Guild Wars 2

Guild Vault Transports are now unlocked with Economy level 5 instead of Economy level 2. The cost has been increased from 50 influence to 1 Guild Merit and 50 influence.

So, small guilds are crucified as collateral damage, eh? My guild was about to embark on E2 to get this, now it’s beyond our reach completely … kitten Anet this is cretinous!

Just what did this exploit enable to happen .. I’m asking what exploiters were able to achieve with it, NOT how it worked! .. which means my friends and I are now barred from getting this perk?

They achieved free storage from anywhere without paying anything for it (which the rest of us did by unlocking bag-slots or used the store bank-access item).

lordkrall.7241:

They achieved free storage from anywhere without paying anything for it (which the rest of us did by unlocking bag-slots or used the store bank-access item).

And you had equal and full access to your very own guild vault as well. That’s not an exploit, unless you live in Soviet Russia. Equal access to a thing does not an exploit make.

killcannon.2576:

And you had equal and full access to your very own guild vault as well. That’s not an exploit, unless you live in Soviet Russia. Equal access to a thing does not an exploit make.

It was however a unintended use of the upgrade, so they changed it.
Had people not abused it they most likely wouldn’t have done anything about it, but since people are experts on abusing things stuff like this happens.

lordkrall.7241:

killcannon.2576:

And you had equal and full access to your very own guild vault as well. That’s not an exploit, unless you live in Soviet Russia. Equal access to a thing does not an exploit make.

It was however a unintended use of the upgrade, so they changed it.
Had people not abused it they most likely wouldn’t have done anything about it, but since people are experts on abusing things stuff like this happens.

Since you seem to be so informed, what was the unintended use of the upgrade exactly?

killcannon.2576:

Since you seem to be so informed, what was the unintended use of the upgrade exactly?

Getting access to more or less unlimited storage without paying anything?

lordkrall.7241:

killcannon.2576:

Since you seem to be so informed, what was the unintended use of the upgrade exactly?

Getting access to more or less unlimited storage without paying anything?

Have you never used a guild vault? A guild vault has a limited (don’t know the exact amount without looking it up) space, the same as your personal bank. You pay by accruing guild reputation either by doing things in game, items, or paying gold. Anyone who is in a guild or made a guild has access to one, in the case of being in another persons guild you must have the permissions to access the guild vault. What this change does, is gate the guild vault dolyak thingy so only large guilds can access it. So, I guess now you know and hopefully have an educated discussion on the matter.

killcannon.2576:

Have you never used a guild vault? A guild vault has a limited (don’t know the exact amount without looking it up) space, the same as your personal bank. You pay by accruing guild reputation either by doing things in game, items, or paying gold. Anyone who is in a guild or made a guild has access to one, in the case of being in another persons guild you must have the permissions to access the guild vault. What this change does, is gate the guild vault dolyak thingy so only large guilds can access it. So, I guess now you know and hopefully have an educated discussion on the matter.

So, it was impossible for people to start 5 guilds (which is free) and then spend some gold to get them all up for the storage and the dolly?
With that tactic it was very possible to get massive amount of storage without having to pay a single $ to unlock more storage, which is most likely the reason for the change.

I wouldn’t minimize it by saying “some gold”, that amount of influence through gold would be pretty expensive. It’s not like you’re getting something for nothing.

lordkrall.7241:

killcannon.2576:

Since you seem to be so informed, what was the unintended use of the upgrade exactly?

Getting access to more or less unlimited storage without paying anything?

And since large guilds still have access to the very same upgrade, this solved what?
Punting should be reserved for ball games.

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

And since large guilds still have access to the very same upgrade, this solved what?
Punting should be reserved for ball games.

The keyword here is large guilds.
The thing was abused by people starting personal guilds in order to get fast and easy storage.

lordkrall.7241:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

And since large guilds still have access to the very same upgrade, this solved what?
Punting should be reserved for ball games.

The keyword here is large guilds.
The thing was abused by people starting personal guilds in order to get fast and easy storage.

Link to a Dev statement confirming that. Put up, or shut up.

You are guessing, no more. And defending that guess as if it were gospel.

Apparently it was because people were using it to deposit baubles while in the super adventure box and thereby bypassing the bag upgrade system and 500 bauble limit without ever needing to leave to use a city bank (Correct me if I’m wrong but that’s the rumour I heard).

Fay.2735:

Apparently it was because people were using it to deposit baubles while in the super adventure box and thereby bypassing the bag upgrade system and 500 bauble limit without ever needing to leave to use a city bank (Correct me if I’m wrong but that’s the rumour I heard).

Bauble Limit. Now this makes sense. And even more infuriating if this idiotic nostalgia “temporary” april fools crap is the reason.

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Fay.2735:

Apparently it was because people were using it to deposit baubles while in the super adventure box and thereby bypassing the bag upgrade system and 500 bauble limit without ever needing to leave to use a city bank (Correct me if I’m wrong but that’s the rumour I heard).

Bauble Limit. Now this makes sense. And even more infuriating if this idiotic nostalgia “temporary” april fools crap is the reason.

If that is so, then i fully expect the guild bank access upgrade be returned to what it was before after SAB is removed in May. Or to make the vault inaccessible from SAB.
The best way to fix exploits is to fix exploits, not to change the game around them.

The best way to fix exploits is to fix exploits, not to change the game around them.
[/quote]

This! ^
Stupid Adventure Box ruining all small/medium guilds is the definition of kitten headed idioticness.

The SAB exploit only makes sense in the Instance part of the exploit, not the raising it to tier 5 and increasing costs. Try again.

Fay.2735:

Apparently it was because people were using it to deposit baubles while in the super adventure box and thereby bypassing the bag upgrade system and 500 bauble limit without ever needing to leave to use a city bank (Correct me if I’m wrong but that’s the rumour I heard).

Close, but no.

It was simply a way for Gold Sellers to bypass the entire bag system.

Let’s paint a picture. You’ve got 50 gold sellers, all out in “the field” working. They are part of a XYZXLKDF guild, constantly using the Vault Transport to easily bring their loot back to the vault without having any downtime farming.

Just like the last update, which prevented guild vault access for 72 hours upon a new character joining a guild. The Vault is the key to wide spread farming efforts.

Sucks for everyone else, but ever since the price of Diamonds skyrocketed, and the price of Gold went down…. ANet will need to keep fighting. (I.E. Currently its cheaper, by 66%, to buy gold then it is to buy Diamonds from Anet, even counting the conversation rate to diamonds from gold)

killcannon.2576:

The SAB exploit only makes sense in the Instance part of the exploit, not the raising it to tier 5 and increasing costs. Try again.

SAB blame makes no sense. Baubles are account bound, therefore cannot be put in the Guild Vault.

I’m guessing the reason they raised the price is because they don’t want single players who have private guilds to be able to have extra storage for free. I’m not so sure this is unreasonable.

A lot of people in this game, due to the multiple guild system, have personal guilds for storage. They simply use it as extra storage. Guild banks aren’t really meant for personal storage, so it’s a way of people getting around buying bank space.

In fact, if you have this upgrade in a single player guild you don’t need remote bank access either. And the summon guild vault that’s a reward for guild missions becomes virtually meaningless if they left it where it was.

Is it a heavy-handed change, or was it too easy to get in the first place? I guess that would be a matter of opinion.

Vayne.8563:

I’m guessing the reason they raised the price is because they don’t want single players who have private guilds to be able to have extra storage for free. I’m not so sure this is unreasonable.

A lot of people in this game, due to the multiple guild system, have personal guilds for storage. They simply use it as extra storage. Guild banks aren’t really meant for personal storage, so it’s a way of people getting around buying bank space.

In fact, if you have this upgrade in a single player guild you don’t need remote bank access either. And the summon guild vault that’s a reward for guild missions becomes virtually meaningless if they left it where it was.

Is it a heavy-handed change, or was it too easy to get in the first place? I guess that would be a matter of opinion.

You honestly believe it took them 7 months to figure out people would use guild banks for personal storage? It’s a staple of most mmo’s, been around for years. Not to mention the fact that the staff at Anet are award winning developers, and I would have to assume, at the very least, moderately intelligent. But you’re gonna go with that. Okie dokie.

Here is a non comprehensive list of what people think or have thought this exploit was

Gold sellers using them

Being used in SAB

Player disparity (some people think it’s unfair that they are free, while some pay for extra bag space, never mind the fact that EVERYONE had access to them)

Anet wants people to buy more bank space (if this is true, I fear what they may remove arbitrarily in the future in order to make a buck)

Anet no longer wants to cater to smaller guilds (would be odd considering some of their recent statements being contrary to this, but is possible)

Devs don’t like farmers (even though most top tier cosmetic and stat gear requires it)

More traffic in major town hubs (no clue)

What they could, and in my opinion should have done, is release what the reasoning was behind this change, especially since they have supposedly closed whatever “exploit” that caused this in the first place. Player discussion and feedback could be a lot more constructive with it, but alas, what we have here is a failure to communicate with a dedicated and passionate player base.

killcannon.2576:

Vayne.8563:

I’m guessing the reason they raised the price is because they don’t want single players who have private guilds to be able to have extra storage for free. I’m not so sure this is unreasonable.

A lot of people in this game, due to the multiple guild system, have personal guilds for storage. They simply use it as extra storage. Guild banks aren’t really meant for personal storage, so it’s a way of people getting around buying bank space.

In fact, if you have this upgrade in a single player guild you don’t need remote bank access either. And the summon guild vault that’s a reward for guild missions becomes virtually meaningless if they left it where it was.

Is it a heavy-handed change, or was it too easy to get in the first place? I guess that would be a matter of opinion.

You honestly believe it took them 7 months to figure out people would use guild banks for personal storage? It’s a staple of most mmo’s, been around for years. Not to mention the fact that the staff at Anet are award winning developers, and I would have to assume, at the very least, moderately intelligent. But you’re gonna go with that. Okie dokie.

Here is a non comprehensive list of what people think or have thought this exploit was

Gold sellers using them

Being used in SAB

Player disparity (some people think it’s unfair that they are free, while some pay for extra bag space, never mind the fact that EVERYONE had access to them)

Anet wants people to buy more bank space (if this is true, I fear what they may remove arbitrarily in the future in order to make a buck)

Anet no longer wants to cater to smaller guilds (would be odd considering some of their recent statements being contrary to this, but is possible)

Devs don’t like farmers (even though most top tier cosmetic and stat gear requires it)

More traffic in major town hubs (no clue)

What they could, and in my opinion should have done, is release what the reasoning was behind this change, especially since they have supposedly closed whatever “exploit” that caused this in the first place. Player discussion and feedback could be a lot more constructive with it, but alas, what we have here is a failure to communicate with a dedicated and passionate player base.

I’m saying while they were changing this for the exploit, it’s why they raised the price…or a possibilty of why. Before the exploit, whatever it was (and I’m relatively sure there was some reason to do that kind of upgrade on a weekend), they didn’t change it but since they had to change it anyway they put in that change.

A solo person only gets 2 influence for a dynamic event. A person with a friend in his party doing the same event gets the guild 20.

It’s entirely possible that at launch they didn’t think single people would sit there and grind out all those 2’s to get extra storage yes. It takes a damnably long time. So long in fact that it probably wasn’t a problem until now.

So lack of foresight then? Did they have guild banks in Guild Wars? (no clue) Did none of them ever play another mmo? See previous post above about them being award winning game developers and at least of moderate intelligence.

And this doesn’t speak to the people who have 5 to 10 people in a guild either, or the casual guilds, or a number of other things.

My point of all this is not to try to figure out why they did it, but to instead highlight that they need to communicate these changes which may affect a significant portion of the player base in a more effective manner. Especially after closing said exploit. Many issues here on the forums and in game could be handled with less player suspicion with just a few lines of text explaining the “whys” of changes, instead of just arbitrarily announcing them.

Player discussion and input can and does help games and developers, but something I have picked up on while on these forums is that the rapport between developer and player has drastically decreased between anet and their playerbase from the times of Guild Wars.

killcannon.2576:

So lack of foresight then? Did they have guild banks in Guild Wars? (no clue) Did none of them ever play another mmo? See previous post above about them being award winning game developers and at least of moderate intelligence.

And this doesn’t speak to the people who have 5 to 10 people in a guild either, or the casual guilds, or a number of other things.

My point of all this is not to try to figure out why they did it, but to instead highlight that they need to communicate these changes which may affect a significant portion of the player base in a more effective manner. Especially after closing said exploit. Many issues here on the forums and in game could be handled with less player suspicion with just a few lines of text explaining the “whys” of changes, instead of just arbitrarily announcing them.

Player discussion and input can and does help games and developers, but something I have picked up on while on these forums is that the rapport between developer and player has drastically decreased between anet and their playerbase from the times of Guild Wars.

I don’t remember guild banks from Guild Wars 1. I’m pretty sure it didn’t have them. We had guild halls, but no guild banks. They’re working on Guild Halls as far as I know. You could access your personal chest in Guild Halls, but there was no way to actually access your storage at all out in the world. You had to return to an outpost.

I can count on one finger how many times my guild has used guild vault transport…so I am having trouble figuring out why this is such a big deal.

Yohimbe.1876:

I can count on one finger how many times my guild has used guild vault transport…so I am having trouble figuring out why this is such a big deal.

The " big deal" wasn’t in the guild vault transports itself, but rather in the arbitrary way they were removed from small guild usage with no other reason given other than “because”.

Astralporing.1957:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Fay.2735:

Apparently it was because people were using it to deposit baubles while in the super adventure box and thereby bypassing the bag upgrade system and 500 bauble limit without ever needing to leave to use a city bank (Correct me if I’m wrong but that’s the rumour I heard).

Bauble Limit. Now this makes sense. And even more infuriating if this idiotic nostalgia “temporary” april fools crap is the reason.

If that is so, then i fully expect the guild bank access upgrade be returned to what it was before after SAB is removed in May. Or to make the vault inaccessible from SAB.
The best way to fix exploits is to fix exploits, not to change the game around them.

Baubles are account bound, you can’t put acc bound stuff in guild bank.

I realized how stupid it was when I thought about it earlier. I think the people talking about it thought it meant bank bank not guild bank and so they had it mixed up and then it mixed me up in return as the plausibility of the bauble thing would make sense when in conjunction with normal bank so the ‘guild’ part sort of slipped my mind.

I never use the guild vault transport. I just think it’s a waste of influence because it only takes a minute to run down to the guild bank so it feels pretty lazy to me. I don’t really see how this is such a big loss. If it was personal bank then maybe yea but guild vault? I don’t know… I don’t really feel like it’s a big enough deal to rage and complain about it as if it’s the end of the world but people sure love to complain on these forums for the sake of complaining. If this stops exploiters then it’s a thumbs up from me.

Fay.2735:

I realized how stupid it was when I thought about it earlier. I think the people talking about it thought it meant bank bank not guild bank and so they had it mixed up and then it mixed me up in return as the plausibility of the bauble thing would make sense when in conjunction with normal bank so the ‘guild’ part sort of slipped my mind.

I never use the guild vault transport. I just think it’s a waste of influence because it only takes a minute to run down to the guild bank so it feels pretty lazy to me. I don’t really see how this is such a big loss. If it was personal bank then maybe yea but guild vault? I don’t know… I don’t really feel like it’s a big enough deal to rage and complain about it as if it’s the end of the world but people sure love to complain on these forums for the sake of complaining. If this stops exploiters then it’s a thumbs up from me.

One of the reasons people are complaining about it is not the fact of whether or not it is useful, but instead the way it was arbitrarily removed from the reach of small guilds with nothing more of a reason than “because”. Since no one knows what the exploit was, there is no way to constructively discuss the situation at all. Developer and player communication is one of the keys to building a stable, long lasting community. Since the exploit was supposedly closed, there was no reason why Anet could not have appended a short explanation on the “why” of their decision. Instead, it’s just another example of a disconnect between game makers and game players, something that happens to often in todays marketplace.

I don’t know any single MMO that discusses exploits though. Even the discussion about them gives people ideas. It’s like having a convention talking about how to break into houses. It’s not done because we don’t want people breaking into houses. Maybe at a police convention they’d have a discussion like that.

Anet is not going to talk about exploits, because it’s their policy not to do so. A policy that every MMO I’ve played in has adopted.

Which unfortunately means all we can do is speculate.

Vayne.8563:

I don’t know any single MMO that discusses exploits though. Even the discussion about them gives people ideas. It’s like having a convention talking about how to break into houses. It’s not done because we don’t want people breaking into houses. Maybe at a police convention they’d have a discussion like that.

Anet is not going to talk about exploits, because it’s their policy not to do so. A policy that every MMO I’ve played in has adopted.

Which unfortunately means all we can do is speculate.

The exploit was closed, supposedly, as was stated from the update. They discussed the snowflake exploit quite openly. And finally, closing an exploit usually doesn’t affect a large chunk of the player base, and when it does, they have posted why they have removed it. There are examples of them discussing exploits in the dungeons forums, pvp forums, wvw forums. It’s never been a black or white policy about discussing exploits, especially after they are closed, regardless of what the terms of service or usage state.

So, there is no reason not to let the player base know why they made their decision.

As an aside about exploits in general, there are plenty of conventions about software exploits, with white hats giving examples and showing IT people how their networks can be broken into. There are also law enforcement conventions that actually do talk about different ways to break into homes along with other crimes. How exactly do you think they learn to stop bots and hackers?

killcannon.2576:

Vayne.8563:

I don’t know any single MMO that discusses exploits though. Even the discussion about them gives people ideas. It’s like having a convention talking about how to break into houses. It’s not done because we don’t want people breaking into houses. Maybe at a police convention they’d have a discussion like that.

Anet is not going to talk about exploits, because it’s their policy not to do so. A policy that every MMO I’ve played in has adopted.

Which unfortunately means all we can do is speculate.

The exploit was closed, supposedly, as was stated from the update. They discussed the snowflake exploit quite openly. And finally, closing an exploit usually doesn’t affect a large chunk of the player base, and when it does, they have posted why they have removed it. There are examples of them discussing exploits in the dungeons forums, pvp forums, wvw forums. It’s never been a black or white policy about discussing exploits, especially after they are closed, regardless of what the terms of service or usage state.

So, there is no reason not to let the player base know why they made their decision.

Can you show me a quote of Anet themselves discussing the snowflake exploit? I didn’t see them discuss it, just other people.

And yes, it is policy not to talk about exploits, even if they decide to sometimes do so. I say it’s policy because that has actually been stated on this forums, if nothing else by mods.

Vayne.8563:

killcannon.2576:

Vayne.8563:

I don’t know any single MMO that discusses exploits though. Even the discussion about them gives people ideas. It’s like having a convention talking about how to break into houses. It’s not done because we don’t want people breaking into houses. Maybe at a police convention they’d have a discussion like that.

Anet is not going to talk about exploits, because it’s their policy not to do so. A policy that every MMO I’ve played in has adopted.

Which unfortunately means all we can do is speculate.

The exploit was closed, supposedly, as was stated from the update. They discussed the snowflake exploit quite openly. And finally, closing an exploit usually doesn’t affect a large chunk of the player base, and when it does, they have posted why they have removed it. There are examples of them discussing exploits in the dungeons forums, pvp forums, wvw forums. It’s never been a black or white policy about discussing exploits, especially after they are closed, regardless of what the terms of service or usage state.

So, there is no reason not to let the player base know why they made their decision.

Can you show me a quote of Anet themselves discussing the snowflake exploit? I didn’t see them discuss it, just other people.

And yes, it is policy not to talk about exploits, even if they decide to sometimes do so. I say it’s policy because that has actually been stated on this forums, if nothing else by mods.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/account/Bans-for-Snowflake-Jewelry-are-unfair

There ya go, they discussed it. Can find more if you need em.

killcannon.2576:

Vayne.8563:

killcannon.2576:

Vayne.8563:

I don’t know any single MMO that discusses exploits though. Even the discussion about them gives people ideas. It’s like having a convention talking about how to break into houses. It’s not done because we don’t want people breaking into houses. Maybe at a police convention they’d have a discussion like that.

Anet is not going to talk about exploits, because it’s their policy not to do so. A policy that every MMO I’ve played in has adopted.

Which unfortunately means all we can do is speculate.

The exploit was closed, supposedly, as was stated from the update. They discussed the snowflake exploit quite openly. And finally, closing an exploit usually doesn’t affect a large chunk of the player base, and when it does, they have posted why they have removed it. There are examples of them discussing exploits in the dungeons forums, pvp forums, wvw forums. It’s never been a black or white policy about discussing exploits, especially after they are closed, regardless of what the terms of service or usage state.

So, there is no reason not to let the player base know why they made their decision.

Can you show me a quote of Anet themselves discussing the snowflake exploit? I didn’t see them discuss it, just other people.

And yes, it is policy not to talk about exploits, even if they decide to sometimes do so. I say it’s policy because that has actually been stated on this forums, if nothing else by mods.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/account/Bans-for-Snowflake-Jewelry-are-unfair

There ya go, they discussed it. Can find more if you need em.

This isn’t Anet really talking about the exploit at all. It’s Anet talking about the bans which people were complaining about. This is a community manager talking about damage of something that everyone else is already talking about. Obviously the exploit was well known at that point and this post revealed zero. Nothing. This is not an example of Anet talking about an exploit.

She didn’t explain the exploit. She didn’t specifically say anything about the exploit. She talked about how much money people made from exploiting it, how it would have ruined the economy and thus why they were banned.

I think there’s a clear difference between someone coming on to defend banning players and someone coming on to explain an exploit or a decision on how they closed an exploit, more specifically.

It’s completely reasonable for them not to explain an exploit as it may give others ideas on how to exploit the game. Anet has no obligation to share exploit fixes. The only time this would be necessary is if the thing they fix is major enough to at least be notified of. Like the guild bank transport change, they at least told us about the changes. However there is really no need nor should they go into details about the exploit that was being used.

What I think the real cause of this change is:

Lots of people used their own personal guild’s bank as if it was their normal bank.

Guild Vault Transport costed 50 Influence to make, which at 20 Copper per point (assuming your buying influence) is 10 Silver.

The Bank Access Express that can be bought from the Gemstore costs 35 Gems. To buy 35 Gems at the current price would cost around 84 Silver.

While the guild vault is not as useful as the normal bank, it costed less than 1/8th of the price to summon.

Now obviously ANet want people to buy Gems, and removing the guild vault as an alternative to the normal bank will make people need to buy Gems for Bank Access Expresses if they want quick access to their stuff, but why make Guild Vault Transport cost Merits is what bugs me.

They are very sought-after by guilds at the moment and for something as trivial as access to the guild vault they are simply not worth it.

Vayne.8563:

killcannon.2576:

Vayne.8563:

killcannon.2576:

Vayne.8563:

I don’t know any single MMO that discusses exploits though. Even the discussion about them gives people ideas. It’s like having a convention talking about how to break into houses. It’s not done because we don’t want people breaking into houses. Maybe at a police convention they’d have a discussion like that.

Anet is not going to talk about exploits, because it’s their policy not to do so. A policy that every MMO I’ve played in has adopted.

Which unfortunately means all we can do is speculate.

The exploit was closed, supposedly, as was stated from the update. They discussed the snowflake exploit quite openly. And finally, closing an exploit usually doesn’t affect a large chunk of the player base, and when it does, they have posted why they have removed it. There are examples of them discussing exploits in the dungeons forums, pvp forums, wvw forums. It’s never been a black or white policy about discussing exploits, especially after they are closed, regardless of what the terms of service or usage state.

So, there is no reason not to let the player base know why they made their decision.

Can you show me a quote of Anet themselves discussing the snowflake exploit? I didn’t see them discuss it, just other people.

And yes, it is policy not to talk about exploits, even if they decide to sometimes do so. I say it’s policy because that has actually been stated on this forums, if nothing else by mods.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/account/Bans-for-Snowflake-Jewelry-are-unfair

There ya go, they discussed it. Can find more if you need em.

This isn’t Anet really talking about the exploit at all. It’s Anet talking about the bans which people were complaining about. This is a community manager talking about damage of something that everyone else is already talking about. Obviously the exploit was well known at that point and this post revealed zero. Nothing. This is not an example of Anet talking about an exploit.

She didn’t explain the exploit. She didn’t specifically say anything about the exploit. She talked about how much money people made from exploiting it, how it would have ruined the economy and thus why they were banned.

I think there’s a clear difference between someone coming on to defend banning players and someone coming on to explain an exploit or a decision on how they closed an exploit, more specifically.

She talked about how much money people made from exploiting it, how it would have ruined the economy and thus why they were banned. She also explained what happened.

That’s pretty much all I ask for. You said the word discuss, she discussed it. There’s also threads on reddit, but you can go look for them yourself. There will come a day when there will be an arbitrary change that comes around that affects you specifically, and you will wonder why. And I hope that you remember that you were on the a game forum saying “Arbitrary changes are a just a thing”

Dev talking about DR implemented for exploits:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/DR-Diminished-Returns

Dev talking about why they sometimes don’t put notes down for closing of exploits:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Why-wasn-t-this-nerf-included-in-patch-notes

There are many more posts talking about exploits, mostly after they were closed and no longer a problem. I’m not saying there should be a detailed report telling me how to do something, because I don’t care about that. Just why it was necessary to remove the functionality from only small guilds.

My small guild can’t build vault transports anymore. We actually used them now and then. Thanks for nothing, ANet.

UndeadRufus.6832:

My small guild can’t build vault transports anymore. We actually used them now and then. Thanks for nothing, ANet.

I agree with this what a dam waste thanks anet again screw the small guild .

The reality is even large guild wont’ use a guild merit for a guild transport. Hack if you are in a large guild, it is usually fill with junk so people wont’ steal things.

So I think people should stop making it a small vs large guild thing.

The people getting hit is really the one using guild bank as a personal bank.

laokoko.7403:

The reality is even large guild wont’ use a guild merit for a guild transport. Hack if you are in a large guild, it is usually fill with junk so people wont’ steal things.

So I think people should stop making it a small vs large guild thing.

The people getting hit is really the one using guild bank as a personal bank.

There is a difference between having to pay a price to use it and not being able to use it AT ALL. Small guilds suffer from the latter.

laokoko.7403:

So I think people should stop making it a small vs large guild thing.

The people getting hit is really the one using guild bank as a personal bank.

I’m in a small guild, and we can no longer build vault transport. You were saying?

UndeadRufus.6832:

laokoko.7403:

So I think people should stop making it a small vs large guild thing.

The people getting hit is really the one using guild bank as a personal bank.

I’m in a small guild, and we can no longer build vault transport. You were saying?

I’m in a large guild. And if any officer build vault transport for personal use, I’ll leave the guild. The reality is “almost” no one actually use vault transport if you are in a large guild.

The only reason you were able to use vault transport because you are in a small guild and don’t need to look at the other 499 people in the face to use vault transport for personal use.

If you are in a small guild, you’ll be able to more controll of the guild resource. If you are in a large guild, you actually need to be responsible for the guild resources.

Do you think a large guild even build guild transport? Even if they did, how many people is able to use it? 1 or 2 people out of the 500 people?

People actually use this. I wasn’t even aware of it until now. I am not sure how this will really affect anyone but the people that were exploiting it.

Ruprect.7260:

People actually use this. I wasn’t even aware of it until now. I am not sure how this will really affect anyone but the people that were exploiting it.

Ya I mean, the only one able to use it is those who exploit it for personal use. Or is in a tight small guild who is able to control the guild resources without caring about the other 499 people.

laokoko.7403:

I’m in a large guild. And if any officer build vault transport for personal use, I’ll leave the guild.

Okay….

The reality is “almost” no one actually use vault transport if you are in a large guild.

And you base this claim on . . . what? I mean, if you’re going to use an opener like “in reality,” then I’ll assume you can demonstrate how that is actually the case. Even then I’m not sure it would matter, but anyway….

The only reason you were able to use vault transport because you are in a small guild and don’t need to look at the other 499 people in the face to use vault transport for personal use.

Again, based on what? How do you know that?

If you are in a small guild, you’ll be able to more controll of the guild resource. If you are in a large guild, you actually need to be responsible for the guild resources.

That’s probably true, depending on the specific situation and your status therein. So what?

Do you think a large guild even build guild transport?

I don’t know. I’m not in a large guild. So what?

Even if they did, how many people is able to use it? 1 or 2 people out of the 500 people?

Based on what? And so what? Even if we assume vault access would likely be restricted to officers or what have you, why is that a problem? Nothing is stopping you from forming your own guild if you’re dissatisfied with your current role.

You seem to have a wide variety of assertions, but little in the way of relevant commentary. My guild built and used guild vault transport. Now we can’t, and I’m somewhat upset about this. I’m not clear on how you not using it, or feeling underprivileged, has anything to do with that.

nothing stop you from forming a large guild to get the merit. (if you really want to argue that way since you said nothing stoping me to form a small guild).

i don’t know why we are arguing about guild vault transport. it’s just a quite useless feature. Maybe you should try to care about guild influence more, there’s so much more things guild influence is good for. If anything you should be arguing your small guild can’t do guild mission because you don’t have enough influence.

I’m sorry. I’ll go find other things to do. You have every right to complain. I’m just surprised people actually care about guild transport to argue about it. I only use it for personal use for my personal guild.

laokoko.7403:

nothing stop you from forming a large guild to get the merit. (if you really want to argue that way since you said nothing stoping me to form a small guild).

I don’t want a large guild, and I didn’t say you had to form a small guild. I said you could form your own guild, size notwithstanding, and your “guild resources” “problem” goes away if you so choose. That really seemed to be your main problem anyway, what with you categorically stating that you would leave your guild if an officer used it for personal transport. You just don’t like someone else being in control, or at least that’s how it looks. Two solutions are obvious: don’t be in a guild, or form your own.

i don’t know why we are arguing about guild vault transport. it’s just a quite useless feature.

For such a “useless feature,” we (my guild) sure found it useful.

Maybe you should try to care about guild influence more, there’s so much more things guild influence is good for.

Depends entirely on what you value in the game. Primarily doing PvE, vault transport was important. Losing it doesn’t break the game or anything, but it makes things substantially less convenient sometimes.

What was it useful for?

I agree, this change is HORRIBLE and punishes smaller guilds like mine, which will never, ever obtain any of the guild merits due to our tiny, tiny size. WHY WAS THIS CHANGE MADE? Our guild ALREADY paid the price for this perk and now it’s been jerked out from under us.

PLEASE CHANGE IT BACK OR ELIMINATE THE GUILD MERIT COST.

Otherwise, it’s just unfair to small guilds.