Guild Wars 2

hello guys, been trying to do raids for the past month. Every LFG requires the player to have 10+ 50+ Li…. how can i find a group if i do not have the required LI?

Well all the raiders on this forum say there are plenty of raids out there for people with no or low li.

Only problem is do you want to kill bosses well that will take afew weeks of banging your head against the wall… I mean boss with others who dont know much.

Edit
Might help to state what class you play some arent as welcomed as others in the raid either.

There are training runs on the LFG, you can also try and join a guild that does raids/raid training. Expect many deaths and wipes in training groups, those who beat the raids also went through that, don’t count on a free ride.

Good luck

Look for training runs, they exist out there.

Also look for guilds recruiting for this sort of thing, Raids are difficult end-game content compared to the rest of the game, and making a static group for it would only be beneficial.

Good luck!

Linken.6345:

Well all the raiders on this forum say there are plenty of raids out there for people with no or low li.

Only problem is do you want to kill bosses well that will take afew weeks of banging your head against the wall… I mean boss with others who dont know much.

Edit
Might help to state what class you play some arent as welcomed as others in the raid either.

I find funny complaining about getting some weeks to get your first boss kill. Its part of the process to start raiding, everybody need to pass it. Just because there are people way far this point now that kill all bosses really fast doesnt mean that you can skip the process they went thought

OnizukaBR.8537:

Linken.6345:

Well all the raiders on this forum say there are plenty of raids out there for people with no or low li.

Only problem is do you want to kill bosses well that will take afew weeks of banging your head against the wall… I mean boss with others who dont know much.

Edit
Might help to state what class you play some arent as welcomed as others in the raid either.

I find funny complaining about getting some weeks to get your first boss kill. Its part of the process to start raiding, everybody need to pass it. Just because there are people way far this point now that kill all bosses really fast doesnt mean that you can skip the process they went thought

Well wouldent be so bad if I could run any build I wanted on my characters but sadly you pigonholed into meta

Linken.6345:

OnizukaBR.8537:

Linken.6345:

Well all the raiders on this forum say there are plenty of raids out there for people with no or low li.

Only problem is do you want to kill bosses well that will take afew weeks of banging your head against the wall… I mean boss with others who dont know much.

Edit
Might help to state what class you play some arent as welcomed as others in the raid either.

I find funny complaining about getting some weeks to get your first boss kill. Its part of the process to start raiding, everybody need to pass it. Just because there are people way far this point now that kill all bosses really fast doesnt mean that you can skip the process they went thought

Well wouldent be so bad if I could run any build I wanted on my characters but sadly you pigonholed into meta

With good reason. The higher group dps the more mechanics you can ignore. Bosses get trivial with more dps.

Take gorseval. Low dps groups have to handle updrafts/adds/orbs/breakbars. A no updraft group literally stands in the center all fight long.

High dps for KC lets the group mostly ignore projection aggro, completely ignore the spirits, and complete the boss while taking less damage.

Don’t rely solely on others posting LFGs that conveniently fit your situation — there are plenty like yourself, so any slots would get snapped up quickly. Instead, look for a training guild and practice until you’re comfortable PUGging. Reddit seems to be the best place to look now.

Linken.6345:

Well all the raiders on this forum say there are plenty of raids out there for people with no or low li.

Only problem is do you want to kill bosses well that will take afew weeks of banging your head against the wall… I mean boss with others who dont know much.

Edit
Might help to state what class you play some arent as welcomed as others in the raid either.

If you’re new to raids and can’t clear the bosses, how do you have the right to complain about not getting instant kills but failing often? All of us raiders had to go through that learning curve.

Linken.6345:

Well wouldent be so bad if I could run any build I wanted on my characters but sadly you pigonholed into meta

This just in…

In co-op content, the group is above the individual.

More gamebreaking news at 11.

TexZero.7910:

Linken.6345:

Well wouldent be so bad if I could run any build I wanted on my characters but sadly you pigonholed into meta

This just in…

In co-op content, the group is above the individual.

More gamebreaking news at 11.

Just in you say, well I could do any co-op content before raids with any build I wanted it just took longer.
If you say I should be able to do that with raids to then perfect.

TexZero.7910:

Linken.6345:

Well wouldent be so bad if I could run any build I wanted on my characters but sadly you pigonholed into meta

This just in…

In co-op content, the group is above the individual.

More gamebreaking news at 11.

So much this…that’s why I don’t understand anti meta people..we’re in a multiplayer player game, so of course it’s important not beeing selfish and thinking group before individual (in instanced content).

Linken.6345:

Just in you say, well I could do any co-op content before raids with any build I wanted it just took longer.
If you say I should be able to do that with raids to then perfect.

You mean in types of content that you can use whatever you want because some others are using the actually useful builds and you hide behind them getting carried to success?

In that case, yes you can bring any build you want in the Raid and succeed, provided a good number of other people in the Raid are using good builds and are able to carry you. I hope they are your good friends though, don’t expect randoms to agree with that.

Also:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/EU-Training-raid/first

“- The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.”
“- Or the one.”

Linken.6345:

Well wouldent be so bad if I could run any build I wanted on my characters but sadly you pigonholed into meta

That’s because if everyone brings whatever raids have a much lower chance to succeed.
Otherwise just open lfg and make your own squad with “bring what you want”. What’s keeping you?

Linken.6345:

TexZero.7910:

Linken.6345:

Well wouldent be so bad if I could run any build I wanted on my characters but sadly you pigonholed into meta

This just in…

In co-op content, the group is above the individual.

More gamebreaking news at 11.

Just in you say, well I could do any co-op content before raids with any build I wanted it just took longer.
If you say I should be able to do that with raids to then perfect.

This also just in to the news desk!

You still can use whatever build you want, stop conflating success with access!

More news at 12.

The other day i joined 80-100+LI Sabetha group while i myself have 40 LI (and Eternal), none of the group knew i actually didn’t fit the “requirements”. We one shot the boss, it was clean smooth run, everyone was happy about it and it felt really really good to tell that group that i actually have only 40 LI and that their LI requirement is garbage.

Had similar story with KC where i sneaked in high requirement group – was also a clean run. They took me to Xera as well despite my lolsy 40 LI.

Also, from my experience so far when it comes to bosses like Xera and Matt, those 200+ LI elitist are sooooo bad in many cases, like REALLY bad (pushing orbs to the edge off platform, stacking on crystal eating 21938219830 confusion, not using action key etc.). They mess up more than new players actually.

Bottom line: LI requirement is a joke and people who want to get carried require those.

@OP: best way to get kills is to join raiding guild. Problem with training runs is that you will never kill boss with those, ever (unless it is VG or escort). You can make own group but if you lack experience you can’t lead it. You can also lie about your LI and link chat codes (there are sites for it).

Shadowstep.6049:

The other day i joined 80-100+LI Sabetha group while i myself have 40 LI (and Eternal), none of the group knew i actually didn’t fit the “requirements”. We one shot the boss, it was clean smooth run, everyone was happy about it and it felt really really good to tell that group that i actually have only 40 LI and that their LI requirement is garbage.

Had similar story with KC where i sneaked in high requirement group – was also a clean run. They took me to Xera as well despite my lolsy 40 LI.

Also, from my experience so far when it comes to bosses like Xera and Matt, those 200+ LI elitist are sooooo bad in many cases, like REALLY bad (pushing orbs to the edge off platform, stacking on crystal eating 21938219830 confusion, not using action key etc.). They mess up more than new players actually.

Bottom line: LI requirement is a joke and people who want to get carried require those.

@OP: best way to get kills is to join raiding guild. Problem with training runs is that you will never kill boss with those, ever (unless it is VG or escort). You can make own group but if you lack experience you can’t lead it. You can also lie about your LI and link chat codes (there are sites for it).

LI requirements aren’t bullkitten tbh. They’re very logical. Ofc a lot of stuff can still go wrong, a player with 40LI might do better than a 200+ player. However, by demanding a high amount of LI you lower the risk of failure substantially. You know the person at least knows the mechanics and has a fair amount of experience. he might be bad but the chance of that is less high. I’ve had bad 200+ groups and good 40+ groups. But overall the chance of clean kills is way higher in a 200+ group.

Shadowstep, you still haven’t understood why ppl are putting an LI requirement.

It doesn’t matter if some 200+ LI folks have less skill than you.
It doesn’t matter if 20, 40, 100 or whateverest LI number you take.
It doesn’t matter if you can kill bosses with less LI than required.
It doesn’t matter if you can sneak into a group with less LI than required and you have success.
It doesn’t matter if you can fake your LI: If you fail hardcorely you will be kicked, if not, everything is fine and it’s ok you got away with cheating.

The requirement of pugs is there to discourage completely unexperienced players and to prevent pug groups from searching and wiping for hours due to those players.
Of course not every “1 billion LI” group will oneshot all bosses, of course some will still struggle, of course ppl can have a bad day, of course some folks have acquired their LIs with easy bosses, were carried someday by the others and have a good amount of LI to get into such groups. Yes, that can happen several times but the bottom line is, it is more likely to not struggle than to set up a group with no requirements and have success with it.

I also had boss kills with less or 0 LI requirements but I would rather join one with such a check because the likelihood of not wasting my time is much better.

Fun part is:
You are still complaining. Over weeks now. If it’s so hard for you to see such groups and you are blaming those “elitists”, then there is a cool option just for you:
Open your own squad – It will fill within minutes.
But don’t tell me that you always get the kill done. That’s more than unlikely and this is why you join the other ones at the moment. Because you know your chance is higher to succeed with these! Don’t lie to yourself!

To OP,

Either find a training group or looking through the forum or reddit for a guild that runs raids. Yes, there are plenty of them that take players from no experience to “elitist” experience.

To those complaining about how hard it is to join groups,

…It’s not. Sure, there’s a lot of groups out there that have requirement (some legitimate, others pretty ridiculous). That doesn’t automatically make them a better group as I’ve often had runs that were much smoother and fun than those groups that were “100+ LI meta-zerk, down=kick” groups that I qualify for. By the same token, having more LI doesn’t automatically make you a better player as there’s no tangible evidence to your experience behind that LI. A single LI ranges anywhere from “I did my homework, tried multiple classes and comps, spent days/weeks on kill attempts, and finally got my kill!!!” to “I got carried”. So, yeah, I agree with those that chuckle at groups that still use this as a filter. Granted, I understand there’s not really anything else you can use to judge a player’s experience other than seeing how often they end up on the floor.

Forming a 10-man squad is a problem (that even Anet admits it as a problem) and it’s not going to be fixed anytime soon. I do make my own squads pretty often at all time frames and it does not fill within minutes at all. You see, newbies don’t tend to join pug training themselves (go figure), or leave as soon as they realize it’s going to be an arduous experience, so every 2 or so wipes you have a 15-30 min average interval to get the next players to fill up your group again.

Exp runs while easier to get kills with, also take a lot of time to fill when you start from 1 squad member, and there’s also the amazing phenomenom of having 6 to 7 people on the LFG tab all trying to find a squad for the same boss I’m announcing for half an hour, and they simply refuse to join on me for raid because it’s not a LF1M or LF2M full group already. I call this the “Chak Gerent” effect because it’s the same with TD meta where people in a full or nearly full secundary map are all trying to get into a primary map instead of doing the meta there themselves.

In the end, it all boils down to the low amount of people actually raiding. Of course, no statistics are available directly to us but it’s clearly harder to find a group than it is for fractals, and not only because of the 10-player requirement I believe. Consider for example that players with 40+LI’s only become a majority among those with 4000+ hours of playing the game, according to gw2economy (which is not the most reliable tool as well, but players with the most playtime do often put their API’s there…). Furthermore, you can look at the raiding tournament hosted by players themselves this weekend: https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/5f7uiv/all_elitists_are_toxic/ . It didn’t have much participation at all (one of the starting brackets didn’t even fill if I recall, it was something like 7 guilds on a 10-guild bracket), unlike PvP where (in spite of being quite unpopular) the bracket was quite large. If these brackets amount to any sample of the actual population actively playing these modes raids are actually an elite thing (in the sense that a low % partake in it).

In sum, and in spite of what one’s guild activity/static groups make it look like, there are not enough people raiding, which is not unhealthy at all for the game itself, but very unhealthy to the raiding environment, as everyone is locked into the “social” aspect of finding a fixed group instead of a plug&play challenging activity like PvP or WvW are. That is detrimental to new players (social barriers being harder than ability barriers is a huge thing on group behavior research), and leads experienced players down the road of stagnation.

All that said, I enjoy running with the 2 raiding guilds I’m part of, both training and exp runs are both fun and profitable, but I do miss the aspect of simply log on and go get a raid done that some other games have. Here it is log on, ask about on the guild, then go sit on your kitten for up to a whole hour until a group of people join your LFG, who will leave after 3 wipes.

maxwelgm.4315:

Forming a 10-man squad is a problem (that even Anet admits it as a problem) and it’s not going to be fixed anytime soon. I do make my own squads pretty often at all time frames and it does not fill within minutes at all. You see, newbies don’t tend to join pug training themselves (go figure), or leave as soon as they realize it’s going to be an arduous experience, so every 2 or so wipes you have a 15-30 min average interval to get the next players to fill up your group again.

Exp runs while easier to get kills with, also take a lot of time to fill when you start from 1 squad member, and there’s also the amazing phenomenom of having 6 to 7 people on the LFG tab all trying to find a squad for the same boss I’m announcing for half an hour, and they simply refuse to join on me for raid because it’s not a LF1M or LF2M full group already. I call this the “Chak Gerent” effect because it’s the same with TD meta where people in a full or nearly full secundary map are all trying to get into a primary map instead of doing the meta there themselves.

In the end, it all boils down to the low amount of people actually raiding. Of course, no statistics are available directly to us but it’s clearly harder to find a group than it is for fractals, and not only because of the 10-player requirement I believe. Consider for example that players with 40+LI’s only become a majority among those with 4000+ hours of playing the game, according to gw2economy (which is not the most reliable tool as well, but players with the most playtime do often put their API’s there…). Furthermore, you can look at the raiding tournament hosted by players themselves this weekend: https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/5f7uiv/all_elitists_are_toxic/ . It didn’t have much participation at all (one of the starting brackets didn’t even fill if I recall, it was something like 7 guilds on a 10-guild bracket), unlike PvP where (in spite of being quite unpopular) the bracket was quite large. If these brackets amount to any sample of the actual population actively playing these modes raids are actually an elite thing (in the sense that a low % partake in it).

In sum, and in spite of what one’s guild activity/static groups make it look like, there are not enough people raiding, which is not unhealthy at all for the game itself, but very unhealthy to the raiding environment, as everyone is locked into the “social” aspect of finding a fixed group instead of a plug&play challenging activity like PvP or WvW are. That is detrimental to new players (social barriers being harder than ability barriers is a huge thing on group behavior research), and leads experienced players down the road of stagnation.

All that said, I enjoy running with the 2 raiding guilds I’m part of, both training and exp runs are both fun and profitable, but I do miss the aspect of simply log on and go get a raid done that some other games have. Here it is log on, ask about on the guild, then go sit on your kitten for up to a whole hour until a group of people join your LFG, who will leave after 3 wipes.

I mean, raids are on a weekly lockout, and fractals are daily. Of course it’s easier to find a fractal group.

Also, I’ve never seen a group take an hour to fill.

Linken.6345:

Just in you say, well I could do any co-op content before raids with any build I wanted it just took longer.
If you say I should be able to do that with raids to then perfect.

Of course you can do raids with any gear you wish to. You just need to find people who are willing to accept your build/gear.

All raids have been done with much less than 10 players, Vale Guardian has even be done with 3. Why should your build/gear make raids impossible?

https://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/comments/56mmnk/trio_vale_guardian_by_sc/

It shouldn’t be "any build’ but more like “any class”. I have no problem swapping my Engi to power if that’s what the group needs, or staying condi. Just take my Engi, that’s all I ask.

Joxer.6024:

It shouldn’t be "any build’ but more like “any class”. I have no problem swapping my Engi to power if that’s what the group needs, or staying condi. Just take my Engi, that’s all I ask.

That’s a an argument I don’t accept for raids. You should be flexible if you want to raid and have at least a 2nd class you can swap to. It’s all for the team not for your personal desire.
There are classes that are easier to play like an engi, so the skill level shouldn’t be a problem at all. There are also classes that are fun to play, just give them a try.

To persist on one specific class is an ignorant stance for me and heavily foils the aspect of team or group play which is the key aspect in raiding. The game offers enough solo content and situations (way too much in my opinion) where you can use an egoistic build or play style. Raids are the opposite, they are a team challenge and to succeed everybody should carry his weight.
Nothing feels better if you can get things done with your raid group and you should always aim for what is best for the group.

Vinceman.4572:

Joxer.6024:

It shouldn’t be "any build’ but more like “any class”. I have no problem swapping my Engi to power if that’s what the group needs, or staying condi. Just take my Engi, that’s all I ask.

That’s a an argument I don’t accept for raids. You should be flexible if you want to raid and have at least a 2nd class you can swap to. It’s all for the team not for your personal desire.

I can buy into that no problem! Its just the blatant refusal to take a certain class, that’s all. But I have no problem being flexible and in fact I am, I do have several “raid ready” toons, so yea, your point is very valid.

Vinceman.4572:

That’s a an argument I don’t accept for raids. You should be flexible if you want to raid and have at least a 2nd class you can swap to. It’s all for the team not for your personal desire.

So you are fine if some class is left completely out of Raids?

maddoctor.2738:

Vinceman.4572:

That’s a an argument I don’t accept for raids. You should be flexible if you want to raid and have at least a 2nd class you can swap to. It’s all for the team not for your personal desire.

So you are fine if some class is left completely out of Raids?

That’s the point I have tried to make Doc…..why can’t there be a way that classes aren’t excluded? I mean I get the being flexible and all that, and at times I have no issue with it. But wouldn’t it be better for all if you only had to change your build? I dunno, maybe there really isn’t an easy fix to this. I mean I can raid on my Engi with my guild, not an issue, they know my skills. But PUGS just run…..that’s the disconnect. But then I see on here that others have no problem with the LFG tool, so yea….kinda sucks. But I am hopeful!!

Shadowstep.6049:

The other day i joined 80-100+LI Sabetha group while i myself have 40 LI (and Eternal), none of the group knew i actually didn’t fit the “requirements”. We one shot the boss, it was clean smooth run, everyone was happy about it and it felt really really good to tell that group that i actually have only 40 LI and that their LI requirement is garbage.

Had similar story with KC where i sneaked in high requirement group – was also a clean run. They took me to Xera as well despite my lolsy 40 LI.

Did you join groups that required 0 LIs and did you one shot the bosses too? If not this only CONFIRMS that LI requirements actually work.

STATISTICALLY speaking players with 100 LIs are more likely to be better than players with 0 LIs. That’s all.

maddoctor.2738:

Vinceman.4572:

That’s a an argument I don’t accept for raids. You should be flexible if you want to raid and have at least a 2nd class you can swap to. It’s all for the team not for your personal desire.

So you are fine if some class is left completely out of Raids?

No, I’m not and Anet should adjust classes so that every class has a valid spot in raids. It’s kind of hard work I know but it should be possible. More possible than to develop an easy mode or other things people are crying for in terms of raids.
The major issue for me is still that we don’t have a split of WvW/PvP/PvE balancing.

But my point stands: If the wish to raid is existent and somebody wants to get things done so badly it is no big deal to make that happen and take another class. You can go back to the other one for the rest of the content + blame Anet in forums or other sources to get their balance straight. I fully support those issues.

Baseleader.4128:

Shadowstep.6049:

The other day i joined 80-100+LI Sabetha group while i myself have 40 LI (and Eternal), none of the group knew i actually didn’t fit the “requirements”. We one shot the boss, it was clean smooth run, everyone was happy about it and it felt really really good to tell that group that i actually have only 40 LI and that their LI requirement is garbage.

Had similar story with KC where i sneaked in high requirement group – was also a clean run. They took me to Xera as well despite my lolsy 40 LI.

Also, from my experience so far when it comes to bosses like Xera and Matt, those 200+ LI elitist are sooooo bad in many cases, like REALLY bad (pushing orbs to the edge off platform, stacking on crystal eating 21938219830 confusion, not using action key etc.). They mess up more than new players actually.

Bottom line: LI requirement is a joke and people who want to get carried require those.

@OP: best way to get kills is to join raiding guild. Problem with training runs is that you will never kill boss with those, ever (unless it is VG or escort). You can make own group but if you lack experience you can’t lead it. You can also lie about your LI and link chat codes (there are sites for it).

LI requirements aren’t bullkitten tbh. They’re very logical. Ofc a lot of stuff can still go wrong, a player with 40LI might do better than a 200+ player. However, by demanding a high amount of LI you lower the risk of failure substantially. You know the person at least knows the mechanics and has a fair amount of experience. he might be bad but the chance of that is less high. I’ve had bad 200+ groups and good 40+ groups. But overall the chance of clean kills is way higher in a 200+ group.

LI requirements is bs. And no, you don’t lower risk, you just don’t – if anything you alienate players from the content. It is toxic and should be bannable if anything.

Vinceman.4572:

Shadowstep, you still haven’t understood why ppl are putting an LI requirement.

It doesn’t matter if some 200+ LI folks have less skill than you.
It doesn’t matter if 20, 40, 100 or whateverest LI number you take.
It doesn’t matter if you can kill bosses with less LI than required.
It doesn’t matter if you can sneak into a group with less LI than required and you have success.
It doesn’t matter if you can fake your LI: If you fail hardcorely you will be kicked, if not, everything is fine and it’s ok you got away with cheating.

The requirement of pugs is there to discourage completely unexperienced players and to prevent pug groups from searching and wiping for hours due to those players.
Of course not every “1 billion LI” group will oneshot all bosses, of course some will still struggle, of course ppl can have a bad day, of course some folks have acquired their LIs with easy bosses, were carried someday by the others and have a good amount of LI to get into such groups. Yes, that can happen several times but the bottom line is, it is more likely to not struggle than to set up a group with no requirements and have success with it.

I also had boss kills with less or 0 LI requirements but I would rather join one with such a check because the likelihood of not wasting my time is much better.

Fun part is:
You are still complaining. Over weeks now. If it’s so hard for you to see such groups and you are blaming those “elitists”, then there is a cool option just for you:
Open your own squad – It will fill within minutes.
But don’t tell me that you always get the kill done. That’s more than unlikely and this is why you join the other ones at the moment. Because you know your chance is higher to succeed with these! Don’t lie to yourself!

No, LI requirement is there literary for people that want to get carried. If you invited someone and you see they are doing bad – you just kick them, done. Don’t need 3 hours of wipes for it, you can see straight away if someone is bad. The LI requirements just prevent players from doing the content all together.

And since you decided to attack me – i am actually in a raiding guild so i am not as affected by LI requirement issue but i still think whole concept of denying content to players who maybe don’t have 1000000 LIs because they didn’t raid from begin with but are actually good with their class and know encounters is toxic and should be bannable. The joke is, in previous guild i was core group (200+ LIs) couldn’t kill KC all evening, training group with people with very few LI if any one shot the boss. If i do have to pug, from my experience so far groups that don’t have high LI requirements were more successful actually. LI requirements are garbage, period. Those W1 150+ LI required groups just want to get carried, nothing else (8-manned escort yesterday in one of such groups, 2 were sitting afk – good joke).

Shadowstep.6049:

LI requirements is bs. And no, you don’t lower risk, you just don’t – if anything you alienate players from the content. It is toxic and should be bannable if anything.

Yes, you do lower risks. The chance of clearing Spirit Vale with a group requirement of “80 LIs” is much higher than with a group of “All welcome” or “Exp”. It would even give a good statistical value. That’s why ppl still insist on them + including killproofs.

Shadowstep.6049:

No, LI requirement is there literary for people that want to get carried.

In all of my hundreds of groups with LI requirements I still haven’t met any commander in the squad who wanted to get carried. Yes, there were a handful of bad apples but that’s the usual trash.

Shadowstep.6049:

If you invited someone and you see they are doing bad – you just kick them, done. Don’t need 3 hours of wipes for it, you can see straight away if someone is bad. The LI requirements just prevent players from doing the content all together.

Of course you can see very bad players in the first seconds of the fight. That’s nothing new. But mediocre ones are harder to identify and they could be responsible for wipes in the last phases of a boss when everybody is more stressed and has no time to actually observe others accurately any longer on the contrary to earlier stages of the fights.

Shadowstep.6049:

And since you decided to attack me

I haven’t attacked you. As you have stated here, you have joined several groups with LI requirements so I’m convinced that you have already benefited from those groups because it’s undeniable that a 100 LI group has a higher chance of killing a boss than an “All welcome” squad even though that this particular group of 100 LI can be unable to beat a boss due to several reasons.
If this wouldn’t be the case nobody would cry out for easy modes or complaining about raids. It’s not the LI requirements that are an issue for most of the people in terms of “anti raids” threads.

Shadowstep.6049:

i am actually in a raiding guild so i am not as affected by LI requirement issue but i still think whole concept of denying content to players who maybe don’t have 1000000 LIs because they didn’t raid from begin with but are actually good with their class and know encounters is toxic and should be bannable.

It’s the same thing with the old “meta zerk” for dungeons: "How do I know that you can kill Lupi in a short amount of time and not facetanking him with your tank class dealing 1% of his health per minute? "compared to

“How do I know that you are experienced with the boss/raid wing/all wings?”

Killproof only? Answer: No, because it’s no big deal to buy a single run to get a kp.
The Eternal for wing 1 only? Answer: No, same reason as from above.
LI only? Answer: No, because you can fake them.

It’s the combination of those (and some others like precursor armor) that most likely ensure you have an experienced person in your squad.
And like I already said, you don’t want to invite 9 players and look out for several ones failing to kick and replace them. You don’t want to waste any second. So, at best you get your kill in 1 attempt, hopefully not more than 3-5.

Shadowstep.6049:

The joke is, in previous guild i was core group (200+ LIs) couldn’t kill KC all evening, training group with people with very few LI if any one shot the boss. If i do have to pug, from my experience so far groups that don’t have high LI requirements were more successful actually. LI requirements are garbage, period. Those W1 150+ LI required groups just want to get carried, nothing else (8-manned escort yesterday in one of such groups, 2 were sitting afk – good joke).

The problem here is you are pretending that your small sample size of experienced situations is a fact but it’s not. Hundreds of pug players joining groups with LI requirements will disagree that your “special snowflake cases” are a realistic evaluation.
You made some bad experiences, we all do from time to time, and from a psychological point of view those are the situations we keep in mind over a longer time than the positive ones.

In the end your opinion of players being “toxic” and those requirements are “bannable” is ridiculous. You can always avoid these groups and you have 0 disadvantage. The LFG is there for everyone to use. Every player can open an own group and start raiding.
The toxic ones are those that try to sneak in and want to get carried while they have never practiced a boss to an extent where it is enough to beat them constantly. Because if you have, you have no issue to get your LIs straight – every frickin week as there are enough LFGs without restrictions and the mentioned possibility to form an own squad.!

New players/players who came back want to join raids … no, ty, nobody wants them.

They ask for story mode raids which allow them to learn raid mechanics – elitists just kill the threads because raids supposed to be something special and “noobs” don’t need to apply or better uninstall if possible.

Yeah, sure, you can make own group but leading one and just filling your role in fights is two different things. Even experienced players (a lot of them in fact) can’t lead a raid and you expect from players that don’t have 1000 runs under their belt to lead one.

Yes, there are groups without restrictions but i also experienced some that would ask your for LI anyway the moment you entered instance despite not stating it in LFG.

Linken.6345:

TexZero.7910:

Linken.6345:

Well wouldent be so bad if I could run any build I wanted on my characters but sadly you pigonholed into meta

This just in…

In co-op content, the group is above the individual.

More gamebreaking news at 11.

Just in you say, well I could do any co-op content before raids with any build I wanted it just took longer.
If you say I should be able to do that with raids to then perfect.

That’s not entirely correct actually … a noob playing any build they wanted was just as unwelcomed in dungeon and fractals as they are in raids. The only difference is that noobs tend to be more ‘put up with’ because there is no enrage in dungeons and fractals, so they can be carried easier.

So if you want to actually help yourself out to GET to the point of playing any build you want in raids, you better start with marketing yourself as a player any raiding party would want first.