Guild Wars 2

Shootsfoot.9276:

I will say one thing that I think would improve GW2 world participation greatly, and that would be vanity drops…mini-pets, town-clothes…whatever. People love collecting these things. People in my guild in WoW go nuts over pets and rare mounts. I would think it would be the same here.

And no, I am NOT advocating mounts in this game…just an example.

This is an area that Anet could greatly improve upon. Lots of people love collecting things (mini-pets as an example). I find it fun collecting mini-pets in other games. Yes, having mini-pets is nice. But, the process of collecting them can also be just as fun. Anet is really missing out by limiting its mini-pet collection to a cash/gem shop only deal. This would be a perfectly good example of something to do at 80. I have not purchased any of the minis. I have no bragging rights or sense of accomplishment by just buying them.

or you grind pve, or continue the progressionless pvp/wvwvw.

btw just trolling, i am 175h in and love the game so far! just hit 80.

Apathy.6430:

Shootsfoot.9276:

I will say one thing that I think would improve GW2 world participation greatly, and that would be vanity drops…mini-pets, town-clothes…whatever. People love collecting these things. People in my guild in WoW go nuts over pets and rare mounts. I would think it would be the same here.

Meh, I don’t really want mounts in this game. I don’t think they are needed.

Wish you’d read my entire post just once.

Shootsfoot.9276:

It was said they were going to make it available by methods other than just running fractals.

The (many) questions asking if it will be easier/cheaper got ignored, though, which is telling.

The argument :“They made their idea of an engame in GW2”

Yes, and albert einstein created his theory which led to a way of splitting the atom to create energy, there’s a good and a bad side to everything when it comes to new ideas and creativity and if you think that ignoring them or claiming that it’s just how it is and deal with it, then with all due respect, you’re wrong. People do not have to like it, or to “shut up and put up”

The argument “Well maybe you should quit til there’s new content”

If we compare this game to console games, which have an abysmal and short longevity to them, then sure… BUT it’s not a console game is it? and I don’t believe we need to be approaching it from the assumption it is one, it certainly is not indicative of a great way of helping with player retention either, and especially not if we use arguments like, leaving is an option.

The argument: “do x, y, and z”

Some of these do have merit, and those making them aren’t totally incorrect, however they also seem to miss certain points or look at certain aspects of the game with rose tinted glasses, for example exploration is great! up until you naturally get sick of it and with nothing to feasably replace it for some folks, they inevitably take that break that leads to a permanent abandoning of the game inadvertently, sure they may want to come back, but the lack of motivation is killer.
Also events, you either catch them or you miss them all more or less from what I’ve seen personally, not that it matters, the events were just horrible in terms of traffic in Lions Arch… A criminally over-used City.

The argument: “IT’S A COMPUTER GAME”

Totally irrelevant to the discussion. The sky is also blue, it has little bearing on global warming, or the retail prices of oxygen tanks.

The argument: “There is a lot of content in the game, that’s your endgame”

Then perhaps the argument isn’t that there’s no endgame, but rather there’s no RELEVANT endgame for some.

The argument: “Get a life” (in any iteration or variant)

Ad hominem, cool story bro

The argument: “people rushed content”

Conjecture, there’s plenty of players who DID NOT rush their way to endgame and still feel the same, kindly stop using this fallacy.

The argument: “you log on for fun, that’s your carrot”

That would explain the lack of people logging on, they’re clearly not having fun. But thanks for helping to make the point of the other side of the community and bringing light to that issue yet again… lol

The argument: “Guild Wars 2 = pvp”

Please, stop classifying a PVX game as a PVP game, it’s most irritating and is most misinformed, if that was the case why even bother with PVE content at all?
so ridiculous a claim… (sigh)

The argument: “I have been 80 for ages and I have never wondered what to do.
I have enjoyed myself immensely doing things I like and setting my own goals.
I have never felt the need for “endgame content” and I always thought that was just code for saying I am more powerful than you, so I get the cool stuffs and get to do the cool content but you don’t.
GW2 is fun from lvl1 and it is just as much fun to me as an old 80.”

This deserved a full quote, it’s a complex issue which really neeed….nah it’s simple, people claiming this would obviously be content with a cardboard box and their imagination, kudos to them for it and they deserve the respect to get more out of something than others but the argument that you can make your own fun in the game can be made of any shoddy and badly designed/made product so it doesn’t really have much bearing on others. Ideally we’d all feel this way, but it’s not an ideal world.

The argument: “play for 15-20 hours a week and it unfolds at a nice pace”

That’s not even that much less than a lot of players have clocked in, and they are still saying the same things. The time spent getting to the lack of reasonably repeatable enjoyable content in some areas, does not mean they don’t exist. This is the same as the “get a life” or “don’t rush to engame” arguments, they’re just not valid.

So yeah, in summary the game has issues, and the arguments are often of the same several flavors of invalid responses or subjective opinions.
“I didn’t have that problem because I’ve made my own fun”
“I didn’t have that problem because I have a life”
“I didn’t have that problem because I play several other games at the same time”
“I didn’t have that problem because I only play PVP/WPVP/pet hunting”

And so forth, and so forth….

Reaver.9256:

“The MMO market is so competitive these days. GW1 was successful because it targeted a niche market. GW2 prior to 11/16 appeared to target a niche. Marketing your endgame approach as “Endgame Reimagined” sent a clear signal that this would not be the same old same old.”

Why would you ever cater a MMO to a “niche” market. They are in it to make a lot of money. Rehashing GW1 was not going to make them that money.

wrong, niche market CAN make money if you are different than the other run-of-the-mill games, if people wanted dungeon and gear grinds, there are plenty out there (RIFT, WOW, etc) besides GW2. Anet made a wrong choice, plain and simple.

This game has plenty to do after reaching 80. More than any other mmo I’ve played, and I’ve played a few. That’s not to say it is perfect, it does have its issues, but when it comes to things to do at end game, it is way ahead of the competition. Let’s see what’s on offer:

Dynamic Event Chains – There are hundreds of these events all across Tyria and, thanks to the level scaling in this game, as a level 80 character you have access to ALL of these events, not just the events equal to or less than you level. I have 2 level 80 characters and 1 level 55 character, and I’m still coming across events I haven’t seen before.

World Bosses – These massive group events occur at different times across many different areas. They are often epic in scale and require a lot of players to have any chance of success.

Jumping Puzzles – There are a large selection of easy to difficult jumping puzzles to find and beat. At the end of which is usually a reward.

WvWvW – It kind of goes without saying that WvWvW is the ultimate end game activity. It is an on going battle vs 2 other worlds. And when the battle is finally won/drawn/lost you get to fight 2 more worlds.

sPvP/ tPvP – Although this side of the game is a little limited in my opinion, due to there only being one game type, I am confident they will expand on this over time. But even as it is now, it is a fun distraction that can take up a good amount of your time. And I’m sure Anet can eventually make this the good eSport it deserves to be.

Altism/Multiple Personal Stories – If, like me, you like to have more than 1 character, then level 80 is definitely not the end. And for the completionists out there, there are many different PS arcs to experience for the difference choices you make at character creation.

Hidden Treasure – As well as hidden chests and monsters to discover and fight, there are many hidden secrets in the world of Tyria, that are not highlight by an achievement or map icon. Tyria is a living and breathing world, so why not just go out there and explore. Help those you come across and perhaps join up with them as they battle their way across the map.

Dungeons – Not only do they tell a story, but they have various ways to complete them, and on top of that have their own little dynamic events to make things more interesting. They can be very challenging and often require good coordination and teamwork. And now, with the addition of the fractals dungeon, players who enjoy this type of content will have access to an ever expanding dungeon experience.

Other stuff and things to come – If the above is not enough for you there are always mini games, such as Keg Brawl, and Anet has hinted at things such as player created content. More mini games, events, fractals and other things will be added over time, but to be honest there is already more than enough to be getting on with.

WvWvW, and SPvP/TPvP alone is far more fun and exciting then any lame dungeon or raid could ever be, and they are the “Endgame”.

So if you Don’t like these things go play WoW Tera or Aion. The rest of us came here to replace DAoC and Guild Wars, and GW2 has succeded in this for most of us.

Again everyone else can feel free to leave, there are other games you know.

rchu.8945:

Reaver.9256:

“The MMO market is so competitive these days. GW1 was successful because it targeted a niche market. GW2 prior to 11/16 appeared to target a niche. Marketing your endgame approach as “Endgame Reimagined” sent a clear signal that this would not be the same old same old.”

Why would you ever cater a MMO to a “niche” market. They are in it to make a lot of money. Rehashing GW1 was not going to make them that money.

wrong, niche market CAN make money if you are different than the other run-of-the-mill games, if people wanted dungeon and gear grinds, there are plenty out there (RIFT, WOW, etc) besides GW2. Anet made a wrong choice, plain and simple.

Just because somebody’s opinion doesn’t match yours does not automatically make that opinion wrong.

Personally I use my 80 character to dungeon, and work on my world completion, and WvW and PvP…. so there’s lots to do.

Rin.1046:

Let’s see what’s on offer:
Dynamic Event Chains – There are hundreds of these events all across Tyria and, thanks to the level scaling in this game, as a level 80 character you have access to ALL of these events, not just the events equal to or less than you level. I have 2 level 80 characters and 1 level 55 character, and I’m still coming across events I haven’t seen before.

These chain events are often unappealing, the scaled loot doesn’t exactly fill my heart with joy, and the karmic rewards are often a drop in the ocean of grind to anything new, sure they’re one of the positives, but they are FAR from compelling to seek out and many are badly tuned for single adventurers

World Bosses – These massive group events occur at different times across many different areas. They are often epic in scale and require a lot of players to have any chance of success.

They usually don’t happen anywhere near enough to warrant completion and get forgotten easily due to being “out of the way”

WvWvW – It kind of goes without saying that WvWvW is the ultimate end game activity. It is an on going battle vs 2 other worlds. And when the battle is finally won/drawn/lost you get to fight 2 more worlds.

Balancing issues, culling issues, zergs, lack of a feeling of impact when things happen. At least I can say the hackers have been somewhat diminished as are the bots, it’s a great game mode and I’m not trying to unfairly diss it, but I don’t think it’s got THAT much of a pull for everyone and that’s ok, but just because a horse has 3 good legs doesn’t mean it isn’t in trouble with one broken one.

sPvP/ tPvP – Although this side of the game is a little limited in my opinion, due to there only being one game type, I am confident they will expand on this over time. But even as it is now, it is a fun distraction that can take up a good amount of your time. And I’m sure Anet can eventually make this the good eSport it deserves to be.

This is true, but we’re all waiting to see aren’t we? many have already called A-Nets manifesto and marketing into question, whilst I don’t entirely share these complaints and have some faith in them I fully understand where the entire “We’ll believe it when we see it” group are coming from.

Altism/Multiple Personal Stories – If, like me, you like to have more than 1 character, then level 80 is definitely not the end. And for the completionists out there, there are many different PS arcs to experience for the difference choices you make at character creation.

THEY.ARE.AWFUL.

Sorry but halfway through my own story a key character I went to ORR itself to save miraculously forgot who I was, it really did ruin a halfway decent story immediately for me, there were some good characters, but they were diamonds in the rough as it needs a bit of polish imho, but no amount of alts will make me want to level them in a game that lacks fun activities for me and seems to just devolve into grind mid to late game and continue on in this vein

Hidden Treasure – As well as hidden chests and monsters to discover and fight, there are many hidden secrets in the world of Tyria, that are not highlight by an achievement or map icon. Tyria is a living and breathing world, so why not just go out there and explore. Help those you come across and perhaps join up with them as they battle their way across the map.

Would be more relevant if everyone was as crazy about getting 100% map completion and exploration, not everyone is and that’s something players will have to deal with

Dungeons – Not only do they tell a story, but they have various ways to complete them, and on top of that have their own little dynamic events to make things more interesting. They can be very challenging and often require good coordination and teamwork. And now, with the addition of the fractals dungeon, players who enjoy this type of content will have access to an ever expanding dungeon experience.

Yes, shame you get both a combination of elitist jerks, horribly selfish bad players and it’s “gated but not gated” also, while I applaud the dungeon designer for a job well done on most parts, as rob seems like a great guy worthy of some respect, I have to say the differences in the dungeons like TA having no waypoints etc and some irritating mechanics or just bland mechanics can at times lead to players avoiding the dungeon totally I’ve yet to try FoTM and I hear it’s good, but honestly I don’t WANT this game to end in nothing but dungeons for me :S even though I love them as a player personally, that doesn’t mean that it’s right for me to say
“games fine people, so stop crying”

Answers to points in Bold

hellkaiser, how many hours did you play and WHY ?

[Edit]

[Edited by CC: Insulting]

I’m not sure I’d call starting at lvl 1 endgame because endgame is usually a point where the majority of content is available/do-able…. Pretty sure lvl 1s can’t do anything beyond the very beginnings of the respective starter zones. If, on the other hand, we all started at level 80 and basically had to run around the world map acquiring skills, that would be endgame because all the content is available.

That being said, I don’t think this game lacks endgame as much as “lasting endgame” in a lot of folks’ minds…. I don’t know what the formula for “lasting endgame” is or even if there is one since it’s really is all a subjective experience. For me, I think it’s a combination of things such as lack of variety of armor skins (medium armor wearer bias), too much RNG/grindiness to obtain cosmetic variety, lackluster encounter mechanics in dungeons and DEs, the mechanics related to professions creating an imbalance, and combat pacing in general (I’m sure this isn’t my full list, but at least a few I can think of off the top of my head).

I’ve seen the endgame debate brought up numerous times and thought I would contribute. First I have to ask, what do we even mean by end-game? In order to complete a level 80 character, you would need to finish the entire continent of Orr, get full exotics, get your legendary weapon, complete all dungeons (now including fractals), get 100% map completion, and complete your personal story. If end game means the amount of game left after you reach maximum level, there is more than enough endgame, so the complaint can’t be about that.

I suppose the endgame outcry is over people not having things to do to advance their characters in power past completion (i.e. the complaint is not that there is no end-game but that they don’t want the progression in the game to have an end.) I don’t think this is a healthy attitude to have towards a game (or towards life really – there’s something to be said for actually enjoying your life rather than just trying to race towards an arbitrary and ever shifting goal line at the expense of personal fulfillment- but I digress). Let’s indulge those of differing opinion, however, and consider how this might be remedied without turning game-play into a gear grind.

Maybe level 80 characters should receive a buff for completing dungeons, with a unique buff for each dungeon, that can not be removed through boon removal but that suffers a state of decay and ultimately vanishes if you do not regularly complete the dungeon. Just by way of example, perhaps the Flame Citadel could provide a buff that reads: Heart of Fire -24h – your every third attack has a 50% chance to cause burning to your target. Burning deals 5% less damage to you. Heart of Fire’s duration is reset whenever you complete the Flame Citadel dungeon in explorable mode. In this way, the hardcore gamer would constantly have power to work towards, without the power provided becoming a significant competitive deterrent to casual PvE gamers. The dungeon buffs could provide aura particle effects for good measure to aid in the player’s sense of expanded power.

if you did all the content (all dungeons explo and map complete), obviously you will play less.

but thats like 400h ?

i mean.. that would have been playing minimum 30hours a week since release.
do you think a lot of people have done that??

PearlGore.7419:

WvWvW, and SPvP/TPvP alone is far more fun and exciting then any lame dungeon or raid could ever be, and they are the “Endgame”.

So if you Don’t like these things go play WoW Tera or Aion. The rest of us came here to replace DAoC and Guild Wars, and GW2 has succeded in this for most of us.

Again everyone else can feel free to leave, there are other games you know.

The “If you don’t like it leave… it’s our super special clubhouse” argument is wearing REAL thin…

No one wants to return to WoW, they’ve made their own mistakes and large ones, the games constantly cannibalizing and ghettoizing itself. Read a few articles online about it, Aion is a P2W game you cannot even be serious here… and Tera, not even sure what to make of that comment…

hellkaiser, how many hours did you play and WHY ?

[Edit]

[Edit]

I played plenty of hours, I ended up grinding dungeons because of several things

1: SPVP was fun enough for a short laugh, but lacks structured systems and seems to just generally exist and with so much lack of variation in game types it’s kinda always going to just slowly push towards an effective meta… Bunkers say hi.

2: I tried to get into crafting, but the market is a horrific mess. precursor market or go away ...

3: I had hopes for the events… however. The event items were horrible to obtain, contained in random “pseudo gambling” boxes of fail, and all in all the events where laggy, uninteresting and buggy to say the least. No I don’t demand perfection but seriously, is LA the America of their world? seems if anything happens it’s THERE and ONLY there.

4: WPVP was reasonably fun until the culling issues just caught up with it, soon you were dead before you had a chance to see what was killing you, I just don’t find that fun.. nor does zerging feel fun either, sure it’s in some way realistic… but that’s not why I was logging on to GW2. Lets not forget the hackers too.

So I made plenty of attempt at the game, and it just fizzled out for me. I levelled up some alts to a reasonable level but it all felt like there was amazing ideas that just weren’t implemented right, sure given time it may improve but until I see it I’ll find it hard to believe, given that there’s been no real swaying arguments that are inherently valid for me I’ve found logging back in something that I’m not that compelled to do

And I bought this game, so telling me that I should just leave it. Is both asinine and insulting to boot. It’s a game in continuous development and it can be better and without ruining the game for other people either in any way shape or form.

[Edited by CC: Reaction to an insult removed, aggressive word replaced]

well you are one hell of a critique.

i play 15h a week since release.
thats 2 work days.

i have not nearly come close to burn out the content.

you, my friend, i dont know whats good for you… maybe change game style? mmo are taking your life away + you seem to feel miserable and hated all the ones you played…

PearlGore.7419:

WvWvW, and SPvP/TPvP alone is far more fun and exciting then any lame dungeon or raid could ever be, and they are the “Endgame”.

So if you Don’t like these things go play WoW Tera or Aion. The rest of us came here to replace DAoC and Guild Wars, and GW2 has succeded in this for most of us.

Again everyone else can feel free to leave, there are other games you know.

I love these kinds of posts. “This is my opinion, those who don’t agree should quit the game now.”

I have news, friend…you have no frigging CLUE why “the rest of us” came to this game.

[Edit]

[Edited by CC: Sentence removed, offending]

You can get 100% exploration, make a legendary, get a dungeon armor set, play PVP, farm, play the market, or my favorite right now do Fractals.

Or… just start a new character with a whole new choice of story, race, and profession.

Gosh so few options… if you’re ignoring all the amazing content that’s there I guess.

Avatar.1923:

well you are one hell of a critique.

i play 15h a week since release.
thats 2 work days.

i have not nearly come close to burn out the content.

you, my friend, i dont know whats good for you… maybe change game style? mmo are taking your life away + you seem to feel miserable and hated all the ones you played…

I’ll fix this for you

Avatar.1923:

I have not nearly come close to burn*ing* out on the content personally.

I dont know whats best for you

All done, nothing more to do here

You can get 100% exploration, make a legendary, get a dungeon armor set, play PVP, farm, play the market, or my favorite right now do Fractals.

Or… just start a new character with a whole new choice of story, race, and profession.

Gosh so few options… if you’re ignoring all the amazing content that’s there I guess.

Those suggestions where brought up, answered, brought up again and answered AGAIN and again and again and again.

As for ignoring content, we’re all ignoring that if we bought the retail boxed cd of GW2 it doubles as a coaster for your cups and mugs!!! omg!!!!

[Edit]

[Edited by CC: Offensive to the users contributing to this thread]

Hellkaiser.6025:

…stuff leading up to…
“games fine people, so stop crying”*

I never said ‘games fine people, stop crying’. I was merely pointing out that there IS a lot of end game content and people DO enjoy them.

Sure, there are issues with all of those items, but for the most part, as far as I and others are concerned, they are fun to play, with room for improvement. If you turn events into gear acquisition then of course you are going to be a little disappointed. But I don’t play events, wvw, dungeons or whatever for the loot, I play them for fun, which for the most part I have. Loot drops, boss spawns, dungeon mechanics, these are all things that need tweaking. But Anet knows this and I’m sure they will do their best to iron these things out. We just need to be a bit more patient and give them time.

So, to repeat what I was trying to say. There ARE a lot of things to do end game. But if you don’t like any of them, then I guess it’s time to move on and try again later.

Rin.1046:

…stuff leading up to…
“games fine people, so stop crying”

I never said ‘games fine people, stop crying’. I was merely pointing out that there IS a lot of end game content and people DO enjoy them.

Sure, there are issues with all of those items, but for the most part, as far as I and others are concerned, they are fun to play, with room for improvement. If you turn events into gear acquisition then of course you are going to be a little disappointed. But I don’t play events, wvw, dungeons or whatever for the loot, I play them for fun, which for the most part I have. Loot drops, boss spawns, dungeon mechanics, these are all things that need tweaking. But Anet knows this and I’m sure they will do their best to iron these things out. We just need to be a bit more patient and give them time.

So, to repeat what I was trying to say. There ARE a lot of things to do end game. But if you don’t like any of them, then I guess it’s time to move on and try again later.

I was perhaps being a bit hasty and putting words in mouths, however when the arguments are the same and come to the same conclusion

“move on and leave”

Then you can hardly blame players that WANT this game to succeed from stepping back and saying to themselves, “Does ANYONE want me playing this game?”

The players tell us to move on, we feel like moving on due to the issues and the lack of real progress towards fixing them, and in the meantime they tack on laggy and buggy events in a seemingly clear attempt to appeal to the “content locusts”

By all means, it may be the logical step for players to leave the game, you’re somewhat right in that regard from that standpoint, but you’re dead wrong if you think that that’s good for the game or that many players will return no matter what changes.
It seems people just don’t care about other gamers/consumers and instead think of themselves and THEIR enjoyment of the game, if they don’t coincide with others then so what? sure players leave the game in droves, some temporary, statistically most PERMANENTLY. But hey they’re ok and so it doesn’t matter.

Instead of striving to see what’s going wrong and find a happy medium, players take it at face value and to be honest, it’s kind of disappointing.

what disscussion ?

some people say the game is good, some people say it is bad.
whos right?

if you want to take one aspect of the game and discuss how it could be improved, that would be a discussion.
right now, its only opinion voicing.

btw, GW2 is perfect.

:/

Try to get all WvW tittles.

Avatar.1923:

what disscussion ?

some people say the game is good, some people say it is bad.
whos right?

if you want to take one aspect of the game and discuss how it could be improved, that would be a discussion.
right now, its only opinion voicing.

btw, GW2 is perfect.

:/

And you claim I’m the one trolling? lol

Your issue with me is that I called you on an attempt to make the issues out to be with me, my playing style, hours played and attitude towards the game whilst ignoring the rest, a lazy cop out if ever there was one. It was Ad hominem at it’s best although mild. I’m not in question here, my approach to the game is not in question and I’m looking at the game as calmly and logically as I can, the last thing I and any others that agree with me deserve, is to be told that the problem is with us and we should stop voicing our opinions and leave the game… it’s rude, it’s not productive and it’s silly

And whilst opinions are just that, and everyone’s entitled to their own it’s safer to regard those thinking systems and content could improve for the betterment of all are closer to what’s right opposed to those that claim “It’s perfect” which is of course is a bold statement at best to be generous.

I believe this game can be better, that’s my point and that’s my stance. And I do not deserve to have have my opinions become about “how many hours I’ve played” or “what sort of games I came from” or any of that useless drivel.

However, you do bring up a salvageable point, so let’s look at in particular one thing that could be improved upon…

“The inherent grind in the game”

There’s a nice off putting aspect in the game, something that goes against it’s own pre release manifesto, why do a lot of the so called long term goals require mindless farming and grinding?

just being cool;
yeah, this game could be better.

want to discuss about it?

maybe if i know how many hours you played so i can gauge where you re from and whats left of original content for you.

and maybe i knew what type of games you like so we can see how gw2 could be improve so that you become constructive and less complaining.

then it would be a start.

im still cool.

re your post update;

the grind.

ok, there is a slight grind.
but the grind is not necessary to unlock more content or to be distinctively stronger. imo.
the whole game is about getting better gear and exploring.
when you start to redo the same content endlessly for a small bonus, i really think its “game over”. again, imo, its time to level and alt or wait for anet to put more content.
keep in mind; a good amount of players are in fact grinders, and anet wants to be nice to them too.
there is pvp too. if you like. this is an area in which i think they dropped the ball. i dont feel its well structured. but thats my opinion.

all in all, gw2 is cool for different type of players, not perfect at any of those type of game, but the fact that it actually incorporate all those types of games and make them “quite” good, is already a huge feat!

Avatar.1923:

if you did all the content (all dungeons explo and map complete), obviously you will play less.

but thats like 400h ?

i mean.. that would have been playing minimum 30hours a week since release.
do you think a lot of people have done that??

I’m well over 400 hours and I have on my highest level character only 70% map completion and I have maybe done 1 path in a handful of dungeons and a few fractals. Mind you I do spend a good deal of time in WvW and I do have many character so I’ve run through the low level stuff multiple times but still!

Exploring all the content in the game does not just take hundreds of hours, but I would suspect a thousand or more.

if you add up pvp and wvwvw, and all classes, mastering this game is on fact probably close to a thousand hours.
just one class is still 500+.
and good luck being in the best spvp team, even after 500.

@Bruno Sardine said “That being said, I don’t think this game lacks endgame as much as “lasting endgame” in a lot of folks’ minds…. I don’t know what the formula for “lasting endgame” is or even if there is one since it’s really is all a subjective experience. For me, I think it’s a combination of things such as lack of variety of armor skins (medium armor wearer bias), too much RNG/grindiness to obtain cosmetic variety, lackluster encounter mechanics in dungeons and DEs, the mechanics related to professions creating an imbalance, and combat pacing in general (I’m sure this isn’t my full list, but at least a few I can think of off the top of my head).”

Good point. But these are issues with the content itself, not that there is “nothing to do after reaching max level.”

1. Bugs do exist and keep any level from playing the content. Arenanet has said this is a top priority. They need to be constantly fixing these to return the game to the level of stability it had at launch.

2. Some people may not like any or all of the content in GW2. They tried it for a while, maybe even hit lvl 80 and realize it is not for them. Arenanet can or should not do anything about this. They have a content design that will not appeal to everyone. Those players should find something that does appeal to them.

3. Some people find the content lacking depth or freshness. This is more in alignment with your point. This is the challenge area that Arenanet could focus on. How they address this may determine the life of this game? If they move forward with their plan laid out in “Endgame Reimagined,” and supported in other interviews, Tyria may develop into an ever-changing, exciting world. If not, it may end up a dead zone.

Again, none of this has anything to do with the lack of content. It is more related to the quality of the content and/or people’s preference for the content being offered.

I personally like the content and hope they do not decide to go the “traditional endgame route” by adding things such as raids. Radically changing their reimagined endgame will not add quality, it will just make it the same as other MMORPGs.

it is the same as other mmos in its current state.
with better everything (mostly).

but we are far from a revolution.

can Anet change the whole thing? how long will it take for them to make content that will feel revolutionary in term of online world ?

i doubt it.
but hey, everybody have its chance in this world!

btw, i enjoy the game.
but its clearly a classic “mmo”.

I am currently doing the Jumping Puzzle and Explorer Achievements. Some of them are really good and you explore new areas in the game, that you haven’t seen before. And there are a lot of them.

redhare.9210:

I have just recently hit 80. I find your post great. There is still plenty to do. i have only 175 or so hearts completed. Between that and all the other dungeons and exp modes i still have months of content. The best part is I am not paying so if i get bored i just need a break and come back in a couple of days.

But once you have all that completed then what? There is nothing. For the most part you “beat the game” when you have 100% world completed. Only other option is to start another character and do it all over again but with different skills.

Sorry but this isn’t a game that will continue on for years like other MMOs. There has to be some sort of end game content else it’s just like your normal $60 console game that you can beat and will never play again.

Avatar.1923:

snip

Well arguing wont’ get us far so by all means I’ll try and offer up the same things I’ve said before…
The initial point in your previous post however should be addressed however.
Time spent playing the game isn’t really indicative of enjoyment of the game, sure it helps to understand a game, but why is it I can jump into a game of a similar genre after so many years of gaming and quickly adapt and get a feel for it’s systems faster than a new player to gaming? time spent playing is “a” factor, but it’s not a “huge” factor and it’s often given way more credit than it deserves.

I can spend five minutes doing something and decide I hate it, just as easily as I can spend five years doing something before I come to the same conclusion.

So lets move on to hopefully some common ground

the game is about getting better gear up to a point wherein it becomes purely aesthetic, or at least that was the idea, some aesthetics would be bought through micro-transactions and others would be earned through gameplay, this did not have to mean what we were given on release in the form of “legen-dairy” farm weapons.
Which is one of the few aesthetic long term goals the game offers at the moment.
To me this was mistake and red flag “numero uno”
It’s not that I personally burned out on this, I didn’t even bother trying because it just looked painful and reliant on too much RNG and farming/flipping items… that’s not legendary to me. You can also get unique skins from dungeons, this seemed good and all…

The reality was that you’d (in it’s last incarnation anyways) 60 tokens per path once a day, and then 20 thereafter, meaning some would log on and play 3 paths of a dungeon… then log off… I don’t see why this is necessary, some dungeon sets weren’t even deemed worthwhile to get aesthetically, we had discrepancies in the dungeons as I mentioned before (TA being one run, no wp’s with cheese deaths galore) and ultimately people just avoided it because aside from being a painful experience for a niche set, it was a grind to get it all… It all added up and needlessly. Someone said early on after release that this was a problem that A-Net had for a while

“here is our game, please jump in and play but our priorities are now to protect it from you as much as possible”

Simple way of helping to reinforce the casual aspect of the game:

stop gating us in terms of token rewards, maybe I’m weird but personally when I’m done with getting my gear, no matter how short or long a time it takes I tend to chillax and hang out more, maybe help some others in runs because the pressures off and I reached that small goal I set myself and got a nice new set of threads for it, but if that takes way too long I generally get the feeling I’m grinding aimlessly and lose focus, then I wonder why I’m bothering and then I log out. given that those rewards are now diminished, with the inclusion of ascended you can imagine how it seems even MORE pointless and a bad time sink.

WPVP was a mess with hackers (at the time) and then the culling issues as well meaning invisible zergs. I don’t hate on those that love it and I hope the best for it but it’s just not for me honestly, I dabble every now and then but it just seems like a gold sink for the best part.

suggestion to improve: I don’t know, I’m sure there are more serious wpvp’ers that would have better ideas than me, if you wanted an outsiders opinion, stop the repair bills and make smaller groups have more impact as opposed to zergs, culling prevents this I think so that might not even be possible.

I could ramble on about these improvements, but I think they’ve all been mentioned already tbh, some are recognized by A-Net, others not. I don’t expect the game to be perfect and it certainly doesn’t have the truly frustratingly crap issues that WoW has that drove me from it after only a year, it’s a good game we have, but it could be WAY less grindy and boring and not so reliant on one city for every bloody update lol…

If the movie independence day was filmed in Tyria, the aliens would have blown up the lions statue instead of the white house, it’s ridiculous that nothing else happens anywhere else, and their housing market must be shot to bits…

Found this is another post. Colin Johanson, Arenanet Lead Content Designer, gave an interview in September 2011. One of the questions asked about what people could do after reaching level cap.

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/19473-interview-gw2-qa-cd-projekt-conference/

The full quote is below but here is a summary of what he suggested.
1. Create an alt (replay personal story with new race).
2. Participate in DEs in high-level zones (assuming he means Orr or Frostgorge).
3. Dungeons (Do story. Then do Explorable mode and choose different paths to vary the experience).
4. Competitive PVP (regular and tournament).
5. WvW
6. Mini-games (right now there is just Keg Brawl but it appears they are planning more).
7. Achievements

The game has all of that right now. That was their vision of what you could do after reaching level cap.

If you now find it boring, please make suggestions in the Suggestions forum on how Arenanet can improve upon their content. It would be better to do that than asking them to add new things they never intended to have in the first place. Or if you just do not like it, its okay. There are other games that may offer what you are looking for.

Colin Johanson Quote:

“Q: I know you are focusing on finishing the game and co-experience but what about the end-level and high-level content for players who max out their characters? What’s in store for them?

A: GW2 offers an extremely rich end-game experience for players. We talked a little bit earlier about the personal story your character has, it’s a unique story for your characters as you play through the game.
One of the options that is available to you is the re-play option, you can actually go back, you can create a brand new character and you can play through level 1-80 experiencing a completely different story and learn a different story of the world through that character. There are tons of different story lines available through the game. (…) And as you re-play the story you will experience some new DE through the world that you’ve never seen before.
You can also take your level 80 character and you can go to high level parts of the world and you can participate in DE that are going on there. (…) We have our dungeons, which we mentioned earlier. Dungeons come in two forms, there is a story version which is a more casual, pick-up version of the dungeon and that tells you the story of important characters in the GW2 world. When you finish the story dungeon you unlock the explorable dungeon and the explorable dungeon is our difficult, five-man raid content. This is intended a lot for the max level characters.
When you do explorable dungeons your party gets to actually vote on which path you want to take through the dungeon and every dungeon has at least three paths you can take through. So unlike a traditional MMO where basically there is a dungeon and you beat it in a very specific way and if you want to play it again you do it the same way all over again. We offer three different, or more, paths that you can pick from so each time the dungeon can work differently. And as you play through that dungeon there are DE in the dungeon, just like what you find out in the open road.
These DE have a random chance of occurrence and can actually change the content you experience in the dungeon so, every time you play through it, it feels like something different and unique.(…)
Another thing we have is our competitive PvP which is our hot joinable PvP or tournament PvP, we also have WvWvW PvP which is your server matched up against 2 other servers in a two week long battle royal. This is hundreds and thousands of players fighting across multiple maps to earn points for their server. At the end of two weeks the server that wins gets bonuses, then the servers are matched up against new servers to fight again.
You can play that all the way form level 1 to 80 and you can play it constantly at level 80. There are also mini games, there are achievements you can earn, there are world tournaments that you can do as well. There is all sorts of endgame content available. And we will have a lot more, we’ll constantly add more free content to the game once the game has been released so people can go back and experience more and more content not just as the game goes out but also as it continues to go from that point forward too."

It’s funny, the question never came up for me before the patch as I knew pretty much how I wanted to play the game. I realize they added a gear treadmill to satisfy those who “want something to aim for”. I believe a lot of people who bought GW2 were burned out on treadmills and came here for relief. I know I was. The introduction of “something to aim for” has had a paradoxical effect on me and maybe others. I have 3 level 80 characters and since the patch I don’t know what to do with them in the future. I know I don’t want to hop on another gear treadmill, but that will become more and more necessary over time. People who question that probably aren’t familiar with treadmills and how they work. They just think that’s the way an MMO is. Now that Guild Wars won’t be “another” kind of MMO I’m in the place the folks who wanted a treadmill were. They have a solution now provided by the game company, but OK, I’m 80 now, what do I do in GW2 that isn’t part of the grind?

what sort of “endgame” does wow feature? mostly carrots on a stick & similar kitten!
run max. level dungeons til you have the right gear score, then run LFR/raid till you have the right gearscore to advance & so on…
pvp is the same maps over and over till you received enough marks for all the top pvp-gear – which then might give you an equal chance somewhat based on player skill. great. sitting around in SW, waiting.Yay great content…
the point where GW2 misses out – it offers more complete controls/movement but not enough.
I’ve played various competition FPS for literally thousands of hours – even without shiny numbers to rush after which might give me a advantage over a more skilled players just because…well dunno, some game dev thought that’s a good example of gameplay.
the reward should be getting better and seeing the results, t/spvp is a good step but otherswise GW2 falls short (wvw esp.). it’s just a shame they didn’t have the balls to follow through.
GAME =/= WORK
it should always be like with other hobbies, get better at the thing you enjoy doing. fun via skill progress.

Rake.7169:

what sort of “endgame” does wow feature? mostly carrots on a stick & similar kitten!
run max. level dungeons til you have the right gear score, then run LFR/raid till you have the right gearscore to advance & so on…
pvp is the same maps over and over till you received enough marks for all the top pvp-gear – which then might give you an equal chance somewhat based on player skill. great. sitting around in SW, waiting.Yay great content…
the point where GW2 misses out – it offers more complete controls/movement but not enough.
I’ve played various competition FPS for literally thousands of hours – even without shiny numbers to rush after which might give me a advantage over a more skilled players just because…well dunno, some game dev thought that’s a good example of gameplay.
the reward should be getting better and seeing the results, t/spvp is a good step but otherswise GW2 falls short (wvw esp.). it’s just a shame they didn’t have the balls to follow through.
GAME =/= WORK
it should always be like with other hobbies, get better at the thing you enjoy doing. fun via skill progress.

I think where you’re going at is both inherent issues with WPVP mechanics, and class build imbalances… not all builds are created equal etc.

WoW is imho a TERRIBLE example of a ghettoized game however. And it has a HORRIFIC toxic community.

dalendria.3762:

Found this is another post. Colin Johanson, Arenanet Lead Content Designer, gave an interview in September 2011. One of the questions asked about what people could do after reaching level cap.

http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/19473-interview-gw2-qa-cd-projekt-conference/

The full quote is below but here is a summary of what he suggested.
1. Create an alt (replay personal story with new race).
2. Participate in DEs in high-level zones (assuming he means Orr or Frostgorge).
3. Dungeons (Do story. Then do Explorable mode and choose different paths to vary the experience).
4. Competitive PVP (regular and tournament).
5. WvW
6. Mini-games (right now there is just Keg Brawl but it appears they are planning more).
7. Achievements

The game has all of that right now. That was their vision of what you could do after reaching level cap.

1. Personal story is okay in the race chapter, but the order and pact ones could really benefit from improvement. Currently there’s no real point in doing the order part more than three times, and pact part more than once. More personalization in that parts is needed. Meaningful links between parts are necessary, so they don’t seem to be completely independent pieces. Quality of the story needs to be improved as well – some parts are really bland now (and there’s the problem of Trahaerne…).

2. We need more high-level zones, we need better current zones (visiting orr makes me want to scream. Frostgorge is generally okay though). We also need better incentives to doing DE’s there (and not only there – the rewards for all zones should be reviewed and adjusted. Up, not down.)

3. Dungeons – again, rewards still need to be looked at, and content tweaked. More dungeons eventually, of course, but at the moment that is not a priority.

4,5 – not being a PvP person, i won’t comment on it too much, but from what i hear at least sPvP seem to have still a lot of problems to be looked at

6. currently there is only keg brawl. They may be working on more (and should be), but it doesn’t mean these are here now. We could do well with a lot more minigames than just one for each racial city. And again, they should offer maningful rewards.

In short – there’s still a lot more to do in these categories.

Looking at AMA and lot of answers with “we wanted to have it on opening” i get the feeling, that the game has been rushed to shops at least a year before it should have been. Too many things are not finished, incomplete, or just plain broken.

Hi OP, what is left? A ton, let me list what you can do.

1. You can farm for your legendary if you do not have one, this will take hundreds, if not thousands of hours of grinding mobs to gain all components, but hey, longevity in an MMO is what people want, right, win win!

2. You can run dungeons over and over and over and over and over and over to get badges to get a new weapon or armor skin.

3. You can re-run the odd sights you noticed during exploration as the majority now give you an achievement whereas they did not the first time you discovered them….

4. The jumping puzzles are always a hoot to re run…..

5. You can spend all your hard earned gold crafting, and even getting an achievement for learning all the craft trades.

6. You can start farming Plix, the ultimate in a farming end game reward, over and over and over and over…..

7. You can farm the magical number…250!!!! As this number is the key to all recipes in this wonderful magical land.

8. You can begin the Fractal of the mists dungeon, the place where the new vertical progression starts, also a new feature in GW2!! Get your ascended gear!

9. You can pvp in a semi structured environment or world verse 3, bring lots of gold though, and only play at a certain time, and transfer to the currently winning server to ensure your greatness in history.

Whew! Lots to do once you hit level 80!!

Sushi.1406:

I think the issue is because most people are used to gearing up for somekind of content in other MMOs. However GW2 literally has no endgame. None. The only thing you have to do is 100 percent the map OR go for a legendary. You can grind for gear but for what? Just to look cool?

Most people were disappointed by the lack of actual content to complete at level 80.

^
^
^
^
THIS. THIS. THIS.

Could not agree more. When I hit level 80 I was like: Umm… ok…? Wtf am I supposed to do now? Theres no endgame content. Why gear up? Whats the purpose? So I can sit in Lions Arch and try and look tough?

In most traditional MMO’s there was a point in gearing up. Take for instance, WoW. I used to gear up in WoW because it was fun, lots of endgame content, and there was open World PvP. You could kill the opposite faction, start massive city wars, and build rivalries and friends from your own server. That was my motivation to get geared up. But Guild Wars 2 has none of that, and I don’t like it. Don’t mistake me, I am NOT a WoW fanboy. But I think their design was better than GW2.

I left WoW to come to GW2 due to the crappy expansions Activision put out. But Now I am just as bored. To be fair, I don’t think this game is meant for me. I am used to the traditional dual-faction MMO games. This MMO is not traditional and seems pointless to me now. Literally, I have no reason to log in game. I barely know anyone on my server, most of the Guilds are dying out (fast), no open World PvP, no fun. And World Vs. World is not fun. I want to fight people on my own server and say “Oh look that guy killed me last week! I’m gonna get him!” But in this game we fight different servers. Its not fun and its a terrible design.

ArenaNet has not choice but to keep pumping out events or they will continue to lose players.

Make new char? I probably lvled 13 chars to 20 already (deleted a few), made new ones with different looks/races etc. Going to different stories really is fun. Human, norn, sylvari stories are very different, as are their starting area’s.

As for endgame. Wvw i considering endgame, althought everything (including wvw) gets borign after a while. So now i switch between farming gold (Orr, on guardian), wvw (on any of my 4 lvl 80 chars for variation), and making new chars. So far good balance. The moment they add even more content (wich they eventually will), guild wars (potentially) could have a lifetime content (like gw1 had tbh).

800 hours playtime here. Yes sometimes I’m bored, but there’s so much to do in gw2, that switching to something else, always stops boredom for me. Talking to new people, making friends, talking about builds, puzzles etc, also fun to me

KeikoTerada.1963:

Shootsfoot.9276:

While I see what you’re saying this “the whole game is endgame” cliche is over used and inaccurate marketing mumbo jumbo and saying it is just as asinine.

It is often quoted… but it is not a cliche.

They said you were in the end game from level one. And they were right.

What’s “assinine”, is people who expected an “end game” to suddenly materialise once they reached level 80. An “end game” that was different to the game they’d been playing before reaching level 80.

If people have really done everything the game has to offer (or rather, everything they find enjoyable in it), don’t want to do PvP, and don’t have friends/guildmates to help or hang out with ingame… then it’s time to put it down, and come back when there’s new content or an expansion. Seriously.

The very definition of end game as understood by a reasonable MMO player would be the activities that a player partakes in when their character has reached max level. The fact that some of those activities may be similar to what the player did at level 1 can never be meant to mean that a player at level 1 is already partaking in the endgame. If similarity was all you needed to show that two things are equal then you could easily show that Guild Wars 2 is Mario Brothers because your character can freely jump about the world.

End game, even semantically, could never mean pre game, early game, or mid game as each of those all have their own seperate and established meanings (the fact that I made most of them up is irrelevent and if you spend a few minutes thinking about it you will understand why).

When a player hits max level they feel like the big man on campus and want to find something new and fresh that they were not able to do before as they presumeably spent so much time doing those activities on the journey to max level that they have grown rather bored of them. In that instance the maximum level is a light at the tunnel, the player doesn’t know why they are trying to get there or what they are going to find there they can only have the hope that it will be worthwhile. And the developers have to hope this is what the players find because they need to retain players in order to keep making money (actually Guild Wars I wanted players to leave since they were not paying a subscription).

Hellkaiser.6025:

I was perhaps being a bit hasty and putting words in mouths, however when the arguments are the same and come to the same conclusion

“move on and leave”

Then you can hardly blame players that WANT this game to succeed from stepping back and saying to themselves, “Does ANYONE want me playing this game?”

The players tell us to move on, we feel like moving on due to the issues and the lack of real progress towards fixing them, and in the meantime they tack on laggy and buggy events in a seemingly clear attempt to appeal to the “content locusts”

By all means, it may be the logical step for players to leave the game, you’re somewhat right in that regard from that standpoint, but you’re dead wrong if you think that that’s good for the game or that many players will return no matter what changes.
It seems people just don’t care about other gamers/consumers and instead think of themselves and THEIR enjoyment of the game, if they don’t coincide with others then so what? sure players leave the game in droves, some temporary, statistically most PERMANENTLY. But hey they’re ok and so it doesn’t matter.

Instead of striving to see what’s going wrong and find a happy medium, players take it at face value and to be honest, it’s kind of disappointing.

First of all can I just say to everyone, that I do not agree that Hellkaiser is being a troll. He is replying calmly and constructively and I respect that, even if I don’t agree with everything he says.

Hellkaiser, I agree with what you said above, people leaving is not necessarily the answer. But you must admit that some people can go too far, and that is not good for the game either. People want this game to succeed so badly that it can make them emotional and sometimes overreact, which leads to poorly constructed feedback.

I respect that you are unhappy with a lot of the game right now and I too have my issues with it. But I think one well constructed post, giving whatever feedback you feel is necessary, is far more valueble and effective than repeating the same old issues over and over again in many different threads.

With regards to Anet bringing out extra content, when there are already serious issues to be fixed (i.e.- culling, lag, etc.). I think that is an unfortunate side effect of having various teams working on many different aspects of the game. It would be pointless for the entire Anet team to work on one or two problems, and at the same time they still want to progress the game and not get stuck fixing bugs that could potentially take some time to ressolve. There are teams working on ballancing, bug fixing and extra content, just to mention a few. So although I agree with you whole heartedly that major bugs should be top priority, I also think that Anet sees it this way too, it’s just that they also have to keep the game moving. I get the impression that they have an insane amount of content that they wish to add, and delaying it would be painful to both them and the players. It’s a balancing act that is not an easy one to get right, so I really feel a little slack should be given to them in this regard.

At the end of the day, Guild Wars 2 is a massive project that is trying to break away from the current standards of the genre, they are bound to hit bumps along the way, but I feel confident that given time, and enough constructive feedback (negative and positive), they will get there.

So to everyone, don’t stop posting and don’t stop playing. Just be constructive with your feedback and try to find ways to deal with the issues as best you can until they are fixed.

P.S. – Please don’t take my response to you in a negative way, Hellkaiser (not that I think you will), as I respect your replies to me and appreciate a good discussion.

Edit: To those that say there is only 100% world complete and legendaries, please stop. There is so much more than that (which I posted previously). If you do not enjoy the rest of the game then fair enough, that is an issue you need to raise in a constructive way. But there IS a LOT of stuff to do in this game once you hit 80. This game is not about gaining gear or getting titles or maxing your achievements. Of course there are those things, but they are just extras as far as I’m concerned, and if anything I think it was a mistake to add the achievements and map completion, as it draws your focus to play the game with this kind of mentality. When I play an FPS game I play for the thrill and the challenge. I don’t care if I’m at the top or bottom of the score board, I just care that I had fun. That’s not to say I don’t care if we win or lose, because I do. But if I had fun, even if we lost, then I’m happy. And the same goes for GW2. Yes I have max gear and I have 100% world complete and I try my best to win in PvP/WvW, but I also like to just enjoy the game for what it is. A game, not a shopping trip.

Before the Nov 16th patch I had a nice long list of things I planned to do. I wanted my 80 thief to get 100% exploration. I wanted to get a second set of exotics for alternative trait setups. I wanted to make at least 2 alts (to experience all 3 orders’ personal stories). All this in between all the special and dynamic events that I’d run in to along the way. It was a joy.

Now, if I log in and start to do these things, I am constantly wondering… “shouldn’t I be grinding fotm for gear?”. I’ve been through this in so many other MMOs that I just instinctively log out, rather than buy in to that grind.

I loved the hell out of this game, but can no longer tolerate playing it.

I am not reading a single thing in the Endgame Reimagined that says we will introduce a typical game treadmill. And make people run the same dungeon 300 times to get a pair of rings and a back piece.

Reading it again makes me so sad and reiterates the level of betrayal to their own game ideals that has happened.

now what? now you get to try the other classes. Best part is tho all you need to do is get them out of the story quest after creating the toon to take them to the mists to check them out at lvl 80 with all skills and weapons.

Only 2 classes i can stand playing out of them all. Rest are garbage and i cant belive people like playing them.

So, if I’m to understand the reactions in this thread, ANet added vertical progression to please those who were thinking there was no end-game, while kinda ruining it for those who were fine with strictly horizontal progression, but in the end it didn’t change anything and there’s still "no end-game?

See ANet? Remove ascended gear already…

KniL.5126:

Go to ORR (level 80 Areas), make the puzzles, make level 80 dungeons (Ex: Arah) go to World vs World, go to sPVP and hit level 80 there. You can do a lot of things in level 80.

Lets take them one by one.

Go to ORR (level 80 areas). What to do there? I have the map completed and running through gazillions of mobs and pretty much being in combat 100% of times without any real sense of direction isnt my idea of fun. But anyway, that map completed.

Make the puzzles – I have all jumping puzzles completed. I LOVED THEM. But you can do them only once to actually get some reward and there are nowhere near enough of them in game to keep me playing. (And im telling you I would log in to the game just to do some jumpies)

Make lvl 80 dungeons (like Arah). For me, since its all about looks, there is no point in doing Arah more than I did to get my shoulders. However I did finish all the paths.

Go to WvW. My server usually has almost 100% of the map occupied so there is no incentive for me to go there. I dont need money, I dont need karma and joining a zerg to play some PvDoor isnt fun either.

sPvP, I am PvE player so I do occasionally PvP but its definitely not a reason for me to log in.

So tell me now, since the whole game is endgame and I should be going back to lower zones and do events as part of my “end game”. What should I do now? If i go to lower zones, I pretty much oneshot anything, get rubbish rewards (since its all about looks the rewards will always look worse than what I have from ExplM dungeons), there are no new bosses introduced in the lower zones for me to see.

Basically, the whole game isnt endgame. The endgame is simply missing from GW2.

Edit: forgot to add that I have 100% world completion..but that was like in second week after GW2 came out.

ahem… you asked what do other MMOs after for an endgame besides raiding and tiered gear? Well, allow me to make a short list of things that they have AND GW2 lacks:

mounts
dueling
arena (more fun that rated BGs.. if you disagree I will wager that you never managed to break 1600 in WoW and are bitter about it)
large scale “WvW” that doesnt involve hitting gates for 1 hour and running down a path
well-designed dungeons (not corpse rushes)

i am sure there is more!