Guild Wars 2

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/ARAH-Path-Scammers/first#post4992355

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Arah-Sellers-Watch-out-for-Scammers/first#post4992341

Funny how these threads are showing up under general gw 2 now. Be nice if Anet would look at ways of fixing this finally, but I am not gonna hold my breath at all.

Iris Ng.9845:

For ele, you either spec heavily in the first 2 lines or the last 2 lines. That’s where it gets boring – in 3 game modes.

I have yet to figure out how having many different “viable” builds translates into fun.

Not that any profession has more than one viable build per circumstance, though.

Dub.1273:

Iris Ng.9845:

For ele, you either spec heavily in the first 2 lines or the last 2 lines. That’s where it gets boring – in 3 game modes.

I have yet to figure out how having many different “viable” builds translates into fun.

Not that any profession has more than one viable build per circumstance, though.

Warrior has many fun builds in WvW and sPvP. Part of it owes to the ability to wield so many weapons, but its traits are decently spread and you get access to kitten tanky build to one-shot zerking to condi stun-lock and anything in between (cele shout bow).

The fun comes after being effective at a certain role in team fight. Pulling one’s own weight is what makes a build viable. In comparison, if the ele isn’t either damage or sustain, they become a liability in the competitive scene. It is much much worse in PvE.

In other people’s words, there is a little synergy in ele traits, which results only a few builds actually work and become popular.

Sounds like half of us are talking about dungeons/PvE and the rest are talking about PvP/WvW.

Most classes have a very limited set of useful builds in PvE, not just ele

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Need-help-The-Ruined-City-of-Arah-story-mode/first#post4993280

O.o

In PvE (solo and group play), warriors can have pure damage or condi or support (ps/ea). For ele, it’s either 6 in Air or 6 in Fire. Diversity is very limited.

The discussion has been brought out in three game modes, by the ways.

Once I feel a bit better, I plan on taking my elly’s cele armor (don’t wvw with her anymore), put monk runes in it and rp as a healer.
I suppose the traits are quite obvious, but I’m wondering how much healing’s gonna be lost if I go cele instead of clerics? I doubt it’s relevant because of the kittenty scaling, and anyway the most important thing for a monk is the “outgoing healing” stat.
…
inb4 I facetank everything with a few defensive pieces and casuals whine about zerk… jesus, I’m broken.

spoj.9672:

I cant agree with that when eles have traits as game changing as fresh air. If only they had more weapons to work with that. :>

Anyway there was an amusing warrior that entered the necro forums a week ago.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/necromancer/Deathly-Claws-1/first

That war is dumb and probably has never seen Rampage auto attack hits for 7k damage

deSade.9437:

Once I feel a bit better, I plan on taking my elly’s cele armor (don’t wvw with her anymore), put monk runes in it and rp as a healer.
I suppose the traits are quite obvious, but I’m wondering how much healing’s gonna be lost if I go cele instead of clerics? I doubt it’s relevant because of the kittenty scaling, and anyway the most important thing for a monk is the “outgoing healing” stat.
…
inb4 I facetank everything with a few defensive pieces and casuals whine about zerk… jesus, I’m broken.

Not much healing is lost. Abuse the hell out of Healing Ripple and Soothing Mist, you can out sustain even in 2v1. Be careful of sneaky power ranger though

I have yet to figure out how having many different “viable” builds translates into fun.

because scrolling over my gear and reading “valkyrie” makes me feel giddy inside

In PvE (solo and group play), warriors can have pure damage or condi or support (ps/ea). For ele, it’s either 6 in Air or 6 in Fire. Diversity is very limited.

strange, pretty sure d/f, staff and sc/d + lh builds were all viable

and to be honest, the “diversity” of warrior builds which force me to carry two sets of gear isn’t that interesting to me, if anything it’s annoying and i’d kill for a template option.

That’s my point. Traits need rework.

Ele traits are way better than most classes. :P

I think thieves traits are very nicely set up because they are not just about DPS. extended stealth, invigorating precision, feline grace are some of the best utility traits.

Thieves, Engi, Warrior are good in my eyes. Mesmer has many interesting trait setups, however, I have never played with the class long enough. Guardian has decent variety. All that left is Necro and Ele. Ele’s Earth line is almost never used as it has so little synergy with anything else. Let me repeat myself; Ele only has two roles: Straight Damage, or Sustain, either Air/Fire or Water/Arcana. Necro I don’t know, never play necro enough.

Edit: Some of Ele’s weapon skills are better than most classes’ weapon skills, but at least 3-4 of the other skills never get to see their use. Same can be said for ele’s traits. To sum up, that explains the amount of wound-licking in the ele subforum.

That’s my point. Traits need rework.

what

Mesmer has many interesting trait setups,

not really. you’re pretty much always traiting mantras ad you’re always taking phantasmal fury and either blade training or in rare cases duelist’s discipline. then you decide whether you want warden’s feedback and glamour traiting or if you prefer compounding power w/phantasmal haste and illusionist’s celerity, and these builds all play basically identical to each other.

gw2 pvp is garbage so I don’t care about that, though I’m pretty sure the optimal mesmer build there is literally just playing another class (or if you’re really persistent, shatter).

Ele only has two roles: Straight Damage, or Sustain

lol ok

Umm… my original post was talking about the complaints in the ele sub-forum, which are about ele’s build problems in three game modes. I think it’s fair to look at a class in different point of view, and not just PvE dungeons.

Mesmer wise, they have way more builds in WvW and sPvP. I find they are very interesting. Even Sandy does not always use phantasmal builds.

Umm… my original post was talking about the complaints in the ele sub-forum, which are about ele’s build problems in three game modes. I think it’s fair to look at a class in different point of view, and not just PvE dungeons.

the build problems of being powerful in all three modes and being able to use a whole array of different weapons.

being locked in to certain traits just comes with the territory of “do I want my build to actually be decent or not” and this applies to like any game with builds ever.

Mesmer wise, they have way more builds in WvW and sPvP. I find they are very interesting. Even Sandy does not always use phantasmal builds.

“run PU, shatter or be bad” is hardly “way more builds”.

my mistake, in large scale WvW you run triple glamours and function basically as ranged DPS with your GS.

Mesmer: Shatter, Blurred Signet/Powerblock, Phantasm Stunlock, Pure Mantra One-shot, Condi-Shatter, etc to name a few that are actually used in sPvP for various roles. PU is a thing in the past and maybe only used in roaming. The most recent popular shatter build of mesmer uses Sword/Torch as their primary immobilization burst and greatsword/shatter to boon rip and set up their 25 stacks of vuln. Any greatsword camping mesmers are certainly no good at all.

Meanwhile, Ele either has been using Fresh Air-centric build or Evasive Arcana-centric build for years. Some niche builds using Ember Might/Written In Stone or Diamond Skin was once cool when firstly introduced, but is certainly not strong enough to establish its own roaming/duelist role. Lightning Rod while fun and potentially strong has no synergy with any other traits/skills at all.

I think you haven’t played the game (outside PvE) for far too long to actually grasp its current state. Therefore, I can only resort to agree to disagree.

P.S.: Metabattle is a joke. Play the game, not the numbers (or Twitch).

P.S. 2: D/D Evasive Arcana is not powerful. The Celestial Amulet is. The combination of cele ammy and D/D EA is the only build that allows ele to compete in the high tier tourney. Therefore, it is sad. Prior to Cele Ammy, D/D ele did not play any pivotal roles in sPvP

so my fail of the day. did my first coe p3 in about 2 months. got to the last alpha. i was on warrior and I did the gs #3 whirlwind to dodge one of his ground attacks, and did it straight into the exit. loaded into mount maelstrom and missed out on my rewards since the boss was at 2% health when i did it

Oh that sucks, sry.
I had a similar experiencr on fractals lv40. We got Mai, someone called to take advantge of the log out thing. So I died near the end… I thought I would earn time logging out and in. To my surprise I log in in the fractal hall, with only one member left. No chest for me. I was so mad.

Iris Ng.9845:

Umm… my original post was talking about the complaints in the ele sub-forum, which are about ele’s build problems in three game modes. I think it’s fair to look at a class in different point of view, and not just PvE dungeons.

Mesmer wise, they have way more builds in WvW and sPvP. I find they are very interesting. Even Sandy does not always use phantasmal builds.

what type of builds do mesmers use for WvW these days?
other than utility types like teleports, reflects, invis?

phys.7689:

Iris Ng.9845:

Umm… my original post was talking about the complaints in the ele sub-forum, which are about ele’s build problems in three game modes. I think it’s fair to look at a class in different point of view, and not just PvE dungeons.

Mesmer wise, they have way more builds in WvW and sPvP. I find they are very interesting. Even Sandy does not always use phantasmal builds.

what type of builds do mesmers use for WvW these days?
other than utility types like teleports, reflects, invis?

I don’t do WvW much to have a broad view of mesmer builds there. For zerging, it makes sense to run glamour (Feedback, Null Field, Veil). From my experience against ganking squad, standard shatter and cancerous Powerblock appears frequent. They usually come in a pack of 4 mesmers in a group of 8-10. Their utilities are almost the same in Decoy. Depending on the build, some would take portal, others use signet of domination, midnight or mantra. You can trait reflect on distortion so I don’t see many use feedback for roaming.

I’d say I’m the actual authority on build diversity as I am an amazing pvper and everyone knows that real skilled play is involved there and trumps all other game modes.

For the record : my experience > anything anyone has to say.

Sure Swifty. :P

J Eberle.9312:

I’d say I’m the actual authority on build diversity as I am an amazing pvper and everyone knows that real skilled play is involved there and trumps all other game modes.

For the record : my experience > anything anyone has to say.

It’s sad (and partly amusing) to see your point If Inha was the person to say it, I would be deeply puzzled and surprised as I consider she’s the most involved in all aspects of the game that her opinions always hold a ring of truth to it.

In my opinion, there are skilled people on both sides of the game. The good ones adapt well and learn to enjoy the game as a whole. The sad ones are cynical about the part that they don’t actively play and generally disregard others’ opinions about it. I hope they still enjoy what they play though.

With respect,

Ducks n Turtles best PvP guild I’ve ever seen.

Dear Iris,

To be fair, after trying out all game modes, I can only say I’m amazed at both the diversity and the absence of it. Playing in WvW/PvP allowed me to try out a lot of stuff that are very different from the PvE I do on a daily basis and that was very enjoyable. However, I find that to be really competitive, or to win so to speak, I need to play something that is really set in stone. I need to play something that is a little OP, or I won’t be able to carry anything/anyone.

What I mean is that their is far more diversity and being viable is actually enough, but to win I can’t go full snowflake :’(

Enaretos.8079:

Dear Iris,

To be fair, after trying out all game modes, I can only say I’m amazed at both the diversity and the absence of it. Playing in WvW/PvP allowed me to try out a lot of stuff that are very different from the PvE I do on a daily basis and that was very enjoyable. However, I find that to be really competitive, or to win so to speak, I need to play something that is really set in stone. I need to play something that is a little OP, or I won’t be able to carry anything/anyone.

What I mean is that their is far more diversity and being viable is actually enough, but to win I can’t go full snowflake :’(

Dear Sam,

I’m glad you enjoy the game as much as I do. With a little observation, it’s true that diversity shines at the casual part of the game where it holds most people’s interest. The competitive scene is at the moment, really stagnant and I don’t have much insights to dare say anything about it. Many of my pvp friends in NA are mature, working folks (some with kids) who always tell me that they do not have the time to esports. They’d rather spend time making hundreds of dollars per week then earning 80$ weekly like The Abjured. That perception really dwindles a good number of players who can potentially drive the meta in a different direction.

Now let’s talk about the diversity which we both enjoy profoundly at our level of game play. The PvE part of the game is design with a simple philosophy : Kill or skip to finish an objective. It is very easy to optimized a build for damage and throw in a couple of utilities to finish the job. We don’t need to use even half of the traits/skills/weapons designed for a class. On the other hand, the Competitive part of the game presents us with a variety of roles. We have to choose to whether play objectives or against other players. It opens the opportunity of diversity there. For example, we cannot simply play a 5-DPS comp in Conquest Mode. After many iterations of the game, the 4:1 or 3:2 (bunker: DPS) splits have evolved to the current cele meta. Some classes have really good synergy across the board which allow them to adapt to changes really well, for example warrior and engineer. Some other classes have genuine and interesting traits which allow builds to thrive off creative and skilled players. For example, Sataarcoeny with the modern version of shatter, Hiba with Celerifle and Sizer with S/D-steal thief. Then there are classes which only became flavor of the month after Anet adding new (working) traits and/or reworking their “fixes”, i.e. necro, ranger and ele. Nevertheless, the current state of the game is much better than before and people are happy about it. Yet, it is legitimate to respect the concern about the lacking in diversity in certain places. I’m pretty sure necro is the unhappiest class and ele is at a better place in over all. But ele has not experienced any “evolution” when it comes to competitive plays. For almost three years, d/d Evasive Arcana has come a long way from good to worst then better and is still indispensable as ever. Then we were blessed with Fresh Air which is our (almost) only viable alternative. We have quite a few non-working/bugged traits and a whole trait line left almost unused in all “optimal” builds (PvE, PvP, WvW). I’m sure it’s not intended as parts of the design. I’m sure people who are passionate about the class wouldn’t feel content either. No one would raise a crusade about it, but it remains as an everlasting sore which throbs whenever the nerf hammer comes. That is how I see it as “wound licking” in the Ele sub forum and re-tell it from my side of perception

Regarding “to win”, you need a lot of teamwork, practice and motivation; not restricted to meta. Among the talks in the competitive scene, “why does The Abjured dominate NA?” – Because his team carries Nos so well that he can make necro works in this meta. Necro is a prime example of full special snowflake, if you ask me.

tl;dr: discussing in good spirits because I’m too bored.

Guys I think I ate all the imbued shaman arrows. Any tips? Tells?

Card.9704:

Hi Iris, this is the dungeon discussion thread. The pvp forum is right here https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp it seems you may belong there instead.

Gaile told us to keep this on topic so I would kindly like to request you do the same, your female privilege is only good so far. As someone who primarily identifies as a squirrel I believe I can sometimes feel the pain of the other lesser sexes via the pouches in my cheeks. Have a nice day. =)

Aren’t you a little bit too late?

This topic has been talking about:

• Different games
• Family matters
• Pug complaints
• Personal disgust
• Snarky comments on other PHIW
  et cetera

Would you be so kind to join the discussion or look past it rather than brandish me with your anti-feminism belief. By no means I think myself a little more than an individual who plays this game possibly as much as anyone else. I am regrettably not one of your cult so our opinions may differ, but I thrive to give a sound argument within my best knowledge.

Ryn.6459:

Guys I think I ate all the imbued shaman arrows. Any tips? Tells?

Hmm… I usually watch out for the direction he is facing and prepare for his arm pulling backward. In pugs, I try to max melee him and only go for burst rotation when safeguarded with reflect. If you range him, you can strafe left-right a bit. Which class are you playing?

I was on warrior. Is strfing enough? That would explain why I didnt have much problems before. I think I got.nervous.cause I.was pugging with a famous guild member :P

Ryn.6459:

I was on warrior. Is strfing enough? That would explain why I didnt have much problems before. I think I got.nervous.cause I.was pugging with a famous guild member :P

You can make it really simple by standing behind him; when he wants to pew pew you he’ll have to turn around which will make it really obvious. Otherwise just keep eating arrows until you recognise and react to his tell.

when should I dodge? When he turns or when the arrow is already fired?

Ryn.6459:

when should I dodge? When he turns or when the arrow is already fired?

It depends on the distance. If you are far enough from him, you can dodge when the arrow is mid way to you. If you’re right under and in front of him, you have to react as soon as he pulls his arm backwards. If you’re right under and behind him, you need to move when he turns 180 degree towards you. The arrow velocity is about as fast as Warrior’s Pin Down, if you really really want to practice.

I’m still not fully grasping the different meta builds for Mesmers in WvW. Could anyone elaborate please with a wall of text or two? It’d be much appreciated.

Ryn.6459:

when should I dodge? When he turns or when the arrow is already fired?

If you’re in melee range, you’ll want to dodge when he fully pulls back the arrow on his bow
(potato quality images taken from https://youtu.be/vdcWnBVn5fU attatched for reference)
https://a.pomf.se/nhmqvi.jpg
https://a.pomf.se/jxbcad.jpg

What rituals must I perform to be initiated into the squirrel cult?

It involves a shaved squirrel and some lard.

“The squirrel cult” sounds like a great guild name. Or a music band.

Mesmer: Shatter, Blurred Signet/Powerblock, Phantasm Stunlock, Pure Mantra One-shot, Condi-Shatter, etc to name a few that are actually used in sPvP for various roles.

i’m too lazy to search, what mesmer builds are actually being used in the (lol) “high-end” pvp tournaments? are mesmers even being played? I remember some of the popular mesmer mains being BHBs and rerolling thieves a few months back because their class sucked.

Any greatsword camping mesmers are certainly no good at all.

in zerg wvw you stick mostly on GS and have sw/f in your off-set to pull people together or off towers or if you need to mitigate damage with blurred frenzy, but you mostly just function as ranged DPS since your whole clone mechanic basically might as well not even exist in WvW.

I think you haven’t played the game (outside PvE) for far too long to actually grasp its current state. Therefore, I can only resort to agree to disagree

remove pole out of backside, thanks.

In my opinion, there are skilled people on both sides of the game. The good ones adapt well and learn to enjoy the game as a whole. The sad ones are cynical about the part that they don’t actively play and generally disregard others’ opinions about it.

I disregard GW2 pvp because it’s trash and it’s comical how ANet want it to be an esport, especially after watching real esports and comparing the two.

On the other hand, the Competitive part of the game

llllllllollllllllllll

it’s like those dungeon tourneys didn’t even exist

fixing booged thread

maha.7902:

in zerg wvw you stick mostly on GS and have sw/f in your off-set to pull people together or off towers or if you need to mitigate damage with blurred frenzy, but you mostly just function as ranged DPS since your whole clone mechanic basically might as well not even exist in WvW

If you’re in an organised zerg then you’ll probably run GS + S/T shatter in the focus party, SF/ + GS melee train mesmer was pretty much only ran by Doiid back in the days of Red Guard if my memory serves me correctly.

Or I could be completely wrong, who knows ¯\(?)/¯

ya when I did organised wvw I was just set in the backline as ranged dps and veil/time warp slave and sometimes either pulled with focus or you could run in quickly with your leap and immobilise a bunch of people to be bursted. i mean generally you could either stick around the raid leader so you could receive boons and healing or splinter off to pick off stragglers, though mesmers were pretty **** at that compared to thieves so we generally just stuck around the melee.

but I mean, that was like … probably over a year ago so tactics probably changed since then.

They’re gonna nerf damage again through stats butchering. Just you watch. I called it.
Also, gg at more (dumb)player-friendly [/cough] changes that force you into specific trait lines. Whatever. It’s cool, trait lines (excluding elly and maybe guard) were already a kittenty and poor excuse to remove* variety through skills like in gw1.
Why, why didn’t they just make gw2.

Element Two.7316:

maha.7902:

in zerg wvw you stick mostly on GS and have sw/f in your off-set to pull people together or off towers or if you need to mitigate damage with blurred frenzy, but you mostly just function as ranged DPS since your whole clone mechanic basically might as well not even exist in WvW

If you’re in an organised zerg then you’ll probably run GS + S/T shatter in the focus party, SF/ + GS melee train mesmer was pretty much only ran by Doiid back in the days of Red Guard if my memory serves me correctly.

Or I could be completely wrong, who knows ¯\(?)/¯

You are correct about the roaming setup. GS + S/T Shatter Zerk is popular among the high burst-great escape group. Then we also have Scepter/Pistol + Gsword or Staff Powerblock as an offensive support in a roaming squad. If limited to solo or small group roaming, you can even see some serious condi cancer. I haven’t seen a dedicated mesmer for melee train recently, but back then War Machine was running with a really tanky mesmer heavily specced to manipulation and glamour.

@Maha: Some of the most notable mesmers are Helseth (TCG), Azani (Made In Meta), Misha (55HP Monk), Supcutie (Dankening, despite rarely playing) at the tourney level. Then there are some really good mesmer mains who aren’t participating in any teams. For example: Malferian (EU streamer), Brain, Countless, StompedByPizza, Elegant (NA). Some good players playing mesmers as alts are Phantaram and maybe Drazeh (wild guess, but HOT did a double mesmer comp in ESL weekly not too long ago). Sword/torch is really strong against thief.

PvE is more Cooperative than Competitive. Maybe Stronghold can satisfy your need for competitive PvE.

@Maha: Some of the most notable mesmers are Helseth (TCG), Azani (Made In Meta), Misha (55HP Monk), Supcutie (Dankening, despite rarely playing) at the tourney level.

and have they played and succeeded with mesmer in recent tournaments?

and if they were, were they using various builds? it’s like you completely skimmed over that part.

PvE is more Cooperative than Competitive. Maybe Stronghold can satisfy your need for competitive PvE.

again, did the dungeon tourneys not exist or something?

maybe I’m going to need someone to help me extracting this pole since you can’t do it yourself.

maha.7902:

maybe I’m going to need someone to help me extracting this pole since you can’t do it yourself.

Helseth rolled necro, Supcutie thief.

For the various builds part, let’s first of all agree on discussing what is “played at a good level”.
PS: (Wiki) viable : capable of working successfully; feasible.

Shatter is the only viable at end play (and is outplayed by meta), Lockdown is ok (like LB/GS ranger is ok…), rest is hotjoin mess. It makes it 1.5 viable builds.
Elementalist has D/D and Staff, Warrior has Shoutbow and Hammer and so on… PvP variations are dumbed down to 2 builds per class (One meta, one “ok”).

So can be said of PvE (Mantra/Glamour ; Staff/LH ; DPS/Phalanx) and of roaming WvW (Shatter/Condi ; Fresh Air/DD ; Hambow/Swordbow). Zerg WvW is something I do not follow, my vild guess is GS power mesmer, Support ele and CC warrior (A whooping 1 build per class).

Who are we kidding with diversity and/or viability? Don’t try to make Signet or Miam mesmer happen.

Edit :

warrior has the best trait tree and so many fun and viable builds

PvP and WvW
Trait core for viable builds : xx4x4
Weapon core for viable builds : Longbow + Melee weapon
Utilities core for viable builds : Healing signet (always) + Berserker stance/Balanced stance/Endure pain (Pick from 2 to 3)

So many fun and variable builds indeed.

I like the part where spirit weapons are meta.

If you like to hear my answer, we can talk in game or in TS. I prefer not to write another wall of text that is most likely not going to be read.