Guild Wars 2

JonPeters.5630:

I just wanted to update everyone on where we stand with this. So far we have found a single bug with the system that is causing certain players to get stuck in a state of reduced rewards without actually exploiting. A fix for this has already been made and is being tested locally now. We are going to do more significant testing on this new version but we also believe it is more bulletproof to begin with. Please keep posting data as these cases are somewhat rare and are hard for us to find with internal testing but seem to be exposed quickly when thousands of people are playing the dungeons.

All rewards are susceptible to our code that is dealing with people who are speed clearing dungeons. This means that if you are speed clearing and then play some new chain for the first time it may not reward the full 60 tokens. If you find yourself getting less rewards consider whether or not your rate of dungeon completion is extremely high.

If you think you are running at a fairly reasonable pace post all of the chains you have run and the time of day they were completed and we will file it to try and figure out if it is a bug. Please post accurate times, otherwise we cannot determine if there are in fact bugs in the system. Please continue to use this thread as a place to post this data so that we have it all in one location.

Thanks,

Jon

start rant
…. Rare case?
More like happening with every other person I’ve talked to..
This DR system has been the most anti-groupwork idea I’ve ever seen in a game. Why?

Take for example a scenerio that happened earlier. I did CoF Magg’s Run Twice in a row… neither of which were particularily fast runs. These were the first CoF dungeon runs in almost a week, and the first dungeon runs period in days.

What did I get for the runs?
1 – 45 tokens
2 – 10 tokens

First of all… why the hell was I penalized on my first run?
Second of all, should I not have gotten 20 tokens for the 2nd run considering neither run was particularily fast?

Not to mention a later run of another dungeon ended with even worse results….

And… Before the “Don’t FARM Magg’s Path” posts come in, I’d like to clarify. These are both GUILD RUNS. I’m behind HELPFUL to guild members as we do not all live in a magical world were there’s a perfect denomination of 5-man parties. Not to mention our class composition does not currently allow us to nuke down the superweapon path currently due to its over-tuned nature (I’d like to see a video of a 1 ranger 2 guardian and 2 ele team doing it…) Pretty much all the posts and suggestions I’ve had from people so far can be summed up as one of two… bring a few OP DPS Warriors or a necro that can keep the boss in constant poison…

But I’m sidetracking… for a game that’s all about GUILDS… I mean.. its in the NAME OF THE GAME…… WHY THE HECK ARE YOU PUNISHING PEOPLE WHO ARE BEING HELPFUL? it’s not like we could go ahead and PUG groups for the missing person because as we ALL KNOW… EXPLORABLE MODES ARE FOR THE ELITE GUILD GROUPS AND NOT FOR PUGS…. AM I RITE?

Seriously
At the very least, make the anti-farming/dr system a VISIBLE BUFF so we aren’t wasting our times… I am currently not going to touch the other dungeon explorables at all, why? Because for all I know, I could or could not already be hit with the DR system and end up with 1~8 tokens at the end of a few-hour run. Sure its fun to do things with friends, but it doesn’t change the fact that you’re getting slapped in the face at the end.

end rant

At the very least, the +40 token bonus/ path should NOT be subject to the DR system. This way regardless of how broken the DR system is, you’d at least get 1 semi-decent run a day.

little.6509:

“A skill organized group”. I sat in front of the dungeon for 30 minutes prior asking about traits and skills running to make sure we knew what we were doing. Now if by skill organized you mean friends or people I know, that is once again absurd that is required to do a dungeon. Rewards should be given for effort and time, not completion.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Do-NOT-nerf-please/127216 (you have to scroll up for the devpost, the forum works as well as the game)

In the end it doesn’t matter what I think, it’s their game. so I read the devposts, see what and how it ends up in the game and make my own assumptions about their intention (which, right now, would be that dungeons aren’t meant for pugs – and according to the zealous fanboys there is an “abundance of alternatives” if can’t or don’t want to do dungeons. so….)

Tora.8610:

…. Rare case?
More like happening with every other person I’ve talked to..

[…]

First of all… why the hell was I penalized on my first run?
Second of all, should I not have gotten 20 tokens for the 2nd run considering neither run was particularily fast?

The answer is right in the post you quoted. It’s a bug.

And it is just a few players. The people who get affected are much more vocal and have a much higher chance of posting in the forums and talk/complain about it in chat. Anecdotal evidence isn’t exactly valid. Of the people I ran with, 3 got full rewards and 2 (including myself) did not.

I lost 90 token stack of Symbol of Koda, anyone experienced that?

Dace.3985:

The answer is right in the post you quoted. It’s a bug.

And it is just a few players. The people who get affected are much more vocal and have a much higher chance of posting in the forums and talk/complain about it in chat. Anecdotal evidence isn’t exactly valid. Of the people I ran with, 3 got full rewards and 2 (including myself) did not.

So 2 out of 5. That’s 40%. Almost half the game’s population.

Tora.8610:

…. Rare case?
More like happening with every other person I’ve talked to..

Every other person. That’s half.

What was your point again?

Krazed.7458:

Dace.3985:

The answer is right in the post you quoted. It’s a bug.

And it is just a few players. The people who get affected are much more vocal and have a much higher chance of posting in the forums and talk/complain about it in chat. Anecdotal evidence isn’t exactly valid. Of the people I ran with, 3 got full rewards and 2 (including myself) did not.

So 2 out of 5. That’s 40%. Almost half the game’s population.

Tora.8610:

…. Rare case?
More like happening with every other person I’ve talked to..

Every other person. That’s half.

What was your point again?

I’ve done 4 dungeon runs, so in total 20 separate rewards, 19 of them were correct.

ref.8196:

I’ve done 4 dungeon runs, so in total 20 separate rewards, 19 of them were correct.

I’m happy for you. Your experience is not shared by almost half the player base. That’s a major issue.

Yesterday I ran Honor of the Wave dungeon since patch
path 3, 45 tokens
path 1, 20 tokens
path 1 again, 5 tokens.

This afternoon (approximately 12 hour since last run)
Path 1, 15 tokens
path 3, 10 tokens

I don’t know what is going on with the “buffed” reward, but this is just dumb. I will not hold you account in comparison to my teammates who all got 60, but I WILL hold you account in comparison what I’m suppose to get pre-patch.

Pre-patch I should have a minimum of
Yesterday
path 3, 30 tokens
path 1, 30 tokens
path 1 again, 20 tokens.

Afternoon (approximately 12 hour since last run)
Path 1, 20 tokens
path 3, 20 tokens

That’s 100 tokens I should have had, now I only have 85. Not only that I can not even run it anymore since I know I’ll probably get 5 or 2 tokens. Since you said you can identify the players who you royally screw over with this patch, how about some compensation? I for one want the 15 tokens stolen from me so I never have to run your stupid dungeon ever again and you can do whatever you want with the “rewards”.

Krazed.7458:

ref.8196:

I’ve done 4 dungeon runs, so in total 20 separate rewards, 19 of them were correct.

I’m happy for you. Your experience is not shared by almost half the player base. That’s a major issue.

You would be crazy to make such statistics from such an extremely small sample space, especially since 2 million copies were sold.

Why does the edit button keep disappearing?

I forgot to add to the above that I did the howling king path yesterday and got 60 (may have been 45, irrelevant anyway since I’m not talking about the bug) and I did it again today without doing any other path, and got 20.

Is this correct? We definitely get penalised doing the same path back to back in 1 day, but I wasn’t sure if the day did not matter if you did not do any other path in between.

My dungeon experience last night:

(1) Sit in Lion’s Arch saying in /map, “Level 80 LFG for any dungeon”

(2) Get a group for Sorrow’s Embrace

(3) We can’t get everyone into the same instance after several tries of logging out, remaking group, etc.

(4) Group disbands

(5) I return to Lion’s Arch, saying in /map, “Level 80 LFG for any dungeon”

(6) I get a group for Arah Exploration

(7) I spend over 2 hours in Arah Exploration in quite a good run and everyone is being polite, etc. and we get to near the end of Arah

(8) I get kicked so that a guildie of the other 4 people in the group (all in the same guild) can join in and get tokens

(9) All I see now is the loading screen as I’m immediately dropped out of Arah back into Cursed Shore

(10) My chat logs no longer show any /party chat, not even anything I had typed in /party … though it does show the various garbage said by the NPCs in Arah … so can’t even make a post with the exact names of the people and guild that screwed me over so that others can at least be warned that these guys will screw them over.

(11) I log off because I’m quite angry at ArenaNet for what I, as a programmer myself (in an actual professional capacity) see as a rushed hack job to fixed what was a “pseudo-exploit” as it wasn’t really an exploit but rather people gaining tokens too quickly, too easily in the eyes of ArenaNet (which I’m fine with … just don’t punish the rest of us with a hacked together fix)

I’m still sticking with the game because ultimately I do enjoy it and this was just one instance.

However, due to this experience, now the idea of doing any dungeon with any group that isn’t dominated by my own guildies/friends is just a non-option in my mind as I could have this same experience again. Heck, really any group that isn’t full of guildies/friends is a risk because any random player we pick up could ultimately leave whenever they want … putting us in a bad place where we are likely to get 0 tokens since we may then be unable to complete the dungeon.

This reduces the social aspect of the game … I will more than likely not be exposed to other people running dungeons now because I don’t want to risk wasting my time again and being simply angry at the game once I get screwed over by people being “bad” and the game catering to them being “bad”.

Did I deserve to get some tokens for the large number of bosses I helped take down in Arah exploration mode in a path I’d never done before? Heck yes. I did my part throughout the dungeon and had never done that path in Arah before so should have received the tokens without any diminishing returns … but I received zero tokens

Did those 4 guys’ guildie that they replaced me with deserve the tokens for path completion? Heck no. Most of the dungeon had been completed already. He/she should have received tokens in proportion to the number/difficulty of bosses defeated once he/she was in the group … but he/she received the full number of tokens for “completing” the dungeon path

I think out of “half that player base” some people are mentioning, at least half of those whining can be dismissed due to lack of understanding of when the game day resets. The game day is 12:00 AM GMT to 11:59 PM GMT, not catered to everyone’s individual time zones.

Sebrent.3625:

My dungeon experience last night:

(1) Sit in Lion’s Arch saying in /map, “Level 80 LFG for any dungeon”
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~number/difficulty of bosses defeated once he/she was in the group … but he/she received the full number of tokens for “completing” the dungeon path*

They could just make it so you can’t kick people in dungeons unless they are offline.

ref.8196:

Sebrent.3625:

My dungeon experience last night:

(1) Sit in Lion’s Arch saying in /map, “Level 80 LFG for any dungeon”
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~number/difficulty of bosses defeated once he/she was in the group … but he/she received the full number of tokens for “completing” the dungeon path*

They could just make it so you can’t kick people in dungeons unless they are offline.

And then people would troll groups. Some people deserved to be kicked from a party.

getting 5 tokens lOL

2nd run after like 4 hours

so how does this anti farming coding works ?

ref.8196:

Sebrent.3625:

My dungeon experience last night:

(1) Sit in Lion’s Arch saying in /map, “Level 80 LFG for any dungeon”
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~number/difficulty of bosses defeated once he/she was in the group … but he/she received the full number of tokens for “completing” the dungeon path*

They could just make it so you can’t kick people in dungeons unless they are offline.

In which case people wouldn’t run dungeons with randoms for another reason. Sometimes you do get stuck with the immature person who seems to think he is all that and doesn’t need to help or follow simple instructions.

Cyn.5036:

getting 5 tokens lOL

2nd run after like 4 hours

so how does this anti farming coding works ?

It doesn’t.

ref.8196:

Sebrent.3625:

My dungeon experience last night:

(1) Sit in Lion’s Arch saying in /map, “Level 80 LFG for any dungeon”
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~number/difficulty of bosses defeated once he/she was in the group … but he/she received the full number of tokens for “completing” the dungeon path*

They could just make it so you can’t kick people in dungeons unless they are offline.

for reference, I was kicked in Arah and the same thing happened to me, I just posted about it a couple scrolls up.

Kicks need to be there for people who are not helping, AFK, or doing stupid things. Its a must, but just as I am, I’m sure he is more disappointed he got no tokens for leading up to that more than mad for getting kicked in general. I am not doing a dungeon again until they put tokens back in, if they don’t, so be it.

dardor.9508:

ref.8196:

Sebrent.3625:

My dungeon experience last night:

(1) Sit in Lion’s Arch saying in /map, “Level 80 LFG for any dungeon”
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~number/difficulty of bosses defeated once he/she was in the group … but he/she received the full number of tokens for “completing” the dungeon path*

They could just make it so you can’t kick people in dungeons unless they are offline.

In which case people wouldn’t run dungeons with randoms for another reason. Sometimes you do get stuck with the immature person who seems to think he is all that and doesn’t need to help or follow simple instructions.

well….that’s life! A-net can’t protect us from everything!

it’s hard to find a balance with all this though, as I see it, A-net want dungeons to be:

- Not easily farm-able
- Fun
- Challenging
- An incentive to complete the whole thing

actually scratch that

the idea earlier was the best, which rickets.1386: posted, putting DR on individual bosses. I can’t find any faults with this, can you?

The issue is that you can do 99% of a dungeon (only need to kill that last boss right in front of you) and then one of the following results in you getting 0 tokens:

1. You get kicked so that the group can replace you with their guildie/friend
2. You get disconnected for a minute (or longer if the login servers are acting up again) and then replaced
3. Someone quits, afks, etc. and the group isn’t good enough to do it with less than 5 people and can’t find a replacement before others have to log … or it simply cascades into everyone just being tired and saying “screw it”.
4. The boss bugs and you can’t kill them
5. The dungeon starter disconnects, is kicked, leaves, etc. so the dungeon closes on all of you.
6. Some technical issue (server crash, reboot for critical patch, etc.) kicks you out of the dungeon
7. Something in real-life makes you have to stop playing (some of us have wives/husbands/kids/responsibilities)

That’s just off the top of my head.

The point is … life happens. You will not always have time to do a full run and sometimes even when you do, life happens and you suddenly don’t or that time you did finally have gets wasted. These things can be aggravating but now they are infuriating because when they happen the past hour or two of our time is now completely wasted because it’s an “all-or-nothing” type system.

ref.8196:

Krazed.7458:

ref.8196:

I’ve done 4 dungeon runs, so in total 20 separate rewards, 19 of them were correct.

I’m happy for you. Your experience is not shared by almost half the player base. That’s a major issue.

You would be crazy to make such statistics from such an extremely small sample space, especially since 2 million copies were sold.

And how is that any different from you assuming the opposite?

Sure there’s a degree of error, but you work with the data you have.

Of the two runs I mentioned before, only 1 of the people in each of the runs got the proper reward.

The every other person was a rough estimate of the people I talked to after that, in voice chat and in game. No, its not a random call in map chat or reading on forums.

Take that however you will, since this is the internet and we all pull stats out of our behinds anyway. I’d love to see an actual poll for this, but short of having it in game right after dungeon runs I doubt it’d be too accurate anyway.

The icing on the cake though is this comment…

All rewards are susceptible to our code that is dealing with people who are speed clearing dungeons. This means that if you are speed clearing and then play some new chain for the first time it may not reward the full 60 tokens. If you find yourself getting less rewards consider whether or not your rate of dungeon completion is extremely high.

Rate of dungeon completion is extremely high.. what the heck is that supposed to mean when NO ONE WOULD TELL US WHAT’S HIGH OR NOT? Oh, we’re supposedly to just magically know the exactly times it should take us to do every dungeon? Or maybe we should all just take a 1-hour break after every boss just to be sure… and I don’t see we can’t just be told this magical number for the dungeons anyway.

Since
1. Its not being farmed by bots, so the argument that botters would find a way around it is moot
2. Its supposedly the “magic” length of time deemed “appropriate” for the dungeon, so if “speed runners” slow themselves to this time, they wouldn’t be “speed running” anymore by definition…

Anyway…. I must say they chose a very good time to mess around with the player base.. with the recent release of a few other games which I won’t mention just around now….

@ Tora, it was just a counter example, just showing how different such small sample spaces can be, the amount of people it affects is irrelevant though, we know its big enough to be a big problem, but it annoys me when people start throwing around random numbers

JonPeters.5630:

I just wanted to update everyone on where we stand with this. So far we have found a single bug with the system that is causing certain players to get stuck in a state of reduced rewards without actually exploiting. A fix for this has already been made and is being tested locally now. We are going to do more significant testing on this new version but we also believe it is more bulletproof to begin with. Please keep posting data as these cases are somewhat rare and are hard for us to find with internal testing but seem to be exposed quickly when thousands of people are playing the dungeons.

All rewards are susceptible to our code that is dealing with people who are speed clearing dungeons. This means that if you are speed clearing and then play some new chain for the first time it may not reward the full 60 tokens. If you find yourself getting less rewards consider whether or not your rate of dungeon completion is extremely high.

If you think you are running at a fairly reasonable pace post all of the chains you have run and the time of day they were completed and we will file it to try and figure out if it is a bug. Please post accurate times, otherwise we cannot determine if there are in fact bugs in the system. Please continue to use this thread as a place to post this data so that we have it all in one location.

Thanks,

Jon

Jon, can you tell us how fast do that mean? Is 1 hour per dungeon considered fast?

Tora.8610:

Rate of dungeon completion is extremely high.. what the heck is that supposed to mean when NO ONE WOULD TELL US WHAT’S HIGH OR NOT? Oh, we’re supposedly to just magically know the exactly times it should take us to do every dungeon?

It was said in the earlier patch. Less than 30 minutes per run. Meaning if you do more than 2 per hour you’ll get hit with anti-farming code.

Did some more runs today.

AC path 1, 15 tokens, finished at 11:20 AM server time
AC path 2, 15 tokens, finished at 12:00 noon server time
AC path 3, 6 token, finished at 12:45 PM server time

Missing 144 tokens and 64 silver despite all runs being more than 30 minutes apart and not having run any dungeons in 24+ hours.

1 other person in my party was also affected by this glitch.

3 other people in my party got 60 tokens for each of these runs meaning it’s not related to clearing dungeons too fast, it’s just a bug.

I did Ascalonian catacombs yesterday at morning. Today afternoon, i do it again got 45 tokens 2rd path, did it again 3rd path got 10 tokens, did it again 1 path 15 tokens. My teammates got between 30 and 60, so it isn’t diminishing returns, we were all the same group for the 3 runs.

I have been in a permanent state of diminishing returns since the start of the system. Doesn’t matter how long and if it is my first time that i do the dungeon, i always get shafted rewards. Did Crucible yesterday, been like 1 week that i haven’t done, and only got 30 tokens.

Jon, please can i take part of the local testing? I’m beginning to think this is something specific to my account. I have plenty of time, so i can test how many times you want.

I’m not trying to be disrespectful here but… this new “anti-farming” system a terrible knee jerk response to an issue and negatively impacts far too many normal, legit players who are trying to simply play the game normally and frankly it really bothers me that ArenaNet seems to be okay with this.

Also if you want to encourage players to participate in different dungeons and not just run a couple try looking the dungeons themselves. Some of these are so horribly tuned and broken that simply stepping foot on many of the paths through them is an exercise in frustration so it’s obvious that many players gravitate to the “least painful” dungeons/paths. So if I was ANet I would take a really good look at why so many paths are outright abandoned and address those before you try to bludgeon players into running different instances avoid a system that penalizes far too many players for doing nothing wrong.

Oh and ANet, remember when you mentioned that you wanted to didn’t want to force players to commit portions of their lives to achieving “end game” content? Well I fear you may have achieved that but not for the reasons you wished, many players simply don’t run far too many paths in far too many dungeons rather than even trying to commit their time to a dungeon that has so many issues that it’s almost impossible to finish.

Yesterday I experienced problem with the reward system right after the update, so I decided to wait at least 24 hours for my first dungeon for the day, just to be on the safe side.

Ran Twilight Arbor [after 24 hrs of not doing any dungeons, should be first run & path of the day]
Took the “up” path, shouldn’t be considered “speed clearing” as the run took almost an hour to finish due to new players for the instance.

As you can see on the screenie…45 tokens//19 silver//experience.
I actually haven’t received 26S from any of my “first run/first path” for dungeons in a few days.

I maybe run TA 3 times a day, maybe the same path twice, but I don’t do the runs back to back and they are definitely not super fast runs.

Also, it would be awesome if the seals post 9/25 patch would stack with the pre patch ones

Punishing skilled people for clearing dungeon fast? What the kitten are you thinking Arena Net?
“This game is for casuals and only casuals, so hardcore players will be punished” – right? I cannot see other explanation.

Did CoF exp mag path twice yesterday. First run I’ve ever done, I only got 35 tokens. Second run with a different group that took much longer to clear I only got 5 tokens.

Sadly I’ve been robbed of a good chunk of tokens like everyone else…and the content was new to me.

Cisza.9540:

Punishing skilled people for clearing dungeon fast? What the kitten are you thinking Arena Net?
“This game is for casuals and only casuals, so hardcore players will be punished” – right? I cannot see other explanation.

Lol, actually it punishes both hardcores and casuals.

Hardcores are getting punished for clearing dungeons too quickly.

Casuals are getting punished for any of the many number of reasons they may clear up to 99% of a dungeon but get 0 tokens because they didn’t complete 100% during the limited amount of time they had to play.

It truly is a knee jerk reaction to people farming the first few bosses for tokens and it resulted in a hack job of a patch that, assuming it was even working correctly, punishes people as stated above. It doesn’t even work correctly though so we not only have a crap scenario created by this hack job but also those who are getting tokens are being by bugs in the hack job.

So, I’m now supposed to play with a watch in hand, checking my time, and if somehow its too fast just /dance before entering the final boss room? No offence, but this is plain stupid. I understand DR for people that do the same path in a dungeon twice (or more) per day, to get tokens, but why are we beong punished for being organized and good at what we do inside? In my opinion there should be absolutely NO DR for EACH PATH that is being done for the FIRST TIME in a day, and the timer should reset just as the daily achievements do. And I believe that is what devs intended to do (according to the latest patch notes). Unfortunately, it doesnt work as it should – and I can only hope for a fix soon…

All rewards are susceptible to our code that is dealing with people who are speed clearing dungeons. This means that if you are speed clearing and then play some new chain for the first time it may not reward the full 60 tokens. If you find yourself getting less rewards consider whether or not your rate of dungeon completion is extremely high.

@Tom Stone
From what I’ve understand – DR for speed clearing also applies for clearing the path first time. And I agree- it’s plain stupid.

Jon,
I’m currently experiencing the permanent diminishing returns bug, but I had a few questions about the system for when it gets fixed

Do the diminishing returns apply to each individual dungeon, or is it all dungeons?

Same question in more detail –
If I do my 3 runs of Catacombs,
Can I do my 3 runs of Twilight Arbor without seeing side effects from running Catacombs?

Last question,
Will running Story Mode effect my Explorer rewards later on?

Thanks ahead of time~

Haven’t run a dungeon since the patch on the 17th of September

Today I did my very first TA exp run, upon completion my whole group got 60 tokens and I got 15. Run took us about 45 to 50 mins.

So scammed out of 45 tokens by a broken system.

We did CoF and SE and . In CoF I got 60 – 2nd route and 30 – 3rd route (first time of the day ) , while my friend got 15 / 2 / 6 – 2nd route (happened when we did it 3 times in a row ) and 6 again when we did 2nd route (which is very frustrating) . Then in SE I got 60 – 3rd route and 45 – 2nd route (again first time of the day ) .

After the September 24th patch, I went to do AC, but the party got bugged out and was unable to get into the same instance. I tried again later in the day. I hadn’t done any dungeons except for that first failed attempt that day. The first path rewarded me with 45 tokens. The second path rewarded me with 30. The third 15. I then redid one of the three paths and got 5.

I do one or two runs a day. Usually they take 30-45 minutes minimum. Today I got 5 tokens for my first run in TA, yesterday I got 15. I is sad.

I just finished CM explorable first run of the day and got 15 tokens, one party member got 30 and another one got 60. Hope they fix this soon.

Just finished Twilight explorable (between 15:20-15:30 server time or so), first time doing it again in quite a few days (only done once before), not done any other dungeons for the last two or three days. This was the “up” path, took about an hour.

Everyone in my party got 60 tokens except me, I got 30. This included 2 players who hadn’t done it before on that character (or at all), and a player who has run it before same as me (we were in the same run the first time). As a person who really rather loves the twilight armor set, this is a slight setback. I am hoping you guys can fix the problem soon for everyone and thank you for the hard work you’re all putting in

2 hours ago I’ve done Twilight Arbor, first and first choice, only 30 token again and all others 60. First time of TA, like yesterday with AC.

Copy paste from ingame bug report:
“Yesterday – Twillight Arbor – Up path- received 30 tokens upon completing, no speed run, no exploits or anything. Was supposed to be 60.
Today- Twillight Arbor- Down Up path – 45 tokens, no speed run, or exploit, rest of group all received 60. was supposed to be 60for me too.
Later today – Twillight Arbor – Up Path – 30 tokens, again the rest (3 of the same group as earlier today) got 60, I was supposed to get 60.
Later today -Flame Citadel – (done for the first time in 3 days) 15!! tokens, rest of group got between 45 and 60.
Seriously messed up!”

All rewards are susceptible to our code that is dealing with people who are speed clearing dungeons. This means that if you are speed clearing and then play some new chain for the first time it may not reward the full 60 tokens. If you find yourself getting less rewards consider whether or not your rate of dungeon completion is extremely high.
@Tom Stone
From what I’ve understand – DR for speed clearing also applies for clearing the path first time. And I agree- it’s plain stupid.

They just need to scrap the DR system, it’s a terrible mechanic that should only be used in cash-grab F2P games to get people to fork over cash to overcome it.

This is literally the first game I’ve played that goes out of it’s way to hurt people for being good at the game, the ironic part is that it doesn’t even work properly so it hurts casual players too.

TA paths 1 and 2
my reward for path 1 -5 everyone else 60
my reward for path 2 -10 everyone else 60
Completed them about a day ago

Thanks Robert…. I have been playing under the assumption that Anet couldn’t possibly punish players for completing dungeons (notice the plural) quickly.

You just confirmed you aren’t the company you represented prelaunch nor is this game represented in the Video Manifesto.

Thanks also for making some room on my hard drive. Enjoy the 60 bucks.

Today i was on TA and that was first runs in that day.

Path1: 60 tokens
Path2: 45 tokens
Path3: 30 tokens

As I said in a post in another thread, I did the ghost-eater chain of AC explorable mode for the FIRST TIME EVER today. This has been only my second explorable dungeon run EVER done, with the first one done with friends last week.

Both of my friends in the run got 60 badges, I only got 15.

Q: In regards to speed clears I am still very confused. So we will get hit with the DR if we run the same dungeon multiple times in 10 minutes, or we will get hit with DR if we run any combination of dungeons multiple times in 10 minutes? If it is the latter I still have a huge problem with that system. So we won’t be hurt for being good at dungeons, just hurt for being consistently good at them? I enjoy running dungeons. I have hit level 80 and it is what I choose to do to enjoy myself in the game now. That would be like telling me I can’t play the part of the game I want. How long do we have to wait til the DR fall off and we can get full rewards again? If this is the planned way the system is going to go there should be some sort of it applied to all the “end game” aspects of the game (which I do not suggest at all) so you aren’t just penalizing people who like to run dungeons, but the people who WvW all the time, or the people who zerg Arah all the time. Its unfair that I can’t play the part of the game that I enjoy because it is a borderline waste of time. And is it really 10 minutes to count as a speed run? Because I am pretty sure I have never run a dungeon in less than a half an hour and I have been having ridiculous issues with the DR since the patch. More clarity on how this works would be nice – I get that you don’t want to tell us because people will try too find ways to work around the system, but right now it is just confusing and frustrating. At least give me a DR debuff so I know when it’s safe to play again.

More gathered data, better reward than my other recent dungeon rewards have been:

Group of 5 ran TA Forward, Up path
5:46 – 6:30, 44minutes to completion
I have never ran this path before ever, and haven’t ran any other dungeons since yesterday. We skipped only one trash mob of like 2 npcs I believe.
My reward: 45 tokens, every other group member recieved 60 and had never even heard of the DR bug which plights me – apparently the system is working perfectly for some people. One of whom I run dungeons with very frequently so they should have the same “speed clearing” profile I do.