Guild Wars 2

In pve? Yes its destroying the game. In WvW its annoying but can easily be countered by a skilled group, hence the term “skill group”.

I enjoy playing with large groups of other players. As others have said, there are challenging events that require a large number of players. I enjoy those events and I enjoy running around with a large group of my fellow players (as an army) and decimating everything in our path.

Draknar.5748:

Sounds like we have different opinions to be honest. Do you have any examples of large scale encounters that you don’t consider zerging or are all large scale encounters zerging because of having a lot of players (i.e. 40man/25man raids in WoW).

I consider any large 50+ group content that could be programmed into a bot “zerg” content. For me, thats the definition of “mindless”. Following a pattern of movement pressing skill1 on nearest target is not so much below following another set pattern and circling through other skills in a set order programmed for maximum efficiency on a bunch of targets prioritized specificly for maximum efficiency. A lot more variables for sure, but its still a mindless program. Failure of such events are mostly the result of “newbies not doing what they should be doing” or if you like, not getting the program.

As such, large scale WvWvW battles that are pretty much balanced, i dont consider “zerging”, because that is very much dependent on reactionary responses. One group reacts to what the other one is doing. Not mindless drones chasing a static pattern. Even though most of the actual tactical gameplay falls on the commanders, there is enough variety of things to actively react to to be something other than mindless or zerg.

Mind you its easy to consider a stampede of players a zerg when you and your small group of 5 is overrun by 50+ enemy players on the open field. If it was in a fully fortified tower and the zerg* outside, thats closer to balanced.

The superficial symptoms of the zerg (drastic drop of framerate, particle effects galore, DPS race or tagging race, and the occasional stupid or just toxic remarks against allied players that dont follow the herd) is common in both the mindless zergs and the legions of players moving in WvW.

*EDIT: Forgive my calling the larger enemy group “zerg” in the scenario i wanted to present as not zerging. In the usual every day sense, we call any group of 30+ players a zerg. But the topic of discussion is “zerg content” and “zerging” which falls into what im discussing above.

I’m torn on the issue.

On one hand, it’s frustrating seeing all the complaining, and trying to call for help with one boss just to have a massive mob drop in. On the other, when RPcd over on Tarnished Coast hosts a zerg swarm, or other times when there’s downtime in the zerg, it’s fun to meet others, talk with them, and when running bosses like Teq or the Jungle Wyrms, communicating and devising the strategies needed to win. And then it’s off to the next thing.

And, if I don’t feel like zerging around, I can just… wander off and do my own thing. Maybe get a few from the crowd to follow me as well.

However, it can be very boring just rolling over everything.

But, the bigger problem is with the sheer size of the Zerg groups forming now, and their ability to seemingly be everywhere. I had a great deal of fun with RPcd’s Crusades Across Tyria back before megaservers. The new size, though, and sheer number of competing trains makes it much less enjoyable.

It is the most boring garbage imaginable. My presence is utterly meaningless and for most of them all I have to do is hit 1 and alt tab. Something like teq is a bit more interesting since there’s a bit more to it and there’s some pressure to do well, but I don’t like that type of content either since there’s absolutely no way you can expect 70 random people to communicate, organize, and play effectively. Success boils down to whether I’m in an instance with TTS or not. Nothing I do can change a loss into a victory.

I can’t believe that some people are actually defending zerg content. If you’re playing an RPG (MMO or otherwise) don’t you want to be the hero? Why would you want to be just a faceless drone in the swarm (since you already are in real life)?

NewTrain.7549:

I can’t believe that some people are actually defending zerg content. If you’re playing an RPG (MMO or otherwise) don’t you want to be the hero? Why would you want to be just a faceless drone in the swarm (since you already are in real life)?

That the same argument i always used to tell people why i hate raiding

However i suspect most of the people that are so against zergs here think that raiding is the best think since sliced bread.

I have no issues with people leveling alongside me. I have no issues with events that gather around 20+ people together. However, i DO have issues standing in one place having skill 1 in auto attack and looking outside my window in order to avoid an epilepsy crisis.

When i first got my hands on this game, i was happy, cause it required skill to get things done, dodge, and be on alert when you fight. Each class mattered, as it has unique gameplay, different survivability, and of course all the different skills/traits to make it fun to play.

With the zerg, you don’t need any of this. You just follow, spam a power, and you’re done! It’s not a game anymore, it’s “sitting in front of your desk with your head rested on your right hand, and spamming 1 with your left one”. Does it matter if you’re a Guardian, or a Thief? Not really, no. You rely to your good old ranged weapon, sit in a spot, and hit. Eventually, all you get in the end, are people with level 80 and fully geared characters, who ask questions like : What happened to my weapon switching ability!? I thought it unlocks on level 7………while playing an Elementalist.

I enjoy zerg content occasionally.

Mostly its funny to see how easily the devs can herd us to whatever location they want.

NewTrain.7549:

I can’t believe that some people are actually defending zerg content. If you’re playing an RPG (MMO or otherwise) don’t you want to be the hero? Why would you want to be just a faceless drone in the swarm (since you already are in real life)?

You’re only faceless if you choose to be. And, there’s something fun about being part of a larger thing that’s actually getting stuff done (And you see it getting stuff done). That said, zerging was a LOT more fun before the megaserver update, when the trains were manageable in size, didn’t dominate the landscape, and was all on one server.

Beldin.5498:

However i suspect most of the people that are so against zergs here think that raiding is the best think since sliced bread.

I suspect you are right.

Beldin.5498:

NewTrain.7549:

I can’t believe that some people are actually defending zerg content. If you’re playing an RPG (MMO or otherwise) don’t you want to be the hero? Why would you want to be just a faceless drone in the swarm (since you already are in real life)?

That the same argument i always used to tell people why i hate raiding

However i suspect most of the people that are so against zergs here think that raiding is the best think since sliced bread.

Raids are alright. They typically require intense coordination between a much smaller, tight-knit group of people. Even in a group of 25, your contribution matters and your guildmates are counting on you to perform well. It can take a very long time and a whole lot of practice to progress forward, but the rewards tend to be spectacular and there’s a real sense of accomplishment involved.

Unless you’re talking about WoW’s relatively new Looking For Raid feature, it is absolutely nothing like GW2 zerg content. And to nobody’s surprise, LFR is boring garbage.

Vargs.6234:

Beldin.5498:

NewTrain.7549:

I can’t believe that some people are actually defending zerg content. If you’re playing an RPG (MMO or otherwise) don’t you want to be the hero? Why would you want to be just a faceless drone in the swarm (since you already are in real life)?

That the same argument i always used to tell people why i hate raiding

However i suspect most of the people that are so against zergs here think that raiding is the best think since sliced bread.

Raids are alright. They typically require intense coordination between a much smaller, tight-knit group of people. Even in a group of 25, your contribution matters and your guildmates are counting on you to perform well. It can take a very long time and a whole lot of practice to progress forward, but the rewards tend to be spectacular and there’s a real sense of accomplishment involved.

Unless you’re talking about WoW’s relatively new Looking For Raid feature, it is absolutely nothing like GW2 zerg content. And to nobody’s surprise, LFR is boring garbage.

The problem for me in raids was always, that if MT dies i just wanted a button to kill myself, since it was crystal clear that in the next 20 seconds i will also be dead. That felt in no way heroic in any form to me and i really really hated it.

Yes, I do enjoy zerg content. (totally being serious)

This end of PvE for ZvE is something that also makes me think twice before i start the game.

Before we could do challenging stuff, events, with small groups of friends and guildies, i feel sad they trade that for massive zergs of lag and afk auto-attackers. Everything around world bosses got to be Zerg for the Win, no need of any skill or even to move at all, if there is people that like such, well you’re the ones who ruin this game.

Zergs could be fine, if the game engine was capable to handle them without require a darn high end pc, as we clearly notice how PvE is not optimized to handle such zergs without performance drops.

Kal Spiro.9745:

Mosharn.8357:

They need to add more solo content and small team content. Things like liadri were great. Give us skill based small group fights and solo stuff. This zerg auto attack stuff is boring and pointless.

Really? The whole entirety of the rest of the game isn’t enough solo content and small team content? Yes, adding the occasional new dungeon would be good, but some people also want HUGE group content, of which there is an insignificant amount when compared to the entire rest of the game.

Sola.7250:

Ok, it’s great for farming and completing your monthly but, it’s not much fun, you just showing up and spam the 1 key, it get’s old fast.

The game went from no one doing an Event to everyone doing Events!

I just want some way to do temple events, they now seem to be open 24/7. I miss doing temple events with some pug groups!

Sorry, but doing the minimum necessary effort to complete a task is your bad, not theirs. If you find spamming the 1 key to be boring, don’t DO that. Use all your powers, treat the fight like you are the only one there and maybe it will be more fun?

What solo content huh? Aside from the boring personal story and running around maps there is no real solo content. Team content is just dungeons nothing else. EVERYTHING ELSE IS ZERG ZERG ZERG. You can’t lie. I don’t know what game you are playing but 90% of the things in this game are focused on just zerging it. World bosses zerg content, teq and wurm zerg content, wvw zerg content and some small team but even then zergs out do small teams as small teams wont matter if there are lets say 3 30 man zergs around the map, pve events turn into ppl just piling in and killing randomly.

There is nothing for those who want to test their skills on their own because there is no effin solo content. The game forces you to hold hands and mindlessly kill kitten. Liadri was the only thing ppl had to test their own skills on. I mean sure you can go try hard and solo dungeons but those don’t come down to skill most the time it just becomes how you can abuse certain things.

More content like liadri. Less content like teq/wurm. Thanks

Mosharn.8357:

Kal Spiro.9745:

Mosharn.8357:

They need to add more solo content and small team content. Things like liadri were great. Give us skill based small group fights and solo stuff. This zerg auto attack stuff is boring and pointless.

Really? The whole entirety of the rest of the game isn’t enough solo content and small team content? Yes, adding the occasional new dungeon would be good, but some people also want HUGE group content, of which there is an insignificant amount when compared to the entire rest of the game.

Sola.7250:

Ok, it’s great for farming and completing your monthly but, it’s not much fun, you just showing up and spam the 1 key, it get’s old fast.

The game went from no one doing an Event to everyone doing Events!

I just want some way to do temple events, they now seem to be open 24/7. I miss doing temple events with some pug groups!

Sorry, but doing the minimum necessary effort to complete a task is your bad, not theirs. If you find spamming the 1 key to be boring, don’t DO that. Use all your powers, treat the fight like you are the only one there and maybe it will be more fun?

What solo content huh? Aside from the boring personal story and running around maps there is no real solo content. Team content is just dungeons nothing else. EVERYTHING ELSE IS ZERG ZERG ZERG. You can’t lie. I don’t know what game you are playing but 90% of the things in this game are focused on just zerging it. World bosses zerg content, teq and wurm zerg content, wvw zerg content and some small team but even then zergs out do small teams as small teams wont matter if there are lets say 3 30 man zergs around the map, pve events turn into ppl just piling in and killing randomly.

There is nothing for those who want to test their skills on their own because there is no effin solo content. The game forces you to hold hands and mindlessly kill kitten. Liadri was the only thing ppl had to test their own skills on. I mean sure you can go try hard and solo dungeons but those don’t come down to skill most the time it just becomes how you can abuse certain things.

More content like liadri. Less content like teq/wurm. Thanks

I also would second this. Not so much the challenge aspects as much as there needs to be a solo play alternative reward-wise to simply zerging champs/world bosses or people won’t have any reason to stop.

Yeah, Dungeons offer better rewards, but honestly some people have a harder time getting groups together than others, or cooperating with other players. Even the friendliest player will simply not have anyone on to group with at times, or want to spend some time on their own for a while.

I don’t like zerg in this game. In SC i do ofc <3 sweet zergies <3 <3 cough btt:
I don’t like to brainafk spam 1 without any risk or intelligence required. It’s as boring as stacking in dungeons. When will mobs fight like the human story circus boss? My god this guy kited my guard to death o.O

I don’t mind it a healthy balance is nice. I would much prefer some capped player hard dungeon content. 5-20 players would be great always enjoyed pve over pvp.

Yes

Edit: Guess that’ll teach me to not read the body carefully.

Subject: Yes
Body (last question): No

And mostly because I think that the alternative that some of you want (I wouldn’t presume to say all) is some America, NASCAR, Gordon Gekko, Free Market, Bernie Maddolf, Starbelly Sneetch game where there’s only a few winners, and everyone else is a scrub and should just quit, because we clearly weren’t riding dinosaurs 6,000 years ago like you were.

I’d much rather be playing this game, where it’s not about comparing rug burns.

Is Vanguard still open? I think that was created by some fellow that thought we all needed to be playing Everquest again? Final Fantasy XIV reboot went military industrial complex (ruining it) in addition to other changes the game needed, that might work?

Kernave.5732:

I don’t mind it a healthy balance is nice. I would much prefer some capped player hard dungeon content. 5-20 players would be great always enjoyed pve over pvp.

If they ever scale that i would more like it to be 2-20 .. since i very much prefer small partys of 2-3 over bigger

Asmodeus.5782:

Lanfear, doing Golem and Fire Elemental solo or with 2-3 players was mighty fun… And I was doing it on Piken, so no population problems there. Just had to stay up late… It was worth it, going to miss it. :/

Thats exactly the kind of fun I miss.- Us low pop servers had fun back then on small WB’s in small units. True- no chance of fighting a 3hwurm ever etc and had to guest to do Marionette on an OF, but daily running the wb’s with 2-10 players was great- or soloing some champs in the open… lovely challenges.
Now its one big QD- train- all of it.- boring.

sternenstaub.8763:

WWW is pretty boring all in all and if 2v1 is bad, well than get a buddy or two and play 2v3. It’s still an MMO

OP meant doubleteaming server’s with 2v1.

On topic: I enjoyed the marionette and the first part of the battle of lions arch a lot, which were zergfests. I hate blobbing around in wvw, though. The new megaserver also created massive blobs killing world bosses in few seconds. I do not welcome this change.

As a few already have said, there need’s to be a better balance between zergy and small group content, with focus on the latter.

Zerg content sucks. It’s basically I suck or I’m lazy so carry me. You can’t shine like in smaller 5man content. I can go up to shatterer start auto attacking tab out and back in for easy loot then onto the new boss. Even if I somehow die there will be dozens of people to ress me. Tequatl and jungle wurm would be very easy if it was instanced and players had control over who can come or not. But nope anet has to please everyone so that the bads get carried and feel good about themselves

It is destroying the game. I hate it.

Decrypter.1785:

Im finding it harder to log in everyday heres why

Zerg > Skill All the world events are just mindless zergs except the wurm and tequatl , These two events are the only ones i enjoy doing as they’re not a given and require co-ordination ..

WvWvW has become very stale Also due to zerg > skill and the 2v1 scenarios

Spvp/Tpvp i am r 80 and loads of champ titles i know have no progress or incentive to play because no more titles really

So yeah Im basically bored i guess , but wanna play the game , anyone else just feeling the same way as me ?

Sounds like you just need take a break as you are becoming burnt out. It happens to everyone don’t matter the game. Older you get or atleast for me harder that it becomes for a game to hold my attention or to keep me entertained because pretty much been there done that type of mentality eventually becomes reality. As all games are based off other games. What I’m trying to say you are becoming tired of the repetitiveness of the GW2 experience this is why it feels stale quit for about 3 months let some new content enter the game and return you’ll see that you wont be feeling this way until you hit that burnt out stage again.

RoRo.8270:

Zerg content sucks. It’s basically I suck or I’m lazy so carry me. You can’t shine like in smaller 5man content. I can go up to shatterer start auto attacking tab out and back in for easy loot then onto the new boss. Even if I somehow die there will be dozens of people to ress me. Tequatl and jungle wurm would be very easy if it was instanced and players had control over who can come or not. But nope anet has to please everyone so that the bads get carried and feel good about themselves

Shine.

Putting on Beserker gear and stacking.

Don’t burn out all at once there, Master Fortgang. You still have 3 years of college left.

Why can’t there be a little bit of everything for everyone to enjoy? How does my enjoying the Fire Elemental or Shatterer preventing you from shining your 5 man or joining a Fraternity/Sororiety of Tequatl or Super New Wurm? Why does the game have to be about wanting content only for you, and wanting ‘all the bads’ to not have any enjoyable content?

I think it’s great you got Tequatl. I wish they didn’t ‘take away’ content to make it, and would have introduced a new super sub dragon for you to fight, like they did with the super wurm. I don’t begrudge content that seems more suited to you. I simply don’t partake in it if it’s not to my liking, and enjoy the content that is more suited to my tastes.

Any reason not to reciprocate?

notebene.3190:

RoRo.8270:

Zerg content sucks. It’s basically I suck or I’m lazy so carry me. You can’t shine like in smaller 5man content. I can go up to shatterer start auto attacking tab out and back in for easy loot then onto the new boss. Even if I somehow die there will be dozens of people to ress me. Tequatl and jungle wurm would be very easy if it was instanced and players had control over who can come or not. But nope anet has to please everyone so that the bads get carried and feel good about themselves

Shine.

Putting on Beserker gear and stacking.

Don’t burn out all at once there, Master Fortgang. You still have 3 years of college left.

Why can’t there be a little bit of everything for everyone to enjoy? How does my enjoying the Fire Elemental or Shatterer preventing you from shining your 5 man or joining a Fraternity/Sororiety of Tequatl or Super New Wurm? Why does the game have to be about wanting content only for you, and wanting ‘all the bads’ to not have any enjoyable content?

I think it’s great you got Tequatl. I wish they didn’t ‘take away’ content to make it, and would have introduced a new super sub dragon for you to fight, like they did with the super wurm. I don’t begrudge content that seems more suited to you. I simply don’t partake in it if it’s not to my liking, and enjoy the content that is more suited to my tastes.

Any reason not to reciprocate?

Because the Zerg swarms crawling around the map are depriving content from small teams. They’d be just fine if every 3rd or 5th or so run of a world boss was a zerg train, letting others take shots at it and experiment with the matches on their own, but when the Zerg are taking every run of every worldboss and major event, then the problem pops up.

Frankly, I actually like Teq and the Jungle Wurm as Zerg Rushed bosses on both sides of the issue – The constant failures tie up the trains long enough for others to enjoy content without them dominating the landscape, while those within the Zerg can re-evaluate, try again, and improve strategy and on-the-fly communication between runs until they get it right and get the rewards.

Sartharina.3542:

notebene.3190:

RoRo.8270:

Zerg content sucks. It’s basically I suck or I’m lazy so carry me. You can’t shine like in smaller 5man content. I can go up to shatterer start auto attacking tab out and back in for easy loot then onto the new boss. Even if I somehow die there will be dozens of people to ress me. Tequatl and jungle wurm would be very easy if it was instanced and players had control over who can come or not. But nope anet has to please everyone so that the bads get carried and feel good about themselves

Shine.

Putting on Beserker gear and stacking.

Don’t burn out all at once there, Master Fortgang. You still have 3 years of college left.

Why can’t there be a little bit of everything for everyone to enjoy? How does my enjoying the Fire Elemental or Shatterer preventing you from shining your 5 man or joining a Fraternity/Sororiety of Tequatl or Super New Wurm? Why does the game have to be about wanting content only for you, and wanting ‘all the bads’ to not have any enjoyable content?

I think it’s great you got Tequatl. I wish they didn’t ‘take away’ content to make it, and would have introduced a new super sub dragon for you to fight, like they did with the super wurm. I don’t begrudge content that seems more suited to you. I simply don’t partake in it if it’s not to my liking, and enjoy the content that is more suited to my tastes.

Any reason not to reciprocate?

Because the Zerg swarms crawling around the map are depriving content from small teams. They’d be just fine if every 3rd or 5th or so run of a world boss was a zerg train, letting others take shots at it and experiment with the matches on their own, but when the Zerg are taking every run of every worldboss and major event, then the problem pops up.

That is a perfectly valid concern and issue.

The vitriol I responded to didn’t seem to share your valid concern.

Yes, even for someone like me, who likes more casual and open world, organic grouping for content (vs old, structured 5 person parties, holy trinities, monster and resource node tagging, et al), the megaservers have created a bit of an overkill, where it can be a little underwhelming, to the point where mechanically it’s breaking down handing out proper rewards for killing some of the champions involved at the activities.

Hopefully it’s something that can be addressed by tuning the number of people that it takes to spawn new instances at world events, as well as maybe creating ‘raid’ type mechanics where ‘groups of groups’ can form together and spin up their own instances to do world events with smaller groups of people. Lots of options to consider.

‘Bads’ and ‘Shines’? Not so helpful.

notebene.3190:

RoRo.8270:

Zerg content sucks. It’s basically I suck or I’m lazy so carry me. You can’t shine like in smaller 5man content. I can go up to shatterer start auto attacking tab out and back in for easy loot then onto the new boss. Even if I somehow die there will be dozens of people to ress me. Tequatl and jungle wurm would be very easy if it was instanced and players had control over who can come or not. But nope anet has to please everyone so that the bads get carried and feel good about themselves

Shine.

Putting on Beserker gear and stacking.

Don’t burn out all at once there, Master Fortgang. You still have 3 years of college left.

Why can’t there be a little bit of everything for everyone to enjoy? How does my enjoying the Fire Elemental or Shatterer preventing you from shining your 5 man or joining a Fraternity/Sororiety of Tequatl or Super New Wurm? Why does the game have to be about wanting content only for you, and wanting ‘all the bads’ to not have any enjoyable content?

I think it’s great you got Tequatl. I wish they didn’t ‘take away’ content to make it, and would have introduced a new super sub dragon for you to fight, like they did with the super wurm. I don’t begrudge content that seems more suited to you. I simply don’t partake in it if it’s not to my liking, and enjoy the content that is more suited to my tastes.

Any reason not to reciprocate?

And where did I state dungeons in this game are challenging? Like you said it’s all stacking. You are the typical player that anet wants to appeal to have fun zerg training around with little effort hitting loot pinatas. A little big of everything? Are you trolling this game is what? 80-90% zerg content? Rofl did you even read what I said about tequatl?

Sartharina.3542:

NewTrain.7549:

I can’t believe that some people are actually defending zerg content. If you’re playing an RPG (MMO or otherwise) don’t you want to be the hero? Why would you want to be just a faceless drone in the swarm (since you already are in real life)?

You’re only faceless if you choose to be. And, there’s something fun about being part of a larger thing that’s actually getting stuff done (And you see it getting stuff done). That said, zerging was a LOT more fun before the megaserver update, when the trains were manageable in size, didn’t dominate the landscape, and was all on one server.

No, you’re faceless. You scream to the high heavens “I’m significant!” all you want, but it won’t make it true.

In a zerg, you are as special and unique as a single worker ant in a hive of thousands. Your presence makes no difference. If you’re there doing your job, great. If you’re not, someone else is. If you die, someone else steps in. Your contribution is not noticeable, significant, or appreciated.

This is not what you want to hear. This is fact.

Only a worker ant in a hive of thousands if there are too many in the zerg. Forty or even 100 aren’t always too many, depending on the encounter. Even then, when I step in to do something, it means someone else doesn’t have to. And, nobody provides silly chat like I do, but sometimes we can build amusing banter together

I’d like to see all world bosses get treatment to make them immune to auto-attack zerg, but not necessarily as hard as the Wurms and Teq. Just enough so that, when the content is zerg rushed they still need the horde to be adaptable and somewhat coordinated.