Guild Wars 2

Aegis nope
Shield of Wrath nope
Protectors Strike this is the only one that works.

im just trying to solo the 1st story instance and that troll is seriously annoying me now….

Welcome to the world of unblockable attacks.
It seems the only way developers currently have to prevent encounters from being trivialized by reflects and other anti projectile mechanics. And yes, it’s annoying as hell.

If reflects and blocks trivialize boss battles, then don’t add them to the game to begin with, one could say. But instead they introduce inconsistencies in the mechanics.

Anet takes the easy route with Bandaid fixes. Rather then addressing issues that need fixed. Hence the changes to be be unblockable or nonreflectable. It isn’t the first time we have talked about the inconsistency of it all.

http://gw2dungeons.net/

its a good place to start if you need to know a bit more about the fight if you are not familiar with the dungeon.

Edit: This made me think back to this tread, ahhh good times

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/No-Freedom-in-Dungeons/first#post4296742

you can think of running stability and condition removal like hallowed ground and purging flames to prevent fear and get weakness off you asap, then just blow him up

or you can condi him down if you have trouble keeping weakness off you.

IllegalChocolate.6938:

you can think of running stability and condition removal like hallowed ground and purging flames to prevent fear and get weakness off you asap, then just blow him up

or you can condi him down if you have trouble keeping weakness off you.

The HotW troll’s projectile removes boons. So this one probably does as well.

If you have a lot of time to spare and all you care about is defeating the troll, you can kite him to the enemies at Foefire’s Heart and they will begin fighting each other. In story mode, troll will win, in explo, Kholer will defeat him easily (since he will spawn elites that heal him). Based on that, you might want to help either of the sides and damage the one with more health.
Nonetheless, I find troll to be too annoying to deal with solo, so skipping him seems to be the best option.

Creating attacks which make your skills useles is dumb in the very core of the idea.
Why do we have 10-skill bar, when some bosses just ignore our skills?
This is why more and more dungeons become just mashing dps instead of thinking.

tramwajarz.2369:

Creating attacks which make your skills useles is dumb in the very core of the idea.
Why do we have 10-skill bar, when some bosses just ignore our skills?
This is why more and more dungeons become just mashing dps instead of thinking.

Lazy development. Just like the Malrona fix, the botched cut-and-paste of the AC troll into HotW, and (my guess) Lupi in the future.

Relevant.

Awww, now I miss Lucas. I’d almost say that we need a new bingo sheet, but the game is in such bad shape that we don’t even have PHIWs in here hassling us anymore :-(

The only problem with it to me is the inconsistent telegraphing of how skills work. If it looks like a projectile, hits like a projectile but then simply isn’t a projectile…what the kitten?

Malrona’s spit would have been a fine change had they adjusted the animation to not look like projectiles.

Troll would be fine if his attacks didn’t again look like bouncing projectiles.

That’s my only issue with it, what looks like something should act like that something.

tramwajarz.2369:

Creating attacks which make your skills useles is dumb in the very core of the idea.

That is basically what long lasting reflect skills do to some bosses. They make their skills completely useless.

I think the best solution would be reworking reflect skills, but making bosses projectiles unblockable is a good workaround.

In spvp and wvw reflect skills that last lond and cover a huge are are not a problem because players are smart enough to stop using projectiles on the reflects. The same cannot be said about dungeon bosses.

xDudisx.5914:

I think the best solution would be reworking reflect skills, but making bosses projectiles unblockable is a good workaround.

No, it is not, because it negates not just the reflect option but eliminates a lot of other defensive skills as well.
I’ve lost count of the times I threw an Aegis out of reflex just to remind myself afterwards “oh right, unblockable”. And Aegis is by far not the only block skill in the game, just the most obvious.

I can accept the “rework reflects” solution, although “design encounters differently” seems even more useful to me. But it’s even more work than “rework reflects”.
“Make unblockable” is just hastily applied “something” but certainly no “good workaround” or even a feasible solution.

Silberfisch.3046:

xDudisx.5914:

I think the best solution would be reworking reflect skills, but making bosses projectiles unblockable is a good workaround.

No, it is not, because it negates not just the reflect option but eliminates a lot of other defensive skills as well.
I’ve lost count of the times I threw an Aegis out of reflex just to remind myself afterwards “oh right, unblockable”. And Aegis is by far not the only block skill in the game, just the most obvious.

I can accept the “rework reflects” solution, although “design encounters differently” seems even more useful to me. But it’s even more work than “rework reflects”.
“Make unblockable” is just hastily applied “something” but certainly no “good workaround” or even a feasible solution.

This.

I’m not completely against some projectiles ignoring projectile specific defense. I find it cheap, unconsistent, I think designers should have think the encounter twice, maybe not release massive and long lasting anti-projectile fields to begin with … but I still can understand and accept it.

What I cannot accept is their workaround making my regular blocks useless.
Blinds? We can’t allow these to work on bosses. Reflections then? It would trivialize this encounter. Blocks maybe? Sorry, our refelction workaround needs to disable them too.
Sigh, it ALMOST make me feel like a Necromancer.

dlonie.6547:

Relevant.

Awww, now I miss Lucas. I’d almost say that we need a new bingo sheet, but the game is in such bad shape that we don’t even have PHIWs in here hassling us anymore :-(

Lucas left me at the altar. So sad. Miss ’im.

xDudisx.5914:

tramwajarz.2369:

Creating attacks which make your skills useles is dumb in the very core of the idea.

That is basically what long lasting reflect skills do to some bosses. They make their skills completely useless.

It doesn’t make the boss skills useless. Your reflect skill is causing the bosses skill to damage the boss. Your using a skill to turn the bosses damage onto himself. If I were to not use the reflect skill, less damage would be done. Your reflect skill is a source of damage as well as cover from the attack. Whether or not I take the reflect with me changes things.

When they make projectiles unreflectable, that is truly making a skill useless. If you put up a reflect, the skill goes right through it. As if it isn’t even there. The outcome is the same as if I didn’t take the skill with me at all.

Tyger.7280:

xDudisx.5914:

tramwajarz.2369:

Creating attacks which make your skills useles is dumb in the very core of the idea.

That is basically what long lasting reflect skills do to some bosses. They make their skills completely useless.

It doesn’t make the boss skills useless. Your reflect skill is causing the bosses skill to damage the boss. Your using a skill to turn the bosses damage onto himself. If I were to not use the reflect skill, less damage would be done. Your reflect skill is a source of damage as well as cover from the attack. Whether or not I take the reflect with me changes things.

When they make projectiles unreflectable, that is truly making a skill useless. If you put up a reflect, the skill goes right through it. As if it isn’t even there. The outcome is the same as if I didn’t take the skill with me at all.

I don’t think you understood my point. A skill that makes the entire party imune to projectiles for very long is a bad mechanic to pve. In spvp players are smart enough to stop using projectiles, but bosses will just keep the dumb rotation killing themselves and doing no dmg. A single wall of reflection can give 12s of reflecting on a very low cooldown (32s). In 12s you can kill most pve bosses or trash mobs before the wall drops. This makes all bosses the projectiles useless against players, because they just drop 1 wall and avoid everything. Some bosses don’t do any signifcant dmg other than via projectiles. AC and TA spiders for example, if we could reflect those hits the boss would just be a huge HP sponge, that does minimun dmg even if you are using zerker.

What would you say if there was a skill that reflect melee atacks for 12s?

xDudisx.5914:

Tyger.7280:

xDudisx.5914:

tramwajarz.2369:

Creating attacks which make your skills useles is dumb in the very core of the idea.

That is basically what long lasting reflect skills do to some bosses. They make their skills completely useless.

It doesn’t make the boss skills useless. Your reflect skill is causing the bosses skill to damage the boss. Your using a skill to turn the bosses damage onto himself. If I were to not use the reflect skill, less damage would be done. Your reflect skill is a source of damage as well as cover from the attack. Whether or not I take the reflect with me changes things.

When they make projectiles unreflectable, that is truly making a skill useless. If you put up a reflect, the skill goes right through it. As if it isn’t even there. The outcome is the same as if I didn’t take the skill with me at all.

I don’t think you understood my point. A skill that makes the entire party imune to projectiles for very long is a bad mechanic to pve. In spvp players are smart enough to stop using projectiles, but bosses will just keep the dumb rotation killing themselves and doing no dmg. A single wall of reflection can give 12s of reflecting on a very low cooldown (32s). In 12s you can kill most pve bosses or trash mobs before the wall drops. This makes all bosses the projectiles useless against players, because they just drop 1 wall and avoid everything. Some bosses don’t do any signifcant dmg other than via projectiles. AC and TA spiders for example, if we could reflect those hits the boss would just be a huge HP sponge, that does minimun dmg even if you are using zerker.

What would you say if there was a skill that reflect melee atacks for 12s?

This is true — for the good dungeon groups, and players who frequent this forum, but what about the average group that has a mix of ranged and melee and has people running around all over the place? These groups are still pretty common and they need all 12 seconds of those reflects.

I think a better fix would have been to seriously nerf reflection duration rather than make ranged attacks unreflectable.

This would have rewarded skilled reflection use.

mtpelion.4562:

I think a better fix would have been to seriously nerf reflection duration rather than make ranged attacks unreflectable.

This would have rewarded skilled reflection use.

At one point I would have been upset at the idea of nerfing reflection damage. But honestly, I use my WoR and Shield for protection and support. Sure its nice that WoR does damage to whatever is shooting at me. I

It is funny to watch a ranger drop himself in PvP or WvW when she does a rapid fire in zerker armor. In PvE, I think the fact I can block the attacks by far outways the extra damage. Everytime Anet changes an enounter to be unblock or unreflectable I hate the game a little more.