Guild Wars 2

If someone want a complete armor set + one weapon, it needs ~1500 token, and with 30 token for a single run we have to do 50 run. I’m not talking about difficulty, it’s great and very challenging, but it’s not rewarding. Arenanet changed the mentality of the dungeon, time ago they said one run = one piece of armor. What is the reason?

“As far as the mechanics of the drop system is concerned, Flannum says “It’s more of a badge system, so this is something that we did in Guild Wars 1 as well. Our basic philosophy is that you should never complete a piece of content and get something you don’t want. So it’s going to be the case where you go through and are guaranteed to get a piece of gear that you didn’t have before, and that you’re going to want.” So, you’re guaranteed to get a piece of gear every time you do a dungeon? “Yes.” Sweet. More specifically, we were told that weapons will come from story mode (one run = one weapon) and the rest of your armor will be earned from explorable mode.”
source:

PCGamer 2010 http://www.pcgamer.com/previews/guild-wars-2-the-kitchen-sink-post/2/

I’m a casual player and I can play only 2-3 hours a day, in this way I have to do only dungeon for two months to get only a single set of armor + weapon.. I hope for some changes, if not I will accept it and move on, I know there are different way to get an exotic armor, but I’d like to know why have you changed your initial idea..

Except this, I love the dungeons, their design and their difficulty! Thanks again for making such a beautiful game..

I’m wondering the same thing. I’m doing citadel of the flame over and over again grinding it. There is no joy and the reward value is spread out to far. It seems to go against everything they had promised in terms of dungeons.

PS the difficulty is awesome.

I agree that the you aren’t rewarded enough tokens and I might complain but working for your things is not a bad thing. I understand you don’t have much time to invest in a game and ArenaNet tried to make this game more for people like you. I just think they should at least make the token system global across all dungeons so it provides variety and make the farm feel less of a farm. This is my solution, I know lower the amount of tokens needed is also good, I just think it might make it too easy to get for such wonderful looking gear.

i agree the duyngeon gear is very very grindy it feels like chore cuz they are epicly to hard and massively buged on so,me places

I HATE they changed the lower level armors to a common crappy looking skin that is the same for every dungeon. I understand making the tough to get elite armor, but the easier to obtain armor should also have a unique looking skin in my opinion. Much like the kurzick/luxon had the 1.5k armor and the 15k armor.

Please A.NET, reconsider how you have dungeon armor and give the lower cost armor a unique skin also even if it’s not as flashy! Otherwise I don’t really see the point of of having the lower armor in there at all… it’s not for the skin and the stats will be outgrown within days…

Summary:

Make dungeon armor look unique and have two different sets much like luxon/kurzick 1.5k armor and 15k armor. As it stands right now there is no reason for me, and many others, to do any dungeons since I would never farm the amount of tokens required for the unique look. Thanks!

Never heard that they’re changing dungeon tokens. Actually my wife was happy that she wouldn’t have to grind dungeons and could just get her set after few runs. Care to inform her in a delicate way that it’s no longer the case dear A-Net? I’d prefer not to do it myself :P

I think is good when it take sometime to get that precious gear,the main problem I see is that Anet is asking TOO much time. They don’t need a sub fee, so why oh why make people grind like that? They need to increase the number of tokens per run,and they need to do it now before the hardcore players get the gear and then come complain that now they made it easier.

I think everybody agrees that you need to much tokens for the armor. I’d also insist on making 1 sort of token instead of a different one for every dungeon. and also account bound instead of soul.

yeah 2 of my guildies are planning on just stopping playing and just logging on every now and again untill something improves, “we dont want players to grind in this game” so lets only give people 20 tokens (after doing it the first time) for a 1-2 hour run of a dungeon (excluding CoF) and charge 400 tokens for a single weapon and then give them alot of useless gear from the chests which will become salvage trash

shinyglove.9703:

I think everybody agrees that you need to much tokens for the armor. I’d also insist on making 1 sort of token instead of a different one for every dungeon. and also account bound instead of soul.

i agree with this except the account bound statement, and possibly using the same tokens across dungeons, the gear is suppose to be “hey look what content i have completed” means much less when you can farm what ever turns out to be the easiest explorable for it (CoF at the time but i dont see it staying the way it is). and being able to gear up all your alts just by playing one character is something they’ve never wanted.

The Dungeons need balanced ASAP. The trash mobs have WAY too much health. I can literally fall asleep while killing them.

The rewards aren’t balance and nobody is going to run them that many times with the current state of difficulty.

The problem to me really isn’t that it takes awhile to farm the tokens but rather the tokens are not universal for all the armour. There are 8 dungeons yet you are forced to farm one over and over for the set you want which pretty much makes the rest of the dungeons useless because it’s pointless if you don’t get the tokens you actually need. I think the best thing Anet could do at the moment is just use one universal token for all sets.

That way you can do one of the eight dungeons without making it feel so monotonous and boring. Most people farm CoF over and over, I really don’t know how they do it.

Didn’t see shinygloves post, i basically agree with him.

If they must stick to the ridicously high costs they are now for cosmetics, then I would like to see a chance of a ‘random token’ dropping every so often. This could then be either worth so many more tokens or allow you to trade for one piece from the vendor.

You could also make it so that trash mobs also have a chance to drop regular tokens at the same time too.

Another idea is that you could also gain a piece of armour for completing explorable mode the first time, the same as how story mode works.

EDIT : Also going to add that dungeon leveling gear is pretty much useless and not worth it currently. That needs fixing asap.

Whitewolf.9736:

If they must stick to the ridicously high costs they are now for cosmetics, then I would like to see a chance of a ‘random token’ dropping every so often. This could then be either worth so many more tokens or allow you to trade for one piece from the vendor.

You could also make it so that trash mobs also have a chance to drop regular tokens at the same time too.

Another idea is that you could also gain a piece of armour for completing explorable mode the first time, the same as how story mode works.

That would be nice instead of that dumb looking and bad stat wise hat….

I found it pretty curious that the highest gear the vendors for the first two dungeons offer is for 60-70. Who was thinking that a person would really buy those things while leveling? They are just useless, which makes the dungeons pretty useless.

The skins, especially for medium armor, are not that great to justify 50+ runs, especially
when there are 50+ runs more to do to get an amor that has the stats for transmutation.

Billiam.7961:

shinyglove.9703:

I think everybody agrees that you need to much tokens for the armor. I’d also insist on making 1 sort of token instead of a different one for every dungeon. and also account bound instead of soul.

i agree with this except the account bound statement, and possibly using the same tokens across dungeons, the gear is suppose to be “hey look what content i have completed” means much less when you can farm what ever turns out to be the easiest explorable for it (CoF at the time but i dont see it staying the way it is). and being able to gear up all your alts just by playing one character is something they’ve never wanted.

valid point about the account binding of tokens. But i do think however everyone should have the choise to get the armor the way he wants and not by repeating the same dungeon 50 times. They promised to have a non grind philosophy after all :P

I would have no problem with getting the lower set if it looked different. Right now it’s a common drop skin. Originally the lower cost armor had the same look as the higher cost armor but then they changed which was the biggest disappointment in all of guild wars 2 for me. Lower cost armor needs a unique skill also or it needs to be removed completely. There is no point to spend tokens on it right now…

Dungeon gear is supposed to be the “endgame”. If you see someone in full Nightmare gear, they deserved it. I like it. There are cool gears you can get from open world pve, so not really necessary to do dungeons if you don’t like hardcore content.

shinyglove.9703:

Billiam.7961:

shinyglove.9703:

I think everybody agrees that you need to much tokens for the armor. I’d also insist on making 1 sort of token instead of a different one for every dungeon. and also account bound instead of soul.

i agree with this except the account bound statement, and possibly using the same tokens across dungeons, the gear is suppose to be “hey look what content i have completed” means much less when you can farm what ever turns out to be the easiest explorable for it (CoF at the time but i dont see it staying the way it is). and being able to gear up all your alts just by playing one character is something they’ve never wanted.

valid point about the account binding of tokens. But i do think however everyone should have the choise to get the armor the way he wants and not by repeating the same dungeon 50 times. They promised to have a non grind philosophy after all :P

this is why we should be able to get atleast a piece of gear every 1-3 runs (depending on if it’s you’re first time running through and the cost of the piece) not 10 runs for a single piece of gear
This way it atleast shows you’ve played through that explorable content to earn that gear rather then farmed the easiest one possible like CoF

Zoid.2568:

Dungeon gear is supposed to be the “endgame”. If you see someone in full Nightmare gear, they deserved it. I like it. There are cool gears you can get from open world pve, so not really necessary to do dungeons if you don’t like hardcore content.

hardcore content is suppose to be because it is challenging to do not because you have to run it 50 times to get anywhere

There was suppose to be an easy to get “max stat” gear and then you do the hard content for the more eye catching gear or had to do more for it like in GW1

The main reason I’m not doing exlporables right now is simply because of how much you have to grind, yes grind, to get even one piece of gear.

I dont mind working for something, but doing it that much is just a plain grind.

Zoid.2568:

Dungeon gear is supposed to be the “endgame”. If you see someone in full Nightmare gear, they deserved it. I like it. There are cool gears you can get from open world pve, so not really necessary to do dungeons if you don’t like hardcore content.

So you are saying that “hardcore” is the person who does nothing in his life but run dungeons over and over? Is it fair to to someone that don’t have too much time realize that will take months to get one set of gear? I like the so called hardcore content but sadly don’t have all the time in the world to play. All I’m asking is that they make it more fair.

Some people dont see the difference between “hardcore” and “time consuming” the only part of hardcore content that should make it take long is dying alot due to not having the practice/skill for it, not have relatively doable content that you just have to repeat over and over

I know that it may seem like a long grind that might be a bit excessive, but it makes the skins from the dungeons feel a lot more prestigious. its not like you have to grind all the pieces you want in one weekend(nor could you). also, you dont need the skins at all to enjoy the game.

So I was looking all the token gear and noticed they all looked the same. On top of that, I play a ranger. Take a look at the medium armor set (besides it looking dumb) it is not even close to what a ranger would wear…. Since gear is only based on looks (which i think is kinda dumb to begin with) shouldn’t the gear at least look good?

I see this as the biggest problem.
For one thing, you do not get dungeon tokens from story mode. Why? This would be an excellent way to introduce the system to people.
The only reason i know tokens exist is because i went to lions arch and saw the vendors.

The “end” reward for story mode is also weird. Sure it might suit some, but seriously? Why do i only get one choice of armor? Why am i “forced” into specific stats?
Why is all the armor so generic looking? When i finish a dungeon i want to get 1) Choice between atleast a couple of stats. 2) Choice between different looks that are not already looking the same as the one i have equipped! ( To be honest, you wear the same thing until about level 35 )

Explorable version:
I do not know about you, but i see no reason to grind to get armor just for the looks. Why does all dungeon reward armor look EXACTLY THE SAME! ( you know, unless the exotic version ). There is no difference at all in looks and ontop of that it’s the exact same look you get from any random vendor.

I get it, people SHOULD be proud about getting cool looking gear, and spending time to get it. But you can create “less” cool gear, but still different.

Chests:
The chests for each boss should contain loot that atleast are not crap… I mostly get white loot from the chests.

Billiam.7961:

Zoid.2568:

Dungeon gear is supposed to be the “endgame”. If you see someone in full Nightmare gear, they deserved it. I like it. There are cool gears you can get from open world pve, so not really necessary to do dungeons if you don’t like hardcore content.

hardcore content is suppose to be because it is challenging to do not because you have to run it 50 times to get anywhere

There was suppose to be an easy to get “max stat” gear and then you do the hard content for the more eye catching gear or had to do more for it like in GW1

Well, then they need to make the explorable dungeons nearly impossible to complete. I mean really really difficult. Else everyone will be running around in Dungeon Exotic gear.

It’s either

Hardcore difficulty explorable dungeons (Nearly impossible) – Reward: 1 armour piece every run.

Hard difficulty explorable dungeons (Depending on your group, it will be possible to clear it fast) – Reward: Coins you can spend on armour. More runs needed.

If ArenaNet want to stay true to their “no grind” philosophy, they will go with extremely tough dungeons in explorable. Right now, they did not give what was promised.

dungeons are to hard whit no healing and kiting and melee clases are just pure stupidity u cant melee man its just godkittenHARD and on top of that u need milions milions of tokens to do anything

I think the issue is this:

I, and I think many people, would be willing to do a few runs (3) for a piece of armor like a helm, or gloves. I might even do 6 for that awesome chest piece/2h weapon. But I’m not going to do 13 runs for one chest piece, 16 runs for a 2h, and about half of that for each other item.

Just hoping Arenanet will consider removing the -10 token penalty..

feeling particularly sore after farming for my ascalonian shield and seeing it not glow at night.. is just one big

YXRomeo.9438:

Just hoping Arenanet will consider removing the -10 token penalty..

feeling particularly sore after farming for my ascalonian shield and seeing it not glow at night.. is just one big

It glows, just has to be at a certain time at night. Also it seems to only work at night for your actual server. Haven’t gotten it to glow on overflows =(.

On one hand, I think the rewards are too low and dungeons are super super grindy.

On the other hand.. it kind of gives me something to work for. lol

One thing I do think they should do though, is remove the non-exotic armor from the dungeon reward merchants in LA, they’re pretty darn pointless if you ask me.

I am just now closing in on the level 80 cap and have not done a single dungeon since the first one in story. The yard trash was amazingly tough to take down and the time involved was substancial. I hear some of the 80 dungeon runs can last 5 hours (from a guild group not a PUG)? Are you serious? If 5 hours is not a grind.. I don’t know what is!

How long are the 80 dungeon runs taking for you folks?

ArenaNet, please just make one global token currency for all the dungeons, that atleast should ease the grind for armors.

Ballamore.8092:

ArenaNet, please just make one global token currency for all the dungeons, that atleast should ease the grind for armors.

The problem with this method is that if you add one currency then people will find the quickest dungeon to run and constantly do that leaving all of the others pretty much unplayed which I’d imagine is something they don’t want to do.

I’m all for challenge but if you hardly get anything for that challenge … why do it? That’s just not fun at all.

Whitewolf.9736:

Ballamore.8092:

ArenaNet, please just make one global token currency for all the dungeons, that atleast should ease the grind for armors.

The problem with this method is that if you add one currency then people will find the quickest dungeon to run and constantly do that leaving all of the others pretty much unplayed which I’d imagine is something they don’t want to do.

I disagree. I think people who regularly group together, like a guild, will put a value on doing fresher content. Some people will only do the msot efficient, true, but most of us would rather spend an extra 10-20% time on something for fresher content. The thing I really want a universal system for is to incentivize me to do content that I would never otherwise do. I only want the CoF armor, so I’m going to be forced to run only CoF. SE, TA, and the rest of the dungeons will have no rewards for me except for the glyphs I want from one dungeon, and maybe a weapon from another. That’s 3 out of many.

Dungeons are too grindy for me too. I also found them really difficult, just a little bit more difficult than it should to be really enjoyable: not like facerolling the entire dungeon like it was in WoW WOTLK, but not even in it’s state(it’s all IMHO). Dungeons for me, shouldnt have a boss who 1shots you. There must be some way to prevent this..because you can’t always dodge or evade attacks. Also, ground AOEs are really fast and umpredictable: again, all imho, but they are too much difficult.

Also, i repeat, i would love a change to the tokens too to make PVE more enjoyable and less grindy.

Lol! When its easy they complaint when its hard they complaint so now what Anet supposed to do? Armor skin in dungeon a tje most prized thropy we can have and you guys want it to be easy so everybody can have them? I dont think so, i dont care if i do it 100 times and then eventually get my prize! Its a part of challenge and progression. Now you guys tell which mmo you can easily get prestige skins? And btw opening of the chest is a part of reward but it is also random LUCK…..

I agree with the majority of these posts, omitting the global tokens and nerfing the dungeons in general.

Considering myself relatively hardcore in game play being as i play frequently, right now I would say that halving the current token costs would be the best bet here. I enjoy the difficulty of the dungeons and i believe 20-30 tokens off a run feels about right, but I do not think it should take so many runs to get a single piece, it feels unrewarding. At least in my opinion I feel that every 3-4 runs you should have enough to purchase a piece of gear. This makes the gear more accessible to the entire population. The hardcore players might have the full sets in a week while the casuals would take a month or so to acquire it all. Unfortunately that’s the way the cookie crumbles in that aspect.

Hardcore players will ALWAYS get the gear first, if that is an issue then you are SoL. They just have more time to devote to the game then you do.

What i think however, would be to shorten the time frame in which hardcore’s and casuals acquire the sets.

If prestige is for everybody then it loses its value….. These people complaint because they cant handle it. It takes group skills to do dungeon runs not some pugs running like headless chicken and to kill evrythng. Prestige=hard to get

WingLegacy.7159:

If prestige is for everybody then it loses its value….. These people complaint because they cant handle it. It takes group skills to do dungeon runs not some pugs running like headless chicken and to kill evrythng. Prestige=hard to get

Not true at all.. what we are saying is, the people who “can’t handle it” should still be given a more achieveable goal and a nice reward for doing the dungeons a few times.

If there was a special armor that was easier to obtain, that would make almost everyone happy.. those people don’t care about the “prestige” you talk about. We’re cool with everyone being able to get that with a lower grind.

WingLegacy.7159:

If prestige is for everybody then it loses its value….. These people complaint because they cant handle it. It takes group skills to do dungeon runs not some pugs running like headless chicken and to kill evrythng. Prestige=hard to get

Nobody is asking for it to be for everyone. They’re asking for it to not take a ridiculous amount of time to get, to the point where it stops becoming enjoyable.

It’s not even about the difficulty, it’s about the time. I can run TA explorable and nail it in an hour with PUGs. I’m not willing to run it 16 times for a single item. It’s not because I can’t handle it, it’s because the FUN is killed well below 16 times.

Alarox.4590:

WingLegacy.7159:

If prestige is for everybody then it loses its value….. These people complaint because they cant handle it. It takes group skills to do dungeon runs not some pugs running like headless chicken and to kill evrythng. Prestige=hard to get

Nobody is asking for it to be for everyone. They’re asking for it to not take a ridiculous amount of time to get, to the point where it stops becoming enjoyable.

It’s not even about the difficulty, it’s about the time. I can run TA explorable and nail it in an hour with PUGs. I’m not willing to run it 16 times for a single item. It’s not because I can’t handle it, it’s because the FUN is killed well below 16 times.

*
i hate those who says " OMG IT’S PRESTIGE " when we are clearly not talking about being able to be farm the whole set easily, we are just asking to roll back the old low-level-low-cost armor that was far from being easily farmed still.

Before it was worth 25 runs now 40+

Kinto.9485:

YXRomeo.9438:

Just hoping Arenanet will consider removing the -10 token penalty..

feeling particularly sore after farming for my ascalonian shield and seeing it not glow at night.. is just one big

It glows, just has to be at a certain time at night. Also it seems to only work at night for your actual server. Haven’t gotten it to glow on overflows =(.

isn’t it ridiculous that it should only glow at certain times at night? even the dungeon vendor has glowy weapons at all times of night.

as a lvl 80 i’m sure as heck not grinding the dungeon for a plain lvl 60 item

i hope someone who can do something about these issues comes to this thread

What I really don’t understand is:
There are 3 explorable modes per dungeon.

So why doesn’t it only take three runs to get a full set? That would make more sense to me.

So I’m not the only one ^^
My real problem isn’t the “farm” of token.. if Arenanet had said “the dungeons armor are difficult to get and need a lot of effort to get one because they are end-game items” I would have accepted.. But I only want to know what are the reasons that led to this change, when they have said they don’t want to force a player to grind..

Before, I would like to get 3 or 4 armour from dungeons (and some weapons too).. now, due to lack of time, I’ll hope to get at least one armor and only one weapon.. and I didn’t think the other characters..

Anyone think the Exotics from the dungeon token should have very slightly higher stats than the other 80 exotics!?

Saying that thought, some of the exclusive runes available from the dungeons sets are sweet. Unavailable in the TP or from loot dropped from mobs!

Myes. I first didn’t feel as though this would be a problem, seeing how I’ve been instancing and dungeoning in other games before, but after being hit with the realization of “50 runs = 1 set” I slowly began to change my mind. Sure – I won’t take the entire set of every armour, and with a good group and a lot of experience these runs, no matter how difficult and long at first, will be a breeze, but…

Why this timesink? Why the grind? I recall that one of the things ANet wanted to do was to eliminate the grind from the MMO – and here we go, a nice sweaty grind is eyeing me up as I reach for the soap, and let me tell you, it’s not a comfortable feeling.

If this is an artificial “gating” for the first month or so, to separate the truly “hardcore” from the rest of the players, then that’s fine – some people deserve their hour of glory, for the amount of time they’ve spent on earning the tokens, and various other contributions. However, if this is a pricing system that is here to stay, then I have to say that it’s simply mad – just like the pricing on all of the currently worthy armour and weapon sets in the game. Again, if this is an artificial and intentional gate that’s there for a month, that’s fine. If it’s a system intended to send the players into an endless grinding spree, it’s not. It’s not THAT huge a carrot to be dongled before the proverbial donkey, really, 50 runs for a full set will just kill an average person’s spirits before they’re even done gathering their first set.

A possible solution to the problems would be to keep the costs as they are and make the tokens global, but make it so that the dungeon specific vendor will only sell the armor to you if you have completed all the paths of that dungeon.
Then if you see a person in full Orrian armor for example, then you know that they have completed all of Arah.
This way you can do any dungeon you want to get your tokens and add a bit of variety rather than running one dungeon 50 times.