Guild Wars 2

I am having trouble grasping the structure of Instance gameplay. In almost every Instance I have entered, I have been unable to keep up with the party due to the fact that the party is in constant motion— they don’t even stop to fight anything but the mini-bosses required to progress the instance to its conclusion.
I have some skill in the game’s combat, but I lack the ability to dodge and weave through several rooms full of enemies without dying. I don’t know how most instances are played at all, because I get kicked from the party every time I mention this. When I question others on why they refuse to fight anything but select minibosses, I always get the same answer;

Because they don’t have to.

Most players will simply ignore the instance and everything in it in order to dash to the largest fights with the largest rewards. They will then exit and reenter the instance to repeat the process.

Players don’t actually PLAY any of the Instances in this game.

I find this incredibly frustrating as a player. There is literally no point in entering an instance other than to farm it for loot. And every time I have ever questioned this practice I find myself kicked.
I would like to request changes in the Instance structure to the game which discourage such laziness.

I feel the best course of action is to make some tweaks to enemy behavior within instances. You could increase the chase range (and give a minor boost to movement speed) for all creatures within instances. If the critters never give up the chase, then the players will HAVE to actually face them. However, also make sure to carefully monitor then enemy spawn rates ( or eliminate enemy respawning); if you make carving a path a viable strategy, then that’s what parties will do.
Also, if a specific enemy or object has it’s own independent lifebar pop up on the side of the screen,

Lock the exits from the room its in until its beaten!! Do you want the players to fight it or not?

I can understand and respect the cleverness in avoiding an enemy to bypass it, but no game should encourage players to skip an entire Instance.

It’s just not fun to go to any Instances with the game in this state.

AntiGW, this is your time to shine!

Yeah we just had this conversation yesterday.

Although there might not be any posts left in that one, so carry on.

Another one of these threads.

OP, no one in this subforum cares, and will all give you the same answer: you don’t like skipping mobs? Find a party of likeminded people (like AntiGW), and don’t skip mobs. In the meantime, stop forcing your flawed opinion on us and pretending you’re superior because you like wasting time on killing worthless trashmobs for no reward.

By the way, when you do a full clear of Arah p4, let me know how long it took you.

Well, the good news is that Anet is already starting to do the stuff you mentioned. For example, the newest dungeon revamp they have made it so the entrance to each area is closed off until you kill all of the enemies, or the objectives are surrounded by adds and the objectives themselves are slow to complete.

Anet themselves have stated that they are looking in to increasing how profitable the mobs are throughout the dungeon, but are having difficulty balancing this. The problem is that if you make the random mobs too profitable, then players will just do the beginning of a dungeon instead of skipping to the end of the dungeon.

It is annoying that players actually avoiding playing the game, but this if Anet’s current trend continues, then this problem is only a temporary one.

I think “skipping” is extremely frustrating for new player. That’s the main problem.

People just think people are avoiding to play the game. But in all skipping is the game. You try to not die when running from one place to another which is full of monster(think guild rush).

And if you read the OP’s post “I lack ability to dodge and weave through several rooms full of enemies without dying.”… You should be able to understand it.

I have to actaully practice skipping. And find strategy to skip. For example use the right skill and sigil of energy.

It is really like the cliff side fractal. It is very frustrating as a new player to run throug all the trap while everyone in your group runs ahead. They just don’t have an excuse there because trap is not killable.

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

Well, the good news is that Anet is already starting to do the stuff you mentioned. For example, the newest dungeon revamp they have made it so the entrance to each area is closed off until you kill all of the enemies, or the objectives are surrounded by adds and the objectives themselves are slow to complete.

Anet themselves have stated that they are looking in to increasing how profitable the mobs are throughout the dungeon, but are having difficulty balancing this. The problem is that if you make the random mobs too profitable, then players will just do the beginning of a dungeon instead of skipping to the end of the dungeon.

It is annoying that players actually avoiding playing the game, but this if Anet’s current trend continues, then this problem is only a temporary one.

They also decreased mobs hp by large margin making them literally melt with decent parties. People don’t skip because it’s fun, they skip because killing mobs is unrewarding waste of time.

don’t come crying on the forums because you didn’t do your homework and want to be carried pls ty ))

I haven’t noticed an overall HP decrease as much as I have noticed that more vets are running about instead of silvers. I have also noticed there are a lot more enemies in general… I’m for this change, though, since a whole lot of smaller HP bags is preferable to one gigantic bag.

Something I’ve always found interesting is that everyone always has a different response to the whole skipping thing. Some say it is to make money. Some say it is because they are bored with the dungeon. Some say it is because they enjoy skipping. Some say it is to be “leet”.

^ Because there are many different type of players. Most of the people complain about skipping are new players that felt left down when everyone just run ahead while left them behind dieing.

Most of the people complain about stacking and cheesy mechanic are non farmers. Who hardly even do dungeon(or casual enough they rarely logon). They just want to max out their fun to play for the game mechanic because they dont’ farm.

I saw someone complain about people cheesing through dungeon. So I try to add him to friend to do some non cheesing dungeon runs. It turns out he hardly even logon. If his a farmer he wont’ be complaining about cheesy technique to maxmize their profit. Or if he is a pro player, he’ll know most of the dungeon is soloable. So he won’t complain about he can’t enjoy the mechanic of the fight in the first place. And more often than not, he hardly even do dungeon, because if he do, he’ll spend more time complaining why newbie join his speed run group.

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

I haven’t noticed an overall HP decrease as much as I have noticed that more vets are running about instead of silvers. I have also noticed there are a lot more enemies in general… I’m for this change, though, since a whole lot of smaller HP bags is preferable to one gigantic bag.

Something I’ve always found interesting is that everyone always has a different response to the whole skipping thing. Some say it is to make money. Some say it is because they are bored with the dungeon. Some say it is because they enjoy skipping. Some say it is to be “leet”.

If you didn’t notice about 50% reduction of silvers hp you must have had really bad dps. Husks don’t die in 2-3s in old TA.

And why multiple smaller hp bags are preferable to one bag? It increases the importance of AoEs, makes los-ing even more important and reduces the viability of single target cc-s. In other words, everything that BHBs stand against.

Bright.9160:

Another one of these threads.

OP, no one in this subforum cares, and will all give you the same answer: you don’t like skipping mobs? Find a party of likeminded people (like AntiGW), and don’t skip mobs. In the meantime, stop forcing your flawed opinion on us and pretending you’re superior because you like wasting time on killing worthless trashmobs for no reward.

By the way, when you do a full clear of Arah p4, let me know how long it took you.

This subforum was created with the purpose of discuss, get information and offer feedback about dungeons, not to be your personal or a group personal chatt site. Think and understand whatever thing you are posting before, so that you stop writing nosenses.

Lucius.2140:

This subforum was created with the purpose of discuss, get information and offer feedback about dungeons, not to be your personal or a group personal chatt site. Think and understand whatever thing you are posting before, so that you stop writing nosenses.

Except that we get threads like this one every few days, and in fact, there is another thread discussing exactly this on the front page, which means you didn’t even bother to look for other discussions like this one before trying to waste our time.

And in each of these threads, it ends up the same way, people say “skipping is bad”, and we say “then don’t skip”, which is -for some reason- and inadequate answer. For some reason it is not enough for people like yourself to play like you think the game is supposed to be played. No, it isn’t good enough for you until everyone is playing the game like you think the game is supposed to be played, because you keep crying for nerfs to dungeons that force other people to kill everything instead of skipping it.

I don’t care how you run dungeons. Do it on your own time. Find a group of like-minded feel-good carebears that want to kill every mob in a dungeon. In the meantime, I’ll play the game how I want, and you can play the game how you want. Making everyone happy. Except that you don’t want us to be happy, because we clear dungeons 4 times faster than you do. Which makes you jealous/angry, and means you want to nerf skipping so everyone can be as slow as you are.

Do you start to see why I don’t have patience with threads like this? Because it usually ends up with anti-skippers calling us cheaters and exploiters and demanding to force us to play the same way they do because their own incompetence to play the game.

Bright.9160:

For some reason it is not enough for people like yourself to play like you think the game is supposed to be played.

We don’t think that the game is supposed to be played in a certain way. Certain things are supposed to be played in a number of fairly certain ways. You don’t design a bunch of fights just to have everyone skip them all.

Boring mobs and/or not rewarding enough? Design failure, the fights should redesigned until they are fun enough to make them worth killing regardless of rewards.

People skip fights in a way that makes no sense? (no features that would make it a realistic option). Redesign until they fight everything they are supposed to (until the mobs won’t let you rush through their entire fortress to kill their boss, while they have a party upstairs).

Bright.9160:

-snip-

pretty much 100% this. I approve.

AntiGw is probably doing PvF more than playing GW2 these days, it’s pretty interesting to see how “play how you want” has been translated into the PvF gamemode. Keep up the good work

Himax.3954:

I have some skill in the game’s combat, but I lack the ability to dodge and weave through several rooms full of enemies without dying.

You need to learn how to dodge; the game is essentially designed around this feature. Also, learning to skip isn’t instant, there is a bit of a learning curve. Look at your utilities and see which ones are most beneficial for when you need to run through things.

Also, I believe at some point, someone linked to a thread/video of a game designer who said “not every mob is supposed to be killed,” indicating that some pre-boss paths were designed to be skipped. In my opinion, the first two runs in Arah path 1 are clear cases for this design choice. You simply don’t design hard-hitting, condition spamming, veteran oozes that split into two once you get them to 25% that appear en masse unless they are there to be skipped.

AntiGw.9367:

Bright.9160:

For some reason it is not enough for people like yourself to play like you think the game is supposed to be played.

We don’t think that the game is supposed to be played in a certain way. Certain things are supposed to be played in a number of fairly certain ways. You don’t design a bunch of fights just to have everyone skip them all.

Boring mobs and/or not rewarding enough? Design failure, the fights should redesigned until they are fun enough to make them worth killing regardless of rewards.

People skip fights in a way that makes no sense? (no features that would make it a realistic option). Redesign until they fight everything they are supposed to (until the mobs won’t let you rush through their entire fortress to kill their boss, while they have a party upstairs).

Except that if Anet wanted, they’d remove leashing from the game, and skipping would be an instant goner. I wonder why they haven’t done so, if they designed things to be killed 100% of the time. Oh right, but now I’m using logic, and you’re having a hard time grasping that.

Anet stated on not one, but multiple occasions that skipping is a legit tactic and totally okay. In fact, some parts of some dungeons were specifically designed for skipping. Most of Arah comes to mind for example. Some parts of CM come to mind too. The run in F/F TA as well after the valiants. I mean, why would it be that a mob that isn’t really so far away would leash right at the end of a bridge, so conveniently out of aggro range of the next mob and with only very few blossoms around?

There are plenty of examples where skipping was most likely intended as a legit tactic.

Stop trying to get your stupid ways enforced on other players. It’s annoying, and quite frankly, borders with fascism on some occasions. We’re not forcing you to skip everything, are we? We’re telling you to keep your flawed arguments to yourself, and play how you want and be happy with it. You on the other hand are telling all of us we’re wrong, not playing the game, cheating, exploiting, and should all play like you do, yet still claim to have the moral high ground.

Good luck with that, Mussolini.

How can you make something fun once you’ve done it 100+ times? Most experienced players have finished hobby dungeonist 100-200+ times. That’s 5 dungeons per recording. What’s 200 * 5? 1000!!!! omg. Come back to me when your on my level.

tl;dr;
BHB

Another one of these? First of all shame on you for not seeing the other ones already posted, and making a duplicate unnecessary thread.

What’s going on? Are there certain people that shall-not-be-named going in game and saying “Oh you don’t like stacking/skipping either??? Go on the forums and complain!!”

Anywho. Just tell them upfront you haven’t done it, and ask politely if they can explain what to do.

Just know it’s perfectly fine to change utilities in a dungeon. You can run stability, invulns, etc while running. Get out of combat, wait for cooldown, and switch back to your normal utilities.

I think a more accurate comparison would be that you are sneaking/barging past the terrorists guarding the doors so you can get to the main objective faster and get him out of there as soon as possible….

Why don’t you answer Bright?

Like he said, if skipping wasn’t intended, why does leashing exist?

haviz.1340:

They also decreased mobs hp by large margin making them literally melt with decent parties. People don’t skip because it’s fun, they skip because killing mobs is unrewarding waste of time.

^ Not sure why people still don’t understand this. It’s 2013 for kitten’s sake.

colesy.8490:

Why don’t you answer Bright?

Like he said, if skipping wasn’t intended, why does leashing exist?

his answer in the other thread is something like: “that is not for skipping, it is to prevent farming”

AntiGw.9367:

Tree.3916:

How can you make something fun once you’ve done it 100+ times? Most experienced players have finished hobby dungeonist 100-200+ times. That’s 5 dungeons per recording. What’s 200 * 5? 1000!!!! omg. Come back to me when your on my level.

tl;dr;
BHB

So you keep doing something that isn’t fun at all? Why? Oh yeah, the reward.

This thread reminded me of a certain recent movie about a terrorist attack on the White House.

So the 5 or so terrorists get into the White House and start shooting people, while the entire freaking US military and armed forces are camping outside the fence and are like

“Oh, we can’t enter the White House. I guess we’ll just sit here and scratch our balls for two hours while five nutjobs are murdering our president and the children inside. Oh look, it’s Barack Obama sticking out of a car with a rocket launcher! How awesome is that, our president is fighting for his life! You go, sir!”

These are the mobs you are skipping.

I get gold per path completed. If I want my legendary within the year I either have to run dungeons or become a trading post flipper. I choose the former option.

Wukunlin.8461:

colesy.8490:

Why don’t you answer Bright?

Like he said, if skipping wasn’t intended, why does leashing exist?

his answer in the other thread is something like: “that is not for skipping, it is to prevent farming”

This one time I facepalmed so hard I caused a shockwave that killed the dinosaurs. This may happen again soon.

Tree.3916:

How can you make something fun once you’ve done it 100+ times?

The same thing I said 9 months ago.

Robert Hrouda himself said they could remove mob leashing was easily but they didn’t want to since Anet knew how kitten the drops were and suggested full-clearers to make their own groups. Yet even after he made that post the anti-skipping threads still came in 1-2+ times a week. I suppose people don’t read forum title much like they don’t read LFG descriptions?

You know what happened to the guilds of “full clear” dungeon running groups from 9 months ago? They all got bored of clearing everything and quit/became skippers themselves. Only we skippers/cheaters/exploiters/elitists have endured since then.

It seems with the loss of Hrouda, some of that skip-tolerancy of Anet as also been lost.
But guess what is happening to the new Twilight Assault which is so unskippable? It’s becoming deader than TAFU after everyone’s done it.

Anet is in a trap, they can’t make the trash mobs rewarding without people farming the trash and ignoring the rest of the dungeon but forcing people to clear trash is also bad. Their game engine apparently can’t handle complex AI either, you’re better off waiting for GW3.

zencow.3651:

you’re better off waiting for GW3.

nah just 2.0 a realm reborn aka W*

I was just as surprised as you were.
It’s a pretty weird thing. I’d blame the players, but although I think they’ve taken it above and beyond, even I have a feeling the devs were going for a ‘wading through a high tension swamp of enemies between boss fights’ thing at some points in the game (Arah).

Sadly, they’re missing the mark by alot. When you’re skipping, mobs aren’t genuinely terrifying, they just feel wimpy and pathetic. So they don’t do much building of tension. Instead of some nice feeling of escalation like you might see in other action games with segments like this, the flow of these skipping sections becomes these these horrible little empty pauses. Not only does skipping keep from adding anything to the experience, but the practice can make the flow vulnerable to go crashing headlong into a wall if your group runs into trouble.

Best case scenario for skipping, everybody’s flawless, and the flow of the run never really amounts to much. Worst case scenario for skipping, everybody’s miserable, and the flow of the run is herky jerky and frustrating. Honestly, it could use some work.

Good news is, they’re getting better at it. The flow in the newer dungeon is great, mostly because they’ve taken to gating. I’m all for separating my peas from my carrots, making good killing experiences and good skipping experiences separately instead of trying to ineffectually mush it all together. You can’t have tension without fear, and you can’t be afraid running from mobs that are balanced to be easily defeated.

Now I just need a few planned sections in an Arah revamp where you’re running through a teaming mass of the undead who are built in a way that actually manages to terrify me, and we’ll be in business.

Bright.9160:

Except that we get threads like this one every few days, and in fact, there is another thread discussing exactly this on the front page, which means you didn’t even bother to look for other discussions like this one before trying to waste our time.

In fact i have posted in that thread before; also in this one theres a post up of your first one, redirecting the OP to it. The difference is that you arent (at least werent) saying him to go there, you said him basically to not put his opinion.

His opinion can not be of your like, but if his using the proper way to express himself ,he has the right to put it. That is the point of my answer, beause he alredy has been redirected to a proper thread (and seriusly the part about using the forums properly will be really good as well as improving the quality of posts, including yours).

In other words: What you just answered me is totally a different matter than the one i posted or what you did originally, reread.

However, this one is about skipping mobs not stacking or exploiting, but since the community thinks its similar i supose he can go there (because i dont plan to argue you about it been different, that will be tiring, so stick with the part when i said hes been redirected to a proper thread).

Lucius.2140:

Bright.9160:

Except that we get threads like this one every few days, and in fact, there is another thread discussing exactly this on the front page, which means you didn’t even bother to look for other discussions like this one before trying to waste our time.

In fact i have posted in that thread before; also in this one theres a post up of your first one, redirecting the OP to it. The difference is that you arent (at least werent) saying him to go there, you said him basically to not put his opinion.

His opinion can not be of your like, but if his using the proper way to express himself ,he has the right to put it. That is the point of my answer, beause he alredy has been redirected to a proper thread (and seriusly the part about using the forums properly will be really good as well as improving the quality of posts, including yours).

In other words: What you just answered me is totally a different matter than the one i posted or what you did originally, reread.

However, this one is about skipping mobs not stacking or exploiting, but since the community thinks its similar i supose he can go there (because i dont plan to argue you about it been different, that will be tiring, so stick with the part when i said hes been redirected to a proper thread).

Read the OP carefully. It is one player, who is probably newer, that has yet run dungeons enough to grasp how to skip trash packs. His post isn’t about changing the structure, it’s because he’s mad the other 4 people left him behind.

My suggestion to the op would be to research the runs more carefully before joining an lfr group that most likely said (experienced players). I can all but guarantee that there is no chance you will still have this same opinion after a few hundred more of those dungeon runs.

I still have the same opinion hundreds of runs later.

Vox Hollow.2736:

I still have the same opinion hundreds of runs later.

Curious, do you run dungeons for the experience the trash mobs offer? With the hp rivaling the bosses and none of the reward to show for it (looking at you fotm). I don’t clear every mob that I run across in open world, because I would probably still be working on explorer instead of having shiny footprints.

I still don’t see the problem here. I happen to like my time in game used to the best extent when pugging. I look for players that share the same interest and group with them. Why not use the LFG tool and specify that you’re clearing every trash pack? Is it because you’d spend longer waiting to get started than the group that went to the dungeon for the end reward and completed it already?

Curious, do you run dungeons for the experience the trash mobs offer?

Kind of Yes and No?

I’m here for the experience.
That means I’m interested in how it feels to play a dungeon as a whole from start to finish. Breaking something down to it’s parts and pieces and examining them individually is just not something I would do. Because the same piece can have a different impact depending on what it’s followed by and coming before.

It’s not really as simple as ‘I think people should skip everything’ or ‘I think people shouldn’t skip anything’. In some paths the overall flow and experience fighting trash mobs is better than it would be skipping them. In other paths fighting them is just as bad, if not worse. Others I tend to like best when they’re done partial.

Meh. That’s kind of a unsatisfying answer, I know.
Flow’s not really my part of the pipeline. So, I only really know enough to know when I don’t like how it’s coming across, not enough to give it the explanation it really deserves.

I still don’t see the problem here. I happen to like my time in game used to the best extent when pugging. I look for players that share the same interest and group with them. Why not use the LFG tool and specify that you’re clearing every trash pack? Is it because you’d spend longer waiting to get started than the group that went to the dungeon for the end reward and completed it already?

‘Play with likeminded people’ is fine from the player’s perspective.
I mean, it’s not like you personally can make changes to the game. So, that’s just about all you can really do at the end of the day.

But all too often people take that handwave-y stopgap measure as something much more serious. And that’s the part that’s silly. I can’t imagine how anybody ever confused dealing with our current circumstances as they are, with trivialized content as a sacrosanct meaningful design decision that was going to be upheld forevermore in revisions. It’s not like developers sit around all day and think up new and creative ways to waste time.

Those who complain about skipping in dungeons could educate themselves a bit and read this and this before posting.
In the end the best solution is to group up with like minded people instead of trying to impose your views on others.

anabasis.7346:

Those who complain about skipping in dungeons could educate themselves a bit and read this and this before posting.
In the end the best solution is to group up with like minded people instead of trying to impose your views on others.

Thanks for looking those up. I’ve been too lazy/didn’t care enough to do so.

P.S. /thread

Why do you think, that just because there are mobs, means that you need to kill them? I dont see the connection.

anabasis.7346:

Those who complain about skipping in dungeons could educate themselves a bit and read this and this before posting.
In the end the best solution is to group up with like minded people instead of trying to impose your views on others.

OMG! You found it, thank you! I went trough 8 pages of Robert’s history looking for this earlier today, in light of all the “PLAY THE WAY I WANT!” threads lately.

haviz.1340:

If you didn’t notice about 50% reduction of silvers hp you must have had really bad dps. Husks don’t die in 2-3s in old TA.

And why multiple smaller hp bags are preferable to one bag? It increases the importance of AoEs, makes los-ing even more important and reduces the viability of single target cc-s. In other words, everything that BHBs stand against.

I never bothered to time it. Then again, that was pre-LFG days, so it could be that the new HP drop coincided with an equal DPS drop from players in general.

Anyway, I’m used to an MMO where the standard mode of play was to be outnumbered 3 to 1, where enemy difficulty came more from numbers rather than being gigantic HP bags. While the two situations can pose equal threat, throwing around multiple enemies invokes a sense of relative power, whereas lightly plinking away against a single big enemy invokes a sense of weakness by comparison. Should things turn sour, the gains made against a group with smaller members are absolute; dead enemies stay dead, whereas failure against a big enemy means the loss of all progress.

Spreading skills and different forms of threat also allows for targeted progress: If one enemy in the group has skills (say, large AoE stuns) that a group of players can’t handle, then they have the option to target, disable and burn that particular enemy, eliminating that kind of threat. Throwing all of the abilities onto few or one mob results in players just having to shrug and grit through a troublesome attack. This also means a diminished effectiveness in enemy attacks, since few or a single enemy has to deal with cooldowns and attack at a certain pace, whereas multiple enemies can attack simultaneously, posing more threat. The end result being that having more enemies results in both greater possible challenge, as well as more tactics in which to deal with that situation.

I suppose the biggest drawback to such a system is that, to compensate for low health, each enemy need proportionately higher damage. Even the mooks need to pose a threat to stay engaged, and if they die quicker then they need to kill quicker.

I don’t have a problem with AoEs. Single target CC isn’t a problem if encounters are designed well enough: a mixture of low HP + high HP enemies, as well as enemies with distinguishable immediate threat makes single target CC worthwhile even when being swarmed. I’m not even sure what LOS is supposed to refer it. As far as I know, that means Line of Sight, AKA “be capable enough to point your toon in the right direction when shooting”. I don’t have a problem with that. Maybe it is in reference to enemies body blocking. I’d actually prefer to see more of that, since it makes sense: have mooks out front while the dangerous guy in the back lays waste. Its like putting snipers at the end of a long hallway: it’s annoying to deal with but a realistic expectation of combat.

Skipping monsters is nothing new to any video game. If you want to slog through the dungeon killing everything, knowing fully well how unrewarding it is, then by all means you’re free to make your own party and do so.

laokoko.7403:

I think “skipping” is extremely frustrating for new player. That’s the main problem.

Pretty much this. In any game skipping is usually a pain in the kitten at first glance. People just need to get used to it instead of coming to the forums to complain about it for the 900th time after doing a dungeon once.

I still dont understand how running past monster is hard. Some people in TA/Arah make it seem like the hardest thing in the game from how much that fail at it.

clint.5681:

I still dont understand how running past monster is hard. Some people in TA/Arah make it seem like the hardest thing in the game from how much that fail at it.

It’s not necessarily that it’s difficult (well, not for EVERYONE at least) so much as it just takes away from the fun of the game. I’d have much more fun clearing dungeons as opposed to skipping honestly, and the only reason why I choose to skip them instead is the lack of reward or incentive for clearing making it nothing more than a time sink.

Black Box.9312:

I’d have much more fun clearing dungeons as opposed to skipping honestly

Black Box.9312:

the only reason why I choose to skip them instead is the lack of reward or incentive for clearing making it nothing more than a time sink.

wat?

If you actually found it fun, you would be inclined to do it with or without the rewards. Sorry, not buying it.

Nokaru.7831:

Black Box.9312:

I’d have much more fun clearing dungeons as opposed to skipping honestly

Black Box.9312:

the only reason why I choose to skip them instead is the lack of reward or incentive for clearing making it nothing more than a time sink.

wat?

If you actually found it fun, you would be inclined to do it with or without the rewards. Sorry, not buying it.

Because not being rewarded for extra work outweighs the desire to do it. It’s not just that the reward is minimal, it’s that it’s pretty much negligible entirely. I don’t particularly care for speed clearing, but taking anywhere from 10-30 minutes extra for no reason at all is just too much baggage for me to actually want to do it, despite it being somewhat entertaining.

Like someone mentioned, skipping has been around a long time.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=kcmKPmj9yeE

Last time I checked, you don’t stomp on piranha plants if you don’t have a star invincibility power up

Black Box.9312:

clint.5681:

I still dont understand how running past monster is hard. Some people in TA/Arah make it seem like the hardest thing in the game from how much that fail at it.

It’s not necessarily that it’s difficult (well, not for EVERYONE at least) so much as it just takes away from the fun of the game. I’d have much more fun clearing dungeons as opposed to skipping honestly, and the only reason why I choose to skip them instead is the lack of reward or incentive for clearing making it nothing more than a time sink.

So why do people join my speedrun experienced only groups knowing that is going to be skip galore and yet they fail.. hard.

Im not telling these people to join my group and screw i up, if they need practice using WASD they can slide on over to Orr where there is plenty of mobs to run past.

clint.5681:

Black Box.9312:

clint.5681:

I still dont understand how running past monster is hard. Some people in TA/Arah make it seem like the hardest thing in the game from how much that fail at it.

It’s not necessarily that it’s difficult (well, not for EVERYONE at least) so much as it just takes away from the fun of the game. I’d have much more fun clearing dungeons as opposed to skipping honestly, and the only reason why I choose to skip them instead is the lack of reward or incentive for clearing making it nothing more than a time sink.

So why do people join my speedrun experienced only groups knowing that is going to be skip galore and yet they fail.. hard.

Im not telling these people to join my group and screw i up, if they need practice using WASD they can slide on over to Orr where there is plenty of mobs to run past.

They’re looking to be carried, lazy kittens.

Bright.9160:

Except that if Anet wanted, they’d remove leashing from the game, and skipping would be an instant goner. I wonder why they haven’t done so, if they designed things to be killed 100% of the time. Oh right, but now I’m using logic, and you’re having a hard time grasping that.

Anet stated on not one, but multiple occasions that skipping is a legit tactic and totally okay. In fact, some parts of some dungeons were specifically designed for skipping. Most of Arah comes to mind for example. Some parts of CM come to mind too. The run in F/F TA as well after the valiants. I mean, why would it be that a mob that isn’t really so far away would leash right at the end of a bridge, so conveniently out of aggro range of the next mob and with only very few blossoms around?

There are plenty of examples where skipping was most likely intended as a legit tactic.

Stop trying to get your stupid ways enforced on other players. It’s annoying, and quite frankly, borders with fascism on some occasions. We’re not forcing you to skip everything, are we? We’re telling you to keep your flawed arguments to yourself, and play how you want and be happy with it. You on the other hand are telling all of us we’re wrong, not playing the game, cheating, exploiting, and should all play like you do, yet still claim to have the moral high ground.

Good luck with that, Mussolini.

This is some of the dumbest things I’ve ever heard. If you are honestly think that the only reason why leashing exists is to encourage people to skip mobs, then you need to think a whole lot harder about what would happen if all the mobs chased you everywhere no matter what. If you don’t honestly think that, then spare us your nonsense and quit trolling.

I’ve heard that excuse of “well, if Anet didn’t want us to skip, then they’d do so and so” and it is getting tiring. Last time I heard, if Anet really didn’t want us to skip, then they would’ve put arbitrary gates that forced clearing before being opened. Well, look what happens with all the recent dungeons: arbitrary gates forcing clearing. If you actually paid attention to what Hrouda said about skipping, you’d see he doesn’t condone it, and didn’t force players to fight every mob because he thinks its a sloppy and bad solution to the problem. Now that he’s gone, look what happened. Instead, the rare circumstance where Anet has designed mobs to be skipped is being used shamelessly as a sweeping justification for all skipping everywhere.

As much as I’d like to sit back and say “play how you want”, the fact is that elitists don’t. They go into every forum and insult players who do anything but run the builds and equipment they do. As if the only metric to gauge a player’s worth is how quickly they can do content and how risky they can be while doing it. Personal preference, comfort, or skill level be darned. You march on this crusade that anyone who doesn’t go for pure damage is bad for the game, and why is this done? All because the elitist despises any player who does anything but increase how fast they get coin from a dungeon.

Of course your constant push for elitism and discrimination is ruining the game for others, because now you keep pulling the better players into a hyper-refined niche that makes them incapable of handling with anything but other hyper-refined builds. So instead of having players who are good enough to run pure DPS working with regular groups and capable of playing off of regular groups, they isolate themselves and then go to the forums to post horror stories about how those backwoods pugs didn’t stack exactly when expected with no word on strategy every time they bother to venture into the rest of the community. But hey, at least we have a bunch of players who have no business running GC gear kissing dirt every 10 seconds because elitists are deeply disturbed by mentalities different from their own.

The whole “play how you want” thing would’ve gone fine until you decided you weren’t happy with how others played, so you go around demonizing them. Now we have this cultural civil war going on in this game, with the other extreme being players who now adamantly refuse any constructive criticism because they’re fed up with impossible advice given out with the purpose to be bragging rights and to increase the adviser’s income. If elitists hadn’t made a big deal about it in the first place, this never would’ve happened. The worst part is that you actually believe that players who like to fight mobs are jealous of you.

Both casuals and pros have said mean things to each other. How about everyone just stops?

Casuals, please don’t join a speed run.
Pros, please don’t join a casual run.

I wish it was easier to make it more obvious in the LFG which is which… but people don’t always have time to read the description.

If you do enter a party of 4 other players not playing how you want to play, then just excuse yourself and save everyone a headache.