Guild Wars 2

So today I have been kicked out of a fractal party cause my dps was not maked out, they confirm using dps meter. So now people can use dps meter? So arenanet you change your mind? Can I ask a refund of my entire account cause I clearly remember back a couple year ago dps meter was illegal and thats was one of the reason I started playing this game. To avoid kittens players. If I recall the user agreement speak of this? Did anet change the user agreement without notice or I miss something?

Ugh…

I thought tracking your own DPS was fine using some programs, but… other players tracking your DPS? That seems fishy.

Also, those people are absolute jerks for kicking you. I wouldn’t give up on fractals, though, very good loot. You just need to find the right group in LFG. Or find a guild even that doesn’t care if you’re 50 AR under because they are willing to carry you so you can get that AR.

(My guild did that for me)

Yes, people are using DPS meters now.. no ArenaNet has not done anything about it. I’ve also heard there are ways to see other peoples gear and builds, presumably by examining the game’s memory—this is illegal, but such programs are difficult for ArenaNet to detect without something like Blizzard’s Warden.

Unfortunately, the only reason this is possible is because they offload so much to the client in order to reduce the load on the servers, but this always comes at as security risk- almost every MMO ends up doing it due to the high server load that comes with this type of game and its always the same result.

There’s also some DPS meters that monitor the screen and thus are completely legal, and ANet wouldn’t do anything about those anyway.

They allow them now. They are not enforcing the policies they have written even if they weren’t allowed. I have had people whisper me and comment on my gear because the meter they are using not only shows dps, but every item you have equipped, inlcuding runes and sigils.

Certain other regions of the game allow these things. They are not allowed here, but Anet doesn’t really care at this point.

Welcome to the new meta, one of the reasons i quit doing high level fractals, game used to be so friendly….

Hannelore.8153:

Yes, people are using DPS meters now.. no ArenaNet has not done anything about it. I’ve also heard there are ways to see other peoples gear and builds, presumably by examining the game’s memory—this is illegal, but such programs are difficult for ArenaNet to detect without something like Blizzard’s Warden.

There’s also some DPS meters that monitor the screen and thus are completely legal, and ANet wouldn’t do anything about those anyway.

You serious?? People HAVE these programs?? That’s not right at all!

Honestly i would join another group. I have been kicked for killing trash mobs instead of skipping, people are going to be elitist no mater what.
Dps in guild wars rarely tells the whole story, i use one but i’m more interested in why people are doing more damage and not punishing people who arnt.
I also give people tips because i know what i’m seeing.
Like lets say we are not able to do the high level fractal, I can look at the dps and see what going on. maybe we have all eles and they getting some stupidly high dps but dying or its a bunch of support classes trying to dps.
(equally i have been kicked for pointing out people dps when we cant do a fractal)

The moment raids were implemented into the game, of course it was going to be inevitable. I use my DPS meter all the time to judge how well I’m doing against other people on a particular encounter.

It also shows buff uptimes so I can maybe suggest things to people to help them get better. Please do not think that DPS meters mean the end of GW2 is coming, it’s just that we need reliable metrics to be able to do raids properly and monitor what is going right/wrong in a particular raid group.

(PSA the people who kicked you are idiots, most of the people I know aren’t like that. Still, it helps to have an idea of what your DPS rotation should be if you’re going to play T4 fractals – which is what I’m going to assume you got kicked from if they kicked you for “low DPS”.).

There are two main DPS programs: Arc and BGDM.

BGDM only reads your own DPS and will only display others if they also have BGDM. It is (imo) the nicer of the two programs because it is opt in, though it does display total % of damage done to the boss, so if 4 people are using it and it reads 20%, 19%, 30%, and 22%, it does mean the person not using it only did 9%. The problems with BGDM is that the creator is not going to continue supporting it and it has some shady stuff that can be unlocked if you know how.

Arc on the other hand lets you see everyones DPS. This one is not as nice because you can’t opt out of being seen. It will probably be the most used meter soon since I haven’t heard of support going away for it.

Edit: DPS meters haven’t been bad for the game (imo). Before Anet said we could use them, Raids were for DPS slots “Ele or GTFO”. Once the meters were allowed, people realized so many Eles were terrible at dealing damage compared to other classes that were lower on the golem but higher for the average player in actual real scenarios. How terrible would it have been to join the fractal group, they see you’re an Thief, and automatically get kicked because you’re not the theoretical golden child of DPS?

Sorry…i have to laugh at the “doing raids correctly” line. There is only one metric you need for knowing if you’ve done a raid correctly: Did you beat it? Yes or No. Yes? Then you did it correctly, yay! No? Try again.

Now what you probably meant was “is my team beating this raid as optimally/quickly as possible?” That is why using DPS meter may come in handy. Unfortunately that’s some utopian nonsense and in reality many people use them to be elitist and exclusionary. Its the reason why so many of us were glad that Anet disallowed them and why we groaned when they green lit them.

And if I ever get someone in game “inspecting” my stuff without my permission I will report them and their account.

This is also why I have just avoided fractals unless I’m with friends and why I will never step foot in a raid.

This is real life guys people will be kittens with or without a dps meter. At least with a dps meter you can prove that you are contributing so they cant complain.
When i played scrapper eng in fractals or raids people would kitten all the time for not playing meta but my dps wasn’t bad so they left me be.

TFW you just installed the game for the first time in forever because the new expansion looks cool then you see this thread and walk right back out the door because there is no way I’m going through the World of Warcraft experience again.

Been there done that.

It’s why I probably won’t ever get to make one of the newer style legendaries, since you have to do fractals, and I’m betting no one wants me to tag along.

I did manage an old school Bifrost before HoT, and did Aurora, so that was fun.

notebene.3190:

It’s why I probably won’t ever get to make one of the newer style legendaries, since you have to do fractals, and I’m betting no one wants me to tag along.

I did manage an old school Bifrost before HoT, and did Aurora, so that was fun.

It’s just not fun. Even if you “can” do it. People always assume that if you’re against meters you’re a bad player, but that’s not true. Whether I know what I’m doing or just kind of bumbling around, either way, the "meter’ makes it unfun. It’s like being policed by people I don’t even know, and since we don’t know each other there is a free pass to be jerks.

It’s unfun. I can’t tell you how many times in WoW we’d down a new boss and the first thing everyone would do is start comparing their meters to see who “beat” who. Uhhh… didn’t we just collectively beat the boss? Why are we now beating each other when we are supposed to be a team?

Maybe I just don’t have the same competitive mentality and therefore don’t “get” it. I’ve always hated this DPS meter stuff though. It’s a pass to be mean, unhelpful, and it causes real anxiety for a lot of folks to know that we’re all essentially being spied on by total strangers. I could count on one hand the times I saw someone use DPS meter information as a learning tool. The number of times I saw someone use it as a free pass to be rude? Boy, I’d need to grow 200 more hands to count that.

@OP those people who kicked you were absolute jerks. But I’ve done T4s every so often for some time now. I have never been kicked from a group for low dps. Hell, my dps against test golems is abysmal, I’m running an off-meta build, rarely carry around food, and I still haven’t been kicked for it.

Ashley.9304:

notebene.3190:

It’s why I probably won’t ever get to make one of the newer style legendaries, since you have to do fractals, and I’m betting no one wants me to tag along.

I did manage an old school Bifrost before HoT, and did Aurora, so that was fun.

It’s just not fun. Even if you “can” do it. People always assume that if you’re against meters you’re a bad player, but that’s not true. Whether I know what I’m doing or just kind of bumbling around, either way, the "meter’ makes it unfun. It’s like being policed by people I don’t even know, and since we don’t know each other there is a free pass to be jerks.

It’s unfun. I can’t tell you how many times in WoW we’d down a new boss and the first thing everyone would do is start comparing their meters to see who “beat” who. Uhhh… didn’t we just collectively beat the boss? Why are we now beating each other when we are supposed to be a team?

Maybe I just don’t have the same competitive mentality and therefore don’t “get” it. I’ve always hated this DPS meter stuff though. It’s a pass to be mean, unhelpful, and it causes real anxiety for a lot of folks to know that we’re all essentially being spied on by total strangers. I could count on one hand the times I saw someone use DPS meter information as a learning tool. The number of times I saw someone use it as a free pass to be rude? Boy, I’d need to grow 200 more hands to count that.

I have to agree with you on this fully !! and I will not say which one of the two dps meters it is but I can say when pof comes out next month one of thos said dps meters will be fully dead and thankfully never ever coming back . bad part is that it will still leave us in the same stuck point .with the other one and all these well not too bright dps meters peeps running around . trying to take away from our fun in the game . personally when I see people in the game or forums talking about this topic . I put them in the blocked list in game . so at least it saves me some headaches their .

Yobculture.5786:

The moment raids were implemented into the game, of course it was going to be inevitable. I use my DPS meter all the time to judge how well I’m doing against other people on a particular encounter.

It also shows buff uptimes so I can maybe suggest things to people to help them get better. Please do not think that DPS meters mean the end of GW2 is coming, it’s just that we need reliable metrics to be able to do raids properly and monitor what is going right/wrong in a particular raid group.

(PSA the people who kicked you are idiots, most of the people I know aren’t like that. Still, it helps to have an idea of what your DPS rotation should be if you’re going to play T4 fractals – which is what I’m going to assume you got kicked from if they kicked you for “low DPS”.).

It’d be funny if my Druid get kicked because of people like you to use dps meter and judge my dps base on it, despite me providing permanent protection/ dps buff/ heal/ regen/ fury / might to the whole party .

Not everyone use dps meter for good intention, like improving yourself.
They use it to look down on other purely base on their dps.

Ashley.9304:

TFW you just installed the game for the first time in forever because the new expansion looks cool then you see this thread and walk right back out the door because there is no way I’m going through the World of Warcraft experience again.

Been there done that.

Don’t give up! There’s lots to do in the game that doesn’t involve elitists with meters. I spent 7 years in WoW, including raiding, and I promise that it’s not at all the same here. Unless you are driven to do the top end of PvE in GW2 you’ll see not a peep of it except in occasional forum threads. Even if you do want top end, you just need to do it with a guild instead of PuGging.

I know my dps will never be the best. /shrugs — I tend to build for staying alive, not for big numbers (love my tanky Reaper). But I will drop hard cc on defiance bars at the right time, help the downed, pay attention to the fight and go to the right place at the right time (usually), and when on supporty characters I will by gum support! I’ve seen the same sentiment expressed by many others on these forums.

So please don’t let a tiny smidge of sourness turn you away from the sweetness most of the game offers. You’re not alone in your disdain for the snobs.

(Disclaimer: not everyone who uses a meter is a snob or jerk. In one of my guilds we worked hard to do some raiding, and the leader did keep a meter running just as a benchmark for how close we were to success. He only told people their dps if they asked and didn’t boot anyone for being low, he simply worked with them to tweak their build and rotation to improve).

Now, if only there was some way to do instanced content without having to randomly group with people with different expectations than you. Oh, wait, there is. Sure, it’s more effort to find a guild of like-minded people, develop a friend’s list, or start your own group. I guess people prefer “log in/LFg/do content” because they think it’s more convenient. At least, it’s more convenient until you get kicked because a random grouping tool grouped you with randoms with meters.

The thing about these people that would kick others for not having the dictated DPS spec, is they will be the first to complain about a “dying game mode” when they can not find players enough to do fractals.

Really you are better off finding people who are not fixated on such things and are willing to help rather then ridicule. There a good many of this type around.

ill say it again, kittens complain about dps. I have been kicked more for being that kitten than the opposite.

IndigoSundown.5419:

Now, if only there was some way to do instanced content without having to randomly group with people with different expectations than you. Oh, wait, there is. Sure, it’s more effort to find a guild of like-minded people, develop a friend’s list, or start your own group. I guess people prefer “log in/LFg/do content” because they think it’s more convenient. At least, it’s more convenient until you get kicked because a random grouping tool grouped you with randoms with meters.

>Start group
>label it a casual run
>4 players join,
>Start Fractal
>Get kicked for low DPS anyway.

Also – There really needs to be a “Confirm Group Merge” in LFG. I keep getting people merging with groups I form when they have completely different goals:
Start an event map in Silverwastes? Get merged with a kitten Chest Train
Look for a casual fractal run for achievements? Get merged with people trying to speedrun dailies.
Looking for a specific dungeon path? Get merged with people who want to do Storymode.

Support for BGDM is not being terminated,it will stay compatible with the game.
I wouldn’t use ARC since it is not TOS compliant,and it gives Anet the right to ban you for using it if they choose so.

If you don’t like a meter don’t use it.
It’s an extremely useful tool,great for testing out the actual performance of different builds,and for measuring your class/build and rotations against those of other players’.
If you want to run a casual pug for fractals create your own LFG listing,or join another
that asks for no requirements.
There are a lot of those,and there’s all shorts of parties running all day long.
If you see listings that require experience and certain class set ups,food,potions etc,don’t join unless you are willing and able to fulfil the requirements,and doing adequate DPS is usually a requirement for exp parties.
I play the T4s almost every day,I use a meter,and I’ve never seen anyone being kicked because they were not using a meter.
Personally I don’t care having low dps players in ,but others won’t carry and it is in their right to do so.

Aenaos.8160:

Support for BGDM is not being terminated,it will stay compatible with the game.
I wouldn’t use ARC since it is not TOS compliant,and it gives Anet the right to ban you for using it if they choose so.

If you don’t like a meter don’t use it.
It’s an extremely useful tool,great for testing out the actual performance of different builds,and for measuring your class/build and rotations against those of other players’.
If you want to run a casual pug for fractals create your own LFG listing,or join another
that asks for no requirements.
There are a lot of those,and there’s all shorts of parties running all day long.
If you see listings that require experience and certain class set ups,food,potions etc,don’t join unless you are willing and able to fulfil the requirements,and doing adequate DPS is usually a requirement for exp parties.
I play the T4s almost every day,I use a meter,and I’ve never seen anyone being kicked because they were not using a meter.
Personally I don’t care having low dps players in ,but others won’t carry and it is in their right to do so.

great response, I never see anyone care about dps.

babazhook.6805:

The thing about these people that would kick others for not having the dictated DPS spec, is they will be the first to complain about a “dying game mode” when they can not find players enough to do fractals.

Gotta love this kind of painful yet ironic truth.

Sartharina.3542:

IndigoSundown.5419:

Now, if only there was some way to do instanced content without having to randomly group with people with different expectations than you. Oh, wait, there is. Sure, it’s more effort to find a guild of like-minded people, develop a friend’s list, or start your own group. I guess people prefer “log in/LFg/do content” because they think it’s more convenient. At least, it’s more convenient until you get kicked because a random grouping tool grouped you with randoms with meters.

>Start group
>label it a casual run
>4 players join,
>Start Fractal
>Get kicked for low DPS anyway.

This is why I believe in group ownership. If I were designing it, it would be immunity to kick, and would pass to the first person admitted if I logged out.

Also – There really needs to be a “Confirm Group Merge” in LFG. I keep getting people merging with groups I form when they have completely different goals:
Start an event map in Silverwastes? Get merged with a kitten Chest Train
Look for a casual fractal run for achievements? Get merged with people trying to speedrun dailies.
Looking for a specific dungeon path? Get merged with people who want to do Storymode.

Yes, for a convenience tool, there are some really inconvenient aspects. I’d also favor a Confirm Merge option for the group starter.

Of course, my preferred option for people to get the experience they want is to avoid the LFG. Pug and ugly have letters in common for a reason. ;P

PookieDaWombat.6209:

Sorry…i have to laugh at the “doing raids correctly” line. There is only one metric you need for knowing if you’ve done a raid correctly: Did you beat it? Yes or No. Yes? Then you did it correctly, yay! No? Try again.

Raidheroes lets you compile arcdps logs into graphs that show you failed mechanics, so yes you can improve with them without looking at DPS.

Aenaos.8160:

Support for BGDM is not being terminated,it will stay compatible with the game.
I wouldn’t use ARC since it is not TOS compliant,and it gives Anet the right to ban you for using it if they choose so.

Arcdps is TOS compliant. Only BGDM had a time where it wasn’t.
The BGDM developer quit the game, if he can’t find a successor BGDM will die.

Aenaos.8160:

Support for BGDM is not being terminated,it will stay compatible with the game.
I wouldn’t use ARC since it is not TOS compliant,and it gives Anet the right to ban you for using it if they choose so.

.
The BGDM developer quit the game, if he can’t find a successor BGDM will die.[/quote]

this is a very real fact that next month BGDM will die . which the BGDM developer posted on reddit about that and the fact he gave up the game . and is never coming back

now if that would only happen with ARC too . the game would be far more better with out them both .

To avoid elitists best tip is to create your own LFG with the message like “Casual and friendly daily T4 run, non-meta builds encouraged”

Allowing DPS meters? Anet dropping the ball again.

Personally when someone uses an add on that won’t affect other players I wouldn’t mind. But this Wow stuff just makes me mad. DPS meters, being kicked from fractals for not doing enough DPS… That’s just horrible.
I hope anet can be stricter with their rules.

If your doing t4 fractals and you dont k ow how to play your class, then dont do t4 fractals. We dont like when fractals take more than an hour. I personally like dps meters. I get to measure my dps. Im not the best player. But when im in a group with pugs ill be hitting 5 more then the next person. The lowest 2 usually sit around 3k. Tbis slows fractals down so much. Yeah you can make the argument that i should play with a static. Which i do usually. But that doesnt change the fact that if u do t4s daily your not doing them for the experience of doing them. The longer it take the less rewarding it becomes. Its basically “get gud” , but why not improve yourself and get the tedious things done faster?

Makuragee.3058:

So today I have been kicked out of a fractal party cause my dps was not maked out, they confirm using dps meter. So now people can use dps meter? So arenanet you change your mind? Can I ask a refund of my entire account cause I clearly remember back a couple year ago dps meter was illegal and thats was one of the reason I started playing this game. To avoid kittens players. If I recall the user agreement speak of this? Did anet change the user agreement without notice or I miss something?

If your party wiped due to low dps and you had the lowest dps, why wouldn’t you be kicked? Don’t blame the game, blame the developers etc, blame yourself. Why is your dps low? Are you running random blues and greens with no build? Well then you are going to do poor dps. There is (unfortunately) no way to legally check other peoples gear (something I wish they would add) and there is no way to 100% accurately check other peoples dps unless they also have the dps meter installed. But, arc can simulate your dps and it is rather accurate, usually within a few hundred. Why are you upset? Most fights in the top end are big time dps checks. If people have sub par dps, the group will fail. In the past, we would just kick certain classes because of a perception of weakness. This is VERY unfair. I ran a raid the other day. My build is unconventional, but works. I was pulling 17k dps. In the past, pre DPS meters I would’ve been kicked, but I wasn’t, because I was top 3 dps according to the meters. Which is more fair, being kicked due to a perceived and possibly incorrect weakness, or being kicked based on performance? Improve yourself, don’t be carried, do the carrying. Your Dps was LOW. That’s not Anets fault, it’s your fault. use the dummy, find a build, get BETTER.

TheShniper.1852:

If your doing t4 fractals and you dont k ow how to play your class, then dont do t4 fractals. We dont like when fractals take more than an hour. I personally like dps meters. I get to measure my dps. Im not the best player. But when im in a group with pugs ill be hitting 5 more then the next person. The lowest 2 usually sit around 3k. Tbis slows fractals down so much. Yeah you can make the argument that i should play with a static. Which i do usually. But that doesnt change the fact that if u do t4s daily your not doing them for the experience of doing them. The longer it take the less rewarding it becomes. Its basically “get gud” , but why not improve yourself and get the tedious things done faster?

Fractals drive me nuts, because I’m always at 8k dps cuz no fury or might :*(

Nice to see the raiding community is consistent in being awful as usual. :^)

EdgarMTanaka.7291:

Personally when someone uses an add on that won’t affect other players I wouldn’t mind. But this Wow stuff just makes me mad. DPS meters, being kicked from fractals for not doing enough DPS… That’s just horrible.
I hope anet can be stricter with their rules.

Why is it horrible? Do you know the mechanics of high end fractals? Take the last boss of nightmare. if your dps is subpar you WILL wipe the group because you aren’t killing him fast enough. In the past, once the group realized this, anyone NOT running meta class/build would be kicked, because we could only assume THAT person is the reason we are kicked. Ele doing 900dps would be kept around because ele, guardian NOT running dragon hunter would be kicked even though he is pushing out 10k dps. How is that more fair than dps meters seeing the ele doing 900 dps and going oh GOD that’s why we are wiping, dude, wtf are you doing in t4 fractals? Kick. This is the single greatest addition for high end instanced PvE as it allows us to make sure we are kicking the right person. If you’re getting kicked for low dps don’t wine to Anet, get better. Work on the dummy, improve your gear. If you can’t be bothered to do that, don’t do T4 fractals. they aren’t easy anymore.

WARIORSCHARGEING.2637:

Aenaos.8160:

Support for BGDM is not being terminated,it will stay compatible with the game.
I wouldn’t use ARC since it is not TOS compliant,and it gives Anet the right to ban you for using it if they choose so.

.
The BGDM developer quit the game, if he can’t find a successor BGDM will die.

this is a very real fact that next month BGDM will die . which the BGDM developer posted on reddit about that and the fact he gave up the game . and is never coming back

now if that would only happen with ARC too . the game would be far more better with out them both . [/quote]

How? Explain how? Without dps meters community perception is all that would matter. There would be nothing but ele’s and buff kittenes. With DPS meters eles doing 8dps will get kicked because they are bad, while guardians doing 20k dps will be kept around, even tho their class isn’t meta at the current time. This does NOTHING but improve the game.

Ultimately it is these things that prevent a bigger influx of players joining these higher end instances than there could be and leads to them stagnating due to low population.

Sadly it wont change, the only answer is to join a like minded guild or to encourage as many people to start their own groups and ensure those groups dont use these ridiculous meters and build checkers.

DPS meter is good for games where classes are well balanced, like WoW. This isn’t the case in GW2.

TheOrlyFactor.8341:

Nice to see the raiding community is consistent in being awful as usual. :^)

Why? Boss has dps checks, low dps players get kicked. This is the most logical thing possible! It used to be it didn’t matter how good you were, if you werent running a meta class (read ele) and the group wiped due to lack of dps you were kicked. Terrible eles were filling groups and doing pathetic dps, but since they were meta (because if you’re good the potential dps is through the roof)they’d never get kicked. Now WITH dps meters I DON’T get kicked because my guard pushes 17k dps while eles doing 300dps DO get kicked. It’s fair! I won’t argue that gear score/ilevel is bull kitten but dps meters? no son.

BurningHeavy.7268:

TheOrlyFactor.8341:

Nice to see the raiding community is consistent in being awful as usual. :^)

Why? Boss has dps checks, low dps players get kicked. This is the most logical thing possible! It used to be it didn’t matter how good you were, if you werent running a meta class (read ele) and the group wiped due to lack of dps you were kicked. Terrible eles were filling groups and doing pathetic dps, but since they were meta (because if you’re good the potential dps is through the roof)they’d never get kicked. Now WITH dps meters I DON’T get kicked because my guard pushes 17k dps while eles doing 300dps DO get kicked. It’s fair! I won’t argue that gear score/ilevel is bull kitten but dps meters? no son.

Thanks for proving my point. :^)

Randulf.7614:

Ultimately it is these things that prevent a bigger influx of players joining these higher end instances than there could be and leads to them stagnating due to low population.

Sadly it wont change, the only answer is to join a like minded guild or to encourage as many people to start their own groups and ensure those groups dont use these ridiculous meters and build checkers.

or, and I know this is a crazy idea, but you COULD get good and do adequate dps. the build I use can pump out over 10k dps by pushing one with scepter, letting the auto attack take over and doing NOTHING else but do mechanics. That’s IT! Better yourself, don’t complain and insist on being bad.

IndigoSundown.5419:

Now, if only there was some way to do instanced content without having to randomly group with people with different expectations than you. Oh, wait, there is. Sure, it’s more effort to find a guild of like-minded people, develop a friend’s list, or start your own group. I guess people prefer “log in/LFg/do content” because they think it’s more convenient. At least, it’s more convenient until you get kicked because a random grouping tool grouped you with randoms with meters.

Guilds are the answer.

…could someone please explain to me what “meta” means? I don’t understand a thing you all say but I am curious and want to understand what’s going on

Randulf.7614:

Ultimately it is these things that prevent a bigger influx of players joining these higher end instances than there could be and leads to them stagnating due to low population.

I was always being told that the amazing thing about Fractals are the difficulty tiers that allow players to train at the lower levels so when they reach the higher levels they are prepared for them. I guess if players joining the higher tiers are getting kicked due to their builds and skills not being what is required then the problem is elsewhere.

notebene.3190:

It’s why I probably won’t ever get to make one of the newer style legendaries, since you have to do fractals, and I’m betting no one wants me to tag along.

I did manage an old school Bifrost before HoT, and did Aurora, so that was fun.

You can tag along with me any time. I have no problem helping people through fractals, even if they’re not good players.

I’ve no issues w/ dps meters aka parser as a personal tool as they can be a useful tool to help improve ones dps the problem/issues that occurs is when some individuals that are using said dps meters/parsers start to get volatile and start harassing players

In ffxiv I used a parser called ACT (Advanced Combat Tracker),but that was for my own personal use to see my own personal dps numbers to help me improve on my personal dps for raids in the game that I mentioned for the much more difficult raids known as Savage versions of the normal raids or w/e that required dps checks.

Yobculture.5786:

The moment raids were implemented into the game, of course it was going to be inevitable. I use my DPS meter all the time to judge how well I’m doing against other people on a particular encounter.

It also shows buff uptimes so I can maybe suggest things to people to help them get better. Please do not think that DPS meters mean the end of GW2 is coming, it’s just that we need reliable metrics to be able to do raids properly and monitor what is going right/wrong in a particular raid group.

Exactly this.

People were just as nasty before anyhow. Only then you got kicked over any of:

• LIs.
• Achievement points.
• Class.
• Weapon.

The best solution would probably be auto group finder that considers a plethora of factors when groups up players together, so that new players with mediocre gear aren’t stuck with hardcore players that want to speedrun.

Aenaos.8160:

I wouldn’t use ARC since it is not TOS compliant,and it gives Anet the right to ban you for using it if they choose so.

I assume you refer to the function to see group members’ dps with arc. It has been stated very clearly by the devs that this is allowed.

As to the topic, kitten happens. There will always be idiots and in doubt, they will kick because of whatever metric they find. I’ve been pugging T4 fractals for a year, using arc myself for half a year and I’ve never seen someone trying to kick another group member because of dps. I’ve never even seen any comment on that, although there were countless people whose performance was a joke.

Which leads me to a much more common issue than dps meter elitism: isn’t it rude to join a group and make content much more difficult for 4 other people because you are too lazy to understand even the basics of class/game mechanics?