Guild Wars 2

This is a raiding game now, it’s no longer about “fun”, its a phallis measuring contest between the worst examples of gaming culture.

Harsh I know, but I hate this culture, EVERYONE hates this culture. And ANet advertised their raiding system as one everyone would be able to get into to some degree, preventing this elitist bullcrap.

Then raids finally released, and that was patently false from the off. And they just shrugged and decided they were okay with it; okay with content that appeal to and even fosters and grows the worst among us (and their hangers on), okay with releasing content for the 99% with 1/100th of the play time and rewards of content released for the 1%, and most of all okay with advertising one product and delivering a completely different one after they had already accepted payment based not on what they delivered but on what they falsely advertised.

Conncept.7638:

This is a raiding game now, it’s no longer about “fun”, its a phallis measuring contest between the dredge of the gaming world.

Harsh I know, but I hate this culture, EVERYONE hates this culture. And ANet advertised their raiding system as one everyone would be able to get into to some degree, preventing this elitist bullcrap.

Then raids finally released, and that was patently false from the off. And they just shrugged and decided they were okay with it, okay with content that applies to the most base among us (and their hangers on), and okay with advertising one product and delivering a completely different one after they had already accepted payment based not on what they delivered but on what they falsely advertised.

I remember raids being described as intended for a niche group of the player base. Being advertised as content aimed at the few, not everyone. Do you have any links or screenshots showing advertisements or statements that I may have missed? I am really curious if we have yet another example of ANet contradicting themself.

Ryou.2398:

Djinn.9245:

Ryou.2398:

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

Ryou.2398:

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

Ryou.2398:

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

Ryou.2398:

I could not agree more, I think it has more to do with ego and the meta community acting like it has to go through them first to be acceptable.

There’s no such thing as a “meta community” and absolutely no one who has publishes data on “best DPS” builds insists that there’s only one way to play.

That’s like accusing the “fun police” of being against DPS meters — different people enjoy the game in different ways. This game makes it easy to have fun in dungeons and fractals and especially open world without worrying much about having optimized builds, so if you don’t care to research & won’t use someone else’s build, then why worry if anyone else is doing so?

I hope your being sarcastic because there is a huge meta community and multiple websites for gw2 meta, I am not accusing anyone im stating facts and experience from multiple mmorpg experiences including this ones.

You claimed that there’s some group that is dictating what other people should play — there isn’t. You claimed that it’s about ego — it’s not, it’s about different ways of approaching the game.

Certainly there are people who publish results of their attempts to eke out the best numbers possible and certainly there are people who will follow in their footsteps. And certainly there are people who will /kick anyone who seems to be marching to the beat of a different drummer.

But that’s nothing close to any sort of community organized around the idea of insisting on what others should do. That’s just human beings exhibiting human nature — some like to push the limits of their abilities, some like to push other people around.

And again, what possible difference does it make that such people exist if you want to just play the game to have fun? Nothing is stopping you from any content, with the possible exception of raids … and that’s only because raids are challenging enough for 10 good players that the choice of build/comp can matter.

The original post asks, “does anyone just have fun anymore?” To answer that question, we don’t need to pay any attention at all to “the meta” because the answer is “yes, people are having fun exactly the same way they had it at launch, doing whatever they like in the game.”

Umm yes there is lol I certainly do not need your validation neither, I never claimed anyone is stopping me from doing content you sure make tons of assumptions about me when I never said any of those things, and your sure going out of your way to justify something you do not think exists.

Stop trying to be so condescending.

I’m sorry that you think that someone disagreeing with you is “condescending.” I’m also sorry that you can’t separate my reply to you about your bold claims & my separate point addressing the OP’s question.

No you where responding to me, if you are responding to the ops question you make a separate post and reply to them, you where being condescending and you know it, I am far from new on the internet and especially forums.

Sorry, but I didn’t see anything “condescending” in his post, maybe you can quote the part you object to.

And I agree with him that unless you are talking ONLY about raids, there generally isn’t anyone telling you how to play unless you pay attention to people in chat and who gives those people weight in a video game?

There are several different sites that parse character numbers and offer opinions on what builds are most effective at different playstyles. But they are run by different people (not one central voice) and they don’t contact you in-game to tell you that you have to use their site. It is completely voluntary to go to these sites and many people don’t even know they exist.

And I never specified if it was outside of raids only you assumed I did, but I’m also talking about fractals not just raids.

No, I didn’t assume anything. I specifically stated unless you are talking about raids. And perhaps some people want meta in fractals but by no means is it everyone.

Ryou.2398:

You can agree all you want but it does not Trump my experience with the game. I see tons telling about meta battle read map chat. For example someone will ask advice and people argue all the time because it is the meta and tell them that their build won’t be able to do endgame or tell them defensive stats are useless. Same goes for guilds and forums.

As I said, sure people talk about meta in chat. But that is individuals, not a cohesive “community”. There are also people in chat that say you don’t need meta unless you are raiding.

And again, it’s video game chat… O.o

Maybe number crunching is fun to them? I may not have fun doing the math behind raiding and DPS benchmarks, but I certainly understand why others do. Like TheRandomGuy said…

TheRandomGuy.7246:

Fun is subjective.

Zedek.8932:

There is not a single week where I am not posting about people should enjoy the game/the profession more and not get mad at every nerf or changes

But the Nerf to Shield Bash took the fun out of the weapon. Instead of being the skill that interrupts (As the shield bash is in every other game, and incredibly fun for it), it’s now the skill that gets interrupted (Bogus!)

Greyraven.4258:

…
No one seems to want to have fun anymore…. .

Not really true. Some save the fun for the end.
He who laughs last, laughs best.

My 14 yo son decided -finally- to give GW2 a try.
He’s a gamer, like me, but he prefers FPS games like CoD and CS:GO. You know, the bang-bang pew-pew – I Kill Ye Ded kinda games. I’ve never been able to enjoy that genre.

Anyway, my son is now playing GW2 and I made a new Mesmer just to play with him.
We’re leveling up slowly (L65 rigt now) and we’re just roaming casually around Tyria, participating in Dynamic Events as we find them, doing reknown hearts if we feel like, doing mini-dungeons and jumping puzzles if we’re in the mood, etc.

We’re having a lot of fun because we’re not pressured to “use the LFG or die”; “Find the ‘right’ map or don’t get this done”; “log in 20 minutes before the event or miss it”; “Pop a tag to get more people or fail”, etc .

We’re playing at our own pace and this is what I feel we lost with HoT.

And yes, we’re having fun. I still don’t know if my son will want to continue thru HoT once he gets Gliding… let’s see.

:)

Ashen.2907:

Conncept.7638:

This is a raiding game now, it’s no longer about “fun”, its a phallis measuring contest between the dredge of the gaming world.

Harsh I know, but I hate this culture, EVERYONE hates this culture. And ANet advertised their raiding system as one everyone would be able to get into to some degree, preventing this elitist bullcrap.

Then raids finally released, and that was patently false from the off. And they just shrugged and decided they were okay with it, okay with content that applies to the most base among us (and their hangers on), and okay with advertising one product and delivering a completely different one after they had already accepted payment based not on what they delivered but on what they falsely advertised.

I remember raids being described as intended for a niche group of the player base. Being advertised as content aimed at the few, not everyone. Do you have any links or screenshots showing advertisements or statements that I may have missed? I am really curious if we have yet another example of ANet contradicting themself.

Ugh its so impossible to find this crap, but I will do my best.

I remember specifically where I first heard it, because after the developer stated this, Woodenpotatoes addressed it in a video shortly after, taking the stance that he disagreed with the developer and that raids should be for a very small “elite” portion of the playerbase and that they should not aim for everyone. WP argued that having content like that was good for the game, it attracted even players with no interest in raiding simply by the “coolness” factor of huge bosses and instances as well as weightier art and lore, especially through the advertising of youtubers and streamers who would raid.

And I remember it so clearly because I vehemently disagreed with him that it attracted anyone besides raiders, though I didn’t post my disagreement, I wish I had because then finding it would be a simple matter of looking up my youtube comment history.

EDIT: Hmm… this might be the quote that WP went off of in his video but I’m not sure, its admittedly vague and not exactly what I remember, I remember it being in answer to a question either in an AMA or here on the forums, I hope not the forums or its lost to ANets web development team and their inability to make a functioning archive and search bar. But it is from the right time period, when there was basically nothing released about raids save that they were being added to the game with the expansion.

Anyway what I could find is found here, and is from the old game director Colin Johanson. In the interview he states that while of course initially there will be a small group of players completing raids successfully, that he does expect a broad portion of the playerbase to play raid content, for that broader portion of the playerbase to eventually be capable of completing the raids, and for that broader portion to grow given time and more raid wing releases.

Now I don’t know about you but I can’t think of a single game where I would call solely hardcore players and raiders a broad portion of anything at all, so clearly he was expecting some player who do not traditionally raid, casual players are the only thing that comes to my mind. And I don’t think anyone can reasonably claim that the amount of raiders has gone up with time or releases, or that more casual players are completing the raid wings. Most casual players I know gave up on the content just from hearing about it.

No, I didn’t assume anything. I specifically stated unless you are talking about raids. And perhaps some people want meta in fractals but by no means is it everyone.

You can agree all you want but it does not Trump my experience with the game. I see tons telling about meta battle read map chat. For example someone will ask advice and people argue all the time because it is the meta and tell them that their build won’t be able to do endgame or tell them defensive stats are useless. Same goes for guilds and forums.

As I said, sure people talk about meta in chat. But that is individuals, not a cohesive “community”. There are also people in chat that say you don’t need meta unless you are raiding.
And again, it’s video game chat… O.o[/quote]
Actually you did assume but nice try. And then why are you even arguing with me? Your the one who presumed and jumped into a response that has nothing to do with what your talking about, yea some people do try to say do not use the meta but more try to push the meta or are just louder about it.
The original response was There’s no such thing as a “meta community” and absolutely no one who has publishes data on “best DPS” builds insists that there’s only one way to play. Trying to say it does not exist at all, but clearly you did not read it and just assumed, typical.

I can’t agree more. its really frustrating when the game become only that. there are so much more than just states.

I was actually really enjoying the game until the recent balance patch. Good bye power builds, hello boring passive condi.

It’s hard to enjoy something when that thing you enjoy continuously gets gutted.

Blue.1207:

I was actually really enjoying the game until the recent balance patch. Good bye power builds, hello boring passive condi.

It’s hard to enjoy something when that thing you enjoy continuously gets gutted.

What are you talking about? Power is still reported as viable.

I guess it’s way too late to think of these ideas in relation to this particular game – and that’s a sad thing.

Mishoo.5918:

Greyraven.4258:

…
No one seems to want to have fun anymore…. .

Not really true. Some save the fun for the end.
He who laughs last, laughs best.

Save fun for the end of what?

Djinn.9245:

Mishoo.5918:

Greyraven.4258:

…
No one seems to want to have fun anymore…. .

Not really true. Some save the fun for the end.
He who laughs last, laughs best.

Save fun for the end of what?

I, for one, am looking forward to a celebration of what the game could have been when the final server shuts down.

Mishoo.5918:

He who laughs last, laughs best.

That only really works if it’s a laugh at the expense of others.

Conncept.7638:

Ashen.2907:

Conncept.7638:

This is a raiding game now, it’s no longer about “fun”, its a phallis measuring contest between the dredge of the gaming world.

Harsh I know, but I hate this culture, EVERYONE hates this culture. And ANet advertised their raiding system as one everyone would be able to get into to some degree, preventing this elitist bullcrap.

Then raids finally released, and that was patently false from the off. And they just shrugged and decided they were okay with it, okay with content that applies to the most base among us (and their hangers on), and okay with advertising one product and delivering a completely different one after they had already accepted payment based not on what they delivered but on what they falsely advertised.

I remember raids being described as intended for a niche group of the player base. Being advertised as content aimed at the few, not everyone. Do you have any links or screenshots showing advertisements or statements that I may have missed? I am really curious if we have yet another example of ANet contradicting themself.

Ugh its so impossible to find this crap, but I will do my best.

I remember specifically where I first heard it, because after the developer stated this, Woodenpotatoes addressed it in a video shortly after, taking the stance that he disagreed with the developer and that raids should be for a very small “elite” portion of the playerbase and that they should not aim for everyone. WP argued that having content like that was good for the game, it attracted even players with no interest in raiding simply by the “coolness” factor of huge bosses and instances as well as weightier art and lore, especially through the advertising of youtubers and streamers who would raid.

And I remember it so clearly because I vehemently disagreed with him that it attracted anyone besides raiders, though I didn’t post my disagreement, I wish I had because then finding it would be a simple matter of looking up my youtube comment history.

EDIT: Hmm… this might be the quote that WP went off of in his video but I’m not sure, its admittedly vague and not exactly what I remember, I remember it being in answer to a question either in an AMA or here on the forums, I hope not the forums or its lost to ANets web development team and their inability to make a functioning archive and search bar. But it is from the right time period, when there was basically nothing released about raids save that they were being added to the game with the expansion.

Anyway what I could find is found here, and is from the old game director Colin Johanson. In the interview he states that while of course initially there will be a small group of players completing raids successfully, that he does expect a broad portion of the playerbase to play raid content, for that broader portion of the playerbase to eventually be capable of completing the raids, and for that broader portion to grow given time and more raid wing releases.

Now I don’t know about you but I can’t think of a single game where I would call solely hardcore players and raiders a broad portion of anything at all, so clearly he was expecting some player who do not traditionally raid, casual players are the only thing that comes to my mind. And I don’t think anyone can reasonably claim that the amount of raiders has gone up with time or releases, or that more casual players are completing the raid wings. Most casual players I know gave up on the content just from hearing about it.

Its a good link but unfortunately doesn’t really come out and say that Anet intended raids for everyone, or anything of the sort. The only reference to, “broad portion,” wasn’t a quote (or at least wasn’t listed as a quote). One quote that does stand out was a reference to spending a lot of time and effort trying to eventually beat the raid. That doesn’t sound like a casual play style so it doesn’t seem as if it references content meant for everyone, or even a majority. It really does seem to describe a hardcore play style/players.

Unfortunately it can be very difficult to find exact dev quotes in these forums. Perhaps it was on Reddit?

The meta are being pushed to only one dmg type its hard to just have fun if every one is running all in condi builds for wvw (where i think most ppl would have fun well for me).

You got to at least run 1 to 3 hard counters to condis or your going to die in secs never a fun thing. All the worst if you class needs to build a set way to do this.

Raids are the worst of meta builds and benchmarks out side of betting a boss the first time its more of a grind.

Open pve is ok all the better with storys. Some times it feels like a chore to do open pve but for the most part the first time is always enjoyable.

Spvp all about meta teams if you have fun dominating ppl that great if your being dominated its not so great.

In pvp (spvp / wvw) what it comes down to is being able to build crazy set up and have them work on some level with out being one shot/condi to death in secs. As for pve its about being able to do new things and minimizing having to do the same thing over and over.

Min maxing is some people’s idea of fun. Doing something better is worth it for its own sake.

If you think about it, why would someone play something to not have fun? This is not an esports. Whatever they are doing must be considered fun for them unless they are compulsive gamers or people who are still in denial that they bought a game they never enjoyed or no longer do.

Well this thread is insulting to the extreme.

Some of us enjoy playing the optimization game. I don’t understand this mentality that having good performance in a game makes you a bad person.

Crinn.7864:

Well this thread is insulting to the extreme.

Some of us enjoy playing the optimization game. I don’t understand this mentality that having good performance in a game makes you a bad person.

I have not seen one person imply that.

Yes, fun is subjective.

Yes, people play in very different ways for very different reasons.

Yes, there is nothing wrong with enjoying min-maxing or trying to be the best you can at the game.

The problem arose when Anet – which has always taken a very open and accessible approach with GW2 end game – decided that a cornerstone of their new end game model would be developed with a myopic focus on only those characters that enjoy min-maxing (or were lucky enough to play the chosen playstyles that make raids WAY easier).

Other games have shown us how easy it is to include raids in an accessible manner – one that gives multiple way to enjoy the story, the mechanics and the feel of the content. Anet – for what I assume are marketing reasons (wanting to tout “challenge”) took a much less friendly approach.

So, yes – fun is subjective. For THAT VERY REASON , end game content needs to be developed for a range of playstyles. It is imperative to the ongoing health of the game and its community. Anet, probably because of a shift in staff as people have left the company, have COMPLETELY FORGOTTEN THAT . It is time they remembered.

And – to clarify – by developed for a range of playstyles, I dont mean mode A for this player and mode B for an entirely different player. That is segmentation and fractures the community.

Blaeys.3102:

And – to clarify – by developed for a range of playstyles, I dont mean mode A for this player and mode B for an entirely different player. That is segmentation and fractures the community.

Have to disagree, vehemently, with this. I wouldn’t want to see more open world PvE added to PvP in order to ensure that open world PvE players’ playstyle is accommodated in PvP. Nor would I want to see Raid bosses added to PvP, nor PvP added to Dungeons, Raids, or open world PvE content. Diluting what makes each type of content appeal to its adherents, what makes it what it is, just ensures, in my opinion, that it is a watered down, unsatisfying version of that content type.

Ashen.2907:

Blaeys.3102:

And – to clarify – by developed for a range of playstyles, I dont mean mode A for this player and mode B for an entirely different player. That is segmentation and fractures the community.

Have to disagree, vehemently, with this. I wouldn’t want to see more open world PvE added to PvP in order to ensure that open world PvE players’ playstyle is accommodated in PvP. Nor would I want to see Raid bosses added to PvP, nor PvP added to Dungeons, Raids, or open world PvE content. Diluting what makes each type of content appeal to its adherents, what makes it what it is, just ensures, in my opinion, that it is a watered down, unsatisfying version of that content type.

Faulty comparison – and I think you know that.

Of course, Im not talking about blurring the lines between PVE and PVP. There are common sense factors that make that illogical. I didnt think it would be necessary to actually say that.

Within PVE, however, there is a need for cohesion – because of story, community and making sure everything fits together. Yes, challenging content can – and should – be part of the equation, but not at the price of exclusion. There is one – and only one – area of PVE where that is currently the case (because of an imbalanced meta and a reluctance to adapt). That is raids.

And because that part of the game is held up as key selling point of end game – in terms of both content and unique reward – it has become the focal point for division, both among current players and how the game is perceived by potential customers.

Ryou.2398:

Crinn.7864:

Well this thread is insulting to the extreme.

Some of us enjoy playing the optimization game. I don’t understand this mentality that having good performance in a game makes you a bad person.

I have not seen one person imply that.

Then you’ve missed all the passive aggressive hate being thrown towards people that “obsess over stats”

Crinn.7864:

Ryou.2398:

Crinn.7864:

Well this thread is insulting to the extreme.

Some of us enjoy playing the optimization game. I don’t understand this mentality that having good performance in a game makes you a bad person.

I have not seen one person imply that.

Then you’ve missed all the passive aggressive hate being thrown towards people that “obsess over stats”

If you feel insulted by general comments that were not directed specifically at you, then you are the one applying those comments to yourself. No one else did it to YOU.

If you enjoy optimization and don’t feel that you obsess over stats, then clearly those comments are NOT about you.

Djinn.9245:

If you enjoy optimization and don’t feel that you obsess over stats, then clearly those comments are NOT about you.

You do realize that most of the people complaining lump anyone who knows anything about buildcrafting as <insert passive-aggressive label>

Blaeys.3102:

Ashen.2907:

Blaeys.3102:

And – to clarify – by developed for a range of playstyles, I dont mean mode A for this player and mode B for an entirely different player. That is segmentation and fractures the community.

Have to disagree, vehemently, with this. I wouldn’t want to see more open world PvE added to PvP in order to ensure that open world PvE players’ playstyle is accommodated in PvP. Nor would I want to see Raid bosses added to PvP, nor PvP added to Dungeons, Raids, or open world PvE content. Diluting what makes each type of content appeal to its adherents, what makes it what it is, just ensures, in my opinion, that it is a watered down, unsatisfying version of that content type.

Faulty comparison – and I think you know that.

Of course, Im not talking about blurring the lines between PVE and PVP. There are common sense factors that make that illogical. I didnt think it would be necessary to actually say that.

Within PVE, however, there is a need for cohesion – because of story, community and making sure everything fits together. Yes, challenging content can – and should – be part of the equation, but not at the price of exclusion. There is one – and only one – area of PVE where that is currently the case (because of an imbalanced meta and a reluctance to adapt). That is raids.

And because that part of the game is held up as key selling point of end game – in terms of both content and unique reward – it has become the focal point for division, both among current players and how the game is perceived by potential customers.

Again, I disagree (also note that PvP/PvE blend was not the entirety of my objection). The divide between PvE and PvP is no more absolute or sacrosanct than the divide between content intended to please the hardest of hardcore and that intended to appeal to the most casual of casual.

I would not want to see Raid level encounters in open world PvE. Nor would I want content that my Ranger’s pet can complete without my participation, while I am AFK for example, in instanced content. What you are suggesting, in my opinion, is diluting or otherwise altering content aimed at players with specific playstyles into versions less effective, at fulfilling the desires of those for whom the content was intended, versions of itself.

I would rather see specialized content aimed at differing playstyles than attempts to homogenize existing content in the hope that a single piece of content can appeal to everyone.

Imagine the reactions of the people complaining about HoT difficulty if the expansion open world difficulty was on par with facing a raid boss.

Personally I am not a raider. The content is not aimed at me. There is, however, a vast majority of the game’s content that is. In my opinion asking for raids to have additional resources spent to modify them to allow for casual play should be accompanied by a request that the entirety of the game’s open world content have resources spent to add some extreme level of difficulty options. What would the content drought be like while redeveloping the entire game?

I understand where you are coming from, and laud your willingness and ability to express it so very clearly, I just, as a casual player, disagree.

Crinn.7864:

Djinn.9245:

If you enjoy optimization and don’t feel that you obsess over stats, then clearly those comments are NOT about you.

You do realize that most of the people complaining lump anyone who knows anything about buildcrafting as <insert passive-aggressive label>

I think people need to stop assuming that every opinion posted is some kind of veiled insult.

People enjoy the game in many different ways – and enjoying the math of the game doesn’t make anyone less of a player or some evil villain, just as enjoying the flavor and diversity of the game doesn’t make someone less important or skilled.

My point is – given that we have these divergent groups, a cornerstone of the endgame cannot be “set aside” for the sole enjoyment of one with no consideration of the others. That is where the animosity and nastiness begins and breeds – and that is something the developers can do something about.

Ryou.2398:

Crinn.7864:

Well this thread is insulting to the extreme.

Some of us enjoy playing the optimization game. I don’t understand this mentality that having good performance in a game makes you a bad person.

I have not seen one person imply that.

I would tend to agree. I’ve not seen anyone state or imply that enjoying min/maxing, and all the rest of the numbers part of the game, makes one a bad person.

I have seen it implied that enjoying the performance aspect of character building, etc makes one obsessive and, essentially, bad at, or not desiring of, having fun.

Greyraven.4258:

No one seems to want to have fun anymore. They are obsessed with numbers, averages, and metrics…

I mean the thread started off with an OP intended to diminish the preferences of others, to, essentially, describe others as being somehow wrong in their approach to the game. I mean a game exists to have fun. If playing the numbers part of the game means that one is not trying to have fun then one is not playing right. That is a significant part of the OP’s point in a nutshell. “Other people have fun differently than I do and that is disheartening.”

Greyraven.4258:

I’m a long time MMO player, I started with the UO beta, though the original GW will always be my favorite, I’m a solid GW2 player since launch. But one thing I have noticed over my years of gaming…….

No one seems to want to have fun anymore. They are obsessed with numbers, averages, and metrics…it’s like the games have become spreadsheet and parser simulations that have very little to do with going on an adventure with your friends. The vast majority conversations I have had in game haven’t been about the world, the story or what is happening it’s all been about the math behind the game and it’s disheartening.

I personally don’t want another statistics class, I want to meet new friends and have fun in a living breathing world…wasn’t that what the MMO Manefesto was about?

Years ago a guy named Jack Emmert created a MMo called City of Heroes and he didn’t want to originally show the math of the attacks, abilities and blocks….he was pretty much crucified for it and caved, but I understand his reasoning now. I can’t be the only one that feels this way can I?

Honestly this whole direction especially with the new raid has me more than a little bit sad.

/thread
you are not alone

I’ve always been more into the story/pve side of things, and I have fun doing that. I don’t know any of these players obsessed with stats because I avoid most of the game modes that house those kind of people.

I just find a small group of friends in game I get along with and hang out with them. Sometimes we’ll do dailies or help each other with achievements/story, sometimes we’ll do dungeons and fractals, other times we just run around like dorks doing nothing in particular.

Another thread that has turned to “i am pleb, raids too hard, struggle with difficulty, anet plz nerf, me wants leg armor, i paid for game so i wanna clear raids, i want to kill boss in nomads gear by pressing 1, i want a sandwhich, i want free LI’s,asc gear expensive, i skillclick because its my playstyle, rifle warrior best warrior, druid is crap anet gimme dps specialization, HoT is too hard pliz nerf, open tyria too hard plz nerf, dps golem too hard pliz nerf, toxic elitist kicked me from group cause celestial gear, dps meters are toxic, fractals are toxic, raids are toxic, dailies take too long,cant kill HoT HP’s cause i dont know anything about my class but it’s anet’s fault, i want story mode for LW cause its too hard, i want story mode for raids cause its too hard, this whole game is too hard, i cant find 5 more people, screw the group i play my way, im not entitled just dellusional, i cant lfg because i am a soloplayer in an MMO”

I stopped having fun with this game the day they nerfed all my engineer combat visuals for their #esports. We’d have had them back if Colin hadn’t left the company, but they did. I’m still furious about that.

Sold Out.7625:

I stopped having fun with this game the day they nerfed all my engineer combat visuals for their #esports. We’d have had them back if Colin hadn’t left the company, but they did. I’m still furious about that.

Colin promised a ton of things that never were delivered. Don’t assume this one would have been an exception.

Crinn.7864:

Djinn.9245:

If you enjoy optimization and don’t feel that you obsess over stats, then clearly those comments are NOT about you.

You do realize that most of the people complaining lump anyone who knows anything about buildcrafting as <insert passive-aggressive label>

“Obsess over” and “know anything about” are not remotely the same thing.

Ashen.2907:

Greyraven.4258:

No one seems to want to have fun anymore. They are obsessed with numbers, averages, and metrics…

I mean the thread started off with an OP intended to diminish the preferences of others, to, essentially, describe others as being somehow wrong in their approach to the game. I mean a game exists to have fun. If playing the numbers part of the game means that one is not trying to have fun then one is not playing right. That is a significant part of the OP’s point in a nutshell. “Other people have fun differently than I do and that is disheartening.”

I disagree. The last sentence of the paragraph you quote states the reason he deplores the obsession with numbers, et al:

" The vast majority conversations I have had in game haven’t been about the world, the story or what is happening it’s all been about the math behind the game and it’s disheartening."

He is saying that this “obsession” is spilling over onto HIS fun. He did not state that he doesn’t like that others are having fun differently.

Then he ends his post with “Honestly this whole direction especially with the new raid has me more than a little bit sad.” So he’s talking about the new emphasis on meta that raids has brought to the game spilling over into the rest of the game. Which is absolutely true. The introduction of raids to GW2 effects the entire game. And as someone who doesn’t raid and probably will never raid, I don’t see an upside to these changes for me. Only negative impact.

Djinn.9245:

Crinn.7864:

Ryou.2398:

Crinn.7864:

Well this thread is insulting to the extreme.

Some of us enjoy playing the optimization game. I don’t understand this mentality that having good performance in a game makes you a bad person.

I have not seen one person imply that.

Then you’ve missed all the passive aggressive hate being thrown towards people that “obsess over stats”

If you feel insulted by general comments that were not directed specifically at you, then you are the one applying those comments to yourself. No one else did it to YOU.

If you enjoy optimization and don’t feel that you obsess over stats, then clearly those comments are NOT about you.

Exactly. Passive agressive is way over used, do not use it if you really do not understand it, anything can be taken in a forum strangely you have no idea how people feel, the only thing I have seen is a concern for people pushing this attitude on everyone else, no one here said they have an issue with people who enjoy that style just keep it within your own guilds or recruit people and state you are only interested in meta groups.

zoomborg.9462:

Another thread that has turned to “i am pleb, raids too hard, struggle with difficulty, anet plz nerf, me wants leg armor, i paid for game so i wanna clear raids, i want to kill boss in nomads gear by pressing 1, i want a sandwhich, i want free LI’s,asc gear expensive, i skillclick because its my playstyle, rifle warrior best warrior, druid is crap anet gimme dps specialization, HoT is too hard pliz nerf, open tyria too hard plz nerf, dps golem too hard pliz nerf, toxic elitist kicked me from group cause celestial gear, dps meters are toxic, fractals are toxic, raids are toxic, dailies take too long,cant kill HoT HP’s cause i dont know anything about my class but it’s anet’s fault, i want story mode for LW cause its too hard, i want story mode for raids cause its too hard, this whole game is too hard, i cant find 5 more people, screw the group i play my way, im not entitled just dellusional, i cant lfg because i am a soloplayer in an MMO”

What? No, clearly we stated people should try for effective builds, there is viable and there is meta that is what you do not get, no one suggested we wanted easy mode, we want diversity, why do they have to think like you? Your proving the toxic crap right now by stereotyping people who want different playstyles when you really have no clue.

It is hypocritical for people like you to say we are entitled but somehow your entitled to complain about how others play and how they push it on others.

Conncept.7638:

This is a raiding game now, it’s no longer about “fun”, its a phallis measuring contest between the worst examples of gaming culture.

Harsh I know, but I hate this culture, EVERYONE hates this culture. And ANet advertised their raiding system as one everyone would be able to get into to some degree, preventing this elitist bullcrap.

Then raids finally released, and that was patently false from the off. And they just shrugged and decided they were okay with it; okay with content that appeal to and even fosters and grows the worst among us (and their hangers on), okay with releasing content for the 99% with 1/100th of the play time and rewards of content released for the 1%, and most of all okay with advertising one product and delivering a completely different one after they had already accepted payment based not on what they delivered but on what they falsely advertised.

I’m quite genuinely curious which game you are talking about. Seriously.

Because raiding in GW2 is nothing like you described. It’s more or less the polar opposite of that.

Our real hope now is that Anet is paying attention to both posts like this and the negative publicity they have received recently because of this topic.

Raids in the form they have implemented them have had negative repercussions on the game, imo. They have created a shift the culture and feel of the game in ways that leave some – including many day one and GW1 fans – feeling disenfranchised and concerned about future direction.

Anet has a history of paying attention to such things, and adapting content when necessary. I think this is definitely one of those times – and there are real changes they need to make in order to get this game back on the right track.