My AH Guardian had no problem dancing with the silver mobs before, and now she flirts with death almost constantly (and is it just me, or is the fight much longer?). My Berserker Elementalist used to either not go down even once, or just once at the very end of the fight, and now I’m downed several times each attempt. I still manage to survive until we complete or fail the event, but I’ve never had this much trouble staying alive.

The Assassin isn’t the issue here, as he dies every time; it’s the rest of the mobs. I wonder if, possibly, groups with more AOE DPS are finding it easier, while groups with less have an easier time with the old event? There was probably also less coordination needed before, whereas now, with more mobs running about every which way, more attention to control is necessary.

Before anyone claims I’m arguing in favor of making everything so easy there’s no point anymore, I’m not — I would have been just fine had they left the Magg event alone. I’m just saying that the new event may actually be harder, not easier, and less favorable to random grouping than before. Just my experience, anyway.

they need better threat / aggro mechanics. This will solve a lot and allow for better content design / encounter mechanics in the future

It was meant to be a DPS event when it began pre – patch, players figured out the kiting exploit, so it was re-designed as a DPS event with the mobs. If your team dies, you dont have enough DPS.

Why do you think CoF comes in glass cannon gear, and its all about fire?

I guess now you can’t take anyone to your party, but need to select classes.

We failed it as silly NPC kept to get owned and guys could not run back and help.

I found are too many OP mobs for only 5 poor guys (and we got like 3 same professions) and silly NPC.

May be it fun to play together, die all as one, resurrect when you have like 10 mobs on you,

but we just kept FAIL and get out of there.

I don’t see it as drama but I see here limitation of choice of player we gonna take for p2 next time. I see whole idea of game (no class limitation, no need healers) broken or, at least, corrupted.

Fail is never fun and I was frustrated to stand there after like 7th try and unable to find any way to save the situation. At the end out tactical decision was to choose party for skills and not take with us some classes and even same classes.
Means now we will avoid some guys who are left behind for us (like it was my para at Dunkan at GW1).

If you think it nice and this update resolved all dungeon problem. good for you.

I think, sorry to tell, it broke even more what was broken before update, or it was wrong solution.

In a good news: number of people spamming LA map chat for FotM reduced like 10x or more at my server. So be happy: most stopped doing them.

I guess if you stop to do all, game will be over…..

I don’t get it? I thought they were normal mobs and 1 veteran every 10 secs or so? 5 players really can’t handle that?

Zogyark.4597:

I don’t get it? I thought they were normal mobs and 1 veteran every 10 secs or so? 5 players really can’t handle that?

QFT. Any group of competent players should be able to handle this.

Classes don’t matter and you can do this event with lvl 80 green gear. If five people can’t kill regular mobs and one low health veteran they should really ask themselves what they’re doing wrong.

Eliyahu.1467:

Zogyark.4597:

I don’t get it? I thought they were normal mobs and 1 veteran every 10 secs or so? 5 players really can’t handle that?

QFT. Any group of competent players should be able to handle this.

Classes don’t matter and you can do this event with lvl 80 green gear. If five people can’t kill regular mobs and one low health veteran they should really ask themselves what they’re doing wrong.

This is sort of what I was thinking. I’ve come to realize that so many of these “dungeons are hard” posts in threads like this are more, “wah it hurts I want it easy,” and not so much, “what can I do to get past this?” I don’t get it. Never will, I guess.

Every time you tell someone it’s doable, you hear, “yeah but with x class only.” Then you say, “no I’ve done it with every class combination.” “yeah well 80 exotics make it too easy.” “I was on level in greens.” “Yeah but bawwwwwww”

The difficulty of some of the content isn’t really consistent with it’s level. I mean CoF paths are easier than AC paths, but it requires a higher level. Either way, all these are doable, have been done multiple ways by many people. If you can’t get past them just simplly ask what you can do to figure it out. There are plenty of people here who would rather help you out than listen to the crying about dungeons being impossible all the time.

This fight is cake. I’ve one shot on both my Thief and Guardian the last times I’ve done it.

My Guardian handles it like a champ. I have everyone sit behind me and I can aggro all the mobs without a problem.

Brennus.1435:

If you can’t get past them just simplly ask what you can do to figure it out. There are plenty of people here who would rather help you out than listen to the crying about dungeons being impossible all the time.

I would be interested in what suggestions you have for tactics for a PUG to use, where you don’t know the stats of the gear on the other 4 members and can’t predict what classes are coming in advance. The only tactical suggestion I’ve really seen in this thread apart from using a Chill temp weapon was to call Target on the assassins, and try to focus fire them. Our group tried that, and still couldn’t take them down fast enough with all the other mobs attacking. We had no source of AoE stability or Reflect, as far as I know.

Its too easy now. Bring back the old Magg room. It will be fun without kiting noobs.

You know the bit at the end when you use cannons on the boss? I used to use that Chill cannon on the Ascalonian ghosts. I am a little disappointed that Robert prevented me from being able to be a bit creative with the encounter.

Kozai.8269:

Brennus.1435:

If you can’t get past them just simplly ask what you can do to figure it out. There are plenty of people here who would rather help you out than listen to the crying about dungeons being impossible all the time.

I would be interested in what suggestions you have for tactics for a PUG to use, where you don’t know the stats of the gear on the other 4 members and can’t predict what classes are coming in advance. The only tactical suggestion I’ve really seen in this thread apart from using a Chill temp weapon was to call Target on the assassins, and try to focus fire them. Our group tried that, and still couldn’t take them down fast enough with all the other mobs attacking. We had no source of AoE stability or Reflect, as far as I know.

Some suggestions, being very broad:

1) Designate people to clear trash and people to focus on assassins.
1a) It may help to designate someone to be primarily ranged, positioned near Magg who has responsibility for calling targets on assassins.
1b) AoE is the best method of clearing trash, but check in your party for what CC abilities you have. Can a thief lay caltrops? Can an ele use chill? Can a ranger lay traps? Even a staff guardian popping Line of Warding is of use in the game of keeping trash in line, though honestly, GS#5 from a guardian is even better.

2) If your party does not have access to AoE stability, make sure everyone slots a stun break, same as you would do for dealing with Gravelings in AC. Every class has a stun break, and most classes have some access to stability. I recomend a Thief use Daggerstorm over Thieves guild for this exact reason, even though some people would prefer the extra targets to take the pressure off, the stability + AoE damage is too important.
2a) If you have people with no access to stability (or limited access) consider putting them in a ranged role on the back line, rather than the front line.

3) Look for Party Wide boons. If you have warriors, discuss what banners will be used, or what shouts will be used. If people are overlapping, fix that unless you want them to overlap to maintain uptime of a buff.
3a) If you have classes that provide little by way of party wide support, see if those people are best suited to front line offense, or back line handling of assassins at range.
3b) Support classes should be placed at the midline where they can affect the entire party. This applies to the placement of banners, the positioning of guardians in general (though not always), good spots for boon spammers of any sort.

4) No one res a downed ally. The trash dies fast, help them rally instead.

I’m going to be honest, I’m only now starting to level a necro, and my ele is lagging behind the level curve so I don’t have much profession specific advice for those classes. My group takes a ranger on every run who manages traps and ranged attacks from right next to Magg, she is the last line of defense and she owns it. We bring a staff ele and a D/D ele to the party, and both bring different things to the mix. Our guardian is Hammer / Scepter + Shield, and I run a GS/ Sword + Focus mesmer most times. I’ve also done this with a GS / Staff guardian, a D/D + SB thief, and a GS + Longbow warrior.

Every profession can contribute, but you need 2 big things to happen:
1) Everyone needs to know what their role in the strategy is
2) Everyone should have some understanding of what the rest of the team is doing, so they can help as able.

There is absolutely nothing wrong, as you’re forming your group, when you realize that you have 3 rangers, a necro, and an engineer from stepping back (before your group even starts) and asking the question: “how are we going to approach the bomb room?” If no one in the group is able to provide some of the needed roles, then there is nothing wrong with saying ‘we need to have someone bow out so we can get someone who can do X.’ Doesn’t mean you have to kick a ranger for a guardian, but it does mean that if the group’s only notion of dealing with the room is to have all 3 rangers stand as far back as possible and range down the assassins…. you might not be set up for success from the get go.

For necros, staff and scepter/dagger is probably best. Aoe Chill, AoE cripple, AoE weakness, Aoe Fear, Aoe Blind, Elite blind, trait that chills on blind, Epidemic, spectral wall, well of power and life transfer if power necro.

Zogyark.4597:

For necros, staff and scepter/dagger is probably best. Aoe Chill, AoE cripple, AoE weakness, Aoe Fear, Aoe Blind, Elite blind, trait that chills on blind, Epidemic, spectral wall, well of power and life transfer if power necro.

That’s in line with what I’ve been thinking. (My necro is lvl 16, pardon the noob statements that follow.)

I’ve been thinking that pre-spawn of the first wave, several of the staff marks could be set at the spawn point which should make life easier in the opening rush, and Scepter #2 feels like natural crowd controll. Wells also feel like a strong way to approach the room…. maybe use ground targeted wells for better positioning?

Any time I’ve failed this event, or failed something in CoF, or wiped/died in CoF, it is always due to Rangers who don’t know that Healing Spring is a party heal, Elementalists that don’t understand what Staff/Water attunement can do for a party, Thieves who don’t know what a Shortbow or Clusterbomb is/does, Guardians who don’t know what Hold The Line is, Great Sword Warriors who don’t know how to be mobile, etc etc etc.

Learn to play issue.

Churchill.8714:

Any time I’ve failed this event, or failed something in CoF, or wiped/died in CoF, it is always due to Rangers who don’t know that Healing Spring is a party heal, Elementalists that don’t understand what Staff/Water attunement can do for a party, Thieves who don’t know what a Shortbow or Clusterbomb is/does, Guardians who don’t know what Hold The Line is, Great Sword Warriors who don’t know how to be mobile, etc etc etc.

Learn to play issue.

Well in a perfect world every player would be geared and know their class and know the dungeon path.

This isn’t a perfect world.

If you are a competent player, you can tell how good a team member is by watching how he/she’s playing his/her class. If you have 2 below average players in your group, you probably won’t make it.

its pretty simple call target on assassin as soon u see one.
The first 2 days are a bit hard cause players are still learning it
this few days I run with pugs we have no problem clearing it with our first try.

Wait, there’re people complaining about this POST-patch? I’m not normally one to pull an “elitist” attitude…. but this encounter is really easily doable. Call target on assassins, and regular mobs die to aoe. There’s really no reason that this part of the dungeon should not be doable..

Edit: Also I’ve observed a lot of people talking about DPS focus for this… Hardly. If anything, I think people with “crowd control” are better suited for this event. For example, when I ran my engineer here, I was able to Immobilize the Assassin so hard he couldn’t move an inch. I just don’t understand why this is a topic.

It’s pretty easy if you have 3-4 smart players in your group. I’ll sum up what you need to do:

1) Know how your class does damage. This means thieves should be using shortbows on the general mob and daggers on the assassins, eles should be going D/D or S/D and spamming AoE effects, engineers should be making this a cakewalk (grenade kit does wonders on the mob, and they can burst down assassins in 2-3 seconds alone, bomb kit works great here too given the larger radius effect), warriors can faceroll with a greatsword (whirlwind attack through the horde does a great job thinning them out), Guardian can either use Staff or Greatsword to work on the mob (Yes I said staff, the damage isn’t that awful – and the ward is actually pretty amazing), etcetera. The only awful class here is ranger, and that’s only if they choose not to use an axe. If they’re not using an axe? Right click → kick.

2) Rallying. When someone goes down, hopefully they’ll call a target, start hitting it, and you can finish the job. It’s not hard, but too often I see people not give a crap when another player goes down, and I’m scrabbling from across the area to try and kill something near them to rally. DO NOT REVIVE PEOPLE, RALLY THEM, IF YOU REVIVE THEM ARE YOU A BAD PLAYER

3) Don’t talk about fight club

Malediktus.9250:

Its too easy now. Bring back the old Magg room. It will be fun without kiting noobs.

They won’t do it because it was too hard. Dungeons are too hard for people unable to adapt so anet needs to adapt dungeons for them. Sad truth.

It’s easy as hell man, I pulled it of with a Engi, Mesm, Necro, Ele and a guardian… Just AoE and stay alive lol.

haviz.1340:

Malediktus.9250:

Its too easy now. Bring back the old Magg room. It will be fun without kiting noobs.

They won’t do it because it was too hard. Dungeons are too hard for people unable to adapt so anet needs to adapt dungeons for them. Sad truth.

I’ve done the old magg room a couple of times, it was pretty hard and you cant do it with all classes. If they made it the same ALOT of people are not able to do it, jsut because they have the wrong proffession. I think it’s good now, you can actually kill all the mobs now.

Play with better people. That path is kitten easy and I completed it with any profession setup. No Guardians, no ele’s, 5 guardians, 5 warriors, every thing. It’s REALLY easy when people know how to equip/build/trait their character right so they don’t do kitten damage and actually kill the mobs as they spawn.

Yes, some people get downed state, but they rally cause of the billions of mobs..

Bottomline: Find better players. It’s not the classes, it’s the players that makes the difference.

p.s. I’ve had times where I failed this event multiple times in certain pugs. e.g. lots of bad players. So I know how you feel. Just get new people and try again.

Thanks for the tips, CassieGold!

Charming Rogue.8071:

p.s. I’ve had times where I failed this event multiple times in certain pugs. e.g. lots of bad players. So I know how you feel. Just get new people and try again.

I’ve only had 2 chances to run any Explorable dungeon since I started play a couple of months ago, though I hope to do one tonight with my friends. Thus I’m looking for ways to turn players who are bad because of lack of experience (I include myself in that) into good ones through tactics, since I and my guildmates, who have done fewer Exp dungeons than me, don’t get a lot of chances to learn them by trial and error.

Kozai.8269:

Thanks for the tips, CassieGold!

Charming Rogue.8071:

p.s. I’ve had times where I failed this event multiple times in certain pugs. e.g. lots of bad players. So I know how you feel. Just get new people and try again.

I’ve only had 2 chances to run any Explorable dungeon since I started play a couple of months ago, though I hope to do one tonight with my friends. Thus I’m looking for ways to turn players who are bad because of lack of experience (I include myself in that) into good ones through tactics, since I and my guildmates, who have done fewer Exp dungeons than me, don’t get a lot of chances to learn them by trial and error.

Hope it helps Kozai. GL in dungeons tonight, for you and your friends!

I did this path for the first time ever yesterday in a group with 2(!!) engineers. We wiped once on the new assassin event since none of us had seen it before but got it pretty easily on the second try. That and one death in the lava room were my only two repairs of the run. If anything this path was relatively easy and I had fun doing it.

Dyroth.5063:

Ctrl+t is all you need. Good communication and people who pay attention it becomes incredibly easy.

This. Last night. Two thieves, a warrior, a ranger and a guardian. We pugged the guardian, and the ranger somehow got downed/dead and we left him there until the thing was done. It was more trouble to res him than just finish the fight.

And the pugged guardian was the one marking the assassins. All it takes is a little teamwork.

Sarcasmic.6741:

Quam.7218:

Sarcasmic.6741:

“Selfish glass cannon warrior” will 2 shot those assassins. Why would someone spec anything but?

Yet You fail where others not. Any conclusions ?

Only conclusion I have is you’re arguing for the sake of arguing.

Sorry for they “You”. I was sure You where the post author didn’t check – my bad. I though That the author who has problems with this path talks about only damage – build and got confused.

For clarification: Anyone can play as they want as long as they don’t fail in every encounter becouse they can’t play a offensively spec’d class.

I just never had a chance to withness a non dying glass cannon player. Maybe that’s why I see them as I see…

saul.7246:

CoF path2 – really hard and disappointing, waht r u doing ARENA NET!?!?!
Ive passed on the survivor part of the dungeon, where magg puts a bomb and we need to kill thiefs and mobs from flame legion, just before the final boss, like 3 times, and failed like 20.

Is arena net trying to dissapoint its players, making this kind of change, where makes a dungeon looks that hard. Im really kitten off with the last changes, like no respwan for party members in non-combat inside dungeons. Me and my friends dont get trouble on others paths and dungeons, we got nice gear but only can do cof path 2 with LUCK.

Challenger is a lot different of Frustrating.

Really m8?? path 2 is hard?? -__-

To the OP, I ran this dungeon two nights in a row. The first night, I had never seen path 2 and we struggled and ended up picking up some doosh canoe who proceeded to tell us to kite, we needed to listen to him, we were f’ing idiots, etc. We finished eventually, but nobody bothered to explain ANY of the fights so I was left to figure everything out on my own. The second night I ran it with a guild group of whoever was on. Our make-up was warrior, warrior, ranger, mesmer, guardian.

The first night, the ONLY aoe heal field was from the ranger in our pug and THEN it was only at my request. The pug ele NEVER dropped out of fire attunement. It was very painful as a warrior for part you are complaining about. I was trying to kite as much as possible because that seemed to be the ‘consensus’ way to handle the fight.

The second night we decided to just aoe down everything in a blitz and had one person calling targets. Our make-up was, in my opinion, worse and we obliterated the fight.

Communication is key.