Guild Wars 2

phys.7689:

you have some points, but your personal opinions cloud some facts.
1) it is not a fact instance raids are replaced by dynamic events. large scale dynamic events play more like world bosses in other MMOs. Some devs have mentioned a desire for raids, honestly i have no desire for raids at all, but likelyhood is it will happen eventually, and it wont likely be in place of large scale dynamic events

In contrast to standard dungeons, raids typically involve large group(s) of players. Because all GW2 dungeons (instanced content) is designed for a max of 5 players at a time, repeatable events (inc world bawses) also took on the function of raids, whether it was intentional or not.

2) your concept that dynamic events are static events, because you have seen them before, is not accurate. dynamic means in motion, it does not mean newly generated or unique. Dynamic means in motion, i have studied dynamics, and statics in engineering and i can assure the difference is studying things that do not move versus things that move.

Ok, so any quest where you accompany an npc is dynamic then. Under that definition even GW had dynamic quests. And rather entertaining ones at that (remember the escape with prince rurik?)

3) it is largely untrue that dynamic events cannot function without zergs, the ONLY events that cannot be defeated by 6-7 people are tequatl and wurm. I know this because i have done almost every major event with low numbers at one time or the other. In fact i would say most dynamic events work, and are way more entertaining without zergs present.

Well, from what I’ve seen there are usually two possible outcomes – you don’t have enough people and therefore cannot complete it (or struggle really, really hard), or you have too many. The smaller ones are doable with less people, true. But those are usually even more static under my definition, as they normally don’t interact with other quests.

4) The reason dynamic events arent hard has little to do with the nature of dynamic events, and more to do with the fact that anet prefers to make easy content most of the time, because hey people like easy content.

I disagree. It is just impossible to demand an advanced level of coordination from what is basically a zerg of strangers. Guild zergs can pull it off with voice comm or just by being prepared/knowing their particular role (so basically, an open world raid), but expecting something like that from a large group of random people is just an effort in futility and frustration.

now, yes, i would say in general pve design could use a step up, and they could have more challenging/engaging encounter design.

There are two major parts of game mechanics (cc and support) which have been rendered obsolete due to monster and profession design. You can use them if you want to, but raw dps with some utility de/buffs is still king.

As for your hatred of dynamic events? while i wish they were executed better, more far reaching, etc. That is not due to the nature of dynamic events, its due to the implementation, some existing dynamic events/chains have changed the nature of the area you are in, the enemies that appear, what other events are happening, and after going back to other quest structures, by and large, is far superior in my opinion, for most types of quests. (although overarching and some personal quests/side quests would be a good compliment to the dynamic ones)

It’s not about hatred. They are static quests on a repeat button, or an elaborated version of repeatable quests you come across in many other games.
The only truly dynamic zones are pvp and to an extent wvw (well, zvz).

As for your last post on previous page, I agree with most of what you say.

But the real bottom line, to me anyway, is how dynamic events make the world feel. In most games, even in Guild Wars 1, I knew exactly what to expect in every zone, pretty much the moment I walked out the door. I knew where pop up creatures and drop down creatures appeared.

With dynamic events, even those on a timer (and not all of them are), I don’t always get the same thing going into a zone. I get a different experience.

I might catch the same event chain from a different point (something that doesn’t happen with static quests). I may get champions in the train if there are enough people there, instead of the usual veterans.

I might be in a zone when those events aren’t spawning. I can even run into other events I’ve never seen before, or find interaction between two events I didn’t know existed.

There are many variables. It’s not completely random, nor did Anet say before launch it would be. They explained before launch dynamic events in great detail. I’m not sure why two years later anyone would now question why they’re called dynamic events. It feels like a red herring to me.

Oh, now I don’t like the game, so now I’ll pick on nomenclature that’s been known for what, three years now? It’s just another way to attack a game, because people don’t like other things that the game has done.

Dynamic events are what we were told they would be. Two years later, you can argue what you’re called all you want, but it’s a moot point.

For me, they change the experience when I enter a zone so that it might not be the same experience I had the last time.

To me, that’s better than static quests.

KarlaGrey.5903:

In contrast to standard dungeons, raids typically involve large group(s) of players. Because all GW2 dungeons (instanced content) is designed for a max of 5 players at a time, repeatable events (inc world bawses) also took on the function of raids, whether it was intentional or not.

Ok, so any quest where you accompany an npc is dynamic then. Under that definition even GW had dynamic quests. And rather entertaining ones at that (remember the escape with prince rurik?)

Well, from what I’ve seen there are usually two possible outcomes – you don’t have enough people and therefore cannot complete it (or struggle really, really hard), or you have too many. The smaller ones are doable with less people, true. But those are usually even more static under my definition, as they normally don’t interact with other quests.

I disagree. It is just impossible to demand an advanced level of coordination from what is basically a zerg of strangers. Guild zergs can pull it off with voice comm or just by being prepared/knowing their particular role (so basically, an open world raid), but expecting something like that from a large group of random people is just an effort in futility and frustration.

It’s not about hatred. They are static quests on a repeat button, or an elaborated version of repeatable quests you come across in many other games.
The only truly dynamic zones are pvp and to an extent wvw (well, zvz).

2) the GW1 quests were always started in the same place, by the player. They always lead to the same things, failure didnt generate more possible options. Whether or not people completed them didnt open up other areas. The fact that i succeeded at an event didnt open up a bridge, or a portal to a different area. The fact that i failed didnt take all the cows away, or turn a hostile area into a player friendly area. Dynamic events change a lot more than just in what position in the map they are. The main point is, what people are doing or not doing in the world alters the world itself, and it actually really does happen. Even though most new events, are less driven by this.

3) from what i have seen most events, even most of the big ones, scale well from 5 to 20ish people(there are a few broken ones which scale wrong), i am talking about temple events, dragon fights, world bosses, boss chains ( i have completed both balthazar and grenths with 7 people) mini dungeons (font of rand) This means people working together using fields dodging at the appropriate times, dealing with mechanics, etc.

4) the advanced level of coordination is in fact demanded in game, with wurm and tequatl, now i wont say these are truely super difficult, but they definately require an advanced level of coordination, and a small group of screw ups can make the event way harder or failable. Also, the temporary event marrionette, allowed a few un coordinated people messing up to fail the event. So it is definately not impossible, or something they would never do, it is in fact in play right now, and has been so in the past. Now you see its an excerise in futility and frustration, that may be true, but that hasnt changed the fact that they have done it.

To be honest having participated in some of these events, although a few players can mess it up, when you do find the right groups (often with guilds and voice coms, etc) it is actually really sweet. And i feel the marionette event design is probably the best execution of a mid teir difficulty event, sure it failed a lot, but it always felt like it mattered, it varied up the experience a lot, and when you won it felt really good.

Ok, so you dont hate dynamic events, but to say they are quests on repeat, really doesnt accurately represent them, or how they generate a different feeling and structure of the open world. It really is miles apart even now that i am bored of them and seen them time and time again. They are still more likely to catch my attention, and make an old area more entertaining, and feel different than traditional quest structures. I would expand on them rather than abandon them, but thats my opinion

Vayne.8563:

I like it ergo it’s fine.

Ok then.

p.s. What Anet said before launch barely counts as an argument (see the manifesto for reference).

But those are usually even more static under my definition, as they normally don’t interact with other quests.

This is probably the most telling statement, so far.

KarlaGrey.5903:

Vayne.8563:

I like it ergo it’s fine.

Ok then.

p.s. What Anet said before launch barely counts as an argument (see the manifesto for reference).

People who saw the mainfesto and believed Anet would introduce a game outta this universe with a technology never seen before, are either ignorant or don’t know the limits of current gaming engines.

KarlaGrey.5903:

Vayne.8563:

I like it ergo it’s fine.

Ok then.

p.s. What Anet said before launch barely counts as an argument (see the manifesto for reference).

Okay so let me get this straight.

Anet says we have dynamic events. They tell you exactly what they are and how they work. They were called dynamic events from the beginning. They’re certainly more dynamic and varied than Rift’s were, that’s certain.

And now, two years later, we have people saying oh look, they’re not dynamic, while in the same breath saying they have dynamic scaling, which makes them dynamic compared to quests that don’t have that, ie traditional quests.

You have talked over and over again about me ignoring points. If you wish, two years after launch, to start a debate about events that DID what Anet said they would in the way Anet said they would, then more power too you.

But to me, it’s not constructive, it doesn’t help improve the game, and it’s the kind of tactic one uses to ridicule and sidetrack, instead of discuss actual issues.

There’s no MMO current in existence that uses what you describe as dynamic events, and I don’t really see any on the horizon.

phys.7689:

2) the GW1 quests were always started in the same place, by the player. They always lead to the same things, failure didnt generate more possible options. Whether or not people completed them didnt open up other areas. The fact that i succeeded at an event didnt open up a bridge, or a portal to a different area. The fact that i failed didnt take all the cows away, or turn a hostile area into a player friendly area. Dynamic events change a lot more than just in what position in the map they are. The main point is, what people are doing or not doing in the world alters the world itself, and it actually really does happen. Even though most new events, are less driven by this.

My point addressed the part of your post saying that “dynamic means in motion, it does not mean newly generated or unique. Dynamic means in motion”. You’re starting to sound like vayne.
Besides, I did concur they were an elaborate version of traditional quests, but they are still limited in the number of possible outcomes, even if there’s a dozen of them. Obviously they’re more elaborate as a single outcome traditional quest which always happen on the same spot, but that’s just about it.

phys.7689:

3) from what i have seen most events, even most of the big ones, scale well from 5 to 20ish people(there are a few broken ones which scale wrong), i am talking about temple events, dragon fights, world bosses, boss chains ( i have completed both balthazar and grenths with 7 people) mini dungeons (font of rand) This means people working together using fields dodging at the appropriate times, dealing with mechanics, etc.

I couldn’t complete melandru (as a condimancer) with that many people, and wouldn’t even dream of trying the others, haha. Perhaps it was the lack of dps that got us, cough cough. I’m not sure about the part about working together …I didn’t see much/any of it, and as a necro you can only dodge so much. As said – expecting coordination from random people which happen to be in the same place at the same time is more often than not pointless. You can pull that off with friends or a guild, or if you get really lucky with randoms, I suppose (and are playing a carry profession yourself).

phys.7689:

4) the advanced level of coordination is in fact demanded in game, with wurm and tequatl, now i wont say these are truely super difficult, but they definately require an advanced level of coordination, and a small group of screw ups can make the event way harder or failable. Also, the temporary event marrionette, allowed a few un coordinated people messing up to fail the event. So it is definately not impossible, or something they would never do, it is in fact in play right now, and has been so in the past. Now you see its an excerise in futility and frustration, that may be true, but that hasnt changed the fact that they have done it.

I never argued the fact it wasn’t done, but it’s more often than not wasted on your usual pug and can only be completed by an organized guild group with a touch of random – kind of like a raid.

phys.7689:

To be honest having participated in some of these events, although a few players can mess it up, when you do find the right groups (often with guilds and voice coms, etc) it is actually really sweet. And i feel the marionette event design is probably the best execution of a mid teir difficulty event, sure it failed a lot, but it always felt like it mattered, it varied up the experience a lot, and when you won it felt really good.

Of course it can be sweet – with the right group.

phys.7689:

Ok, so you dont hate dynamic events, but to say they are quests on repeat, really doesnt accurately represent them, or how they generate a different feeling and structure of the open world. It really is miles apart even now that i am bored of them and seen them time and time again. They are still more likely to catch my attention, and make an old area more entertaining, and feel different than traditional quest structures. I would expand on them rather than abandon them, but thats my opinion

I don’t know about this ‘different feeling’ experience…To me it made no difference the n-th time I’d see the message pop-up (bar for the extra random exp I’d occasionally receive) because for the most part I’d know exactly what could and would happen, and often it even inconvenienced me if I wanted to cross the zone and was unable to do so, because it was littered with mobs or closed off (either the wp was contested or the access to a certain area was blocked). I should add here there are few things as annoying as having way points contested constantly because of these repeatables.

phys.7689:

2) your concept that dynamic events are static events, because you have seen them before, is not accurate. dynamic means in motion, it does not mean newly generated or unique. Dynamic means in motion, i have studied dynamics, and statics in engineering and i can assure the difference is studying things that do not move versus things that move.

The ‘in motion’ you refer to implies a delta with start and end points, as anyone who studied physics would know …

The most accurate description for the so-called ‘dynamic’ events in GW2 is ‘cyclical closed system,’ All events have starting and ending conditions that stop or pause the events when either conditions are not met, then advance until conditions are met, and then repeat, and so on …

This is does equate to ‘dynamic’, in any vocabulary I am familiar with.

For those of you defending or claiming GW2 events are dynamic, because they scale, are desperately grasping at straws.

First, let look at scaling, as currently implemented, separate from ‘dynamic’ events,

The concept, as I understand it, adjusts the number and/or type of mob(s) that spawn in a given location based on a proximity algorithm. Essentially it executes a /supplyinfo command at a particular point in time, tallies the number against a list-table that sets the mob type (vet, elite, champ, etc.) and numbers.

If a number of players run out, or run into, of the proximity area after the sampling count, the algorithm cannot adjust for this until the next sampling occurs, if it does occur. Regardless, the mobs have spawned according to the first sample.

This is a predetermined system based on a number count at a specific point in time.
This is not a dynamic system.

So, claiming a predetermined system integrated into a cyclical closed system somehow transforms it all into a ‘dynamic’ system is just wrong on so many levels.

bri.2359:

phys.7689:

2) your concept that dynamic events are static events, because you have seen them before, is not accurate. dynamic means in motion, it does not mean newly generated or unique. Dynamic means in motion, i have studied dynamics, and statics in engineering and i can assure the difference is studying things that do not move versus things that move.

The ‘in motion’ you refer to implies a delta with start and end points, as anyone who studied physics would know …

The most accurate description for the so-called ‘dynamic’ events in GW2 is ‘cyclical closed system,’ All events have starting and ending conditions that stop or pause the events when either conditions are not met, then advance until conditions are met, and then repeat, and so on …

This is does equate to ‘dynamic’, in any vocabulary I am familiar with.

For those of you defending or claiming GW2 events are dynamic, because they scale, are desperately grasping at straws.

First, let look at scaling, as currently implemented, separate from ‘dynamic’ events,

The concept, as I understand it, adjusts the number and/or type of mob(s) that spawn in a given location based on a proximity algorithm. Essentially it executes a /supplyinfo command at a particular point in time, tallies the number against a list-table that sets the mob type (vet, elite, champ, etc.) and numbers.

If a number of players run out, or run into, of the proximity area after the sampling count, the algorithm cannot adjust for this until the next sampling occurs, if it does occur. Regardless, the mobs have spawned according to the first sample.

This is a predetermined system based on a number count at a specific point in time.
This is not a dynamic system.

So, claiming a predetermined system integrated into a cyclical closed system somehow transforms it all into a ‘dynamic’ system is just wrong on so many levels.

Those who are arguing about it now, 2 years after the launch of the game, 3 years after we knew what dynamic events are, are grasping at straws.

Oh look, the new living world is so popular, let’s pick on what they call the dynamic event system, which many still find superior to the static quest system whatever it’s called.

I tried, and really wanted to like, Wildstar, but I just couldn’t go back to a static quest system. I felt the same about ESO (but I didn’t like that game for other reasons as well).

bri.2359:

phys.7689:

2) your concept that dynamic events are static events, because you have seen them before, is not accurate. dynamic means in motion, it does not mean newly generated or unique. Dynamic means in motion, i have studied dynamics, and statics in engineering and i can assure the difference is studying things that do not move versus things that move.

The ‘in motion’ you refer to implies a delta with start and end points, as anyone who studied physics would know …

The most accurate description for the so-called ‘dynamic’ events in GW2 is ‘cyclical closed system,’ All events have starting and ending conditions that stop or pause the events when either conditions are not met, then advance until conditions are met, and then repeat, and so on …

This is does equate to ‘dynamic’, in any vocabulary I am familiar with.

For those of you defending or claiming GW2 events are dynamic, because they scale, are desperately grasping at straws.

First, let look at scaling, as currently implemented, separate from ‘dynamic’ events,

The concept, as I understand it, adjusts the number and/or type of mob(s) that spawn in a given location based on a proximity algorithm. Essentially it executes a /supplyinfo command at a particular point in time, tallies the number against a list-table that sets the mob type (vet, elite, champ, etc.) and numbers.

If a number of players run out, or run into, of the proximity area after the sampling count, the algorithm cannot adjust for this until the next sampling occurs, if it does occur. Regardless, the mobs have spawned according to the first sample.

This is a predetermined system based on a number count at a specific point in time.
This is not a dynamic system.

So, claiming a predetermined system integrated into a cyclical closed system somehow transforms it all into a ‘dynamic’ system is just wrong on so many levels.

yay this guy gets it!
Thanks for explaining my point in a manner far better I could ever have.

KarlaGrey.5903:

bri.2359:

phys.7689:

2) your concept that dynamic events are static events, because you have seen them before, is not accurate. dynamic means in motion, it does not mean newly generated or unique. Dynamic means in motion, i have studied dynamics, and statics in engineering and i can assure the difference is studying things that do not move versus things that move.

The ‘in motion’ you refer to implies a delta with start and end points, as anyone who studied physics would know …

The most accurate description for the so-called ‘dynamic’ events in GW2 is ‘cyclical closed system,’ All events have starting and ending conditions that stop or pause the events when either conditions are not met, then advance until conditions are met, and then repeat, and so on …

This is does equate to ‘dynamic’, in any vocabulary I am familiar with.

For those of you defending or claiming GW2 events are dynamic, because they scale, are desperately grasping at straws.

First, let look at scaling, as currently implemented, separate from ‘dynamic’ events,

The concept, as I understand it, adjusts the number and/or type of mob(s) that spawn in a given location based on a proximity algorithm. Essentially it executes a /supplyinfo command at a particular point in time, tallies the number against a list-table that sets the mob type (vet, elite, champ, etc.) and numbers.

If a number of players run out, or run into, of the proximity area after the sampling count, the algorithm cannot adjust for this until the next sampling occurs, if it does occur. Regardless, the mobs have spawned according to the first sample.

This is a predetermined system based on a number count at a specific point in time.
This is not a dynamic system.

So, claiming a predetermined system integrated into a cyclical closed system somehow transforms it all into a ‘dynamic’ system is just wrong on so many levels.

yay this guy gets it!
Thanks for explaining my point in a manner far better I could ever have.

Irrelevant point remains irrelevant.

Old system: I know exactly what’s going to happen in every zone as soon as I enter it.
New system: Things aren’t always going to be the same when I enter a zone.

Whatever you want to call it means nothing. It’s a completely different feel from a players point of view. The game becomes more dynamic because of these quests, which also scale dynamically.

Those who don’t like this game are sure going to a lot of effort to say what? That the new way isn’t better? That the old way is better?

It’s a name, it’s been around for three years. It’s not going to change now. I asked the question before and I ask it again now. How is this conversation constructive?

KarlaGrey.5903:

from what you say, i m not sure if you would particularly like dynamic events in any iteration(even if they were as you viewed them dynamic), but thats fine, not everyone likes everything.

As for not being able to do it, you are right, you wont be able to do it if you dont have the right people, working together. Often times in pugs this doesnt happen, but most of the times i did beat these events low man was also just random pugs. Some people learn the events/bosses, and work together better. I remember many times trying to explain boss mechanics in chat, and people just saying we need more people, when a great many times more people just means more people to scale the boss/enemies, and screw up, and cause failure. Often times people brute force the event to the point nothing matters, but that is actually, usually a failure of design. It should theoretically be as hard with 15 people as it is with 100, but i suppose thats hard for them to design well.

anyhow, i like dynamic events, i have played other games since gw2, and even though i may like other facets, the world feels a lot more dull and limited, in the ones that dont have these type of systems. For others, its all useless fluff and they could care less regardless. Different strokes.

Make no mistake, dynamic events without updates, changes, new content, thats not going to entertain anyone forever, i havent played the game for more than a few hours in months, but i wouldnt say that dynamic events effected that at all. I doubt many people at all would say dynamic events mess up the game, at worst i would think one would be indifferent.

Galphar.3901:

For everyone that complains about “instancing” please think about what WoW usually gives you in an update; Raids. Now add up the amount of time spent in an Instance in the LS2 and compare it to the amount of time spent in a Raid. For the “Hard-core” player probably 3-4 hrs a day for a few weeks to get ALL the achieves vs 3-4 hrs a day for a few weeks to “finish” a Raid. Same could be said for a “casual” player except in a Raid they’d spend more time because of “requirements”.

As people (like myself) have noted before that unless the raids are faceroll easy, the overwhelming bulk of the players won’t even bother to touch them, and certainly won’t spend hours of every day grinding them.

bri.2359:

phys.7689:

2) your concept that dynamic events are static events, because you have seen them before, is not accurate. dynamic means in motion, it does not mean newly generated or unique. Dynamic means in motion, i have studied dynamics, and statics in engineering and i can assure the difference is studying things that do not move versus things that move.

The ‘in motion’ you refer to implies a delta with start and end points, as anyone who studied physics would know …

The most accurate description for the so-called ‘dynamic’ events in GW2 is ‘cyclical closed system,’ All events have starting and ending conditions that stop or pause the events when either conditions are not met, then advance until conditions are met, and then repeat, and so on …

This is does equate to ‘dynamic’, in any vocabulary I am familiar with.

For those of you defending or claiming GW2 events are dynamic, because they scale, are desperately grasping at straws.

First, let look at scaling, as currently implemented, separate from ‘dynamic’ events,

The concept, as I understand it, adjusts the number and/or type of mob(s) that spawn in a given location based on a proximity algorithm. Essentially it executes a /supplyinfo command at a particular point in time, tallies the number against a list-table that sets the mob type (vet, elite, champ, etc.) and numbers.

If a number of players run out, or run into, of the proximity area after the sampling count, the algorithm cannot adjust for this until the next sampling occurs, if it does occur. Regardless, the mobs have spawned according to the first sample.

This is a predetermined system based on a number count at a specific point in time.
This is not a dynamic system.

So, claiming a predetermined system integrated into a cyclical closed system somehow transforms it all into a ‘dynamic’ system is just wrong on so many levels.

you do realize that by your definition even real life is static?
I wake up in the morning, I start the car… guess what, there are 2 possible outcomes at that point, I make it to work or I dont make it work. Tomorrow the same cycle will repeat and so on!

Your close system definition is also wrong. Is it cyclic? most of the time yes, but there are other types, some are push / pull and others are triggerable, there are also a few which are hidden and will never trigger unless found and well triggered. So even cyclic isnt 100% correct. Not exactly sure what cyclic has got to do with static though, again real life is cyclic as well, do you consider real life static as well by any chance?

As for close system, a close system is a system that isnt effected by external input and has no external outputs. Thats not dynamic events, you said it yourself. "Essentially it executes a /supplyinfo command at a particular point in time, tallies the number against a list-table that sets the mob type (vet, elite, champ, etc.) and numbers. " inst that an external input? players arent part of the dynamic events yet they are affecting the dynamic event execution hence its not a closed system. Also why is the dynamic event polling for data a bad thing? this is a computer program not an omniscient system. Every simulation is ultimately fake, yeah the centaurs arent really assessing the situation and calling in reinforcements to deal with the extra resistance they found at the town. like you correctly said its the script polling for conditions in its general area and acting according to what it finds so what? The same things happen in both scenarios, the centaurs would not know before going in the area what the conditions they’ll find are going to be (no satellite technology in tyria ) Even if this was real there would be a latency just like with the fakery and the first wave cannot magically boost itself in both events.

In anycase none of this has an bearing on this being static or dynamic in anyway. This makes it scripted, but guess what everything in any game is scripted.

I will say this again since for some reason people considered it irrevant or perhaps just have no answer to it…

In a static quest this is what you get:
“What the NPCs tell you conflicts with your other senses. Mr Woodcutter you’re thanking me for killing all the wolves bothering you but I can see them right over there, if I just take a step in that direct I will undoubtley be bitten too no doubt.”
Thats a description of a static quest..

This is a dynamic event
“freeing a town from centaurs means there are no centaurs in town, not even a painting of one. How can you expect us to say they’re static when if I fail to defend the town, not only centaurs will be roaming the streets but houses will be burning and there will dead bodies everywhere. For the first time what we’re told matches what we’re seeing. Okey its not perfect, these centaurs never give up no matter how many times we stop them from taking over the town but that aside each and every time it repeats the whole thing plays out with small differences. NPCs arent the biggest lazy bunch ever that do not lift a finger to defend their threatened town like in regular static quest, they join the fray, risk everything and die defending what’s there’s. The whole thing is beautiful if thats the sort of thing you appreciate.”

Are people saying these two experiences are the same? A dynamic event will change the world around it as it plays out. How can anyone call that static! NPCs actually die (something that never happens in a static quest), A quest can fail (something that never really happens in a static quest). A house that was fine a few minutes ago can be on fire. You can be walking down the street and mother comes to you desperate for someone to help her find her son. If you go afk for a couple of minutes the centaurs that are about to ravage the town will ravage the town unlike in a static quest that will never leave the field they’re in even if you take a break for a few years. How can there even be a question about this ?

just cause things repeat it doesnt make it static. Hey my country was pretty popular and got invaded 100s of times. The usual outcomes happened each time, we either repelled the invasion, we got conquered and then convinced whoever to leave or someone else came and convinced them to leave. In the 2nd world war we got bombarded 100s of times. People go to school, work, everyday. The sun sets and comes up every day. The moon has a cyclic phase. Tons of things are cyclic but that doesnt make them static. Sure you will never go save nabu Terrance and have the shatterer swoop down on you, but you will never start your car and have a helicopter land right next to you either. Like in real life every event has likely outcomes and thats whats going to happen in nearly every single case. I start the car to go to work, I get there or I dont. Like wise the centaurs attack nabu, they’re going to conquer it or they’re not going to manage.

bri.2359:

phys.7689:

2) your concept that dynamic events are static events, because you have seen them before, is not accurate. dynamic means in motion, it does not mean newly generated or unique. Dynamic means in motion, i have studied dynamics, and statics in engineering and i can assure the difference is studying things that do not move versus things that move.

The ‘in motion’ you refer to implies a delta with start and end points, as anyone who studied physics would know …

The most accurate description for the so-called ‘dynamic’ events in GW2 is ‘cyclical closed system,’ All events have starting and ending conditions that stop or pause the events when either conditions are not met, then advance until conditions are met, and then repeat, and so on …

This is does equate to ‘dynamic’, in any vocabulary I am familiar with.

For those of you defending or claiming GW2 events are dynamic, because they scale, are desperately grasping at straws.

First, let look at scaling, as currently implemented, separate from ‘dynamic’ events,

The concept, as I understand it, adjusts the number and/or type of mob(s) that spawn in a given location based on a proximity algorithm. Essentially it executes a /supplyinfo command at a particular point in time, tallies the number against a list-table that sets the mob type (vet, elite, champ, etc.) and numbers.

If a number of players run out, or run into, of the proximity area after the sampling count, the algorithm cannot adjust for this until the next sampling occurs, if it does occur. Regardless, the mobs have spawned according to the first sample.

This is a predetermined system based on a number count at a specific point in time.
This is not a dynamic system.

So, claiming a predetermined system integrated into a cyclical closed system somehow transforms it all into a ‘dynamic’ system is just wrong on so many levels.

cyclical closed system has nothing at all to do with dynamic.
dynamic means in motion thats really exactly what it means.

Even if every result is calculated the fact that it is in motion makes it dynamic. It changes, Closed systems can be dynamic, open systems can be dynamic. For example a pendulum is a dynamic force, building a structure to properly hold the pendlum is a question for dynamics. regardless that the pendulum has a cyclical and predictable behavior, it is a problem that you have an extra dimension in solving. because it changes over time. Some times the force required to hold the structure is one thing, in the next moment, the moment changes.

however, everyones arguing here, and they are missing the point.
call it whatever you want, define it as whatever you want. It really is irrelvant.

Whats important is not what we each THINK dynamic means, but what any body actually wants or doesnt want from the questing system. So instead of arguing (even though i am guilty as well) about the semantics of the word dynamic. How about people say what they expect, or actually want

phys.7689:

however, everyones arguing here, and they are missing the point.
call it whatever you want, define it as whatever you want. It really is irrelvant.

Whats important is not what we each THINK dynamic means, but what any body actually wants or doesnt want from the questing system. So instead of arguing (even though i am guilty as well) about the semantics of the word dynamic. How about people say what they expect, or actually want

Very well said, 100% agree!

This argument is like arguing over how much you hate Burger King’s fries, but everything else is delicious.

They’re called dynamic events in game. Whether you believe that or not is irrelevant. It is one part of a very large game. I enjoy them for the fact that I’ve been playing since launch and there are STILL events I’ve come across that I haven’t seen before.

Once again, if you are still here, trolling about the “manifesto” and other garbage, you need to just leave.

phys.7689:

Whats important is not what we each THINK dynamic means, but what any body actually wants or doesnt want from the questing system. So instead of arguing (even though i am guilty as well) about the semantics of the word dynamic. How about people say what they expect, or actually want

I think they all want Sherlock Data Holmes

Why we bickering over dynamic events lol?
They are such a casual mini-zerg fest with simple scraps as rewards (outside of teq/wurm)
If some ppl actually consider this endgame content, than wow…going around a zone doing really simple events? You mean those events I go around on my guardian spamming 1 on staff and just looting bags after tagging mobs that die in less than a second?

This game has plenty of that simple stuff, there’s nothing wrong with anet adding something remotely challenging thats instanced … but no, majority of this playerbase just likes casual things where they can just log in and hop on a zerg and spam 1 on their way to victory….

GW2 is not a physics text book.

Anet chose a term (Dynamic Event), in many ways using it as a proper noun, to refer to the fact that many of GW2’s quests are implemented in a somewhat different way than similar quests in many other MMOs.

Some of GW2’s dynamic events are not all that different than other games’ static quests. Some play very differently. Are they exactly what Anet said they would be ? Not completely in my opinion. Permanently change the world doesn’t happen, but it was said.

Were they more interesting when they were new, of course. Thats true of most MMO content IMO. When I enter a zone I know, for the most part, what’s going on, what is happening, what I’ll be doing, and so on. Fia needs to study those gorillas after all.

Personally I think a mix of the big Dynamic Events (note the capitalization) and old fashioned quests (which can be done in a manner that really contributes to a game/zone’s story) would be nice.

Ashen.2907:

GW2 is not a physics text book.

Anet chose a term (Dynamic Event), in many ways using it as a proper noun, to refer to the fact that many of GW2’s quests are implemented in a somewhat different way than similar quests in many other MMOs.

Some of GW2’s dynamic events are not all that different than other games’ static quests. Some play very differently. Are they exactly what Anet said they would be ? Not completely in my opinion. Permanently change the world doesn’t happen, but it was said.

Were they more interesting when they were new, of course. Thats true of most MMO content IMO. When I enter a zone I know, for the most part, what’s going on, what is happening, what I’ll be doing, and so on. Fia needs to study those gorillas after all.

Personally I think a mix of the big Dynamic Events (note the capitalization) and old fashioned quests (which can be done in a manner that really contributes to a game/zone’s story) would be nice.

Anet said that permanent change to the world happens in personal stories, not in dynamic events.

The day after the manifesto was released, Anet released a disclaimer specifically because people were confused. Ree was talking about personal story, Colin was talking about dynamic events

Anet explained dynamic events in great detail on their website, and even more specifically at panels at conventions which were recorded. They said from day one, dynamic events were persistent but not permanent.

SkiTz.4590:

Why we bickering over dynamic events lol?
They are such a casual mini-zerg fest with simple scraps as rewards (outside of teq/wurm)
If some ppl actually consider this endgame content, than wow…going around a zone doing really simple events? You mean those events I go around on my guardian spamming 1 on staff and just looting bags after tagging mobs that die in less than a second?

This game has plenty of that simple stuff, there’s nothing wrong with anet adding something remotely challenging thats instanced … but no, majority of this playerbase just likes casual things where they can just log in and hop on a zerg and spam 1 on their way to victory….

why do people speak like there is no choice but to join a zerg when doing open world stuff? It may seem crazy but you can like ignore the zerg, go do the other events solo or in a small group, its more fun that way… though still relatively easy. At least you’ll have to pay attention and spamming 1 will definitely not cut it.

nGumball.1283:

People who saw the mainfesto and believed Anet would introduce a game outta this universe with a technology never seen before, are either ignorant or don’t know the limits of current gaming engines.

Game engines could be smarter, more dynamic, and creative — but the expense of producing such a game would severely limit the number of people who would play it.

Look at the majority of tablet games: simple, repetitive, derivative in the extreme. But they make money, because that’s what the average consumer wants.

Galen Grey.4709:

SkiTz.4590:

Why we bickering over dynamic events lol?
They are such a casual mini-zerg fest with simple scraps as rewards (outside of teq/wurm)
If some ppl actually consider this endgame content, than wow…going around a zone doing really simple events? You mean those events I go around on my guardian spamming 1 on staff and just looting bags after tagging mobs that die in less than a second?

This game has plenty of that simple stuff, there’s nothing wrong with anet adding something remotely challenging thats instanced … but no, majority of this playerbase just likes casual things where they can just log in and hop on a zerg and spam 1 on their way to victory….

why do people speak like there is no choice but to join a zerg when doing open world stuff? It may seem crazy but you can like ignore the zerg, go do the other events solo or in a small group, its more fun that way… though still relatively easy. At least you’ll have to pay attention and spamming 1 will definitely not cut it.

sure, but its not rewarding lol..
I have gone around orr soloing events occasionally when I’m really bored but its a lot better to just pug a dung or do fracs…. dynamic events are just so lackluster…there’s nothing remotely challenging about them and they are unrewarding.. the majority of them have been the same for years. the only new ones are in the new zones from LS2… which is just a zerg fest…

My point is not about events though, I just think a lot of ppl would like to see some kind of new instanced event…. theres plenty of open world dynamic events… would the community seriously cry if anet decided to add some kind of remotely challenging instanced content ? just one lol.

knight in shining armor is BACK!!!

Sytherek.7689:

nGumball.1283:

People who saw the mainfesto and believed Anet would introduce a game outta this universe with a technology never seen before, are either ignorant or don’t know the limits of current gaming engines.

Game engines could be smarter, more dynamic, and creative — but the expense of producing such a game would severely limit the number of people who would play it.

Look at the majority of tablet games: simple, repetitive, derivative in the extreme. But they make money, because that’s what the average consumer wants.

how specifically? Whats your idea?

SkiTz.4590:

Galen Grey.4709:

SkiTz.4590:

Why we bickering over dynamic events lol?
They are such a casual mini-zerg fest with simple scraps as rewards (outside of teq/wurm)
If some ppl actually consider this endgame content, than wow…going around a zone doing really simple events? You mean those events I go around on my guardian spamming 1 on staff and just looting bags after tagging mobs that die in less than a second?

This game has plenty of that simple stuff, there’s nothing wrong with anet adding something remotely challenging thats instanced … but no, majority of this playerbase just likes casual things where they can just log in and hop on a zerg and spam 1 on their way to victory….

why do people speak like there is no choice but to join a zerg when doing open world stuff? It may seem crazy but you can like ignore the zerg, go do the other events solo or in a small group, its more fun that way… though still relatively easy. At least you’ll have to pay attention and spamming 1 will definitely not cut it.

sure, but its not rewarding lol..
I have gone around orr soloing events occasionally when I’m really bored but its a lot better to just pug a dung or do fracs…. dynamic events are just so lackluster…there’s nothing remotely challenging about them and they are unrewarding.. the majority of them have been the same for years. the only new ones are in the new zones from LS2… which is just a zerg fest…

My point is not about events though, I just think a lot of ppl would like to see some kind of new instanced event…. theres plenty of open world dynamic events… would the community seriously cry if anet decided to add some kind of remotely challenging instanced content ? just one lol.

You’re right they are easy no contest there. As for lackluster it depends on what you’re looking for. For me who wants story and immersion they’re not lackluster at all they’re the best I’ve seen done in an MMO so far.

But yeah sure some hard instanced content like the guantlet would be nice, no contest there. Everything should be given some attention in my opinion. Open world. PvP, hard instanced content, dungeons, mini games… and MMO is something that needs to cater for different play styles and Arenanet do that really, its just there is so much stuff that even with a 2 week release cycle it can be some time before its the turn of the thing we love most.

Galen Grey.4709:

SkiTz.4590:

Galen Grey.4709:

SkiTz.4590:

Why we bickering over dynamic events lol?
They are such a casual mini-zerg fest with simple scraps as rewards (outside of teq/wurm)
If some ppl actually consider this endgame content, than wow…going around a zone doing really simple events? You mean those events I go around on my guardian spamming 1 on staff and just looting bags after tagging mobs that die in less than a second?

This game has plenty of that simple stuff, there’s nothing wrong with anet adding something remotely challenging thats instanced … but no, majority of this playerbase just likes casual things where they can just log in and hop on a zerg and spam 1 on their way to victory….

why do people speak like there is no choice but to join a zerg when doing open world stuff? It may seem crazy but you can like ignore the zerg, go do the other events solo or in a small group, its more fun that way… though still relatively easy. At least you’ll have to pay attention and spamming 1 will definitely not cut it.

sure, but its not rewarding lol..
I have gone around orr soloing events occasionally when I’m really bored but its a lot better to just pug a dung or do fracs…. dynamic events are just so lackluster…there’s nothing remotely challenging about them and they are unrewarding.. the majority of them have been the same for years. the only new ones are in the new zones from LS2… which is just a zerg fest…

My point is not about events though, I just think a lot of ppl would like to see some kind of new instanced event…. theres plenty of open world dynamic events… would the community seriously cry if anet decided to add some kind of remotely challenging instanced content ? just one lol.

You’re right they are easy no contest there. As for lackluster it depends on what you’re looking for. For me who wants story and immersion they’re not lackluster at all they’re the best I’ve seen done in an MMO so far.

But yeah sure some hard instanced content like the guantlet would be nice, no contest there. Everything should be given some attention in my opinion. Open world. PvP, hard instanced content, dungeons, mini games… and MMO is something that needs to cater for different play styles and Arenanet do that really, its just there is so much stuff that even with a 2 week release cycle it can be some time before its the turn of the thing we love most.

Lol I agree with you except anet does not focus AT ALL on anything outside gemstore + LS updates (and tooltips lmao)
sPvP /WvW has been thrown aside.
EoTM has literally no impact WvW, its strictly a karma train farm. There has been no meaningful updates to WvW At all.
sPvP just recently had some changes in the feature patch, but theres still no new game modes after 2 years…
Dungs, lol, that’s the last thing anet has touched.

sPvP/WvW is about the only thing I touch because thats where I have the most fun… but the group of friends/guildies I play with is slowly diminishing simply because its gotten so stale due to the lack of changes…and thats what happens when theres little to no meaningful changes..ppl quit… anet just doesn’t care that much about other aspects of the game compared to LS+gemstore stuff and thats a fact , just purely based on their history of updates