Guild Wars 2

Tigaseye.2047:

It’s offensive when it’s used in its latest meaning, which is basically “lame”.

As in: “Rangers are so gay.”, or whatever (not meaning that they are actually gay, but that they are a bad class).

I see. On a scale of 1 to 10, 10 being the most vile racist homophobic sexist epithet ever uttered by a cis-gendered hetrosexual Caucasian man, what would be its rating?

‘Gay’ to mean ‘homosexual’ is (far and away) the dominant meaning at the moment. It is, more importantly, how a lot of people identify. If you use ‘gay’ to mean ‘bad’, you are being homophobic, because you are equating the two. This is especially true given that that is the exact origin of the gay=bad definition.

It’s the same as using the word ‘Jewish’ to mean ‘greedy, tightfisted’ – as in, “Stop being so Jewish, lend me some money.” It is equally unacceptable.

Your intent in doing so, and your own personal views on LGBT people, are irrelevant. By using ‘gay’ to mean ‘bad,’ you are perpetuating casual homophobia. By defending the usage, knowing that it is offensive…. you reveal a lot about yourself.

Arguing that ‘homosexual’ was not the original meaning of ‘gay’ is also irrelevant, because neither ‘homosexual’ nor ‘cheerful, colorful’ have negative meanings, and there is no possibility of offense.

Smartcat.2130:

They word Gay has also been discussed here alot; where I grew up it was still a term that meant ‘happy’. Not Homosexual. But thank you to whoever is responsible for perverting such a nice and innocent word.

I am interested in how you’re going to justify that homosexuality is a “perversion” or in any way mutually exclusive from “nice and innocent.”

If anything, can we get ‘Glarrgh’ added to the filter? Even if its a foreign language, having characters in game speaking it is bad enough.

Olvendred.3027:

‘Gay’ to mean ‘homosexual’ is (far and away) the dominant meaning at the moment. It is, more importantly, how a lot of people identify. If you use ‘gay’ to mean ‘bad’, you are being homophobic, because you are equating the two. This is especially true given that that is the exact origin of the gay=bad definition.

It’s the same as using the word ‘Jewish’ to mean ‘greedy, tightfisted’ – as in, “Stop being so Jewish, lend me some money.” It is equally unacceptable.

Your intent in doing so, and your own personal views on LGBT people, are irrelevant. By using ‘gay’ to mean ‘bad,’ you are perpetuating casual homophobia. By defending the usage, knowing that it is offensive…. you reveal a lot about yourself.

Arguing that ‘homosexual’ was not the original meaning of ‘gay’ is also irrelevant, because neither ‘homosexual’ nor ‘cheerful, colorful’ have negative meanings, and there is no possibility of offense.

Smartcat.2130:

They word Gay has also been discussed here alot; where I grew up it was still a term that meant ‘happy’. Not Homosexual. But thank you to whoever is responsible for perverting such a nice and innocent word.

I am interested in how you’re going to justify that homosexuality is a “perversion” or in any way mutually exclusive from “nice and innocent.”

South Park should be banned in Israel. To my surprise, the game is actually banned in Israel. Dont know abt the series though.

Oh dear is the word gay going to be banned in USA made games?

Khal Drogo.9631:

Tigaseye.2047:

It’s offensive when it’s used in its latest meaning, which is basically “lame”.

As in: “Rangers are so gay.”, or whatever (not meaning that they are actually gay, but that they are a bad class).

I see. On a scale of 1 to 10, 10 being the most vile racist homophobic sexist epithet ever uttered by a cis-gendered hetrosexual Caucasian man, what would be its rating?

There are no degrees in this question. Simply offensive or not. This is the former.

Khal Drogo.9631:

Oh dear is the word gay going to be banned in USA made games?

No. Did you actually read anything anyone wrote, or are you just making glib responses regardless?

Gay is not an offensive word. Using it to mean ‘bad, lame’ is offensive.

stale.9785:

Censorship – the principle that adults must live on pablum because baby can’t have steak.

Actually it’s more like “civility – the price we have to pay for functional society”. Yes, any restriction to personal freedom is a negative thing, but at the same time often the price of not restricting those things is even greater.

Tigaseye.2047:

The trick is to know when it is acceptable and when it isn’t.

Exactly. Unfortunately it seems that some people think that self-restrain is something that should happen to others, not to themselves. And think that internet anonymity should make them immune from repercussions for their behaviour.

Gaile Gray.6029:

Rauderi.8706:

Gaile Gray.6029:

Miss Lana.5276:

Gaile Gray.6029:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Ben K.6238:

With regards to obscene guild names, is reporting individual players the best way to address the issue?

A ticket is better. The report options have nothing to do with the guild name so they won’t know that’s what you are trying to report. Get the Display name and character name as well as the guild name and tag and report it on a ticket.

Correct. Please submit a ticket. The in-game report is expressly for character names.

What do we do for pet names? I’ve seen a few rangers running around with pets that have some obscene names, and others downright derogatory towards a certain demographic.

Submit a ticket. But please be sure you include the exact spelling of the character name or the display (name.1234) name, so that the team can look into the matter. It isn’t possible to pull a pet name without account-related info.

Thanks for asking.

Gaile, could you hand up a suggestion to the policy folks? Rather than split efforts on tickets and reports, would it be more comprehensive for the report form generated by in-game reporting to include not just name, but current pet name and current guild representation as well?
This would streamline the process for the people moderating names and would make it an easier process for players to engage in.

Implementing this would take resources that are not available at this time and wouldn’t be available in the near future. This is not a trivial request, as it would need to pull information from the database on a few different levels.

Would the system really need to pull different information from the database? You’ve said that CS people can definitely check pet and guild names once they know the player’s display name. If so, could not a “Inappropriate Pet Name” report simply send the player’s display name to the GM (I assume reports do this anyway), and they navigate to the pet name themselves? Obviously I don’t know how the GMs operate or how their report-checking system looks, but it doesn’t seem like it would be a particularly difficult or time-consuming step to take.

Astralporing.1957:

stale.9785:

Censorship – the principle that adults must live on pablum because baby can’t have steak.

Actually it’s more like “civility – the price we have to pay for functional society”. Yes, any restriction to personal freedom is a negative thing, but at the same time often the price of not restricting those things is even greater.

Tigaseye.2047:

The trick is to know when it is acceptable and when it isn’t.

Exactly. Unfortunately it seems that some people think that self-restrain is something that should happen to others, not to themselves. And think that internet anonymity should make them immune from repercussions for their behaviour.

The price of not restricting freedom of speech seems to be people discussing politics in a GW2 forum it would seem.

Seriously, I never thought I would ever live to see a day when Americans become more uptight than Europeans (British included), Russians or Chinese. Well at least on some niche gaming forums and apparently in some US states that vote a certain way.

I think I am going to take a break from these forums.

I think the kittenizer is great. But a few times I have seen words in my texted changed to “kitten”, and I have no idea what was offensive or what triggered. Is there a random function too? lol

Well, English is not my first language so I guess I might miss some words that are indeed offensive in English.

Olvendred.3027:

Smartcat.2130:

They word Gay has also been discussed here alot; where I grew up it was still a term that meant ‘happy’. Not Homosexual. But thank you to whoever is responsible for perverting such a nice and innocent word.

I am interested in how you’re going to justify that homosexuality is a “perversion” or in any way mutually exclusive from “nice and innocent.”

Would you like me to change the word perverting? How about one of these?
distort, warp, corrupt, subvert, twist, bend, abuse, divert, deflect, misapply, misuse, misrepresent, misinterpret, misconstrue, falsify, garble
I used the word as a descriptive word, because Gay originally meant “happy” and has been (take your pick) distorted, warped, corrupted, subverted, twisted, bent, abused, diverted, deflected, misapplied, misused, misrepresented, misinterpreted, misconstrued, falsified, or garbled into now meaning Homosexual.
I’m not saying it’s bad or good, but now if we want to use the word GAY everyone misunderstands the use of it.

For example: “I’m having a real gay day today.” To me that says they’re having a happy day. To some it still upholds its original meaning especially those that know me and know that I actually speak english and not Americanized english. But to those that don’t know me that well they assume I’m being homophobic and jump all over me. Like you have outstandingly done. The word has been twisted and now in today’s online forums it means almost the exact opposite of what it used to. It doesn’t matter who started it or how it ended up to be what it is now, there are still those that use it for it’s original meaning as with MANY other words that are often censored now.

The new meaning of ‘lame’ may offend people, but I’m getting tired of words being perverted. Why can’t words all just go back to being what they used to be, when animals were animals and not body parts to be censored from chats and happiness and being carefree wasn’t offensive in chats. And people weren’t looking for offence in every word.

And FYI I’ve been temp banned before on another mmo because of this sentence:
“Yes I know this must come as a shock to you since I am normally such a gay and carefree chap”.
because some overly sensitive buttercup thought it was offensive.
I would HATE to see this game become so politically correct that it destroys the game.

Smartcat.2130:

Olvendred.3027:

Smartcat.2130:

They word Gay has also been discussed here alot; where I grew up it was still a term that meant ‘happy’. Not Homosexual. But thank you to whoever is responsible for perverting such a nice and innocent word.

I am interested in how you’re going to justify that homosexuality is a “perversion” or in any way mutually exclusive from “nice and innocent.”

Would you like me to change the word perverting? How about one of these?
distort, warp, corrupt, subvert, twist, bend, abuse, divert, deflect, misapply, misuse, misrepresent, misinterpret, misconstrue, falsify, garble
I used the word as a descriptive word, because Gay originally meant “happy” and has been (take your pick) distorted, warped, corrupted, subverted, twisted, bent, abused, diverted, deflected, misapplied, misused, misrepresented, misinterpreted, misconstrued, falsified, or garbled into now meaning Homosexual.
I’m not saying it’s bad or good, but now if we want to use the word GAY everyone misunderstands the use of it.

For example: “I’m having a real gay day today.” To me that says they’re having a happy day. To some it still upholds its original meaning especially those that know me and know that I actually speak english and not Americanized english. But to those that don’t know me that well they assume I’m being homophobic and jump all over me. Like you have outstandingly done. The word has been twisted and now in today’s online forums it means almost the exact opposite of what it used to. It doesn’t matter who started it or how it ended up to be what it is now, there are still those that use it for it’s original meaning as with MANY other words that are often censored now.

The new meaning of ‘lame’ may offend people, but I’m getting tired of words being perverted. Why can’t words all just go back to being what they used to be, when animals were animals and not body parts to be censored from chats and happiness and being carefree wasn’t offensive in chats. And people weren’t looking for offence in every word.

Ok, if that is what you meant…

I have no problem with you using ‘gay’ to mean happy. It isn’t the slightest bit offensive to do so. But yes, you may be misunderstood (and, indeed, not get the benefit of the doubt if your intention is ambiguous). Language does change. There are no ‘original meanings.’ We have to deal with what things mean now, and currently (and indeed, increasingly), the dominant meaning of ‘gay’ is ‘homosexual.’

And FYI I’ve been temp banned before on another mmo because of this sentence:
“Yes I know this must come as a shock to you since I am normally such a gay and carefree chap”.
because some overly sensitive buttercup thought it was offensive.
I would HATE to see this game become so politically correct that it destroys the game.

See, this is offensive. Not what you said (at least as quoted and without context), but the fact you were banned for it. As I’ve been saying, ‘gay’ is not an offensive word. Banning it implies there is something wrong with it.

Using it to mean ‘bad, lame’ is, though.

Olvendred.3027:

Khal Drogo.9631:

Tigaseye.2047:

It’s offensive when it’s used in its latest meaning, which is basically “lame”.

As in: “Rangers are so gay.”, or whatever (not meaning that they are actually gay, but that they are a bad class).

I see. On a scale of 1 to 10, 10 being the most vile racist homophobic sexist epithet ever uttered by a cis-gendered hetrosexual Caucasian man, what would be its rating?

There are no degrees in this question. Simply offensive or not. This is the former.

Khal Drogo.9631:

Oh dear is the word gay going to be banned in USA made games?

No. Did you actually read anything anyone wrote, or are you just making glib responses regardless?

Gay is not an offensive word. Using it to mean ‘bad, lame’ is offensive.

See there you go. It’s not offensive at all.

I think it should be “that’s so GRAY” because have you seen some of the ‘writing’ in that book?

Khal Drogo.9631:

Tigaseye.2047:

It’s offensive when it’s used in its latest meaning, which is basically “lame”.

As in: “Rangers are so gay.”, or whatever (not meaning that they are actually gay, but that they are a bad class).

I see. On a scale of 1 to 10, 10 being the most vile racist homophobic sexist epithet ever uttered by a cis-gendered hetrosexual Caucasian man, what would be its rating?

Well, I don’t know what the rating would be?

But if you are using it to mean bad, then it definitely has potential to make gay people feel less than good about themselves/others’ view of them.

I don’t know where it was first used, in that derogatory way?

But schoolkids in the UK started using it like that quite a long time ago, now.

Not sure if the trend first started in the UK, but still?

People from the UK, who use it like that (who are now adults) claim they are not referencing gay (as in the sexuality) people, at all, when they say it.

They claim it has a separate meaning, in their eyes.

That may well be true, but the problem is that some other people may be using it in reference to gay people being “bad”.

Not to mention that I’m sure it’s just not pleasant hearing the name used, for your orientation, also being used as a derogatory term; whether the people doing it are thinking about the connection, or not.

If, conversely, the word had just reverted to, also, commonly meaning happy/pretty, for example, I doubt that would have caused an issue.

It’s the fact it has been made to mean bad.

I dropped the “lame” word, BTW, as it occurred to me that that word fell into the same category, at some point.

It, originally, just meant injured, or disabled and then, at some point, someone used it to mean bad.

Therefore, it could also be viewed as offensive and/or unkind.

The only real difference is the amount of time that has passed since that was allowed to happen.

Anet does not need to get into social engineering just to placate players who have a different belief system and low tolerance level. If it is an issue—-use the filter, report words that you take PERSONAL offense to then block the player.
The game has all the tools you need.

Tigaseye.2047:

Khal Drogo.9631:

Smartcat.2130:

I’ve read through alot of these posts and some of you seem to have personalized the issue and seem very self righteous about it. So let me do the same.

My question is what gives you specifically the right to choose which words are offensive and which ones aren’t on a multicultural game?

Gw2 is very culturally diverse and many words have very different meanings for a great range of people. What might be offensive to you might actually have been completely harmless. GW2 has a block feature, a hide chat feature and a profanity filter for the more delicate souls that play the game.

Now I’m not condoning bullying or verbal abuse, for those there is a report button and I honestly haven’t seen it fail yet, though it can take a few days to kick in. They can only add so many words to the profanity filter, at which point it gets somewhat ridiculous.

An example of this:
Hooters in america means an adult bar (from what I understand). Where I am from it is a slang term for owls. Completely harmless. Yet this term I have often found to be blocked by profanity filters in many games.
There are many many names for genitalia which I had no idea about most of them about until coming to the internet only to find these words (when trying to use them in a complete mundane and harmless fashion) have been blocked as ‘profanity’.
They word Gay has also been discussed here alot; where I grew up it was still a term that meant ‘happy’. Not Homosexual. But thank you to whoever is responsible for perverting such a nice and innocent word. And now it has become slang for ‘uncool’ or ‘boring’ or ‘lame’ and all the homosexuals get up in arms about it. But heaven forbid that you remind such people about it actual meaning.

I’m sorry if this is a bit of a rant, but I am sick and tired of playing games where I have to change my language even though the words I do not use are cuss words or are not profanity, simply because some Americans decide that a word is offensive because it’s american slang, even when the context uses it’s ORIGINAL MEANING.

The profanity filter covers so much already, and can make harmless intellectual conversation difficult as it is. What more do you want them to do with it?
If someone is being a bully or being unnecessarily cruel or even if there is someone breaking TOS, there IS a report function and it does work. I suggest you use it. And if all that fails you are able to block the offensive person and never hear from them again.
The technology is there! Use it!

Block and dont read map chat if you find certain things triggering. Btw dare I ask if WoW is as “liberal” in applying censorship?

In first place I don’t think the term gay is offensive to homosexuals. I mean LGBTQI etc. Sorry I am not from a Western country, perhaps it is really offensive.

It’s only offensive when it’s used in its latest meaning, which is basically “lame”.

As in: “Rangers are so gay.”, or whatever (not meaning that they are actually gay, but that they are a bad class).

Obviously, if you are a gay person, it will probably be offensive to you that the word used to describe your sexual orientation, now also means bad/lame.

As it would appear there was a connection made, at least at some point, between the two.

Obviously, historically, before it referred to sexuality, it meant happy and I think, also, brightly coloured/pretty?

So, within a few decades, it has gone from meaning happy/pretty, to lame, via a sexuality.

It’s had quite a journey…

This. This is the point I was trying make, sorry if I was unclear.

No, I do not object to people using the word " gay" in general. Adding that to the filter would just be ridiculous.

Gaile Gray.6029:

Having reread the thread, I see a few different things:

• Some players, like me, only rarely see extreme instances of offensive behavior.
• Some players don’t see issues at all.
• Some feel they see them daily and have modified their game experiences to avoid such instances.
• Some say “Buck up and ignore it.”
• Others say, “I have a god-given right to offend you, and you have no right to complain.”

End of the day, why don’t we let the professionals decide? Why don’t each of you who see offensive chat report it and let the moderation team make a decision about the overall offensiveness of a word or phrase in the context of the game. The team is not draconian, they understand the difference between a word spoken in the heat of the moment and a pattern of abusive language. Report and forget and trust that things will be taken care of in the best and more fair manner possible.

Well, I don’t think this is about you being professional or not. I think you’re very professional btw.

It’s about the agreement that you mentioned before. I have an entitlement to urinate. I have a physical need to do that eventually, but I cannot do that whenever and wherever I want to. I have to respect everyone else.

I think swearing and many other activities are the same. It’s not that you cannot do them. You just cannot do them here.

Khal Drogo.9631:

Astralporing.1957:

stale.9785:

Censorship – the principle that adults must live on pablum because baby can’t have steak.

Actually it’s more like “civility – the price we have to pay for functional society”. Yes, any restriction to personal freedom is a negative thing, but at the same time often the price of not restricting those things is even greater.

Tigaseye.2047:

The trick is to know when it is acceptable and when it isn’t.

Exactly. Unfortunately it seems that some people think that self-restrain is something that should happen to others, not to themselves. And think that internet anonymity should make them immune from repercussions for their behaviour.

The price of not restricting freedom of speech seems to be people discussing politics in a GW2 forum it would seem.

Seriously, I never thought I would ever live to see a day when Americans become more uptight than Europeans (British included), Russians or Chinese. Well at least on some niche gaming forums and apparently in some US states that vote a certain way.

I think I am going to take a break from these forums.

It would appear you’re taking offence at other people taking offence?

Perhaps you should grow thicker skin?

Theirs a chat “Filter” and a “Block/Ignore” Option for a Reason Use it.

Exiled Dbl.9035:

Theirs a chat “Filter” and a “Block/Ignore” Option for a Reason Use it.

I assume from your response you haven’t read the rest of the thread.

Gaile (and other posters) have pointed out that the filter is not there to allow poor language.

“Oh and keep in mind: The Profanity Filter is not in place to give you or any other player “Permission to Swear.” The Profanity Filter is a means to allow some level of personal selection on what a player does and does not see, but it is by no means intended to serve as a 100% solution to the bad choices of others.” (Post by Gaile Gray, can’t quote it for some reason: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/support/Why-is-there-a-Profanity-Filter/first#post4436966)

Personally, I don’t have the chat filter on. I don’t mind seeing the occasional swear. I do mind when swears are directed towards a particular player or group, and I also do mind if I see a constant string of profanity and/or nastiness.

The profanity filter doesn’t necessarily block out some of the cruellest things anyway. People can spew hate speech without triggering the filter.

Reporting certainly has its place. I use it fairly liberally- if I’m not sure if something is toeing the line or not, I’ll report. If somebody continues to swear in large amounts (even if the topic isn’t harmful) I’ll report. If somebody verbally attacks anybody in any way, I’ll report.

I was suprised to read the OP’s take on the general atmosphere in the game. In my experience, GW2 is one of the cleaner, friendlier communities.

Not to say that I never see vulgar chat. The vast majority of it, though, comes across as teenage boys trying to seem mature (ironically) with drug references or sexual chat. All of which I report and then ignore.

Almost all of the vulgar or religious themed names I’ve reported seem to be about someone thinking they are being clever and funny, rather than promoting hate.

The megaserver tries to lump us together with our home server, right? Could this be why some people have a very different experience with chat? I know my server, before megaserver, seemed skewed toward a more helpful, friendly community.

Olvendred.3027:

‘Gay’ to mean ‘homosexual’ is (far and away) the dominant meaning at the moment. It is, more importantly, how a lot of people identify. If you use ‘gay’ to mean ‘bad’, you are being homophobic, because you are equating the two. This is especially true given that that is the exact origin of the gay=bad definition.

It’s the same as using the word ‘Jewish’ to mean ‘greedy, tightfisted’ – as in, “Stop being so Jewish, lend me some money.” It is equally unacceptable.

Your intent in doing so, and your own personal views on LGBT people, are irrelevant. By using ‘gay’ to mean ‘bad,’ you are perpetuating casual homophobia. By defending the usage, knowing that it is offensive…. you reveal a lot about yourself.

Arguing that ‘homosexual’ was not the original meaning of ‘gay’ is also irrelevant, because neither ‘homosexual’ nor ‘cheerful, colorful’ have negative meanings, and there is no possibility of offense.

Smartcat.2130:

They word Gay has also been discussed here alot; where I grew up it was still a term that meant ‘happy’. Not Homosexual. But thank you to whoever is responsible for perverting such a nice and innocent word.

I am interested in how you’re going to justify that homosexuality is a “perversion” or in any way mutually exclusive from “nice and innocent.”

There is even a somewhat prominent gay podcaster who said “gay is what I get called in online games” – and no, he did not mean he was bashed as a homosexual.

I guess I have to stop singing the Flinstones’ Theme before the political correct thought police bash done my door. Love that show.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2s13X66BFd8

Gibson.4036:

Not to say that I never see vulgar chat. The vast majority of it, though, comes across as teenage boys trying to seem mature (ironically) with drug references or sexual chat.

Almost all of the vulgar or religious themed names I’ve reported seem to be about someone thinking they are being clever and funny, rather than promoting hate.

This is the experience I have had. Mostly kids who don’t get it.

Speaking of which, I’m pretty appalled at the discussion going on in this thread right now. How is this hard to understand? If you know something is considered hurtful in the context you’re about to say it, don’t say it.

You may have a right to say whatever you want, but don’t act like you’re the victim when people treat you like the jerk that you are. People who complain about political correctness are those who refuse to come to terms with the fact that the behavior they learned growing up is not acceptable in society at large.

Andred.1087:

Gibson.4036:

Not to say that I never see vulgar chat. The vast majority of it, though, comes across as teenage boys trying to seem mature (ironically) with drug references or sexual chat.

Almost all of the vulgar or religious themed names I’ve reported seem to be about someone thinking they are being clever and funny, rather than promoting hate.

This is the experience I have had. Mostly kids who don’t get it.

Speaking of which, I’m pretty appalled at the discussion going on in this thread right now. How is this hard to understand? If you know something is considered hurtful in the context you’re about to say it, don’t say it.

You may have a right to say whatever you want, but don’t act like you’re the victim when people treat you like the jerk that you are. People who complain about political correctness are those who refuse to come to terms with the fact that the behavior they learned growing up is not acceptable in society at large.

Ehh, when discussing political correctness it’s not about what is acceptable in society, it’s about what isn’t going to kitten off that one overly up tight guy who is not going to let it go. Those people aren’t worth dealing with so it’s often better to try and avoid it, or not care and not have any issues 99% of the time when you call someone black instead of african american.

Blude.6812:

Anet does not need to get into social engineering just to placate players who have a different belief system and low tolerance level. If it is an issue—-use the filter, report words that you take PERSONAL offense to then block the player.
The game has all the tools you need.

THIS.

You have profanity filter, you have possibility to block people, you have possibility to not see certain chat, you have a possibility do basically block yourself from all the “bad” content.
The sad fact is that those who claim that vulgar behaviour is in place in this game have little to no proof at all of that. Of course, people some times will be like that, because let’s face it – some people take it too far. But that doesn’t mean that, becasue few people misbehave, that the entire system should be changed. I’ve got my map chat constantly on and quite frankly I have not seen bad behaviour there beside sporadical instances. The fact that you are discussing it here means that you want some kind of censorship that will basically turn into what good ol’ USSR gave us in Eastern Europe. Because “omg this person offended me”.

The tools to “shield” yourself are here, and as Blude stated, you are welcome to use them – profanity filter, block option, invisibility, possibility to close map chats.
And if everything makes you go into rage and you claim behaviour of all is so terrible, then perhaps online gaming is not for you?

GW2 Community is the nicest and the most helpful one out there. Don’t try to enforce something, that is really not an issue.

I agree with you, OP, but unfortunately all MMOs have this. If people were more respectful, the chat would be cleaner. Talking about certain things and cussing is fine when you’re around friends and family that approve, but a public arena is where everyone should exercise more self-control out of respect for others. That’s how I personally approach chat.

Celtic Lady.3729:

I agree with you, OP, but unfortunately all MMOs have this. If people were more respectful, the chat would be cleaner. Talking about certain things and cussing is fine when you’re around friends and family that approve, but a public arena is where everyone should exercise more self-control out of respect for others. That’s how I personally approach chat.

Sometimes when I read these threads, I chuckle a bit

http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/239318/More_carrot_less_stick_Jeffrey_Lin_on_tweaking_League_of_Legends_player_behavior.php

Yeah. So in our analysis of the whole player demographic, only 1 percent of players are the ones who are consistently homophobic, sexist, or racist. What’s interesting, though, is that they’re not responsible for a lot of the toxicity in the system.

So when you break down the ecosystem — how much toxicity is sourced from that 1 percent — it’s only about 5 percent. Actually, the majority of toxicity is the neutral or positive players.

And the thing is that every once in a while, they’ll have a bad day — a bad day at work, bad day at school. They’ll carry that into their game. 90 percent of the toxicity is those players. So you look at a 100-game history, and they may be only negative in three games. And the question for us is, “How do you solve that problem?”

But part two of that is what we learned this year: Even though a small minority is truly negative, they can control your community’s perception by themselves. It just takes — and this is really interesting — 11 percent of negative posters on a forum discussion to just change the direction of the forum discussion.

If we can learn anything from the psychologist from league of legends, Most toxicity is started either normal people are having a bad day or accidently trip on offended culture without realizing it.

Ludovicus.7980:

Well, I don’t think this is about you being professional or not. I think you’re very professional btw.

It’s about the agreement that you mentioned before. I have an entitlement to urinate. I have a physical need to do that eventually, but I cannot do that whenever and wherever I want to. I have to respect everyone else.

I think swearing and many other activities are the same. It’s not that you cannot do them. You just cannot do them here.

The use of the word gay is the same as urination?

Everyone else is really not everyone else but just the very small minority of people who wants to make a mountain out of a molehill and draw attention to themselves.

If Anet really wants to court a particular demographic as their enduring customer base, it is their prerogative. Just don’t be surprised if other people get turned off when it becomes too ridiculous.

loseridoit.2756:

Celtic Lady.3729:

I agree with you, OP, but unfortunately all MMOs have this. If people were more respectful, the chat would be cleaner. Talking about certain things and cussing is fine when you’re around friends and family that approve, but a public arena is where everyone should exercise more self-control out of respect for others. That’s how I personally approach chat.

Sometimes when I read these threads, I chuckle a bit

http://www.gamasutra.com/view/news/239318/More_carrot_less_stick_Jeffrey_Lin_on_tweaking_League_of_Legends_player_behavior.php

Yeah. So in our analysis of the whole player demographic, only 1 percent of players are the ones who are consistently homophobic, sexist, or racist. What’s interesting, though, is that they’re not responsible for a lot of the toxicity in the system.

So when you break down the ecosystem — how much toxicity is sourced from that 1 percent — it’s only about 5 percent. Actually, the majority of toxicity is the neutral or positive players.
…

If we can learn anything from the psychologist from league of legends, Most toxicity is started either normal people are having a bad day or accidently trip on offended culture without realizing it.

Nothing to learn but a bunch of sensitive offended ppl too lazy to use the block function. Death threats etc should be reported to the devs though.

Jerus.4350:

Andred.1087:

Gibson.4036:

Not to say that I never see vulgar chat. The vast majority of it, though, comes across as teenage boys trying to seem mature (ironically) with drug references or sexual chat.

Almost all of the vulgar or religious themed names I’ve reported seem to be about someone thinking they are being clever and funny, rather than promoting hate.

This is the experience I have had. Mostly kids who don’t get it.

Speaking of which, I’m pretty appalled at the discussion going on in this thread right now. How is this hard to understand? If you know something is considered hurtful in the context you’re about to say it, don’t say it.

You may have a right to say whatever you want, but don’t act like you’re the victim when people treat you like the jerk that you are. People who complain about political correctness are those who refuse to come to terms with the fact that the behavior they learned growing up is not acceptable in society at large.

Ehh, when discussing political correctness it’s not about what is acceptable in society, it’s about what isn’t going to kitten off that one overly up tight guy who is not going to let it go. Those people aren’t worth dealing with so it’s often better to try and avoid it, or not care and not have any issues 99% of the time when you call someone black instead of african american.

Well, in the UK, we would still call someone black, as they’re obviously not African Americans, if they’re British.

The term “African British” doesn’t exist, as far as I know.

Similarly, the word “Asian”, in the UK, generally refers only to people from India, or Pakistan (and maybe Bangladesh etc.); not to people from (or originally from) China/Japan/Singapore etc..

I was on another American forum, a few years ago and an Asian (as in, Chinese) British woman was being reprimanded by American Asians for calling herself “Oriental”, as they found that offensive.

Didn’t matter how much she tried to explain that she didn’t find it offensive, at all, as it wasn’t considered an offensive term in the UK, or that it was awkward for her to use the word Asian to describe herself, as everyone here then assumes you must be Indian/Pakistani, they still insisted she should call herself Asian.

I think, at this point, most British people have just given up and now just call Chinese etc. people Asian as well (at least online), but it is obviously slightly confusing.

So, to a certain extent what is considered right, or wrong, will be cultural, as well.

I’ve taken to turning chat bubbles off, leaving map chat and hiding the chat window so I can’t even see it highlighting new messages.

At one point I was reporting people. Then I changed to just blocking. Now after some 500 (or thereabouts) blocked there is simply too much to contend with. I have simply retreated from that avenue of conversation completely.

Tigaseye.2047:

Jerus.4350:

Andred.1087:

Gibson.4036:

Not to say that I never see vulgar chat. The vast majority of it, though, comes across as teenage boys trying to seem mature (ironically) with drug references or sexual chat.

Almost all of the vulgar or religious themed names I’ve reported seem to be about someone thinking they are being clever and funny, rather than promoting hate.

This is the experience I have had. Mostly kids who don’t get it.

Speaking of which, I’m pretty appalled at the discussion going on in this thread right now. How is this hard to understand? If you know something is considered hurtful in the context you’re about to say it, don’t say it.

You may have a right to say whatever you want, but don’t act like you’re the victim when people treat you like the jerk that you are. People who complain about political correctness are those who refuse to come to terms with the fact that the behavior they learned growing up is not acceptable in society at large.

Ehh, when discussing political correctness it’s not about what is acceptable in society, it’s about what isn’t going to kitten off that one overly up tight guy who is not going to let it go. Those people aren’t worth dealing with so it’s often better to try and avoid it, or not care and not have any issues 99% of the time when you call someone black instead of african american.

Well, in the UK, we would still call someone black, as they’re obviously not African Americans, if they’re British.

The term “African British” doesn’t exist, as far as I know.

Similarly, the word “Asian”, in the UK, generally refers only to people from India, or Pakistan (and maybe Bangladesh etc.); not to people from (or originally from) China/Japan/Singapore etc..

I was on another American forum, a few years ago and an Asian (as in, Chinese) British woman was being reprimanded by American Asians for calling herself “Oriental”, as they found that offensive.

Didn’t matter how much she tried to explain that she didn’t find it offensive, at all, as it wasn’t considered an offensive term in the UK, or that it was awkward for her to use the word Asian to describe herself, as everyone here then assumes you must be Indian/Pakistani, they still insisted she should call herself Asian.

I think, at this point, most British people have just given up and now just call Chinese etc. people Asian as well (at least online), but it is obviously slightly confusing.

So, to a certain extent what is considered right, or wrong, will be cultural, as well.

Absolutely. I’ve just always gone by the tone of the conversation, rarely do people just throw in one term meant to offend someone without really emphasizing it with a change in tone and presence. If the point is to offend, you know it, and you shouldn’t get angry if someone simply uses the incorrect term. It’s like screwing up someone’s name, correct them politely and move on.

Khal Drogo.9631:

Nothing to learn but a bunch of sensitive offended ppl too lazy to use the block function. Death threats etc should be reported to the devs though.

well, you just written off the largest problem.

Problem solved.

I wish people would move into the 21st century and stop getting so offended over “swear” words. And it’s really a minority of people that are offended but that’s still far too many.

uhohhotdog.3598:

I wish people would move into the 21st century and stop getting so offended over “swear” words. And it’s really a minority of people that are offended but that’s still far too many.

I wish people would move into the 21st century and stop getting so offensive to other people. And it’s really a minority of people that are offensive but that’s still far too many.

There’s a difference between somebody who lets slip a swear word or somebody who is offensive on propose (kitten, I completely kittened up this thing vs [Some group/person] is so kittening stupid they should kill themselves). The second person will earn a report from me (and a block), the first only if he keeps doing it.

(It also depends on my mood, when it’s that time of the month, you’ll earn a report faster :p)

1. Adjust chat filters
2. Report when appropriate
3. Block

Azhure.1857:

1. Adjust chat filters
2. Report when appropriate
3. Block

Good advice, although an A-net staffer did say that having a profanity filter was no excuse for players to cuss a blue streak.

LadyRhonwyn.2501:

uhohhotdog.3598:

I wish people would move into the 21st century and stop getting so offended over “swear” words. And it’s really a minority of people that are offended but that’s still far too many.

I wish people would move into the 21st century and stop getting so offensive to other people. And it’s really a minority of people that are offensive but that’s still far too many.

There’s a difference between somebody who lets slip a swear word or somebody who is offensive on propose (kitten, I completely kittened up this thing vs [Some group/person] is so kittening stupid they should kill themselves). The second person will earn a report from me (and a block), the first only if he keeps doing it.

(It also depends on my mood, when it’s that time of the month, you’ll earn a report faster :p)

Sorry no it doesn’t work that way. You get offended far too easily if some “bad” words offend you. This isn’t leave it to beaver world.

Celtic Lady.3729:

Azhure.1857:

1. Adjust chat filters
2. Report when appropriate
3. Block

Good advice, although an A-net staffer did say that having a profanity filter was no excuse for players to cuss a blue streak.

You still have the tools to solve the problem yourself. Be the better person and use them.

Manufactured outrage offends me, as does censorship.

Here’s a fun fact. Sinister originally means left-handed, but I do not qq endlessly on tumblr when someone uses it to mean evil. The language another person uses casually is not a personal attack on you, because you just aren’t important to at least 99.995% of the population of this planet.

Some posters might want to bear in mind that players who bought GW2 bought a membership in a private club, with a virtual clubhouse (or two, if you count the forums). The arbiter of what is acceptable in a private club is the owner of the club, in this case ANet. The offended player is not the arbiter, and neither is the offender.

Players can debate what is offensive and what ought not to be considered offensive until pigs fly. That debate will have zero effect on ANet’s policies and the protocols their GM/CS personnel use when reviewing reports of offensive behavior.

As to the belief that others ought to lower their standards because <reasons>… well, a laissez faire attitude towards behavior is not necessarily a good thing for a culture.

yolo swaggins.2570:

Celtic Lady.3729:

Azhure.1857:

1. Adjust chat filters
2. Report when appropriate
3. Block

Good advice, although an A-net staffer did say that having a profanity filter was no excuse for players to cuss a blue streak.

You still have the tools to solve the problem yourself. Be the better person and use them.

Versus being the better person and show some civility in a public space.

Behellagh.1468:

yolo swaggins.2570:

Celtic Lady.3729:

Azhure.1857:

1. Adjust chat filters
2. Report when appropriate
3. Block

Good advice, although an A-net staffer did say that having a profanity filter was no excuse for players to cuss a blue streak.

You still have the tools to solve the problem yourself. Be the better person and use them.

Versus being the better person and show some civility in a public space.

It goes both ways. First person to do the right thing wins?

Coldtart.4785:

Manufactured outrage offends me, as does censorship.

Here’s a fun fact. Sinister originally means left-handed, but I do not qq endlessly on tumblr when someone uses it to mean evil. The language another person uses casually is not a personal attack on you, because you just aren’t important to at least 99.995% of the population of this planet.

Actually, sinister did originally mean ‘left’ in Latin, but it also originally meant ‘favourable,’ due to the Roman practice of sacrificing while facing to the south (therefore an omen on the left would be to the east, which is good). It was the Greeks who sacrificed facing north, and for them the left side was unfavourable. It’s therefore quite difficult if, for example, Cicero says something was ‘sinister’, to tell which meaning he was using and whether he was being sarcastic. It only crystallized into meaning ‘evil’ in the medieval period.

Of course, the difference with ‘sinister’ is that it almost never means ‘left’ in modern English usage. So being outraged by that would indeed be incredibly manufactured. Unlike other examples explained in this thread.

Kedarrian.2905:

Yes, well, adolescent males make up a big part of the videogame market. So there it is. GW2 is comparatively good.

Maybe someone will create a game where you have to be a 40yrs+ female to possess an account?

They would joke about sex even more. Trust me.

And for the OP. MMOs are the Internet. If you find Internet that offensive and you can’t just accept it, I have bad news for you – you won’t change it, it’s open community with no selection besides couple euros. Either you learn how to live with it and overcome, or you leave.

There’s nothing ArenaNet can do with it, really, so you might as well don’t post it.

I always found the sheer amount of mysogynist, homophobic and racist chat (whether so-called jokes or direct insults) in Guild Wars 2 quite appalling, more so because people seem to think it’s NORMAL to type whatever.

Yes, I report and block. But the fact I keep having to, means the problem is pretty persistent and more should be done about it.

As a gay man, I’m always humored by how many heterosexuals are so offended for me. I’ve had a lifetime of abuse and oppression. I can stand someone saying “gay.”

And in delicious irony, I once had someone use “the f word” (rhyming with maggot) to insult me. I responded that I was, in fact, one. I was banned from the game for a short period for hate speech. It was decided that I could not defend myself by devaluing the insult because the insult itself is deemed wrong by my heterosexual cultural superiors. Goodness forbid I take the insult and morph it into something to the point it loses its power. You know, like certain other words?

In speaking only for me, I don’t need your safe space. I don’t need to be protected from a word or words because you think they offend me. Take your benevolent sexism, racism, and homophobia somewhere else to swoop in and play the hero for someone else.

I’ve no need for your heroics. I do not need your projection onto me. You’re the one offended and made uncomfortable. I am not. You are using me, my experiences of oppression, and my population of people to justify your offense and your censoring response.

If needed, I can save myself, thanks.

I’m a zillion years late to this topic, and I really don’t wanna participate in the current point it’s revolving around, but I definitely have to agree with the OP.

What gets me is how gross things get, and how quickly. Like, you can’t call something a “sticky situation” without some nerd in chat talking about, uh, something else sticky. And god forbid you make the mistake of calling something hard.

It’s exhausting at this point. I didn’t express that I was having difficulty with the content so that some stranger could tell me about their genitals or bodily functions.

I mean, I get it. Some people just have, let’s say, an “explicit” sense of humor. But do I log in to listen to that? I think of it like being outdoors. If I’m walking to the store, just going about my day as I please, and- I don’t know, let’s say I trip and split my lip on the sidewalk.

For those keeping the pace, this is the figurative language I’m using to describe “playing the game normally and encountering difficulty.”

You know what I don’t wanna hear, while I’m having that kind of trouble? Imagine someone sees me with a hurt lip, picking myself up off the sidewalk, and makes a gross remark about what my lips can or can’t do in that state.

That’s what it feels like to call a piece of content “hard” in map chat and hear, you know, “hard as my-” etcetera. It’s gross, it’s unpleasant, it makes me uncomfortable, and goodness knows it doesn’t help me.

But things like that don’t really violate the TOS, do they? They’re not hate speech, they’re not technically discriminatory, but they make me extremely uncomfortable. If I report that person, it might be written off as frivolous. If I block that person, I spare myself the trouble of listening to them, but they might be a good player when they aren’t being gross for no reason. I might end up missing out on someone I’d otherwise have liked to work with.

The answer to my problem that I’ve been told is to grin and bear it. That some people are just like that. But… that really isn’t a solution. The more uncomfortable I get, the more I have to isolate myself, as if I’m the one responsible for the problem- rather than the person making me uncomfortable.

It feels pretty bad to have a problem and be told it’s my own fault for being, y’know, “too sensitive” or “letting it get to me,” when I wouldn’t be seen as either if the person making me uncomfortable hadn’t done so in the first place.

Maybe I’m off-base, I dunno. Hopefully someone gets where I’m coming from on this one.

cainejw.7142:

As a gay man, I’m always humored by how many heterosexuals are so offended for me. I’ve had a lifetime of abuse and oppression. I can stand someone saying “gay.”

And in delicious irony, I once had someone use “the f word” (rhyming with maggot) to insult me. I responded that I was, in fact, one. I was banned from the game for a short period for hate speech. It was decided that I could not defend myself by devaluing the insult because the insult itself is deemed wrong by my heterosexual cultural superiors. Goodness forbid I take the insult and morph it into something to the point it loses its power. You know, like certain other words?

In speaking only for me, I don’t need your safe space. I don’t need to be protected from a word or words because you think they offend me. Take your benevolent sexism, racism, and homophobia somewhere else to swoop in and play the hero for someone else.

I’ve no need for your heroics. I do not need your projection onto me. You’re the one offended and made uncomfortable. I am not. You are using me, my experiences of oppression, and my population of people to justify your offense and your censoring response.

If needed, I can save myself, thanks.

Dude, I don’t know you, at all. That said, I love you! Your simple sanity is just awesome.

Carry one being the epic person you are!

Later, eh?

Stale/Dan

cainejw.7142:

As a gay man, I’m always humored by how many heterosexuals are so offended for me. I’ve had a lifetime of abuse and oppression. I can stand someone saying “gay.”

And in delicious irony, I once had someone use “the f word” (rhyming with maggot) to insult me. I responded that I was, in fact, one. I was banned from the game for a short period for hate speech. It was decided that I could not defend myself by devaluing the insult because the insult itself is deemed wrong by my heterosexual cultural superiors. Goodness forbid I take the insult and morph it into something to the point it loses its power. You know, like certain other words?

In speaking only for me, I don’t need your safe space. I don’t need to be protected from a word or words because you think they offend me. Take your benevolent sexism, racism, and homophobia somewhere else to swoop in and play the hero for someone else.

I’ve no need for your heroics. I do not need your projection onto me. You’re the one offended and made uncomfortable. I am not. You are using me, my experiences of oppression, and my population of people to justify your offense and your censoring response.

If needed, I can save myself, thanks.

I equally don’t know you at all, but it’s difficult to miss the massive chip on your shoulder. It’s kind of obvious in the sweeping assumptions you make about the sexuality and intentions of everyone else.

In any case, the ‘safe space’ exists. For everyone, whether they want it or not. You agreed to it when you accepted the ToS. I think a lot of people, myself included, like that it does exist. ‘Saving oneself,’ all the time, is incredibly tiresome. And usually pointless, when dealing with anonymous people on the internet. This is why we have moderators.

So you will (and should) indeed be banned for using homophobic language, no matter how you identify. A game is not the place to fight battles to reclaim language, or to expect people to have to save themselves. If you’ve had a lifetime of abuse and oppression, you shouldn’t wish it on others. Especially not in their leisure time, which is generally supposed to be about having fun.