Guild Wars 2

LordByron.8369:

even if this was a L2P issue would be still a problem.

The real fact is that its clear some classes have huge advantages other Others:

Guardians: support, healing, REFLECT and best crowd control in the game, Aegis is huge in fotm any level, means you do one mistake, you possibly survive…or again you can just finish channeling your skill safely without worrying…
Warriors: best DPS in the game
Mesmers: portals, good dps, and second best reflect skills in the game (tested in Pve they can reflect some stuff other classes cannot with guardian exception that reflect everything)

on paper its easy to see why in MOST situations warrior, mesmers and guardians are the best PvE professions.
Expecially without the use of TS.

What you described is exactly l2p issue. The reason those 3 classes are considered 1st tier is because average grp needs their utilities. Warrior doesn’t have best dps in game if he constantly dies and guardian/mesmer gives them that possiblity.

Secondly, you mistakes reflection with absorption. Shield of avenger doesn’t reflect.

its not l2p actually..

Just think to something…
Playing fotm lvl 30-40 needs almost Always 1-2 guardians.
1 guardian + 4 cloths will be hard.

yet there are people that learned everything that can do it to lvl 80.
Its clear their gameplay is made about exploiting (=/= cheating) anything they can, to the point they change equip and traits before ANY battle (just according to other players not to the single fight) and use TS.
For example they can negate projectiles simply rotating skills between 5 players…whereas 2 guardians can do that easily ina random Group.*

And you cannot for sure ask random players to wander with 3 exotic sets in dungeons and think its normal.

You cannot consider these latter as meaningful for balancing purpose.

On the other side you CAN look at the necessity of random high level groups without TS.

They are skilled but doesn t rely on 100% memory.
They absolutely need something to have at least a minimum margin for errors

If you design this game around few team with TS prepare to see it empty in few weeks.

Actually for random teams a guardian is mandatory.
A mesmer can help if you don t have a second guardian
Any number of warriors is also great because the class is forgiving for players so you have less chances to fail.

P.S. i should ve said reflect + absorb….
It seems there are quite a lot of bugs in fotm mob skills when it comes to reflect/absorb the disparity between classes is quite clear if you test each.

P.P.S. * most players change traits according to fights but doing it with TS increase effectiveness a lot.

Meanwhile in Arah p2 a warrior solos this.

(This guy is awesome)

To the OP.

Why do I need any other class again?
This guy is doing 800-4k auto attacks, omfg huge deeps with 100blades and whirlwind.

5 warriors will roflstomp everything in sight in a dungeon. (FotM past 20+ is a different story)
No other class will have the raw DPS/chanelled dps
Skewed high HP
Heavy Armor
Full Zerker survivability
As a warrior.

Sure all the extra fluff the other classes provide is nice, but its not needed.

Once you pass the L2P threshold. You will realize that Warriors are the kings of PvE.
They are the most efficient class to PvE. Period.

I’m sure other classes can solo yadda yadda whatever. However can you imagine how agonizingly long it will take due to lack of dps, with less threshold for mistakes to boot?

Also, I like to cut my steak with a steak knife, not a spoon.

Brangien.7462:

Meanwhile in Arah p2 a warrior solos this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iKy67S6uvNU

(This guy is awesome)

Why do I need any other class again?
This guy is doing 800-4k auto attacks, omfg huge deeps with 100blades and whirlwind.

5 warriors will stop everything in sight in a dungeon. (FotM past 20+ is a different story)
No other class will have the raw DPS/chanelled dps
Skewed high HP
Heavy Armor
Full Zerker survivability
As a warrior.

any other argument is invalid. Warriors are easy to play and are in my opinion either OP or other classes are too weak and needs serious tweaking.

Wethospu is highly skilled player, why don’t you check this heavy armour, full zerker survivability yourself. Full zerker warrior has ~150 more defense than full zerker thief/ranger/eng and ~300 more defense than full zerker ele/mes/nec. That’s around 8/17% damage reduction. High HP is because warrior has no aegis/blinds/prot/regen like guardian, stealth/blinds like thief, protection/regen/heals like elementalist and so on. The only issue is their higher damage but not survivability.

And people say that d/d’s are OP.
Well, nothing against warriors.. But this “only wars or guards + 1 mesmer :experienced” thing is not really welcoming to the new players. Best thing is to try to find own group like people said..

haviz.1340:

Brangien.7462:

Meanwhile in Arah p2 a warrior solos this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iKy67S6uvNU

(This guy is awesome)

Why do I need any other class again?
This guy is doing 800-4k auto attacks, omfg huge deeps with 100blades and whirlwind.

5 warriors will stop everything in sight in a dungeon. (FotM past 20+ is a different story)
No other class will have the raw DPS/chanelled dps
Skewed high HP
Heavy Armor
Full Zerker survivability
As a warrior.

any other argument is invalid. Warriors are easy to play and are in my opinion either OP or other classes are too weak and needs serious tweaking.

Wethospu is highly skilled player, why don’t you check this heavy armour, full zerker survivability yourself. Full zerker warrior has ~150 more defense than full zerker thief/ranger/eng and ~300 more defense than full zerker ele/mes/nec. That’s around 8/17% damage reduction. High HP is because warrior has no aegis/blinds/prot/regen like guardian, stealth/blinds like thief, protection/regen/heals like elementalist and so on. The only issue is their higher damage but not survivability.

I understand, the trade-off of it all but the balancing is slightly shortsighted when trying to remove the holy trinity.

While it is true that warriors have no access to aegis/blinds/protection they do have 2 personal regens (Signet and 15 points in to the defense line) Omnomnom Pies that give 66% chance to heal on crit…(And almost every hit is a crit because all zerkers have about a 80%chance to crit) A invulnerability utility called endure pain, #5 shield skill for another invulnerability. A trait that pops another invulnerability at 25%(no one uses that though in dungeons)….and so forth.

This makes them godlike solo stomping on silver mobs all day with the 3 sources of self healing and dps. protection/aegis isn’t needed in clearing trash when you have access to a potential 10invulnerability and a 3 second block while the other party members bash down on trash mobs.

I admit thieves perma blinding trash is fun…and can pop the most consistent amount interrupts Vs all the other classes.

Guardians aegis and protection spam only gives wiggle room for parties when they make mistakes against bosses, pretty much a buffer.

Elementalists are the best supports in the game, but the trade off is Horrible hp/armor/dps.

If they nerfed omnomnom pies, warrior healing, and endure pain, then yes…zerker warriors are in for a whole new ball game in PvE.

Seriously though to balance warriors in pve is easy and after a few months I surprised they haven’t thought of this.

Balancing warriors so that they need other classes comes down to this
1. Adjust Berserker’s Power so that you give what you take. 12% damage output for stage 3 Adrenaline, HOWEVER…12% more damage recieved from enemies. (The idea is that because the damage is so superior to other classes, you take in more damage as a cost)

This will force warriors to either
1. Gimp their dps because the damage/chance risk Vs. reward isnt worth it.
2. Encourage them to play with other classes because of the risk vs reward in dps can be muffled with aegis/protections/regens/heals/blindness and so forth.

Brangien.7462:

-snip-

He’s running 20/30/0/0/20, using mixed berry pies (which are op by themselves, not because warriors make them op) and sometimes shield#5 though more often warhorn. He doesn’t use other defensive skills like endure pain or warrior healing.

x per fection x.2096:

Mirta.5029:

The ones that want wars only are normally noobs that don’t know how to play. They normally don’t say but its the Berserker warriors that they want. Good only for AC and CoF.
CoE, HotW, Arah normally kicks their kitten
It’s the run fast elitist groups that want DPS only.
Don’t worry, type your own LFG and you will probably end up with a normal group

You sir have no idea what your talking about i don’t ever go into COE, ARAH, TA or any dungeon to be honest without full zerker gear. Only time I don’t is for fotm30+.

When I make a group for any dungeon I always put zerker preferred because as any good player knows dodge is your friend and every path of every dungeon is easily done with multiple zerkers. This is the only way to combat the insane hp bosses have in this game. Anet thinks difficulty means add more hp

Some people actually enjoy the fights and how the different classes interact. Speed runs bore me. I could care less what class someone plays. I care about how well they play as a team.

I run a nearly full Berserker set (karka shell, lunaria, and solaria) on my warrior for 98% of the dungeon/fractal content. I’m usually one of the last to die, not that we die a lot, and I rarely down in a fight. It’s all about skill and understanding the encounters. That being said, I still carry a full soldier set around for certain fights, I’m looking at you Graal shaman final fight, because some fights just have too much huge AoE damage flying everywhere.

Edit – Also subject alpha is a joke once you learn to dodge his attacks. A good group can basically AFK him to death without a single down.

the perfect dungeon party : 1-2-3 guards, 1-2 warrs and 1-2 necro/mesmer/ele
uh…. why is that i wonder ???
thief no, ranger no, engineer … a maybe
i dare you answer this question !

p.s. there are frequent “no thieves” stated in lfm for a dungeon party, why ???

Yet, sadly, the engineer and ranger will be the one to get nerfed again.

Haha learn the way of the warrior!!! Cookie warriors make me laugh.

IMO, if elitist players can make the effort in specifying what professions they prefer, you can alternatively put in the effort to making your own group free of warriors/mesmers or free for all.

I think this is mostly a non-elitist player doesn’t like making group on gw2lfg.com problem.

It’s common in all groups to run full guardians and warrior groups, and maybe stick a necro or a mesmer in there at the cost of one less warrior or guardian. It’s because every other class is trash and, currently, it’s Guardians and Warriors 2.

Mad Rasputin.7809:

Yet, sadly, the engineer and ranger will be the one to get nerfed again.

The truth in this statement hurts me because it’s true!

Engi’s get cool toys which means you can’t be good at anything, LOL.

Mirta.5029:

haviz.1340:

Mirta.5029:

It’s noobish to run full berserker gear without getting any toughness AND accept only warriors.

But toughness is waste of stat point in current metagame.

except that instead of getting hit for 14K damage you get hit for 1K. You can tank bosses, you can pawn berserker warriors in WvW and PvP… If you have lots of healing power you can always heal more than what the boss hits you for and effectively can do constant damage instead of a quick burst of 17K and go down and die.

I wonder how you managed to get the 28000 toughness needed to reduce a 14K damage hit to 1K, assuming the 14K was done on a GC player with 2000 armor.

It really a problem with the defiant mechanic. The mechanic really unfavorably favor dps classes over classes that has alot of utiliy against bosses. By removing this mechanic, warrior will not be as use as theifs or any other classes since cc abilties will deny any boss attack