Guild Wars 2

While Mai Trin may be the new liadri it kittenes the crap out of my fractal farming plans. Most of the time I spend rezzing or soloing it which takes an eternity and for me to change classes that have the obvious unfair advantage on the fight.
This fight should at least be fixed to have consistent and logic rules if it’s going to be this demanding.
As it stands right now Mai Trin is our new liadri, in the sense that it’s a fight where she dictates the fighting conditions and very special rules apply to her. Right now she is a GODMOD and here’s why.
She’s immune to conditions for the most part and it’s not until she has less than 5 stacks of shield that she takes SOME duration. This makes smart play like using immobilize, cripple or chill to take out the chill out of the question. So pretty much tank her IN the lightning circles and try to juggle her around.
She has undogeable instagib abilities (unless you use sturdier classes). Just…why….

General problems with the fight that make it tedious:
The arena is too small, especially for the cannon phase, more often than not people without experience WILL be killed by the -nowtoopowerful- cannons.
The bloody roof has kitten that blocks your camera. Seriously, liadri had camera problems too, and it’s a total nuisance to get blocked or crammed into corner camera.
Horrik circles are sometimes incorrect AND the projectile more often than not hits you while travelling, there’s enough to worry about in the fight.

Right now the fight is boring because it feels like I’m being cheated by a godmodder. I just strafe in circles, hit 1 1 1, dodge whip, block bullet, repeat. It takes way too long, and it’s utterly boring. Her having undodge-ables and unblockables is even taking out even more control from the player. And having a designated bullet catcher, while creative, is BORING too, because it requires a specific selection of classes to do, and if your party doesn’t have, then it may as well be good game.

This fight doesn’t follow A LOT of rules that gw2 currently has. It’s takes away too much control from the player which is BAD DESIGN. Basically you have to dance at the rhythm she dictates and at the steps she does (cool for raids, not so much for casual dungeon-stuff like gw2).

Finally, suggestions:
Remove the unblockables and undodgeables from her attacks.
Tone down the cannons, both horrick and cannon phase.
Make her vulnerable to conditions even at shield 10 (like the grawl shaman bubble, first encounter).
Widen the arena
Take off the crap on the roof
Add a visual hint on the player she is targetting (like maw, perhaps less obvious) since it’s impossible to tell if near other players.

While I know this would make the fight all “too easy”, it would put it in line with the other fractals. And not having a difficulty wall that equals to a waste of time for some pugs and a fight that just feels cheap.

Well, i can at least help you with a new farm plan.
I’m also pretty good at farming simulator.

Cries Of Sorrow.5864:

Well, i can at least help you with a new farm plan.
I’m also pretty good at farming simulator.

lol, gear gates games are kinda like this. Play more to level up. Farm mats to obtain gear. Button smash to achieve maximum gain.

As much as I agree with you about raising the difficulty in fractal. I find mai trin is such a boring boss.

I am starting to quit running fractals because I find the encounter boring.

All of her attacks nearly 1 hit KO. Teleport is undodgable. Must either block or reflect.

You have to stack while putting yourself at risk to remove her invul.

I dislike bosses with long and tedious phases. Especially when the whole battle is practically a battle with rng, I always find myself with worse than average odds.

Just remove Mai Trin. I would rather fight that moa in dry top than this boss.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/s2/A-new-boss-champ-and-how-to-beat-it

i agree that if its very doable at 50 due to players experience, 3 times out of 3 i had almost to solo her at 20-40 totally ignoring team mates because at lower levels is totally messed up.

And its way easier to solo than if you have 4 party members.

This fractal is great because it shows everything is wrong in PvE at the same like:
- no aggro mechanic
- huge numbers to replace AI
- bad collision detection
- wrong tells to confuse players
- lack of trinity without a real counterplan

but more than anything, developers making changes without any test
and they don t even revert issues fast unless they favor players.

P.S. once again you can avoid the pistol.
But as Always anet made the tell almost invisible (mai lift the pistol and shoots an invisible projectile) and the attack effect (the teleport with lights etc) seems the attack itself.

Dodge few seconds after mai lift pistol and the second part won t even happen.

Its like swamp fractal… they put wooden passages that closes when you pass, and instead you have to jump on trees…. total nonsense.
Luckily they have dulfy

The Mai Trin fight seems mostly fine at level 49/50, my only big issues are the following:

- Sometimes points the pistol at the wrong player, and then teleports to a different one. This is fine most of the time, as we can tell who is the furthest player, but in the midst of battle it can cause people to waste precious blocks.
- AoE bomb section, always hits my bloody Norn in the head when I’m not standing in any AoE, and insta-kills me.

Aoes near a wall are totally random…

You can be hit by aoe on wall despite there is nothing on the floor.

domness.6719:

[…]
- AoE bomb section, always hits my bloody Norn in the head when I’m not standing in any AoE, and insta-kills me.

Not sure if the problem is norn exclusive, but that’s something I’ve noticed too. If the trajectory of the cannon barrage goes through the point where you are standing to a red circle close to you, you sometimes get hit by the projectile in flight. Very annoying.

Nothing is wrong with her tells, but I will admit it is rather difficult to discern them with other people huddled near her (especially if one of them is a guardian). A simple solution to this was to go on minimum settings.

LordByron.8369:

—
P.S. once again you can avoid the pistol.
But as Always anet made the tell almost invisible (mai lift the pistol and shoots an invisible projectile) and the attack effect (the teleport with lights etc) seems the attack itself.

Dodge few seconds after mai lift pistol and the second part won t even happen.
—

If only repeating this would somehow make it true.

Wethospu.6437:

LordByron.8369:

—
P.S. once again you can avoid the pistol.
But as Always anet made the tell almost invisible (mai lift the pistol and shoots an invisible projectile) and the attack effect (the teleport with lights etc) seems the attack itself.

Dodge few seconds after mai lift pistol and the second part won t even happen.
—

If only repeating this would somehow make it true.

^^^^^^^ this lol

LordByron.8369:

i agree that if its very doable at 50 due to players experience, 3 times out of 3 i had almost to solo her at 20-40 totally ignoring team mates because at lower levels is totally messed up.

And its way easier to solo than if you have 4 party members.

This fractal is great because it shows everything is wrong in PvE at the same like:
- no aggro mechanic
- huge numbers to replace AI
- bad collision detection
- wrong tells to confuse players
- lack of trinity without a real counterplan

but more than anything, developers making changes without any test
and they don t even revert issues fast unless they favor players.

P.S. once again you can avoid the pistol.
But as Always anet made the tell almost invisible (mai lift the pistol and shoots an invisible projectile) and the attack effect (the teleport with lights etc) seems the attack itself.

Dodge few seconds after mai lift pistol and the second part won t even happen.

Its like swamp fractal… they put wooden passages that closes when you pass, and instead you have to jump on trees…. total nonsense.
Luckily they have dulfy

I agree with your points. My biggest gripes however are with the clumsy design. Like the false tells, map blocking, projectile hitting mid-air, ect. Those things pretty much screw you over in a fight where you have to dodge everything and getting everything perfect, more so. If they want us to have a fight that is like get 100% in their dance-dance-mai trin then they might as well give us perfect conditions to do so.
While things may not make sense, like in the swamp fractal, at least they are do-able, and that’s all I can care of. Mai Trin is just TOO LONG. If they want a tough boss fight, then sure; just make it SHORT. Making it extremely long makes it annoying since you can have a mistake anytime and 90% of the time I get a lag spike on her 5% remaining hp.
The only reason why I could stand the bad design before was because it was fairly easy to bypass with experience. Now it’s just the kittened cousin nobody wants to play with.

About the pistol, I only manage to dodge 1 of the two hits of the pistol, she always hits me with one part, but it reduces damage to half, which is nice but seeing how I only got two dodges for so many aoes I don’t really know if it’s worth it.

Zephyric Reaper.3049:

LordByron.8369:

i agree that if its very doable at 50 due to players experience, 3 times out of 3 i had almost to solo her at 20-40 totally ignoring team mates because at lower levels is totally messed up.

And its way easier to solo than if you have 4 party members.

This fractal is great because it shows everything is wrong in PvE at the same like:
- no aggro mechanic
- huge numbers to replace AI
- bad collision detection
- wrong tells to confuse players
- lack of trinity without a real counterplan

but more than anything, developers making changes without any test
and they don t even revert issues fast unless they favor players.

P.S. once again you can avoid the pistol.
But as Always anet made the tell almost invisible (mai lift the pistol and shoots an invisible projectile) and the attack effect (the teleport with lights etc) seems the attack itself.

Dodge few seconds after mai lift pistol and the second part won t even happen.

Its like swamp fractal… they put wooden passages that closes when you pass, and instead you have to jump on trees…. total nonsense.
Luckily they have dulfy

I agree with your points. My biggest gripes however are with the clumsy design. Like the false tells, map blocking, projectile hitting mid-air, ect. Those things pretty much screw you over in a fight where you have to dodge everything and getting everything perfect, more so. If they want us to have a fight that is like get 100% in their dance-dance-mai trin then they might as well give us perfect conditions to do so.
While things may not make sense, like in the swamp fractal, at least they are do-able, and that’s all I can care of. Mai Trin is just TOO LONG. If they want a tough boss fight, then sure; just make it SHORT. Making it extremely long makes it annoying since you can have a mistake anytime and 90% of the time I get a lag spike on her 5% remaining hp.
The only reason why I could stand the bad design before was because it was fairly easy to bypass with experience. Now it’s just the kittened cousin nobody wants to play with.

About the pistol, I only manage to dodge 1 of the two hits of the pistol, she always hits me with one part, but it reduces damage to half, which is nice but seeing how I only got two dodges for so many aoes I don’t really know if it’s worth it.

It can’t be dodged. Use blocks.

People seem to be inventing lots of reasons now why Mai Trin is a bad boss. You have to stack. You can’t dodge. No trinity. No aggro control. Blah, blah, blah. Forget all that. Mai Trin has been a well designed boss ever since she first appeared in the aetherblade hideout. What seems to be wrong is straightforward -
1) The latest tweak have made the red circles misleading. That should never be the case. Even if they do not tell you everything they should never be misleading. Lupi should have been tidied up as well, long ago, as his circles are also misleading. Missile trajectory is all well and fine but most players cannot dodge based on the visuals of the missile trajectory, and if they could there would be no need for red circles at all.
2) The damage scaling was broken in the last patch, not fixed. I can’t see that anyone had any problems with the previous damage and Mai did kill people who used the wrong tactics.

So there are no problems with Mai that cannot be fixed by reverting the last patch on her. I don’t see why everyone needs to be bring their own personal causes, like trinity in GW2, into this thread whatsoever.

Stooperdale.3560:

People seem to be inventing lots of reasons now why Mai Trin is a bad boss. You have to stack. You can’t dodge. No trinity. No aggro control. Blah, blah, blah. Forget all that. Mai Trin has been a well designed boss ever since she first appeared in the aetherblade hideout. What seems to be wrong is straightforward -
1) The latest tweak have made the red circles misleading. That should never be the case. Even if they do not tell you everything they should never be misleading. Lupi should have been tidied up as well, long ago, as his circles are also misleading. Missile trajectory is all well and fine but most players cannot dodge based on the visuals of the missile trajectory, and if they could there would be no need for red circles at all.
2) The damage scaling was broken in the last patch, not fixed. I can’t see that anyone had any problems with the previous damage and Mai did kill people who used the wrong tactics.

So there are no problems with Mai that cannot be fixed by reverting the last patch on her. I don’t see why everyone needs to be bring their own personal causes, like trinity in GW2, into this thread whatsoever.

I just want her fixed/reverted/nerfed to normal standards. Anet has quite the policy of not accepting their mistakes so I have little hopes on that. I have been asking for all of the above to voice out the fact that mai trin is currently out of proportion, but the point is just to get anet’s attention, thing that is very hard to do.
There WAS a clear strat before, sort of but now it’s all for their own, running like headless chickens.

You should try to make your text more presentable:

• Avoid repeating the same idea: we got it that Mai Trin is the new Liadri, you don’t have to say it every line
• Bold is here to help you show the others where the important stuff is. Use it wisely though
• Topics, organize ideas and suggestions
• Curses are good to emphasize that you hate a mob, or the damage is too kitten high, but reading kitten every 10 words makes you sound like a little ranting kid (bolding the important stuff)

Have a good day

Wethospu.6437:

LordByron.8369:

—
P.S. once again you can avoid the pistol.
But as Always anet made the tell almost invisible (mai lift the pistol and shoots an invisible projectile) and the attack effect (the teleport with lights etc) seems the attack itself.

Dodge few seconds after mai lift pistol and the second part won t even happen.
—

If only repeating this would somehow make it true.

last time i did it was 2 days ago when all pugs died.
._.
here for example

P.S: we still have 3 workarounds… lets see if they fix workarounds before fixing mai as they usually do -.-

Could you give me an example time of when it’s happening?

I only saw invulnerability, projectile absorbing and reflecting.

afaik first attack is always the pistol
It says evade.

The guy unfortunately deleted the chat that i could use to check the vid.

(i’ll raise the gangplans or stuff like that and she uses her attack).

What i can say is that 2 days ago once again i found myself alone at mai trinn.
I could stay alive for 10 min to kill her and i would notice if i gate hit by her pistol since she takes away 80% my HP and i play ranged (ele scepter/focus for mai).

I usualy as said evade short after she lift pistol, there is also an acoustic tell (pistol shot).
If you see flashy stuff (with a “swish” sound) you are late.

If i remember well the Attacks works like this:
Lift arm
Shoot projectile (evade this)
Shoot a light stuff with teleport (way later than previous)

They told me it works like a thief skill also (or i would say it resembles ele earth dagger 3-3).

You gave a solo video as an example (I guess) but I cannot see any evade of that attack. Are you sure it shows it?

I’ll try next time i see mai to make some screens.

But didn t people in this section explain in detail how to evade that during Living story?

You can evade the lightning not the pistol shot.

Time to give my 1cent.
Had Mai alot the last days. 4 Times in a row yesterday and once today on lvl49.
I really don’t see why her lightning attack is unblockable. I don’t see why you cannot block horricks canon shot. I don’t see why her normal attack hit with 1/3 dmg of my lifepool. Her shadowstep hits with 1/2 for me on guard or warrior which have heavy armor.
Also it seems like there are more canon balls OR the canon balls fly faster in the bombing phase. There are some situations where you get surrounded by aoe circles and almost have no chance to get out of them.

I don’t want to say it’s not doable. We killed her everytime except today when i left the party because the pug was horrible and i saw no way we could make it.

Why the hell did you buff her like this? She is totally imba now. Test what you are doing before releasing it kitten .

Just had the instance owner rage quit Mai Trin after about 20 attempts. The real problem is people not even understanding that THEY HAVE TO BLOCK OR REFLECT THE PISTOL SHOT. 20 times over and people still do not get the mechanics, says a lot about the player bases skill after the game has been out 2 years.

Guardian – Mace block, Focus block, f3, Retreat, wall of reflection, sanctuary, shield of avenger, sword reflect, renewed focus, f3 again! Plenty of access to blocks.

Mesmer- Feedback, iwarden, temporal curtain, distortion, evades, blocks. plenty of access.

Ele-Obsidian flesh, reflects, arcane shield, mist form, enough blocks to be self sufficient.

Thief-Dagger storm, Smoke screen, plenty of evades, stealth. I’m sure thief is painful with a bad group but nonetheless, utility is available to make it work.

Warrior- More blocks than you could ever ask for, mace block, shield block, sword block, endure pain, defiant stance.

This isn’t even counting the option to retrait whenever you please. I bet people who failed repeatedly didn’t even think, hey, I should have a look at my traits and see what helps.
Don’t know much about engi, and I don’t think I have to go into ranger or necro for higher tier fractals since they aren’t as group oriented as the others.

There has been so much fuss over the new and ’’improved’’ Mai Trin, how about a-net makes the rewards actually worth our time. Before long this content will never be played because they see how pointless it is to complete.

Edit: I forgot to add that people should probably move when they facetank 10 or more stacks of bleed ^^

I did a lvl 49 fractal the other day for the first time in weeks, and of course we roll Mai Trin as boss fractal.
We ‘only’ needed 3 tries, but this was because we had one mesmer staying afar and luring the pistol shot to himself, while I was on my guardian having aggro 90% of the time. I know the theoretic mechanics, but I find it hard to pinpoint her tells and miss a couple once in a while myself.

I found the fight ok for lvl 49; people should have a minimal understanding of all the fractals by then, and the level of difficulty will make the majority of players better at it after it’s out for a longer while. But if Mai and Horrik’s damage numbers barely change on lvl 10+ or 20+ (which some posts make it seem out to be), then there is something seriously wrong and it should be fixed.

Also, they shouldn’t be making level 50 “play perfect or you’re dead” level (not only restricted to Mai Trin). I was under the impression they are going to release higher level fractals in the future, reaching up to 80. If level 50 is near non-forgiving, then what’s left to do on the later levels? Increase HP of foes and make it all last even longer? If I’m mistaken and level 50 is the ultimate cap, I retract my words, though.

@etb:
smoke screen doesn’t work vs her attacks, i tried; she completely ignores it

daggerstorm is extremely long CD, she casts her port like what every 10 sec?

the problem with evade is that you are stuck in same place with is and if you get aoe’d by horrik at the same time you are insta dead… so hardly a solution

as far as reflects go, yes, you can reflect her short but then it teleports you to her and you are allowed to eat her cleave

you happend to be a necro? well might as well not do fractals… what kind of absurd discriminating design is that?

i honestly start to think they just test things out on warrior and go with it… not s single thought is put into how other classes would deal with it

Cynz.9437:

as far as reflects go, yes, you can reflect her short but then it teleports you to her and you are allowed to eat her cleave

reflecting is a valid counter since her teleport shot does blind also. It should provide enough time to run away from her

Thief: Smoke screen (absorbs pistol shot), sword #3
Ele: D/F then earth #2,#4,#5 and air #4,arcane shield, mistform

Guardian, Mesmer, Warrior, Engi are obvious.

Ranger and Necro I don’t know.

Dodge her spinning attack where she shoots out electric bolts. Everyone can do it, people just have to reduce particle effects as much as possible and then get used to the fact that this fight requires some effort and doesn’t go well with the “its just a game I don’t want to be challenged” mantra.

loseridoit.2756:

Cynz.9437:

as far as reflects go, yes, you can reflect her short but then it teleports you to her and you are allowed to eat her cleave

reflecting is a valid counter since her teleport shot does blind also. It should provide enough time to run away from her

Except:
1. Her shield renders her immune to conditions if it has at least 7 charges iirc 5 (thx rainbowchainmailguy) and
2. Enemies with Unshakable only have a 10% chance of missing when blinded.

:)

It’s -20% condition duration per stack.

How do I know this?

It’s magic.