Guild Wars 2

IF killing is the end goal and the main purpose of a game play, then doing it fast and then even faster is the most straight forward and efficient way of achieving that purpose; and thus berserker (or in fact the underlining stats combo) is the natural choice of tool to do that. Player will of course instinctively use berserker gears. Berserker gears themselves have no problem existing in the game; killing fast CAN be a legitimate goal of a game. The current concern is mainly due to the environment upon which berserker gears are the rational and dominant choice in most situations.

Changing the berserker gears, or any other set of gears, will NOT improve the situation. The game platform itself has to allow OTHER play styles to have a role. That is to say killing is not the final solution.

Guild Wars 2 is fun because it does have game plays that do not solely revolve around killing the targets fast. But the domain of which is small and ultimately killing the targets IS still the final solution.

What I would therefore suggest is that leave the gears alone for now. Add more diversity to end game contents, focusing not on killing fast but on other aspects that are compatible the characteristics of all the different playable classes. Of course it has to be fun and rewarding too. But I am sure ANet understand that.

That should encourage players to diversify they build portfolio. What next is to make accessing those builds more easily and user-friendly. I would suggest having a “Build Template” feature whereby players can switch between builds, for instance between Berserker, Knight, Cleric, Sinister, …, at the click of a button instead of having to slot each piece one by one and remember where all those trait points go everytime switching is required.

So, in order words, introduce more “NOT-kill-them-all-fast-and-furious” based contents and make switching gears and trait much much more straight forward.

Well, there have been 1-2 “nerf turrets QQ” posts in the pvp section every day for the past 9 or more months.

Now look at anet doing exactly what the qq posts asked for, without even thinking for themselves.

Maybe the QQ zerk scene will also get somewhere, someday.

PS: Not sure what there is to discuss anyway.

serenke.4806:

Maybe the QQ zerk scene will also get somewhere, someday.
PS: Not sure what there is to discuss anyway.

They already did last year and yeah,probably the QQers will get their way again – although the build diversity gotless after the nerf, but whatever, right? Those complaining about the meta will have long left the game anyway.

serenke.4806:

Maybe the QQ zerk scene will also get somewhere, someday.

It’s well known that the bleed cap is being lifted in the expansion, increasing the value of condition builds.

So, yes, the movement to bring other stat combinations closer to berserker is making progress. It’ll be interesting to see how well power/precision/condition damage builds do in the future.

It’s kind of disappointing too. More stat diversity turns ascended gear into even more of a gold sink. At the moment I can move my ascended armor around between characters of the same armor weight without any significant issues.

Stat diversity means “make another set or fall behind”.

Eponet.4829:

serenke.4806:

Maybe the QQ zerk scene will also get somewhere, someday.

It’s well known that the bleed cap is being lifted in the expansion, increasing the value of condition builds.

So, yes, the movement to bring other stat combinations closer to berserker is making progress. It’ll be interesting to see how well power/precision/condition damage builds do in the future.

It’s kind of disappointing too. More stat diversity turns ascended gear into even more of a gold sink. At the moment I can move my ascended armor around between characters of the same armor weight without any significant issues.

Stat diversity means “make another set or fall behind”.

Sure, the condi cap thing. What happens then though? If they will be just as effective as berserker but not more effective, nobody will bother. If they will be more effective than berserker, that will break the whole game because the risk-reward ratio will be imbalanced (you can run a toughness build with condi dmg and kill stuff just as well as a glass-cannon).
The zerker meta discussion is generally about instances anyway, so if a blob of 80 people can stack bleeds on a boss to infinity is not really important.

Another thread about this and so many people against or for Berserker meta.

Well I am against Berserker meta and I have fixed it… I don’t play with people who thinks that you need Berserker to play the game. I myself got some Berserker geared characters but it is becouse they are good that way, but I also got Cleric and Carrion and I find them all as good as my Berserker characters. except for my Zerker Guardian (don’t want a nerf but realy needs it) that can survive better than my cleric Elementalist.

I have one suggestion though… What if base healing was lowered and Healing power was stronger? I mean that without healing power you heal realy good for example with Warriors Healing signet and Guardians Meditation healing. Though I don’t think the skills needs a nerf but healing for all needs a nerf. Some healings needs a buff after this though, like Rangers Spirit.

So, the problem now is that some enemies kills you with one hit but the rest of them hit’s pretty weak so even a Zerker Warrior can out heal them with Warrior signet. That makes Zerker one of the most Viable builds … So my thought was that maby if you couldn’t outheal your enemies? You still will kill them as fast as before, you can still dodge their attacks (You are rewarded for your skills) and Zerker will still be a Viable stat for good players but honestly at the moment you don’t have to be any darn good to play with Zerker stats in PvE (Not including Silverwastes, Teq or Evolved Jungle Wurm).

Hmm.. I am going to try explain it better…

Less base healing = Will make it harder to survive for everyone.
More effectivness to Healing Power = Will in the end with maxed out healing power even out the Healing Power making it just as good as maxed out healing power is now. That is you will not heal to much to be able to outheal everything.
Zerker meta will still be viable = Harder to survive but still as strong as before and timed dodge, Blocks and evades will have an even more important role for Zerkers.

I dunno… I am no good at this, but it is an idéa.

Nobody says you can only complete content with zerker gear, it just happens to be that you do not benefit at all from any other combos because you use your other tools to avoid being smacked. Try to complete any dungeon with a group of cleric’s guards traited 01661 and with runes of mercy. You WILL do it, but the lame zerkers will have done half a dungeon sweep by the time you do one path of a single dungeon.

The idea behind the zerker meta is… you do not get hit because you use your active defenses smart. You have blocks, invulnerability, projectile blocks, reflects, immunities, dodge, condi cleanse(though most people think it’s not needed… sigh), positioning.

This actually makes the PvE fights more interesting as you have to use the active defenses or you’ll die.

Sigh.

Yet again this thread is going over ground that has been discussed before.
Ideas that have been suggested before.

but GG circle talkers.
I guess the mods aren’t bright enough to merge/lock the meta threads.

edit:
looky
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/lets-talk-healing-power-and-roles/first

another thread talking about gear stats running concurrently.

serenke.4806:

This actually makes the PvE fights more interesting as you have to use the active defenses or you’ll die.

For dungeons this is a load of BS (in my opinion) as I have been in some (Not many) Zerker groups now and the most important thing to remember is where to stack and what skills to use to reflect, mitigate or outheal damage in a blob full of NPCS and players where you can’t see anything but flashy effects. Well okay, you will “have to” use active defenses but it isn’t very skillfull play as you more or less just throw it out as soon as the fight starts. There are some bosses some enemies that needs more planning but this is true for players with other stats to as bosses hits so hard that their thoughness, Vitality or healing power doesn’t help anyway and THAT is why people go for Zerker becouse you die from a hit anyway.

So people stack with Zerkers to quicker kill lots of enemies before they kill you, if they kill one of your friends and no NPC dies it’s a quick ress if all four is stacked to help rez and also Boons like protection and might will be easier to stack up/renew to all members if you stack up and finally skills like reflect will mostly protect everyone from NPC’s that are ranged.

If I would go with a Zerker group and starting to run around and fight my enmies head on I would get kicked before I could say ‘Hi’.

Zerker needs skills to stay alive yes, as you are glass. Zerker team in dungeons needs no skills as you will mostly stack and kill.

EdgarMTanaka.7291:

serenke.4806:

This actually makes the PvE fights more interesting as you have to use the active defenses or you’ll die.

For dungeons this is a load of BS (in my opinion) as I have been in some (Not many) Zerker groups now and the most important thing to remember is where to stack and what skills to use to reflect, mitigate or outheal damage in a blob full of NPCS and players where you can’t see anything but flashy effects. Well okay, you will “have to” use active defenses but it isn’t very skillfull play as you more or less just throw it out as soon as the fight starts. There are some bosses some enemies that needs more planning but this is true for players with other stats to as bosses hits so hard that their thoughness, Vitality or healing power doesn’t help anyway and THAT is why people go for Zerker becouse you die from a hit anyway.

So people stack with Zerkers to quicker kill lots of enemies before they kill you, if they kill one of your friends and no NPC dies it’s a quick ress if all four is stacked to help rez and also Boons like protection and might will be easier to stack up/renew to all members if you stack up and finally skills like reflect will mostly protect everyone from NPC’s that are ranged.

If I would go with a Zerker group and starting to run around and fight my enmies head on I would get kicked before I could say ‘Hi’.

Zerker needs skills to stay alive yes, as you are glass. Zerker team in dungeons needs no skills as you will mostly stack and kill.

most content is designed so people with bad pings can still get active defences off.
Many of them are extremely long compared to the window in which they need to be up.

This is to make things easier to learn.

The best still find the tells for things in those particle effects and time things precisely to achieve maximum effect.

however there are still a vast majority of players that have no idea when/how to use the right skills at all. Many who won’t replace a useless skill, for one which can change the fate of an encounter.

Classic “I know how to play like a pro” but really don’t. I hear this all the time from abusive pugs.

OP can’t be taken serious right after first sentence where he’s assuming “most players” do anything.
Changing stats will do nothing. Encounters should be changed. Creatures in GW1 had vulnerabilities and immunes to different conditions. Why not use it in GW2? Why stone elemental can bleed? Why turrets are going to bleed or be poisoned? This is ridiculous.

tramwajarz.2369:

OP can’t be taken serious right after first sentence where he’s assuming “most players” do anything.
Changing stats will do nothing. Encounters should be changed. Creatures in GW1 had vulnerabilities and immunes to different conditions. Why not use it in GW2? Why stone elemental can bleed? Why turrets are going to bleed or be poisoned? This is ridiculous.

Aren’t turrets already immune to conditions? It’s one of the most common complaints about them that I’ve heard.

They will be changed to be crit and vuln to conditions, which means buildings can bleed which is RIDICULOUS.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/Proposed-Changes-for-Engineer-Turrets/first

Artemis Thuras.8795:

Lyndis.4653:

I don’t think your suggestion is the right way to do it.

If I were to handle this issue I’d just change the curve of both precision and ferocity so that going full zerk/assassin has a less drastic impact.

For instance 40% chance and +100% damage without zerk and 50% chance +125% damage with.

This way the zerk/assassin gear still gives optimum damage but others spec become more interesting because they don’t need to sacrifice so much to get their stats.

Really? This discussion again?
Ok.

They already tried this but it didn’t work. Meta won’t change. It will just make people more picky, more kick happy. More QQ elitist scum kicked me. So, still think this is a good idea to punish good players?

Game is not the exclusive domain of casual bad players.
Ktnxbai.

Hey chill out !

I just explained my view on the matter, I’m not the one who started the thread and don’t have too much problem with the current meta.

Your answer is not constructive since :

-You say they tested it without source/quote/proof… I don’t follow those forums daily so I can’t tell to what extent what you say is true.

-You say it didn’t work without explaining why it didn’t work. This is the most important part of the discussion if something failed ! We cannot discuss an alternative solution without this information you didn’t provide. Do you know what it was ?

-The rest of your post makes no sense. Being less handicaped by non-zerk players will make zerk players more picky and kick-happy ? There’s no punishment for good players (I’m not talking about nerfing zerk) but only less punishment for less skilled players. (The numbers I gave were just for comparison’s sake, I don’t know the actual values zerk gear gives, I play too many games to recall each ones’ specifics).

Please don’t answer if you’re not willing to actually discuss the matter.

the most important question in my opinion hasn´t been answered in any of these threads: Why exactly?

Algreg.3629:

the most important question in my opinion hasn´t been answered in any of these threads: Why exactly?

+1 That´s what I´m curious about every time a new “nerf zerker QQ”-thread comes up and nobody was able to give me a concise and convincing answer yet.

Fyi, “I don´t like it” is not a valid answer.

Algreg.3629:

the most important question in my opinion hasn´t been answered in any of these threads: Why exactly?

Because playing healer is cool I think.

The reason why these threads pop up is because people don’t understand this game and instead of learning it they want to make it more typical, boring trinity mmo.

And because search function on forums is not working.

Lyndis.4653:

Artemis Thuras.8795:

Lyndis.4653:

I don’t think your suggestion is the right way to do it.

If I were to handle this issue I’d just change the curve of both precision and ferocity so that going full zerk/assassin has a less drastic impact.

For instance 40% chance and +100% damage without zerk and 50% chance +125% damage with.

This way the zerk/assassin gear still gives optimum damage but others spec become more interesting because they don’t need to sacrifice so much to get their stats.

Really? This discussion again?
Ok.

They already tried this but it didn’t work. Meta won’t change. It will just make people more picky, more kick happy. More QQ elitist scum kicked me. So, still think this is a good idea to punish good players?

Game is not the exclusive domain of casual bad players.
Ktnxbai.

Hey chill out !

I just explained my view on the matter, I’m not the one who started the thread and don’t have too much problem with the current meta.

Your answer is not constructive since :

-You say they tested it without source/quote/proof… I don’t follow those forums daily so I can’t tell to what extent what you say is true.

-You say it didn’t work without explaining why it didn’t work. This is the most important part of the discussion if something failed ! We cannot discuss an alternative solution without this information you didn’t provide. Do you know what it was ?

-The rest of your post makes no sense. Being less handicaped by non-zerk players will make zerk players more picky and kick-happy ? There’s no punishment for good players (I’m not talking about nerfing zerk) but only less punishment for less skilled players. (The numbers I gave were just for comparison’s sake, I don’t know the actual values zerk gear gives, I play too many games to recall each ones’ specifics).

Please don’t answer if you’re not willing to actually discuss the matter.

Would you like me to go find the patch notes from when they nerfed crit damage into ferocity?

IT is a widely known fact. I didn’t think it needed proof. but here you go:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/updates/Game-Update-Notes-April-15-2014/first#post3896042

What evidence do I have that it didnt work?

Well we still have zerker meta dont we?

GG.

Skoigoth.9238:

Algreg.3629:

the most important question in my opinion hasn´t been answered in any of these threads: Why exactly?

+1 That´s what I´m curious about every time a new “nerf zerker QQ”-thread comes up and nobody was able to give me a concise and convincing answer yet.

Fyi, “I don´t like it” is not a valid answer.

It’s pretty much the only justification we get though.

Or " I like how it works in other games"
(- so go play them then??)

Or just fluffy posts full of meaningless talk

Artemis Thuras.8795:

Would you like me to go find the patch notes from when they nerfed crit damage into ferocity?

IT is a widely known fact. I didn’t think it needed proof. but here you go:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/updates/Game-Update-Notes-April-15-2014/first#post3896042

What evidence do I have that it didnt work?

Well we still have zerker meta dont we?

GG.

Well you misunderstood me if you think what I am talking about is close to the ferocity nerf.

I am not talking about lowering the highest amount of damage that can be reached but about increasing the base amount of damage you have regardless of gear. I stated that very clearly in my previous post.

Even though both my suggestion and the ferocity nerf are about changing stat curves, they don’t have the same purpose and I am for a much more drastic change than what was done.

The only problem I have with my own suggestion is that it could make characters too good when having near max damage while having high support stats. Even then, if those support options are unneeded zerk is still king but noone cares whether you run zerk or not unless you’re going for world records :p

You might want to quit the arrogant tone and read more accurately instead.

drtoszi.2967:

“This isn’t a balance question. This is the fact the game was designed to work this way, and people no long need to be held back by needing x build to do content. People get to play what’s fun to them, and the speed-clear optimization meta is going to remain no matter what happens, no matter the game.”

Excuse me, but I’d like to point out that isn’t this exactly the argument?

You’re saying that “people no longer NEED to be held back by needing X build,” but it’s becoming increasingly common in-game that you do NEED to be Berserker or kicked.

It’s pretty much the reason why I’ve just given up on PVE and spend 90% of my time in PVP. At least there skilled people can make any build work and can lead to some surprises

For example, I met a hybrid (as in amulet wise) PP thief just a while ago that had a top spot on the kill board. It was mad fun since you usually never see that work, but they made it work!

This is a reference to my post so I’ll respond.

No. You don’t need berserker. Period. People want it for faster runs.

In many games, groups require a certain class of build x or y to complete the content in any way, shape, or form. There becomes zero ability to even complete the content without that dependency being fulfilled by someone of a certain build. This creates LFG problems and huge content dependencies. This is what GW2 deliberately tried to avoid doing in its development.

What you’re seeing now is an optimization strategy. In many trinity-based games, the same thing occurs; the whole healer/tank/DPS thing by class is also often a player-made creation where people get so used to clearing content this way it’s universally accepted as being necessary or “the way to do things.”

There is zero benefit to nerfing/removing berserker gear in regards to community toxicity. It just changes to what they’re arguing.

I feel like I’ve had this conversation before…

Just make the AI smarter in PvE. Give them real skill bars like they had in GW1 and the intelligence to use them. Set up some of them to run in ‘packs’ with synergized builds (like hylek and some other critters did).

Having a thinking foe is the (part of) reason zerk is not the meta in pvp. (Don’t get me wrong, people still run glass, but there is great risk in doing so) You see a greater variety of set ups in that game mode. If we could get even a minor semblance of that in pve AI, it might shake things up a bit.

Akusokuzan.6790:

True people will tend to gravitate towards certain builds, but I feel this could possibly help to make a more ambiguous “best stat combo”.

For all of ten minutes before a number cruncher calculates that best stat combo, I suppose. Then you get maybe a month of novelty while people learn the new best rotation, then within three you’ve got the same bitter “meta” whining again.

What you guys seem to forget when demanding to raise the AI of mobs is that most of you will die.
One of my favourite PvE bosses is the Candycorn Viscont of the Halloween Labyrinth, he was deadly when fighting ranged, I think or it was possible but harder than melee and you have to get a sugar buff to become immune against his special attacks. But the trick with the sugar buff is that you can only have so many stacks until you’re knocked out.
People didn’t get it.
They worked with reflections and whatnot although this boss is rather easy to understand, even without looking it up and I explained it many times so people should’ve had a clue about it.
Raise the AI and the open world events will become less fun as they won’t work as a lot if not most people will fail to understand the mechanics.

tramwajarz.2369:

They will be changed to be crit and vuln to conditions, which means buildings can bleed which is RIDICULOUS.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/Proposed-Changes-for-Engineer-Turrets/first

Well, you can bleed fluid lines.

I couldnt resist.

Reasons to nerf Berserker gear offered so far… My responses on parenthesizes.

1. Bored. (you’re bored of the content. playing a healer won’t make doing AC more fun)

2. Diversity is a good goal. (We already have build diversity. gear diversity is enforced naturally by the challenge or lack thereof of the content)

3. I enjoy playing other roles than DPS… (so go play them, no one is stopping you!)

4. …but I don’t want to be ineffective. (So you really just want your roleplay build to get buffed)

5. Different gear should enable different playstyles. (Actually, it doesn’t have to do anything. There is no law that says that. Anet designed the game to have traits be a more meaningful determinant of your playstyle than your gear. Simply put, you WANT gear to enable playstyles but that is a far cry from saying is SHOULD enable playstyles.)

6. It makes the game too easy, fights are over before you have to dodge. (Thats a content problem not a gear problem. People who solo bosses take minutes to kill them and dodge a lot and wear berserker so they aren’t being blown up in seconds)

7. In Silverwastes Berserker isn’t meta (It is, but either you aren’t skilled enough to survive or you are but just aren’t aware of it.)

8. Well they should eliminate all gear stats and make all gear the same. (no one here disagrees)

9. Berserker isn’t fun for me. (That’s probably a content issue. Or a roleplaying issue. Or an issue of you not referring to my response to #3)

Jana.6831:

What you guys seem to forget when demanding to raise the AI of mobs is that most of you will die.
One of my favourite PvE bosses is the Candycorn Viscont of the Halloween Labyrinth, he was deadly when fighting ranged, I think or it was possible but harder than melee and you have to get a sugar buff to become immune against his special attacks. But the trick with the sugar buff is that you can only have so many stacks until you’re knocked out.
People didn’t get it.
They worked with reflections and whatnot although this boss is rather easy to understand, even without looking it up and I explained it many times so people should’ve had a clue about it.
Raise the AI and the open world events will become less fun as they won’t work as a lot if not most people will fail to understand the mechanics.

I’m all for a challenge. I’m well aware that upping the AI would probably result in me being dead more often, but learning is part of the fun.

It’s fine to have some zones or some events where dodging is enough, or just plain passive defense is enough and you can just autoattack to your hearts desire, but that lands us right where we are right now. You end up with the mentality that unless you’re running a specific gear set, you’re “bad.” That unless you’re running that specific gear set you’re “detrimental.” That the one specific gear set is the only way to play. None of which is actually true.

Changing up the AI so that is more ‘life like’ is going to force some people to rethink their set up because its going to be more risk than they can handle. Yes, there will still be some that run all glass and are just fine, but probably not as many. Yes, there will be some that just don’t get it, but that doesn’t mean they won’t be able to complete it.

NikeEU.7690:

Reasons to nerf Berserker gear offered so far… My responses on parenthesizes.

1. Bored. (you’re bored of the content. playing a healer won’t make doing AC more fun)

2. Diversity is a good goal. (We already have build diversity. gear diversity is enforced naturally by the challenge or lack thereof of the content)

3. I enjoy playing other roles than DPS… (so go play them, no one is stopping you!)

4. …but I don’t want to be ineffective. (So you really just want your roleplay build to get buffed)

5. Different gear should enable different playstyles. (Actually, it doesn’t have to do anything. There is no law that says that. Anet designed the game to have traits be a more meaningful determinant of your playstyle than your gear. Simply put, you WANT gear to enable playstyles but that is a far cry from saying is SHOULD enable playstyles.)

6. It makes the game too easy, fights are over before you have to dodge. (Thats a content problem not a gear problem. People who solo bosses take minutes to kill them and dodge a lot and wear berserker so they aren’t being blown up in seconds)

7. In Silverwastes Berserker isn’t meta (It is, but either you aren’t skilled enough to survive or you are but just aren’t aware of it.)

8. Well they should eliminate all gear stats and make all gear the same. (no one here disagrees)

9. Berserker isn’t fun for me. (That’s probably a content issue. Or a roleplaying issue. Or an issue of you not referring to my response to #3)

Can we have this comprehensive guide stickied please?

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

I’m all for a challenge. I’m well aware that upping the AI would probably result in me being dead more often, but learning is part of the fun.

Since a lot of open world events are group events all of you/us would fail if most of you fail -has happened a lot in the past. I haven’t really been to the silverwastes, mostly because I despise all the clutter I have to carry around to be on that map, but I guess there’s bad blood as well.

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

It’s fine to have some zones or some events where dodging is enough, or just plain passive defense is enough and you can just autoattack to your hearts desire, but that lands us right where we are right now. You end up with the mentality that unless you’re running a specific gear set, you’re “bad.” That unless you’re running that specific gear set you’re “detrimental.” That the one specific gear set is the only way to play. None of which is actually true.

It wouldn’t change, no matter what, zerker would still be the gear for the most skilled players and of course players want to play with the most skilled players; either because they think they belong to the most skilled players as well or because it makes stuff easier for them. 2 skilled players are usually enough to carry 3 others through a dungeon/fractal – well, a high level fractal needs maybe 3 skilled players.

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Changing up the AI so that is more ‘life like’ is going to force some people to rethink their set up because its going to be more risk than they can handle. Yes, there will still be some that run all glass and are just fine, but probably not as many. Yes, there will be some that just don’t get it, but that doesn’t mean they won’t be able to complete it.

Don’t know what you want actually, because it is like that right now. If you can’t handle content full glass, then go more defensive and even if you can handle it you can go more defensive, no one forces you to wear this or that gear and you don’t have to join “zerkers only” groups either.

Edit: Punctuation and missing spaces (I reallyy should rethink my keyboard choice).

Zenos Osgorma.2936:

this new content [in HoT] won’t be so easily dps’ed into the ground

If i had a penny for every time i heard that one in mmo circles!

Jana.6831:

Since a lot of open world events are group events all of you/us would fail if most of you fail -has happened a lot in the past. I haven’t really been to the silverwastes, mostly because I despise all the clutter I have to carry around to be on that map, but I guess there’s bad blood as well.

You mean like Tequatl and Wurm once upon a time? It’s only challenging until it’s learned, and eventually even new AI would be learned, so you’re issue with it failing would be short lived. Just like with Viscount and Lich during Halloween. By the end of the event, every group I was in walked right over them without any issue.

Jana.6831:

It wouldn’t change, no matter what, zerker would still be the gear for the most skilled players and of course players want to play with the most skilled players; either because they think they belong to the most skilled players as well or because it makes stuff easier for them. 2 skilled players are usually enough to carry 3 others through a dungeon/fractal – well, a high level fractal needs maybe 3 skilled players.

Yes, zerk would still be the gear for the most skilled players. And being able to wear it might actually mean something, though maybe not. However, that pool of players would be smaller, and it would also help to reduce the mentality that you ‘have’ to play the content in ‘x’ gear.

We’re also discussing more than just dungeons and fractals here.

Jana.6831:

Don’t know what you want actually, because it is like that right now. If you can’t handle content full glass, then go more defensive and even if you can handle it you can go more defensive, no one forces you to wear this or that gear and you don’t have to join “zerkers only” groups either.

Lol no, the PvE AI is far from ‘life like.’ I’m talking about making the pve creature AI more like a thinking human being like you would face of against in pvp. The current AI is no where close, which is why there is 0 risk to running full glass (unless you have connection issues or can’t mitigate your dodges well).

You are correct, no one forces someone to wear full zerkers. However, people do tend to get tired of being spat on for not doing so. Even when they don’t join the “zerker only” groups. Its a mentality that needs to change.

Where do you get your knowledge about HoT content?
Because there wasn’t much in news yet and when I played beta event, the so-called “boss” wyvern was like any other world boss – avoid 1 attack, pew pew like no tomorrow.

Akusokuzan.6790:

Ok, so most of us playing the game know that if you want significant DPS you use equips with berserker stats. On top of that people can trait build to get some ridiculous damage as opposed to say somebody who uses carrion or knight equips. That isn’t to say you can’t do any acceptable damage with any other build, berserker just happens to be the most effective due to many bosses and dungeon enemies having really large HP pools that can take forever to kill without some high stable DPS. The longer you take to kill a powerful enemy/dangerous player, the more at risk you are of dying yourself.

My proposal to the community is to somewhat nerf berserker and rearrange various other nomenclature to aid in spreading power across the board. Using the table of stats provided here, I would like to discuss these suggestions:

• Changing berserker to [power, precision, condition damage]
• Removing the assassin’s name and adding a new [precision, power, vitality]
• Adding a new [precision, power, healing power]
• Adding more vitality primary options with precision and ferocity among 2 new ones
• Adding a new condition damage primary with ferocity included
• Adding more condition duration and boon duration nomenclature

The main objective with these changes would be to avoid pairing precision with ferocity as both together give much larger burst damage potential than any other purely power based grouping. The final part to the proposal would be to add in a new ferocity based boon. It could be added as a part of might at +15 per stack at level 80 to gain a +25% increase to critical damage at 25 stacks, or it could be a stand alone boon similar to fury.

Of course these changes would be extremely drastic on the way the people build their character’s skills, equipment and traits so it would definitely upset a fairly large number of people, however I believe it would be the first step in making any other build competent in dealing significant damage within a party either with burst or stable DPS. To aid in mitigating outrage at having to reacquire new statted equipment as a result of berserker having different properties, stat reassignment coupons could be distributed to every character to allow players to keep their equipment but have the stats they now desire.

This post is merely a hypothetical change to the game that could much further be refined at the discretion of ANet of course. Anyways, what are your thoughts on these suggestions guys?

tl;dr – make the game take much longer and change a lot of stuff around possibly breaking PVE, PVP ans WvW completely in order for people to ask for another gear set ping when you want to run with efficient players.

You can’t make a “more ambiguous best stat combo” because you’re contradicting yourself. The best stat combo is just that. THE BEST.

You can only have one combo that’s THE BEST at clearing dungeons and mobs quickly and people will ask for it and it will become the new meta.

Look at it this way – Assassin isn’t very different from berserker and people still prefer zerker over it. Why would you think the situation would be different between other sets that differ more?

People min/max. Live with it. Your suggestion isn’t fixing anything because ultimately it has nothing to do with stats and everything to do with people wanting to play a certain way.

What way is that? Reward driven.

Cuddy.6247:

There’s already ambiguity in “best stat combo.” Play in WvW, PvP or do different open world content (Triple Wurm, e.g. can’t be critted). If there’s anything ANet needs to do, is return to Guild Wars 1 where they politely ask you to take a break from the game, and get more passive-aggressive each time. Large multiplayer communities would see great improvement if people weren’t constantly obsessed with the state of the game and had a well-rounded outlook of comparison.

You do realize a F2P model means the longer they keep you in the game and the more invested in the game you are the more money they’re going to make off you via the gem store right?

It is most certainly not in their interest to tell you to take a break or to not want you glued to your GW2 as much as possible.

They even attempted to push this very hard via the 2 week cycle Living Story that you can only do during those two weeks.

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

You mean like Tequatl and Wurm once upon a time? It’s only challenging until it’s learned, and eventually even new AI would be learned, so you’re issue with it failing would be short lived. Just like with Viscount and Lich during Halloween. By the end of the event, every group I was in walked right over them without any issue.

Yes until it’s learned. It doesn’t really matter whether or not there’s 20 new people at teq but new players need a bit to understand the mechanics, so add 50 new people to teq and it will fail.
And even if you would add more AI it would be boring for you after 3 weeks again whereas new people would fail – I don’t know if it’s really that hard to understand. And the people who I ran with (was a lot) haven’t learned the halloween mechanics until the end. They just didn’t do the Lich anymore and died to the Labyrinth Horror.

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Yes, zerk would still be the gear for the most skilled players. And being able to wear it might actually mean something, though maybe not. However, that pool of players would be smaller, and it would also help to reduce the mentality that you ‘have’ to play the content in ‘x’ gear.

I don’t think so, like I explained previously. “What, the gear for the most skilledplayers is zerker? Then I’m zerker!”

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

We’re also discussing more than just dungeons and fractals here.

So?

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Lol no, the PvE AI is far from ‘life like.’ I’m talking about making the pve creature AI more like a thinking human being like you would face of against in pvp. The current AI is no where close, which is why there is 0 risk to running full glass (unless you have connection issues or can’t mitigate your dodges well).

You are correct, no one forces someone to wear full zerkers. However, people do tend to get tired of being spat on for not doing so. Even when they don’t join the “zerker only” groups. Its a mentality that needs to change.

Ok, so where should players then learn this game when PvE becomes like pvp/wvw?

Edit: Well, I’m probably not against adding more “intelligent” bosses to the world – it’s fine unless it’s forever, so the mechanics of that boss are really widely known, like teq, for example, it’s just that I do teq in my zerkers gear and I am bored. Ilove the first phase though as I try to dodge right under his feet (the most fun I have) and I get partially annoyed when others don’t get the mechanics – I barely bicker just when things really look as if they’re about to fail. The funny thing about teq is that there is some kind of “trinity” but people either haven’t gotten it yet or don’t mention it. There are classes who are best at battery x,y or z.
But – I don’t think that more AI would promote different gear choices and even if it would be some sort of elitism again – I got a lot of hate when I said I was doing teq in zerkers ;)

Jana.6831:

Yes until it’s learned. It doesn’t really matter whether or not there’s 20 new people at teq but new players need a bit to understand the mechanics, so add 50 new people to teq and it will fail.

Which is part of a lot of people’s complaint. Nothing seemingly ever fails. It’s “too” easy. Now regardless that eventually we’ll get to the same general point again, I can agree that the AI in the pve content does make it a tad easy…and boring. We kill things so fast in the current set up that generally speaking, the creature just ends up standing there getting beat on. That’s not really any fun.

Jana.6831:

And even if you would add more AI it would be boring for you after 3 weeks again whereas new people would fail – I don’t know if it’s really that hard to understand. And the people who I ran with (was a lot) haven’t learned the halloween mechanics until the end. They just didn’t do the Lich anymore and died to the Labyrinth Horror.

Yes, eventually everything will be learned again and it would be easier, but I was shooting for at least still entertaining because the creature wouldn’t be dying in 3 hits and wouldn’t just be standing there taking it.

And yikes, you had some terrible luck with Halloween then. The first couple of days, yes, most people I ran with had issues with Horror and Lich, but by day 4 not so much. Viscount and Horror were downed every time they popped. Lich, people would check if we had enough boon removal, and skip if we didn’t (normally not an issue though).

Jana.6831:

I don’t think so, like I explained previously. “What, the gear for the most skilledplayers is zerker? Then I’m zerker!”

People do that now, and can’t survive wearing it. So that part wouldn’t change. You’re always going to have some of that. You’ve completely sidestepped the original point I was trying to make.

Jana.6831:

So?

face…desk

Really? So there’s no point in looking at the broader picture at all? The game should just revolve around dungeons and fractals? I guess then we should just nix open world all together.

Jana.6831:

Ok, so where should players then learn this game when PvE becomes like pvp/wvw?

Starter zones exist for a reason. The AI could become progressively more intelligent as the zones get harder.

Lyndis.4653:

Artemis Thuras.8795:

Would you like me to go find the patch notes from when they nerfed crit damage into ferocity?

IT is a widely known fact. I didn’t think it needed proof. but here you go:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/updates/Game-Update-Notes-April-15-2014/first#post3896042

What evidence do I have that it didnt work?

Well we still have zerker meta dont we?

GG.

Well you misunderstood me if you think what I am talking about is close to the ferocity nerf.

I am not talking about lowering the highest amount of damage that can be reached but about increasing the base amount of damage you have regardless of gear. I stated that very clearly in my previous post.

Even though both my suggestion and the ferocity nerf are about changing stat curves, they don’t have the same purpose and I am for a much more drastic change than what was done.

The only problem I have with my own suggestion is that it could make characters too good when having near max damage while having high support stats. Even then, if those support options are unneeded zerk is still king but noone cares whether you run zerk or not unless you’re going for world records :p

You might want to quit the arrogant tone and read more accurately instead.

I’m sorry, I shall take more time to read walls of text that are just QQ damage output in future. /sarcasm.

Azure The Heartless.3261:

NikeEU.7690:

Reasons to nerf Berserker gear offered so far… My responses on parenthesizes.

1. Bored. (you’re bored of the content. playing a healer won’t make doing AC more fun)

2. Diversity is a good goal. (We already have build diversity. gear diversity is enforced naturally by the challenge or lack thereof of the content)

3. I enjoy playing other roles than DPS… (so go play them, no one is stopping you!)

4. …but I don’t want to be ineffective. (So you really just want your roleplay build to get buffed)

5. Different gear should enable different playstyles. (Actually, it doesn’t have to do anything. There is no law that says that. Anet designed the game to have traits be a more meaningful determinant of your playstyle than your gear. Simply put, you WANT gear to enable playstyles but that is a far cry from saying is SHOULD enable playstyles.)

6. It makes the game too easy, fights are over before you have to dodge. (Thats a content problem not a gear problem. People who solo bosses take minutes to kill them and dodge a lot and wear berserker so they aren’t being blown up in seconds)

7. In Silverwastes Berserker isn’t meta (It is, but either you aren’t skilled enough to survive or you are but just aren’t aware of it.)

8. Well they should eliminate all gear stats and make all gear the same. (no one here disagrees)

9. Berserker isn’t fun for me. (That’s probably a content issue. Or a roleplaying issue. Or an issue of you not referring to my response to #3)

Can we have this comprehensive guide stickied please?

+1

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

And yikes, you had some terrible luck with Halloween then. The first couple of days, yes, most people I ran with had issues with Horror and Lich, but by day 4 not so much. Viscount and Horror were downed every time they popped. Lich, people would check if we had enough boon removal, and skip if we didn’t (normally not an issue though).

I didn’t really mind, I just thought it was kind of sad that peopledidn’t learn the mechanics, especially since I liked the viscont that much.
And I myself failed to see the movements of the lich and I wonder if it’s me or all this disco-clutter -that bugs me to this day-I will try harder next halloween.

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

People do that now, and can’t survive wearing it. So that part wouldn’t change. You’re always going to have some of that. You’ve completely sidestepped the original point I was trying to make.

Then it seems as if I didn’t get your point.

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

face…desk

Really? So there’s no point in looking at the broader picture at all? The game should just revolve around dungeons and fractals? I guess then we should just nix open world all together.

You do realize that I was talking about more than just dungeons and fractals, right?

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Starter zones exist for a reason. The AI could become progressively more intelligent as the zones get harder.

Problem is that leveling is that fast that people don’t spend too much time in starter zones and if the mobs become too hard people would either whine or quit.

Edit: And in fact if you look at all the “But I want trinity” or “I want build diversity” threads it is obvious that the people have no clue about their classes/the game, so those who want all this stuff don’t even know what they’ve got.

NikeEU.7690:

Reasons to nerf Berserker gear offered so far… My responses on parenthesizes.

1. Bored. (you’re bored of the content. playing a healer won’t make doing AC more fun)

2. Diversity is a good goal. (We already have build diversity. gear diversity is enforced naturally by the challenge or lack thereof of the content)

3. I enjoy playing other roles than DPS… (so go play them, no one is stopping you!)

4. …but I don’t want to be ineffective. (So you really just want your roleplay build to get buffed)

5. Different gear should enable different playstyles. (Actually, it doesn’t have to do anything. There is no law that says that. Anet designed the game to have traits be a more meaningful determinant of your playstyle than your gear. Simply put, you WANT gear to enable playstyles but that is a far cry from saying is SHOULD enable playstyles.)

6. It makes the game too easy, fights are over before you have to dodge. (Thats a content problem not a gear problem. People who solo bosses take minutes to kill them and dodge a lot and wear berserker so they aren’t being blown up in seconds)

7. In Silverwastes Berserker isn’t meta (It is, but either you aren’t skilled enough to survive or you are but just aren’t aware of it.)

8. Well they should eliminate all gear stats and make all gear the same. (no one here disagrees)

9. Berserker isn’t fun for me. (That’s probably a content issue. Or a roleplaying issue. Or an issue of you not referring to my response to #3)

Best summary.

I am all for berserker builds and I am all for only skilled players should be able to make the best use out of berserker builds. But that just isn’t the case in the current state of PvE and especially in dungeons. Currently this is the easiest way of clearing dungeons and involves very little skill play.
1Guardian/ 1 Phalanx Str Warrior/ 1Thief/ 2Staff eles.
1: Stealth through all mobs to go to boss.(Save all your long cooldowns)
2: Guardian use aegis before boss becomes active. Warrior just spam Greatsword and drop banners. 2Staff eles does Glyph of Storm Lightning swap to fire, ice bow 5-4. And boss is dead.

You don’t get hit and there is very little active play and you have literally buffed your party’s DPS significantly by doing almost nothing but spamming, it is very scripted and you can literally teach anyone who is willing to learn this type of strategy.

TL:DR you don’t need to be a skilled player to play berserker builds effectively.

Edit: I am addressing my problem with Berserker group composition meta.

EcoRI.9273:

I am all for berserker builds and I am all for only skilled players should be able to make the best use out of berserker builds. But that just isn’t the case in the current state of PvE and especially in dungeons. Currently this is the easiest way of clearing dungeons and involves very little skill play.
1Guardian/ 1 Phalanx Str Warrior/ 1Thief/ 2Staff eles.
1: Stealth through all mobs to go to boss.(Save all your long cooldowns)
2: Guardian use aegis before boss becomes active. Warrior just spam Greatsword and drop banners. 2Staff eles does Glyph of Storm Lightning swap to fire, ice bow 5-4. And boss is dead.

You don’t get hit and there is very little active play and you have literally buffed your party’s DPS significantly by doing almost nothing but spamming, it is very scripted and you can literally teach anyone who is willing to learn this type of strategy.

TL:DR you don’t need to be a skilled player to play berserker builds effectively.

You would be amazed how many ppl have no idea what their skills do.
And still zerk is not the easiest. There was already fractal 50 video posted with full cleric party facerolling content. That’s trivial.

P.S. casting aegis before boss goes active is wrong because it can be shattered by autoattack living party vulnerable to one-hit shot.

tramwajarz.2369:

EcoRI.9273:

I am all for berserker builds and I am all for only skilled players should be able to make the best use out of berserker builds. But that just isn’t the case in the current state of PvE and especially in dungeons. Currently this is the easiest way of clearing dungeons and involves very little skill play.
1Guardian/ 1 Phalanx Str Warrior/ 1Thief/ 2Staff eles.
1: Stealth through all mobs to go to boss.(Save all your long cooldowns)
2: Guardian use aegis before boss becomes active. Warrior just spam Greatsword and drop banners. 2Staff eles does Glyph of Storm Lightning swap to fire, ice bow 5-4. And boss is dead.

You don’t get hit and there is very little active play and you have literally buffed your party’s DPS significantly by doing almost nothing but spamming, it is very scripted and you can literally teach anyone who is willing to learn this type of strategy.

TL:DR you don’t need to be a skilled player to play berserker builds effectively.

You would be amazed how many ppl have no idea what their skills do.
And still zerk is not the easiest. There was already fractal 50 video posted with full cleric party facerolling content. That’s trivial.

P.S. casting aegis before boss goes active is wrong because it can be shattered by autoattack living party vulnerable to one-hit shot.

Ignorance =/= bad players.

Precasting aegis is the right way of playing the game at the moment. This ensures that every1 is at 100% hp for scholar buff during the icebow freeze instant nuke phase. And it also gives guardian 20%more dps with unscathed contender making the nuke phase even stronger.

EcoRI.9273:

I am all for berserker builds and I am all for only skilled players should be able to make the best use out of berserker builds. But that just isn’t the case in the current state of PvE and especially in dungeons. Currently this is the easiest way of clearing dungeons and involves very little skill play.
1Guardian/ 1 Phalanx Str Warrior/ 1Thief/ 2Staff eles.
1: Stealth through all mobs to go to boss.(Save all your long cooldowns)
2: Guardian use aegis before boss becomes active. Warrior just spam Greatsword and drop banners. 2Staff eles does Glyph of Storm Lightning swap to fire, ice bow 5-4. And boss is dead.

You don’t get hit and there is very little active play and you have literally buffed your party’s DPS significantly by doing almost nothing but spamming, it is very scripted and you can literally teach anyone who is willing to learn this type of strategy.

TL:DR you don’t need to be a skilled player to play berserker builds effectively.

Yes because all “zerkers” can do all of those things effortlessly.

Jana.6831:

I didn’t really mind, I just thought it was kind of sad that peopledidn’t learn the mechanics, especially since I liked the viscont that much.
And I myself failed to see the movements of the lich and I wonder if it’s me or all this disco-clutter -that bugs me to this day-I will try harder next halloween.

Probably all the disco clutter. That bugs me too from time to time. I often can’t actually see tells (and boy does it hurt).

Jana.6831:

Then it seems as if I didn’t get your point.

I’ll chalk it up to not feeling well and being mildly cognitively impaired due to it (ie: I’m exhausted), thus not presently my point as clearly as I could.

Jana.6831:

You do realize that I was talking about more than just dungeons and fractals, right?

I thought we were, then you went on the mild rant about carrying people in dungeons and fractals and I wasn’t sure anymore. I’ve come across a lot of people on this forum that seem to be of the opinion that the open world has no meaning and everything revolves around dungeons and fractals. However, any ‘pve’ change should affect dungeons and fractals to a certain extent, since they are ‘pve’ as well. Though, it doesn’t necessarily have to. It depends on how their code is done.

Jana.6831:

Problem is that leveling is that fast that people don’t spend too much time in starter zones and if the mobs become too hard people would either whine or quit.

It would definitely require some effort to be done in a way that it doesn’t necessarily make people feel this way. It should be a gradual ramp up, enough to make you feel like you’re getting stronger, that your foes are more challenging, but not so much so that you want to throw your mouse through a window. Now, if you try going directly from like…Wayfarer’s to Frostgorge…ok yeah, that should just be an obvious ‘oh kitten.’ However, I think we could make the AI more intelligent and offer a bit more challenge without making it ‘too hard’ for the average player. As others have pointed out before, it’s been severely dumbed down since the original betas and I think they went a tad overboard.

Jana.6831:

Edit: And in fact if you look at all the “But I want trinity” or “I want build diversity” threads it is obvious that the people have no clue about their classes/the game, so those who want all this stuff don’t even know what they’ve got.

Always going to have that to an extent. Even in games that have the things they are asking for. Hell I’m guilty of it myself. Can’t please everyone unfortunately.

DonQuack.9025:

EcoRI.9273:

I am all for berserker builds and I am all for only skilled players should be able to make the best use out of berserker builds. But that just isn’t the case in the current state of PvE and especially in dungeons. Currently this is the easiest way of clearing dungeons and involves very little skill play.
1Guardian/ 1 Phalanx Str Warrior/ 1Thief/ 2Staff eles.
1: Stealth through all mobs to go to boss.(Save all your long cooldowns)
2: Guardian use aegis before boss becomes active. Warrior just spam Greatsword and drop banners. 2Staff eles does Glyph of Storm Lightning swap to fire, ice bow 5-4. And boss is dead.

You don’t get hit and there is very little active play and you have literally buffed your party’s DPS significantly by doing almost nothing but spamming, it is very scripted and you can literally teach anyone who is willing to learn this type of strategy.

TL:DR you don’t need to be a skilled player to play berserker builds effectively.

Yes because all “zerkers” can do all of those things effortlessly.

Give me 4 random zerkers that you think are bad but can listen to me, I will make them into 3hour dungeon tour runners in 1 week.

EcoRI.9273:

tramwajarz.2369:

EcoRI.9273:

I am all for berserker builds and I am all for only skilled players should be able to make the best use out of berserker builds. But that just isn’t the case in the current state of PvE and especially in dungeons. Currently this is the easiest way of clearing dungeons and involves very little skill play.
1Guardian/ 1 Phalanx Str Warrior/ 1Thief/ 2Staff eles.
1: Stealth through all mobs to go to boss.(Save all your long cooldowns)
2: Guardian use aegis before boss becomes active. Warrior just spam Greatsword and drop banners. 2Staff eles does Glyph of Storm Lightning swap to fire, ice bow 5-4. And boss is dead.

You don’t get hit and there is very little active play and you have literally buffed your party’s DPS significantly by doing almost nothing but spamming, it is very scripted and you can literally teach anyone who is willing to learn this type of strategy.

TL:DR you don’t need to be a skilled player to play berserker builds effectively.

You would be amazed how many ppl have no idea what their skills do.
And still zerk is not the easiest. There was already fractal 50 video posted with full cleric party facerolling content. That’s trivial.

P.S. casting aegis before boss goes active is wrong because it can be shattered by autoattack living party vulnerable to one-hit shot.

Ignorance =/= bad players.

Precasting aegis is the right way of playing the game at the moment. This ensures that every1 is at 100% hp for scholar buff during the icebow freeze instant nuke phase. And it also gives guardian 20%more dps with unscathed contender making the nuke phase even stronger.

Actually the ignorance is followed by bad gameplay. Look at all the pugs still stacking at FGS spots. They have no clue what they’re doing and why.

The situation you are describing is a reward for good, organised players.
“We know the encounter, we are prepared for it, we execute our plan, we succeed faster than others”.

EcoRI.9273:

DonQuack.9025:

EcoRI.9273:

I am all for berserker builds and I am all for only skilled players should be able to make the best use out of berserker builds. But that just isn’t the case in the current state of PvE and especially in dungeons. Currently this is the easiest way of clearing dungeons and involves very little skill play.
1Guardian/ 1 Phalanx Str Warrior/ 1Thief/ 2Staff eles.
1: Stealth through all mobs to go to boss.(Save all your long cooldowns)
2: Guardian use aegis before boss becomes active. Warrior just spam Greatsword and drop banners. 2Staff eles does Glyph of Storm Lightning swap to fire, ice bow 5-4. And boss is dead.

You don’t get hit and there is very little active play and you have literally buffed your party’s DPS significantly by doing almost nothing but spamming, it is very scripted and you can literally teach anyone who is willing to learn this type of strategy.

TL:DR you don’t need to be a skilled player to play berserker builds effectively.

Yes because all “zerkers” can do all of those things effortlessly.

Give me 4 random zerkers that you think are bad but can listen to me, I will make them into 3hour dungeon tour runners in 1 week.

Hmm Almost as if you had to teach them a skill. Make them skilled?

tramwajarz.2369:

EcoRI.9273:

tramwajarz.2369:

EcoRI.9273:

I am all for berserker builds and I am all for only skilled players should be able to make the best use out of berserker builds. But that just isn’t the case in the current state of PvE and especially in dungeons. Currently this is the easiest way of clearing dungeons and involves very little skill play.
1Guardian/ 1 Phalanx Str Warrior/ 1Thief/ 2Staff eles.
1: Stealth through all mobs to go to boss.(Save all your long cooldowns)
2: Guardian use aegis before boss becomes active. Warrior just spam Greatsword and drop banners. 2Staff eles does Glyph of Storm Lightning swap to fire, ice bow 5-4. And boss is dead.

You don’t get hit and there is very little active play and you have literally buffed your party’s DPS significantly by doing almost nothing but spamming, it is very scripted and you can literally teach anyone who is willing to learn this type of strategy.

TL:DR you don’t need to be a skilled player to play berserker builds effectively.

You would be amazed how many ppl have no idea what their skills do.
And still zerk is not the easiest. There was already fractal 50 video posted with full cleric party facerolling content. That’s trivial.

P.S. casting aegis before boss goes active is wrong because it can be shattered by autoattack living party vulnerable to one-hit shot.

Ignorance =/= bad players.

Precasting aegis is the right way of playing the game at the moment. This ensures that every1 is at 100% hp for scholar buff during the icebow freeze instant nuke phase. And it also gives guardian 20%more dps with unscathed contender making the nuke phase even stronger.

Actually the ignorance is followed by bad gameplay. Look at all the pugs still stacking at FGS spots. They have no clue what they’re doing and why.

The situation you are describing is a reward for good, organised players.
“We know the encounter, we are prepared for it, we execute our plan, we succeed faster than others”.

Yes I agree with that but the thing is those habits can be corrected very easily. My problem is that the meta is too easy to learn and does not require much skill to learn them.

EcoRI.9273:

tramwajarz.2369:

EcoRI.9273:

tramwajarz.2369:

EcoRI.9273:

I am all for berserker builds and I am all for only skilled players should be able to make the best use out of berserker builds. But that just isn’t the case in the current state of PvE and especially in dungeons. Currently this is the easiest way of clearing dungeons and involves very little skill play.
1Guardian/ 1 Phalanx Str Warrior/ 1Thief/ 2Staff eles.
1: Stealth through all mobs to go to boss.(Save all your long cooldowns)
2: Guardian use aegis before boss becomes active. Warrior just spam Greatsword and drop banners. 2Staff eles does Glyph of Storm Lightning swap to fire, ice bow 5-4. And boss is dead.

You don’t get hit and there is very little active play and you have literally buffed your party’s DPS significantly by doing almost nothing but spamming, it is very scripted and you can literally teach anyone who is willing to learn this type of strategy.

TL:DR you don’t need to be a skilled player to play berserker builds effectively.

You would be amazed how many ppl have no idea what their skills do.
And still zerk is not the easiest. There was already fractal 50 video posted with full cleric party facerolling content. That’s trivial.

P.S. casting aegis before boss goes active is wrong because it can be shattered by autoattack living party vulnerable to one-hit shot.

Ignorance =/= bad players.

Precasting aegis is the right way of playing the game at the moment. This ensures that every1 is at 100% hp for scholar buff during the icebow freeze instant nuke phase. And it also gives guardian 20%more dps with unscathed contender making the nuke phase even stronger.

Actually the ignorance is followed by bad gameplay. Look at all the pugs still stacking at FGS spots. They have no clue what they’re doing and why.

The situation you are describing is a reward for good, organised players.
“We know the encounter, we are prepared for it, we execute our plan, we succeed faster than others”.

Yes I agree with that but the thing is those habits can be corrected very easily. My problem is that the meta is too easy to learn and does not require much skill to learn them.

Not so many people is eager to do so, so why should I care about those scrubs?
Those who are willing to learn have a very warm and cosy spot in my heart.