Guild Wars 2

IrisTheCasual.3742:

At this point of no contents, please don’t even think of removing any content at all. TA F/U, anyone?

TA F/U had a buggy boss that crashed the game if you feared her. Then it had a buggy end boss.

I don’t exactly miss those buggy bosses, but the general idea of the mesmer boss was good. Too bad they thought it easier to just scrap it instead of fixing.

Jerus.4350:

roachsrealm.9284:

I like that the Mai Trin fight takes tactics, coordination, and communication.

I don’t like that Mai Trin herself is buggy, and the general location of the static fields required to remove her buffs seem totally random. I also don’t like that if anyone goes down, and you don’t want to completely wipe every time one person goes down, you are required to use an exploit to get people back in or they simply miss the rewards.

Why are you required to use an exploit?

My team will regularly pick someone up who died during the canon phase.

A good team will be able to do this. Pugs, however, are another story.

roachsrealm.9284:

Jerus.4350:

roachsrealm.9284:

I like that the Mai Trin fight takes tactics, coordination, and communication.

I don’t like that Mai Trin herself is buggy, and the general location of the static fields required to remove her buffs seem totally random. I also don’t like that if anyone goes down, and you don’t want to completely wipe every time one person goes down, you are required to use an exploit to get people back in or they simply miss the rewards.

Why are you required to use an exploit?

My team will regularly pick someone up who died during the canon phase.

A good team will be able to do this. Pugs, however, are another story.

Naw, Good players will be able to do this, Bad players however are another story.

Purple Miku.7032:

What I wish would happen with Mai Trin is that when you remove all of her stacks and push her to 75% 50% and 25% hp she will either get stronger or new skills, and regain her stacks along with the cannons firing periodically throughout the fight, but just way less often. After each phase, the cannons would increase in frequency.

This is a good idea and along with this they should get rid of maw

Mai trin is pretty easy honestly it’s just painful in bad groups. What I do nowadays is tell people to stay as close as possible to her and then call out when the electric field will come next, every third shot, and have everyone stack then. Makes it a lot simpler and lets people be chickens for a bit.

Canon phase is utter kitten tho

Purple Miku.7032:

Removing it hell no lol

What I wish would happen with Mai Trin is that when you remove all of her stacks and push her to 75% 50% and 25% hp she will either get stronger or new skills, and regain her stacks along with the cannons firing periodically throughout the fight, but just way less often. After each phase, the cannons would increase in frequency.

That would make this fight more interesting. Too bad it will not happen.

Seconded. Time gated content becomes frustrating over time, see Aetherpath and Molten Furnace (thought those ones are even more gated).

• The fight is not hard at all in a competent party with the speedrun strategy, unless you are the one kiting. You just brain AFK and keep blasting stealth every 10s, occasionally dropping an Ice Bow and bursting Mai.

• Whatever arguments you might have about it being hard, just remember, after over a year, you can still relog and get back inside alive any time. Unless your entire party dies the same time or you have insane load times, there’s virtually no way to fail the fight.

• It’s awfully designed with the random aggro from Horrik. Yes, strong teamwork should be encouraged, but when soloing a boss feels much better than doing it with 4 random non-terrible players, something is wrong. The complete lack of controllable aggro is a huge oversight for this fight.

• The canon phase is one of the buggiest and clunkiest PvE encounters of the game.
  Getting hit outside AoE circles by shots passing through your hitbox?
  Cannon shots impacting at other locations than the circles telegraph?
  Here’s an example. I’ve died countless and countless time to random crap like that, a lot more than to legitimately messing up dodges or blocks. It ruins whatever fun the bossfight could be for me: “oh, another cannon phase, let’s roll the dice again on getting randomly hit”

bladex.9502:

Pino.5209:

By OP logic, every dungeons and fractals in this game should be removed just because players already too good and too bored with them. (most of them are 2-3years old after all)
Throw every world bosses event to the garbage too, except 3xwurm. They can be done by pressing 1.
Pathetic request and logic … tbh.

So, the content has been around for 2 years, and players are too good, but you still have to pull Mossman underwater? :^)

I find it funny that you call the OP’s logic “pathetic”, but then rant on another post that pulling Mossman underwater is okay because “it saves time”(???) and the boss is too hard?
If I would base your view of the game on that specific post, you would agree with the OP, and want them to remove Mai Trin (or add a a savespot), because its long and slightly challenging

The irony of your post is that you still taken my point on that post out of context and still keep dragging it on. Get over it … seriously.
The point was, it’s a grey area that anet has known for long time. As long as the group is in agreement that, aka majority that’s the way to go, then it’s fine. It does save time for unoptimized pug grp.
No your argument is all wrong … by OP’s logic Mossman should have been removed too like every bosses and events in the game.
You are the type of person who like to take something out of context, cherry picking. Dragging it on to another thread is just spectacular as pathetic as OP’s request.

Look closely at the game you are playing. Players are exploiting and using bugs from A-Z everywhere they can. Some are considered acceptable grey zone that anet just left out of their priority. Are you telling me you’ve never picked up a glitched Fiery Greatsword? Or enter a mesmer’s portal glitching @ wherever they are? Skipping JP with portal (cheating)? Arah Lupi any1? Glitch bypassed instance door like CoF? Running through every mobs instance skipping (taking advantage of game’s npc limited aggro distance mechanic)? So … why don’t you go ban yourself from the game?

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Safespots-and-Exploits/page/2#post4338224

Jerus.4350:

Why are you required to use an exploit?

My team will regularly pick someone up who died during the canon phase.

I almost only ever pug. I do feel a lot of pressure to use the exploit if I get downed. It sucks, but because it is a pug you never know how people will react to you not using it. It is also a pug, so the fractal took a decent chunk of time, and I don’t want to risk getting kicked. It only takes one person to start the kick, then mob mentality sets in. Sometimes I will ask before the fight if I am expected to use the exploit. Usually I don’t die, so it’s a non issue, and I would rather not ask so as not to start a fight. Still, I wish anet would just change ellen’s ai a little bit, so that all these issues go away.

EDIT: I don’t know how to use the quote system

I think Mai Trin is one of the more interesting boss fights in the game, I wouldn’t support removing it.

It’s way more fun than Jade Maw…

Aleth.9630:

• It’s awfully designed with the random aggro from Horrik. Yes, strong teamwork should be encouraged, but when soloing a boss feels much better than doing it with 4 random non-terrible players, something is wrong. The complete lack of controllable aggro is a huge oversight for this fight.

Both mai trin and horriks electroshot are actually super likely to aggro high defense characters. Put some toughness on your guard or war and theyll stick to you like glue.

That worked like a year ago at least

Khristophoros.7194:

There is nothing fun about this fight. I’ve been rolling it way too often lately. It’s gotten to the point that every time I think about playing fractals I expect to roll this fight.

I rarely die on this fight. It’s just that for some reason it’s really annoying and exhausting.

I find it fun.

RubberDougie.2750:

Khristophoros.7194:

There is nothing fun about this fight. I’ve been rolling it way too often lately. It’s gotten to the point that every time I think about playing fractals I expect to roll this fight.

I rarely die on this fight. It’s just that for some reason it’s really annoying and exhausting.

I find it fun.

Out of curiosity, how often do you do fractals? Because that seems to be a major part in how different people feel about the fight. For perspective, I’ve been doing 20/30/40/50 tour almost every day for the past 2-3 months or so, and the time gated fractals are all at least mildly frustrating.

Mai is one of the worst offenders with at least a 3min time gate for cannon phases and about 30s for the dialogs. Potentially more if Horrik doesn’t open with his lightning shots after each phase.

Rag.3258:

Both mai trin and horriks electroshot are actually super likely to aggro high defense characters. Put some toughness on your guard or war and theyll stick to you like glue.

That worked like a year ago at least

You’d need exactly 1 tanky player and 4 without toughness for that to work even remotely.
There’s practically no way they intended that to be the way to do it, they never tried forcing people into specific stats for dungeons. It’s not even about zerker gear, what if multiple people in your party run tanky builds? It becomes just as unreliable as with a full zerker party.

I’m just saying its actually one of the least random and most controllable aggro mechanics in game

Aleth.9630:

You’d need exactly 1 tanky player and 4 without toughness for that to work even remotely.
There’s practically no way they intended that to be the way to do it, they never tried forcing people into specific stats for dungeons. It’s not even about zerker gear, what if multiple people in your party run tanky builds? It becomes just as unreliable as with a full zerker party.

You’d just find the tankiest person of the 5… Just like in a zerker party the guardian has the highest base toughness because of their profession.

Every profession’s base stats besides HP are the same…

RubberDougie.2750:

Every profession’s base stats besides HP are the same…

You’re right, I have no idea why I have a guardian with higher base armour in one of my tests.

Do bosses gain more aggro to higher toughness or higher armour? In which case guardians and warriors would draw the most aggro in a party.

Are you sure it’s universal. Because I’m pretty sure the ta wurm doesn’t aggro on guard and warriors… he likes eles, necros and rangers a lot.

Rag.3258:

Aleth.9630:

• It’s awfully designed with the random aggro from Horrik. Yes, strong teamwork should be encouraged, but when soloing a boss feels much better than doing it with 4 random non-terrible players, something is wrong. The complete lack of controllable aggro is a huge oversight for this fight.

Both mai trin and horriks electroshot are actually super likely to aggro high defense characters. Put some toughness on your guard or war and theyll stick to you like glue.

That worked like a year ago at least

My full berserker ele is probably secretly wearing nomad then.

Have someone stays down and Horrik will aggro on that downed body almost all the time.

There is no consistency to Horrik’s aggro patterns, regardless of armor or hp values or damage or anything. He fires at both my ele and warrior in groups, neither more often than the other and I have noticed absolutely no pattern to it.

It’s Mai Trin’s aggro pattern that tends to be more consistent, as she always will go for a warrior or guardian over an ele. The only time I don’t get aggro when I’m on my warrior is on the occasion there’s another warrior and sometimes guards. I don’t know which value(s) she aggroes most off of for which attributes but my first guess would maybe be armor.

You guys should do some actual tests about it. I would if I wasn’t so busy with stuff.

From what I’ve noticed:
- Mai Trin aggroes on toughness (armor)
- Horrik aggroes on channeling skills (meteor shower, empower etc.). Probably that also has something to do with standing still, because whenever my DPS team loses stealth for a split second – Horrik is all over them with his cannon.

And I’m just sitting over waiting for the Elemental Source’s crown hitbox to be fixed…

The reason the Mai Trin encounter is poorly designed is that players don’t care for fights where they spend a significant portion of the time not fighting. This is why Mai Trin is terrible, this is why Claw of Fearmag is terrible, this is why any encounter where players spend a significant amount of time either CC’ed or running around doing basically nothing to further the encounter is terribly designed.

Purple Miku.7032:

There is no consistency to Horrik’s aggro patterns, regardless of armor or hp values or damage or anything. He fires at both my ele and warrior in groups, neither more often than the other and I have noticed absolutely no pattern to it.

It’s Mai Trin’s aggro pattern that tends to be more consistent, as she always will go for a warrior or guardian over an ele. The only time I don’t get aggro when I’m on my warrior is on the occasion there’s another warrior and sometimes guards. I don’t know which value(s) she aggroes most off of for which attributes but my first guess would maybe be armor.

just did a mai trin, put on nomads gear and had aggro of both mai trin and electroshot pretty much all the time. it wasnt 100% but pretty close.
that run didnt go well, we had someone ressing almost all the time, mesmer channeling mantras, pugs with questionable zerker gear etc.
so yeah, its pretty consistent

Land of Cheese.2584:

The reason the Mai Trin encounter is poorly designed is that players don’t care for fights where they spend a significant portion of the time not fighting. This is why Mai Trin is terrible, this is why Claw of Fearmag is terrible, this is why any encounter where players spend a significant amount of time either CC’ed or running around doing basically nothing to further the encounter is terribly designed.

That is your opinion. Mine is that the Mai Trin fight is fun in that it challenges people to not mess up during the long cannon phases.

Land of Cheese.2584:

The reason the Mai Trin encounter is poorly designed is that players don’t care for fights where they spend a significant portion of the time not fighting. This is why Mai Trin is terrible, this is why Claw of Fearmag is terrible, this is why any encounter where players spend a significant amount of time either CC’ed or running around doing basically nothing to further the encounter is terribly designed.

>not fighting. Since when is Claw of jormag afking equal to maitrin stack removing.Lol are you kidding me?

No, I’m not kidding. I said exactly what I meant in my comment, “any encounter where players spend a significant amount of time either CC’ed or running around doing basically nothing to further the encounter is terribly designed.”

I’m not talking about AFK’ing (no words in my mouth, please!). I’m saying that at Mai Trin, spending so much time running around avoiding cannons without fighting anything is boring. I’m saying that at Claw of Jormag, having the boss AE fear every 5-10 seconds is boring.

Anet needs to have come up with better mechanics to make the fights challenging and interesting. No, running around during cannon phase at Mai Trin isn’t interesting. No, chain fear at Claw isn’t interesting. Both encounters suffer from bad design.

RubberDougie.2750:

That is your opinion. Mine is that the Mai Trin fight is fun in that it challenges people to not mess up during the long cannon phases.

What fight? You spend more time running around and kiting her in to blue circles than fighting. Biggest challenge during cannon phase is aoe bug.

Fight your teammates. Make sure every hits of cannon counts toward the decimation of their bodies, from fully down to death. Then you can have the entire fight with Mai Trin on your own. Less kiting time, more slashing action.

#Imnotjokingatall

Mai Trin becomes exponentially easier everytime a teammate dies.

IrisTheCasual.3742:

Fight your teammates. Make sure every hits of cannon counts toward the decimation of their bodies, from fully down to death. Then you can have the entire fight with Mai Trin on your own. Less kiting time, more slashing action.

#Imnotjokingatall

Yes unfortunately its true

I always ask my buyers to jump off the cliff and let us kill her in peace quickly for the same reason

Taku.6352:

Mai Trin becomes exponentially easier everytime a teammate dies.

And less boring. A solution for anyone who finds this fight only long because the need of kiting.

RubberDougie.2750:

That is your opinion. Mine is that the Mai Trin fight is fun in that it challenges people to not mess up during the long cannon phases.

More like it challenges you to stay awake while waiting to play the game.

stambogalizi.8356:

>not fighting. Since when is Claw of jormag afking equal to maitrin stack removing.Lol are you kidding me?

With bad enough pugs I’ve accomplished more in the stack removing phase by taking my hands off the keyboard than by trying to get the others to stop running around like headless chickens…

Avoiding red circles IS playing the game, though.

I enjoy ressing people in the static shots with mai beating on me. #nomads4lyfe

Anet really needs to nerf tanky gear its so op.

HoT expansion, you pick which fractals you do now arc out drops the mic

mai trin is a beautiful girl , why do you want to delete her ?

Khristophoros.7194:

Quarktastic.1027:

Khristophoros.7194:

Quarktastic.1027:

Khristophoros.7194:

There is nothing fun about this fight. I’ve been rolling it way too often lately. It’s gotten to the point that every time I think about playing fractals I expect to roll this fight.

I rarely die on this fight. It’s just that for some reason it’s really annoying and exhausting.

I feel like the imbued shaman is worse, though that may be because I’ve had more groups fail at the shaman than Mai Trin.

I love Imbued Shaman and I cannot remember the last time I had a group wipe on it. The secret is necromancer dominates that fight.

I’ve never had a group above scale 30 that didn’t wipe at least once on the shaman. And how does a necromancer dominate that fight?

Lots of sustain with siphons and shroud
Well of Power turns Burning into Aegis, Immobilize into Swiftness
Well of Darkness shuts down the adds (though I don’t bring it usually)
Dagger+horn breaks down the shield fast
AoE damage (Well of Suffering, Shroud 4 and 5, staff marks) helps people rally off the adds
Transfusion can be nice, but I really prefer Vampiric Rituals

I dunno somehow this doesn’t look like a convincing list of reasons, but I never have groups wipe on this boss and I only play my necro. And yes I usually play 30+.

It also helps to know the strategy of this fight really well I guess. I always tell my groups to stop DPSing if anyone is down/dead, make sure we clear all the adds, and rez everyone between phases. But mostly I don’t have to do any of that because I tear down the shield quickly and then I kill the adds and anyone who happens to go down will rally off the adds.

I found that epidemic clears the adds much quicker than well of darkness. I usually tell my group to ignore the adds and light up the boss for me.

atomicblue.1306:

Khristophoros.7194:

Quarktastic.1027:

Khristophoros.7194:

Quarktastic.1027:

Khristophoros.7194:

There is nothing fun about this fight. I’ve been rolling it way too often lately. It’s gotten to the point that every time I think about playing fractals I expect to roll this fight.

I rarely die on this fight. It’s just that for some reason it’s really annoying and exhausting.

I feel like the imbued shaman is worse, though that may be because I’ve had more groups fail at the shaman than Mai Trin.

I love Imbued Shaman and I cannot remember the last time I had a group wipe on it. The secret is necromancer dominates that fight.

I’ve never had a group above scale 30 that didn’t wipe at least once on the shaman. And how does a necromancer dominate that fight?

Lots of sustain with siphons and shroud
Well of Power turns Burning into Aegis, Immobilize into Swiftness
Well of Darkness shuts down the adds (though I don’t bring it usually)
Dagger+horn breaks down the shield fast
AoE damage (Well of Suffering, Shroud 4 and 5, staff marks) helps people rally off the adds
Transfusion can be nice, but I really prefer Vampiric Rituals

I dunno somehow this doesn’t look like a convincing list of reasons, but I never have groups wipe on this boss and I only play my necro. And yes I usually play 30+.

It also helps to know the strategy of this fight really well I guess. I always tell my groups to stop DPSing if anyone is down/dead, make sure we clear all the adds, and rez everyone between phases. But mostly I don’t have to do any of that because I tear down the shield quickly and then I kill the adds and anyone who happens to go down will rally off the adds.

I found that epidemic clears the adds much quicker than well of darkness. I usually tell my group to ignore the adds and light up the boss for me.

I just meant it’s a good option to defend from their attacks since it pulses blind on up to 5 of them. I actually usually just use well of suffering and well of power personally.

Are you using epidemic with a condi build? I don’t even use conditions so I approach that fight differently than you I suppose.

Just goes to show how many great options necro has in that fight.

Removing the cannon phases and make something new like killing adds that makes her invincible would be better, this fight is unbearable otherwise and dying because of a bugged AOE field is ridiculous…

Well, I have a list of funny things to do while in the cannon phase.

If you’re a warrior:
- try to aim rush so that you BARELY stop at the edge of the arena, additional points if you fall down and manage to get ressed in time;
- inbetween WWs, catch the lowest mobility class and follow him around the arena like a guard dog, always on top of the sod – additional points if you get him killed;
- if an ele, mesmer or thief downs, try to calculate the angle and the range at which your warbanner is supposed to fall, then shout “OUT OF THE WAYYYYYYYYYYYY” and see if they move – points if you ress them, more points if you miss narrowly so you can rage at them safely.

If you’re an ele:
- “WTS fgs, 2g pls”;
- do your best to dodge the aforementioned warbanner, then scream “WHY DIDN’T U RESS ME” – additional points for “OMG, this sucks, bugged aoes, i’m so unlucky”;
- fiery whirl down the cliff and squish like a rotten pear – more if burning retreat;
- require more than 1 warbanner per cannon phase to be ressed (/gulp, who would do that, huh?).

If you’re a guardian:
- caused by your previous mental breakdown in the fracs, keep screaming “RECEIVE THE LIGHT! RECEIVE THE LIGHT! RECEIVE THE LIGHT!” 1 point per shout, more if you make someone bellow at you to shut up;
- jump on top of your allies using mace 2, at their protests answer “But I’m healing youu!!!”;
- leap of faith off the edge: “God will catch me”.

If you’re a mesmer:
- slot blink because kitten them, always dying when I don’t, they’re gonna cleanse their godkitten conditions and when I fb I always get ported, THEY GOT THEIR OWN BLOCKS ALRIGHT??? No need for me!
- place a troll portal as soon as the phase starts, the exit should be either close to the door or in a corner very close to the edge, double points if someone falls down;
- unload all your phantasms on Horrik, “blocking projectiles?”;
- pull mai trin and Horrik together, possibly very close to your teammates.

If you’re a ranger:
- “tanking! ops, I forgot the bear” juvenile jaguar dies in 2 seconds
- you, your bear and your ally are supposed to be snuggling together, didn’t you know?

Other classes… I dunno, you’re boring, suck it up.

Now I understand why Nat is so rich :’<

Because I pay him to carry me?
I should’ve stopped playing years ago. Actually, I shouldn’t have even started.

I think Mai Trin is the best example of A.Net’s boring boss mechanics. You have 4 phases and nothing changes it’s literally going back and forth between phase 1 and 2, no increased difficulty, no added mechanics just doing the same crap 4 times.

kokiman.2364:

I think Mai Trin is the best example of A.Net’s boring boss mechanics. You have 4 phases and nothing changes it’s literally going back and forth between phase 1 and 2, no increased difficulty, no added mechanics just doing the same crap 4 times.

Actually longer barrage phase can be considered “increased difficulty”

I see a lot of people complaining about bugged barrage. Can anyone elaborate what you guys mean?

Skady.5916:

kokiman.2364:

I think Mai Trin is the best example of A.Net’s boring boss mechanics. You have 4 phases and nothing changes it’s literally going back and forth between phase 1 and 2, no increased difficulty, no added mechanics just doing the same crap 4 times.

Actually longer barrage phase can be considered “increased difficulty”

I see a lot of people complaining about bugged barrage. Can anyone elaborate what you guys mean?

I assume they are referring to the aoe indicators appearing after the aoe has landed so you take damage before you have an opportunity to dodge. The aoes sometimes don’t match up with the indicators either, supposedly jumping causes this.

Cannon phase bugs:
- Getting “headshot” by the projectiles.
- The AoE circles don’t accurately show the size of the AoE
- The AoE circles don’t accurately show WHEN you will get hit by the AoE, and the actual falling projectiles don’t necessarily do this either
- The AoE circles aren’t always placed where the cannons will even land
- [insert more bugs regarding the AoE indicators]
- The camera sometimes randomly moves into the walls, or the ceiling, preventing you from seeing what’s going on.

I am fairly certain non-accrurate circles is some rendering issue and can be related to your GPU and/or drivers. The thing is that i kited those circle hundreds of times by now and they were always pretty accurate for me, but I always do it solo (while team is stealthed in the corner). Maybe more people running around cause the lag?

Well of course, it never happens to you so it never happens.

The AoE indicators can fade while the effect remains persistent….Not just limited to mai trin but any flame/frost encounter turned into a dungeon for fractals.