Guild Wars 2

Ooh, I haven’t seen a thread like this in a while.

Can someone pass me a bingo card?

When you get a collection of casual or bad or lazy players (three distinct groups mind you), a small fraction of them will be the kind of special snowflakes who don’t want to learn, don’t want to try, but at the same time insist on being “teh best” regardless.

When they see people being better than them at the game, they cry foul and try and attack those players and the systems which they perceive as giving them an advantage. Because of course they can’t admit that they are simply worse or put the effort in to improve.

This is why the whole PHIW mantra got warped, it started being about playing how you want and being able to do the content. Then it became “playing how I want also has to be as optimal as any given meta”. They want everything, regardless of effort and they cant stand anyone who is putting in that effort.

Now due to the design and marketing of this game, it has more casuals, bads and special snowflakes than any other. So whilst the majority of them are fine, that small section of bad eggs is actually quite a large number of players.

There are also people who think they are the best, run meta builds, run somewhat meta strats and refuse to listen to suggestions that may or may not increase the efficiency of dungeon/fotm runs. Trying things that aren’t meta is how one improves in speed honestly.

There are also people who think the community verified DPS sheets are wrong and have their own unverified DPS sheets to tell people that theirs is the right one.

anyways not every special snowflake is bad/lazy or casual.

Fenrir.3609:

When you get a collection of casual or bad or lazy players (three distinct groups mind you), a small fraction of them will be the kind of special snowflakes who don’t want to learn, don’t want to try, but at the same time insist on being “teh best” regardless.

When they see people being better than them at the game, they cry foul and try and attack those players and the systems which they perceive as giving them an advantage. Because of course they can’t admit that they are simply worse or put the effort in to improve.

This is why the whole PHIW mantra got warped, it started being about playing how you want and being able to do the content. Then it became “playing how I want also has to be as optimal as any given meta”. They want everything, regardless of effort and they cant stand anyone who is putting in that effort.

Now due to the design and marketing of this game, it has more casuals, bads and special snowflakes than any other. So whilst the majority of them are fine, that small section of bad eggs is actually quite a large number of players.

The bads and casuals are just fine with me. It’s the special snowflakes that I can’t really bring myself to suffer.

Harper.4173:

The bads and casuals are just fine with me. It’s the special snowflakes that I can’t really bring myself to suffer.

Oh indeed, there is nothing wrong at all with being bad or casual. I was railing more about the small subset of special snowflakes within their ranks.

Jerus.4350:

Windsagio.1340:

I think it’s wrong to post your style unless you’re insisting on it.

Do you feel there’s anything wrong with insisting?

Personally I was banned from posting LFGs in my old group for a reason, I never posted “right” I’ve always played under the pretense that if you can’t carry someone who isn’t good, then you’re no good, but I have no qualms about those who do insist upon whatever requirements they see fit, I just don’t take part in the quelling.

I actually like when dungeons take a bit longer to kill things, which is why I don’t do dungeons much anymore and prefer fractals. Though there is that satisfaction of things just going smoothly. As my grandpa used to say “I love when it just cinches” when things just go right, ahh, such a refreshing feeling. Did an Arah p2 the other day with someone who frequents this forum in a PUG, other than one little hiccup on my part (my weapon swap didn’t trigger and I didn’t get the shortbow blast in my black powder) it was awesome. It does get boring when you run with that efficiency all the time though, at least IMO.

Na, be clear on what you demand if you have demands. I might disagree with your (again general ‘you’) way of thinking about the game, but its up to you to maximize your fun.

Plus, it’s a filter that goes both ways. If you don’t like meta-mongers it lets you avid something you think is going to be a negative experience anyways.

Posting your build without an intent to filter others seems to me to just lead to more isolation and segmantation.

In general, this thread is a ‘why do they hate us?’

I find in my own life that the most common answer to that question is ’it’s because I’m being obnoxious’.

That’s the thing I’d like to have folks get out of this. As easy as it is to look outward and blame/insult others it’s much more useful, if you actually care about fixing the situation, to look inwards

“If you run into an kitten in the morning, you ran into an kitten. If you run into kittens all day, you’re the kitten.”

Windsagio.1340:

In general, this thread is a ‘why do they hate us?’

I find in my own life that the most common answer to that question is ’it’s because I’m being obnoxious’.

That’s the thing I’d like to have folks get out of this. As easy as it is to look outward and blame/insult others it’s much more useful, if you actually care about fixing the situation, to look inwards

so what was it you were trying to say about the people in the guild I’m in again?

maha.7902:

Windsagio.1340:

In general, this thread is a ‘why do they hate us?’

I find in my own life that the most common answer to that question is ’it’s because I’m being obnoxious’.

That’s the thing I’d like to have folks get out of this. As easy as it is to look outward and blame/insult others it’s much more useful, if you actually care about fixing the situation, to look inwards

so what was it you were trying to say about the people in the guild I’m in again?

I regret the reference, don’t wanna get into a flame war.

Windsagio.1340:

In general, this thread is a ‘why do they hate us?’

I find in my own life that the most common answer to that question is ’it’s because I’m being obnoxious’.

That’s the thing I’d like to have folks get out of this. As easy as it is to look outward and blame/insult others it’s much more useful, if you actually care about fixing the situation, to look inwards

See that’s the thing. Hating players, I can get, the fact that people hate the strats and builds is what gets me.

Elitists are hated just as much in any other game I’ve played as they are here. In those other games playing the Meta way isn’t hated like it is here. In fact it’s pretty much embraced by anyone doing the top level of content. But I guess taht goes to the segregated communities, the more casual players stick to the older/easier content while the more “hardcore” folks jump on the new content and master it. GW2 pushes us all into the same stuff.

I think there’s 2 other things;

1) General ease: Maximum optimization isn’t even remotely required for essentially all content (even the hardest stuff we have) so people can’t grok why it’s being required of them. Edit: And they feel it is being required.

2) This is pretty subjective, but it seems like the people taking part in these discussions have a very high % of former raid players on each side. The ‘embittered refugree’ sense is real, and nothing makes you hate like burning out from a raid experience.

Windsagio.1340:

maha.7902:

Windsagio.1340:

In general, this thread is a ‘why do they hate us?’

I find in my own life that the most common answer to that question is ’it’s because I’m being obnoxious’.

That’s the thing I’d like to have folks get out of this. As easy as it is to look outward and blame/insult others it’s much more useful, if you actually care about fixing the situation, to look inwards

so what was it you were trying to say about the people in the guild I’m in again?

I regret the reference, don’t wanna get into a flame war.

Hard to believe with how obnoxious you are and how you always seem to pop out of nowhere to bring these issues up. :>

spoj.9672:

Windsagio.1340:

maha.7902:

Windsagio.1340:

In general, this thread is a ‘why do they hate us?’

I find in my own life that the most common answer to that question is ’it’s because I’m being obnoxious’.

That’s the thing I’d like to have folks get out of this. As easy as it is to look outward and blame/insult others it’s much more useful, if you actually care about fixing the situation, to look inwards

so what was it you were trying to say about the people in the guild I’m in again?

I regret the reference, don’t wanna get into a flame war.

Hard to believe with how obnoxious you are and how you always seem to pop out of nowhere to bring these issues up. :>

Calling people out by name or by group is a whole different thing tho, no? I’d edit it out but the post has already been quoted and referenced.

(I know you’re largely kidding, but you know how it is ><)

This stuff is important though. I do high fractals a lot, so I end up having to interact with a lot of this stuff, and the attitudes effect me personally.

I was speaking of your general style of posts. You always seem to pop up and start instigating this same discussion. And the suckers we are cant seem to resist the temptation to respond.

spoj.9672:

I was speaking of your general style of posts. You always seem to pop up and start instigating this same discussion. And the suckers we are cant seem to resist the temptation to respond.

I’m certainly not intentionally instigating, I’ll cop to being stubborn at trying to get my point across though.

Edit: I love talking about me, but it’s not totally on point to the thread :p pm me if you’d like to go over it more

spoj.9672:

And the suckers we are cant seem to resist

i love saying “filthy casual”

Gw2 players feel like they are entitled to your free time, some guy joined my arah pug at 4 in the morning on eu the other day and gave me a lecture on how the meta is ruining the game, this is the kind of people we are dealing with.

kitten knows how they function on a day to day basis.

Edit: If anyone disagrees with the PHIW community being more toxic be sure to check the comments on the reddit thread and youtube video whenever sesshi uploads a video, it’s really sad what these people do and say to convince themselves that they aren’t terrible.

laokoko.7403:

I won’t speak for dungeons, because that is so easy, probably anyone should be meleeing and try to do max dps.

But purely speaking for high level fractal. Most pug are doing so poorly on boss fight, 5 bearbow probably out dps them.

So when it’s easy it’s ok to try to max dps, but when there is a little difficulty we should just lay back, relax and range? What about Warrior, Mesmer and Thief that just have kittenty range option? Should they range too or should they stay alone in melee getting all the hits while you range from 1500 range away?

That’s why I don’t pug fractal, people are lazy. They prefer taking 20-45 more minute in range, than trying a little challenge in melee against some fractal bosses.

depends so much on the groups, maybe the definition of ‘high’ changes… the only places where I get a lot of ‘annoying/lazy’ in fractal pugs (say post-30) is people wanting to cheeze mossman, people being scared of Mai, and the terror that is a true pug molten duo.

Thaddeus.4891:

laokoko.7403:

I won’t speak for dungeons, because that is so easy, probably anyone should be meleeing and try to do max dps.

But purely speaking for high level fractal. Most pug are doing so poorly on boss fight, 5 bearbow probably out dps them.

So when it’s easy it’s ok to try to max dps, but when there is a little difficulty we should just lay back, relax and range? What about Warrior, Mesmer and Thief that just have kittenty range option? Should they range too or should they stay alone in melee getting all the hits while you range from 1500 range away?

That’s why I don’t pug fractal, people are lazy. They prefer taking 20-45 more minute in range, than trying a little challenge in melee against some fractal bosses.

Part of the problem here is many don’t learn the tells while completing lower levels.

Even after hitting 50 I found myself needing some extra help identifying what certain attacks look like ( they can be very hard to spot til you know what to look for, then it seems easy).

having reward level 50 doesn’t make you ready for 50 necessarily..

spoj.9672:

I was speaking of your general style of posts. You always seem to pop up and start instigating this same discussion. And the suckers we are cant seem to resist the temptation to respond.

These types are the funniest. I love it when they try to act high and mighty after backpedaling. “Guys, stop being so obnoxious. Then the casuals will not hate you! …oh right, let me edit out my baseless/insulting claims from my previous post. teehee.”

Again, if you want to talk about me, take it to PMs.

I can, and am willing to play, but am also trying to be good.

Which is exactly why ANet should let us segregate ourselves. But then of course no one would carry their casual players and they couldn’t complete vinewrath while they afk

Harper.4173:

This is because people secretly – in the back of their mid whether they’re aware of it or not are jealous. They’re mad because someone is doing something they can’t.
Someone is playing well, being “more of a hero” than they are.

MMOs are about an empowerment fantasy. Fighting and killing Lupi as a 5 man PHIW casual party feels like a huge achievement for them (since Lupi is big and seems scary) so when they see someone can solo it – even with more mobs added they’re going to have that fantasy ruined to some extent.

See up until that moment they felt like the most special snowflakes in the world but once that person has shown them just what he can do and how good he is by soloing it they’re getting a cold bucket of water to the face.
They’re no longer the “awesome heroes that win at everything forever” because they now have a different standard that they compare themselves to.

People say they play MMOs for their own fun, for the social aspect and what not but people lie – to others and to themselves. Most people play MMOs in order to openly or secretly compete with others.
Otherwise you’d be playing an RPG.

And when others do significantly better than you, you take it personal. You start hating and looking for reasons why it happened.

That’s why you get :

“Zerker is exploiting” or " stacking is cheating" or “skiping is cheating” because they’re crutches used to dismiss what those people are doing and achieving.
By applying this logic and putting them in the “they’re playing the game wrong” you can still safely delude yourself that you’re one of the best out of those who are playing it “right” and thus you can become the hero again.

That’s pretty much how these people think and feel.

And this is why the zerker meta receives so much hate.

The people who bolster about it come off as if their the only ones who study and practice the game. They come off as if they are only ones who know how to properly use active defense measures or pour their energy into perfecting their boss solos or know numbers or at worst, know how to operate their base functionality to play the game properly.

The zerker meta isn’t just some meta game min maxing. Its a religious practice of blind hate empowerment. This post that was quoted is sheer proof of this.

The moment I wanna play around with a condi mesmer out of curiosity in fractals, or start using weapons on my warrior that isn’t axe/mace + greatsword like a mace/shield missile deflection build EVEN if I am full zerker I am crucified the moment someone catches onto it. The only people who do this are zerker meta enthusiasts.

Optimizing damage or your play is fine. The discrimination isn’t.

people who actually are PHIW accepts people who min max if that is how you want to play because its play how you want. PHIW does not look down on people who min max but the zerker meta people look down on us for choosing not to do so to the standards of the zerker meta.

It’s all perspective. Assume that the other side (whether you’re PHIW or ‘meta’) knows how to play and knows what they’re doing and why.

If their playstyles don’t match, don’t play with them, but don’t call them bad for playign differently.

This is the entire core of the hate, and yeah it’s mutual.

Dub.1273:

Obtena.7952:

Having a Inspect Gear option would do NOTHING to force players into min-maxing … except making those players LEAVE GW2.

Seems like a great thing to happen.

If your ignorant I guess. How long do you think the game would last if it didn’t appeal to it’s core market anymore?

The moment I wanna play around with a condi mesmer out of curiosity in fractals, or start using weapons on my warrior that isn’t axe/mace + greatsword like a mace/shield missile deflection build EVEN if I am full zerker I am crucified the moment someone catches onto it. The only people who do this are zerker meta enthusiasts.

strange, I’ve pugged on condi warrior, I’ve taken shield out on one or two occasions and other off-meta weapon choices and haven’t been crucified for it.

then again, I don’t join “ZERK ONLY” groups.

Windsagio.1340:

maha.7902:

Windsagio.1340:

In general, this thread is a ‘why do they hate us?’

I find in my own life that the most common answer to that question is ’it’s because I’m being obnoxious’.

That’s the thing I’d like to have folks get out of this. As easy as it is to look outward and blame/insult others it’s much more useful, if you actually care about fixing the situation, to look inwards

so what was it you were trying to say about the people in the guild I’m in again?

I regret the reference, don’t wanna get into a flame war.

lol, can’t even dignify me with an actual response.

for the record, it’s the guild you named which is what releases a whole load of video guides on different classes, and in the past how to even perform dungeon paths (like, strife era).

and then you’ve got people like me who read posts on here of some guy who wanted to know how to solo lupicus with no energy sigils (couldn’t afford them) so I booted up my game and sent two of them over to him.

but sure, we’re filthy scum.

want to know why people here are fed up of “casuals” and whatever other perjoratives they throw around? it’s because of attitudes like this. you bust your balls to help the community and then you get it thrown in your face because people don’t know what they’re talking about and would rather trash talk groups of people who they don’t even understand. not saying the other end of it (the side referring to others as casuals, etc.) is in the right, but regardless.

it’s irritating.

IllegalChocolate.6938:

And this is why the zerker meta receives so much hate.

IllegalChocolate.6938:

PHIW does not look down on people who min max but the zerker meta people look down on us for choosing not to do so to the standards of the zerker meta.

Who know that these two statement contradict themselves. PHIW hate zerker meta because they accept it, but get look down by zerker meta??

Nothing is white and black. The majority of PHIW and Zerk Meta player don’t give a crap about what other people are running. Most of them just pug and go through the dungeon with no problem even when they play together. Most Zerk Meta are not 100% optimized and most PHIW don’t play a full cleric staff guardian either. They are closer what we can think after looking at the forum.

Then you have those who don’t care about the other group, but don’t really want to play with it. PHIW that don’t want to skip, stack, hear about dps or revive dead zerker. Zerk Meta that don’t want to carry someone with bad dps or profession that don’t use advanced tactic or bring the utilities/support that he expect from other profession.

But finally you have toxic people on both side. PHIW that create anti-zerk/meta subject every single day and hate on it like it’s something that broke the game and should be ban. Zerk meta that are look down and think they are better than everyone, talking about dps all the time and view any non meta build as pure garbage.

Nobody group is more or less at fault than the other here. Just more or less toxic people on both sides that kind of ruin it for everybody.

IllegalChocolate.6938:

Harper.4173:

This is because people secretly – in the back of their mid whether they’re aware of it or not are jealous. They’re mad because someone is doing something they can’t.
Someone is playing well, being “more of a hero” than they are.

MMOs are about an empowerment fantasy. Fighting and killing Lupi as a 5 man PHIW casual party feels like a huge achievement for them (since Lupi is big and seems scary) so when they see someone can solo it – even with more mobs added they’re going to have that fantasy ruined to some extent.

See up until that moment they felt like the most special snowflakes in the world but once that person has shown them just what he can do and how good he is by soloing it they’re getting a cold bucket of water to the face.
They’re no longer the “awesome heroes that win at everything forever” because they now have a different standard that they compare themselves to.

People say they play MMOs for their own fun, for the social aspect and what not but people lie – to others and to themselves. Most people play MMOs in order to openly or secretly compete with others.
Otherwise you’d be playing an RPG.

And when others do significantly better than you, you take it personal. You start hating and looking for reasons why it happened.

That’s why you get :

“Zerker is exploiting” or " stacking is cheating" or “skiping is cheating” because they’re crutches used to dismiss what those people are doing and achieving.
By applying this logic and putting them in the “they’re playing the game wrong” you can still safely delude yourself that you’re one of the best out of those who are playing it “right” and thus you can become the hero again.

That’s pretty much how these people think and feel.

And this is why the zerker meta receives so much hate.

The people who bolster about it come off as if their the only ones who study and practice the game. They come off as if they are only ones who know how to properly use active defense measures or pour their energy into perfecting their boss solos or know numbers or at worst, know how to operate their base functionality to play the game properly.

The zerker meta isn’t just some meta game min maxing. Its a religious practice of blind hate empowerment. This post that was quoted is sheer proof of this.

The moment I wanna play around with a condi mesmer out of curiosity in fractals, or start using weapons on my warrior that isn’t axe/mace + greatsword like a mace/shield missile deflection build EVEN if I am full zerker I am crucified the moment someone catches onto it. The only people who do this are zerker meta enthusiasts.

Optimizing damage or your play is fine. The discrimination isn’t.

people who actually are PHIW accepts people who min max if that is how you want to play because its play how you want. PHIW does not look down on people who min max but the zerker meta people look down on us for choosing not to do so to the standards of the zerker meta.

And your post just demonstrates the hate from the other side.

And, yeah, people do join “zerker” advertised groups just to lecture people about how they’re elitists and are ruining the game. So, no, the idea that it’s just zerkers who are self righteous kittens is quite false.

As someone playing in full zerk gear, the replies in this thread bashing “filthy casuals” and “special snowflakes” are pretty much why the majority of players in the game think zerkonly players are jerks.

Going by this thread, who’d blame them? I sure can’t.

We’d have a better community without the circlejerk about eeeevil non-zerkplayers. Then we’d have less hostility all around. Which would make it much easier for people to accept GOOD advice on how to improve their play – such as improving the usage of dodge and using zerk/assassin gear.

The people waxing on and on about the eeevil casuals? Not helping – all they are doing is failing at trying to boost their fragile egos.
To be honest, I rather have a sword/shield warrior in soldier gear along than a person who goes on about wrongclass/necros/nonzerk gear the entire run. I can carry the former easily, while the latter just makes the run annoying.

Windsagio.1340:

In general, this thread is a ‘why do they hate us?’

I find in my own life that the most common answer to that question is ’it’s because I’m being obnoxious’.

That’s the thing I’d like to have folks get out of this. As easy as it is to look outward and blame/insult others it’s much more useful, if you actually care about fixing the situation, to look inwards

I’m not so much interested in not being hated as I am in not having to deal with these people at all.
The question for me is “Why do they keep joining the wrong group and what more can I do to stop them?”

Haters gonna hate. I was told a number of people in this game hates me even though I barely interacted with them o_0, let alone had a conversation with them lol.

IllegalChocolate.6938:

And this is why the zerker meta receives so much hate.

The people who bolster about it come off as if their the only ones who study and practice the game. They come off as if they are only ones who know how to properly use active defense measures or pour their energy into perfecting their boss solos or know numbers or at worst, know how to operate their base functionality to play the game properly.

The zerker meta isn’t just some meta game min maxing. Its a religious practice of blind hate empowerment. This post that was quoted is sheer proof of this.

The moment I wanna play around with a condi mesmer out of curiosity in fractals, or start using weapons on my warrior that isn’t axe/mace + greatsword like a mace/shield missile deflection build EVEN if I am full zerker I am crucified the moment someone catches onto it. The only people who do this are zerker meta enthusiasts.

Optimizing damage or your play is fine. The discrimination isn’t.

people who actually are PHIW accepts people who min max if that is how you want to play because its play how you want. PHIW does not look down on people who min max but the zerker meta people look down on us for choosing not to do so to the standards of the zerker meta.

My post is nothing but an explanation of what’s going on. It’s common sense.
People are selfish and ultimately want validation. When people find out they aren’t special they become angry/sad/frustrated.

This isn’t just video-game or GW2 related. It’s a real life phenomenon that happens every day.

People might consider something cool or fun but if someone else does it better the tendency of the majority is to start finding excuses for why they’re being outperformed and generally to dislike the person who’s doing it.

Ever heard the phrase “you’re making the rest of us feel bad?” – that’s exactly what’s going on here. People are being forced to confront the fact that they’re not the heroes they thought themselves to be.

The post I made is not “evidence” of me hating anyone. It’s a pretty obvious and clear explanation of how people work. I happen to study people and thus have a good understanding of them.

This is again – not about “religious fanaticism” or “blind hate empowerment” – if you join a group then you subject yourself to being part of that group.
If that group has requirements by joining you subject yourself to them – and to being scrutinized and evaluated according to those requirements.
Otherwise you can always choose not to join and make your own or join one where the requirements are to your liking.

This is not about “discrimination” it is about people respecting other people’s rights to play the way they want.

If I make a group that is full meta zerker then I expect :

1.People to play only meta builds.
2.People to have only zerker gear.

If you fail to meet these two criteria then I will kick you. It has nothing to do with you personally – I do not hate you and I don’t want to discriminate but it is my right to choose with whom I play and I choose to not play with you since you cannot meet the criteria I requested.
On top of that If you know you don’t meet them and join anyway that also tells me you either have a problem in communicating ( can’t read or comprehend) or in showing other people due courtesy – in which case I most definitely will not want to play with you.

I cannot stress this enough : I do not look down on you – I simply want nothing to do with you – that is my only wish and dream – that we never meet and never play together.

maha.7902:

Windsagio.1340:

maha.7902:

Windsagio.1340:

In general, this thread is a ‘why do they hate us?’

I find in my own life that the most common answer to that question is ’it’s because I’m being obnoxious’.

That’s the thing I’d like to have folks get out of this. As easy as it is to look outward and blame/insult others it’s much more useful, if you actually care about fixing the situation, to look inwards

so what was it you were trying to say about the people in the guild I’m in again?

I regret the reference, don’t wanna get into a flame war.

lol, can’t even dignify me with an actual response.

for the record, it’s the guild you named which is what releases a whole load of video guides on different classes, and in the past how to even perform dungeon paths (like, strife era).

and then you’ve got people like me who read posts on here of some guy who wanted to know how to solo lupicus with no energy sigils (couldn’t afford them) so I booted up my game and sent two of them over to him.

but sure, we’re filthy scum.

want to know why people here are fed up of “casuals” and whatever other perjoratives they throw around? it’s because of attitudes like this. you bust your balls to help the community and then you get it thrown in your face because people don’t know what they’re talking about and would rather trash talk groups of people who they don’t even understand. not saying the other end of it (the side referring to others as casuals, etc.) is in the right, but regardless.

it’s irritating.

And this is exactly why I don’t teach people anything in this game anymore.
And why I don’t take new players in parties anymore.

Obtena.7952:

Dub.1273:

Obtena.7952:

Having a Inspect Gear option would do NOTHING to force players into min-maxing … except making those players LEAVE GW2.

Seems like a great thing to happen.

If your ignorant I guess. How long do you think the game would last if it didn’t appeal to it’s core market anymore?

you’re*

@Harper

1) It’s a lot about how you do it. I’ve seen polite kicks, I’ve seen silent kicks, I’ve seen angry/mocking kicks. Of course some people are going to flip out no matter what, such is the internet.

2) This conflict is almost exclusively a forum thing. There’s a small number (as mentioned above) that get all ants-in-the-pants on it in game, but it’s really a metaconflict.

Edit: And in the forum side, there’s plenty of people that do vocally and aggressively look down on these people.

Edit2: I haven’t actually managed to get kicked from a group, dunno how I’d react (the one thing I do know is that it wouldn’t be by harassing the person that kicked me)

Harper.4173:

IllegalChocolate.6938:

And this is why the zerker meta receives so much hate.

The people who bolster about it come off as if their the only ones who study and practice the game. They come off as if they are only ones who know how to properly use active defense measures or pour their energy into perfecting their boss solos or know numbers or at worst, know how to operate their base functionality to play the game properly.

The zerker meta isn’t just some meta game min maxing. Its a religious practice of blind hate empowerment. This post that was quoted is sheer proof of this.

The moment I wanna play around with a condi mesmer out of curiosity in fractals, or start using weapons on my warrior that isn’t axe/mace + greatsword like a mace/shield missile deflection build EVEN if I am full zerker I am crucified the moment someone catches onto it. The only people who do this are zerker meta enthusiasts.

Optimizing damage or your play is fine. The discrimination isn’t.

people who actually are PHIW accepts people who min max if that is how you want to play because its play how you want. PHIW does not look down on people who min max but the zerker meta people look down on us for choosing not to do so to the standards of the zerker meta.

My post is nothing but an explanation of what’s going on. It’s common sense.
People are selfish and ultimately want validation. When people find out they aren’t special they become angry/sad/frustrated.

This isn’t just video-game or GW2 related. It’s a real life phenomenon that happens every day.

People might consider something cool or fun but if someone else does it better the tendency of the majority is to start finding excuses for why they’re being outperformed and generally to dislike the person who’s doing it.

Ever heard the phrase “you’re making the rest of us feel bad?” – that’s exactly what’s going on here. People are being forced to confront the fact that they’re not the heroes they thought themselves to be.

The post I made is not “evidence” of me hating anyone. It’s a pretty obvious and clear explanation of how people work. I happen to study people and thus have a good understanding of them.

This is again – not about “religious fanaticism” or “blind hate empowerment” – if you join a group then you subject yourself to being part of that group.
If that group has requirements by joining you subject yourself to them – and to being scrutinized and evaluated according to those requirements.
Otherwise you can always choose not to join and make your own or join one where the requirements are to your liking.

This is not about “discrimination” it is about people respecting other people’s rights to play the way they want.

If I make a group that is full meta zerker then I expect :

1.People to play only meta builds.
2.People to have only zerker gear.

If you fail to meet these two criteria then I will kick you. It has nothing to do with you personally – I do not hate you and I don’t want to discriminate but it is my right to choose with whom I play and I choose to not play with you since you cannot meet the criteria I requested.
On top of that If you know you don’t meet them and join anyway that also tells me you either have a problem in communicating ( can’t read or comprehend) or in showing other people due courtesy – in which case I most definitely will not want to play with you.

I cannot stress this enough : I do not look down on you – I simply want nothing to do with you – that is my only wish and dream – that we never meet and never play together.

Wasn’t that the very same excuse white supremacist store owners used against black people when they refuse to service them?

This situation happened during one of my pug fractal. The LFG was Zerk, Ping leggings. Only until the second fractal did we realized that we have a Shoutbow (zerker?! I don’t even) with an absolute hate of Banners. No banners from her, as the matter of fact. The group respected her resolution and firmly asked her to swap to thief in the beginning of the third fractal. Even when I found the situation hilarious, I was quite astonished at how people treated each others out of respect without any actual mud slinging.

Maybe the “hate” isn’t even real…

EcoRI.9273:

Wasn’t that the very same excuse white supremacist store owners used against black people when they refuse to service them?

Ok seriously dude, that’s kitten’d up.

Windsagio.1340:

EcoRI.9273:

Wasn’t that the very same excuse white supremacist store owners used against black people when they refuse to service them?

Ok seriously dude, that’s kitten’d up.

Was that an inappropriate comparison? I am morally ignorant. All I read was summed up as “I don’t want your kind(non zerkers) here” and immediately thought of that.

Well it’s not a comparison I’d be comfortable making, and that’s probably saying something ><

Welcome to the Dungeon subforum Windsagio, where you might see some things as completely inappropriate, well, that’s just the way we roll here

GW2 advertised to get rid of everything, that MMO players got tired of, including lack diversity. When it launched, most players where pretty comfortable with the fact, that anything kinda worked, until they discovered “Why should i wear soldier’s, if i can just move out of way?”

Some people (like me) don’t see min-maxing as a bad thing. We see min-maxing for raw DPS and nothing else as a bad thing. Other mmo’s at least provide diversity.
Have you seen PoE’s skillboard? HAVE YOU SEEN IT!? O.O

It’s just that there’s ZERO reason to do anything else, but go full zerk and melee weapons with power builds in PvE, up to the point, where some professions can’t even find already rare groups to run dungeons with.

I heard, there’s alot more room for experimentation in sPvP and WvW.
Maybe the PvE needs some of the random nature of PvP, by randomizing mobs, giving the resistance to that sort of thing and weaknesses to that and i’m sure, it can be achieved without slowing the game down too much.
Bringing PoE up again: Due to how randomized enemy encounters are, there is no “meta”. Some builds work better on this, some work better on that.

In GW2’s PvE however, everything is weak to zerk.

PvE is merely a game of “Simon Says” right now, if simon would say the same thing over and over again, even if you restart and simon would speak in slow motion, unless you’re wearing zerker armor. :P

Jerus.4350:

Welcome to the Dungeon subforum Windsagio, where you might see some things as completely inappropriate, well, that’s just the way we roll here

haha touche’!

The circle of hate is now complete!

EcoRI.9273:

Wasn’t that the very same excuse white supremacist store owners used against black people when they refuse to service them?

No – because I’m not here offering a service. There’s a difference between having a store open to the public that anyone can enter and having a select group that only certain individuals can join because of the way that group is made up.

More over – he is not barred from joining if he chooses to meet the requirements – thus I’m not permanently and irrevocably excluding him – I’m setting a set of rules on the basis of which our group functions. If he chooses to adhere to them he is free and welcome to join – if he does not he is excluding himself.

Think about it this way : if you want to join the chess club you should be able to play chess right? Those are requirements.
If you want to join a book club you should be able to read yes?

Wanting people to respect a given set of rules that a group sets up in order for them to join it is not “racism” since unlike racism they can choose to be a part of it or not. It is their choice.

And again, many people choose to not join groups that say ‘zerk only ping’ not because they’re not zerk but for similar association reasons.

That part works well except for a few people that get mad on a conceptual level.

EcoRI.9273:

Windsagio.1340:

EcoRI.9273:

Wasn’t that the very same excuse white supremacist store owners used against black people when they refuse to service them?

Ok seriously dude, that’s kitten’d up.

Was that an inappropriate comparison? I am morally ignorant. All I read was summed up as “I don’t want your kind(non zerkers) here” and immediately thought of that.

Maybe you should read again and this time put in the effort to understand.

This is not about “discrimination” it is about people respecting other people’s rights to play the way they want.
If I make a group that is full meta zerker then I expect :

1.People to play only meta builds.
2.People to have only zerker gear.

If you fail to meet these two criteria then I will kick you. It has nothing to do with you personally – I do not hate you and I don’t want to discriminate but it is my right to choose with whom I play and I choose to not play with you since you cannot meet the criteria I requested.

On top of that If you know you don’t meet them and join anyway that also tells me you either have a problem in communicating ( can’t read or comprehend) or in showing other people due courtesy – in which case I most definitely will not want to play with you.
I cannot stress this enough : I do not look down on you – I simply want nothing to do with you – that is my only wish and dream – that we never meet and never play together.

Windsagio.1340:

@Harper

1) It’s a lot about how you do it. I’ve seen polite kicks, I’ve seen silent kicks, I’ve seen angry/mocking kicks. Of course some people are going to flip out no matter what, such is the internet.

2) This conflict is almost exclusively a forum thing. There’s a small number (as mentioned above) that get all ants-in-the-pants on it in game, but it’s really a metaconflict.

Edit: And in the forum side, there’s plenty of people that do vocally and aggressively look down on these people.

Edit2: I haven’t actually managed to get kicked from a group, dunno how I’d react (the one thing I do know is that it wouldn’t be by harassing the person that kicked me)

1. I do silent kicks. If they respond I block them.

2. I’d like to point out that the conflict is in the game as well – since there are quite a few people who insist on joining my groups even though they don’t meet the requirements posted on the LFG.