Guild Wars 2

Revolution.6301:

killcannon.2576:

Aedil.1296:

Paulytnz.7619:

I think that your problem is that you think you can “farm” in GW2. Honestly, Anet do NOT want people farming….

I would love to ask Anet and Paul how do u justify the existance of Magic Find sets of armor weapons sigils runes and food if Anet don’t want us to farm taking also in account the amount of money u need to create an MF set?

Anet said they don’t like grindy games, they said they don’t want us to farm, but looking at what do i have to do to get a full set of armor, or enough matherials for a legendary or to craft anything, i would say the opposite of that, and well fractals…just have no words about it many players already talked about it.

A LOT of items needs 250 ectos, 250 lodestones, cores, 250 t6 materials, to be upgraded or produced, wanna talk about the skills points too? u know how much gold u need to buy 250 kitten charged lodestones on the trading post? or the hours u need to farm just 1 with a full magic find set+weapon lucksigil+food?

I sincerly suggest the Anet team to watch again the “Anet Manifesto” couse gw2 is really not a game for Casual Players, unless they just think a casual players don’t deserve to have a satifying nice looking armor or weapon, or they just don’t deserve any exotic/ascended gear..

Last thing: people do not split only between
1 – who have time to spend playing on GW2 and nerding to get stuff
2 – who have money to spend on GW2 and buy gold with gems

There are also people who have no money and a lot of free time, too bad they have to spend most of it looking for a job they cannot find due to the infamous economical crisis (here in italy the country is down on the knees).

Sincerly

All the mats you listed are for cosmetic items, if you want to grind for cosmetics, go for it, if not…well then you don’t have to. No one is making you do it, it is player choice. The mindset that you should have cosmetic, RARE items handed to you is beyond entitled.

lets remain on topic peps.

His point is they should be more accessable. Not everyone has the time to grind several hours everyday. A simple solutition to this would be to include their drop with normal mob drop (they would still be rare but) atleast the price would not be so high.

If you wish to do a mods job, have kids.

RARE cosmetic items should not be easily accessible, that is what makes them RARE. If you don’t put the effort into it in some form, then you shouldn’t have it. None of the things that were listed impacts the ability to play the game in any way. The RARE cosmetic items are a way for people who play the game to show their dedication either in terms of game hours or money given to the devs so we can have even more content. Wanting it for free, for nothing other than showing up, is entitlement.

I did the grind in Orr while the gettin’ was good, now I just don’t bother playing.

I can’t believe I was so excited for this game less than a year ago, what a joke it has become.

killcannon.2576:

Revolution.6301:

killcannon.2576:

Aedil.1296:

Paulytnz.7619:

I think that your problem is that you think you can “farm” in GW2. Honestly, Anet do NOT want people farming….

I would love to ask Anet and Paul how do u justify the existance of Magic Find sets of armor weapons sigils runes and food if Anet don’t want us to farm taking also in account the amount of money u need to create an MF set?

Anet said they don’t like grindy games, they said they don’t want us to farm, but looking at what do i have to do to get a full set of armor, or enough matherials for a legendary or to craft anything, i would say the opposite of that, and well fractals…just have no words about it many players already talked about it.

A LOT of items needs 250 ectos, 250 lodestones, cores, 250 t6 materials, to be upgraded or produced, wanna talk about the skills points too? u know how much gold u need to buy 250 kitten charged lodestones on the trading post? or the hours u need to farm just 1 with a full magic find set+weapon lucksigil+food?

I sincerly suggest the Anet team to watch again the “Anet Manifesto” couse gw2 is really not a game for Casual Players, unless they just think a casual players don’t deserve to have a satifying nice looking armor or weapon, or they just don’t deserve any exotic/ascended gear..

Last thing: people do not split only between
1 – who have time to spend playing on GW2 and nerding to get stuff
2 – who have money to spend on GW2 and buy gold with gems

There are also people who have no money and a lot of free time, too bad they have to spend most of it looking for a job they cannot find due to the infamous economical crisis (here in italy the country is down on the knees).

Sincerly

All the mats you listed are for cosmetic items, if you want to grind for cosmetics, go for it, if not…well then you don’t have to. No one is making you do it, it is player choice. The mindset that you should have cosmetic, RARE items handed to you is beyond entitled.

lets remain on topic peps.

His point is they should be more accessable. Not everyone has the time to grind several hours everyday. A simple solutition to this would be to include their drop with normal mob drop (they would still be rare but) atleast the price would not be so high.

If you wish to do a mods job, have kids.

RARE cosmetic items should not be easily accessible, that is what makes them RARE. If you don’t put the effort into it in some form, then you shouldn’t have it. None of the things that were listed impacts the ability to play the game in any way. The RARE cosmetic items are a way for people who play the game to show their dedication either in terms of game hours or money given to the devs so we can have even more content. Wanting it for free, for nothing other than showing up, is entitlement.

its okay if you have an opinion but don’t derail the thread. Please and thank you.

Look he is not asking for them to be handed but more accessable. There is a difference. And this is about Orr. And how there should be more locations to grind.

We all need to raise awareness to this. Anet has shown to listen to us if enough speak up and this is clearly an issue that is detrimental to the game.

Revolution.6301:

killcannon.2576:

Revolution.6301:

killcannon.2576:

Aedil.1296:

Paulytnz.7619:

I think that your problem is that you think you can “farm” in GW2. Honestly, Anet do NOT want people farming….

I would love to ask Anet and Paul how do u justify the existance of Magic Find sets of armor weapons sigils runes and food if Anet don’t want us to farm taking also in account the amount of money u need to create an MF set?

Anet said they don’t like grindy games, they said they don’t want us to farm, but looking at what do i have to do to get a full set of armor, or enough matherials for a legendary or to craft anything, i would say the opposite of that, and well fractals…just have no words about it many players already talked about it.

A LOT of items needs 250 ectos, 250 lodestones, cores, 250 t6 materials, to be upgraded or produced, wanna talk about the skills points too? u know how much gold u need to buy 250 kitten charged lodestones on the trading post? or the hours u need to farm just 1 with a full magic find set+weapon lucksigil+food?

I sincerly suggest the Anet team to watch again the “Anet Manifesto” couse gw2 is really not a game for Casual Players, unless they just think a casual players don’t deserve to have a satifying nice looking armor or weapon, or they just don’t deserve any exotic/ascended gear..

Last thing: people do not split only between
1 – who have time to spend playing on GW2 and nerding to get stuff
2 – who have money to spend on GW2 and buy gold with gems

There are also people who have no money and a lot of free time, too bad they have to spend most of it looking for a job they cannot find due to the infamous economical crisis (here in italy the country is down on the knees).

Sincerly

All the mats you listed are for cosmetic items, if you want to grind for cosmetics, go for it, if not…well then you don’t have to. No one is making you do it, it is player choice. The mindset that you should have cosmetic, RARE items handed to you is beyond entitled.

lets remain on topic peps.

His point is they should be more accessable. Not everyone has the time to grind several hours everyday. A simple solutition to this would be to include their drop with normal mob drop (they would still be rare but) atleast the price would not be so high.

If you wish to do a mods job, have kids.

RARE cosmetic items should not be easily accessible, that is what makes them RARE. If you don’t put the effort into it in some form, then you shouldn’t have it. None of the things that were listed impacts the ability to play the game in any way. The RARE cosmetic items are a way for people who play the game to show their dedication either in terms of game hours or money given to the devs so we can have even more content. Wanting it for free, for nothing other than showing up, is entitlement.

its okay if you have an opinion but don’t derail the thread. Please and thank you.

Look he is not asking for them to be handed but more accessable. There is a difference. And this is about Orr. And how there should be more locations to grind.

You quoted the post saying that it was an example of “getting it” “what is was about”. at no point in that post was anything mentioned about the aesthetics of Orr. So..which is it, aesthetics or the grind itself? If it is just the aesthetics, then I agree with you. Need more level 80 open world zones, regardless of grind or any other concerns. If it is the grind itself, then my other post stands.
You opened the door to my replies by quoting the post I referenced.

killcannon.2576:

Revolution.6301:

killcannon.2576:

Revolution.6301:

killcannon.2576:

Aedil.1296:

Paulytnz.7619:

I think that your problem is that you think you can “farm” in GW2. Honestly, Anet do NOT want people farming….

I would love to ask Anet and Paul how do u justify the existance of Magic Find sets of armor weapons sigils runes and food if Anet don’t want us to farm taking also in account the amount of money u need to create an MF set?

Anet said they don’t like grindy games, they said they don’t want us to farm, but looking at what do i have to do to get a full set of armor, or enough matherials for a legendary or to craft anything, i would say the opposite of that, and well fractals…just have no words about it many players already talked about it.

A LOT of items needs 250 ectos, 250 lodestones, cores, 250 t6 materials, to be upgraded or produced, wanna talk about the skills points too? u know how much gold u need to buy 250 kitten charged lodestones on the trading post? or the hours u need to farm just 1 with a full magic find set+weapon lucksigil+food?

I sincerly suggest the Anet team to watch again the “Anet Manifesto” couse gw2 is really not a game for Casual Players, unless they just think a casual players don’t deserve to have a satifying nice looking armor or weapon, or they just don’t deserve any exotic/ascended gear..

Last thing: people do not split only between
1 – who have time to spend playing on GW2 and nerding to get stuff
2 – who have money to spend on GW2 and buy gold with gems

There are also people who have no money and a lot of free time, too bad they have to spend most of it looking for a job they cannot find due to the infamous economical crisis (here in italy the country is down on the knees).

Sincerly

All the mats you listed are for cosmetic items, if you want to grind for cosmetics, go for it, if not…well then you don’t have to. No one is making you do it, it is player choice. The mindset that you should have cosmetic, RARE items handed to you is beyond entitled.

lets remain on topic peps.

His point is they should be more accessable. Not everyone has the time to grind several hours everyday. A simple solutition to this would be to include their drop with normal mob drop (they would still be rare but) atleast the price would not be so high.

If you wish to do a mods job, have kids.

RARE cosmetic items should not be easily accessible, that is what makes them RARE. If you don’t put the effort into it in some form, then you shouldn’t have it. None of the things that were listed impacts the ability to play the game in any way. The RARE cosmetic items are a way for people who play the game to show their dedication either in terms of game hours or money given to the devs so we can have even more content. Wanting it for free, for nothing other than showing up, is entitlement.

its okay if you have an opinion but don’t derail the thread. Please and thank you.

Look he is not asking for them to be handed but more accessable. There is a difference. And this is about Orr. And how there should be more locations to grind.

You quoted the post saying that it was an example of “getting it” “what is was about”. at no point in that post was anything mentioned about the aesthetics of Orr. So..which is it, aesthetics or the grind itself? If it is just the aesthetics, then I agree with you. Need more level 80 open world zones, regardless of grind or any other concerns. If it is the grind itself, then my other post stands.
You opened the door to my replies by quoting the post I referenced.

Wow, well I was in the wrong then. Sorry.
Your right the post is just about Orr.

No need to be sorry, I should have clarified my posts much earlier than what I did. You are correct regardless, there should be more high level zones, here’s to hoping they put them in over the next few content patches, or that their revamp of lower level rewards goes well.

People have become well and truly spoiled when it comes to mmos these days. The sense of entitlement especially when they feel that gear is their ‘right’ to have with minimal effort is a terrible mindset that was bred by the casual catering easy mode grindfest known as WoW.

You don’t need to grind in this game. Doing so is not optimal because it’s done intentionally as a way to discourage it. Play what you want to have fun. A concept most seem to have long since forgotten. The gear will come. And here’s the best part there isn’t a gear treadmill. Not playing for a couple weeks doesn’t put you behind the curve. You can mention ascended gear but the stat gain isn’t really that large. It’s terribly minor and the effort needed to achieve ascended gear more then makes up for the rather moderate stat ‘advantage’… which having 50 more points of stats at 80 really isn’t game breaking.

No rare cosmetic items should not be made more accessible. They are rare cosmetic items meant to be earned through hard work to show off your dedication. A personal achievement. Hence legendary weapons only being a skin more or less.

I play what I want, when I want. I enjoy wvw so I play that, I do dungeons with friends, I do spvp and I’ll help friends level alts or level my own. Never once did I grind an area for hours on end. Sometimes I’ll go a week without playing, sometimes I’ll play hardcore. The bottom line is I’m almost done with my legendary. And I haven’t done a grind even once.

It took me a week of doing dungeons casually to get a full exotic set with my chosen stats. And an additional week to make it look as I wanted cosmetically. You do not need to grind at all. Doing so is simply a foolish waste of time. The special items are meant to be special and achieved through tremendous effort because… here is the kicker. Gear doesn’t matter and getting full exotics is easy just playing casually.

The only thing I can anet needs to adjust which they said they are. Is balancing the rewards across game modes. WvW v Dungeons v Karma v Events ect. And they already said they had plans underway for such things.

Yes, we need more level 80 zones. But many of you seem to have forgotten how MMO’s operate. They come in time, with new content either patches or expansions. Apparently no one remembers there only being one ‘end game’ zone in other MMO’s such as WoW. And those zones ARE total grind fests which are… mandatory.

I have bitter memories of silithus desert in vanilla WoW… among other things. And it hasn’t gotten any better you just get a new ‘end zone’ every new content patch there.

Anet already said they plan on balancing rewards in the various game modes so seriously chill. You don’t need to grind Orr for anything. I certainly haven’t. And we’ll get new content soon enough.

Mesiphidon.8324:

People have become well and truly spoiled when it comes to mmos these days. The sense of entitlement especially when they feel that gear is their ‘right’ to have with minimal effort is a terrible mindset that was bred by the casual catering easy mode grindfest known as WoW.

You don’t need to grind in this game. Doing so is not optimal because it’s done intentionally as a way to discourage it. Play what you want to have fun. A concept most seem to have long since forgotten. The gear will come. And here’s the best part there isn’t a gear treadmill. Not playing for a couple weeks doesn’t put you behind the curve. You can mention ascended gear but the stat gain isn’t really that large. It’s terribly minor and the effort needed to achieve ascended gear more then makes up for the rather moderate stat ‘advantage’… which having 50 more points of stats at 80 really isn’t game breaking.

No rare cosmetic items should not be made more accessible. They are rare cosmetic items meant to be earned through hard work to show off your dedication. A personal achievement. Hence legendary weapons only being a skin more or less.

I play what I want, when I want. I enjoy wvw so I play that, I do dungeons with friends, I do spvp and I’ll help friends level alts or level my own. Never once did I grind an area for hours on end. Sometimes I’ll go a week without playing, sometimes I’ll play hardcore. The bottom line is I’m almost done with my legendary. And I haven’t done a grind even once.

It took me a week of doing dungeons casually to get a full exotic set with my chosen stats. And an additional week to make it look as I wanted cosmetically. You do not need to grind at all. Doing so is simply a foolish waste of time. The special items are meant to be special and achieved through tremendous effort because… here is the kicker. Gear doesn’t matter and getting full exotics is easy just playing casually.

The only thing I can anet needs to adjust which they said they are. Is balancing the rewards across game modes. WvW v Dungeons v Karma v Events ect. And they already said they had plans underway for such things.

Yes, we need more level 80 zones. But many of you seem to have forgotten how MMO’s operate. They come in time, with new content either patches or expansions. Apparently no one remembers there only being one ‘end game’ zone in other MMO’s such as WoW. And those zones ARE total grind fests which are… mandatory.

I have bitter memories of silithus desert in vanilla WoW… among other things. And it hasn’t gotten any better you just get a new ‘end zone’ every new content patch there.

Anet already said they plan on balancing rewards in the various game modes so seriously chill. You don’t need to grind Orr for anything. I certainly haven’t. And we’ll get new content soon enough.

The point is Anet should have easily forseen this. What has happened is quite logical, and not at all shocking. There should’ve already been more then 1 area to grind, but my point is, is the very area they chose to grind is a bleak, dead zone.

GW2… literally the ONLY game in history where the players ARE MAD that everyone isnt equal.

Your serious? Your mad that someone better than you, with more time spent, and an overall better grasp of mechanics HAS BETTER gear than you? Are you serious?

This game needs rewards, and NOT SKINS. If your banging out FotM lvl 30 with an amazing premade group… (which im nowhere near) then yes, YOU deserve more gold, better items, cooler skins… whatever.

How does someone having more gold, or better items, or cooler skins than YOU, directly hurt YOUR game play? Good lord GW2… grow up.

ATTHWSM.7840:

GW2… literally the ONLY game in history where the players ARE MAD that everyone isnt equal.

Your serious? Your mad that someone better than you, with more time spent, and an overall better grasp of mechanics HAS BETTER gear than you? Are you serious?

This game needs rewards, and NOT SKINS. If your banging out FotM lvl 30 with an amazing premade group… (which im nowhere near) then yes, YOU deserve more gold, better items, cooler skins… whatever.

How does someone having more gold, or better items, or cooler skins than YOU, directly hurt YOUR game play? Good lord GW2… grow up.

Well to be fair in terms of gear power and stats GW2 was marketed as a game where achieving the ceiling is relatively easy and grind-free. As opposed to many other MMO games where you need to constantly grind to not fall behind the gear curve. This is how GW1 worked and this is how GW2 is working for the most part. I am a bit confused about the pink gear casus but we shall see what A.net will do about that this year.

Now as for OP and his complain that this game is grindy. Yes, in some way it is. GW1 also had some extreme grinds. But there is a key difference from, lets say, WoW grind. You dont have to do it in order to remain competetive. The grind for legendary weapon is extreme but what shall you get for completing it other than nice skin and an achievement? Nothing. Or at least nothing that, if not completed, would get you stomped in PvE or PvP. Therefore, as some people in this thread already mentioned, start enjoying the game. Dont focus only on things that provide best gold/karma/items per hour. Focus on things that you think would be fun to do at this particular moment and dont think if it will bring you less gold than farming Orr. I play GW2 in this way and even though I spent a lot of time with it, I am not bored and I am looking for more. I would quit months ago if all I would do would be farming skeletons in Orr.

Revolution.6301:

The point is Anet should have easily forseen this. What has happened is quite logical, and not at all shocking. There should’ve already been more then 1 area to grind, but my point is, is the very area they chose to grind is a bleak, dead zone.

… So an area based on the theme of risen dead creatures in service to an undead dragon in the wasteland of a once magnificent empire is a bleak grey zone… You don’t say.

As to it being dead? Maybe it’s your server, the event chains in Orr here are fairly populated. The random out there parts though can be abandoned from time to time. Because well… you don’t need too and shouldn’t be grinding ‘one spot’ there. It’s really not hard to get in or find a group or ‘the group’ doing the event chains. The temples especially.

Thing is most people do the chain once or a few times then go do… other things in the world, as you were meant to do.

In a matter of a couple hours you could do some orr events kill a dragon or two and even run a dungeon if you’re so inclined. And your return on time invested for items/loot/karma/exp ect would be significantly greater then grinding one spot over and over. The game is designed this way.

In short branch out go do things. -Enjoy- the game and stop playing GW2 like WoW and thinking you need or even should be grinding. All that aside… I can’t even think of a reason you would need or want to grind Orr.

And my final point is. They shouldn’t be trying to grind Orr or anyplace at all. The game is designed to keep you from grinding. So complaining about grinding in Orr isn’t even a relevant complaint.

Mesiphidon.8324:

Revolution.6301:

The point is Anet should have easily forseen this. What has happened is quite logical, and not at all shocking. There should’ve already been more then 1 area to grind, but my point is, is the very area they chose to grind is a bleak, dead zone.

… So an area based on the theme of risen dead creatures in service to an undead dragon in the wasteland of a once magnificent empire is a bleak grey zone… You don’t say.

As to it being dead? Maybe it’s your server, the event chains in Orr here are fairly populated. The random out there parts though can be abandoned from time to time. Because well… you don’t need too and shouldn’t be grinding ‘one spot’ there. It’s really not hard to get in or find a group or ‘the group’ doing the event chains. The temples especially.

Thing is most people do the chain once or a few times then go do… other things in the world, as you were meant to do.

In a matter of a couple hours you could do some orr events kill a dragon or two and even run a dungeon if you’re so inclined. And your return on time invested for items/loot/karma/exp ect would be significantly greater then grinding one spot over and over. The game is designed this way.

In short branch out go do things. -Enjoy- the game and stop playing GW2 like WoW and thinking you need or even should be grinding. All that aside… I can’t even think of a reason you would need or want to grind Orr.

And my final point is. They shouldn’t be trying to grind Orr or anyplace at all. The game is designed to keep you from grinding. So complaining about grinding in Orr isn’t even a relevant complaint.

you missed my point. By dead it LOOKS dead. No of course there are people there, but the area looks dead hence there are no trees, rolling hills nothing!

As I said… its a zone based on the theme of risen undead servants to a dragon in the wasteland of an Empire. So yes it’s going to look dead. The zone is meant to be a wasteland.

You really are bouncing all over. If you don’t like the aesthetics of the zone… then go to another place man. There is no reason to stay in Orr and grind you don’t like it there. Grinding is useless so just go to a zone activity you enjoy.

Players know that the biggest joke of the game is that :
1) They demotivates you to grind.
2) The end-game carrots and rewards requires you to grind.

They kept nerfing ways for you to earn golds.
It’s no longer possible for you to earn 1 gold per hour now.

I have to be honest.
GW2 end-game mechanic are far worst than traditional mmorpgs.
In traditional mmorpg, when you grind, you feel it’s worth it.
In GW2, there’s no point of grinding except extra gold.

Naoko.7096:

I have to be honest.
GW2 end-game mechanic are far worst than traditional mmorpgs.
In traditional mmorpg, when you grind, you feel it’s worth it.
In GW2, there’s no point of grinding except extra gold.

Again I shall disagree. In “traditional mmorpgs” if you dont grind, you will fail to keep up with adequate power curve and in the end have problems with finding people wanting to play with you. I spent thousands of hours grinding in WoW and thanks to that my gear was always good, I was able to do good DPS/healing/whatever thanks to that. I felt pressure to grind. If would stop, I would quickly fall from the special snowflake podium. In GW2 I do not feel this pressure. I see this as a good thing.

Wow…lol uh where to start with the latest batch of kittens. First of all the OP isn’t wrong, there needs to be more level 80 zones, I’m sure they are working on it, but currently it’s the truth. I go there everyday for a couple hours, run the event chains, chop some trees, etc etc. it’s the only place to get a reliable amount of T5 and T6 mats easily, Frostgorge is nice, but it doesn’t have quite as reliable a drop and mat farm rate as Orr. Grinding isn’t useless (gold, mats, armor drops, weapon drops), it’s how you get money, and stuff. If you actually want to craft (which you need to do to get achievements, some parts of the Legendary, just because you want to) you are going to have to grind eventually, or pay money to get stuff off the tp with gold from grinding or buying it. He isn’t complaining about the grind, just the area, and the area is pretty same-y. After awhile you start to memorize everything and one blue/brown/reefy place starts to bleed into the next Blue/brown/reefy place (seriously…water…give it a rest, it’s a friggin pain) He doesn’t want to be entitled, he wants to grind for his mats or gold or whatever. Grinding is a choice true (especially in this game), but it is a valid choice for a game, some people like it, it is a core feature of the mmo genre. I honestly think people would not play a mmo that didn’t have some form of it. And the grind here is more than worth it. You can clear five gold a day easy just farming Orr for a couple hours, or get rares to throw into the Mystic Forge, or de them for ectos.

The OP is not wrong in his statements, Orr is ugh after awhile, and we need some additional level 80 areas. He did what he should do, brought his concerns to the forum so the devs can read them. I am pretty sure they are working on it, but it doesn’t hurt to let them know when there are valid concerns either.

kinda sorta have to farm, no matter how much arena net hates it. I am trying to make the legendary staff and so many mats to get

killcannon.2576:

Wow…lol uh where to start with the latest batch of kittens. First of all the OP isn’t wrong, there needs to be more level 80 zones, I’m sure they are working on it, but currently it’s the truth. I go there everyday for a couple hours, run the event chains, chop some trees, etc etc. it’s the only place to get a reliable amount of T5 and T6 mats easily, Frostgorge is nice, but it doesn’t have quite as reliable a drop and mat farm rate as Orr. Grinding isn’t useless (gold, mats, armor drops, weapon drops), it’s how you get money, and stuff. If you actually want to craft (which you need to do to get achievements, some parts of the Legendary, just because you want to) you are going to have to grind eventually, or pay money to get stuff off the tp with gold from grinding or buying it. He isn’t complaining about the grind, just the area, and the area is pretty same-y. After awhile you start to memorize everything and one blue/brown/reefy place starts to bleed into the next Blue/brown/reefy place (seriously…water…give it a rest, it’s a friggin pain) He doesn’t want to be entitled, he wants to grind for his mats or gold or whatever. Grinding is a choice true (especially in this game), but it is a valid choice for a game, some people like it, it is a core feature of the mmo genre. I honestly think people would not play a mmo that didn’t have some form of it. And the grind here is more than worth it. You can clear five gold a day easy just farming Orr for a couple hours, or get rares to throw into the Mystic Forge, or de them for ectos.

The OP is not wrong in his statements, Orr is ugh after awhile, and we need some additional level 80 areas. He did what he should do, brought his concerns to the forum so the devs can read them. I am pretty sure they are working on it, but it doesn’t hurt to let them know when there are valid concerns either.

Grind doesn’t make up a game since effectively all games that are an RPG in some form have grind (even Dark Souls) but its how its applied is what makes or breaks game.

My friend and I yesturday was discussing on how detailed and intricate the game world looks but you are stuck in a city (LA) or the island (Orr). The devs put so much detail into the game it seems wasteful for those 2 areas to be the areas people are at the most. I was just looking around the beginning area and was struck by the level of detail they put into it.

All of us just want to see the world be put the use to its fullest, only less then 10% of it.

Revolution.6301:

Grind doesn’t make up a game since effectively all games that are an RPG in some form have grind (even Dark Souls) but its how its applied is what makes or breaks game.

My friend and I yesturday was discussing on how detailed and intricate the game world looks but you are stuck in a city (LA) or the island (Orr). The devs put so much detail into the game it seems wasteful for those 2 areas to be the areas people are at the most. I was just looking around the beginning area and was struck by the level of detail they put into it.

All of us just want to see the world be put the use to its fullest, only less then 10% of it.

The solution is easy and was already implemented in GW1. Hard mode. In GW1 you could enter to every single zone in game with hard mode toggled. Same thing could be done in GW2 where every zone could have a mirror version filled with level 80 mobs, events and resource nodes. Perhaps it will happen one day. HM was added to GW1 few years after game release and it brought some life back into it. Might be the case for GW2 in the future.

Awe.1096:

Revolution.6301:

Grind doesn’t make up a game since effectively all games that are an RPG in some form have grind (even Dark Souls) but its how its applied is what makes or breaks game.

My friend and I yesturday was discussing on how detailed and intricate the game world looks but you are stuck in a city (LA) or the island (Orr). The devs put so much detail into the game it seems wasteful for those 2 areas to be the areas people are at the most. I was just looking around the beginning area and was struck by the level of detail they put into it.

All of us just want to see the world be put the use to its fullest, only less then 10% of it.

The solution is easy and was already implemented in GW1. Hard mode. In GW1 you could enter to every single zone in game with hard mode toggled. Same thing could be done in GW2 where every zone could have a mirror version filled with level 80 mobs, events and resource nodes. Perhaps it will happen one day. HM was added to GW1 few years after game release and it brought some life back into it. Might be the case for GW2 in the future.

that would be difficult since unlike guildwars this game is not ‘instanced’. No comepletly different animals + if you make a hardmore orr then the Tunnel grind will still be better.

OMG who is forcing you to grind it? Seriously I’m doing the right thing only checking forums once per week cus its same melody from the same trumpet like in every other mmo, by people who somehow feel forced to do something they dont like. Its not a job, who is preventing you from going to other areas, exploring? If you are rushing for legendary or whatever, thats your own fault, nobody is telling you to do that but you, so just deal with it without spreading your .. to public.

“Grind”
Whats to grind?

The gear ‘skins’ are optional. Many players boast that they are earning 1-5G a day. A toon can be outfitted in full Exotic gear for <20G. (so the ‘whine’ is about 1w-1m of playing the game?)

I just leveled a Ranger and have only done AC+CM (Story mode). I’m currently working on map completion. EGADS! Some of those maps are hard to find/get to everything! Meanwhile I have to fight my way to/from everything! So many hearts, POI, VP’s, WP’s its taking me a few evenings in each area. This is going to take forever to complete everything!

EGADS!! Anet! There’s simply TO MUCH CONTENT!! I can’t “finish” the game in one sitting! (jk)

Anet gives all players two choices on getting gold: A) Play the game or Buy gems.

Take your pick.

Awe.1096:

Revolution.6301:

Grind doesn’t make up a game since effectively all games that are an RPG in some form have grind (even Dark Souls) but its how its applied is what makes or breaks game.

My friend and I yesturday was discussing on how detailed and intricate the game world looks but you are stuck in a city (LA) or the island (Orr). The devs put so much detail into the game it seems wasteful for those 2 areas to be the areas people are at the most. I was just looking around the beginning area and was struck by the level of detail they put into it.

All of us just want to see the world be put the use to its fullest, only less then 10% of it.

The solution is easy and was already implemented in GW1. Hard mode. In GW1 you could enter to every single zone in game with hard mode toggled. Same thing could be done in GW2 where every zone could have a mirror version filled with level 80 mobs, events and resource nodes. Perhaps it will happen one day. HM was added to GW1 few years after game release and it brought some life back into it. Might be the case for GW2 in the future.

While not being a popular idea among the more ‘ego centric’ players the easy and surefire solution is to simply TURN UP the dynamic down scaling so that its more effective.

If Anet simply LOOKED to see what the average Lvl30/40/50/60/70 player actually was outfitted with and DEF/DPS stats they are actually capable of they’d find that their current amount of down scaling is hopelessly ineffective in making lower level areas interesting to ‘end game players’ outfitted with the best gear available.

Then again nothings stopping a EGP from ditching their ‘god gear’ and picking up Lvl20 centric gear to play Lvl20 content ether.

MaRko.3165:

“Grind”
Whats to grind?

I LOL when I see this on an MMO, any MMO. I can’t help it. I just disagree with the whole “There is no such thing as farming/grind in GW2.” People in this camp love to give advice. Their number one piece for avoiding “grind” in a game is to “play the game the way you want to” and “just have fun.”

Terrific! Fabulous advice! Play the game the way you want to! Okay, let’s take one tiny example of me doing just that: playing the game the way I want to. I’m a crafter. I love crafting. I have them all. GW2 is especially fun for crafters because we get to do something called “discovering” recipes. As a crafter, part of the “fun” is to discover my recipes in a given discipline.

Let’s just take jeweler, for example. I’m having fun discovering my recipes and lo and behold, I come to a few sets of jewelry involving passion flowers. Passion flowers are great! Added to the game during The Lost Shores and found in the sunny, sensational isle called Southsun Cove. Stupendous! Remember, my advice for “playing the game right” is to “just have fun” and “play the game the way you want to.”

When I ask the “grinding is nonexistent” crowd exactly how I accomplish these 2 things, the answer is a simple: “You just earn money and materials via a casual play through of your characters.” Again, super advice! I love it. I’m a casual player, so hey! I’m good at the whole “casual playthrough” bit. This should be easy, right?

I have three 80s. Each of them did a “casual playthrough” of Southsun Cove, meaning that for each of them I spent from 2-4 hours exploring the map, collecting all the resources I could find, killing the enemies I encountered, doing as many DEs as I could actually solo (no one is really out there), and filling in my map. That is what entailed a “casual playthrough” for me. Doing this on three different characters, I got a total of 3 passion flowers. Pretty little things if you like pink and all.

Back to me having fun playing the game the way I want to via a casual playthrough. My remaining jewelry recipes involve my getting my grubby little pixelated hands on a grand total of 270 passion flowers. As a crafter, I usually do what I can to get my own materials for crafting rather than buy them off the TP. But 270 passion flowers?!

I have acquired 3 by “playing the game the way I want to” and “having fun” and “doing a casual playthrough.” Right now, I’m just not sure how to follow this stellar advice and still get enough passion flowers to discover my remaining jeweler recipes. Something we’ve already established that I do because it’s “fun.”

So, therefore, my options are these:

1. Farm/grind out the necessary passion flowers to discover my recipes. But wait, farming and grinding don’t exist in this game, so that’s out.

2. Buy the passion flowers on the TP. Passion flowers are currently going for 55s each. I would need in the vicinity of 150 gold just for the discovery of these few recipes. Since I have nowhere near 150 gold after leveling 3 characters to 80 in the last 5 months, this presents yet another problem:

3. Farm/grind the gold to buy the passion flowers. But again, farming/grinding doesn’t exist, so that’s out.

4. Ummm…any ideas on me still having fun and playing the game the way I want to and doing a casual playthrough and getting my passion flowers? How many character slots am I going to need to buy from the gems store if I’m averaging 3 passion flowers per 5 months and 3 completely leveled characters so I can do more “casual playthroughs” to get what I need to keep having “fun?”

TL;DR: Sometimes “casual playing” and “playing the game the way you want to” collides with “farming/grinding.” Yes, even in GW2.

Celtic Lady.3729:

-snip-

This poster nailed it.

This is why I scoff when people claim that there’s no grinding in GW2, because there most certainly is. Leveling a craft is grinding. Getting money at any rate beyond a snail’s pace is grinding. Getting materials is grinding. Running dailies is grinding. Doing JPs is grinding. Doing anything beyond Lvl 80 is a grind of some sort.

Grinding doesn’t mean “activity that you do over and over even though it’s not fun”, it means “any repetitive task, usually performed for the sake of rewards”. There are plenty of grinds in GW2.

And the common response to this is always “but all those things are optional”.

• JPs are optional.
• Legendaries and Ascended items are optional.
• Fractals and all dungeons are optional.
• WvW is optional.
• sPvP is optional.
• Crafting is optional.
• Achievements are optional.

And so on. To which I say….well, yes, all of those things are optional in the broadest sense of the term, in that no one is forcing you to do them.

However, in order to “play the game you want to” and “have fun”, many of these tasks are most certainly not optional. If going after max crafting is something you enjoy doing, you’ll be grinding to get there. If you have fun killing Orrians, you’re grinding. If you enjoy dungeon runs on a regular basis, you’re grinding. If you like Southsun Cove and go there regularly, you’re grinding. Avid WvW players are grinding, and so are sPvP players. Are you an Achievement hog? Then you’re grinding. There is no activity in the entire game that does not demand some form of repetition in order to continue “enjoying it” and “playing the game the way you want to”.

Grinding is merely defined as repetition. And there is plenty of repetition in GW2, no matter what activities you enjoy doing. The question you should be asking is not if there is grind in GW2 or not (because there is), the real question is “at what point is my grinding no longer fun?”, and that depends on the person. But for a game that proclaimed itself a “zero grind” game, it’s nowhere near being devoid of grind. And things like the weaker loot tables and in-game penalties applied to anyone who tries to farm an event only make the situation even worse.

Red Falcon.8257:

It’s funny that GW2 is “extremely grindy” yet somehow I managed to pull of 5 lvl 80s with max gear without grinding once nor buying gems.

People ignore things, play wrong, blame the game. Oh well.

I think a lot of people have begun to forget just how horrid other games are with grind. We got spoiled with the easy leveling and gearing up to 80 and now they still expect the same instant handouts. And yeah I agree, while I’m not trying to demonize anyone or put them down, people really do need to realize it’s not the game making it grindy, it’s them.

Legendaries aside, but they said outright those would be hard to get, so there ya go.

Revolution.6301:

Awe.1096:

The solution is easy and was already implemented in GW1. Hard mode. In GW1 you could enter to every single zone in game with hard mode toggled. Same thing could be done in GW2 where every zone could have a mirror version filled with level 80 mobs, events and resource nodes. Perhaps it will happen one day. HM was added to GW1 few years after game release and it brought some life back into it. Might be the case for GW2 in the future.

that would be difficult since unlike guildwars this game is not ‘instanced’. No comepletly different animals + if you make a hardmore orr then the Tunnel grind will still be better.

Oh but it is instanced. Each time you enter a different zone you have a loading screen. You could simply make two different versions of each zone hiding behind that loading screen. Normal one and hard one. Also as for Orr, perhaps the hard Orr would be better in terms of profit per hour but not overwhelmingly better. Right now if you go to for example Metrica Province, you will not find there orichalcum nodes or top tier crafting mats dropping from mobs. No chance for lv80 yellow drops as well. In hard Metrica Province you would see those. And if hard Orr would provide 10% better yield? Honestly? I would not give a kitten

Awe.1096:

Revolution.6301:

Awe.1096:

The solution is easy and was already implemented in GW1. Hard mode. In GW1 you could enter to every single zone in game with hard mode toggled. Same thing could be done in GW2 where every zone could have a mirror version filled with level 80 mobs, events and resource nodes. Perhaps it will happen one day. HM was added to GW1 few years after game release and it brought some life back into it. Might be the case for GW2 in the future.

that would be difficult since unlike guildwars this game is not ‘instanced’. No comepletly different animals + if you make a hardmore orr then the Tunnel grind will still be better.

Oh but it is instanced. Each time you enter a different zone you have a loading screen. You could simply make two different versions of each zone hiding behind that loading screen. Normal one and hard one. Also as for Orr, perhaps the hard Orr would be better in terms of profit per hour but not overwhelmingly better. Right now if you go to for example Metrica Province, you will not find there orichalcum nodes or top tier crafting mats dropping from mobs. No chance for lv80 yellow drops as well. In hard Metrica Province you would see those. And if hard Orr would provide 10% better yield? Honestly? I would not give a kitten

Not sure why people compare GW1 to GW2. One was an online rpg, the other a mmo. The things that work in one won’t necessarily work in the other. In order to make instanced zones for hard mode you essentially have to double the server load (probably less than double) and for what exactly? So people get better stuff. To play less. A mmo is made to a large extent to get people to play more, not less. It would also move even more people out of the high level zones, where people say there aren’t enough already. So two problems right out of the gate, and I spent five minutes thinking about it.

critickitten.1498:

Celtic Lady.3729:

-snip-

This poster nailed it.

This is why I scoff when people claim that there’s no grinding in GW2, because there most certainly is. Leveling a craft is grinding. Getting money at any rate beyond a snail’s pace is grinding. Getting materials is grinding. Running dailies is grinding. Doing JPs is grinding. Doing anything beyond Lvl 80 is a grind of some sort.

Grinding doesn’t mean “activity that you do over and over even though it’s not fun”, it means “any repetitive task, usually performed for the sake of rewards”. There are plenty of grinds in GW2.

And the common response to this is always “but all those things are optional”.

• JPs are optional.
• Legendaries and Ascended items are optional.
• Fractals and all dungeons are optional.
• WvW is optional.
• sPvP is optional.
• Crafting is optional.
• Achievements are optional.

And so on. To which I say….well, yes, all of those things are optional in the broadest sense of the term, in that no one is forcing you to do them.

However, in order to “play the game you want to” and “have fun”, many of these tasks are most certainly not optional. If going after max crafting is something you enjoy doing, you’ll be grinding to get there. If you have fun killing Orrians, you’re grinding. If you enjoy dungeon runs on a regular basis, you’re grinding. If you like Southsun Cove and go there regularly, you’re grinding. Avid WvW players are grinding, and so are sPvP players. Are you an Achievement hog? Then you’re grinding. There is no activity in the entire game that does not demand some form of repetition in order to continue “enjoying it” and “playing the game the way you want to”.

Grinding is merely defined as repetition. And there is plenty of repetition in GW2, no matter what activities you enjoy doing. The question you should be asking is not if there is grind in GW2 or not (because there is), the real question is “at what point is my grinding no longer fun?”, and that depends on the person. But for a game that proclaimed itself a “zero grind” game, it’s nowhere near being devoid of grind. And things like the weaker loot tables and in-game penalties applied to anyone who tries to farm an event only make the situation even worse.

Grinding is repetition….by this definition anything and everything you do is grinding. Games, watching tv, showering, sex (lol), brushing your teeth, spending time with friends, Christmas. Grinding is subjective, and to be able to apply the term to an activity, that activity needs to have negative connotations to the person doing the activity. Otherwise, it’s just playing, or relaxing.

critickitten.1498:

Celtic Lady.3729:

-snip-

This poster nailed it.

This is why I scoff when people claim that there’s no grinding in GW2, because there most certainly is. Leveling a craft is grinding. Getting money at any rate beyond a snail’s pace is grinding. Getting materials is grinding. Running dailies is grinding. Doing JPs is grinding. Doing anything beyond Lvl 80 is a grind of some sort.

Grinding doesn’t mean “activity that you do over and over even though it’s not fun”, it means “any repetitive task, usually performed for the sake of rewards”. There are plenty of grinds in GW2.

And the common response to this is always “but all those things are optional”.

• JPs are optional.
• Legendaries and Ascended items are optional.
• Fractals and all dungeons are optional.
• WvW is optional.
• sPvP is optional.
• Crafting is optional.
• Achievements are optional.

And so on. To which I say….well, yes, all of those things are optional in the broadest sense of the term, in that no one is forcing you to do them.

However, in order to “play the game you want to” and “have fun”, many of these tasks are most certainly not optional. If going after max crafting is something you enjoy doing, you’ll be grinding to get there. If you have fun killing Orrians, you’re grinding. If you enjoy dungeon runs on a regular basis, you’re grinding. If you like Southsun Cove and go there regularly, you’re grinding. Avid WvW players are grinding, and so are sPvP players. Are you an Achievement hog? Then you’re grinding. There is no activity in the entire game that does not demand some form of repetition in order to continue “enjoying it” and “playing the game the way you want to”.

Grinding is merely defined as repetition. And there is plenty of repetition in GW2, no matter what activities you enjoy doing. The question you should be asking is not if there is grind in GW2 or not (because there is), the real question is “at what point is my grinding no longer fun?”, and that depends on the person. But for a game that proclaimed itself a “zero grind” game, it’s nowhere near being devoid of grind. And things like the weaker loot tables and in-game penalties applied to anyone who tries to farm an event only make the situation even worse.

Your right, there is grind now matter what but as you said “at what point is my grinding no longer fun?” is the point. Grinding can be made fun and enjoyable not boring and painful.

Yes someone mentioned their take on “zero grind”!! Anet needs to accept that the way they built this game that their is grind and trying to “force” people to not grind will not solve the issue.

The fact is what could have been done is money caps on how much items can be sold for could’ve been put in place (for example a pre no more then 300 gold). Then that is somewhat a step towards fixing the problem but even then 300 gold takes a while to get. Heck even getting 100 without investing in something and making 20X the profit takes a while (and I have full MF gear). (PS: I know this suggestion is far fetched but really that is the only way to “control” ingame grind, since their is no trade system (if you don’t count mail that this)).

We need ways to make the grind more fun. Anet should create an area or revamp and areas event that splash us with exciting events that have drops equivalent to tunnel but events that are so much more exciting.

Orr in all 3 zones on Kaineng is always full of players doing the Temples. So I have never had a problem getting what I need. Yes running through Orr is a do not do. I proceed slowly and skirt the edges of the agro range to navigate Orr. That does not always work but it works 50% of the time. Orr is meant to be done in a group not solo. Get fairly better drops in a party.

Josh.8154:

Orr in all 3 zones on Kaineng is always full of players doing the Temples. So I have never had a problem getting what I need. Yes running through Orr is a do not do. I proceed slowly and skirt the edges of the agro range to navigate Orr. That does not always work but it works 50% of the time. Orr is meant to be done in a group not solo. Get fairly better drops in a party.

that happens but not that often since doing temples doesnt make you that much money unless you get lucky and get a pre.

Narkosys.5173:

I do that in the daily and then go back to Orr.
At this point I dont care what they do.
All I want is LOOT to be on par with FRACTALS. It isnt and that is wrong very very wrong.
The game is almost dead anyways but forcing players to do things against their will just to make gold or buy gems isnt the way to go. Treating 1 player better than another is what is killing this game fast. Reread your manifesto and pre release marketing material and return to what was promised.

This what i expect as well, loot equal throughout the game, not in certain places..

And the common response to this is always “but all those things are optional”.

• JPs are optional.
• Legendaries and Ascended items are optional.
• Fractals and all dungeons are optional.
• WvW is optional.
• sPvP is optional.
• Crafting is optional.
• Achievements are optional.

And so on.

So to the players that say grinding isn’t needed and everything above is optional, whats left to do if you choose not to fall into these grinds, Play the trading post? Stand in LA talking trash?

With the list above being optional what isn’t actually a grind in this game that you can do?

killcannon.2576:

Grinding is repetition….by this definition anything and everything you do is grinding. Games, watching tv, showering, sex (lol), brushing your teeth, spending time with friends, Christmas. Grinding is subjective, and to be able to apply the term to an activity, that activity needs to have negative connotations to the person doing the activity. Otherwise, it’s just playing, or relaxing.

No, it doesn’t. The definition of grind is not implicitly negative. It is simply a term to refer to the repetition of activity.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grinding_%28video_gaming%29

Grinding is a term used in video gaming to describe the process of engaging in repetitive tasks during video games. The most common usage is in the context of MMORPGs like Final Fantasy XI, World of Warcraft, Tibia, or Lineage in which it is often necessary for a character to repeatedly kill AI-controlled monsters, using basically the same strategy over again to advance their character level to be able to access newer content. MUDs, generally sharing much of the same gameplay as MMORPGs, encounter the same problem. Grinding may be required by some games to unlock additional features.

Grinding is a controversial subject among players. Many do not enjoy it, and disparage it as a symptom of poor or uninspired game design. Others embrace it, claiming that all games feature grinding to some extent, or claim to enjoy the practice of regular grinding.

As to your other point….actually, people DO call regular repetitive activites a “grind”. I’m assuming you’ve never heard a worker refer to their job as “the daily grind”? Was a common way for some folks to refer to factory or office work, in fact, because of its repetitive nature. Teachers (especially in math where learning techniques often revolve around repetition) sometimes have referred to their teaching method as “grinding”. And people were calling it that long before video games, much less MMOs, were invented, much less before they became as big as they are today. In fact, because of this, dictionaries have included this definition for years:

http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/grind

Informal. to work or study laboriously (often followed by away ): He was grinding away at his algebra.

laborious, usually uninteresting work: Copying all the footnotes was a grind.

You’re basically trying to redefine a term as something negative to suit your own narrative. Unfortunately, words do not work that way. They have definitions, words (by their nature) cannot be implicitly “bad” as they have no sense of positive or negative, it’s the person using the word who assigns that connotation to it. And I’m telling you, the word “grind” has been used to refer to repetition since long before video games.

So, now that we’ve laid out what grinding actually is, can we stop denying that GW2 contains grinding and start thinking more like this bright individual?

Revolution.6301:

Your right, there is grind now matter what but as you said “at what point is my grinding no longer fun?” is the point. Grinding can be made fun and enjoyable not boring and painful.

Yes someone mentioned their take on “zero grind”!! Anet needs to accept that the way they built this game that their is grind and trying to “force” people to not grind will not solve the issue.

The fact is what could have been done is money caps on how much items can be sold for could’ve been put in place (for example a pre no more then 300 gold). Then that is somewhat a step towards fixing the problem but even then 300 gold takes a while to get. Heck even getting 100 without investing in something and making 20X the profit takes a while (and I have full MF gear). (PS: I know this suggestion is far fetched but really that is the only way to “control” ingame grind, since their is no trade system (if you don’t count mail that this)).

We need ways to make the grind more fun. Anet should create an area or revamp and areas event that splash us with exciting events that have drops equivalent to tunnel but events that are so much more exciting.

I can tell you precisely why they didn’t have price caps on items: because they hired a real world economist to manage their Trading Post. And it is a common belief amongst real world economists that price capping does not work (even though, within a game environment, it’s probably the best possible solution to items that are exceedingly rare and prices skyrocketing out of control). Don’t expect them to change this policy, as they vehemently believe real world economics apply to their fantasy game.

Dante.1508:

So to the players that say grinding isn’t needed and everything above is optional, whats left to do if you choose not to fall into these grinds, Play the trading post? Stand in LA talking trash?

With the list above being optional what isn’t actually a grind in this game that you can do?

I hoped someone would figure this out!

To answer your query? The only answer that those players could give you is “nothing”, because supposedly everything else is optional. The fact of the matter is, people use this “it’s optional” defense as an excuse for the game not needing to fix its flaws. After all, if you don’t HAVE to do it, it’s clearly just fine as is, right?

What they don’t understand is that if you label everything in the game as “optional” and thus not requiring a fix, you leave nothing left for players to do, and they will move on to the next game. That’s why “it’s optional” isn’t a valid excuse.

Seriously, gonna cite wikipedia? Did you even see how many citations that entry needs to be taken seriously? As it is, it’s an opinion piece. So lets use the definition of grinding you chose from an actual source. Informal. to work or study laboriously (often followed by away ): He was grinding away at his algebra.
laborious, usually uninteresting work: Copying all the footnotes was a grind. Do you realize this definition supports my post and not yours? Lets take a look at the word laborious: involving or characterized by hard or toilsome effort. If I use this definition for the word grind, I find that if a person finds the act rewarding or fun, it would no longer be considered a grind. Which supports my post. If you find your occupation rewarding or enjoyable it’s not a grind. You also mentioned teachers, but provided no citations, although I think most would agree that school is a grind, unless of course you like it. You mentioned words can only ever be objective, this is obviously false, with the easiest example being poetry, and another is how words can change meaning in the way that they are used. You accuse me of trying to redefine a term, when the term is purely subjective and has no definition except which we give to it.

If I enjoy, and find rewarding killing 10,000 mobs one after the other, it’s not a grind, it’s a game (diablo). If I don’t like that activity, it’s a grind not a game. Grind is a subjective term, that one person can not inherently define for any other person.

Also when stating an opinion, please don’t use the word we, unless you’re royalty. If that is indeed the case, then all apologies.

killcannon.2576:

Seriously, gonna cite wikipedia? Did you even see how many citations that entry needs to be taken seriously? As it is, it’s an opinion piece. So lets use the definition of grinding you chose from an actual source. Informal. to work or study laboriously (often followed by away ): He was grinding away at his algebra.
laborious, usually uninteresting work: Copying all the footnotes was a grind. Do you realize this definition supports my post and not yours? Lets take a look at the word laborious: involving or characterized by hard or toilsome effort. If I use this definition for the word grind, I find that if a person finds the act rewarding or fun, it would no longer be considered a grind. Which supports my post. If you find your occupation rewarding or enjoyable it’s not a grind. You also mentioned teachers, but provided no citations, although I think most would agree that school is a grind, unless of course you like it. You mentioned words can only ever be objective, this is obviously false, with the easiest example being poetry, and another is how words can change meaning in the way that they are used. You accuse me of trying to redefine a term, when the term is purely subjective and has no definition except which we give to it.

If I enjoy, and find rewarding killing 10,000 mobs one after the other, it’s not a grind, it’s a game (diablo). If I don’t like that activity, it’s a grind not a game. Grind is a subjective term, that one person can not inherently define for any other person.

Also when stating an opinion, please don’t use the word we, unless you’re royalty. If that is indeed the case, then all apologies.

This is about Orr’s grinding, not if the word we is being used properly. So, tries to bring on topic what do you all think about constantly seeing zombies?

Naoko.7096:

Players know that the biggest joke of the game is that :
1) They demotivates you to grind.
2) The end-game carrots and rewards requires you to grind.

They kept nerfing ways for you to earn golds.
It’s no longer possible for you to earn 1 gold per hour now.

I have to be honest.
GW2 end-game mechanic are far worst than traditional mmorpgs.
In traditional mmorpg, when you grind, you feel it’s worth it.
In GW2, there’s no point of grinding except extra gold.

This is why I was so skeptical of this game pre-release. Last year there was this rather lengthy thread on why B2P with gems was so much better than that “rip off monthly fee” and my argument was that 15 maybe a ripoff but 5 to 10 dollars would make this game superior to B2P models.

People don’t understand that you lose large part of what makes a fun game fun, when you have a cash shop. The cash shop dictates what you can and cant do based on what makes the game possible. So we have a hollow shell of an mmorpg that limits reward, but encourages spending.

I rather pay for a full experience than to dance around diminishing returns as punishment for not buying gems every day.

Nappychappy.7046:

Naoko.7096:

Players know that the biggest joke of the game is that :
1) They demotivates you to grind.
2) The end-game carrots and rewards requires you to grind.

They kept nerfing ways for you to earn golds.
It’s no longer possible for you to earn 1 gold per hour now.

I have to be honest.
GW2 end-game mechanic are far worst than traditional mmorpgs.
In traditional mmorpg, when you grind, you feel it’s worth it.
In GW2, there’s no point of grinding except extra gold.

This is why I was so skeptical of this game pre-release. Last year there was this rather lengthy thread on why B2P with gems was so much better than that “rip off monthly fee” and my argument was that 15 maybe a ripoff but 5 to 10 dollars would make this game superior to B2P models.

People don’t understand that you lose large part of what makes a fun game fun, when you have a cash shop. The cash shop dictates what you can and cant do based on what makes the game possible. So we have a hollow shell of an mmorpg that limits reward, but encourages spending.

I rather pay for a full experience than to dance around diminishing returns as punishment for not buying gems every day.

League of Legends would have words with you about that.

There is literally no reason that a cash shop should be either glorified gambling, ineffectual and lacking in aesthetic items this long after release, unless of course they went and did something absolutely crazy…

Like hire someone from a hated and much criticized company that’s known for making “nickle and dime” decisions.

Yes Revolution we get that you don’t like the aesthetics of the zone. Orr has a risen dead theme. It is what it is. If you don’t like seeing all the undead or the looks of the land anymore. The solution is simple. Go to another zone. Nothing is keeping you in Orr. Anet isn’t going to change the the looks of an entire zone for you.

In short, get over it. Orr is Zombie land and it’s not going to change. If you want to see green hills and kill centaurs go to one of the human areas. Problem solved.

I believe he would if there were level 80 centaurs over there to make it worth his while.

Hellkaiser.6025:

Nappychappy.7046:

Naoko.7096:

Players know that the biggest joke of the game is that :
1) They demotivates you to grind.
2) The end-game carrots and rewards requires you to grind.

They kept nerfing ways for you to earn golds.
It’s no longer possible for you to earn 1 gold per hour now.

I have to be honest.
GW2 end-game mechanic are far worst than traditional mmorpgs.
In traditional mmorpg, when you grind, you feel it’s worth it.
In GW2, there’s no point of grinding except extra gold.

This is why I was so skeptical of this game pre-release. Last year there was this rather lengthy thread on why B2P with gems was so much better than that “rip off monthly fee” and my argument was that 15 maybe a ripoff but 5 to 10 dollars would make this game superior to B2P models.

People don’t understand that you lose large part of what makes a fun game fun, when you have a cash shop. The cash shop dictates what you can and cant do based on what makes the game possible. So we have a hollow shell of an mmorpg that limits reward, but encourages spending.

I rather pay for a full experience than to dance around diminishing returns as punishment for not buying gems every day.

League of Legends would have words with you about that.

There is literally no reason that a cash shop should be either glorified gambling, ineffectual and lacking in aesthetic items this long after release, unless of course they went and did something absolutely crazy…

Like hire someone from a hated and much criticized company that’s known for making “nickle and dime” decisions.

LoL is a different game, if everyone in GW2 played as stick men/woman and they only charged for skins that’s be a lot different. The fact is gold is a currency that works against the cash shop, so it is hard to acquire, being able to sell items in game world-wide also works against the cash shop and we have had a nerf to drop rates for how long now? Dyes could be bought with in game gold, or in the cash shop – they accidentally increase the drop rate and it is patched ASAP, anything that is beneficial to the player is removed, or nerf’d out of the game all in the name of greed.

Greed? But it is B2P and free 2 play from then on!

B2P opens the doors up wider than P2P games, some people wouldn’t dare spend 15 a month, but hand over 20 a week in a F2P.

Only a fanboy would pay 5 times the amount for a game that is a step back in the industry.

killcannon.2576:

Seriously, gonna cite wikipedia? Did you even see how many citations that entry needs to be taken seriously? As it is, it’s an opinion piece.

No, I’m sorry, you can’t dismiss Wikipedia as a source when your only evidence to the contrary is your own opinion.

I have defined my terms quoting several sources directly, and you’re saying you don’t agree with the definition. Fair enough. I’d tell you to argue with the writers of most modern dictionaries, then, as the definition I quoted appears in many of them as well. But the fact of the matter is this: I have evidence that the term means “engaging in repetitive tasks”. If you can’t prove my definition is wrong (and believe me, you can’t, because that is what the word means, and that has been part of its definition for longer than video games have even existed) then you have no argument.

Either provide contrary evidence, or your objection will be summarily ignored. That is how a proper debate works. Either way, this off-topic line of discussion ends now. I won’t humor you further if all you can contribute to the discussion is “I don’t agree that it’s grinding” (even though by the definition of the term, it clearly is).

People stay on topic! If you want to talk about other things that is not about ether:

Orr
Orr Grind
How Orr looks like
How Orr Mobs look like
How to fix/improve grind
GuildWars 2 grind in general

Then please post elsewhere! Thank you!

With all the love I have for this game, all my hate has to go to Orr.

Yeah, sorry… Can’t stand the place at all, give me some fire, some purple magic, dragons, erh.. just about anything but zombies.

How about some asuran crystal magic rainbow zombies? That would liven Orr up.

critickitten.1498:

Celtic Lady.3729:

-snip-

This poster nailed it.

This is why I scoff when people claim that there’s no grinding in GW2, because there most certainly is. Leveling a craft is grinding. Getting money at any rate beyond a snail’s pace is grinding. Getting materials is grinding. Running dailies is grinding. Doing JPs is grinding. Doing anything beyond Lvl 80 is a grind of some sort.

Grinding doesn’t mean “activity that you do over and over even though it’s not fun”, it means “any repetitive task, usually performed for the sake of rewards”. There are plenty of grinds in GW2.

And the common response to this is always “but all those things are optional”.

• JPs are optional.
• Legendaries and Ascended items are optional.
• Fractals and all dungeons are optional.
• WvW is optional.
• sPvP is optional.
• Crafting is optional.
• Achievements are optional.

And so on. To which I say….well, yes, all of those things are optional in the broadest sense of the term, in that no one is forcing you to do them.

However, in order to “play the game you want to” and “have fun”, many of these tasks are most certainly not optional. If going after max crafting is something you enjoy doing, you’ll be grinding to get there. If you have fun killing Orrians, you’re grinding. If you enjoy dungeon runs on a regular basis, you’re grinding. If you like Southsun Cove and go there regularly, you’re grinding. Avid WvW players are grinding, and so are sPvP players. Are you an Achievement hog? Then you’re grinding. There is no activity in the entire game that does not demand some form of repetition in order to continue “enjoying it” and “playing the game the way you want to”.

Grinding is merely defined as repetition. And there is plenty of repetition in GW2, no matter what activities you enjoy doing. The question you should be asking is not if there is grind in GW2 or not (because there is), the real question is “at what point is my grinding no longer fun?”, and that depends on the person. But for a game that proclaimed itself a “zero grind” game, it’s nowhere near being devoid of grind. And things like the weaker loot tables and in-game penalties applied to anyone who tries to farm an event only make the situation even worse.

Thank you to have expressed my thoughts in a polite way and perfect english!

Suddenflame.2601:

You could kill off a large number of young karka sell the shells and make a large number of money and buy the T6 material. Just a thought.

It shouldn’t work that way, at all. You should be able to find enough crafting mats through normal play without having to play “tricks” to get the basics of what you need.

DM ruins it even further. I want to make a rare bow for my ranger? 15 blood (or 15 of a different mat)That is literally days and enormous luck just to get 15 blood.

That is broken. If it’s working as intended, time to find a new game.

Aedil.1296:

Paulytnz.7619:

I think that your problem is that you think you can “farm” in GW2. Honestly, Anet do NOT want people farming….

I would love to ask Anet and Paul how do u justify the existance of Magic Find sets of armor weapons sigils runes and food if Anet don’t want us to farm taking also in account the amount of money u need to create an MF set?

Anet said they don’t like grindy games, they said they don’t want us to farm, but looking at what do i have to do to get a full set of armor, or enough matherials for a legendary or to craft anything, i would say the opposite of that, and well fractals…just have no words about it many players already talked about it.

A LOT of items needs 250 ectos, 250 lodestones, cores, 250 t6 materials, to be upgraded or produced, wanna talk about the skills points too? u know how much gold u need to buy 250 kitten charged lodestones on the trading post? or the hours u need to farm just 1 with a full magic find set+weapon lucksigil+food?

I sincerly suggest the Anet team to watch again the “Anet Manifesto” couse gw2 is really not a game for Casual Players, unless they just think a casual players don’t deserve to have a satifying nice looking armor or weapon, or they just don’t deserve any exotic/ascended gear..

Last thing: people do not split only between
1 – who have time to spend playing on GW2 and nerding to get stuff
2 – who have money to spend on GW2 and buy gold with gems

There are also people who have no money and a lot of free time, too bad they have to spend most of it looking for a job they cannot find due to the infamous economical crisis (here in italy the country is down on the knees).

Sincerly

you could do what i am doing flipping mystic coins!
buy at around:11 silver 20 copper (happens around once a day)
and sell at around: 13 silver and 30 copper
you get around: 10 copper a piece! (after placing tax)
Try multiplying this by 20 and it builds up fast im at around 50 silver! and im a level 14 in game! Just started this month.