Guild Wars 2

Azel.4786:

Faereilos.5106:

But what if they don’t want a civil union? A civil union doesn’t include all the rights that a normal marriage does. I think it’s kind of selfish to tell someone they can’t have a marriage because it’s against your beliefs. Two gay guys wanting to get married literally has no effects on you. None.

Trust me, you are far from being persecuted. ANet is allowing you to post on this forums, to play their game, and by golly as a Christian you have more power than those who you claim to be oppressing you. Does it not occur to you that LGBTQ+ people have been persecuted by almost everyone since…forever? In some countries, you get imprisoned or stoned to death just for loving the opposite sex. That’s persecution. Having people disagree with your beliefs and feeling offended is not.

You believe what you want, I’m just pointing out your religion doesn’t get to dictate the government or how people want to live their lives.

Okay, let me clarify this before we go too deep here. This may be a language/ country problem.

When I say civil union I mean the exact same thing a straight couple does if they are no religious and go to church to get a religious marriage.

I only ask that you do not force churches to make same sex union if the religion does not allow it. On the civil side, full equal treatment – meaning full equal rights of the union, whatever the most complete type of civil union civil “marriage” you get in your country.

Hope this clears the discussion, because I think we might be supporting the same thing, but the language barrier is keeping the message from getting across.

It’s the word “marriage” that you seem to have quarrel with. I understand that from your point of view it is strictly a religious term and ritual, but according to the government and society at large, it is not. I’m married, and got married at a court house, as we are not a religious family. We did not have a civil union, as we wanted there to be no doubt in anyone’s mind, be it people we meet or organizations we become a part of that we are joined wholly.

I don’t think you seem like a bad person or that you are trying to harm anyone, but I do think that it’s a bit disingenuous to call someone your close friend, but in the same breath say you do not want them to have the same rights as you. I can’t imagine trying to maintain a friendship like that. I know people that I’m friendly with that I see on a regular basis, but would not call my friend because I disagree with something or other about them or their lives. It does not mean I hate them. I think this is really the kind of relationship you describe.

I don’t think religious institutions should be forced to marry anyone against the wishes of its leadership, precepts, congregation, or what have you. I do think that anyone deserves the have the right to marry whomever they please, within the confines of the law.

As stated before, separate but equal is not equal. Obviously what we call marriage matters, or we would not be having this discussion. How would you feel if you were defending your right to a have a “Christian” marriage?

Asudementio.8526:

Well yes, i understand that’d likely be the case- but let’s return to my scenario.

If OP was on the opposite of this would they still be supportive of having anet refrain from politics? chances are they wouldn’t be. And that’s the point. This is being discussed because someone is contentious with the issue at hand and is trying to grasp at whatever little comfort they can get to support their dissent.

Ehh, true enough and would be good if he understood it when it’s pointed out to him.

It’s hardly exclusive to just him though. Most people would not use his argument if it were a political idea they supported (though it’s not an excuse…) Still, despite it being an unpopular decision nobody should give him flak for posting it if he doesn’t go beyond simple disagreement. Point out why he’s wrong (as you did)? Sure. But keep it civil.

I for one am happy to see Anet embrace same-sex couples and even give transgendered people a voice through Sya.

I can understand why some people might be troubled by this development, though, due to their beliefs and whatnot, but Anet has been on this path since the beginning and will continue to walk down this path. You either accept that this is how it’s going to be in Tyria, ignore those specific NPCs and story moments when they pop up and continue adventuring in Tyria, or leave and find entertainment that better suits your taste.

I hope you’ll give Tyria another chance and try to look at this from another perspective, though; this is a fantasy world with giant eldritch dragons, gods, undead and whatnot, after all, so surely it can’t be too much of a stretch to accept that Tyria also happens to have relationships of different kinds, which just so happens to mirror our more mundane world. We’re going to beat the Elder Dragons with the power of love and friendship based on hints in game, so we might as well embrace love and friendship in all their forms.

As for those criticizing the OP and a few others in this thread, please stay respectful and try to look at things from their perspective too instead of being blinded by your own point of view. There’s no need to act rude when you can discuss the topic in a polite and intelligent manner instead. Let’s show that GW2 has the friendliest community around.

Arioso.8519:

There are several prominent gay couples in the game’s story and an ENTIRE race that seems to be bisexual by default. Though Sylvari have no sexual organs, so the “sexual” part of that is kind of a misnomer. Their genders are purely aesthetic.

What we know is that sylvari can’t impregnate others or get pregnant. However, they’re still equipped (as confirmed by devs) with parts that allow them to have sex and enjoy it. As for how they view gender:

“Sylvari believe very much in the concept of love. Emotion, the empathy that I spoke of with the tree. Because they are created by the tree, – they have a sense of sex like male and female, gender – but it is based very much on what they chose in the dream or what the tree chose for them. And when they come out they don’t reproduce like humans do, they don’t think of it that way, they think of it as the spirit inside the person, no matter gender the person is and they very much fall in love with each other and even with the other races, when they do, because of the spirit.” —Ree Soesbee, Wartower interview

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Show me what verse in the Bible says God is against same-sex marriage.

I checked the Bible’s online versions out of curiosity. Based on what I found, interestingly enough the Bible doesn’t seem to directly state (as in, give an outright order or such) that God is against or would punish same-sex marriage. However, it does identify marriage as being between a man and a woman, and very specifically condemns intercourse between same-sex couples (based on the original text’s wording, it appears many of these passages condemn male homosexuals in particular, but this is likely because of the patriarchal context of the time the text was written in), so take that as you will.

As for the sources I used if you want to check them yourself:

About marriage: Genesis 2:24, 1 Corinthians 7:2-16
About same-sex relationships: Leviticus 18:22, Romans 1:26-27, 1 Corinthians 6:9

The social “justice” warriors are sure giving the op a bad time with their one word vocabulary…. “bigot” Over and over I see that word popping up… A bigot is someone who can’t tolerate another person’s point of view. This would be more appropriately apply to the politically correct crowd. I mean look at the name “politically correct”. They’ve already assumed their intellectual victory and really don’t want anyone questioning their superior intellect. OP has issue that by gw2 posting that it is representing all players in that post….. well all players don’t agree with the court’s ruling… so would the social “justice” bigots quit harassing the op

Dashingsteel.3410:

The social “justice” warriors are sure giving the op a bad time with their one word vocabulary…. “bigot” Over and over I see that word popping up… A bigot is someone who can’t tolerate another person’s point of view. This would be more appropriately apply to the politically correct crowd. I mean look at the name “politically correct”. They’ve already assumed their intellectual victory and really don’t want anyone questioning their superior intellect. OP has issue that by gw2 posting that it is representing all players in that post….. well all players don’t agree with the court’s ruling… so would the social “justice” bigots quit harassing the op

politically correct means that someone is phrased euphemistically as to not offend anyone who may have sensitivities to a particular wording due to associative meaning, it does not have the connotations you are applying to it here

Dashingsteel.3410:

The social “justice” warriors are sure giving the op a bad time with their one word vocabulary…. “bigot” Over and over I see that word popping up… A bigot is someone who can’t tolerate another person’s point of view. This would be more appropriately apply to the politically correct crowd. I mean look at the name “politically correct”. They’ve already assumed their intellectual victory and really don’t want anyone questioning their superior intellect. OP has issue that by gw2 posting that it is representing all players in that post….. well all players don’t agree with the court’s ruling… so would the social “justice” bigots quit harassing the op

Pot meet kettle!

Dashingsteel.3410:

The social “justice” warriors are sure giving the op a bad time with their one word vocabulary…. “bigot” Over and over I see that word popping up… A bigot is someone who can’t tolerate another person’s point of view. This would be more appropriately apply to the politically correct crowd. I mean look at the name “politically correct”. They’ve already assumed their intellectual victory and really don’t want anyone questioning their superior intellect. OP has issue that by gw2 posting that it is representing all players in that post….. well all players don’t agree with the court’s ruling… so would the social “justice” bigots quit harassing the op

While boiling everything wrong with the op down to a single word is lazy, it is bigoted to think that the court’s decision is wrong. It’s ok to say i don’t agree with gay marriage or to have a “religious” qualm against it (although if you do you are wrong :p) but to say you think court’s should be able to deny someone’s basic right to anything is the definition of being a bigot. Bigotry is not close mindedness its close mindedness combined with hatred and intolerance. Thinking someone else is wrong and not listening to their POV is close minded, acting upon that and taking away their rights is bigoted. That’s why social justice bigots are not actually bigots -_-, they’re just pushy.

Also Company’s have every right to post something based on their beliefs, or mainly their owner’s beliefs. They have no duty to represent their consumer, Any conservative would tell you that…. :p

Muzicman.9741:

I don’t think religious institutions should be forced to marry anyone against the wishes of its leadership, precepts, congregation, or what have you. I do think that anyone deserves the have the right to marry whomever they please, within the confines of the law.

Okay, I will copy only this part because it seems where the largest misunderstanding is happening and will explain this in a bit more detail on how it works where I am from.

If you have a “marriage” (or the equivalent word in your religion) you have a religious union before whoever is capable of doing so in your religion . If you go to anywhere – even abroad – and you have to right down if you are single or “married” what do you write?

Single. You can not write “married”.

Why? I had a marriage! I did everything that religion states that I should do! I spent a ton of money to do it! So how come I can’t say I am married??

Because a religious union is not recognized by the state and thus, for all legal purposes, you are still very much single.

The State only recognizes civil unions. So if you want to be able to write down and have the full legal implications of being “married” you have to do a civil union before the state.

If you go and have a civil union before the state and you go anywhere and have to say your civil status what do you write? “Married”.

Having a religious union is entirely up to the religious institution to decide who can or can not do a religious union. Having a civil union is entirely up to the Government to say who can or can not have a civil union. And here a civil union can occur freely – same sex or different sexes – but you can only have one civil union (whereas you can have as many religious unions your religion allows).

So at the end of the day what I say is that I don’t support the government going and telling the religious institutions what they must do. If a religion does not allow same sex marriage, that is the religious institution who has a right to say.

But on the state side, I very much support the position of our government in treating all equally.

Actually political correctness was a liberal political movement that originated at the University of Wisconsin.

OP only asked that ANET not try to represent the entire player base by posting political statements since the entire player base doesn’t agree

Dashingsteel.3410:

Actually political correctness was a liberal political movement that originated at the University of Wisconsin.

I pulled this from conservapedia as i figured you may find that as acceptable.

“Political correctness or P.C. also means the alteration of one’s choice of words in order to avoid either offending a group of people or reinforcing a stereotype considered to be disadvantageous to the group.”

This was the way in which i read it in your post, but i can see the disconnect now that i know the context you were going for.

Dashingsteel.3410:

OP only asked that ANET not try to represent the entire player base by posting political statements since the entire player base doesn’t agree

But Anet isn’t representing the total player base, any more than they are when they say anything. I mean if Anet said the old trait changes were good, the playerbase wouldn’t be represented by it. Anet’s comments represent Anet’s believe as a company. Not everyone in the playerbase is going to share Anet’s belief as a company.

But Anet sure has the right to express a belief.

zacharias.5437:

I believe marriage is between a man and a woman. There, now before I receive my infraction:

It is clear that this game is not accepting of everyone, only those who accept their politically correct viewpoint. And all those ‘tolerant’ folks who aplaud Anet and can only stand to play a virtual game filled with people who have the same thoughts and beliefs as those them, I don’t blame you. It’s much easier not to have to discuss or argue or having your beliefs challenged. Good luck with life.

For me, I believe in God, shocking as that sounds. And many of my friends don’t. Unlike many, I believe you can disagree with someone and his/her lifestyle and still care for them. I realize that it is only a matter of time before the feds start fining and jailing churches who don’t perform same sex marriages, like in Canada. But I will continue to follow my core beliefs.

I am uninstalling after countless hours of play. My biggest regret is that I just prepurchased HoT. I’m asking for a refund, doubt I’ll see it. Now lay on the hate, I can take it.

Wait, so your lifestyle is supported by both the company and the game. A life style that you, through personal beliefs, hold as directly opposed to your own is also approved of by the company and in game entities. This means that the company is in fact intolerant of you??

Dashingsteel.3410:

OP only asked that ANET not try to represent the entire player base by posting political statements since the entire player base doesn’t agree

You’re talking about a business, not some group that players have elected as representatives. It doesn’t matter if they have a position on something that contradicts how you, the OP, or anyone else feels. They can do that. If you don’t like it, all you can do about it is not buy things from them—but they’re obviously not worried about that.

I noticed, since Friday night is when I refresh all my MMOs looking for patches, that Champions Online is giving everyone who logs in this weekend can get Rainbow Flight, an ability where you fly around on a cloud that is shooting out a rainbow, a 525 Zen (their proxy currency) item for free.

So see, a Tweet is nothing to get upset over.

I agree Anet has a right to post what they want. The op has a right to disagree with them doing it. The forums are partially to let anet know what you feel they are doing right and what they are doing wrong. Anet then decides whether they want to do something about it…… All the hate, insults, and abuse heaped on OP by all of the "openminded " posters just make me laugh

zacharias.5437:

I believe marriage is between a man and a woman. There, now before I receive my infraction:

It is clear that this game is not accepting of everyone, only those who accept their politically correct viewpoint. And all those ‘tolerant’ folks who aplaud Anet and can only stand to play a virtual game filled with people who have the same thoughts and beliefs as those them, I don’t blame you. It’s much easier not to have to discuss or argue or having your beliefs challenged. Good luck with life.

For me, I believe in God, shocking as that sounds. And many of my friends don’t. Unlike many, I believe you can disagree with someone and his/her lifestyle and still care for them. I realize that it is only a matter of time before the feds start fining and jailing churches who don’t perform same sex marriages, like in Canada. But I will continue to follow my core beliefs.

I am uninstalling after countless hours of play. My biggest regret is that I just prepurchased HoT. I’m asking for a refund, doubt I’ll see it. Now lay on the hate, I can take it.

You make it sound like someone who believes in God can’t be in favor of marriage equality. I assure you, not everyone who believes in God is against marriage equality. What you actually believe in is a literal interpretation of the bible, which is not the same thing as believing on God.

Many who believe in God believe the bible is allegory. Many believe that numerous translations and changes have altered the original intent of the bible. And many believe in God without believing in the bible at all.

I think that probably only a small percentage of people who believe in God believe in a literal interpretation of the bible.

As for uninstalling the game because you don’t like the politics of the company that makes it, that’s actually okay. I have no issue with that.

But it won’t change anything at all, except you don’t get to play a game you previously enjoyed. To me that’s cutting off your nose to spite your face.

Dashingsteel.3410:

I agree Anet has a right to post what they want. The op has a right to disagree with them doing it. The forums are partially to let anet know what you feel they are doing right and what they are doing wrong. Anet then decides whether they want to do something about it…… All the hate, insults, and abuse heaped on OP by all of the "openminded " posters just make me laugh

And all these other players are letting a-net (and the OP) know how they feel about it. So essentially everything here is working as intended.

Why is openminded in quotation marks?

Dashingsteel.3410:

I agree Anet has a right to post what they want. The op has a right to disagree with them doing it. The forums are partially to let anet know what you feel they are doing right and what they are doing wrong. Anet then decides whether they want to do something about it…… All the hate, insults, and abuse heaped on OP by all of the "openminded " posters just make me laugh

We all also have the same right to disagree and post our point of view as well. This thread has been more peacful then I thought it would have been till you came in with your troll comments.

Why the over exaggeration of “All the hate, insults, and abuse on the OP” ?

LameFox.6349:

And all these other players are letting a-net (and the OP) know how they feel about it. So essentially everything here is working as intended.

Why is openminded in quotation marks?

To be a truly open minded person, you have to tolerate intolerance and hold no opinions of your own. Meaning unless you agree with OP denying rights to another group of people, you’re an SJW bigotted hater.

LameFox.6349:

Dashingsteel.3410:

I agree Anet has a right to post what they want. The op has a right to disagree with them doing it. The forums are partially to let anet know what you feel they are doing right and what they are doing wrong. Anet then decides whether they want to do something about it…… All the hate, insults, and abuse heaped on OP by all of the "openminded " posters just make me laugh

And all these other players are letting a-net (and the OP) know how they feel about it. So essentially everything here is working as intended.

Why is openminded in quotation marks?

To claim that the posters are hypocrites for being open-minded but then being abusive. He seems to think that disagreeing with someone and voicing your own opinion is the same as showering them with hatred, insults, and abuse lol.

I disagree with him though. For once, it’s nice to not see everyone in a thread so angry that every other word is censored with the word “kitten.”

I find it inappropriate for this company, or any company. If you want to be an activist, fine. Support whatever. If you want to engage your company and your product in that activism…well, that is very foolish, regardless of what side of whatever issue you are on…it shows remarkably poor judgment.

I find the intolerance and the demands for conformity by those who claim to bow down to the secular gods of the state and of liberalism…well, that is equally foolish. Labeling anyone that doesn’t agree with your view point as intolerant, is hypocritical, and intolerant. Especially when the concept of tolerance, and what should be tolerated, changes overnight. Three years ago POTUS was against gay marriage legalization.

As far as the law, and the experts…remember, it was a 5-4 decision. The “experts” fundamentally disagree. We get to do that in this country. Some people think this is a victory for liberty or equality. Others think this is a departure from moral and biological first principles, imperatives, that are beyond the reach of politically correct whimsy.

Okay this thread is derailing from a discussion about whether if it’s okay for ANet to tweet about controversial current events to a debate about the concept of marriage altogether.

So lets bring the focus back to the original issue and please don’t pick on the OP.

Dyvim.8293:

I find it inappropriate for this company, or any company. If you want to be an activist, fine. Support whatever. If you want to engage your company and your product in that activism…well, that is very foolish, regardless of what side of whatever issue you are on…it shows remarkably poor judgment.

I find the intolerance and the demands for conformity by those who claim to bow down to the secular gods of the state and of liberalism…well, that is equally foolish. Labeling anyone that doesn’t agree with your view point as intolerant, is hypocritical, and intolerant. Especially when the concept of tolerance, and what should be tolerated, changes overnight. Three years ago POTUS was against gay marriage legalization.

As far as the law, and the experts…remember, it was a 5-4 decision. The “experts” fundamentally disagree. We get to do that in this country. Some people think this is a victory for liberty or equality. Others think this is a departure from moral and biological first principles, imperatives, that are beyond the reach of politically correct whimsy.

I mean corporations are people right, surely they have a right to express themselves. The individual who works for this corporation has a right to express themselves. If the two disagree they will settle the matter internally, but that does not seem to be the case.

Or is this invoking the logic of the “secular gods of the state and of liberalism”?

Dyvim.8293:

Labeling anyone that doesn’t agree with your view point as intolerant, is hypocritical, and intolerant.

And that statement is so hyperbolic as to be irrelevant to anything that is actually happening here.

Dyvim.8293:

I find it inappropriate for this company, or any company. If you want to be an activist, fine. Support whatever. If you want to engage your company and your product in that activism…well, that is very foolish, regardless of what side of whatever issue you are on…it shows remarkably poor judgment.

I find the intolerance and the demands for conformity by those who claim to bow down to the secular gods of the state and of liberalism…well, that is equally foolish. Labeling anyone that doesn’t agree with your view point as intolerant, is hypocritical, and intolerant. Especially when the concept of tolerance, and what should be tolerated, changes overnight. Three years ago POTUS was against gay marriage legalization.

As far as the law, and the experts…remember, it was a 5-4 decision. The “experts” fundamentally disagree. We get to do that in this country. Some people think this is a victory for liberty or equality. Others think this is a departure from moral and biological first principles, imperatives, that are beyond the reach of politically correct whimsy.

I’m sorry but this is a ridiculous point.

The people against marriage equality aren’t speaking for themselves. They’re saying those people over there, a group I’m not part of, can’t do something.

The people in that group aren’t saying that the first group can’t. One side is speaking for the other. That’s the issue here.

Oh no. Two men in a game are getting married. It’s the end.

. . .

Where is my /rolls eyes emote?

Magicus.4302:

I’m referring to this: https://twitter.com/GuildWars2/status/614560129573351424

Please remember that a very large portion of your player base doesn’t agree with the court’s decision today.

Bad news for you
www.destructoid.com/gaming-companies-voice-their-support-for-the-same-sex-marriage-ruling-in-the-us-294906.phtml

But you know, for folks like yourself there is always the guy that did “Earthworm Jim”. He made no secret of his views on homosexuality and gay marriage.
One day in the not too distant future all this outrage will be looked upon just like most do today on arguments that women shouldn’t be allowed to vote or that black people shouldn’t be allowed to frequent the same restaurants as whites.

On that note, everyone is aware of the Destiny’s Edge 2.0, right? We have two lesbians, a char falling for a norn, a handicapped asura, and you.

Good news everybody! ANet is an open-minded company. Guess you didn’t see the writing on the wall, did you?

Welcome to the 21st century.

Ardenwolfe.8590:

On that note, everyone is aware of the Destiny’s Edge 2.0, right? We have two lesbians, a char falling for a norn, a handicapped asura, and you.

Good news everybody! ANet is an open-minded company. Guess you didn’t see the writing on the wall, did you?

Welcome to the 21st century.

I’m still waiting for Logan and Rytlock to declare their undying love for each other. ANet pls

Hah! I think the Queen has Logan’s number. You might be waiting a while.

Ardenwolfe.8590:

On that note, everyone is aware of the Destiny’s Edge 2.0, right? We have two lesbians, a char falling for a norn, a handicapped asura,

That doesn’t sound so controver…

Ardenwolfe.8590:

and you.

Oh.

Dashingsteel.3410:

OP only asked that ANET not try to represent the entire player base by posting political statements since the entire player base doesn’t agree

They never said anything about representing the players, they represent themselves. And posting political statement doesn’t mean “representing the players”. Don’t make up fake argument.

Vayne.8563:

Khristophoros.7194:

Behellagh.1468:

Khristophoros.7194:

I don’t care how many people agree or disagree with the court’s decision but I do find it annoying when a company takes a position on political issues.

There are a bunch of reasons why and I’d rather not get too deep into it. To keep it simple; just do your job ANet, which is making Guild Wars.

They’re already taken a position with Jory and Kas for years and recently added a transgender NPC.

These things shouldn’t be in the game for the purpose of taking a position. They should be there for the purpose of making characters deeper and more interesting.

Anet never said they were in game for taking a position, even if someone on the forums said. Of course, art of any kind was always meant to challenge preconceptions and stereotypes and that’s as valid a reason for including something in a game as anything else.

What are we doing now? Talking about it. That’s publicity. That’s another reason to put something in a game.

But I don’t see the stuff Anet has put in the game as being there just to take a position. As a writer, I know that characters sometimes just show up, and when they do I welcome them in, unless there’s a compelling reason not to use them.

Now that I think about it, what really annoys me is people like that person I was responding to who get so excited about seeing a token NPC like Sya or a homosexual couple in a story. It makes me think that they are obsessed with these topics and that they put LGBT people on a pedestal.

I grew up in the SF Bay Area. Some of my best friends are gay. They are literally just normal dudes and you wouldn’t think they were gay if you met them. Then you have those guys who do the lisp and dress specifically to make sure everyone knows immediately, and that’s their entire life and identity. Those people make normal gays look bad. I am not gay but it’s an opinion all my gay friends share with me.

So anyway that’s kinda why the obsession annoys me. I think it encourages more tokenism because the unnecessary enthusiasm looks like positive feedback.

Vayne.8563:

I’m sorry but this is a ridiculous point.

The people against marriage equality aren’t speaking for themselves. They’re saying those people over there, a group I’m not part of, can’t do something.

The people in that group aren’t saying that the first group can’t. One side is speaking for the other. That’s the issue here.

Far as I understand, on the marriage issue the chief argument Christians against gay marriage have is the belief that marriage is a religious thing. A large part of the faith revolves around marriage and it’s very traditional. To me that’s hardly a reason to deny gay people marriage due to marriage hardly being only a religious practice.

However, a church is not a business and not a government program. They can’t “refuse service” because it’s not a service (well, not the business type of service…). A large number of people against gay marriage think one thing will lead to another and eventually they would get in trouble for refusing service. My opinion? Just laws shouldn’t be kept out because they might lead to unjust laws. However, it’s a justified fear given how the LGBT community has acted in the past. Well, that’s my understanding.

Magicus.4302:

I’m referring to this: https://twitter.com/GuildWars2/status/614560129573351424

Please remember that a very large portion of your player base doesn’t agree with the court’s decision today.

ANET does not have to tip toe around people with wrong opinions.

Teenwolf.9174:

Conski Deshan.2057:

Magicus.4302:

Please remember that a very minor portion of your player base doesn’t agree with the court’s decision today.

FTFY

Also you’re in breach of the code of conduct.
Do not post:
which promotes hatred of any kind, including that based on nation, race, religion, age, sex, gender orientation, or culture.

How is in breech…. freaking liberals always think their opinion is the only one in the world that is the right one. Liberals are the true racists and bigots.

^ By promoting discriminatory hate against homosexuals. For what it’s worth, if you want to spew out verbal gonorrhea, you deserve whatever Anet is going to dish out against you in punishment.

Vayne.8563:

I’m sorry but this is a ridiculous point.

The people against marriage equality aren’t speaking for themselves. They’re saying those people over there, a group I’m not part of, can’t do something.

The people in that group aren’t saying that the first group can’t. One side is speaking for the other. That’s the issue here.

Your oversimplification is amusing. What some people for traditional marriage are saying is that you should not REDEFINE marriage. That redefinition affects everyone. Profoundly. How small to think it doesn’t affect everyone and everything.

Marriage equality as a term is about as accurate and meaningful as climate change. The left realized global warming was a loser, so they had to change it…except that the climate always changes and has historically been both warmer and colder before man came on the scene. So in a similar fashion, the left rebranded gay marriage as marriage equality. The playbook is always the same, redefine terms in order to cheat in any subsequent debate in order to dishonestly claim the high ground.

The gay marriage advocates are demanding that society redefine roles, traditions, and relationships that are based in moral and biological imperatives that are millennia old…or older. They aren’t simply asking for new rights, they are demanding that everyone accept their definition of an institution that many people have very strong feelings about. Some would label that a clear case of tyranny by a tiny minority.

Most people are fair minded. So having couples get equal treatment under the law is beneficial. But no one should kid themselves into thinking gay marriage is marriage. It is fundamentally something else, no matter how many times people want to pull Orwellian rabbits out of their hat and play word games. Certain biological truths cannot be redefined away. Marriage is about bringing together two FUNDAMENTALLY different genders that have fundamentally different roles and capabilities.

Why shouldn’t three people be allowed to marry? Or four? Why not allow bigamy, polygamy? Where does marriage equality end? It’s a laughable notion, as laughable as the current notion of tolerance and political correctness, which demands conformity to whatever daily wind is blowing about what might offend some group somewhere. Who cares. No one has a right to not be offended.

Dyvim.8293:

Marriage equality as a term is about as accurate and meaningful as climate change. The left realized global warming was a loser, so they had to change it…except that the climate always changes and has historically been both warmer and colder before man came on the scene.

This right here pretty much invalidates anything else you’re saying in my eyes

Magicus.4302:

I’m referring to this: https://twitter.com/GuildWars2/status/614560129573351424

Please remember that a very large portion of your player base doesn’t agree with the court’s decision today.

A very large portion of Arena Nets player base are Quaggans and hate the colour blue. Point is that it is easy to make statements like this, if you do not back it up with facts.

Just because you are intolerant Magicus, does not mean everyone should tiptoe around you. Everyone is entitled to their view and beliefs not just you.

Azel.4786:

Muzicman.9741:

I don’t think religious institutions should be forced to marry anyone against the wishes of its leadership, precepts, congregation, or what have you. I do think that anyone deserves the have the right to marry whomever they please, within the confines of the law.

Okay, I will copy only this part because it seems where the largest misunderstanding is happening and will explain this in a bit more detail on how it works where I am from.

If you have a “marriage” (or the equivalent word in your religion) you have a religious union before whoever is capable of doing so in your religion . If you go to anywhere – even abroad – and you have to right down if you are single or “married” what do you write?

Single. You can not write “married”.

Why? I had a marriage! I did everything that religion states that I should do! I spent a ton of money to do it! So how come I can’t say I am married??

Because a religious union is not recognized by the state and thus, for all legal purposes, you are still very much single.

The State only recognizes civil unions. So if you want to be able to write down and have the full legal implications of being “married” you have to do a civil union before the state.

If you go and have a civil union before the state and you go anywhere and have to say your civil status what do you write? “Married”.

Having a religious union is entirely up to the religious institution to decide who can or can not do a religious union. Having a civil union is entirely up to the Government to say who can or can not have a civil union. And here a civil union can occur freely – same sex or different sexes – but you can only have one civil union (whereas you can have as many religious unions your religion allows).

So at the end of the day what I say is that I don’t support the government going and telling the religious institutions what they must do. If a religion does not allow same sex marriage, that is the religious institution who has a right to say.

But on the state side, I very much support the position of our government in treating all equally.

I don’t know where you live, but where I am, the term marriage is not a term that’s exclusively religious. Even the dictionary definition of “marriage” is one that includes a union by state. You can call my marriage what you want, but as far as I and the US government is concerned I am married.

The discussion may then be whether or not “marriage” has been watered down as a term, but, alas, this is how it is.

Again, you may support the distinction between a civil union and a marriage, but where I live this distinction does not really exist as you state it.

Magicus.4302:

I’m referring to this: https://twitter.com/GuildWars2/status/614560129573351424

Please remember that a very large portion of your player base doesn’t agree with the court’s decision today.

There have been same-sex couples/relationships in this game (I would presume since the beginning). In fact, my sylvari has encountered two. One between Eldon amd some other male sylvari. Caithe and Faolin are another. There’s a third in LS2 where one female Sylvari loses her “friend” who sacrifices herself to blow up a Risen Giant Generator.

My surprise, coming from WoW where the only nod to same-sex relationships is tenuous at best, was how well their portrayals were so well written and performed. Anet obviously has been a supporter of same-sex relationships for quite some time. I’m just grateful that they were portrayed so well.

So it would make perfect sense for Anet to support yesterday’s SCOTUS ruling.

Aedelric.1287:

Just because you are intolerant Magicus,

If their point of view is just as valid as yours, why are they the intolerant one? Just wondering.

Its sad that this is even considered politics, the role of government is not to enforce moral guidelines. Not saying anything either way on this issue, but, the role of the government, state or federal, being so involved in social issues is a mistake. Looking at things morally rather then rationally. It shows that we still haven’t removed religion from politics.

Faereilos.5106:

Magicus.4302:

I’m referring to this: https://twitter.com/GuildWars2/status/614560129573351424

Please remember that a very large portion of your player base doesn’t agree with the court’s decision today.

Do you have numbers on this “large portion”? I don’t see anyone complaining about it in-game, on Reddit, and this is the first post about it on the forums.

Everyone deserves basic human rights and being able to marry who you love is one of them. If you’re teaching your kids otherwise, you don’t deserve to be a parent.

My main account was suspended today for pointing out that gays wanted special snowflake status for wanting rainbow dye.

ANET is bias on whose opinion matters.

Fermi.2409:

Dyvim.8293:

Marriage equality as a term is about as accurate and meaningful as climate change. The left realized global warming was a loser, so they had to change it…except that the climate always changes and has historically been both warmer and colder before man came on the scene.

This right here pretty much invalidates anything else you’re saying in my eyes

Moreso than ‘moral and biological imperatives’?

Still, I have to agree with the last part:

Dyvim.8293:

No one has a right to not be offended.

This is exactly how I feel whenever I see people flailing impotently about some bit of social progress they’ve been unable to stop or undo as though this time, finally, it’s really gone too far!

Celtic Lady.3729:

Aedelric.1287:

Just because you are intolerant Magicus,

If their point of view is just as valid as yours, why are they the intolerant one? Just wondering.

We all know the answer to that…

Because only opinions that agree with their groupthink are “good” opinions. Those screaming for tolerance are typically, today, among the least tolerant when it comes to debate. If you disagree, you are personally attacked, personally labeled in an ad hominem attempt to demean you and ridicule you. Its the old liberal playbook from the 60s. It is simply an effort to avoid honest debate to ignore varying points of view.

Person A doesn’t think marriage should be redefined. Person A gets labeled a homophobe. What if Person A is gay? Is he still a homophobe? Welcome to the lunacy of groupthink and those that practice it.

LameFox.6349:

Moreso than ‘moral and biological imperatives’?

That was just the first bit I got to. It was clear that the rest wasn’t worth wasting my time on.

Celtic Lady.3729:

Aedelric.1287:

Just because you are intolerant Magicus,

If their point of view is just as valid as yours, why are they the intolerant one? Just wondering.

Replace gay-marriage with inter-racial marriage and see if it sounds intolerant. If ANET tweeted a picture of black person marrying a white person and someone made a thread asking ANET to not make political statements because “many” players disagree with the concept, how ridiculously intolerant would that seem to you?

Also valid views can be intolerant.