Guild Wars 2

Quaggan Paragons….

ArtemusHunter.9521:

milo.6942:

funkylovemonkey.3097:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/GW1-Nostalgia-Why-not-just-PLAY-GW1/page/3#post3440125

bam
100% +1

Lets not forget the manifesto..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fvxOWwH0Vlo

What a laugh that is compared to how GW2 is now. These were the promises we GW1 players were given. What colin said in it, the first half we got, then he mentioned swinging a sword and grinding.. And then the video goes on to show stuff that’s STILL not in the game.

Actual Quotes:

Mike O’brien – FOUNDER:

“We founded ArenaNet to innovate. So Guild Wars 2 is our opportunity to question everything; to make a game that defies existing conventions.”

“Guild Wars 2.. Takes everything you love about Guild Wars 1 and puts it into a persistent world that’s got.. more active combat, a fully branching personalized story-line, a new event system to get people playing together and still no monthly fee’s.”

Dynamic events existed in other games before Guild Wars 2. It didn’t break the mold unless renaming them counts as breaking the mold. More active combat doesn’t exist in WvW when you limit the amount of people you can attack with aoe to 5. it means you throw a couple attacks out, expect to hit a few people, and carry on with your life.

Guild Wars 2 took the name that you loved from Guild Wars 1 and proceeded to add locations that changed over 250 years and turn most of them into ruins. It took the classes, renamed some, and barely took the skills from gw1 to gw2. It exclusified weapons to certain classes – there by removing my favourite thing from GW1. It removed locations and has yet to describe if we will EVER see them again. I’m talking about you cantha, elona and the areas above frostgorge..

Colin Johanson – Game Designer:

“Most games, you go out and have really fun tasks occasionally that you get to do, and the rest of the game is this boring grind to get to the fun stuff.”

That last quote is how GW2 currently is. The ‘fun stuff’ of the game is either holiday related or groups require you to be level 80. After one grind through levels, I never wanted to do it again because it literally was a boring grind to me. I know its not the same for everyone, but that’s just how I am. but the best part is his next quote RIGHT after the last one..

“I swung a sword. I swung a sword again. HE-EY! I swung it again!! That’s great. We just don’t want players to grind in Guild Wars 2. No one enjoys that, no one finds it fun, we want to change the way people view combat.”

Colin. You are a GAME DESIGNER. If you didn’t want players to grind – not only for levels – but for specific gear, why in the name of the 6 is that how you get specific gear? Why say people don’t like to grind? People do. As long as it’s not riddled with RNG.

The Guild Wars 2 promise and the results 18 months later are clearly two different things, and people have the nerve to say we GW1 players should stop complaining. I’ll stop complaining when I see them truly deliver on empty promises.
mic drop

This is from manifesto. And the manifesto is DEAD! So move on……

Navzar.2938:

Guild Wars 1 players don’t want to play the same Guild Wars 1 content over and over again. Heck, many of us do agree that it’s old and could use new mechanics and features (I sure do). Yes, we were expecting a new game when we heard about Guild Wars 2, but expecting a new game is not synonymous to expecting a completely different game, especially when it’s within the same series.

What we wanted was a sequel to Guild Wars 1 as was implied. Like Pokemon Gold and Silver were to Pokemon Red and Blue, or Halo 2 was to Halo 1. We expected something new that built off of the old things that made the first game great. While Guild Wars 2 is good in it’s own way, many Guild Wars 1 players don’t feel like that sequel was delivered. It’s just a new MMO with the Guild Wars name slapped on it.

I was going to reply and say something along these lines – but you’ve already done it.
That’s exactly how it is.

I expected GW2 to be a new level set on the foundation that GW1 had laid. Instead it is a completely different thing that’s just borrowing some lore, some stories and some very loose design bits from GW1.
I do like GW2 – and I have adapted to it ( even though I am and always will be a GW1 hardcore player and fan) BUT I can’t really get past the shallow storytelling and the shift from pretty epic stories and events to this inconsequential mess in GW2.

lordkrall.7241:

All I hear is people talking about vertical progression, but that was present in GW1 as well (worse than in GW2 in some cases).

Oh really now? What is this vertical progression you speak of?

Mada.5319:

Oh really now? What is this vertical progression you speak of?

Faction points.
Sunspear points.
Lightbringer points.
(Two of which were actually REQUIRED to even get past certain parts of the MAIN STORYLINE, and the third more or less required to do a certain dungeon or even certain parts of the world, including later missions.)

Ebon Vanguard points.
Deldrimor points.
Norn points.
Asura points.

I would say that was a rather massive amount of grind and vertical progression there, especially since all of those gave skills and most (all but Factions and Sunspear) gave very real and quite powerful passive effects when equipped.

lordkrall.7241:

Mada.5319:

Oh really now? What is this vertical progression you speak of?

Faction points.
Sunspear points.
Lightbringer points.
(Two of which were actually REQUIRED to even get past certain parts of the MAIN STORYLINE, and the third more or less required to do a certain dungeon or even certain parts of the world, including later missions.)

Ebon Vanguard points.
Deldrimor points.
Norn points.
Asura points.

I would say that was a rather massive amount of grind and vertical progression there, especially since all of those gave skills and most (all but Factions and Sunspear) gave very real and quite powerful passive effects when equipped.

I think many gw1 players may leap to attack this post, but for the most part it is correct. I strongly disagree that it was “massive grind” and I certainly disagree with the suggestion that this was in any way worse than gw2 though. GW1 had a vast array of skills you could discover and use; if there were a handful that became a bit more powerful with some grind, it was fine by me. I agree the sunspear and lightbringer phases that required you to have a certain level were a buzzkill and I didn’t like them at the time nor do I like them now.

edit: grind means doing a thing over and over. If you like doing this thing then you don’t mind, but if it’s not fun you are more likely to complain. I see GW1 having less grind and it was more fun. In gw2 the grind is practically required and gets boring very quickly because it lacks diversity.

lordkrall.7241:

Mada.5319:

Oh really now? What is this vertical progression you speak of?

Faction points.
Sunspear points.
Lightbringer points.
(Two of which were actually REQUIRED to even get past certain parts of the MAIN STORYLINE, and the third more or less required to do a certain dungeon or even certain parts of the world, including later missions.)

Ebon Vanguard points.
Deldrimor points.
Norn points.
Asura points.

I would say that was a rather massive amount of grind and vertical progression there, especially since all of those gave skills and most (all but Factions and Sunspear) gave very real and quite powerful passive effects when equipped.

Lol. Those were faaar from a grind. Sunspear required 1k points if I remember correctly and you could easily get 50 points from one single quest (not to mention extra points from killing hostile mobs), and each quest was unique and not repetitive but rather fun in my experience. Lightbringer points were gathered through simply following your story, I didn’t even farm for any of it.

All the other titles were pretty much not needed. You could get them by grinding sure, but they werent needed for anything, just for players who wanted to show: I completed x, y, z.

Your point is invalid.

Adine.2184:

Jamais vu.5284:

How often still do you play your favourite video games that haven’t been updated in years?

Worst question you could possibly ask . Since you asked however I still play One Must Fall 2097 ,Buldars Gate , Europa Univereralis (the first one ) Colonization ( the original ) and Pax Imperium Eminent Domain to name a few

Baldur’s Gate was redone as an Enhanced Edition. Well worth playing again or playing for the first time if you never had a chance to play one of the best RPG’s ever made

Remember Anet, that the singular awesome quality BG and BG2 have that make it fantastic…STORY!

Sirendor.1394:

lordkrall.7241:

Mada.5319:

Oh really now? What is this vertical progression you speak of?

Faction points.
Sunspear points.
Lightbringer points.
(Two of which were actually REQUIRED to even get past certain parts of the MAIN STORYLINE, and the third more or less required to do a certain dungeon or even certain parts of the world, including later missions.)

Ebon Vanguard points.
Deldrimor points.
Norn points.
Asura points.

I would say that was a rather massive amount of grind and vertical progression there, especially since all of those gave skills and most (all but Factions and Sunspear) gave very real and quite powerful passive effects when equipped.

Lol. Those were faaar from a grind. Sunspear required 1k points if I remember correctly and you could easily get 50 points from one single quest (not to mention extra points from killing hostile mobs), and each quest was unique and not repetitive but rather fun in my experience. Lightbringer points were gathered through simply following your story, I didn’t even farm for any of it.

All the other titles were pretty much not needed. You could get them by grinding sure, but they werent needed for anything, just for players who wanted to show: I completed x, y, z.

Your point is invalid.

I am with you that it’s far from a bother. You could play the game easily without them, I’ve cleared DoA, UW, FoW and any other PvE content without using PvE-only skills or displaying titles. How-ever, would it have been quicker and easier with? Yes, aka Vertical Progression: Being max in certain titles greatly helped in certain content just like in a game like WoW better gear did. Whether it was a bother or not differs per person.

GW2 does the exact same thing though by introducing Ascended Gear, especially since it gives an advantage over Exotic in PvP situations (If you ever considered AB/JQ/FA PvP, you can’t deny WvW being PvP.) I feel though, that people greatly desire that.

I played GW1 mainly for the GvG, their PvP in general was amazing. Loads of options leaving something for everyone. I never got how people could enjoy its PvE though. It felt very reptitive just getting through certain missions for certain looks, let alone titles. GW1 had a lot of (seemingly unique, but I haven’t played that many MMO’s) playstyles, such as protection monk (most MMO’s seem to have mainly reactive than preemptive ‘healing’) and the mesmer/ranger playstyles with unique shut down and interrupts were something I really enjoyed from both playing as dealing with it. Anyway enough nostalgic rant.

But no matter how much I loved GW1 (likely my favourite game ever, definitly MMO) it does feel, been there done that, the second many good friends and players started moving on, this was way before GW2 was released. I see GW2 as an unique game, it’s good in it’s own way and I know I’ll never find something like GW1 again, too bad, but get over it people. GW2 has done great on a lot of aspects and many people love and enjoy this game, there’s room for improvement, just like any game, but that’s not by copying GW1. Like people said, age is one factor, but if it was the best of the best, it would be a lot more lively, I’m sorry but WoW seems to prove that. (Never played it, don’t have an account, so just going by what I hear people say.) Yes, I’m aware how much hate not being negative about WoW will give me…

SonicTHI.3217:

Because ANET abandoned the development of GW1 to make a better game based on the same principles – no grind for stats, cosmetic endgame, good and engaging pvp.

Instead why dont the people that want vertical progression and all that go back to WoW?

You forget the most important part. An expansion based income model so a micro-transaction focus does not destroy the game like it does now.

I don’t really like GW1 that much, just there payment model.

SonicTHI.3217:

Because ANET abandoned the development of GW1 to make a better game based on the same principles – no grind for stats, cosmetic endgame, good and engaging pvp.

Instead why dont the people that want vertical progression and all that go back to WoW?

They abandoned the game, still better than gw2!

GW2 worse mmo ever!

Aeolus.3615:

SonicTHI.3217:

Because ANET abandoned the development of GW1 to make a better game based on the same principles – no grind for stats, cosmetic endgame, good and engaging pvp.

Instead why dont the people that want vertical progression and all that go back to WoW?

They abandoned the game, still better than gw2!

GW2 worse mmo ever!

So far for reasonable discussions.
That is a rather radical, subjective, and largely false statement.

ArenaNet has been dead since Eye of the North any way. Wouldn’t surprise me if most of the good developers left and people like Isaiah Cartwright stayed. You can notice the change in thematics, writing, priorities. Much the same as in GW2 it’s just a run off the mill game.

I played GW1 for 5000 hours, got a gold cape, got pretty much everything I wanted and I am done with it. I hoped GW2 would be more of the same revolutionary formula, but it became very clear GW2 is envisioned by business men instead of gamers. The whole ‘manifesto’ was based on lies: the game was developed with an appeal to the masses and ease of use from the beginning, ultimately making it a rather shallow experience that is interchangeable with pretty much any other MMO in the market.

You know why people are angry? They supported ANet and made them big, they played and waited for GW2 for over five years. This is the thanks they get.

Adine.2184:

Worst question you could possibly ask . Since you asked however I still play One Must Fall 2097 ,Buldars Gate , Europa Univereralis (the first one ) Colonization ( the original ) and Pax Imperium Eminent Domain to name a few

And you presume we don’t likewise “go back” to GW1 every once in a while to play it? My question was whether you still play your singular favourite video game on a daily/weekly basis, like you normally do with MMOs. A MMO (or “CORPG” if you have stick shoved up) that hasn’t received updates for years is like an old single-player game.

That this very obvious point went over your and the other guy’s head isn’t my problem.

Sirendor.1394:

Aeolus.3615:

SonicTHI.3217:

Because ANET abandoned the development of GW1 to make a better game based on the same principles – no grind for stats, cosmetic endgame, good and engaging pvp.

Instead why dont the people that want vertical progression and all that go back to WoW?

They abandoned the game, still better than gw2!

GW2 worse mmo ever!

So far for reasonable discussions.
That is a rather radical, subjective, and largely false statement.

[trying to get ontopic then]
I know it is radical but its not entirely false, gw1 was and is way more fun than gw2, we are talking a game thats close to 10years, yet Phrophecies history is far superior and had severall pvp concepts, Gw2 lacks all of it, classes mechanics included, for a game with 1year there were alot of bad decisions on how to the game(Tyria) would envolve further, you got concepts that got badly deployed into the game as in “living sotry VS districs” as i like to call it.
The worse problem is the artwork was what saved the game, game mechanics(to the player) has zero new/inovative content, being a DPS only game was a just easy way that dev’s tough it would be better and easier way to balance the game.
The only content i ended doing in gw2 was WvW even that has huge problems…
Gw2 is just a common themepark game with good graphics, the rest is nothing new, even ascenced gear show how game is disorganized.

Actually atm im playing gw1…

Aeolus.3615:

Sirendor.1394:

Aeolus.3615:

SonicTHI.3217:

Because ANET abandoned the development of GW1 to make a better game based on the same principles – no grind for stats, cosmetic endgame, good and engaging pvp.

Instead why dont the people that want vertical progression and all that go back to WoW?

They abandoned the game, still better than gw2!

GW2 worse mmo ever!

So far for reasonable discussions.
That is a rather radical, subjective, and largely false statement.

[trying to get ontopic then]
I know it is radical but its not entirely false, gw1 was and is way more fun than gw2, we are talking a game thats close to 10years, yet Phrophecies history is far superior and had severall pvp concepts, Gw2 lacks all of it, classes mechanics included, for a game with 1year there were alot of bad decisions on how to the game(Tyria) would envolve further, you got concepts that got badly deployed into the game as in “living sotry VS districs” as i like to call it.
The worse problem is the artwork was what saved the game, game mechanics(to the player) has zero new/inovative content, being a DPS only game was a just easy way that dev’s tough it would be better and easier way to balance the game.
The only content i ended doing in gw2 was WvW even that has huge problems…
Gw2 is just a common themepark game with good graphics, the rest is nothing new, even ascenced gear show how game is disorganized.

Actually atm im playing gw1…

This is your opinion and I do not share it. In my opinion your statement is entirely false. I realy like the story and the mechanics of GW2. Compared to GW1 I had a hard time focusing on the story and get a feeling for the world until the end of Profecies and Factions, Nightfall was on the other hand perfect. I liked the story of EotN too.

GW2 story is realy interesting and makes me wanna see more, both LS and Main story and I realy hope that LS will mix in with the main story later.

Fox.1054:

ArenaNet has been dead since Eye of the North any way. Wouldn’t surprise me if most of the good developers left and people like Isaiah Cartwright stayed. You can notice the change in thematics, writing, priorities. Much the same as in GW2 it’s just a run off the mill game.

I played GW1 for 5000 hours, got a gold cape, got pretty much everything I wanted and I am done with it. I hoped GW2 would be more of the same revolutionary formula, but it became very clear GW2 is envisioned by business men instead of gamers. The whole ‘manifesto’ was based on lies: the game was developed with an appeal to the masses and ease of use from the beginning, ultimately making it a rather shallow experience that is interchangeable with pretty much any other MMO in the market.

You know why people are angry? They supported ANet and made them big, they played and waited for GW2 for over five years. This is the thanks they get.

yes, exactly! They created a money game instead a follow up game of gw1

EdgarMTanaka.7291:

This is your opinion and I do not share it. In my opinion your statement is entirely false. I realy like the story and the mechanics of GW2. Compared to GW1 I had a hard time focusing on the story and get a feeling for the world until the end of Profecies and Factions, Nightfall was on the other hand perfect. I liked the story of EotN too.

GW2 story is realy interesting and makes me wanna see more, both LS and Main story and I realy hope that LS will mix in with the main story later.

Lol, gw2 interesting story… lol… Gotta find a my lost sister,, yeah, verry interesting… lol :P then there’s this uber epic dragon, and he doesn’t even do anything xD looool

lordkrall.7241:

Mada.5319:

Oh really now? What is this vertical progression you speak of?

Faction points.
Sunspear points.
Lightbringer points.
(Two of which were actually REQUIRED to even get past certain parts of the MAIN STORYLINE, and the third more or less required to do a certain dungeon or even certain parts of the world, including later missions.)

Ebon Vanguard points.
Deldrimor points.
Norn points.
Asura points.

I would say that was a rather massive amount of grind and vertical progression there, especially since all of those gave skills and most (all but Factions and Sunspear) gave very real and quite powerful passive effects when equipped.

Yeah, no.
You were able to get Faction, LightBringer and Sunspear through quests, it was a way to make players do the second quests. Which was cool because there were a lot of second quests so you could choose which one to do.
The EotN factions’ skills aren’t powerful, thoses reputations were for people who wanted to get the titles or the Hall of Monuments’s statues.

Guild Wars had no required farm,
I stayed with the same armor during 2.5 years in Guild Wars. The max stats stayed the SAME during the ENTIRE game, the ENTIRE game, during the whole 3 expansions.
And now I have to change my armor in not even 2 years, because “muh, we have to add a tier of stuff because we have to add a new farm-content, but don’t worry, it was all planed, we just forgot to add it at the release”

Jumping is like main thing in mmos so i can’t play gw1.

I think GW2 biggest problem is the LS. With guild wars it was all there. You could do it at your own pace. The LS just feels rushed, game play wise. You have to get through it as quick as you can so you don’t miss out. I’m glad I didn’t like winters day. So I could go do something else. I’ve mist a big chunk of the LS, mostly dew to the abysmal launch of south sun. Trying to do events and the karak or what ever they are called no loading in, I missed finishing flame and frost dew to not being able to fing a group to do the end dungeon. I know it’s in fractles now, but that’s not the point.

Guild Wars has a story you want and CAN replay. Guild Wars 2 has neither of these. The personal story starts off really well, right up to claw island. I really don’t remember the point to the missions after that. Where as in Guild Wars I’m confidant you could name a mission I could tell you the story. The other problem with the personal story are the big level gaps between some of the missions. Your in a race against time but need to be 5 levels higher to stand a chance of getting to the start point, let alone complete it.

What ever is coming next, I hope it is better than what we have had, and follows what we had in Guild Wars story telling and pertinent at your own pace content.

CoRtex.2157:

EdgarMTanaka.7291:

This is your opinion and I do not share it. In my opinion your statement is entirely false. I realy like the story and the mechanics of GW2. Compared to GW1 I had a hard time focusing on the story and get a feeling for the world until the end of Profecies and Factions, Nightfall was on the other hand perfect. I liked the story of EotN too.

GW2 story is realy interesting and makes me wanna see more, both LS and Main story and I realy hope that LS will mix in with the main story later.

Lol, gw2 interesting story… lol… Gotta find a my lost sister,, yeah, verry interesting… lol :P then there’s this uber epic dragon, and he doesn’t even do anything xD looool

I’m not sure you can separate story from mechanics…because stories have nothing to to do with mechanics. The dragon Zhaitan does in fact do something. You’re simply not following the story.

Your battle with Zhaitan isn’t a boss battle, which is a game mechanic. Your battle with Zhaitan begins at level 70 with the story. You then proceed to starve him, blind him, cripple him, cripple his ability to make undead and use a mega laser against him that was designed to be anti dragon magic by the asura. I suppose you think a better story would be that you could walk up to him and slay him with your sword. That’s not only overdone, but it’s not plausible in any way shape or form.

These dragons were forces of nature. Creatures so powerful that they could raise dead nations out of the sea. I’m not sure how you thought you could run up to it and hit it with a hammer.

The dragon did plenty. By the time you finally defeated it you’d been striking at it for a long time. The story is fine.

Some people just didn’t follow it.

lordkrall.7241:

Mada.5319:

Oh really now? What is this vertical progression you speak of?

Faction points.
Sunspear points.
Lightbringer points.
(Two of which were actually REQUIRED to even get past certain parts of the MAIN STORYLINE, and the third more or less required to do a certain dungeon or even certain parts of the world, including later missions.)

Ebon Vanguard points.
Deldrimor points.
Norn points.
Asura points.

I would say that was a rather massive amount of grind and vertical progression there, especially since all of those gave skills and most (all but Factions and Sunspear) gave very real and quite powerful passive effects when equipped.

You do realize that you didn’t have to max those titles to get the full effect of those skills/titles right? You only needed to reach rank 5 for most of them which was pathetically easy to get. You were pretty much already there just by completing the campaign.

Also, the “grind” to advance in the Nightfall story was hardly a grind. Grind means doing something repeatedly. Last I remembered most people did the side quests, which were all unique. It was also exclusive to Elonian characters. Tyrian/Canthans didn’t have to do them.

Mada.5319:

You do realize that you didn’t have to max those titles to get the full effect of those skills/titles right? You only needed to reach rank 5 for most of them which was pathetically easy to get. You were pretty much already there just by completing the campaign.

Also, the “grind” to advance in the Nightfall story was hardly a grind. Grind means doing something repeatedly. Last I remembered most people did the side quests, which were all unique. It was also exclusive to Elonian characters. Tyrian/Canthans didn’t have to do them.

And you don’t NEED to grind out Ascended Gear. All content can be fairly quickly completed with exotic gear that flows like water. But it DOES provide a significant improvement if you do put in the time and grind for the Ascended Gear. See how that cuts both ways?

I laugh at the idea of GW1 being this grind-free utopia its hardcore fans try to paint it out to be. You liked the novelty of the vertical progression being through skills rather than gear. That’s what it boils down to.

Not a long time ago I found out that ArenaNet which made GW1 and ArenaNet which made GW2, are completely different companies. Yes, some of the origin developers are still here, but they are so few.
And once I found out about it, I got over with it and just deleted the game. Will install it when we’ll have new lands, skills, etc.
Now I understand why GW2 is so much different from GW1. There is no point expecting from GW2 what we loved in GW1.

Guild Wars 1 and Guild Wrs 2 it’s like Gothic 1-3, made by Piranha Bytes, and Gothic 4: Arcania, made by Spellbound Entertainment. And we all know that Gothic 4 is not Gothic at all. It’s another game which just has the same universe.

So I wouldn’t expect from GW2 future updates what we loved in GW1. Different companies, different ideas, different views about how the game should look like.

chemiclord.3978:

Mada.5319:

You do realize that you didn’t have to max those titles to get the full effect of those skills/titles right? You only needed to reach rank 5 for most of them which was pathetically easy to get. You were pretty much already there just by completing the campaign.

Also, the “grind” to advance in the Nightfall story was hardly a grind. Grind means doing something repeatedly. Last I remembered most people did the side quests, which were all unique. It was also exclusive to Elonian characters. Tyrian/Canthans didn’t have to do them.

And you don’t NEED to grind out Ascended Gear. All content can be fairly quickly completed with exotic gear that flows like water. But it DOES provide a significant improvement if you do put in the time and grind for the Ascended Gear. See how that cuts both ways?

I laugh at the idea of GW1 being this grind-free utopia its hardcore fans try to paint it out to be. You liked the novelty of the vertical progression being through skills rather than gear. That’s what it boils down to.

One could get max level, max armor and weapon in GW1 in less than 4 hours.
Faction → first island, level 13 → Kaineng → Eye Of The North → Brawl Dungeon and XP Scrolls.

GW2 leveling and gear system is more grindy than in GW1.

Nick.6972:

One could get max level, max armor and weapon in GW1 in less than 4 hours.
Faction -> first island, level 13 -> Kaineng -> Eye Of The North -> Brawl Dungeon and XP Scrolls.

GW2 leveling and gear system is more grindy than in GW1.

This is true. Then again, GW2 is and was intended to be more akin to the traditional MMO experience (which is more grindy than GW1 by its nature). That should NOT have been a surprise.

But to herald GW1 as “grind-free” and “no vertical progression” is simply a falsehood.

I still play GW and I have the feeling the game is more active than 2011/2012

2 districts in ascalon (pre ) and 3 districts in kama, ToA has multiple parties lf people to do sc’s,

I still play it, it’s fun.