Guild Wars 2

I don’t the think the personal story was as well received as Anet wanted it to be. We all know what people thought of Trahearne and the Zhaitan fight. We’ve all seen people talk it down. While it did have people who liked it, many many people disliked it. The open world has always been the strength of this game.

I think Anet really wanted to shift the focus to the world and away from the story.

Oh, cows. You know, there were some times I’d consider only feeding the cows in Applenook for that heart. Plug leaks? No. Murderise bandit pirate scallies on the rob? Why, no, sir. Feed cows (and okay, some chickens and pigs too)? Yes! A thousand times! Cows rock.

No cow feeding in Queensdale is clearly a travesty which ought to be corrected.

Hm.

These days, I’m mostly playing a different game, where I can raise my own cows and feed them. Which is nice. I wouldn’t consider making a new character in GW2 at this time, and I was a confirmed altoholic. Well, at least I’ll be sober with no need for a twelve-step programme.

Now I just join in for the WvW tournament, and playing with my kid when she wants to do stuff (we killed the Shatterer today; it was Small’s first dragon, and she, unlike most of us who have haunted these forums for that last few years, actually thought it was quite something. So that was nice). I feel rather uninspired to do anything else. I don’t know if it was just the cows that did it, or if the bovines were merely the cherry on top of the icing on top of the cake. Poor cows. Who’d’ve ever thought it was too confusing to feed them? *sheds tear for starving cows*

Vayne.8563:

I don’t the think the personal story was as well received as Anet wanted it to be. We all know what people thought of Trahearne and the Zhaitan fight. We’ve all seen people talk it down. While it did have people who liked it, many many people disliked it. The open world has always been the strength of this game.

I think Anet really wanted to shift the focus to the world and away from the story.

Speaking of the personal story, my NPE ele has at last met Trahearne. Last night we visited the Pale Tree, at his suggestion, and my ele got to see visions of Trahearne as the Savior of Tyria who will lead us all to victory against Zhaitan (“We fi-i-i-ght!”), and then she got to stand by in awe and wonder as his proud mama gave him a magic sword.

I can tell you she (like many before her) was thrilled beyond measure to be there.

But! Thanks to the NPE changes, she wasn’t thinking, “Ya know, I could totally take this Trahearnia guy in rock ’em sock ’em golems over in Metrica Province.”

:D

Vayne.8563:

I don’t the think the personal story was as well received as Anet wanted it to be. We all know what people thought of Trahearne and the Zhaitan fight. We’ve all seen people talk it down. While it did have people who liked it, many many people disliked it. The open world has always been the strength of this game.

I think Anet really wanted to shift the focus to the world and away from the story.

The same thing could be said for dynamic events. Arenanet said people just weren’t doing new events, which is why they weren’t putting a lot of effort into them. Hearts have always seem to be hated by the majority because they mimic your typical mmo quest.
What does that leave for the open world? Vistas, PoI, skill points, and parts of the living story? I guess that would explain why they are putting all their eggs in the living story basket.
I actually don’t know what I find to be the strongest aspect of the game. I mostly just run around killing stuff. I guess that would mean the open world is what’s keeping me going.

I actually think I liked the season 1 stuff more than the current season. It’s biggest problem was grindy achievements and of course it being temporary.
Marionette fight was much better than anything we’ve seen this season imo.

Vayne.8563:

I don’t the think the personal story was as well received as Anet wanted it to be. We all know what people thought of Trahearne and the Zhaitan fight. We’ve all seen people talk it down. While it did have people who liked it, many many people disliked it. The open world has always been the strength of this game.

I talk a lot of things as “not all that bad as people say”. Trahearne, and by extension Kormir, would be one of the things I like to sit down and go on at length about. He’s a lightning rod for it because he is the only persistent character to be dealt with when the story before his entrance at Claw Island didn’t have persistence as a big deal.

But the Zhaitan fight . . . no. That should have been what we would have gotten in November 2012 instead of Lost Shores. Not a rushed encounter.

The Personal Story is/was a mess of stand-alone chapters getting welded together poorly, up until Trahearne entered the picture. Then we get what resembled a GW1 storyline – fairly straightforward and generally not getting bogged down in junk.

I think Anet really wanted to shift the focus to the world and away from the story.

I think they aren’t quite ready to drop the axe on the Personal Story and wholesale re-work it as they probably need to. And they will continue to have it be an albatross around the necks of players who want to care about the story at all.

Behellagh.1468:

felessan.9587:

Suggestions:

• Unlock personal story at level 1 and every 10 levels after, and re-insert “My Greatest Fear” at level 60

Except that violates the reasoning behind the change, to unlock a chapter only when a player can binge it in it’s entirety.

Assuming, of course, that the change is a good one that should be kept.

shadow.6174:

Anyway, let’s put it this way: entertaining a cow isn’t logical in anywhere in universe, either RL or in game. A cow is hungry and what you do is dance in front it? C’mon, that’s non-sense. And again, what’s the difficulty in handling a bundle? Anyone curious enough could quickly figure out what to do with it and how to get rid of it. It’s even funny they took away bundles from starter hearts while I still see random bundles around in some starter areas (and with it I mean lower than lvl 5 areas)…

The feed bundles were abused as speed boosters.

Of course that does not answer why they just didn’t take the speed boost away. On the other hand, I bought a dancing with cows t-shirt at the Tillamook factory in Oregon this summer.

HandOfKane.5409:

Behellagh.1468:

felessan.9587:

Suggestions:

• Unlock personal story at level 1 and every 10 levels after, and re-insert “My Greatest Fear” at level 60

Except that violates the reasoning behind the change, to unlock a chapter only when a player can binge it in it’s entirety.

Assuming, of course, that the change is a good one that should be kept.

HandOfKane. Warhammer?

Bellizare.5816:

HandOfKane.5409:

Behellagh.1468:

felessan.9587:

Suggestions:

• Unlock personal story at level 1 and every 10 levels after, and re-insert “My Greatest Fear” at level 60

Except that violates the reasoning behind the change, to unlock a chapter only when a player can binge it in it’s entirety.

Assuming, of course, that the change is a good one that should be kept.

HandOfKane. Warhammer?

I was thinking Command and Conquer.

Bellizare.5816:

The feed bundles were abused as speed boosters.

Of course that does not answer why they just didn’t take the speed boost away. On the other hand, I bought a dancing with cows t-shirt at the Tillamook factory in Oregon this summer.

The speed boost happens that way because it then manages to work with Engineer kits, presumably. Taking it away then breaks Engineer.

. . . well, breaks it again.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Bellizare.5816:

HandOfKane.5409:

Behellagh.1468:

felessan.9587:

Suggestions:

• Unlock personal story at level 1 and every 10 levels after, and re-insert “My Greatest Fear” at level 60

Except that violates the reasoning behind the change, to unlock a chapter only when a player can binge it in it’s entirety.

Assuming, of course, that the change is a good one that should be kept.

HandOfKane. Warhammer?

I was thinking Command and Conquer.

Ah yes. Warhammer was Khaine or something.

Loved C&C on my old power mac.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Bellizare.5816:

The feed bundles were abused as speed boosters.

Of course that does not answer why they just didn’t take the speed boost away. On the other hand, I bought a dancing with cows t-shirt at the Tillamook factory in Oregon this summer.

The speed boost happens that way because it then manages to work with Engineer kits, presumably. Taking it away then breaks Engineer.

. . . well, breaks it again.

The feed bundles at the ranch were speed boosts. The bunnies by the Asura gate to DR also gave a speed boost, but I have not noticed that event up lately. You used to be able to buy rabbit foot accessories from the nearby merchant for a short time if the bunnies all got returned before they ate all of the melons.

But the bunnies were not up all of the time, and I never passed the ranch without grabbing a feed sack.

Bellizare.5816:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Bellizare.5816:

The feed bundles were abused as speed boosters.

Of course that does not answer why they just didn’t take the speed boost away. On the other hand, I bought a dancing with cows t-shirt at the Tillamook factory in Oregon this summer.

The speed boost happens that way because it then manages to work with Engineer kits, presumably. Taking it away then breaks Engineer.

. . . well, breaks it again.

The feed bundles at the ranch were speed boosts. The bunnies by the Asura gate to DR also gave a speed boost, but I have not noticed that event up lately. You used to be able to buy rabbit foot accessories from the nearby merchant for a short time if the bunnies all got returned before they ate all of the melons.

But the bunnies were not up all of the time, and I never passed the ranch without grabbing a feed sack.

Hmm? I must have thought you meant “swap weapon” effects happening on bundles. Such as getting swiftness when I pick up a “bone” bundle weapon.

Yeah, I see that.

Never understood why they had the boost on the feed bundle to start with. The cows are right next to the sacks.

The bunnies on the other hand…

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Bellizare.5816:

HandOfKane.5409:

Behellagh.1468:

felessan.9587:

Suggestions:

• Unlock personal story at level 1 and every 10 levels after, and re-insert “My Greatest Fear” at level 60

Except that violates the reasoning behind the change, to unlock a chapter only when a player can binge it in it’s entirety.

Assuming, of course, that the change is a good one that should be kept.

HandOfKane. Warhammer?

I was thinking Command and Conquer.

^Got it.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Hmm? I must have thought you meant “swap weapon” effects happening on bundles. Such as getting swiftness when I pick up a “bone” bundle weapon.

Oh? I never heard about that, sounds like some bug or something.. if my slow mesmer would only knew that.. goodbye unreliable TC… :P just joking.

shadow.6174:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Hmm? I must have thought you meant “swap weapon” effects happening on bundles. Such as getting swiftness when I pick up a “bone” bundle weapon.

Oh? I never heard about that, sounds like some bug or something.. if my slow mesmer would only knew that.. goodbye unreliable TC… :P just joking.

For PvE Mesmer I always equip a weapon slot with sigil of speed and murder everything in sight to maintain acceleration.

Bellizare.5816:

shadow.6174:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Hmm? I must have thought you meant “swap weapon” effects happening on bundles. Such as getting swiftness when I pick up a “bone” bundle weapon.

Oh? I never heard about that, sounds like some bug or something.. if my slow mesmer would only knew that.. goodbye unreliable TC… :P just joking.

For PvE Mesmer I always equip a weapon slot with sigil of speed and murder everything in sight to maintain acceleration.

I’ve been doing the same thing the last couple of weeks on my Mesmer. I leveled my Mesmer to 80 months ago. Wish I had known what a difference it made a long time ago. I didn’t add the sigils until I already had 80% map completion, lol.

To keep this on topic, leveling my Mesmer to 80 was actually enjoyable for me and didn’t feel like a grind at all (crazy, I know). Still that was before the trait changes and the NPE. I can’t imagine leveling a Mesmer from scratch at this point.

Vayne.8563:

I don’t the think the personal story was as well received as Anet wanted it to be. We all know what people thought of Trahearne and the Zhaitan fight. We’ve all seen people talk it down. While it did have people who liked it, many many people disliked it. The open world has always been the strength of this game.

I think Anet really wanted to shift the focus to the world and away from the story.

See personal story isnt great, but its actually generally better in the first 20 levels, (depending on your race/choices) But it does provide a backdrop or narrative.

The open world on the otherhand isnt that strong early, its ok, but its not stirring. Also the open world actually loses more with the arrow. Its good for completion, but its bad for making you feel like the game is free and open.

What they really needed to have, was an open world means of leading newbs. Lets think of some newbie like dynamic event chains that tell a story, The truth is the dynamic event system is one of the main strengths, and a well crafted chain in the beginning could be a lot more satisfying than the starter story, and hold them over till level 10.

They should also kind of make it clear when your next personal story missions will unlock.

point is, if they want to keep people, a more riveting starter experience will probably go further than a more easy one, imo.

phys.7689:

Vayne.8563:

I don’t the think the personal story was as well received as Anet wanted it to be. We all know what people thought of Trahearne and the Zhaitan fight. We’ve all seen people talk it down. While it did have people who liked it, many many people disliked it. The open world has always been the strength of this game.

I think Anet really wanted to shift the focus to the world and away from the story.

See personal story isnt great, but its actually generally better in the first 20 levels, (depending on your race/choices) But it does provide a backdrop or narrative.

The open world on the otherhand isnt that strong early, its ok, but its not stirring. Also the open world actually loses more with the arrow. Its good for completion, but its bad for making you feel like the game is free and open.

What they really needed to have, was an open world means of leading newbs. Lets think of some newbie like dynamic event chains that tell a story, The truth is the dynamic event system is one of the main strengths, and a well crafted chain in the beginning could be a lot more satisfying than the starter story, and hold them over till level 10.

They should also kind of make it clear when your next personal story missions will unlock.

point is, if they want to keep people, a more riveting starter experience will probably go further than a more easy one, imo.

I still think it’s not a huge deal that the story starts 1 hour or so into the game. The actual leveling and constant or almost contest addition of information from the level windows is what will keep people going to then. And I think we’ll see what percentage of people get engaged in MMOs due to story very shortly.

Again, to me it would have been the beauty of the world itself that kept me playing for an hour.

phys.7689:

They should also kind of make it clear when your next personal story missions will unlock.

And this is one of the issues (I even noted it on my lvl 80 that had PS completed yet, I felt something was lacking), at certain stages there’s not anything telling you what’s next until you reach the required level. As I have stated before it just gives the feeling of “it’s over?”.

phys.7689:

Vayne.8563:

I don’t the think the personal story was as well received as Anet wanted it to be. We all know what people thought of Trahearne and the Zhaitan fight. We’ve all seen people talk it down. While it did have people who liked it, many many people disliked it. The open world has always been the strength of this game.

I think Anet really wanted to shift the focus to the world and away from the story.

See personal story isnt great, but its actually generally better in the first 20 levels, (depending on your race/choices) But it does provide a backdrop or narrative.

The open world on the otherhand isnt that strong early, its ok, but its not stirring. Also the open world actually loses more with the arrow. Its good for completion, but its bad for making you feel like the game is free and open.

What they really needed to have, was an open world means of leading newbs. Lets think of some newbie like dynamic event chains that tell a story, The truth is the dynamic event system is one of the main strengths, and a well crafted chain in the beginning could be a lot more satisfying than the starter story, and hold them over till level 10.

They should also kind of make it clear when your next personal story missions will unlock.

point is, if they want to keep people, a more riveting starter experience will probably go further than a more easy one, imo.

Every new character I made, I played the first parts of the PS first. It was the best content and the best way to start the game. I even made characters that I didn’t want (Charr and Norn) just to see there parts of the story in the early levels. My only complaint about it was that each chapter was too short.

I agree, if there is no PS at the start, there needs to be something more interesting in the early levels than mapping, which quickly feels like a chore.

Revert it to back to the way it was before the September patch, did anyone REALLY have an issue with it prior to this?

Vayne.8563:

phys.7689:

Vayne.8563:

I don’t the think the personal story was as well received as Anet wanted it to be. We all know what people thought of Trahearne and the Zhaitan fight. We’ve all seen people talk it down. While it did have people who liked it, many many people disliked it. The open world has always been the strength of this game.

I think Anet really wanted to shift the focus to the world and away from the story.

See personal story isnt great, but its actually generally better in the first 20 levels, (depending on your race/choices) But it does provide a backdrop or narrative.

The open world on the otherhand isnt that strong early, its ok, but its not stirring. Also the open world actually loses more with the arrow. Its good for completion, but its bad for making you feel like the game is free and open.

What they really needed to have, was an open world means of leading newbs. Lets think of some newbie like dynamic event chains that tell a story, The truth is the dynamic event system is one of the main strengths, and a well crafted chain in the beginning could be a lot more satisfying than the starter story, and hold them over till level 10.

They should also kind of make it clear when your next personal story missions will unlock.

point is, if they want to keep people, a more riveting starter experience will probably go further than a more easy one, imo.

I still think it’s not a huge deal that the story starts 1 hour or so into the game. The actual leveling and constant or almost contest addition of information from the level windows is what will keep people going to then. And I think we’ll see what percentage of people get engaged in MMOs due to story very shortly.

Again, to me it would have been the beauty of the world itself that kept me playing for an hour.

people like leveling up, but thats not enough for many people. Leveling up is more thrilling when you see real effects. GW2 is not designed properly to work well with the unlock method.

I dont think leveling in and of itself is as thrilling as you make it out to be for a lot of people

Bottom line is that they deleted content. Yes folks. Not adding content. Just the opposite. Silly golem chess and so on. It was content , now it’s gone.

Personally I enjoyed the silly starter level quests and such. The game is just so mundane without it. Still playable, yet so bland.

Bellizare.5816:

shadow.6174:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Hmm? I must have thought you meant “swap weapon” effects happening on bundles. Such as getting swiftness when I pick up a “bone” bundle weapon.

Oh? I never heard about that, sounds like some bug or something.. if my slow mesmer would only knew that.. goodbye unreliable TC… :P just joking.

For PvE Mesmer I always equip a weapon slot with sigil of speed and murder everything in sight to maintain acceleration.

Have a look at what I mean about swapping weapons . . .

It does happen on picking up a bundle, or a conjured weapon.

VergilDeZaniah.3295:

Changes are sometimes for the better, and sometimes for the supposed better (which end up being worse).

I invited a friend of mine to test GW2 during this free “weekend”. He is an avid WoW player but decided to try a game without subscription. He was so eager to play… Until he tested.

1. " So I have to wait to unlock skills? That’s stupid. " I explained. " Right, I didn’t know I was too dumb to read a description or try more than two skills at a time… "
2. " I am dancing in front of a cow… I feel stupid. " I explained about the bundles being too complex. " I can use a credit card but not a bundle when a message pops up, right. But it’s good: I can’t use more than two skills so… "
3. " No stats bonus while leveling? There’s no need for leveling then. " I explained the stats burst. " Ok, so you’re strong, then weak, then super weak, then strong, then weak, then super weak. Why don’t they just buff stats at lvl80? "
4. " There’s no story? " I explained level gated story parts. " I didn’t realize this game was made for kids between 3 and 4. "
5. " I’m bored, I’m only level 6 and I have nothing left to do… "

And that’s how a new player received NPE.

This is why someone not very well versed in the game should not “explain” things to noobs.

1. i guess he feels exponentionally dumber playing WoW if thats the case. have you xplained him that in the old system it was actually much worse and that he had to unlock EACH skill on EACH weapon individually AND that he probably wouldnt have those skills anyway?

2. how is feeding the cow makes you feel any more or less stupid than dancing for a cow? Also look at 1, he had same skills as he would have had before.

3. Since the game showers you with gear now i bet you what you want that most people will have avrage bigger stats than they had before, AND you can play naked….if youre skilled. have you “explained” that to him too?

4. What does story starting at lvl 10 has to do with 3 or 4 or any year olds? So if exact same story starts at level 5 it would be awesomly mature now? Does it maybe have anything to do with your “explanation”…yeah

5. If he didnt have anything to do at lvl 6 then im afaraid hes a lost cause becuse thats how GW2 plays you go look out for stuff. If anything (and your frind proved it) it seems that avid WoW players need even MORE hand holding than NPE brought (not really surprising considering how WoW is)

phys.7689:

Vayne.8563:

I don’t the think the personal story was as well received as Anet wanted it to be. We all know what people thought of Trahearne and the Zhaitan fight. We’ve all seen people talk it down. While it did have people who liked it, many many people disliked it. The open world has always been the strength of this game.

I think Anet really wanted to shift the focus to the world and away from the story.

See personal story isnt great, but its actually generally better in the first 20 levels, (depending on your race/choices) But it does provide a backdrop or narrative.

The open world on the otherhand isnt that strong early, its ok, but its not stirring. Also the open world actually loses more with the arrow. Its good for completion, but its bad for making you feel like the game is free and open.

What they really needed to have, was an open world means of leading newbs. Lets think of some newbie like dynamic event chains that tell a story, The truth is the dynamic event system is one of the main strengths, and a well crafted chain in the beginning could be a lot more satisfying than the starter story, and hold them over till level 10.

They should also kind of make it clear when your next personal story missions will unlock.

point is, if they want to keep people, a more riveting starter experience will probably go further than a more easy one, imo.

They are actually steamlining early play experience with NPE (doing exatcly what you want them to do) so now you complain its not streamlined enough? And needs even MORE hand holding than it already has?

By forums i thought “everyone” hates hand holding.

MikaHR.1978:

This is why someone not very well versed in the game should not “explain” things to noobs.

1. i guess he feels exponentionally dumber playing WoW if thats the case. have you xplained him that in the old system it was actually much worse and that he had to unlock EACH skill on EACH weapon individually AND that he probably wouldnt have those skills anyway?

2. how is feeding the cow makes you feel any more or less stupid than dancing for a cow? Also look at 1, he had same skills as he would have had before.

3. Since the game showers you with gear now i bet you what you want that most people will have avrage bigger stats than they had before, AND you can play naked….if youre skilled. have you “explained” that to him too?

4. What does story starting at lvl 10 has to do with 3 or 4 or any year olds? So if exact same story starts at level 5 it would be awesomly mature now? Does it maybe have anything to do with your “explanation”…yeah

5. If he didnt have anything to do at lvl 6 then im afaraid hes a lost cause becuse thats how GW2 plays you go look out for stuff. If anything (and your frind proved it) it seems that avid WoW players need even MORE hand holding than NPE brought (not really surprising considering how WoW is)

Don’t get on your high horse just because I somehow criticize your beloved system, White Knight #2. People have opinion, and trying to prove them their tastes are wrong is totally similar to religious extremism. Nobody is like you and nobody needs to be like you, and respecting people is the first step into a calm discussion. The way you are aggressive towards an opinion shows that you are not in fact someone to talk to, because you think you’re always right even if it’s something totally out of your control.

About me not being well versed: I am as much well versed in the game as you are. After all you don’t know me at all and don’t know how much time I’ve spent on the game, or GW1, or any other game. Maybe you’d want me to quit my job to play all day long and send you an IG message to boast about my AP? Please, just because I’m not addicted to the game does not mean I don’t know what I’m talking about.

First of all, I didn’t say I agreed with most his criticisms. Second, I’m as objective as you are to explain him what changed when he didn’t understand why I didn’t show him when I first showed him the game a long time ago. So yeah, if reading what is on the wiki in the patch notes means I’m biased, then I won’t deny I am, but everyone is biased then.

Also, to give you the proper answer to your divine knowledge of me and my friend:

1. I did explain how it worked before. To him having the same simple skills for levels gave him the impression he couldn’t better himself right away.

2. Because to him it’s more stupid to dance for a cow than to feed it. We gotta kill enemies right? So maybe it could be changed to “scare your enemy” with only the “boo!” skill? The point is it was transformed into something stupid for the sake of removing a bundle.

3. I explained that the game focused more on skills than on gear/stats. And getting info in pop-ups was not something he considered rewarding, as he felt he was stagnating.

4. He doesn’t like the fact the game believes he can’t progress at his own pace, he is forced to wait until level 10 to advance in his own story. Before, some skills and the first story arc could be done without even being level 5 (key farming was about skills right?). Now he can’t do anything until he is allowed to. This makes him feel like a kid who needs to have his parents’ permission to go play outside.

5. Since he can’t see vistas, points of interest, or skill challenges, he doesn’t have the impression that there are interesting things on a map, and since he can’t do most things he does not see why he should explore with a low level character. I told him otherwise (but you won’t believe I did since I seem to be the anti-NPE Grinch). Once he had unlocked some skills and ended up doing the same things again, he felt bored, and couldn’t do anything but… Do the same things again.

What actually bothers him most is that the game seems really open while it actually is gated. What did I do when I first got online? I tried everything and had my fun that way! Now? People can’t do what they want but only what they are told.

The NPE in itself is not all bad or all good: I do not spit on every change that happened with the NPE, I’m just showing the frustrating side of the levelgating process for a new customer that was supposed to be swooning in front of the new system. My friend might be one in a million, and therefore GW2 will thrive more than ever, but he might be just one drop in the sea of people who could have bought the game but actually did not like the system.

It’s live or let die, and we’ll soon discover how it is.

VergilDeZaniah.3295:

MikaHR.1978:

This is why someone not very well versed in the game should not “explain” things to noobs.

1. i guess he feels exponentionally dumber playing WoW if thats the case. have you xplained him that in the old system it was actually much worse and that he had to unlock EACH skill on EACH weapon individually AND that he probably wouldnt have those skills anyway?

2. how is feeding the cow makes you feel any more or less stupid than dancing for a cow? Also look at 1, he had same skills as he would have had before.

3. Since the game showers you with gear now i bet you what you want that most people will have avrage bigger stats than they had before, AND you can play naked….if youre skilled. have you “explained” that to him too?

4. What does story starting at lvl 10 has to do with 3 or 4 or any year olds? So if exact same story starts at level 5 it would be awesomly mature now? Does it maybe have anything to do with your “explanation”…yeah

5. If he didnt have anything to do at lvl 6 then im afaraid hes a lost cause becuse thats how GW2 plays you go look out for stuff. If anything (and your frind proved it) it seems that avid WoW players need even MORE hand holding than NPE brought (not really surprising considering how WoW is)

snip

High horse? rofl My beloved system? Where do you get these gems?

Next time be objective about changes, and yes, “avid WoW players” wont have a good time in GW2. With or without your “explanations”

VergilDeZaniah.3295:

What actually bothers him most is that the game seems really open while it actually is gated. What did I do when I first got online? I tried everything and had my fun that way! Now? People can’t do what they want but only what they are told.

I think it just summarize how I and several other feels about some of the changes. teaching isn’t about hand-holding all time, but people also needs some freedom to do things like they want. People needs to be given all info they need about “how” to do stuff, but not to be told “when” they are “allowed” do them.

We are now up to 3 weeks.

Can someone from Anet point me to the official ‘what happens at every level’ guide please?

Up to now, we can only assume that what hasn’t been changed yet is exactly as it is meant to be. If that is the case there are still issues with what is left and the messaging is all over the place about it. There are also still some bugs that need to be worked out.

We were told that there were bugs, misinformation and that somethings were not implemented correctly. We were never told what exactly fell into each of those categories. I feel that a map of the new leveling system along with what exactly the NPE is supposed to contain will help drive feedback in a constructive direction.

Please may I have this ‘road map’. Surely constructive, informed feedback is the goal. If it is not implemented as intended then feedback on it is virtually worthless. Surely you can tell us what it is supposed to be right? I mean it’s live, it’s not like I am asking about future development.

Not sure if it’s what you are asking for, but here is a list of what each level gives now: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Leveling_rewards

XarOneZeroNine.2374:

We are now up to 3 weeks.

Can someone from Anet point me to the official ‘what happens at every level’ guide please?

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Level_rewards

Only one I know of and was updated as of 9/25.

So when are these ‘changes’ coming?

Seems we had a spurge of information from Anet, soon as they see we are satisfied they disappear again.

shadow.6174:

Not sure if it’s what you are asking for, but here is a list of what each level gives now: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Leveling_rewards

Castrin.8972:

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Level_rewards

Only one I know of and was updated as of 9/25.

I am aware of the wiki guide, but is it correct? I mean is what we have now final? Are all the things on that guide implemented as Anet designed? Is that list definitive? Is there anything on that list that is part of the “bugs, miscommunications and improper implementation” we were told about? We were specifically asked to wait until things were fixed before judging the NPE. Is now the time?

I asked for this same list 1 week after the patch and received no response. So I ask again, can we expect more changes or is what we have what now what was originally intended?

XarOneZeroNine.2374:

I am aware of the wiki guide, but is it correct? I mean is what we have now final? Are all the things on that guide implemented as Anet designed? Is that list definitive? Is there anything on that list that is part of the “bugs, miscommunications and improper implementation” we were told about? We were specifically asked to wait until things were fixed before judging the NPE. Is now the time?

Ah I get what you mean. Well, from what I heard so far none has told what of that list is really working as intended or what not. The only thing told so far was like you said: “bugs, miscommunications and improper implementation”, no further details given like “skill X is intended to unlock at level Y but it’s unlocking later (or before)”.

Also, this thread was created by a dev asking for feedback and such, then I believe it’s the time yes.

Behellagh.1468:

felessan.9587:

Suggestions:

• Unlock personal story at level 1 and every 10 levels after, and re-insert “My Greatest Fear” at level 60

Except that violates the reasoning behind the change, to unlock a chapter only when a player can binge it in it’s entirety.

I’m not suggesting they change their binge storying, just that they give access to it at level 1. So story would go 1, 10, 20, 30, 40, 50, 60, 70, 80, instead of 10, 20, 30, etc. To make up for the missing content, re-insert “My Greatest Fear” at 60.

felessan.9587:

Behellagh.1468:

felessan.9587:

Suggestions:

• Unlock personal story at level 1 and every 10 levels after, and re-insert “My Greatest Fear” at level 60

Except that violates the reasoning behind the change, to unlock a chapter only when a player can binge it in it’s entirety.

I’m not suggesting they change their binge storying, just that they give access to it at level 1. So story would go 1, 10, 20, 30, 40, 50, 60, 70, 80, instead of 10, 20, 30, etc. To make up for the missing content, re-insert “My Greatest Fear” at 60.

So you want the entirety of the first chapter to be doable at level 1?

Key farm much?

XarOneZeroNine.2374:

shadow.6174:

Not sure if it’s what you are asking for, but here is a list of what each level gives now: http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Leveling_rewards

Castrin.8972:

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Level_rewards

Only one I know of and was updated as of 9/25.

I am aware of the wiki guide, but is it correct? I mean is what we have now final? Are all the things on that guide implemented as Anet designed? Is that list definitive? Is there anything on that list that is part of the “bugs, miscommunications and improper implementation” we were told about? We were specifically asked to wait until things were fixed before judging the NPE. Is now the time?

I asked for this same list 1 week after the patch and received no response. So I ask again, can we expect more changes or is what we have what now what was originally intended?

There was the patch last week where they adjusted Utility 2 and 3 and Elite unlocks, and clarified a few things that are supposed to be account unlocks that weren’t (skill challenges, for example). Nothing has been said since, largely since Chris was out with a family emergency and Gaile has been very selective on what she’s engaging with. I would assume that the NPE is in its “final” working state since we haven’t heard anything.

Behellagh.1468:

felessan.9587:

Behellagh.1468:

felessan.9587:

Suggestions:

• Unlock personal story at level 1 and every 10 levels after, and re-insert “My Greatest Fear” at level 60

Except that violates the reasoning behind the change, to unlock a chapter only when a player can binge it in it’s entirety.

I’m not suggesting they change their binge storying, just that they give access to it at level 1. So story would go 1, 10, 20, 30, 40, 50, 60, 70, 80, instead of 10, 20, 30, etc. To make up for the missing content, re-insert “My Greatest Fear” at 60.

So you want the entirety of the first chapter to be doable at level 1?

Key farm much?

If they want to keep the silly 10-level blocks, I guess so. There was a complaint that there’s not enough to do, and since the Personal Story is, you know, content that can be done with very clear guidance, maybe it would be a thing to do.

If you’re so concerned about key farming, then move the key to the level 20 story step. Frankly, I don’t care, I’m just trying to think about what’s best for the flow of play without having to re-write an entire patch.

MikaHR.1978:

VergilDeZaniah.3295:

MikaHR.1978:

This is why someone not very well versed in the game should not “explain” things to noobs.

1. i guess he feels exponentionally dumber playing WoW if thats the case. have you xplained him that in the old system it was actually much worse and that he had to unlock EACH skill on EACH weapon individually AND that he probably wouldnt have those skills anyway?

2. how is feeding the cow makes you feel any more or less stupid than dancing for a cow? Also look at 1, he had same skills as he would have had before.

3. Since the game showers you with gear now i bet you what you want that most people will have avrage bigger stats than they had before, AND you can play naked….if youre skilled. have you “explained” that to him too?

4. What does story starting at lvl 10 has to do with 3 or 4 or any year olds? So if exact same story starts at level 5 it would be awesomly mature now? Does it maybe have anything to do with your “explanation”…yeah

5. If he didnt have anything to do at lvl 6 then im afaraid hes a lost cause becuse thats how GW2 plays you go look out for stuff. If anything (and your frind proved it) it seems that avid WoW players need even MORE hand holding than NPE brought (not really surprising considering how WoW is)

snip

High horse? rofl My beloved system? Where do you get these gems?

Next time be objective about changes, and yes, “avid WoW players” wont have a good time in GW2. With or without your “explanations”

Translation: I can’t respond to any of your arguments, so you’re just a loser!

XarOneZeroNine.2374:

We are now up to 3 weeks.

Can someone from Anet point me to the official ‘what happens at every level’ guide please?

Up to now, we can only assume that what hasn’t been changed yet is exactly as it is meant to be. If that is the case there are still issues with what is left and the messaging is all over the place about it. There are also still some bugs that need to be worked out.

We were told that there were bugs, misinformation and that somethings were not implemented correctly. We were never told what exactly fell into each of those categories. I feel that a map of the new leveling system along with what exactly the NPE is supposed to contain will help drive feedback in a constructive direction.

Please may I have this ‘road map’. Surely constructive, informed feedback is the goal. If it is not implemented as intended then feedback on it is virtually worthless. Surely you can tell us what it is supposed to be right? I mean it’s live, it’s not like I am asking about future development.

There was misinformation. It was coming from players.

Players claimed you couldn’t dodge, or used the TP, or use an Asuran gate even at level 2. They were wrong to say it, because when tested it was obvious you could. People were confusing what you could do and when you were told about it.

People said you couldn’t get vistas, when what was true was they didn’t appear on your map. That’s the misinformation being referred to.

Since I’m sure that changes are being made to both a roadmap and player feedback I’m not sure how the original plan is going to help you much.

Vayne.8563:

XarOneZeroNine.2374:

We are now up to 3 weeks.

Can someone from Anet point me to the official ‘what happens at every level’ guide please?

Up to now, we can only assume that what hasn’t been changed yet is exactly as it is meant to be. If that is the case there are still issues with what is left and the messaging is all over the place about it. There are also still some bugs that need to be worked out.

We were told that there were bugs, misinformation and that somethings were not implemented correctly. We were never told what exactly fell into each of those categories. I feel that a map of the new leveling system along with what exactly the NPE is supposed to contain will help drive feedback in a constructive direction.

Please may I have this ‘road map’. Surely constructive, informed feedback is the goal. If it is not implemented as intended then feedback on it is virtually worthless. Surely you can tell us what it is supposed to be right? I mean it’s live, it’s not like I am asking about future development.

There was misinformation. It was coming from players.

Players claimed you couldn’t dodge, or used the TP, or use an Asuran gate even at level 2. They were wrong to say it, because when tested it was obvious you could. People were confusing what you could do and when you were told about it.

People said you couldn’t get vistas, when what was true was they didn’t appear on your map. That’s the misinformation being referred to.

Since I’m sure that changes are being made to both a roadmap and player feedback I’m not sure how the original plan is going to help you much.

There was also some misinformation in the patch notes, caused by ambiguity like the phrase “starting zone,” which didn’t actually mean an entire level 1-15 map, just the small area immediately around where you load into the game.

It’s clear things have already changed. From Mark Katzbach:

• Skill challenges now unlock on an account-wide basis rather than a per-character basis as originally intended.
• Skill Challenges are now visible at level 13 instead of level 15.

These are specific changes they made in regard to our feedback. The original plan isn’t going to help much now.

HandOfKane.5409:

MikaHR.1978:

VergilDeZaniah.3295:

MikaHR.1978:

This is why someone not very well versed in the game should not “explain” things to noobs.

1. i guess he feels exponentionally dumber playing WoW if thats the case. have you xplained him that in the old system it was actually much worse and that he had to unlock EACH skill on EACH weapon individually AND that he probably wouldnt have those skills anyway?

2. how is feeding the cow makes you feel any more or less stupid than dancing for a cow? Also look at 1, he had same skills as he would have had before.

3. Since the game showers you with gear now i bet you what you want that most people will have avrage bigger stats than they had before, AND you can play naked….if youre skilled. have you “explained” that to him too?

4. What does story starting at lvl 10 has to do with 3 or 4 or any year olds? So if exact same story starts at level 5 it would be awesomly mature now? Does it maybe have anything to do with your “explanation”…yeah

5. If he didnt have anything to do at lvl 6 then im afaraid hes a lost cause becuse thats how GW2 plays you go look out for stuff. If anything (and your frind proved it) it seems that avid WoW players need even MORE hand holding than NPE brought (not really surprising considering how WoW is)

snip

High horse? rofl My beloved system? Where do you get these gems?

Next time be objective about changes, and yes, “avid WoW players” wont have a good time in GW2. With or without your “explanations”

Translation: I can’t respond to any of your arguments, so you’re just a loser!

There was some kind of argument there?

felessan.9587:

Vayne.8563:

XarOneZeroNine.2374:

We are now up to 3 weeks.

Can someone from Anet point me to the official ‘what happens at every level’ guide please?

Up to now, we can only assume that what hasn’t been changed yet is exactly as it is meant to be. If that is the case there are still issues with what is left and the messaging is all over the place about it. There are also still some bugs that need to be worked out.

We were told that there were bugs, misinformation and that somethings were not implemented correctly. We were never told what exactly fell into each of those categories. I feel that a map of the new leveling system along with what exactly the NPE is supposed to contain will help drive feedback in a constructive direction.

Please may I have this ‘road map’. Surely constructive, informed feedback is the goal. If it is not implemented as intended then feedback on it is virtually worthless. Surely you can tell us what it is supposed to be right? I mean it’s live, it’s not like I am asking about future development.

There was misinformation. It was coming from players.

Players claimed you couldn’t dodge, or used the TP, or use an Asuran gate even at level 2. They were wrong to say it, because when tested it was obvious you could. People were confusing what you could do and when you were told about it.

People said you couldn’t get vistas, when what was true was they didn’t appear on your map. That’s the misinformation being referred to.

Since I’m sure that changes are being made to both a roadmap and player feedback I’m not sure how the original plan is going to help you much.

There was also some misinformation in the patch notes, caused by ambiguity like the phrase “starting zone,” which didn’t actually mean an entire level 1-15 map, just the small area immediately around where you load into the game.

It’s clear things have already changed. From Mark Katzbach:

• Skill challenges now unlock on an account-wide basis rather than a per-character basis as originally intended.
• Skill Challenges are now visible at level 13 instead of level 15.

These are specific changes they made in regard to our feedback. The original plan isn’t going to help much now.

There was no missinformation on Anets part, there was no “low level zone” it was low level area, all missinformation was brought on by “community”

MikaHR.1978:

HandOfKane.5409:

MikaHR.1978:

VergilDeZaniah.3295:

MikaHR.1978:

This is why someone not very well versed in the game should not “explain” things to noobs.

1. i guess he feels exponentionally dumber playing WoW if thats the case. have you xplained him that in the old system it was actually much worse and that he had to unlock EACH skill on EACH weapon individually AND that he probably wouldnt have those skills anyway?

2. how is feeding the cow makes you feel any more or less stupid than dancing for a cow? Also look at 1, he had same skills as he would have had before.

3. Since the game showers you with gear now i bet you what you want that most people will have avrage bigger stats than they had before, AND you can play naked….if youre skilled. have you “explained” that to him too?

4. What does story starting at lvl 10 has to do with 3 or 4 or any year olds? So if exact same story starts at level 5 it would be awesomly mature now? Does it maybe have anything to do with your “explanation”…yeah

5. If he didnt have anything to do at lvl 6 then im afaraid hes a lost cause becuse thats how GW2 plays you go look out for stuff. If anything (and your frind proved it) it seems that avid WoW players need even MORE hand holding than NPE brought (not really surprising considering how WoW is)

snip

High horse? rofl My beloved system? Where do you get these gems?

Next time be objective about changes, and yes, “avid WoW players” wont have a good time in GW2. With or without your “explanations”

Translation: I can’t respond to any of your arguments, so you’re just a loser!

There was some kind of argument there?

I rest my case.

MikaHR.1978:

phys.7689:

Vayne.8563:

I don’t the think the personal story was as well received as Anet wanted it to be. We all know what people thought of Trahearne and the Zhaitan fight. We’ve all seen people talk it down. While it did have people who liked it, many many people disliked it. The open world has always been the strength of this game.

I think Anet really wanted to shift the focus to the world and away from the story.

See personal story isnt great, but its actually generally better in the first 20 levels, (depending on your race/choices) But it does provide a backdrop or narrative.

The open world on the otherhand isnt that strong early, its ok, but its not stirring. Also the open world actually loses more with the arrow. Its good for completion, but its bad for making you feel like the game is free and open.

What they really needed to have, was an open world means of leading newbs. Lets think of some newbie like dynamic event chains that tell a story, The truth is the dynamic event system is one of the main strengths, and a well crafted chain in the beginning could be a lot more satisfying than the starter story, and hold them over till level 10.

They should also kind of make it clear when your next personal story missions will unlock.

point is, if they want to keep people, a more riveting starter experience will probably go further than a more easy one, imo.

They are actually steamlining early play experience with NPE (doing exatcly what you want them to do) so now you complain its not streamlined enough? And needs even MORE hand holding than it already has?

By forums i thought “everyone” hates hand holding.

its not about streamlining, its adding an actual adventure/narrative to the starting area, that no longer exists now that story starts at level 10. Its actually the opposite of streamlining, its about adding depth and substance to the starter experience.

i dont know why i respond to you though

phys.7689:

MikaHR.1978:

phys.7689:

Vayne.8563:

I don’t the think the personal story was as well received as Anet wanted it to be. We all know what people thought of Trahearne and the Zhaitan fight. We’ve all seen people talk it down. While it did have people who liked it, many many people disliked it. The open world has always been the strength of this game.

I think Anet really wanted to shift the focus to the world and away from the story.

See personal story isnt great, but its actually generally better in the first 20 levels, (depending on your race/choices) But it does provide a backdrop or narrative.

The open world on the otherhand isnt that strong early, its ok, but its not stirring. Also the open world actually loses more with the arrow. Its good for completion, but its bad for making you feel like the game is free and open.

What they really needed to have, was an open world means of leading newbs. Lets think of some newbie like dynamic event chains that tell a story, The truth is the dynamic event system is one of the main strengths, and a well crafted chain in the beginning could be a lot more satisfying than the starter story, and hold them over till level 10.

They should also kind of make it clear when your next personal story missions will unlock.

point is, if they want to keep people, a more riveting starter experience will probably go further than a more easy one, imo.

They are actually steamlining early play experience with NPE (doing exatcly what you want them to do) so now you complain its not streamlined enough? And needs even MORE hand holding than it already has?

By forums i thought “everyone” hates hand holding.

its not about streamlining, its adding an actual adventure/narrative to the starting area, that no longer exists now that story starts at level 10. Its actually the opposite of streamlining, its about adding depth and substance to the starter experience.

i dont know why i respond to you though

Its actually streamlining and more hand holding, because you acknowledge noobs cant handle the freedom they are given (as ironically “avid WoW player” example also confirmed).

HandOfKane.5409:

MikaHR.1978:

HandOfKane.5409:

MikaHR.1978:

VergilDeZaniah.3295:

MikaHR.1978:

This is why someone not very well versed in the game should not “explain” things to noobs.

1. i guess he feels exponentionally dumber playing WoW if thats the case. have you xplained him that in the old system it was actually much worse and that he had to unlock EACH skill on EACH weapon individually AND that he probably wouldnt have those skills anyway?

2. how is feeding the cow makes you feel any more or less stupid than dancing for a cow? Also look at 1, he had same skills as he would have had before.

3. Since the game showers you with gear now i bet you what you want that most people will have avrage bigger stats than they had before, AND you can play naked….if youre skilled. have you “explained” that to him too?

4. What does story starting at lvl 10 has to do with 3 or 4 or any year olds? So if exact same story starts at level 5 it would be awesomly mature now? Does it maybe have anything to do with your “explanation”…yeah

5. If he didnt have anything to do at lvl 6 then im afaraid hes a lost cause becuse thats how GW2 plays you go look out for stuff. If anything (and your frind proved it) it seems that avid WoW players need even MORE hand holding than NPE brought (not really surprising considering how WoW is)

snip

High horse? rofl My beloved system? Where do you get these gems?

Next time be objective about changes, and yes, “avid WoW players” wont have a good time in GW2. With or without your “explanations”

Translation: I can’t respond to any of your arguments, so you’re just a loser!

There was some kind of argument there?

I rest my case.

You had some kind of case?