Guild Wars 2

This year, I started GW2 with a friend of mine.
I really enjoyed GW2 until a huge difference of loot between us showed up over time. I’ve sold everything to complete my first legendary, while he already completed his legendary a long time ago, even though I’ve spent more time in GW2 than him (I had ~1500h while he had ~900h). Additionally he has found two precursors and is currently sitting with a huge amount of gold, without spending any real money.
Basically we did the same thing: doing boss events, dungeons and silverwastes.
I got frustrated and decided to grind even more. Sometimes I’ve reached about 120 Gold after 24hours. However I’ve come to realize, that I have basically no luck. I rarely got sigills/runes which were worth about 6-8 gold, but that’s it.
Out of desperation, I started to gamble. That was the first (and last) time in my life that I’ve ever thought about gambling could raise my wealth. I’ve thrown over 1k of rare great swords in the mystic toilet and spend 1k+ Gold in Tarrktun.
Of course I’ve lost everything. Now sitting with 27 Silver, I decided to quit GW2. That was about one month ago.
If I had saved up all the gold instead of gambling, I could have bought a second legendary for sure. However it feels like I’m endlessly grinding without any luck in sight, which frustrates me more than saving up every copper for a legendary. I like shiny things (like a Skritt), but without any noticeable reward, it makes me feel I’m being treated unfairly, no matter how much effort I’m putting into it. This kind of “Wow, I’ve found something really cool”-feeling is missing. I’ve played many games involving RNG (GW1, D1-D3, PoE etc.) but I’ve never felt so unsatisfied like in GW2.
I really like to come back, but thinking of the situation which I mentioned above is holding me back (kind of a love-hate relationship). I don’t know what to do.
I like to hear your opinion on it. What are your experiences so far?
Sorry for my English.

come back to the game u cant leave just by losing gold in the game u can fix everything u can start a new and fresh start u already got a legendary u should be happy go play collect gold again its not thats hard u just need to play to earn gold and yea im sitting here got all gift still to precurser and im not going to use mystic forge i promised my self after losing like 300 gold i’d better save and buy the prec so have fun
im about 250 hour and 90% completed my legendary

Spending habits matter as much as the ability to gain gold. If you were able to gain up to 120 gold in 24 hours, what happened next? If you don’t know, then maybe you’re spending much more than you realize.

Maybe what you should do is keep a running total of income and expenses. Do it for a week at least and consider doing it for a month. Write down every day when you log in what your balance is and write down each expense.

You aren’t using the gem store as intended to access all content…

I’m not sure what you’re expecting. If you think you have “no luck”, then nobody can really fix that. It’s not a problem with the game. Best you can do is rely on your own abilities to make gold.

I agree that the rewards in GW2 suck, but honestly, I never understood the people’s need to grind or farm.

I hate grinding. I hate farming even more. Hence I don’t do either. I just play whatever I feel like and the gold + mats pile up automatically.

I’m sitting on 1800g now and have 3 legendaries. The only time I ever grinded is when I was really close to finishing my 1st legendary. After that, I never grinded, not once.

And before you think I must be really lucky like your friend is: No I’m not. I never had a precursor drop and I rarely get an exotic drop worth more than 2-3g.

Seriously, just run a few dungeons, do a few world bosses, maybe one or two cycles of Silverwastes and before you know it you’re sitting on a pile of gold. It might take a bit longer to get rich that way but if you don’t waste your gold on useless crap you will get rich in an acceptable amount of time.

Most of us have felt or still feel this way. In the parlance of the forum’s white knights, it’s ‘working as intended’. The game is designed to induce us to spend real money, on gem store content or for conversion into gold.

Personally, I feel a little bad for people who value Legendary weapons. They’re hideously gaudy, imo. You can get loads of far better looking BL skins for the same amount of gold.

LucosTheDutch.4819:

I agree that the rewards in GW2 suck, but honestly, I never understood the people’s need to grind or farm.

I hate grinding. I hate farming even more. Hence I don’t do either. I just play whatever I feel like and the gold + mats pile up automatically.

I’m sitting on 1800g now and 3 legendaries. The only time I ever grinded is when I was really close to finishing my 1st legendary. After that, I never grinded, not once.

And before you think I must be really lucky like your friend is: No I’m not. I never had a precursor drop and I rarely get an exotic drop worth more than 2-3g.

Seriously, just run a few dungeons, do a few world bosses, maybe one or two cycles of Silverwastes and before you know it you’re sitting on a pile of gold. It might take a bit longer to get rich that way but if you don’t waste your gold on useless crap you will get rich in an acceptable amount of time.

^
I agree. I currently have about 2500 gold. That gold is from harvesting nodes and general gameplay, selling the mats. Once I got all my chars geared up, it steadily accumulated. The big thing is not to be buying this or that or throwing all your gold into the toilet and then being depressed because now you don’t have any gold.

RNG is always RNG. I did not get a precursor drop for over 2.5 years, and i played pretty much every day (i have over 7000 gaming hour overall). After that a precursor spear dropped, a month later the focus pre, and 3 months after that i got the torch from the mystic forge. Noone of them i really wanted and the torch and the focus ae on my bank, but never the less they suddenly just showered over me.
RNG sucks in any game and you simply have to deal with it. And gambling is ok to do as long as you can handle it and don’t gamble away all you have. That is true words in game and irl

Jahroots.6791:

Most of us have felt or still feel this way. In the parlance of the forum’s white knights, it’s ‘working as intended’. The game is designed to induce us to spend real money, on gem store content or for conversion into gold.

Personally, I feel a little bad for people who value Legendary weapons. They’re hideously gaudy, imo. You can get loads of far better looking BL skins for the same amount of gold.

Yes and no.

I fully disagree that the reward system in GW2 is bad. I’m glad that seems to be somewhat changing in HoT (precursor collection mastery and armor precursors earned through raiding) however I don’t think the game is build to encourage gems-to-gold conversions. I mean seriously, who wants to spend $10,- on give or take 150g if you’re lucky? Which such conversion rates it would cost you $200,- if you wanted to use real money on crafting a legendary. That’s TWO-HUNDRED DOLLARS. For a digital item!

If Anet wanted us to spend real money on gems to convert to gold, then they’d make the gems-to-gold conversion a bit more lucrative. They’d set it to a default good conversion rate instead of linking it to the gold-to-gems conversion rate.

Never gamble in any game, you will most likely lose just like in Vegas. RNG sucks in this game and all games but it is what it is. You can’t enjoy the game if you’re only in it to get those precious precursors. Playing the game to enjoy the game is the real win. All else is a loss.

Saving gold to get a precursor to build a legendary is trying to hit a moving target. The artificial scarcity is also a huge problem for some exotics, but ANet rules itself based on its economics, instead of what would be rewarding for the players.

Not really, but then I never understood how the steady stream of slightly more purple-named pixels can motivate people to play a game they – clearly , looking at this thread – don’t enjoy when that is taken away.

Just doesn’t work that way for me.

I play MMOs for two reasons:

• Socialize
• Expand the social gaming circle (which feeds into the first)

For everything else, including raw clicky-clicky-grind-grind, I know better games off top of my head, and I would never ever pick up a MMORPG, a game in a genre built upon a ton of concessions to make the MMO-part work, to fulfill this part of the gameplay I desire.

MMOs are social games and social games only for me. Whether I do PvE, PvP or WvW, although granted, I don’t “get” sPvP.

Rauderi.8706:

Saving gold to get a precursor to build a legendary is trying to hit a moving target. The artificial scarcity is also a huge problem for some exotics, but ANet rules itself based on its economics, instead of what would be rewarding for the players.

O really? Then explain to me how I managed to save up gold for 3 precursors without much grinding or farming.

Scarcity is a good thing. It makes items more valuable. What matters is how to achieve such scarcity.

What Anet does now is locking items behind insane RNG numbers or even more insane grind walls. Some people prefer RNG and others prefer grinding. GW2 has plenty of that and that shouldn’t change. However, there is another way of creating scarcity.

Another, much more enjoyable way of creating scarcity would be to lock items behind insanely challenging content. That way you have something to strive for and when you finally manage to beat that challenge you’ll be rewarded with a valuable item.

Like I said, some people prefer RNG and some prefer grinding, so that shouldn’t go away. But GW2 would go a long way in feeling much more rewarding if it also had really challenging content with really good rewards locked behind that content. I’d much prefer trying and failing a difficult raid a bunch of times than to mindlessly grinding my kitten off in the Silverwastes or trying my luck at the Mystic Toilet.

Thanks for the replies.
Normally I don’t gamble at all (except there’s a currency only for gambling like the blood shards in D3) and I would never ever do it in real life.
Basically I’m a laidback person in game: doing some events here and there, farming a bit, doing some stuff with the guild etc. and saving up gold for sunrise.
It just threw me off balance that although I had a higher play time than my friend, he already had much more valuable stuff than me. We played together very often. However the difference was that he got two precursors out from bonus chests. Furthermore he also got so much other good stuff that he completed his legendary way faster than me. I got jealous and impatient, trying to catch up as fast as possible. Therefore I stacked up magic find as high as possible and started to grind in the Silverwastes. Gambling seemed to be the fastest way to obtain a precursor, but unfortunately it turned out otherwise. Should I come back to GW2, I’ll never do it again, no matter what the circumstances might be.

LucosTheDutch.4819:

But GW2 would go a long way in feeling much more rewarding if it also had really challenging content with really good rewards locked behind that content. I’d much prefer trying and failing a difficult raid a bunch of times than to mindlessly grinding my kitten off in the Silverwastes or trying my luck at the Mystic Toilet.

I like this idea.

LucosTheDutch.4819:

Jahroots.6791:

Most of us have felt or still feel this way. In the parlance of the forum’s white knights, it’s ‘working as intended’. The game is designed to induce us to spend real money, on gem store content or for conversion into gold.

Personally, I feel a little bad for people who value Legendary weapons. They’re hideously gaudy, imo. You can get loads of far better looking BL skins for the same amount of gold.

Yes and no.

I fully disagree that the reward system in GW2 is bad. I’m glad that seems to be somewhat changing in HoT (precursor collection mastery and armor precursors earned through raiding) however I don’t think the game is build to encourage gems-to-gold conversions. I mean seriously, who wants to spend $10,- on give or take 150g if you’re lucky? Which such conversion rates it would cost you $200,- if you wanted to use real money on crafting a legendary. That’s TWO-HUNDRED DOLLARS. For a digital item!

If Anet wanted us to spend real money on gems to convert to gold, then they’d make the gems-to-gold conversion a bit more lucrative. They’d set it to a default good conversion rate instead of linking it to the gold-to-gems conversion rate.

Every downward tic in the exchange rate is caused by a player exchanging gems for gold. RMT is an important part of the game for many players and for Arenanet. If you made your argument to Arenant shareholders they would laugh in your face and insist that anyone who worked at Arenanet and shared your opinion of RMT be barred from management positions.

If the exchange rate were artificially inflated, the value of gold (the product Arenanet offers for sale) would plummet. Linking the amount of gold leaving circulation to the amount of gold entering circulation helps maintain the value of gold. An artificially inflated exchange rate would show Arenanet didn’t value RMT.

That being said, all ‘needed’ rewards can be obtained without ever using gold.

edit for clarity: "Every downward tic in the exchange rate is caused by players exchanging gems for gold outnumbering players exchanging gold for gems.

This actually is a fairly common complaint, that the game feels “unrewarding.” The problem is that when you’re dealing with a game like this… it’s hard really to pinpoint what “rewarding” could even BE.

There’s no real gear treadmill, so the color of the item you get really doesn’t mean all that much, especially since exotics are fairly easy to get. The reward of getting more “powerful”, i.e. vertical progression isn’t there… and frankly, I like that. If that’s your idea of “rewarding”, then honestly, I hope you never get what you want in this game.

Which means that “rewarding” basically falls into appearance, which is a very subjective measure. There’s “cool” looks on pretty much every level of item quality… and if you don’t like the look of the ascended or harder to get item sets, then yeah, you’re kinda outta luck there. That’s unfortunate, but I’m not really sure what can be done about that other than more varied looks, which is a very time consuming process on the developer side.

The only thing I see this game lacking with is that endgame activity that gets me super excited to hit endgame and makes me want to play my lv80 non stop.

Leveling is great in this game. I like the grind for looks aspect. However theres really nothing super exciting about hitting 80.

Think part of the issue is that spvp has you the same power at lv1 as 80, the pve “endgame” is the weakest part of the game mechanically, and for wvw maybe for roaming theres some “cant wait to hit 80” but really you are just a number in the zerg.

I dunno, its like they need to create some sort of special “thing” for endgame (yeah yeah raids but I don’t see those as super exciting) something we all can look forward to and something we can comfortably participate in as a means to “progress” once level cap. hope that makes sense.

LucosTheDutch.4819:

O really? Then explain to me how I managed to save up gold for 3 precursors without much grinding or farming.

Just because you didn’t consider it grinding or farming doesn’t mean it wasn’t grinding and farming. Or playing the trading post, which only works because not everyone does it.

Scarcity is a good thing. It makes items more valuable. What matters is how to achieve such scarcity.

What Anet does now is locking items behind insane RNG numbers or even more insane grind walls. Some people prefer RNG and others prefer grinding. GW2 has plenty of that and that shouldn’t change. However, there is another way of creating scarcity.

Another, much more enjoyable way of creating scarcity would be to lock items behind insanely challenging content. That way you have something to strive for and when you finally manage to beat that challenge you’ll be rewarded with a valuable item.

Like I said, some people prefer RNG and some prefer grinding, so that shouldn’t go away. But GW2 would go a long way in feeling much more rewarding if it also had really challenging content with really good rewards locked behind that content. I’d much prefer trying and failing a difficult raid a bunch of times than to mindlessly grinding my kitten off in the Silverwastes or trying my luck at the Mystic Toilet.

RNG-based artificial scarcity is bad. Not for the economy, necessarily, but for the players. It is a meritless reward structure that causes more frustration than it does enjoyment. A combination of RNG + Tokens was generally well received when J. Smith put up the forum post on it. But flat RNG or gold-grinding to moving targets? Demotivating and drives people out.

I’m with you on the idea of skill-based rewards. I’m not sure how well the Adventures thing will go, but I’ll likely give a few a try. I don’t know if I’ll do raids, but I fully support them existing for people who want challenge and rewards.

chemiclord.3978:

This actually is a fairly common complaint, that the game feels “unrewarding.” The problem is that when you’re dealing with a game like this… it’s hard really to pinpoint what “rewarding” could even BE.

There’s no real gear treadmill, so the color of the item you get really doesn’t mean all that much, especially since exotics are fairly easy to get. The reward of getting more “powerful”, i.e. vertical progression isn’t there… and frankly, I like that. If that’s your idea of “rewarding”, then honestly, I hope you never get what you want in this game.

Which means that “rewarding” basically falls into appearance, which is a very subjective measure. There’s “cool” looks on pretty much every level of item quality… and if you don’t like the look of the ascended or harder to get item sets, then yeah, you’re kinda outta luck there. That’s unfortunate, but I’m not really sure what can be done about that other than more varied looks, which is a very time consuming process on the developer side.

I agree with your description of the problem. While it can be unrewarding to turn to the marketplace for rewards, I don’t think that is the real issue. I love playing EVE and in the context of the game it is rewarding to turn to the marketplace for rewards. In Tyria, turning to the marketplace makes me feel like a mercenary, not the hero they keep telling me I am.

I think the change to precursors is a step in the right direction but I think rewards will always be unfulfilling until they expand the concept of personal rewards to include something other than cosmetics doodads such as NPCs within the personal instance, rewards that anchor the player in the LW.

Psientist.6437:

LucosTheDutch.4819:

Jahroots.6791:

Most of us have felt or still feel this way. In the parlance of the forum’s white knights, it’s ‘working as intended’. The game is designed to induce us to spend real money, on gem store content or for conversion into gold.

Personally, I feel a little bad for people who value Legendary weapons. They’re hideously gaudy, imo. You can get loads of far better looking BL skins for the same amount of gold.

Yes and no.

I fully disagree that the reward system in GW2 is bad. I’m glad that seems to be somewhat changing in HoT (precursor collection mastery and armor precursors earned through raiding) however I don’t think the game is build to encourage gems-to-gold conversions. I mean seriously, who wants to spend $10,- on give or take 150g if you’re lucky? Which such conversion rates it would cost you $200,- if you wanted to use real money on crafting a legendary. That’s TWO-HUNDRED DOLLARS. For a digital item!

If Anet wanted us to spend real money on gems to convert to gold, then they’d make the gems-to-gold conversion a bit more lucrative. They’d set it to a default good conversion rate instead of linking it to the gold-to-gems conversion rate.

Every downward tic in the exchange rate is caused by a player exchanging gems for gold. RMT is an important part of the game for many players and for Arenanet. If you made your argument to Arenant shareholders they would laugh in your face and insist that anyone who worked at Arenanet and shared your opinion of RMT be barred from management positions.

If the exchange rate were artificially inflated, the value of gold (the product Arenanet offers for sale) would plummet. Linking the amount of gold leaving circulation to the amount of gold entering circulation helps maintain the value of gold. An artificially inflated exchange rate would show Arenanet didn’t value RMT.

That being said, all ‘needed’ rewards can be obtained without ever using gold.

edit for clarity: "Every downward tic in the exchange rate is caused by players exchanging gems for gold outnumbering players exchanging gold for gems.

I get what you’re saying, and I do realize that fixing the conversion rates would come with complications of its own, but lets be real here, who in his rightful mind would spend 200 bucks for a legendary weapon?

The amount of gold you get for your real money is so laughably low that I can’t imagine anyone seriously pouring real money into gems to convert those to gold. I mean obviously it happens, but how often? How much?

I mean if we look at the convention rates, they’re actually steadily going up. 10 bucks will give you more gold now than it used to 1 or 2 years ago. Meanwhile converting gold to gems is also becoming more and more expensive. This actually implies that more people are converting gold to gems than the other way around.

Considering the fact that gems-to-gold and gold-to-gem conversions are directly linked, with a small (I think 15%) tax thrown on top of each conversion, I doubt Anet is making much money from these conversions.

What matters to Anet is people buying gems. What these people use these gems on doesn’t matter because in the end, every single gem brought into the game will be used on gemstore items (to explain: if you convert gems to gold, then someone else who converts gold to gems will get your gems and he/she will spend those gems on gemstore items).

So I don’t think it’s Anet’s intention to get people to buy gems to convert that to gold because that’s not what makes them money. What makes them money is people buying gemstore items.

Being “lucky” is also a matter of perception. We all know that you’re supposed to get tails about half the time when you flip a coin. If you get gold for tails and you end up with 48 tails out of 100, you’d think “wow, that’s unlucky,” even though it’s a common outcome. Similarly, most people getting 52/100 would think “oh that’s just average; nothing special.”

In other words, we tend to discount merely average results, over-concern ourselves with slightly worse-than-average. We overcount bad streaks and ignore good streaks, unless they are really stellar (and then tend to forget about them).

tl;dr most humans aren’t very good about evaluating how lucky we are (or aren’t).

What I do is try to decide if I like doing stuff for its own sake, in which case the rewards are a nice bonus.

LucosTheDutch.4819:

however I don’t think the game is build to encourage gems-to-gold conversions.

No? Let’s boil it down. You want some cool item? A precursor, a new skin, the cool new gemstore toy, what have you. What do you have to do, in the vast majority of cases? You either need gems, as with gem store items, or gold to buy from other players off the TP, which can be exchanged with gems. In either case, opening your wallet and buying gems is the fastest way to getting that item.

This is no accident. Anet is absolutely hoping that some people will decide that farming for gold is not worth their time and they’d rather just buy gems and either spend them or convert to gold. When gold is the most valuable and most versatile resource in the game, able to get you almost anything under the sun, it’s no accident that Anet has a shop that players can conveniently use to turn real money into gold.

It’s also a big part of why the game feels unrewarding to some. When everything is obtained with gold, and when the rarest loot you could realistically hope to get is worth only a few gold at most, then it all boils down to gold per hour. Nothing you loot is individually worth a hill of beans, but after you spend a long time collecting lots of beans, finally you can buy that cool, shiny item.

Personally, it reminds me of working a job for a regular wage until one can afford to buy an expensive luxury item. It does not remind me of a game, ostensibly designed to entertain us. I guess I’m lucky that I also have no interest in most of the expensive luxury items the game has to offer. I play when the mood strikes me, or when people want to run stuff with me, and when that loses its charm, I go find something else to do. Shiny loot and rare items don’t even cross my mind, because if they did, I’d have probably gone insane after three years of playing this game, seeing everyone around me getting precursors while the rarest thing I’ve ever looted was a recipe worth a couple hundred gold. shrug

TL;DR farming for gold sucks, but you gotta do it. Or buy gems.

Game is way more rewarding to play now than it was when I started.

2 gold just for killing Tequatl once a day, 1 gold or more for every dungeon path, in my day we got 26 silver from any dungeon path, and we would then jump back into it for 13 silver (if it was CoF1) Hell Arah paths give 3 gold!

LucosTheDutch.4819:

Jahroots.6791:

Most of us have felt or still feel this way. In the parlance of the forum’s white knights, it’s ‘working as intended’. The game is designed to induce us to spend real money, on gem store content or for conversion into gold.

Personally, I feel a little bad for people who value Legendary weapons. They’re hideously gaudy, imo. You can get loads of far better looking BL skins for the same amount of gold.

Yes and no.

I fully disagree that the reward system in GW2 is bad. I’m glad that seems to be somewhat changing in HoT (precursor collection mastery and armor precursors earned through raiding) however I don’t think the game is build to encourage gems-to-gold conversions. I mean seriously, who wants to spend $10,- on give or take 150g if you’re lucky? Which such conversion rates it would cost you $200,- if you wanted to use real money on crafting a legendary. That’s TWO-HUNDRED DOLLARS. For a digital item!

If Anet wanted us to spend real money on gems to convert to gold, then they’d make the gems-to-gold conversion a bit more lucrative. They’d set it to a default good conversion rate instead of linking it to the gold-to-gems conversion rate.

Who want to spend $10 for 150g? Cash shop based games are usually built around people who are willing spend obscene amounts for their pixels. There are also plenty of people who are willing to exchange real money for virtual currency based on the fact that gold sellers can remain in business.

LucosTheDutch.4819:

Jahroots.6791:

Most of us have felt or still feel this way. In the parlance of the forum’s white knights, it’s ‘working as intended’. The game is designed to induce us to spend real money, on gem store content or for conversion into gold.

Personally, I feel a little bad for people who value Legendary weapons. They’re hideously gaudy, imo. You can get loads of far better looking BL skins for the same amount of gold.

Yes and no.

I fully disagree that the reward system in GW2 is bad. I’m glad that seems to be somewhat changing in HoT (precursor collection mastery and armor precursors earned through raiding) however I don’t think the game is build to encourage gems-to-gold conversions. I mean seriously, who wants to spend $10,- on give or take 150g if you’re lucky? Which such conversion rates it would cost you $200,- if you wanted to use real money on crafting a legendary. That’s TWO-HUNDRED DOLLARS. For a digital item!

If Anet wanted us to spend real money on gems to convert to gold, then they’d make the gems-to-gold conversion a bit more lucrative. They’d set it to a default good conversion rate instead of linking it to the gold-to-gems conversion rate.

200 dollars is peanuts for those who have jobs. If I were to get a legendary, I’d much rather just fork over cash and buy it. You could easily blow $200 on a dinner or a night out these days.

If you want to talk ridiculous, I think spending months grinding (and not having fun) to be a much bigger waste.

For every pair of friends where one has been lucky with drops, there are in all likelihood many, many pairs of friends within which neither has been lucky. Your friend is what’s called an outlier. His situation is an aberration caused by the nature of low-chance RNG. The norm is what you — and many others – experience.

GW2 is both highly rewarding and unrewarding at the same time. The game drops so many items that only those that are the most rare are seen as having any value.

chemiclord.3978:

This actually is a fairly common complaint, that the game feels “unrewarding.” The problem is that when you’re dealing with a game like this… it’s hard really to pinpoint what “rewarding” could even BE.

I think in many cases the complaints about unrewarding is more a symptom than the actual problem. The actual problem being the lack of “fun” and the person complaining is trying to find a justification for why they are playing. If they were having fun and enjoying what they were doing there wouldn’t be a need to search for additional rewards.

Of course that doesn’t really help much since fun is its own can of worms.

Why do you want a legendary?

It’s the journey that’s supposed to be fun. If you don’t enjoy it, why do it? It’s like the Obsidian Sanctum JP. You know going in that those drops are crap, but you do the JP because it’s fun.

Tenkei.1902:

…while he already completed his legendary a long time ago, even though I’ve spent more time in GW2 than him (I had ~1500h while he had ~900h). Additionally he has found two precursors and is currently sitting with a huge amount of gold, without spending any real money.
Basically we did the same thing: doing boss events, dungeons and silverwastes.
I got frustrated and decided to grind even more.

I had a similar issue with a buddy of mine, but there’s more to the story, like there usually is.

I’m a GW1 veteran and I’ve played GW2 since the betas were out. I played since the inception and quit for the entire duration of the 1st season of the living story, which I didn’t know was going on at the time. It was also partly due to lack of content… partly because I didn’t have any RL friends who played GW2 at the time, and partly because I was frustrated with the watering down of the skill interractions from GW1 to GW2.

About a year ago I managed to get some friends to join and we played together very often. We did Teq runs, dungeons, silverwastes, fractals, sPvP – a variety of things. One Teq run however, my buddy who had MAYBE accrued 250 hours of play time compared to my 1000ish got a Dusk drop. My first precursor drop was about a month and a half ago. Nearly 3 years after release. He had around 129% MF from Luck, but this was Teq. It wasn’t a mob drop. It was from the chest, which if I remember correctly, isn’t affected by MF.

Since then I’ve managed to finish a different legendary and I’m holding on to my innitial pre, but I have no idea how unlucky I must have been for it to take that long for one to drop. If I had to spend 3 years… closer to 2.3 years since I took a long break… to get my first pre… man… That’s serious business.

As far as if I’m enjoying it now? I would say I am for sure. The game has only grown and improved over the years in my opinion, but I just wish there was something to do that isn’t a weekend event until HoT launches.

That’s really all. I understand they’re busy making sure it’s all ready to launch, and I’m not demanding content to be generated just because I want more, but I think this is a very common thought shared amongst us in the community.

LucosTheDutch.4819:

Psientist.6437:

LucosTheDutch.4819:

Jahroots.6791:

Most of us have felt or still feel this way. In the parlance of the forum’s white knights, it’s ‘working as intended’. The game is designed to induce us to spend real money, on gem store content or for conversion into gold.

Personally, I feel a little bad for people who value Legendary weapons. They’re hideously gaudy, imo. You can get loads of far better looking BL skins for the same amount of gold.

Yes and no.

I fully disagree that the reward system in GW2 is bad. I’m glad that seems to be somewhat changing in HoT (precursor collection mastery and armor precursors earned through raiding) however I don’t think the game is build to encourage gems-to-gold conversions. I mean seriously, who wants to spend $10,- on give or take 150g if you’re lucky? Which such conversion rates it would cost you $200,- if you wanted to use real money on crafting a legendary. That’s TWO-HUNDRED DOLLARS. For a digital item!

If Anet wanted us to spend real money on gems to convert to gold, then they’d make the gems-to-gold conversion a bit more lucrative. They’d set it to a default good conversion rate instead of linking it to the gold-to-gems conversion rate.

[some snark but mostly objective description]

[only logical fallacies]

Before I take your argument apart, I want to be clear about my position on how Arenanet has handled RMT and its effect on content design. I think it is appropriate for a game designer to sell in-game currency and to design that currency to act as a progression multiplier. Once that decision is made, it is impossible for RMT and ‘currency as a progression multiplier’ to not affect content design, especially if the in-game currency can be obtained without spending real world currency. Except for the design of precursors, I think Arenanet has done a square job of balancing the pros and cons of their decision. I am responding because I can’t stand using misinformation to influence opinion.

LucostheDutch, describing players who purchase Tyrian gold with real world currency as being out of their minds can only be described ironically as a defense of Arenanet’s decision to engage in RMT.

Your argument boils down to the same three misconceptions many players have about the currency exchange; that “RMT can not affect content design because”:

1. “Players who buy gold are dumb.”
There is a candidate for the US presidency who may have a job for you.

2. “The volume of gold being converted into gems is larger than the volume of gems being converted into gold”
The difference is irrelevant and ignores some important facts.
a)To paraphrase one of Arenanet’s design philosophy pillars: “More dough than time is just fine” (Not having as much time to play as others should not prevent any player from getting the rewards they want).
b) The exchange has reached equilibrium and is only disrupted by events like sales and new cash shop offerings.

3. “The exchange does not generate any profit.”
This argument depends on the misconception that 100% of the gold to gem to gem shop item conversions are unrealized revenue. The conversion of gold to gems can be described as unrealized revenue only if the player would have purchased the gem shop item with cash instead if the option to use gold did not exist. A sizable percentage of the gem shop purchases made with gold would never have occurred if the only option were to use cash. Every player who uses gold but who wouldn’t have used cash (in other words done without) increases the revenue potential of the currency exchange. The currency exchange becomes profitable far more easily than most people realize.

Why is everyone so fixated on rewards?
I wont do anything unless I get a reward for doing it.
Doesnt anyone actually play games simply to have fun?
I havnt got the foggiest idea what legenderies or exotics are , and I dont even understand why I need them, simply because Im having plenty of fun without them.

Well, killing the BL key farm has not done anything positive for my sense of game rewards.

Lol. With this patch the game got distinctly unrewarding.

mauried.5608:

Why is everyone so fixated on rewards?
I wont do anything unless I get a reward for doing it.
Doesnt anyone actually play games simply to have fun?
I havnt got the foggiest idea what legenderies or exotics are , and I dont even understand why I need them, simply because Im having plenty of fun without them.

GW2 can be played “just for fun,” but that is not the way MMO aficionados play it. These MMO stalwarts play “their” game as a hobby, spending as much of their free time as they can get away with playing. Since developers can only produce content so fast, the result of their play-preference is that they get tired of repeating content, and look to rewards as their motivation. This seems not to be you, but it is them.

For me, I can play Gw2 purely for fun, but if I do, I never repeat anything in a play session, and seldom play more than an hour or two at a time. I’ve done a lot of what’s available to do, and much of it is old hat to me now.

If MMO players were not getting rewarded for anything, the genre would die a very quick death.

Always amazes me how many people flat-out lie in threads like this.

“I’m not a lucky person but I have thousands of gold and 10 Legendary weapons and I don’t grind or farm at all!” Yeah right. You’re either a liar or a cheater, buying gold illegally (or legally, just forgetting to mention it)

I don’t have the stamina to grind for hours anymore but I do a bit of it… or just “playing the game” as someone put it (do some world bosses, pick nodes as you go etc) and I can say for sure that selling garbage trash to NPC’s from Grenth, Gates of Arah, those tedious stationary zerg world bosses etc does NOT get you thousands of gold and Legendaries. Not even cash shop gambling gets you anything decent in this game. Black Lion chest keys, dye packs etc, they are so shady, worse than any F2P Korean grinder I’ve ever seen. Great I got a chest key let’s see what I get! Oh yay I can summon a merchant LOL. That was really worth spending real money on considering there are THOUSANDS of merchants spread out over every single map.

The thing that makes me laugh is that after a break from this game, I came back recently and see that you get “rewarded” for every single thing you do now. Log in: get garbage reward. Stand in one place for 20 seconds in a PvP game: get garbage reward. Open one garbage reward box and get another garbage reward. It’s great that this game is trying to appeal to 5 year old Xbox gamers by showering us with trash, but I wish the rewards would be of a higher quality and much less frequent. It’s actually really annoying having these useless, laggy chests pop up on my screen every time I fart or cough or some tl;dr mail awarding me 70 copper for completing a heart.

Khisanth.2948:

I think in many cases the complaints about unrewarding is more a symptom than the actual problem. The actual problem being the lack of “fun” and the person complaining is trying to find a justification for why they are playing. If they were having fun and enjoying what they were doing there wouldn’t be a need to search for additional rewards.

Of course that doesn’t really help much since fun is its own can of worms.

Well… let’s be honest… MMOs in and of themselves aren’t terribly engaging.

It’s not exactly like they are a high energy sort of game. They aren’t faced paced like platformers or shooters. GW2 is one of the more “active” MMOs out there, and even then you’re still spend the majority of the time standing in one place only hitting 2 or 3 buttons. So, chances are there’s not going to be much “fun” within the game’s mechanics.

The thrill of MMOs by and large come from the rewards for doing so, whether it’s opening another part of the narrative, the social aspects (like roleplaying), or the “loot.”

Tenkei.1902:

This year, I started GW2 with a friend of mine.
I really enjoyed GW2 until a huge difference of loot between us showed up over time. I’ve sold everything to complete my first legendary, while he already completed his legendary a long time ago, even though I’ve spent more time in GW2 than him (I had ~1500h while he had ~900h). Additionally he has found two precursors and is currently sitting with a huge amount of gold, without spending any real money.
Basically we did the same thing: doing boss events, dungeons and silverwastes.
I got frustrated and decided to grind even more. Sometimes I’ve reached about 120 Gold after 24hours. However I’ve come to realize, that I have basically no luck. I rarely got sigills/runes which were worth about 6-8 gold, but that’s it.
Out of desperation, I started to gamble. That was the first (and last) time in my life that I’ve ever thought about gambling could raise my wealth. I’ve thrown over 1k of rare great swords in the mystic toilet and spend 1k+ Gold in Tarrktun.
Of course I’ve lost everything. Now sitting with 27 Silver, I decided to quit GW2. That was about one month ago.
If I had saved up all the gold instead of gambling, I could have bought a second legendary for sure. However it feels like I’m endlessly grinding without any luck in sight, which frustrates me more than saving up every copper for a legendary. I like shiny things (like a Skritt), but without any noticeable reward, it makes me feel I’m being treated unfairly, no matter how much effort I’m putting into it. This kind of “Wow, I’ve found something really cool”-feeling is missing. I’ve played many games involving RNG (GW1, D1-D3, PoE etc.) but I’ve never felt so unsatisfied like in GW2.
I really like to come back, but thinking of the situation which I mentioned above is holding me back (kind of a love-hate relationship). I don’t know what to do.
I like to hear your opinion on it. What are your experiences so far?
Sorry for my English.

Rewards in GW2 has a big a huge topic since the beginning of the game when such things as diminishing returns was put into place. Unfortunately it’s an issue that has never really been addressed and if anything rewards have been consistently and slowed lessened from each new content release. That is unfortunately the price of a game where you can buy story items with in game gold because amount of rewards affect their bottom line.

Its the trade off for lack of progression grind. I think back to the first generation of mmorpgs. Getting to level cap was a serious time investment. It wasn’t really easy to get there, and well, endgame for a lot of these games was standing around town while people marveled at you in your high level gear. No one wanted that. GW2 is the evolution of people disliking strong progression and character building.

So this game cut out the gear grind, cut out the level grind, cut out character building ( can just respect any way I see fit any time ect) replaced the need to continually play with deco skins and whatnot.

I don’t dislike it, but I’m only a couple weeks into the game and ive already started working on a second character.

Game needs a definitive game mode for endgame, raids wont cut it, lack of trinity sort of dulls the pve endgame imo.

I’m a huge ARPG fan so I get what your saying with lack of shiny in this game. For me this is a nice change of pace I guess. Combat is fun, the game looks pretty decent and well made, just clearing pve map content is fun, the pvp isn’t half bad for a non full loot game.

Oh and I get that arpg loot tingle when I’m doing spvp, those gear box progression tracks…I love them…they need to put those in for all sorts of other activities. Id do a hell of a lot more wvw if I saw progress towards a unique skin box going up ect….not that wvw isn’t unfun, just that game modes been done to death in a lot of other games ive played.

I see alot of people telling the OP that it is somehow “HIS” fault that his luck is terrible in GW2.

If you read his post, he explains that he, and the friend he started with, did the same content, they did dungeons, world bosses, silverwastes… the OP goes on to explain that he put in almost twice the time doing this same content and while his friend got 2 precursor drops he got zero precursor drops, and that his friend got consistantly better loot and more of it, not just for his time playing, but over all.

That doesn’t sound like a spending behavior issue, or wrong place at the wrong tiome issue, it sounds like a RNG issue, because it IS an RNG issue.

I never did, nor will I ever understand the reasoning behind why Gw2’s RNG system is implemented the way it is, with a baseline probability with equal numbers of both above baseline RNG characters and below baseline characters, to equal extents. So that for every person that has great luck, and has pulled 7 precursors out off the forge with little effort, received another 2 or 3 as drops, etc, etc there is another player that could throw 10000 exotics into the forge and never get a precursor, who could grind content 24 hours a day from the moment of launch until right now and never see a precursor drop.

It defies logic, why would you want to make one player’s game experience rewarding and fun, while making another player’s thankless and unfair?

I can’t see how making some players into RNGesus and others into born losers is a good thing for anyone other then the person with the great RNG…

Why is it such a bad idea to make everyone have, say… an EQUAL chance at rare and exotic items?

Would rewarding players that put in the effort and time in hopes of getting that coveted items be a bad thing?

I know that I have stopped playing for long periods of time because of similar situations, my RNG is apparently not as bad as the OP’s, but I used to farm chests non stop, for months in the winter when I have tons of free time, there were times I have 5000+ gilded strong boxes in my bank, I used all the magic find food, and salvaged blues and greens for magic find… yet I would rarely get exotics, maybe 8 or 10 out of several thousand exotic chests from Frost Gorge, yet I had friends farming with me that would pick up about 10 rares and an exotic or so off of trash mobs while we were farming, and they would get 2 or 3 x the exotics I got, from half the boxes.

I know people that will buy 100 rares and CONSISTENTLY pull precursors out of the forge, I know a lady that pulled 7 out in a week, 1 a day, with 100 or so rares, honest truth here.

I have thrown 1000’s of rares into the mystic forge and have received 1 precursor, the rifle, for which I was very thankful, and out of the 20,000 or 30,000 or more chests I have opened I got the shield precursor, again I was so excited I was yelling (that was my first one) and my wife ran into my office thinking something was wrong.

I have a good friend I play with regularly, when we do fractals he ALWAYS gets 2x more rares/exos then I get, ALWAYS. I am happy for him, but it gets annoying to ALWAYS be the one getting the short end of the stick.

And as bad as I feel my RNG is compared to other players I know of, I also know that there are others, like the OP that have it way worse.

It really does seem like the RNG mechanics in this game are not only unfair, but in the end will discourage the players with unusually bad RNG from continuing to play, like the original poster that assumed working hard and being dedicated would increase his chances at better loot.

Unfortunately, this is not the way it works in GW2.

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/news/1553-john-smith-outlines-discussion-of-rng-changes/

They believe that if the playing field is level in terms of rewards, that the game wouldn’t be fun at all. So in Mr. Smith’s mind, it’s more fun for everyone if some people get constantly rewarded and some people never get rewarded at all. Sorry but that seems irrational and, as far as I am concerned, a terrible approach towards making the game enjoyable for all players.

I don’t think everyone should be getting awesome drops all the time, but I also don’t think ANYBODY should.

I guess I am really confused about how making the rewards for playing be decided at the time of account or character creation rather then RANDOM per drop and equal for everyone is not a terrible system that sucks.

Unless the goal is to manipulate an emotion response that research indicates may cause more people to break out then wallets then to quit… which would be my guess.

Maybe one day they will start doing RNG “rerolls” on a regular basis like weekly or monthly, at least that would give everyone a chance experience the Midas touch… and it’s antithesis.

Or would that be too fair and ruin the game?

If there is some logic behind why making some people’s experience in GW2 less rewarding then everyone else’s somehow makes the game better, please enlighten me.

Thanks,

Eddie

I also think the rewards are important for motivation to keep playing the game. However some people have already said that most of the rewards in this game aren’t even worth mentioning if you’re playing long enough.
My goal was to get Eternity, because I like the skins and it is connected with an achievement.

Basically you have 3 options how to get a precursor:
1) farm weeks or months for gold and buy it from TP (depending on how much you play)
2) buy it with real money (gems)
3) you’re lucky
Point 3 is what makes me feel like an Idiot: Why did I have to grind for a precursor, while a friend of mine already has found two of them? Why do I have to roll a dice more than a thousand times (without any ending in sight), when it’s possible to get the desired result after 500 times? GW2 has proven that RNG ‘is working as intended’: It’s possible to get a precursor dropped after 100 or 10000 hours of play time (or you’ll never get one, hahaha lol).
Then how many thousands of hours do I have to keep playing until I see something “precious”?

No proper rewards for effort –> unrewarding. It feels like I’m playing a casino slot machine.

Pretty much agree with the previous poster XYLUM.

LordEnki.9283:

Unfortunately it’s an issue that has never really been addressed and if anything rewards have been consistently and slowed lessened from each new content release.

What? Have you only been playing a few months or something?

I’ve played since release. Let me tell you a few things about how some rewards used to work.

Tequatl would give you maybe 3 or 4 rares. If you were lucky you’d get an exotic you could sell for 2 gold. That was it. Now you get 2 gold and 3 rares MINIMUM. Dungeons give you 1 gold or more for the first clear of the day. Everything is now a daily with much better rewards.

LucosTheDutch.4819:

I agree that the rewards in GW2 suck, but honestly, I never understood the people’s need to grind or farm.

I hate grinding. I hate farming even more. Hence I don’t do either. I just play whatever I feel like and the gold + mats pile up automatically.

I’m sitting on 1800g now and have 3 legendaries. The only time I ever grinded is when I was really close to finishing my 1st legendary. After that, I never grinded, not once.

And before you think I must be really lucky like your friend is: No I’m not. I never had a precursor drop and I rarely get an exotic drop worth more than 2-3g.

Seriously, just run a few dungeons, do a few world bosses, maybe one or two cycles of Silverwastes and before you know it you’re sitting on a pile of gold. It might take a bit longer to get rich that way but if you don’t waste your gold on useless crap you will get rich in an acceptable amount of time.

^ This is so just me too, though I don’t have a single Legendary… I have no gold but that is all my foult as I don’t care for a Legendary and I spend my gold. But yes, loot could have been more interesting.

Good Tofu.9376:

LucosTheDutch.4819:

Jahroots.6791:

Most of us have felt or still feel this way. In the parlance of the forum’s white knights, it’s ‘working as intended’. The game is designed to induce us to spend real money, on gem store content or for conversion into gold.

Personally, I feel a little bad for people who value Legendary weapons. They’re hideously gaudy, imo. You can get loads of far better looking BL skins for the same amount of gold.

Yes and no.

I fully disagree that the reward system in GW2 is bad. I’m glad that seems to be somewhat changing in HoT (precursor collection mastery and armor precursors earned through raiding) however I don’t think the game is build to encourage gems-to-gold conversions. I mean seriously, who wants to spend $10,- on give or take 150g if you’re lucky? Which such conversion rates it would cost you $200,- if you wanted to use real money on crafting a legendary. That’s TWO-HUNDRED DOLLARS. For a digital item!

If Anet wanted us to spend real money on gems to convert to gold, then they’d make the gems-to-gold conversion a bit more lucrative. They’d set it to a default good conversion rate instead of linking it to the gold-to-gems conversion rate.

200 dollars is peanuts for those who have jobs. If I were to get a legendary, I’d much rather just fork over cash and buy it. You could easily blow $200 on a dinner or a night out these days.

If you want to talk ridiculous, I think spending months grinding (and not having fun) to be a much bigger waste.

Value of stuff in Dollars seems to be way off …
Here in sweden $200 would be atleast 4 dinners at a quite neat resturant. A night out depends on who you are but I would spend max around $50.
$200 is nearly half my rent on my apartment and my rent is cheap… So no, I wouldn’t go buy digital graphics (Nothing) for $200 even if I earned twice as much as I do now.

I rather enjoy the game becouse it is fun and one day when the item falls in my lap I will say ‘Hello to you’. I don’t need bragging rights to play this game, this game isn’t about Legenary, a game is a game and a game is there to give enjoyment so if I don’t enjoy a game or if I have to fork up lots of money to enjoy it I stop playing it.

I got my 1st legendary precursor weapon after 3 years of active gameplay. (doing everything Gw2 has to offer) I got it from the MF. My friend that has just started playing got a far more expensive precursor weapon within 4 months of gameplay from SW.

So it’s about luck, and you should not be counting on it to come your way. Just enjoy the game in general and don’t fixate on getting a legendary weapon right from the start. That is my advice I can give you.

It varies, honestly. Gem store I don’t really have a problem with, but weapon skins going straight to the BL key/chests system feels extremely unrewarding. Thats because I hate gambling, though. I’d rather just know what the cost of something is up front and buy it that way. I refuse to gamble for it. I tried it once, got absolutely nothing, and I felt awful that I had just thrown my money away like that. Never again. Ever.

On the other hand, being able to get ascended rings through achievements was pretty nice (sinister jewelry), and that certainly felt rewarding. So for me it really depends.

Khisanth.2948:

LucosTheDutch.4819:

Jahroots.6791:

Most of us have felt or still feel this way. In the parlance of the forum’s white knights, it’s ‘working as intended’. The game is designed to induce us to spend real money, on gem store content or for conversion into gold.

Personally, I feel a little bad for people who value Legendary weapons. They’re hideously gaudy, imo. You can get loads of far better looking BL skins for the same amount of gold.

Yes and no.

I fully disagree that the reward system in GW2 is bad. I’m glad that seems to be somewhat changing in HoT (precursor collection mastery and armor precursors earned through raiding) however I don’t think the game is build to encourage gems-to-gold conversions. I mean seriously, who wants to spend $10,- on give or take 150g if you’re lucky? Which such conversion rates it would cost you $200,- if you wanted to use real money on crafting a legendary. That’s TWO-HUNDRED DOLLARS. For a digital item!

If Anet wanted us to spend real money on gems to convert to gold, then they’d make the gems-to-gold conversion a bit more lucrative. They’d set it to a default good conversion rate instead of linking it to the gold-to-gems conversion rate.

Who want to spend $10 for 150g? Cash shop based games are usually built around people who are willing spend obscene amounts for their pixels. There are also plenty of people who are willing to exchange real money for virtual currency based on the fact that gold sellers can remain in business.

Yeah but illegal gold sellers usually give you somewhere between 500 and 1000 gold for 10 bucks. That’s a way more acceptable rate than 150g (at most) for 10 bucks.

If Anet would offer 1000g for 10 bucks, then I probably would have been tempted to buy gold with real money. But as it is now (150g at most for 10 bucks) it’s just a waste of money. I really can’t justify spending 10 bucks on 150g.

Edit: Nevermind, I just checked some sites, the best bang for your buck these days is 300g for 12,50 bucks. It’s still better than 150g for 10 bucks, but still not worth it.

LucosTheDutch.4819:

Khisanth.2948:

LucosTheDutch.4819:

Jahroots.6791:

Most of us have felt or still feel this way. In the parlance of the forum’s white knights, it’s ‘working as intended’. The game is designed to induce us to spend real money, on gem store content or for conversion into gold.

Personally, I feel a little bad for people who value Legendary weapons. They’re hideously gaudy, imo. You can get loads of far better looking BL skins for the same amount of gold.

Yes and no.

I fully disagree that the reward system in GW2 is bad. I’m glad that seems to be somewhat changing in HoT (precursor collection mastery and armor precursors earned through raiding) however I don’t think the game is build to encourage gems-to-gold conversions. I mean seriously, who wants to spend $10,- on give or take 150g if you’re lucky? Which such conversion rates it would cost you $200,- if you wanted to use real money on crafting a legendary. That’s TWO-HUNDRED DOLLARS. For a digital item!

If Anet wanted us to spend real money on gems to convert to gold, then they’d make the gems-to-gold conversion a bit more lucrative. They’d set it to a default good conversion rate instead of linking it to the gold-to-gems conversion rate.

Who want to spend $10 for 150g? Cash shop based games are usually built around people who are willing spend obscene amounts for their pixels. There are also plenty of people who are willing to exchange real money for virtual currency based on the fact that gold sellers can remain in business.

Yeah but illegal gold sellers usually give you somewhere between 500 and 1000 gold for 10 bucks. That’s a way more acceptable rate than 150g (at most) for 10 bucks.

If Anet would offer 1000g for 10 bucks, then I probably would have been tempted to buy gold with real money. But as it is now (150g at most for 10 bucks) it’s just a waste of money. I really can’t justify spending 10 bucks on 150g.

Edit: Nevermind, I just checked some sites, the best bang for your buck these days is 300g for 12,50 bucks. It’s still better than 150g for 10 bucks, but still not worth it.

Thing is there, that if Anet changed it to say $10/1000g then all the items on the TP would just go up in price to match, T6 mats would be 3 or 4 gold each, skins would be x5 more expensive,

They just need to reward more ingame, some people believe that will come with HoT others do not and have quit already, the game has never really been that rewarding, there was an update a couple of years ago that made Heavy Moldy Bags drop more in Cursed Shore, so people went there to farm, this was frowned upon and so a lot of the events where nerfed to drop no loot, sadly that has been echo’d across the game, instead of fixing a problem, they remove the drops, and thus we have topics like this,

After HoT comes out I will personally give it 3 months to see if loot improves if it does not, my 10/11 year relationship with Anet is done, and I know several other people whom will abandon the game.

As for the OP, there are several people in this game that get the best rewards, from pre’s to really expensive skins etc, its just the way the game is made, some believe that your account is tagged on creation to either get said loot, or not, Magic Find no matter how high you push it, does not seem to change this ( even though it should ) you will never get a reply from Anet or a Dev on this topic, as its working as intended as far as they are concerned, even though RNG has caused so many hate filled topics.

It can, but the rewards are typically very long term, like grinding to afford certain dyes.

I’m looking for something better to do with my time, I pre ordered but I’m not very hopeful right now. I loved it when I first came in about 5 months ago, but I’m not adjusting well to the changes.