Guild Wars 2

I’ve come to a realisation recently: That is that, in my opinion, explorable dungeons are too easy once you reach level 80.

I remember, while leveling my main, that I really enjoyed CM explorable while level-appropriate. We wiped and we wiped, we had to adapt our strategies and we felt a real sense of accomplishment when we finally reached the end.

Now that I’m level 80, running explorable dungeons feels like a cakewalk. It’s a very depressing feeling that the game currently doesn’t offer any challenge within its hardest content once you’re level 80 and have exotic gear.

Suddenly, we run through two Citadel of Flames paths with no wipes. Suddenly we can plow through Honor of the Waves without ever having a challenge. This is not a good thing. It means that dungeons feel like nothing more than timesinks, since without a challenge all you have to do to earn tokens is spend time. This makes the dungeon gear’s status as ‘prestige gear’ completely meaningless.

I believe that ArenaNet should come up with something to help combat this. I’m not sure exactly what they can do to help make dungeons challenging for geared level 80s without making them impossible for poorly-geared lowbies, but I’m sure there is something they can do.

At it stands, dungeons are not fun for me. Not because they’re too hard, but because they’re too easy.

Does anyone have any thoughts on this? And I would, of course, appreciate having an ArenaNet developer (I’m looking at you, Robert) respond.

Just so that I can provide some more specific dungeon paths:

CoF paths one and two are ridiculously easy and offered practically no challenge to my PuG group. I would advise increasing enemy damage across the board there.

HotW path three was exceptionally easy, however the final boss had extraordinarily highly-tuned HP, making it take around half an hour to kill him despite him offering no challenge whatsoever.

I’d say that Giganticus Lupicus is a good baseline for where explorable dungeon bosses should all be – challenging but fair.

Any thoughts?

Also, before people complain that dungeons are too hard as it is, I’d ask you to run them at level 80 and tell me that. (Arah explorable is an exception to this, since at least Giganticus isn’t a faceroll).

Yes, this is the general consensus among everyone who actually put some time into dungeons. Will it change? Probably not.

i figured that the exact same thing would probably happen for me too and it has. Explorable modes for the most part are too easy. they do offer a challenge the first few times you go through but after that the challenge disappears. The same issue was true of World of Warcrafts “Heroic” modes which were anything but heroic. They were boring and easy. The difference there is that you could at least raid for a more challenging time. Since GW2 does not have raiding these dungeons are essentially the end all be all of the PvE world

something needs to be done either way. i enjoy the casual aspect of this game a lot but at the same time i miss the challenge that other games have provided. i would love to see something like a super difficult 10 man dungeon or something like that to change it up

Remember you always have the option to make it more difficult yourselves. Limit your party to 2-4, don’t use your exotic gear, don’t skip, run all mesmers, thieves, etc…there are plenty of ways in which the players can bring difficulty into the game. In most cases they simply choose not to b/c in all actuality they don’t really want harder content…just new content with new rewards…..or else why would they try to make everything easier on themselves by using max gear, optimal stats, maximum party members…etc?

Essence Snow.3194:

Remember you always have the option to make it more difficult yourselves. Limit your party to 2-4, don’t use your exotic gear, don’t skip, run all mesmers, thieves, etc…there are plenty of ways in which the players can bring difficulty into the game. In most cases they simply choose not to b/c in all actuality they don’t really want harder content…just new content with new rewards…..or else why would they try to make everything easier on themselves by using max gear, optimal stats, maximum party members…etc?

2 players.

Still not hard.

EDIT: Btw, people don’t want dungeons to be harder because it’s more “fun”. They want them to be harder so that the gear will be more exclusive to people who can actually play.

Level 80 does not make the exp paths magically somehow “too easy” or even “easy”.

Only experience and muscle memory among 5 players who have learned the mechanics for each exp path (and the overall pattern of dungeon mechanics), and the exploits and shortcuts, etc. make these easier over time.

That and also the concurrent growth into full sets of exo 80 stats.

But people who have just hit 80 and still have only yellow or green gear? And haven’t run dungeons much or at all yet?

NO. Sorry, but you’re wrong and I know at least 9 people who will back me up on that.

The only answer to the problem you’re really stating (which is that once your static group learns all the paths well, they become boring) is either more new dungeons or another tier of the same dungeons but with more difficult mechanics and larger numbers of enemies and tougher bosses.

But if they take the dungeon paths as they stand today and simply make them even harder? NO. You’ll have a player revolt on your hands. You do see all the threads complaining that dungeons are too hard, right?

I think dungeons need newer mechanics that require you to think logically rather than “beep boop large boss with lots of health sighted, push 1,1,1, 2, to defeat beep boop.” This way anyone can do it if you use your brain, gear wouldn’t be an issue. Content would only be as hard as you make it.

Shuguard.7125:

I think dungeons need newer mechanics that require you to think logically rather than “beep boop large boss with lots of health sighted, push 1,1,1, 2, to defeat beep boop.” This way anyone can do it if you use your brain, gear wouldn’t be an issue. Content would only be as hard as you make it.

There are boss encounters with good mechanics right now. Have you done the final boss in Citadel of Flame (story mode) yet? Fantastic. Not your typical boss encounter at all. Requires logical thought, teamwork, and coordination to do, but no inexplicable insta kill or chaotic mechanics or lack of tells or time to react to tells. Everything is straightforward and logical, and you have time to think, plan, and coordinate how to beat it. And you need to coordinate: wily nilly every man for himself won’t cut it.

So Anet’s capable of doing interesting, fun bosses.

Edit: pretty much every boss encounter in CoF story mode was good. All fun, all different, all logical to figure out how to beat. Once you figured the strategy, executing on that strategy was still challenging and fun, not a snoozefest at all.

Oh yes i have done all the stories modes so far. CoF story was an example of a good dungeon run, now if more bosses did something similar or required teamwork. I’d be a very happy dungeon runner. Something that takes away the monotony of 1,1,1,2 in a dungeon run is a very good change. Be it side weapons or optional mechanics the dungeons need some variety that wouldn’t require assistance from gear.

Maybe some sort of system where parts of the dungeon change depending on the instance?

i.e.
Start = Start area of the dungeon.
A = Default Straight corridor.
B = Room with traps.
C = Open area with lots of mobs.
Static = A part of the dungeon/path that will never change
“#” = Part leading to the chosen path
Boss = Boss
Chuuboss = trashy midboss

vanilla explorer mode of a example dungeon:
Start – A – path decision(1,2,3) – A – #
#=
1 – Static – A – A – Boss
2 – Static – A – Boss
3 – Static – A – chuuboss – Boss

And with a design that randomizes some of the internal structures of the dungeon:

Start – (A,B,C) – path decision(1,2,3) – (A,B,C) – #
#=
1 – Static – (A,B,C) – (A,B,C) – Static – Boss
2 – Static – (A,B,C) – Static – Boss2
3 – Static – (A,B,C) – chuuboss – Static – Boss3

Sort of like random dungeon generation in dungeon crawler games, but simplified and limited to certain areas.

Of course, you’ll eventually realize it’s still the same thing over and over again.

But in the end, if you know how to do a dungeon well, You are going to do it well.
If you don’t know how to do a dungeon well, you are likely not going to do it well.

If you raise the difficulty to cater to the people who knows the ins and out of the dungeon, the people who’s doing it for the first time are just going to break their banks on repairs and running around naked.

They could always put in normal and hard mode, though! and the rewards will reflect it.

Gab Superstar.4059:

Essence Snow.3194:

Remember you always have the option to make it more difficult yourselves. Limit your party to 2-4, don’t use your exotic gear, don’t skip, run all mesmers, thieves, etc…there are plenty of ways in which the players can bring difficulty into the game. In most cases they simply choose not to b/c in all actuality they don’t really want harder content…just new content with new rewards…..or else why would they try to make everything easier on themselves by using max gear, optimal stats, maximum party members…etc?

2 players.
Still not hard.

EDIT: Btw, people don’t want dungeons to be harder because it’s more “fun”. They want them to be harder so that the gear will be more exclusive to people who can actually play.

…but ya used all the tricks/skipping to make it as easy as possible……sigh…..

btw path 3 is easily duo-able as well…path 2 I haven’t quite figured out how to duo the graveling traps but….in due time

I definitely agree however about ppl really just wanting exclusive gear….that’s what internet ego(won’t let me use the word) is all about

Yes, in hindsight they shouldn’t just make current dungeons harder, but instead come up with some sort of hard mode or dungeons that are harder in general in the future.

I’m not suggesting that unskilled players shouldn’t have content they can play, I’m simply suggesting that there should be content for other audiences as well.

i know they will never implement an actual raiding system in this game similar to other MMO’s and thats completely fine by me. but something i think that would be a great addition to the game is 10 man dungeons. make the bosses require more co-ordination and make the overall experience more challenging. raiding in typical MMO’s gives you much better gear than regular dungeons but with the design of this game that wouldnt be the case since everything at the end game level is for looks once you have the exotics you want. give players a bigger challenge yet keep the rewards on par with everything else

I think the current set of dungeons are (mostly) alright. Yes, they’re very easy once you’re fully kitted out and have experience running them – and they’re a downright cakewalk if you meet those criteria and also have a tightly-knit group to run with. And yes, there needs to be harder content to accommodate the people who have mastered the current dungeons.

But they’re also the first dungeons in the game, and the ones that players need to use to learn how to play dungeons in the first place. Presently, they offer a difficulty curve that many new dungeoneers find steep (see: All the threads in this forum about how dungeons are too hard) while still being a rewarding learning experience for those willing to buckle down and meet the challenge (see: How many more people there are in this forum satisfied – or indeed, bored – with the current difficulty levels, compared with the first couple weeks after the game launched).

I wouldn’t be altogether opposed to a Hard Mode version of the current dungeons, but for my money, the current difficulty level for the current dungeons should be maintained. As new dungeons (or new paths within existing dungeons) are introduced to the game, make those at a level of difficulty beyond what currently exists in the game.

Yes yes, dungeons are easy. Actually they are not. As many mentioned, any content gets super easy if you have a good group, fully geared, know what you are doing and have done it infinity times before.

Until, they make dungeons that can dynamicly adjust to your strengths, most content will get easier after awhile, unless they are so hard only the leet few can do them.

i think most dungeons are just horrible
unbalanced bosses that rain aoe and kill your entire team with ease
the dungeons aren’t fun
they’re just annoying blockades for reaching your armor you so want

Encounters in this game get easier because folks progressively get better at adding to the total dps while not dying…. not because they’re better coordinated in a team sense.

I think about boss fights like WoW’s Azuregos from Sunwell; where you had people going in and out of the real world and “demon realm” to essentially fight two different bosses at the same time that you had to kill within a few seconds of each other or else the fight would fail. Even if you have awesome gear and individual skill, a team that lacks coordination cannot finish the fight. Few of these encounters exist in GW2 and most of them aren’t actually boss encounters.

YES they are easily puggable at 80, should not have much problem save a few encounters. If you have a cohesive group its a faceroll……..

gadenp.7586:

Yes yes, dungeons are easy. Actually they are not. As many mentioned, any content gets super easy if you have a good group, fully geared, know what you are doing and have done it infinity times before.

Until, they make dungeons that can dynamicly adjust to your strengths, most content will get easier after awhile, unless they are so hard only the leet few can do them.

I dont think dungeons should be a total gear test i think they should reley more on skill (do x when boss does y) to say that yes it is ok that the dungeons are super easy because you have some gear and are level 80 is well pretty crappy. I’d go as far to say the hard modes should be hard enough where not everyone can do it on there first few trys. Because if everyone can do it then that leaves lots of good players going wow this is boring.

Bruno Sardine.2907:

Encounters in this game get easier because folks progressively get better at adding to the total dps while not dying…. not because they’re better coordinated in a team sense.

I think about boss fights like WoW’s Azuregos from Sunwell; where you had people going in and out of the real world and “demon realm” to essentially fight two different bosses at the same time that you had to kill within a few seconds of each other or else the fight would fail. Even if you have awesome gear and individual skill, a team that lacks coordination cannot finish the fight. Few of these encounters exist in GW2 and most of them aren’t actually boss encounters.

WHAT HE SAID^^^^^^^ GW2 could learn alot from wow on boss mechanics. Even with out the trinity a lot of boss mechanics could be taken from the king of MMOs

Yes, in general Dungeons are way too easy once you are 80. They would also be too easy while you’re still in the leveling phase, if people would wear proper gear. And I’m not talking about greens here, blues are enough, if they have other stats then pure DPS on them.

In my book this is cause most bosses’ mechanics are just too simple and boring, if there were tanks in this game we could call it “tank and spank”, there is nothing more to do than to avoid one or two attacks and do damage. Yes, there are some fun encounters like the CoF story mode endboss and others that are tough enough to be a challenge (Giganticus Lupicus, Simin oder Subject Alpha), but there still are too few of them.

I don’t want every boss to be like Lupi, that would probably be too much for some players out there that are not as good at this game as they think they are, but 2 out of the 4 paths of each dungeon should have multiple Lupis, Simins or Alphas in it. This way you can still do the two easy paths if you are just want your tokens, but it would be faster if you also take the real challenges and, of course, you wouldn’t get the Master of X achievement unless you have faced the “real” content too.

I don’t think they’re too easy. I don’t really have many problems once I get to know them, but no matter what is added, there will always be tricks that we’ll learn to make it through. If they tweak them to be harder, we’ll just dodge the new traps or figure new ways to pull enemies. IMO, they’re hard enough to be a semi-significant challenge to players new to them, and I think that’s a good sign.

I think the elitists just need to calm down, and take thier ridilin. They will probably incorporate harder dungeons/ dungeon modes soon enough. Just take a chill pill, the games only been out for 4 months and your already min/maxing it. Too much of a good thing becomes a bad thing soon enough.

Kashien.6278:

I think the elitists just need to calm down, and take thier ridilin. They will probably incorporate harder dungeons/ dungeon modes soon enough. Just take a chill pill, the games only been out for 4 months and your already min/maxing it. Too much of a good thing becomes a bad thing soon enough.

Well, this argument could also read: “I think the below average players just need to calm down, …”

When it comes to discussions about whether the content is too hard or too easy cause I’m neither a fan of the term “elitist” nor “casual” cause they aren’t well defined. Casuals are not “stupid” by default, are unable to follow simple command and are kind allergic to voice communication tools as well as you don’t become an “elitist” just cause you wear proper gear, use a special build or have cleared a dungeon multiple times.
Additionally, once someone throws in these words things tend to get ugly. In both camps we have people that are, at least in my opinion, horribly wrong. Not every boss should be like Lupi, this would kill the game and complaining about e.g. AC or CM is ridiculous. If you killed Lupi at your first try you are either really far above average or you had a really good group that told you exactly what to expect and what to do and if you have problems in AC or CM you are really below-average, had a bad group or were wearing the inappropriate gear (e.g. full glass cannon builds) for your skill level.

Kashien.6278:

I think the elitists just need to calm down, and take thier ridilin. They will probably incorporate harder dungeons/ dungeon modes soon enough. Just take a chill pill, the games only been out for 4 months and your already min/maxing it. Too much of a good thing becomes a bad thing soon enough.

This game may have been out for 4 months, but boss encounters have been designed in video games since conception of industry. Bugs can be fixed and forgiven, lazy encounter design is just that.

Lasur Arkinshade.4107:

Any thoughts?

Also, before people complain that dungeons are too hard as it is, I’d ask you to run them at level 80 and tell me that. (Arah explorable is an exception to this, since at least Giganticus isn’t a faceroll).

there are some very easy parts in many dungeons, some challenging encounters, and some annoying ones (the final boss in TA, for example). i think that encounter mechanics need more thought, as they are too simple (so they either raise the challenge by giving the boss one or many one shot abilites, or they increase the boss’ life so it takes forever to kill)

Arah explorable is more or less what dungeons (at least some paths in some dungeons) should be. It only needs to last less… 3 hours yesterday, and we only wiped a couple of times in some bosses (Giganticus Lupicus.. we killed it in the second try…. and we were a pickup group with no raid call and no experience…..)

The real issues with regard to dungeon difficulty, or lack thereof, are: the practice effect; and down-scaling seemingly not working as well as advertised. Case in point, when my warrior was 35 my adrenal skill, and the number 3 maintained rifle shot were capping out around 800-900. At 80, down-leveled to 35, I am doing nearly 2K. That’s a lot of difference.

The dungeons were harder when you were first learning them? Please go on.

IMHO the difficulty for most dungeons is just right, although there are a few that are too easy or too hard. I think the lower levels dungeons SHOULD be easier by default, since they should be complete-able with level appropriate characters in level appropriate masterwork/rare gear. But in order to give a challenge to kitted out lvl 80’s maybe ANet could add a GW1 style hardmode where they change some things such as:

a) Increase boss damage (but decrease boss hp somewhat)
b) A wall/door closes after starting a boss fight so there can be no WP zerging. After boss a resets the door can open again. (Or easier to implement- all WPs become contested while a boss has aggro).
c) Give each boss, or maybe only each final boss, an additional attack or phase to mix up the encounters and make them harder.

Or the ultimate punisher:
d) Party wipe == dungeon reset (UW/FoW/DoA style defeat)

Also I like the idea of a 10 man dungeon that has more complex mechanics and requires more teamwork, but I doubt that would last long against the challenge seekers in this thread.

Except part of Arah, I agree 100%. Please introduce HM(Hard Mode)

Where the bosses have even more life? I will pass on that.

support, dungeons are too easy except arah which is perfectly well balanced

In my book even Arah is too easy. Not all of it, Simin, Lupi and maybe Alphard are perfectly fine, but the rest of the bosses, especially in path 2 and 3, are not really what they should be.

I sort of agree with the OP.

My problem is that there is hardly any difficulty progression throughout Dungeons. Aside from Arah, no Dungeon is really harder than the next.

Hell, some Story Modes feels harder than explorables.

The thing is, once you’ve beaten one explorable mode….none of the others are going to be significantly harder. Some paths might be harder to coordinate or require some tricky puzzle but the fights themselves are all more of less the same difficulty.

I wasn’t there, but didn’t GW1 have easier dungeons in the beginning also? And then dungeons/missions got progressively hard throughout the course of the games life?

I agree, once you get to level 80, obtain exotic gear, and have done the runs a couple of times the dungeons become a cake walk. However, I believe ANet will address this later in time as they did in GW1 with the implementation of Hard Mode. Just give it some time, the game is still relatively new and not all players have gotten the hang of dungeons yet.

I’d like to see harder dungeons with decent rewards saidly if you already have the armor/ equipment you have it’s mutch more effective to farm all ac explorables cause with reward and drops you make good money instead of arah. Arah chests should drop at least if there is a hm about the way mdk chest dropped. I never got a yellow out of an arah chest and I opened lot’s of em about 100 or even more. In addition to that best drops from simin and lupi are blue ones . Make it harder and the rewards better.

I don’t know, but maybe they didn’t design these first dungeons to be extremely difficult, but instead plan on introducing more challenging dungeon content in future updates and expansions? Kind of like building up difficulty as the game goes?

They will probably nerf Dungeons because of players like this: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Dungeons-way-overpowered/first

Everytime I post in his threads he reports me and Anet bans my account for a few days. I guess you can get banned now a days just by saying he needs to learn how to play his class and learn how dungeons work. Like all the other whinners, he is a WoW type of dungeon player and those types of players can’t understand GW2 Dungeon concepts. So ya, since devs on these forums seem to be ban happy, dont post anything he doesnt like in his thread for you will get banned for 5 days.

Milennin.4825:

I don’t know, but maybe they didn’t design these first dungeons to be extremely difficult, but instead plan on introducing more challenging dungeon content in future updates and expansions? Kind of like building up difficulty as the game goes?

Why? With all explore dungeons having at least 3 paths and a story mode tied to it, why have the explore mode be uniform in difficulty (with the exception of an encounter or two)? You could’ve easily had an easy, medium, and hard path (and for dungeons with more than 3 paths, 2 easy or 2 mediums) with scaling rewards… Easy path is the standard drop rates we’re all familiar with and 60 tokens, medium path is slightly better drop rates with 80-100 tokens, and hard is good drop rates and 120 tokens; or something to this effect.

But here we go… shouldwouldacoulda, but ultimately didn’t.

Once you learn the dungeon path and the mechanics of course it becomes easier. Making it stupid hard isn’t “fun”. I don’t want to spend 1-2 hours in one dungeon. 1-2 hours when learning with a new group, i am fine with. But once we all know it, it should become easy.

If they do the easy, medium and hard path, people will only do the path with best loot. the hard path will become easy just by doing it over and over.

Hard doesn’t have to be brick wall inflated numbers hard, but execution hard in that the team needs to cooperate and perform or else it fails the encounter.

The best example I can think of is Azuregos from WoW’s Sunwell dungeon. Basically, you have to go in between the “real world” and the “demon realm” to fight two bosses at once. If they both don’t die within a few seconds of each other then the encounter fails. Regardless of how geared or skilled the players are, if you don’t work together, you can’t finish the encounter. This is the hard I’m talking about, this is the hard other folks in the forums seem to be talking about… Not sure why folks seem to think we’re asking for beefed up numbers.

Like…. say there was a boss that took almost 0 direct damage unless it was off combo fields. Well aside from condition builds, you’d need the group to chain combo fields and work off each other rather than just adding dps and cooperating through serendipity rather than actual strategy. How is this hard? It’s actually fairly easy and teaches folks that combo fields are good and should be utilized… slowly instilling them with mechanics that make for good gameplay. But you have to execute this otherwise it’s a long fight that will likely end up in your team failing (as it should if it’s not going to work together).

Yes people who get skilled at the hard path will want to keep doing the hard path for loot and rewards… as opposed to farming Orr non-stop for essentially the same thing? There’s also the DR, so there is some incentive to not keep running the same path over and over and over again even if it does have the best potentials (cause a DR’ed hard path probably won’t be as lucrative as a non-DR’ed medium path)

And since this game has no item inflation like WoW has, with each tier essentially trivializing the previous one, fights can rely more on mechanics than numbers.

Bruno Sardine.2907:

The best example I can think of is Azuregos from WoW’s Sunwell dungeon. Basically, you have to go in between the “real world” and the “demon realm” to fight two bosses at once. If they both don’t die within a few seconds of each other then the encounter fails. Regardless of how geared or skilled the players are, if you don’t work together, you can’t finish the encounter. This is the hard I’m talking about, this is the hard other folks in the forums seem to be talking about… Not sure why folks seem to think we’re asking for beefed up numbers.

There’s a similar boss like that in Sorrow’s Embrace, path 2, where you have to kill 2 Golem bosses around the same time, or else they respawn.

shaktiboi.5194:

But people who [don’t think, turn with their keyboard, click their skills] and still have only yellow or green gear? And haven’t [understood the concept that standing in fire and stuff like that is bad for you] yet?

NO. Sorry, but you’re wrong and I know at least 9 [other facepalm inducing players who most of you hope you’ll never be unfortunate enough to group with] who will back me up on that. [There could be a 10th out there somewhere but he probably thinks AC, CoF, HotW, and CoE are pretty easy so he only half agrees with me]

Fixed your post for you.

They could take a leaf from the GW1 book and introduce a lvl80 hard mode for all dungeon paths with improved rewards.

Lasur Arkinshade.4107:

This makes the dungeon gear’s status as ‘prestige gear’ completely meaningless.

Exotic armor != exclusive. Legendary weapons require legendary amounts of everything but skill, too. “Elite” armor in Guild Wars required no eliteness (if you had the crafting materials, you could roll new and have a set of “exotic” armor yet do exactly zero content). This was addressed in future content with a reputation system, which took time and persistence, difficulty was not a factor.

CoF paths one and two are ridiculously easy and offered practically no challenge to my PuG group. I would advise increasing enemy damage across the board there.

No, no and a corrosive, planet-shaking NO. You misunderstand the very complaint you have. It’s not that dungeons are too easy, it’s level 80s being extremely powerful. Why bring up the difficulty because of them? This is how power creep begins. You start raising the bar with mob hp/damage/skills to appease the minority, yet it won’t be hard enough for some and will disenfranchise builds/professions which are not as capable as others. With time, players get new power to make them competitive again. Rinse, repeat and you have Guild Wars, which was utterly ruined by extreme PvE power creep brought on by…

Hard Mode. Which, honestly, if a level 80 team wants a challenge, this is the simplest way to go. Add the option to dungeon entrances, required level 80, pop in some extra rewards and better drop rates, then throw the kitchen sink of difficulty at them. However don’t be surprised after a month when players (I’d guess mostly light/med) complain of brutality, 1-shots and LFM guardian/warrior only meta runs.

I don’t want any of that. I’d like to see a cap on trait levels and levies on utility, and a return of environmental effects (similar from Guild Wars).

Keep player power in-check, do NOT buff mobs/bosses or otherwise make dungeons more annoying. No matter how “extreme” or “elite” you can make content, there will be people who think it’s too easy and no way to make it harder without starting a trend toward runaway power creep.

I can see how the level 80 Fully Elite geared and spect for dungeons characters might see dungeons as too easy. The problem is, not everyone is Fully Elite geared and wants to be a copy paste character.

I would agree, for those who put all their focus on Dungeons and not caring about being just another copy of everyone else of your class, there needs to be tougher dungeons. But the “Base” dungeon difficulty needs to be either toned down, or re-designed to accomidate players of different builds and leveled and equiped for the “required” level for the dungeon. (If explorable dungeons were “end game” content the level requirement would be level 80)

Ghost.6247:

They will probably nerf Dungeons because of players like this: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Dungeons-way-overpowered/first

Everytime I post in his threads he reports me and Anet bans my account for a few days. I guess you can get banned now a days just by saying he needs to learn how to play his class and learn how dungeons work. Like all the other whinners, he is a WoW type of dungeon player and those types of players can’t understand GW2 Dungeon concepts. So ya, since devs on these forums seem to be ban happy, dont post anything he doesnt like in his thread for you will get banned for 5 days.

Dungeons ARE overpowered, If it “Requires” level 80, exotic gear and SPECIFIC builds for at least some of the classes, then it needs re-thought.

I know how to play my character, the problem is I don’t want to play it D/D with all Vit/Toughness gear with most my traits going to Earth and Water. That locks me down to one small subset of what the class is capable of.

You were reported for being insulting and non-constuctive in that thread. You were the only one in the thread reported repeatedly, and it was for near identical posts of L2P with no actual constructive feedback.

I hated WoW because there too, they forced you into specific roles, and if you didn’t fit the build they wanted, and have a minimal “gear score”, they wouldn’t let you in.

Drake Brimstone.3706:

I can see how the level 80 Fully Elite geared and spect for dungeons characters might see dungeons as too easy. The problem is, not everyone is Fully Elite geared and wants to be a copy paste character.

Dungeons ARE overpowered, If it “Requires” level 80, exotic gear and SPECIFIC builds for at least some of the classes, then it needs re-thought.

I know how to play my character, the problem is I don’t want to play it D/D with all Vit/Toughness gear with most my traits going to Earth and Water. That locks me down to one small subset of what the class is capable of.

You were reported for being insulting and non-constuctive in that thread. You were the only one in the thread reported repeatedly, and it was for near identical posts of L2P with no actual constructive feedback.

I hated WoW because there too, they forced you into specific roles, and if you didn’t fit the build they wanted, and have a minimal “gear score”, they wouldn’t let you in.

Dude, like I said before, we run the exp modes that require lvl 45 ON OUR LVL 45’s and have zero problems. I hit 80 last night and was still wearing lvl 60 gear and still had ZERO problems with pugs even. L2P is the correct statement here. Dungeons DO NOT need a nerf of any sort, people just need to learn how the run them correctly and strategically.

Drake Brimstone.3706:

I can see how the level 80 Fully Elite geared and spect for dungeons characters might see dungeons as too easy. The problem is, not everyone is Fully Elite geared and wants to be a copy paste character.

I would agree, for those who put all their focus on Dungeons and not caring about being just another copy of everyone else of your class, there needs to be tougher dungeons. But the “Base” dungeon difficulty needs to be either toned down, or re-designed to accomidate players of different builds and leveled and equiped for the “required” level for the dungeon. (If explorable dungeons were “end game” content the level requirement would be level 80)

Ghost.6247:

They will probably nerf Dungeons because of players like this: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Dungeons-way-overpowered/first

Everytime I post in his threads he reports me and Anet bans my account for a few days. I guess you can get banned now a days just by saying he needs to learn how to play his class and learn how dungeons work. Like all the other whinners, he is a WoW type of dungeon player and those types of players can’t understand GW2 Dungeon concepts. So ya, since devs on these forums seem to be ban happy, dont post anything he doesnt like in his thread for you will get banned for 5 days.

Dungeons ARE overpowered, If it “Requires” level 80, exotic gear and SPECIFIC builds for at least some of the classes, then it needs re-thought.

I know how to play my character, the problem is I don’t want to play it D/D with all Vit/Toughness gear with most my traits going to Earth and Water. That locks me down to one small subset of what the class is capable of.

You were reported for being insulting and non-constuctive in that thread. You were the only one in the thread reported repeatedly, and it was for near identical posts of L2P with no actual constructive feedback.

I hated WoW because there too, they forced you into specific roles, and if you didn’t fit the build they wanted, and have a minimal “gear score”, they wouldn’t let you in.

Except Arena Net have personally stated that Explorable Mode dungeons should NOT be for pugs who don’t push their skill / character to the limit, but for highly coordinated groups of players who actually do, so everything you say is wrong.

The fact that pugs can still run any explorable mode just fine is enough to warrant an increase in difficulty when it comes to dungeons.