Guild Wars 2

on a similar track can anyone remember if there was any dps meter for GW1 raiding?

vesica tempestas.1563:

As you can probably guess, you are not the only player who has raided. i raided from pre wow through to start of cata, including casual through to hardcore competing directly with IS on silvermoon. level of player is irrelevant though.

As i said 10 years ago which was before tbc and yes during vanilla time when people did indeed do 40 man pug raids – recall, random pug to MC, the only concern was decursing correctly and wearing fire res gear, there was never any booting people because they didnt do x dps etc.

And yes from end of vanilla onward it started to change, that’s what i said. and the competitive nature did in fact evolve alongside meters- that’s no coincidence.

Ever wonder why there wasn’t the same level of anti social behavior in GW1 raids?

There was already competitive nature in the game before meters were allowed.

Speed run groups in dungeons trying to see if they can get the fastest times. These guys were usually in guilds and it was competitive to get into these guilds. You went through a trial period where you had to prove that you knew the dungeons and the meta to even be allowed into the guild.

PUG groups trying to do it as fast as PUG groups can go. The PUG groups had to rely on guesswork on who was the weakest link if there wasn’t a clear answer. And that usually relied on player bias as to what classes are the weakest link. Players used AP, gear, class, etc to gauge whether or not a player was worth having in their party. None of which actually gave any clue as to how good the player actually was in the dungeon.

Just reading the posts in this subforum that date from before HoT was released will show that this competitive nature that you said comes with meters was already present in the game.

many people enjoy playing their class and hate speed running ofc. GW1 is an interesting question is it not, why did it not have the kind of anti social problems you saw/see in wow?

People need to relive players will be against anything that shines the light on their shortcomings especially when it’s at the expense of others and want to be carried without allowing the others to know, it has been that way for along time in Mmos, they want to reap the benefits without actually being held accountable, nothing new and they will always complain to get stuff like DPS meters removed, which the meters that are used are misnomered as DPS meters when they Show much much more and should be considered Combat Efficacy meters since they track Boon uptime and so on.

vesica tempestas.1563:

on a similar track can anyone remember if there was any dps meter for GW1 raiding?

guild wars never ever had raiding at all !! only thing guild wars ever had was dungeons and maps you went into all by yourself when you left towns . and you had no minis as well to take out with you into maps when you left towns . it was just you and the map only .

oh also too you could not use any add ons at all . you just really lucky if you could use a overlay . to tell you what parts of a map you not been to yet . otherwise guild wars never ever had a add on or anything. for the fact you used any add on,s you got banned from the game and lost your acount

‘held accountable’ in a mmo game where the point is to enjoy content together, interesting viewpoint. So why isn’t dps meters needed in GW1, or 99% of GW2?

WARIORSCHARGEING.2637:

vesica tempestas.1563:

on a similar track can anyone remember if there was any dps meter for GW1 raiding?

guild wars never ever had raiding at all !! only thing guild wars ever had was dungeons and maps you went into all by yourself when you left towns . and you had no minis as well to take out with you into maps when you left towns . it was just you and the map only .

no, i remember doing instances with groups of players, probably not referred to as raids.

https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Urgoz's_Warren. party size 12.

vesica tempestas.1563:

‘held accountable’ in a mmo game where the point is to enjoy content together, interesting viewpoint. So why isn’t dps meters needed in GW1, or 99% of GW2?

And sometimes there are people whose views differ so much that they would not enjoy doing something together because that something highlights their differences.

Some people find enjoyment in simply trying to complete difficult content. Being successful doesn’t hinder their enjoyment.

Some people find enjoyment in completing difficult content. Failing to complete the difficult content is not fun for them.

Then there are people who fall in the middle. They don’t mind failing sometimes, but too many times and the fun wears off of the content.

For the first group, DPS meters don’t matter. They don’t need to know the exact numbers they or their group are doing.

For the second group, DPS meters help them ensure that they fail as few times as possible. Either by helping them figure out what rotation gives the group the best DPS or routing out the player who just wants to be carried.

Most people fall into the third group, with the number of failures they’ll tolerate varying from person to person. And DPS meters can help the players who have a low threshold for failures they’ll accept before the content ceases to be fun avoid failing too many times.

Everyone needs to remember that different people find different things fun and that failure affects people differently.

And DPS meters aren’t needed in any content in GW2. They’re wanted because they are helpful tools for players to get better.

Unfortunately, like with any measure of skill or possible skill, some players will abuse the tool. Report those who break the rules of the game while doing so.

vesica tempestas.1563:

Ever wonder why there wasn’t the same level of anti social behavior in GW1 raids?

Mostly because GW1 didn’t have any raids at all.

If you’re referring to GW2 raids, there have been constant accusations of “anti social behavior” since before their introduction.

But the thing is, there have long been jerks in GW2; it’s simply too big a community not to have a bunch. I get that people don’t like DPS meters for a variety of reasons; that doesn’t mean there’s evidence that they have been, are, or will be bad for this game.

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

vesica tempestas.1563:

Ever wonder why there wasn’t the same level of anti social behavior in GW1 raids?

Mostly because GW1 didn’t have any raids at all.

If you’re referring to GW2 raids, there have been constant accusations of “anti social behavior” since before their introduction.

But the thing is, there have long been jerks in GW2; it’s simply too big a community not to have a bunch. I get that people don’t like DPS meters for a variety of reasons; that doesn’t mean there’s evidence that they have been, are, or will be bad for this game.

https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Urgoz's_Warren.

12 man instances, takes up to 2 hours, did not need damage meters, raid like mechanics.

GW games are not about being competitive dps races, if it was then we would be playing wow, rift etc, that niche in the market is well covered.

vesica tempestas.1563:

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

vesica tempestas.1563:

Ever wonder why there wasn’t the same level of anti social behavior in GW1 raids?

Mostly because GW1 didn’t have any raids at all.

If you’re referring to GW2 raids, there have been constant accusations of “anti social behavior” since before their introduction.

But the thing is, there have long been jerks in GW2; it’s simply too big a community not to have a bunch. I get that people don’t like DPS meters for a variety of reasons; that doesn’t mean there’s evidence that they have been, are, or will be bad for this game.

https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Urgoz's_Warren.

12 man instances, takes up to 2 hours, did not need damage meters, raid like mechanics.

GW games are not about being competitive dps races, if it was then we would be playing wow, rift etc, that niche in the market is well covered.

Sorry, but no. In the days that people PUGged them (and DoA and UW), there were constant complaints that people would only take certain classes, certain comps. People were kicked for not healing or not doing enough damage or enough buffs.

And, just like Raids in GW2, it was far more often a matter of people understanding the mechanics and helping the rest of the group to be at the right place, right time, focused on the right target.

No one has been arguing that Raids/GW2 need DPS meters; they’ve been saying that it would help individuals and teams to figure out what they were doing well and what they weren’t. There’s no question that some people will misuse them, but those are the same folks who are already misusing other tools.

vesica tempestas.1563:

WARIORSCHARGEING.2637:

vesica tempestas.1563:

on a similar track can anyone remember if there was any dps meter for GW1 raiding?

guild wars never ever had raiding at all !! only thing guild wars ever had was dungeons and maps you went into all by yourself when you left towns . and you had no minis as well to take out with you into maps when you left towns . it was just you and the map only .

no, i remember doing instances with groups of players, probably not referred to as raids.

https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Urgoz's_Warren. party size 12.

them are missions you’re talking about and not raids guild wars never ever had raids

and the mission your linking is called a elite missions at the very best in guild wars only

and other wise your party only had and You can add no more than 7 heroes per character in a party

https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/User_interface#Party_window

vesica tempestas.1563:

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

vesica tempestas.1563:

Ever wonder why there wasn’t the same level of anti social behavior in GW1 raids?

Mostly because GW1 didn’t have any raids at all.

If you’re referring to GW2 raids, there have been constant accusations of “anti social behavior” since before their introduction.

But the thing is, there have long been jerks in GW2; it’s simply too big a community not to have a bunch. I get that people don’t like DPS meters for a variety of reasons; that doesn’t mean there’s evidence that they have been, are, or will be bad for this game.

https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Urgoz's_Warren.

12 man instances, takes up to 2 hours, did not need damage meters, raid like mechanics.

GW games are not about being competitive dps races, if it was then we would be playing wow, rift etc, that niche in the market is well covered.

guild wars never took 2 hours to do elite missions at all . and not only that but you did

not need people at all to do them . as guild wars add something called heros to the
game and with them heros you no longer need people at all even .

https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Hero

also too back then there was no such games as rift or other wise at all . it just was wow
or everquest or guild wars only !!

vesica tempestas.1563:

i’ve already said if it was kept to raids it would be a decent compromise.

Let me know when you get kicked from a squad doing Tetrad in VB for doing low DPS or something.

Where are you seeing these meters being used outside of raiding? I haven’t come close to anyone doing something like this, even in 100 CM in Fractals.

I thought to make a very very quick video showing what bgdm is like. .. its very good to use. only see people that let you see their dps.
video 1 of 2 quickly show what it has in option. and 2 of 2 is what it is like in battle.

https://youtu.be/21ovsVyG-gc
https://youtu.be/oQ0bCB5wdwg

hope this helps. sorry if quality isn’t good enough.

Mate, forget WoW. Hostile atmosphere was present in GW2, meters have nothing to do with it. If anything, meters at least give some valid reasoning to it, because they show you’re actually underperforming. Before them, you’d get kicked for arbitrary stuff like LI count. People always find a way to measure others and act differently based on this measurement. It’s not the meters, it’s just people in a competitive environment. The question isn’t, and never was, “hostile or non-hostile”. The question is “arbitrarily hostile or accurately hostile”.

DesiRe.1348:

The thing is that alot of players like to get carried in different ways, without ever thinking as to how much they contribute to the gain. For example, I did install a DPS meter a few days ago, and have been doing alot of Fractal 40 farm with it.
I was obviously searching for an expert group, since you want to get as much out of the farm as possible. And let me tell you, its unbelievable how many people 1) think they are exp, but are not, 2) dont care about requirements at all or 3) just lie to get what they want. Before the meters you had a group, if it went well – fine. If it didn’t however, you had no reliable way to tell WHICH PART was the reason for it, so you basically had to search for a whole new group. NOW you can see who is responsible, and tell him he doesn’t meet your requirements (in a friendly manner of course). It’s just way easier to cope with the whole thing. It also helps players in realizing on what level they actually play on. And it does keep snitches from lying their way into getting what they want, thats just a fact.

What I don’t understand is, how can you say you are AGAINST dps meters, because you don’t like to be monitored, and one sentence later say “Let Anet do a DPS meter ingame!!” – it’s the exact same thing? You still get monitored, you still (maybe) get called out for your performance. But honestly, how is that a bad thing? Some people want to take things seriously, and do smooth and/or effective runs. People that aren’t playing on top of their game are denying them that. How is it unfair to help these serious players? If you want to take a more relaxed approach to the game, no one is ever gonna blame you for that. Just don’t join exp groups or such then, you don’t really get any disadvantage by these tools.

Oh and PS:
That thing about gaining an advantage as a commander e.g. is a joke right? Yes, it does make things easier, but it only gives you something you could do anyways. Then you could also say it shouldn’t be allowed to play a mouse with side keys. Or to change your skill hotkeys, because Q,E,R,T are way easier to reach than 6 7 8 9 or F1 F2 F3 F4. What kind of argument is that?

let me sum this up for people who did not understand

There was no way before to see how we can kick people out
now we do !
“in a friendly way ofc !”

MrPinks.2015:

let me sum this up for people who did not understand

There was no way before to see how we can kick people out
now we do !
“in a friendly way ofc !”

So how exactly did people get kicked out before? Because they did, I guarantee it.

it happened before ofc, However it will certainly happen more with meters for the wrong reasons, e.g drama, impatience, bullying, insecure or inexperienced leaders driving wrong behaviors. Then there is misinterpretation of the stats i.e someone has top dps, but actually causes massive disruption on the fight due to the pressure he puts on other players, or a kid with no experience who sees a number but fails to read the group dynamics. Still raiders are used to it, winning at meters is part of the psyche, so as long as it doesn’t bleed into other areas then i guess its a necessary evil.

Personally i think the root cause of this conflict is the evolution of group orientated dungeons that derived from rpg roots to the modern competitive dps race style of dungeon. The worry for me is that this will grow out of control and turn into a wow like selfish cesspit. Most play games to relax, not deal with this kind of drama.

vesica tempestas.1563:

it happened before ofc, However it will certainly happen more with meters for the wrong reasons, e.g drama, impatience, bullying, insecure or inexperienced leaders driving wrong behaviors. Then there is misinterpretation of the stats i.e someone has top dps, but actually causes massive disruption on the fight due to the pressure he puts on other players, or a kid with no experience who sees a number but fails to read the group dynamics. Still raiders are used to it, winning at meters is part of the psyche, so as long as it doesn’t bleed into other areas then i guess its a necessary evil.

Personally i think the root cause of this conflict is the evolution of group orientated dungeons that derived from rpg roots to the modern competitive dps race style of dungeon. The worry for me is that this will grow out of control and turn into a wow like selfish cesspit. Most play games to relax, not deal with this kind of drama.

I disagree. Drama an impatience have always been there. If anything, dps meters filter out a lot of wrong reasons, like LI, AP and similar arbitrary measures of performance. Are meters going to put more emphasis on reaching certain numbers, buff times, etc.? Perhaps. Perhaps not. In the end, what matters is to get a smooth kill. Numbers are only looked at when this doesn’t happen and there’s a problem.

I fail to see how having a way to identify and address the problem would promote more toxicity. Without it the same people would just blindly throw accusations and flame people for irrelevant stuff.

You have to realize this is people’s issue, not a tool’s one. And that people won’t change. If you want a less toxic environment, then dps meters are actually a good thing for you, too. See someone bully another player because of numbers? Just kick him or quit. Problem solved and you avoided a toxic player.

vesica tempestas.1563:

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

vesica tempestas.1563:

Ever wonder why there wasn’t the same level of anti social behavior in GW1 raids?

Mostly because GW1 didn’t have any raids at all.

If you’re referring to GW2 raids, there have been constant accusations of “anti social behavior” since before their introduction.

But the thing is, there have long been jerks in GW2; it’s simply too big a community not to have a bunch. I get that people don’t like DPS meters for a variety of reasons; that doesn’t mean there’s evidence that they have been, are, or will be bad for this game.

https://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Urgoz's_Warren.

12 man instances, takes up to 2 hours, did not need damage meters, raid like mechanics.

GW games are not about being competitive dps races, if it was then we would be playing wow, rift etc, that niche in the market is well covered.

These were not raids. And they had speed clears for them.
You could cheese them easily.

Also I find it amusing to see you talk about what GW is as a franchise. Because you’re wrong.
GW2 promised no gear grind, no level grind, that sort of thing. IT was never promised GW2 wouldn’t have challenging content.

DPS meters are fine – the only reason you’re against them is that they would probably quickly point you out as a reason things aren’t going well.

vesica tempestas.1563:

it happened before ofc, However it will certainly happen more with meters for the wrong reasons, e.g drama, impatience, bullying, insecure or inexperienced leaders driving wrong behaviors. Then there is misinterpretation of the stats i.e someone has top dps, but actually causes massive disruption on the fight due to the pressure he puts on other players, or a kid with no experience who sees a number but fails to read the group dynamics. Still raiders are used to it, winning at meters is part of the psyche, so as long as it doesn’t bleed into other areas then i guess its a necessary evil.

Personally i think the root cause of this conflict is the evolution of group orientated dungeons that derived from rpg roots to the modern competitive dps race style of dungeon. The worry for me is that this will grow out of control and turn into a wow like selfish cesspit. Most play games to relax, not deal with this kind of drama.

People were already kicked for those reasons before DPS meters were released. It won’t happen anymore than before because of them. Because DPS meters don’t turn people into drama lovers, impatient people, bullies, insecure people, and doesn’t make a person inexperienced.

And the person putting pressure and disrupting the fight would have found someone else to blame for the failure of the mission than his disruptive nature and kicked someone for some arbitrary reason.

The kid with no experience without the DPS meter assume he’s doing great because he’s been in successful groups when he’s really just being carried and then finds it harsh in other groups and kicked because he’s not really as good as he thought. And then doesn’t know why. With a DPS meter he has at least one tool to help him figure out that maybe he’s not as good as he thinks he is.

So each of those bad situations you mention would still exist or have a potentially worse situation happen without it.

Actually it does, because a % of people are affected by perceived monitoring, their behaviour can change negatively, its human nature, people do strange things when under pressure, and its niave to assume this is allways positive. E,g see post before yours and the ‘you dont like meters because you would be found out’ personal attack. a prime example of using meters in the negative.

This isn’t a mystery, its been discussed to death for years and denying it does not make it less so. for example 1 of thousands of discussions:

http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/1073498-quot-Dps-kitten-quot-in-semi-hardcore-or-hardcore-guilds-How-to-deal-with-this/page5

in any case, each to their own, ive said my concern was really outside of raids.

vesica tempestas.1563:

Actually it does, because a % of people are affected by perceived monitoring, their behaviour can change negatively, its human nature, people do strange things when under pressure, and its niave to assume this is allways positive. E,g see post before yours and the ‘you dont like meters because you would be found out’ personal attack. a prime example of using meters in the negative.

This isn’t a mystery, its been discussed to death for years and denying it does not make it less so. for example 1 of thousands of discussions:

http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/1073498-quot-Dps-kitten-quot-in-semi-hardcore-or-hardcore-guilds-How-to-deal-with-this/page5

in any case, each to their own, ive said my concern was really outside of raids.

Ultimately there is nothing to be concerned about, Arenanet isn’t foolish enough to do something along the lines of the Original Triple Trouble again, and they’ve shown it with the Shatterer Revamp which focuses less on DPS and more on mechanics. The end-game environments between WoW and GW2 are so different that it’s nearly impossible to make that correlation that the DPS meter tool will do the same impact. And lastly as long as Arenanet makes the open-world around the same pace that their latest Living Story maps have been, I expect there never to be any kittens who start calling out players in Map chat for DPS.

It’s isolated and a non-issue for non-raiders.

But nobody is answering my question! Is there really a dps meter available that accurately shows my dps and the dps of my team with my team having to consent to providing me this information in any way?

Shaogin.2679:

But nobody is answering my question! Is there really a dps meter available that accurately shows my dps and the dps of my team with my team having to consent to providing me this information in any way?

Yes it’s called BGDM, as others have posted in the thread, the consent is given by you using the Meter and joining a party or squad that uses it as well.

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Shaogin.2679:

But nobody is answering my question! Is there really a dps meter available that accurately shows my dps and the dps of my team with my team having to consent to providing me this information in any way?

Yes it’s called BGDM, as others have posted in the thread, the consent is given by you using the Meter and joining a party or squad that uses it as well.

• and keeping its networking enabled. You can disable it and only use it to see your own performance. Personally, I think this is a pretty decent middle ground and I don’t think there’s any reason to complain about it.

vesica tempestas.1563:

Actually it does, because a % of people are affected by perceived monitoring, their behaviour can change negatively, its human nature, people do strange things when under pressure, and its niave to assume this is allways positive.

While this is correct in general terms (as in, human psychology and nature), do explain how DPS meters do anything which didn’t already happen before.

I mean, were you just as concerned that someone can read what you were doing or not doing in the combat log?

The thing to keep in mind with UI mods is that generally speaking pure UI mods do just that, they adapt the UI. In this case, they count what is happening, but the information was already available to the client beforehand, just presented in a different and – usually – far less efficient manner. Add a UI mod, and you can view the same information in a more useful way, but you didn’t actually add any information.

A DPS meter is simply used to quantify a numerical value. What is done with that knowledge, that is the problem. If it’s abused and used to shame and divide the GW2 community, then it needs to be removed. So simply, don’t use the knowledge in such a fashion! Use it to build bonds and help teach one another.

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Shaogin.2679:

But nobody is answering my question! Is there really a dps meter available that accurately shows my dps and the dps of my team with my team having to consent to providing me this information in any way?

Yes it’s called BGDM, as others have posted in the thread, the consent is given by you using the Meter and joining a party or squad that uses it as well.

BGDM only show YOUR DPS numbers & Those who has it installed who consent to share their numbers to the server.

I made two very quick videos to show you what they look like and its function etc.

https://youtu.be/21ovsVyG-gc
https://youtu.be/oQ0bCB5wdwg

one of great feature free to use.

Shaogin.2679:

But nobody is answering my question! Is there really a dps meter available that accurately shows my dps and the dps of my team with my team having to consent to providing me this information in any way?

Accurately and without your consent? no.

Feanor.2358:

MrPinks.2015:

let me sum this up for people who did not understand

There was no way before to see how we can kick people out
now we do !
“in a friendly way ofc !”

So how exactly did people get kicked out before? Because they did, I guarantee it.

true but now you have a real reason for it !
Friend ! you doing 2k dps ! so adorable leave please !
how exciting !

MrPinks.2015:

Feanor.2358:

MrPinks.2015:

let me sum this up for people who did not understand

There was no way before to see how we can kick people out
now we do !
“in a friendly way ofc !”

So how exactly did people get kicked out before? Because they did, I guarantee it.

true but now you have a real reason for it !
how exciting !

also i was referring to this statement the guy made

“OW you can see who is responsible, and tell him he doesn’t meet your requirements (in a friendly manner of course). "

since it is very funny to me in a ironic way “in a friendly manner you dont meet our requirements”
our community is soooooooooooo friendly !
(this entire community is Smiley mask wearing people , once you take off the mask you see the true nature of this community and let me tell you amy schumar is nice compared to them)

MrPinks.2015:

MrPinks.2015:

Feanor.2358:

MrPinks.2015:

let me sum this up for people who did not understand

There was no way before to see how we can kick people out
now we do !
“in a friendly way ofc !”

So how exactly did people get kicked out before? Because they did, I guarantee it.

true but now you have a real reason for it !
how exciting !

also i was referring to this statement the guy made

“OW you can see who is responsible, and tell him he doesn’t meet your requirements (in a friendly manner of course). "

since it is very funny to me “in a friendly manner you dont meet our requirements”
our community is soooooooooooo friendly !

Since when does “friendly” mean that there’s no requirements?

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

MrPinks.2015:

MrPinks.2015:

Feanor.2358:

MrPinks.2015:

let me sum this up for people who did not understand

There was no way before to see how we can kick people out
now we do !
“in a friendly way ofc !”

So how exactly did people get kicked out before? Because they did, I guarantee it.

true but now you have a real reason for it !
how exciting !

also i was referring to this statement the guy made

“OW you can see who is responsible, and tell him he doesn’t meet your requirements (in a friendly manner of course). "

since it is very funny to me “in a friendly manner you dont meet our requirements”
our community is soooooooooooo friendly !

Since when does “friendly” mean that there’s no requirements?

since when does requirements mean friendly?

MrPinks.2015:

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

MrPinks.2015:

MrPinks.2015:

Feanor.2358:

MrPinks.2015:

let me sum this up for people who did not understand

There was no way before to see how we can kick people out
now we do !
“in a friendly way ofc !”

So how exactly did people get kicked out before? Because they did, I guarantee it.

true but now you have a real reason for it !
how exciting !

also i was referring to this statement the guy made

“OW you can see who is responsible, and tell him he doesn’t meet your requirements (in a friendly manner of course). "

since it is very funny to me “in a friendly manner you dont meet our requirements”
our community is soooooooooooo friendly !

Since when does “friendly” mean that there’s no requirements?

since when does requirements mean friendly?

“requirements” means requirements; it has nothing to do with people being friendly or not. I’ve been in groups without any requirements where people are jerks and groups with strict requirements that are very helpful.

It can be a lot of work to organize a group, especially among strangers. People understandably would like to a good chance of succeeding in a reasonable amount of time. For some commanders, that means limiting who joins. People can be nice about it or they can be rude.

On the face of it, kicking someone for their choice of profession seems more arbitrary than kicking someone because they don’t seem to be up with the mechanics of the game. A DPS meter is a tool that could show who gets it and who doesn’t (even if it also gets misused by some).

tl;dr “friendly” has nothing to do with “requirements”.

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

MrPinks.2015:

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

MrPinks.2015:

MrPinks.2015:

Feanor.2358:

MrPinks.2015:

let me sum this up for people who did not understand

There was no way before to see how we can kick people out
now we do !
“in a friendly way ofc !”

So how exactly did people get kicked out before? Because they did, I guarantee it.

true but now you have a real reason for it !
how exciting !

also i was referring to this statement the guy made

“OW you can see who is responsible, and tell him he doesn’t meet your requirements (in a friendly manner of course). "

since it is very funny to me “in a friendly manner you dont meet our requirements”
our community is soooooooooooo friendly !

Since when does “friendly” mean that there’s no requirements?

since when does requirements mean friendly?

“requirements” means requirements; it has nothing to do with people being friendly or not. I’ve been in groups without any requirements where people are jerks and groups with strict requirements that are very helpful.

It can be a lot of work to organize a group, especially among strangers. People understandably would like to a good chance of succeeding in a reasonable amount of time. For some commanders, that means limiting who joins. People can be nice about it or they can be rude.

On the face of it, kicking someone for their choice of profession seems more arbitrary than kicking someone because they don’t seem to be up with the mechanics of the game. A DPS meter is a tool that could show who gets it and who doesn’t (even if it also gets misused by some).

tl;dr “friendly” has nothing to do with “requirements”.

i dont care if people use the tool
i just care about the guy who wants to block the people who do use it

in a way it dosnt matter is if it is helpful or not
from my point of view from my friends iv seen more screenshot of dps sent to me to joke about people “look at this ele making only 2kdps”

i understand this tool is useful for people who likes to group up and know each other and very well aware of their practice.
but people who dont will mostly use it in a different manner.

so yea if some one wants to block this tool , i think this is a very viable option to have so you can shut some bothering mouths around.

and on the other note
“with strict requirements that are very helpful”
requirements are not that helpful when you have a bad ele you required to have and you kicked out a good theif

you talking about organized group requirements , while i am talking about other matter of rquirements .

MrPinks.2015:

also i was referring to this statement the guy made

“OW you can see who is responsible, and tell him he doesn’t meet your requirements (in a friendly manner of course). "

since it is very funny to me in a ironic way “in a friendly manner you dont meet our requirements”
our community is soooooooooooo friendly !

I fail to see the relevance to the dps meters. What’s the difference if you got kicked for low dps or for low LI count? Except the prior has at least some relevance to the game? People don’t want to play with just about anyone? Well, duh! That’s not something introduced recently, it’s been around for ages. Again, it doesn’t come from the tools, it comes from the people. You can’t change what the players want to and what they don’t want to do. You can’t enforce friendly attitude. Some will play with you and some won’t. Get over it.

Feanor.2358:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Shaogin.2679:

But nobody is answering my question! Is there really a dps meter available that accurately shows my dps and the dps of my team with my team having to consent to providing me this information in any way?

Yes it’s called BGDM, as others have posted in the thread, the consent is given by you using the Meter and joining a party or squad that uses it as well.

• and keeping its networking enabled. You can disable it and only use it to see your own performance. Personally, I think this is a pretty decent middle ground and I don’t think there’s any reason to complain about it.

but some of us here do think there is a very good reason to complain and not want
add ons in this game at all for this very easy and most simple reasons .

that is this the use of dps meters turns guild wars 2 into world of warcraft . and thus will only let in more add on junk to come to this game of guild wars 2 that will let hackers take over your acount and the game its self . and more

not only that but with the add ons being allowed in this game . it will bring other bad things like mounts and take way from the game even more

and doing all this will only fully drive more people away from this game then it has already done

WARIORSCHARGEING.2637:

Feanor.2358:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Shaogin.2679:

But nobody is answering my question! Is there really a dps meter available that accurately shows my dps and the dps of my team with my team having to consent to providing me this information in any way?

Yes it’s called BGDM, as others have posted in the thread, the consent is given by you using the Meter and joining a party or squad that uses it as well.

• and keeping its networking enabled. You can disable it and only use it to see your own performance. Personally, I think this is a pretty decent middle ground and I don’t think there’s any reason to complain about it.

but some of us here do think there is a very good reason to complain and not want
add ons in this game at all for this very easy and most simple reasons .

that is this the use of dps meters turns guild wars 2 into world of warcraft . and thus will only let in more add on junk to come to this game of guild wars 2 that will let hackers take over your acount and the game its self . and more

not only that but with the add ons being allowed in this game . it will bring other bad things like mounts and take way from the game even more

and doing all this will only fully drive more people away from this game then it has already done

mounts? pls explain how the usage of an external tool will lead to this?

OniGiri.9461:

WARIORSCHARGEING.2637:

Feanor.2358:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Shaogin.2679:

But nobody is answering my question! Is there really a dps meter available that accurately shows my dps and the dps of my team with my team having to consent to providing me this information in any way?

Yes it’s called BGDM, as others have posted in the thread, the consent is given by you using the Meter and joining a party or squad that uses it as well.

• and keeping its networking enabled. You can disable it and only use it to see your own performance. Personally, I think this is a pretty decent middle ground and I don’t think there’s any reason to complain about it.

but some of us here do think there is a very good reason to complain and not want
add ons in this game at all for this very easy and most simple reasons .

that is this the use of dps meters turns guild wars 2 into world of warcraft . and thus will only let in more add on junk to come to this game of guild wars 2 that will let hackers take over your acount and the game its self . and more

not only that but with the add ons being allowed in this game . it will bring other bad things like mounts and take way from the game even more

and doing all this will only fully drive more people away from this game then it has already done

mounts? pls explain how the usage of an external tool will lead to this?

ummm i already just did that thank you very much . and if you really want that answer
then go and get wow and play it . and see just how long it takes for your acount there to get hacked with the use of add ons . and see how it works for you . and even tho i do play wow . i do not use any add ons at all . never have and never will . and do not wish to see them in this game . as it will only drive more people away from the game than it has done now . like i already have said . oh and a have a nice day

WARIORSCHARGEING.2637:

Feanor.2358:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Shaogin.2679:

But nobody is answering my question! Is there really a dps meter available that accurately shows my dps and the dps of my team with my team having to consent to providing me this information in any way?

Yes it’s called BGDM, as others have posted in the thread, the consent is given by you using the Meter and joining a party or squad that uses it as well.

• and keeping its networking enabled. You can disable it and only use it to see your own performance. Personally, I think this is a pretty decent middle ground and I don’t think there’s any reason to complain about it.

but some of us here do think there is a very good reason to complain and not want
add ons in this game at all for this very easy and most simple reasons .

that is this the use of dps meters turns guild wars 2 into world of warcraft . and thus will only let in more add on junk to come to this game of guild wars 2 that will let hackers take over your acount and the game its self . and more

not only that but with the add ons being allowed in this game . it will bring other bad things like mounts and take way from the game even more

and doing all this will only fully drive more people away from this game then it has already done

Lots of statements, zero reasoning. You get points for doomsaying, but you don’t really expect to be taken seriously, do you?

Feanor.2358:

WARIORSCHARGEING.2637:

Feanor.2358:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Shaogin.2679:

But nobody is answering my question! Is there really a dps meter available that accurately shows my dps and the dps of my team with my team having to consent to providing me this information in any way?

Yes it’s called BGDM, as others have posted in the thread, the consent is given by you using the Meter and joining a party or squad that uses it as well.

• and keeping its networking enabled. You can disable it and only use it to see your own performance. Personally, I think this is a pretty decent middle ground and I don’t think there’s any reason to complain about it.

but some of us here do think there is a very good reason to complain and not want
add ons in this game at all for this very easy and most simple reasons .

that is this the use of dps meters turns guild wars 2 into world of warcraft . and thus will only let in more add on junk to come to this game of guild wars 2 that will let hackers take over your acount and the game its self . and more

not only that but with the add ons being allowed in this game . it will bring other bad things like mounts and take way from the game even more

and doing all this will only fully drive more people away from this game then it has already done

Lots of statements, zero reasoning. You get points for doomsaying, but you don’t really expect to be taken seriously, do you?

I woldn’t give him the satisfaction of calling them “statements”
I’ve played WoW for quite some time and I have never experienced this “ruin” he speaks of

WARIORSCHARGEING.2637:

OniGiri.9461:

WARIORSCHARGEING.2637:

Feanor.2358:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Shaogin.2679:

But nobody is answering my question! Is there really a dps meter available that accurately shows my dps and the dps of my team with my team having to consent to providing me this information in any way?

Yes it’s called BGDM, as others have posted in the thread, the consent is given by you using the Meter and joining a party or squad that uses it as well.

• and keeping its networking enabled. You can disable it and only use it to see your own performance. Personally, I think this is a pretty decent middle ground and I don’t think there’s any reason to complain about it.

but some of us here do think there is a very good reason to complain and not want
add ons in this game at all for this very easy and most simple reasons .

that is this the use of dps meters turns guild wars 2 into world of warcraft . and thus will only let in more add on junk to come to this game of guild wars 2 that will let hackers take over your acount and the game its self . and more

not only that but with the add ons being allowed in this game . it will bring other bad things like mounts and take way from the game even more

and doing all this will only fully drive more people away from this game then it has already done

mounts? pls explain how the usage of an external tool will lead to this?

ummm i already just did that thank you very much . and if you really want that answer
then go and get wow and play it . and see just how long it takes for your acount there to get hacked with the use of add ons . and see how it works for you . and even tho i do play wow . i do not use any add ons at all . never have and never will . and do not wish to see them in this game . as it will only drive more people away from the game than it has done now . like i already have said . oh and a have a nice day

Sorry it seems i am not as smart and experienced as you. Can you explain in simple words how using dps meters will lead to the game getting mounts?

OniGiri.9461:

WARIORSCHARGEING.2637:

OniGiri.9461:

WARIORSCHARGEING.2637:

Feanor.2358:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Shaogin.2679:

But nobody is answering my question! Is there really a dps meter available that accurately shows my dps and the dps of my team with my team having to consent to providing me this information in any way?

Yes it’s called BGDM, as others have posted in the thread, the consent is given by you using the Meter and joining a party or squad that uses it as well.

• and keeping its networking enabled. You can disable it and only use it to see your own performance. Personally, I think this is a pretty decent middle ground and I don’t think there’s any reason to complain about it.

but some of us here do think there is a very good reason to complain and not want
add ons in this game at all for this very easy and most simple reasons .

that is this the use of dps meters turns guild wars 2 into world of warcraft . and thus will only let in more add on junk to come to this game of guild wars 2 that will let hackers take over your acount and the game its self . and more

not only that but with the add ons being allowed in this game . it will bring other bad things like mounts and take way from the game even more

and doing all this will only fully drive more people away from this game then it has already done

mounts? pls explain how the usage of an external tool will lead to this?

ummm i already just did that thank you very much . and if you really want that answer
then go and get wow and play it . and see just how long it takes for your acount there to get hacked with the use of add ons . and see how it works for you . and even tho i do play wow . i do not use any add ons at all . never have and never will . and do not wish to see them in this game . as it will only drive more people away from the game than it has done now . like i already have said . oh and a have a nice day

Sorry it seems i am not as smart and experienced as you. Can you explain in simple words how using dps meters will lead to the game getting mounts?

Near as I can tell, this is the argument:

• DPS meters lead to fear (of getting /kicked)
• Fear leads to anger (of the possibility of being kicked)
• Anger leads to hate (of the possibility that the sole reason was the DPS meter)
• Hate leads to suffering (from the anxiety of worrying about being kicked)
• Suffering leads to mounts (i.e. “the dark side”)

As I recall, didn’t WoW have mounts from the start? So wouldn’t it be more correct to say that mounts led to DPS meters?

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

OniGiri.9461:

WARIORSCHARGEING.2637:

OniGiri.9461:

WARIORSCHARGEING.2637:

Feanor.2358:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Shaogin.2679:

But nobody is answering my question! Is there really a dps meter available that accurately shows my dps and the dps of my team with my team having to consent to providing me this information in any way?

Yes it’s called BGDM, as others have posted in the thread, the consent is given by you using the Meter and joining a party or squad that uses it as well.

• and keeping its networking enabled. You can disable it and only use it to see your own performance. Personally, I think this is a pretty decent middle ground and I don’t think there’s any reason to complain about it.

but some of us here do think there is a very good reason to complain and not want
add ons in this game at all for this very easy and most simple reasons .

that is this the use of dps meters turns guild wars 2 into world of warcraft . and thus will only let in more add on junk to come to this game of guild wars 2 that will let hackers take over your acount and the game its self . and more

not only that but with the add ons being allowed in this game . it will bring other bad things like mounts and take way from the game even more

and doing all this will only fully drive more people away from this game then it has already done

mounts? pls explain how the usage of an external tool will lead to this?

ummm i already just did that thank you very much . and if you really want that answer
then go and get wow and play it . and see just how long it takes for your acount there to get hacked with the use of add ons . and see how it works for you . and even tho i do play wow . i do not use any add ons at all . never have and never will . and do not wish to see them in this game . as it will only drive more people away from the game than it has done now . like i already have said . oh and a have a nice day

Sorry it seems i am not as smart and experienced as you. Can you explain in simple words how using dps meters will lead to the game getting mounts?

Near as I can tell, this is the argument:

• DPS meters lead to fear (of getting /kicked)
• Fear leads to anger (of the possibility of being kicked)
• Anger leads to hate (of the possibility that the sole reason was the DPS meter)
• Hate leads to suffering (from the anxiety of worrying about being kicked)
• Suffering leads to mounts (i.e. “the dark side”)

As I recall, didn’t WoW have mounts from the start? So wouldn’t it be more correct to say that mounts led to DPS meters?

Oh yes, I remember hitting level 40 (The level where you could first get mounts) and saving every gold I could for a mount. Mounts from day 1, so I guess they must lead to DPS meters, as they came later.

Amaimon.7823:

Feanor.2358:

WARIORSCHARGEING.2637:

Feanor.2358:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Shaogin.2679:

But nobody is answering my question! Is there really a dps meter available that accurately shows my dps and the dps of my team with my team having to consent to providing me this information in any way?

Yes it’s called BGDM, as others have posted in the thread, the consent is given by you using the Meter and joining a party or squad that uses it as well.

• and keeping its networking enabled. You can disable it and only use it to see your own performance. Personally, I think this is a pretty decent middle ground and I don’t think there’s any reason to complain about it.

but some of us here do think there is a very good reason to complain and not want
add ons in this game at all for this very easy and most simple reasons .

that is this the use of dps meters turns guild wars 2 into world of warcraft . and thus will only let in more add on junk to come to this game of guild wars 2 that will let hackers take over your acount and the game its self . and more

not only that but with the add ons being allowed in this game . it will bring other bad things like mounts and take way from the game even more

and doing all this will only fully drive more people away from this game then it has already done

Lots of statements, zero reasoning. You get points for doomsaying, but you don’t really expect to be taken seriously, do you?

I woldn’t give him the satisfaction of calling them “statements”
I’ve played WoW for quite some time and I have never experienced this “ruin” he speaks of

thanks a lot for gendering me . and giving me the wrong gender to boot . i done my job very well i see . and now back on topic now . let’s say i think a game should be played the way it was meant to be played . and without add ons or any other extras

OniGiri.9461:

WARIORSCHARGEING.2637:

OniGiri.9461:

WARIORSCHARGEING.2637:

Feanor.2358:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Shaogin.2679:

But nobody is answering my question! Is there really a dps meter available that accurately shows my dps and the dps of my team with my team having to consent to providing me this information in any way?

Yes it’s called BGDM, as others have posted in the thread, the consent is given by you using the Meter and joining a party or squad that uses it as well.

• and keeping its networking enabled. You can disable it and only use it to see your own performance. Personally, I think this is a pretty decent middle ground and I don’t think there’s any reason to complain about it.

but some of us here do think there is a very good reason to complain and not want
add ons in this game at all for this very easy and most simple reasons .

that is this the use of dps meters turns guild wars 2 into world of warcraft . and thus will only let in more add on junk to come to this game of guild wars 2 that will let hackers take over your acount and the game its self . and more

not only that but with the add ons being allowed in this game . it will bring other bad things like mounts and take way from the game even more

and doing all this will only fully drive more people away from this game then it has already done

mounts? pls explain how the usage of an external tool will lead to this?

ummm i already just did that thank you very much . and if you really want that answer
then go and get wow and play it . and see just how long it takes for your acount there to get hacked with the use of add ons . and see how it works for you . and even tho i do play wow . i do not use any add ons at all . never have and never will . and do not wish to see them in this game . as it will only drive more people away from the game than it has done now . like i already have said . oh and a have a nice day

Sorry it seems i am not as smart and experienced as you. Can you explain in simple words how using dps meters will lead to the game getting mounts?

i did not say that and please do not put words in my mouth too that i did not say . ok ???

you ask nicely so its like this they say ok to dps meters . look back lets say 6 months later and ok that went great and very well . lets say now how they like mounts add to the game . even tho there is already kinda of in a round about way a form of mounts in the game . with the flying carpet . so maybe in a way they put they did put the horse before the cart this time maybe lol

WARIORSCHARGEING.2637:

Amaimon.7823:

Feanor.2358:

WARIORSCHARGEING.2637:

Feanor.2358:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Shaogin.2679:

But nobody is answering my question! Is there really a dps meter available that accurately shows my dps and the dps of my team with my team having to consent to providing me this information in any way?

Yes it’s called BGDM, as others have posted in the thread, the consent is given by you using the Meter and joining a party or squad that uses it as well.

• and keeping its networking enabled. You can disable it and only use it to see your own performance. Personally, I think this is a pretty decent middle ground and I don’t think there’s any reason to complain about it.

but some of us here do think there is a very good reason to complain and not want
add ons in this game at all for this very easy and most simple reasons .

that is this the use of dps meters turns guild wars 2 into world of warcraft . and thus will only let in more add on junk to come to this game of guild wars 2 that will let hackers take over your acount and the game its self . and more

not only that but with the add ons being allowed in this game . it will bring other bad things like mounts and take way from the game even more

and doing all this will only fully drive more people away from this game then it has already done

Lots of statements, zero reasoning. You get points for doomsaying, but you don’t really expect to be taken seriously, do you?

I woldn’t give him the satisfaction of calling them “statements”
I’ve played WoW for quite some time and I have never experienced this “ruin” he speaks of

thanks a lot for gendering me . and giving me the wrong gender to boot . i done my job very well i see . and now back on topic now . let’s say i think a game should be played the way it was meant to be played . and without add ons or any other extras

Pretty sure “he” was being used generically, that is a thing.

More to the point, you haven’t said how adding dps meters into the game leads to mounts.

WARIORSCHARGEING.2637:

OniGiri.9461:

WARIORSCHARGEING.2637:

OniGiri.9461:

WARIORSCHARGEING.2637:

Feanor.2358:

BlaqueFyre.5678:

Shaogin.2679:

But nobody is answering my question! Is there really a dps meter available that accurately shows my dps and the dps of my team with my team having to consent to providing me this information in any way?

Yes it’s called BGDM, as others have posted in the thread, the consent is given by you using the Meter and joining a party or squad that uses it as well.

• and keeping its networking enabled. You can disable it and only use it to see your own performance. Personally, I think this is a pretty decent middle ground and I don’t think there’s any reason to complain about it.

but some of us here do think there is a very good reason to complain and not want
add ons in this game at all for this very easy and most simple reasons .

that is this the use of dps meters turns guild wars 2 into world of warcraft . and thus will only let in more add on junk to come to this game of guild wars 2 that will let hackers take over your acount and the game its self . and more

not only that but with the add ons being allowed in this game . it will bring other bad things like mounts and take way from the game even more

and doing all this will only fully drive more people away from this game then it has already done

mounts? pls explain how the usage of an external tool will lead to this?

ummm i already just did that thank you very much . and if you really want that answer
then go and get wow and play it . and see just how long it takes for your acount there to get hacked with the use of add ons . and see how it works for you . and even tho i do play wow . i do not use any add ons at all . never have and never will . and do not wish to see them in this game . as it will only drive more people away from the game than it has done now . like i already have said . oh and a have a nice day

Sorry it seems i am not as smart and experienced as you. Can you explain in simple words how using dps meters will lead to the game getting mounts?

i did not say that and please do not put words in my mouth too that i did not say . ok ???

you ask nicely so its like this they say ok to dps meters . look back lets say 6 months later and ok that went great and very well . lets say now how they like mounts add to the game . even tho there is already kinda of in a round about way a form of mounts in the game . with the flying carpet . so maybe in a way they put they did put the horse before the cart this time maybe lol

So how does adding dps meters lead to 6 months from now adding in mounts?