Guild Wars 2

Ran from Fields of Ruin to the Blazeridge Steppes and didn’t come across 1 person. This kind of has me worried because it makes the world feel completely dead. I have no reason to even want to come here to level from 40-50 because nobody is around.

Anyway share your thoughts please.

I’m afraid that’s how it is. Even on a “Full” world, this is what I see :
From the areas level 1-30 is where it has a good amount of people running around.
Then from 30-40 the population seems like it dwindles down.
The level 40-75 areas, is where it gets really lonely. Almost makes the game seem like a single player RPG.
75-80 is where it gets back up slowly.
Then on the level 80 map, Cursed Shore, is where you’ll see a bunch of people again.

It really is a pain leveling through the middle levels :/

yea I have noticed this too mid level zones don’t have many people but the 1-30 zones and 70-80 have lots of people.

What’s more, in those dead zones you need people to play out the dynamic events. They scale down to about 5 it seems, but not below that….

Ya I am kind of disappointed because like Sam said, there isn’t enough people to play these DE’s….

If it helps once you get past the straits of isolation (j/k) you will see more people than you want to see. In fact there are certain areas that you will wish so badly there were fewer people in because you won’t be able to get a kill in fast enough.

I was in a mid level zone this evening and saw an abundant number of players, as normal. There were so many people around me during events I was having problems seeing key NPCs.

What you’re assuming is a server population problem may actually be simply the result of a large game world combined with fact that any character can effectively level in any zone that is around their level or lower. You can be level 50 and thinking “I’m tired of Shiverpeak snow-themed zones”, and go play in Queensdale instead.

In addition, this is a game where people are enjoying trying out new character races/professions, and thus the lower levels zones are seeing additional traffic. Not everyone is choosing to level at the same speed as you, or doing it in the same zones. Maybe people are just playing in places and ways they like best.

@Edge

But regardless of the “reasons” behind why, the fact still remains that the zone is empty so it makes the whole zone not even worth trying to level in.

1) Teleports are the problem (give us mounts instead)

2) The game itself is boring, people don’t play as much as they used to

3) The game lacks open world PvP (boy, that can really get things going and fill areas up, trust me)

And so on and so on…

All they need to do is get the karma farming train out of Orr and into the world more (like they advertised in the first place). Most people chasing legendaries after getting a 100% log in and farm Cursed Shore and or other Orr zones. The event web is more dense and they happen really frequently, they also reward the most karma per event.

If you go to any other zone, you’re rewarded with karma according to your SCALED level and not your actual level. If people got karma regardless of zone/scaled level but their actual level, you’d see more people moving around. Frankly not everyone wants to stomach cursed shore but believe it is most efficient for their goals.

Tharjax.9068:

@Edge

But regardless of the “reasons” behind why, the fact still remains that the zone is empty so it makes the whole zone not even worth trying to level in.

In what way? Outside of events with champion/boss mobs and maybe the highest level zones, they’re almost all supposed to be doable by a single character.

Seriously, I wish I could play around on more empty maps, and there are plenty of players like me who prefer less adventurers around them to more for a variety of reasons. So, if you’re running into zones where there aren’t many people playing.. to some of us that’s a good thing.

If you don’t like being in a particularly empty zone, you can always move to one with a larger population. There are a ridiculous number of zones that can take you to 80. You would have better luck with that than insisting on playing on a particular map and expecting everyone else to flock to your preferred location.

Lumines.3916:

If you go to any other zone, you’re rewarded with karma according to your SCALED level and not your actual level.

That is not accurate. A level 80 player in Queensdale scaled to level 5 will see much higher rewards at the end of events than a true level 5 player in Queensdale. He will not see rewards as high as he would seen in a level 80 zone, but that’s because the events in the lower level zones can be completed much quicker than their higher level counterparts.

Sadly this is often a problem in these games and I hope they have some smart fixes.

If they could manage to get people out of Orr for resource and karma farming it might make people more spread out. If an event happens when I’m out gathering, I will join.

@Edge

MMO = Massive Multiplayer Online, I didn’t buy an MMO so I can see 1 or 2 people here and there.

I like this game a lot and I don’t expect people to “flock” to the zone of my picking. I actually expect there should be people already in the zone for me to play with, not me having to chase down players in other zones.

If a zone is empty there is something wrong, maybe the zones quests are to boring, maybe the zone itself is ugly? Who knows it can be a multitude of reasons. But I still expect to go to any zone in this game and see people playing there.

Also there is only 2 level 40-50 zones and like 1 45-50. Why wouldn’t there be a good amount of people in this zone, especially if I play on a “Full” server.

Raging Bull.5048:

1) Teleports are the problem (give us mounts instead)

2) The game itself is boring, people don’t play as much as they used to

3) The game lacks open world PvP (boy, that can really get things going and fill areas up, trust me)

And so on and so on…

Except lowering Teleport cost. I don’t see mount and open world PvP can fix the issue.

The major problem is the reward isn’t worthy and no interesting DEs, there is no reason to go back to wander in lower level area.

Reason that mid level zones are more empty is by this point, most people who are actively playing the game have atleast 1 level 80 they play most. In their spare time they play low level toons which populate the lvl 30 and below zones, but dont exactly spend a lot of time consistantly leveling them, so the mid zones are empty at hte moment.

Also while world pvp would be kinda fun (it has its times) how you would implement it in the open party environment hte game sets up currently in PvE would be complicated if not possible.

I’d leave a zone if it were filled with other people… It’s much more fun to be an adventurer in an area that isn’t swarming with other people.

And as long as people only want the best loot and the fast way to get money and won’t relax to smell the roses, the lower areas will always be more empty than the top areas.

…and in Cursed Shore all the DE’s are boring aoe-spamming zergfests.

There’s no reason to go back. It’ll stay this way until ANet actually starts making going back to old zones more profitable than dinking around Orr all day (which few people want to do anyway.)

They really need to reexamine their entire reward system in this game.

Edge.4180:

Lumines.3916:

If you go to any other zone, you’re rewarded with karma according to your SCALED level and not your actual level.

That is not accurate. A level 80 player in Queensdale scaled to level 5 will see much higher rewards at the end of events than a true level 5 player in Queensdale. He will not see rewards as high as he would seen in a level 80 zone, but that’s because the events in the lower level zones can be completed much quicker than their higher level counterparts.

But the fact remains that the Karma/hour or Gold/hour is far far higher in the higher level zones. Coupled with the high transport costs there is not so much incentive to travel back. I would guess it comes about 15 times quicker in Or.

Edge.4180:

Seriously, I wish I could play around on more empty maps, and there are plenty of players like me who prefer less adventurers around them to more for a variety of reasons. So, if you’re running into zones where there aren’t many people playing.. to some of us that’s a good thing.

If you read what Anet have written it is clear that they want a good shared experience. While you might be happy with a more solitary experience that is clearly not what the game is about. I too am quite happy to run solo but I do like to bump in to people here and there and do stuff. It is brilliant that Anet have made it so there are few barrieres to doing that. At the end of the day this is not Skyrim. Some places where too crowded (not always by actual players cough) but you need a certain ‘critical mass’ for maximum enjoyment for the most people. There is a pretty wide ‘sweet spot’ but outside that its not such a good experience.

I have a whole bunch of alts approaching mid level, it does seem sparser but I don’t think the sky is falling yet. I guess I’ll find out as they progress.

I don’t think the problem is the “reward system” (assuming that you’re referring to drops / karma / gold). Games that try to replace enjoyable gameplay with the promise of some reward at the end are exactly what most people playing GW2 were trying to get away from.

The issue is that level 80 players need some items (ex., crafting materials) that can only be found in level 80 zones, and don’t need any materials from lower-level zones.

The linking of player level, zone level and crafting material level always leads to this.

Materials should be found in their “logical” zones, regardless of what level recipes they’re used by, and high-level recipes should require materials of multiple levels.

If some high-level recipes needed soft wood, cotton, iron, etc., you’d see a lot more high-level players in mid-level areas.

Instead, they “have” to be in high-level areas (even if they’re bored of them – as most people are of Orr after a couple of days, due to the uniformity of mobs there) because that’s the only place where they can get the materials they need.

Sprinkle some high-level resource nodes through other areas and change high-level recipes to require some mid-level materials and the world will soon feel more populated (and high-level players will be less bored, because they’ll be able to play in different places, see more events, etc.).

It’s fine for some items to come from very small and specific areas (ex., Orrian Truffles could come only from Orr). I’m not saying that every zone should have every resource, just that there shouldn’t be such a strong link between zone level, resource type and recipe ingredients.

Anyone on the Aurora Glade server who needs help with DE’s can whisper me. I spend most of my time doing DE’s across various zones as I dont like Cursed Shore much, too many people just stood in one place abusing the system.

Agree with the reward system. ANet says that “end-game” starts in level 1, but why should a character in level 80 go trough areas 30-60 if there is no reward except gold and experience?

I’m level 80 and one of my favorite things to do right now is wander in mid-level zones and explore. I’m seeing content I missed or bypassed on my way up through the levels, getting lots of level 74+ blue/green/yellow item loot and healthy karma / exp rewards, and getting a bit more of a challenge since events have a few people rather than a giant zerg. I love the feeling of exploring a massive, unspoiled wilderness and getting to see events and stories play out as intended (rather than just crushed in seconds by dozens of players).

I think as the game settles in, players will be more apt to spread out. A lot of players are really taking their time or running alts, and many high level players right now are mostly only concerned with maximum perceived efficiency with rewards. The game world is huge, and all completely open to the max level player. I’ve never had an issue finding folks when I wanted to be social or needed help with something…and I’m sure this will always be the case.

@Edge
“…any character can effectively level in any zone that is around their level or lower. You can be level 50 and thinking “I’m tired of Shiverpeak snow-themed zones”, and go play in Queensdale instead.”

For high level characters the xp they get from low level DE’s and Hearts is very small relative to the amount of xp needed to gain a level. Yes a high level char can level up in low level areas, but it takes for ever.

@Account: “I’m not saying that every zone should have every resource, just that there shouldn’t be such a strong link between zone level, resource type and recipe ingredients.”

Agreed – The problem is that this is baked into the whole levelling/progression system now and maybe very hard to alter without lots of knock on effects. For instance, its intended that final tier materials should be harder to obtain than previous tier materials, so it would require a complete rethink of the whole resource & crafting systems, if the intent isn’t to try and apply a quick bandaid.

The basic problem comes down to the fact that non linear exploration gameplay mixes with an archaic levelling design about as well as oil mixes with water.

If they want me to leave Cursed Shore and Frostgorge Sound, they will need to upscale the rewards more.

There is no reason positively whatsoever for me to enter Queensdale for example. The karma is lower, the money is lower, hearts are pointless, and the gathering nodes are MUCH lower! (No Orichalcum/Mithril!)

If Queensdale had a good farm for a level 80 that was as profitable as Orr, I would go. But it’s Cursed Ore which has the Orichalcum, the farms (tunnel for example), the Zerg (plinx), and so on.

Well, if they would make it so that DE’s give a universal amount of rewards and fix it so that drops really scale to the players level, not 5 levels below it, people would spread out more.

For the crafting material problem, they could probably make all foes drop tier 5/6 crafting mats at level 80, and add in an NPC who allows you to exchange higher level mats for lower level ones.

This would bring a large number of players back to the lower levels.

Or maybe a downgrade recipe.

I was also thinking about adding a karma bonus to some maps everyday/week so people would travel to those maps.

I believe it’s because most people are either playing their 80s or leveing alts through crafting… Many of my guild rushed their alts after a certain level just by crafting

I’ve been in level 40-50 zones and surrounding zones, and haven’t seen many players either. And this isn’t even endgame areas.

@deriver: “I believe it’s because most people are either playing their 80s or leveing alts through crafting… Many of my guild rushed their alts after a certain level just by crafting”

A bit sad to see the lengths players will go to avoid doing the content. A lot of players at level cap can’t have seen more than 30% of the game.

Ill be honest, I logged in last night and saw two people in Blazedridge mountains. Ive never even heard of that zone, nor do I know where it is. (about 250 hours playtime, 70 or so at 80). I might have to check out that zone tonight…where is it?

And agreeing with Roqoco, when I hit 80 I had 43% world completion. Im still only 51%, but I am not actively persuing map completion at the moment (enjoying dungeon runs, crafting, and alts).

I’ll be hitting every zone eventually.

The midlevels are too easy and people endup too fast in endgame. Lowlevel people have to adjust to the game and go slow because of that, but after that people go 80 in a week or two. So that is why midlevel areas are desolated.

the solution is a faction grind
we all love to grind the bar
charr / norn / syl / asu
offer unique items for killing a billion mobs or something
ditch the cultural trip and roll with a grind

trust me

Low Population Zone Boon Suggestion that might encourage player migration a bit: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Zone-Population-Boon/first#post386829

Doesn’t deal with crafting mats though; I have no suggestions on how to address that.

My possible solution to several game issues, including the max level crafting mats forcing people into only a couple zones…

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/suggestions/Explorer-Coins-A-possible-fix-to-multiple-issues/

@Player.9621 some more grind is necessary. Overal a casual player playing a hour or 2 can be 80 in one month of play. This is too fast. MOO fanatics where 80 in 2 weeks! Either there must be a reason to play in mid level areas or the XP needs to be decreased 6 fold or they already should start transforming the level of areas.

The current system requires a couple of players to rim DEs smoothly. And there are a lot of human players, additionally the center line map of Tyria is where every races come across, thus it is the most popular zone. On the contrary, the Charr’s zones are far away from the story quest progression that very few would go there. People go to where the crowd is, thus causing an extreme concentration on one place but deserted on the rest.

Besides, it seems that they spent less time in balancing those Charr’s zones. Therefore there are less events but a lot of boring grinding. Some bosses and locations are extremely hard, with extremely high density and quick respawn. There are also a few locations that you are demoted to incorrect level to fight mobs which are 5 or 6 levels above you (yeah it’s insane). Unless you need 100% map completion or you really want to explore or challenge harder maps, usually you don’t want to go to those maps.

First of all, they need to finish the balancing and debug ( a lot of bugs too) in those zones or I doubt people would respond even with extra benefits given. Everything is just harder and with almost no support from other players, you gotta expect tons of frustration to complete those maps.

Tharjax.9068:

@Edge

MMO = Massive Multiplayer Online, I didn’t buy an MMO so I can see 1 or 2 people here and there.

I like this game a lot and I don’t expect people to “flock” to the zone of my picking. I actually expect there should be people already in the zone for me to play with, not me having to chase down players in other zones.

If a zone is empty there is something wrong, maybe the zones quests are to boring, maybe the zone itself is ugly? Who knows it can be a multitude of reasons. But I still expect to go to any zone in this game and see people playing there.

Also there is only 2 level 40-50 zones and like 1 45-50. Why wouldn’t there be a good amount of people in this zone, especially if I play on a “Full” server.

One of the points I’m trying to get across is that, in addition to the 3 zones you just mentioned, there are 13 additional zones someone in that level range can go play in to level up thanks to the scaling system. And that’s not even including the PvP side of the game which adds several more maps, dungeons, or cities. And the options keep increasing as you get higher in level.

There’s only so many bodies allowed on each server. Essentially, your complaint is that we have too many areas to adventure in, or too much freedom to choose where we level. I, for one, am happy that we aren’t just confined to a couple zones at any given level.

For whatever reason, some of the zones are more populated than others. This seems perfect as some players prefer less populated zones in their MMOs and some prefer more. Since nobody is forcing you to play in any particular zone, the power to be or not be around plenty of other players is completely within your hands. In your case, you just have to go visit the proverbial mountain rather than waiting for the developers to move the mountain to you.

helladoom.4317:

@Edge
“…any character can effectively level in any zone that is around their level or lower. You can be level 50 and thinking “I’m tired of Shiverpeak snow-themed zones”, and go play in Queensdale instead.”

For high level characters the xp they get from low level DE’s and Hearts is very small relative to the amount of xp needed to gain a level. Yes a high level char can level up in low level areas, but it takes for ever.

No, it doesn’t take forever. I have several characters, but two of them currently get the majority of my time. Despite spending much less time on one of them, he is higher level (and richer, and has ridiculously more karma) than the other. And that is because he spends almost all his time adventuring in lower level zones instead of the higher level zones the other is hitting. I haven’t even touched his personal story for rewards. It’s all about the frequency of easy-and-quick-to-complete events in lower level areas.

Here’s a real example:

Level 61 character completing a level 56 event: 4,314 XP, 270 Karma, 1 silver 33 copper reward.

Level 61 character completing a level 2 event: 1,158 XP, 158 Karma, 78 copper reward.

Level 2 character completing a level 2 event: 254 XP, 27 Karma, 13 copper reward.

As you can see, the level 61 character is earning much higher rewards than the level 2 character, despite the fact that they’re both participating in the same level 2 event. And, yes, the level 61 character would be earning higher rewards in the level 56 event, but the amount of time required to complete a level 56 event is much longer than the time required to complete a level 2 event.

Way points are the issue.

There should be no way points.

Instead there should be blimps, horses, or something moving you around and showing you the landscape and people below.

This is no different then when they had instant ports to the dungeons in WoW. It kills the feeling of scale of the game. They should know better.

I actually don’t mind outrunning the crowd from time to time. Thats when immersion starts really kicking in for me.

Ryth.6518:

Way points are the issue.

There should be no way points.

Instead there should be blimps, horses, or something moving you around and showing you the landscape and people below.

This is no different then when they had instant ports to the dungeons in WoW. It kills the feeling of scale of the game. They should know better.

I actually wouldn’t mind this is they were pre-set destinations similar in how LoTRO does their “taxi” services. Talk to NPC, purchase a ride and sit back and watch the world zip by… and I think it would be pretty cool to see it via a airship.

Every zone is packed for me. I’m on my second toon (first one is 80), and loving all the people I see.

In Orr, the amount of XP is nice for events, but the Karma does seem a bit low. at level 80, i heard you need skill points to craft, which is cool and useful for those who keep leveling. but 12,755 xp for an escort seems like too much xp sometimes.

maybe raise the karma amount, and lower the xp amount. the 1 silver per event is okay (its better than nothing) though in reality i wish it was more. shoving xp in everyone’s face is nice, but at level 80, it doesn’t seem like we need all that extra. Just raise the karma amount to hurry players along. the faster they get it, the faster they leave zones to go do something else. that would work for me, anyways. the sooner i get to where i want to be, the sooner i can move along.

i may camp at the Penitent Path for 2 hours a night, but i do make an effort to help my guild mates around the world. but then i always go back to the tunnel for the quickest boosts.

when i finally get my exotic Dwayna armor, i will then move on to other things, like maybe PvP.

I have the opposite issue, bumping into people everywhere from Harathi to CS.

Orr is the worst, explanatory pic below

Just a question of rewards which Arenanet have a good history with. They’ll make us want to go back to all these zones and they’ll have new stuff waiting for us when they do. Not sure how they will do it, but it will be something along the lines of a really awesome thing that you need thousands of smaller things to get and these things are spread over the world.

im tellin ya
remove the cost and race restriction for cultural armor, open it up to max faction, make each area faction for kill and im sure a lot of people would rather grind other areas than run in circles in orr for days on end,