Guild Wars 2

I am leveling up my last character, and I have 5 trait points right now and nothing to spend them on because of this stupid unlock system, and now I have to do a ton of mindless zone completions and other stuff that I do not want to do or break down and spend 43 gold and 360 skill points for what would have been~ 4 gold before the patch!?!

I will say this now, unlocking 65 individual traits on each new character is stupid stupid stupid, and I bet any new player would rather quit when they experience the mindless grind to make their characters viable, instead of staying and leveling up their new character to level 80.

I will tell anyone looking into joining this game to stay away until you fix this horrible trait system.

I wasn’t sure that I was going to waste my time actually posting my thoughts on this subject, but then realized that it best that I do so that my voice can join the hundreds of others which are disappointed with the new trait system.

I recently started playing the game and found it to be exactly what I was looking for. The lvling was fun, the events really cool and the environment fun to explore. I power lvl’d my first character to 80 and thought … win! However, this all took a sharp turn for the worse after this content patch. I am now currently lvling another toon and realised that in order to complete the process I will have yet another incredibly lengthy grind in order to free up all of the traits. Honestly, I don’t know what the Anet developers were smoking when they thought this change would be good? It seems so abysmally executed it makes me wanna choke. The fact that Anet remains so silent causes me no amount of frustration. At the very least someone, any one, should step up and actually be actively discussing this with the community. Your silence only makes things worse for both you and your player base. I for one am right on the cusp of never playing again. (admittedly I am one of the foolish people that actually spent real money to buy gems for an outfit).

There are other things which are equally annoying but at the very least Anet has provided different means of attaining such things (such as the dungeon armor sets from the pvp dungeon track). Although the pvp grind to finish one is insane!! I only bring this up because I believe the change to the trait system is similar … the amount of time required to complete something is staggering. I for one only have so much time to invest in a game and making that game require vast amounts of time to completely “finish” a character (lvling/gear/traits/etc) is absurd.

Something else that’s been bothering me are some of the changes that have been implemented which makes certain aspects of the game less useful. One such example is the “zerg train”. I know that some folks liked to grind this in order to power level their character, make some gold and obtain some nice loots. However, it seems that that has been smacked about with the nerf bat as well. My question is … why? If people are happy with something why bother changing it? If all I want to do is run from point A to point Z kill things and get loot then so be it. I realize that as a game designer you might want your player base to enjoy the world as a whole but it is up the individual player, not the game company, to decide how an individual enjoys the game.

[/end rant]

Well, that’s about it. I will stop there before this becomes a full blown novel. In closing I would like to add that many facets of the game are incredible even with the faults I have listed above. However, unless something is done to shore up some of the failures I will have to walk away from the game permanently (I know this is no big deal but hey, thought that I would say it anyway :p ).

Cheers
Kor

Kanto.1659:

I made two characters with this new system. When I reached 31 and saw what I posted above I pretty much lost interest. After 30 levels I have to trudge through another 20 or so just to get adept traits? No. I have a gazzilion tomes so I just stopped bothering to level normally and bumped myself to 80 (word of advice for other players who actually want to acquire the traits: bump yourself to 65 or so. By the time you have explored the maps and done the required storyline missions you’ll be 80), geared myself, and then, traitless, went out to acquire them.

It was a slog. A big, slow, boring slog. Full map explores to get one adept trait? Unnecessary. Level 59 story line missions? Between all the slow conversations, the unskippable cutscenes, the scripted fights and the constant back and forth (gotta say it is a nice WoW throwback to be sent to a place, kill someone, WP back to the city, enter the instance, speak with another NPC, load out, WP somewhere else, do something, WP back, enter another instance, etc etc). I spent an afternoon on it and was sorry, I should have bought the skills.

You know what I find funny? They said they had changed the trait system because people were not making optimal use of the traits (putting 4 and 6 points in a line for instance). With the new system, I know with 100% surety, that at least one person will walk around with a non-optimized build (me) with any non-grandfathered character. Simply because I won’t buy anything I know I could get for free. Combined with the fact that I won’t go to EotM, nor ever have managed to even get that JP in WvW really started. So, any new character will be missing a lot of lower level traits.

I’m not sure if anyone has already pointed this out, so I say it anyway:
New players will need months to get only one of the traitlines done as they’re generally really confused. They will have no option to play with their builds and get to know their class. If they want to try wvw/pvp they stand no chance against the fully ascended geared and traited opponents, especially not since the *nerfed mobs in pve are that easy that they lure the worst players into thinking they’re good so they will stick to pve and/or demand classes to be nerfed.
As someone who has been around for a while I don’t really want to do map completions or jumping puzzles which I already did for each new character, how boring is that?
I don’t really get why traits are now being handled as if they were “only for the elite”.

And I don’t know a solution to this as this game IS amazing, or maybe was – and it wasn’t too complicated, only if you didn’t know about traits, weapon rarities, combos, skills, dodging. Maybe explaining all of that better instead of a popup in the middle of a fight would’ve solved a lot and would’ve spared us all these nerfs (which leads to the above*, that most/more players will never understand this game). Although I do agree that condition damage should have a place in PvE; I never understood why my ranger’s settings were all condi when I went into PvP – confusing.

Kylden Ar.3724:

I’ll just copy my post from Reddit —

Really, I like it pretty well, but a few improvements I could see—

1) One trait point per every 5 levels starting at level 15. Keep it an even spread. Gives you something new between your level 10 skill slot and level 20 skill slot, and something between the level 20 and level 30 elite slot opening. By level 30 you’d have 4 trait points to spend that might have good synergy with skills and your elite by then.

Adept would open at level 15, Master at 40, Grandmaster at 70.

2) Traits should unlock in areas relevant to their levels. Adepts in level 15-40 zones, Master in zones up to 70, GM in 71-80. Some story mode quests should grant a choice of adept traits.

3) If not already (I have no way to test, my slots are full) traits should unlock per account, not character, for those that like multiple races of the same class.

I like to emphasize your first two points (really, what were they thinking?!) but I disagree on the third. I like having a sense of progression on characters.

Honestly, the complete randomness of where some of these traits are located is mind boggling. Seriously ANet? An adept trait that requires 100% map completion of Fireheart Rise?!

I like the concept, honest I do. Running around to unlock new traits gives me something else to do rather then just complete zones/etc. I LOVE having more goals to complete. But at least make it so that the Adept traits are located in level 1-59 zones or something.

I now honestly regret deleting my 3 day head-start Elementalist who I never actually got around to doing much on to make a new Elementalist to enjoy the new trait system.

Marcus Greythorne.6843:

Paul.4081:

Horrible, the next time a dev gets a bright idea that dev should be forced to actually play the game for an hour to check if they’re genius idea is actually worth it. In this case it is not.

Can’t preview available traits in a selected slot without spending points? Thanks for adding the extra work to the previously easy system, numpties.

you can easily preview each of the traits in the list on the left, just click on the traitline and not the slot.

Whereas before I could just read about the trait as I created my build. This is an improvement how? To make me exercise my mouse hand more? What’s next? Adding extra clicks required to the hero panel?

/doh

This is more on unlocking the said traits, but trait unlocking should be rational and doable by the player, instead of binding the unlock on zone masteries that are for higher levels. Frankly, by design, it’s bad, because you force the players to rely on their stats instead of the traits that they might have during the level.

Just got my first post-patch character to 80, and…

What a grind.

And it’s not over yet.

How in the blazes is this system change supposed to make it “simpler for new players”? That was their goal, right? The level chart for when you unlock each trait point is confusing, getting new traits in the first place is confusing, ASSIGNING traits is confusing… And if you try to skip the grind via buying traits from Class Trainers, you’re forced into a different grind due to the maddening Gold and Skill Point costs.

This system effectively DISALLOWS making alts, because it’s so horrifyingly expensive and time-consuming to dare to make a new character.

The ONE thing I approve of is the switch from 70 points to 14. Though, I like 70 for the fact that it’s a less “random” number than 14. Multiples of 10 are pretty.

One change that is “up in the air” for me is being able to change traits on a whim, not having to visit a Class Trainer. On one hand, this means more freedom, and more effectiveness in that you can change traits based on the situation given enough time to actually make the changes.
On the other hand, it also discourages using your own build, in my eyes, in dungeon runs and the like. Partially-elitist dungeon-goers now have the option to whine at each party member to change to certain traits regardless of build.

“You there, Ranger! Spotter or kick.”
“But I don’t have points in Marksmanship.”
“So PUT points in Marksmanship. Screw the build that makes you happy, I want a 3% faster clear time! Switch the trait NOW. It’s not like you have to leave and find a Class Trainer for it!”

I will say, though, that “thankfully”, the shoddy system behind unlocking traits in the first place means that most people will never HAVE the traits they haven’t explicitly hunted for given that it’s such a ridiculous hassle to get them.

Marcus Greythorne.6843:

one thing I thought about recently: why do people spend so much thought on a part of the game-experience that makes up for a very little percentage of their playtime.

I mean: you spend a few days/weeks on leveling up a character and months/years for playing that character. I don’t want the excitement gone when I’ve reached 80, so in that spirit the new trait-system makes a lot of sense. It’s something to progress your character when he’s reached max level even further.

Sure, some players won’t like this since until now once you’d reached lv.80 your progression was mostly over and you were on an even playingfield – some consider this one of GW2’s strenghts but on the other hand others found GW2 becoming stale too fast because there’s nothing to work towards to.

It’s probably bad communication from Anet’s side that they have turned the trait-system into a long-term progression system away from a leveling system.

except that they took away the basics.
Thats really the issue, they only added 5 new traits. they rebalanced the traits to act partially as endgame. But that sits poorly for people who already had them.

Im all for a more long term goal built around new traits and new skills, but i think its a bad idea to shuffle the starter set of traits/skills into endgame goals.

the old abilities were “vanilla” the new endgame ones can be extra.

Toolbox.9375:

Just got my first post-patch character to 80, and…

What a grind.

And it’s not over yet.

How in the blazes is this system change supposed to make it “simpler for new players”? That was their goal, right? The level chart for when you unlock each trait point is confusing, getting new traits in the first place is confusing, ASSIGNING traits is confusing… And if you try to skip the grind via buying traits from Class Trainers, you’re forced into a different grind due to the maddening Gold and Skill Point costs.

This system effectively DISALLOWS making alts, because it’s so horrifyingly expensive and time-consuming to dare to make a new character.

The ONE thing I approve of is the switch from 70 points to 14. Though, I like 70 for the fact that it’s a less “random” number than 14. Multiples of 10 are pretty.

One change that is “up in the air” for me is being able to change traits on a whim, not having to visit a Class Trainer. On one hand, this means more freedom, and more effectiveness in that you can change traits based on the situation given enough time to actually make the changes.
On the other hand, it also discourages using your own build, in my eyes, in dungeon runs and the like. Partially-elitist dungeon-goers now have the option to whine at each party member to change to certain traits regardless of build.

“You there, Ranger! Spotter or kick.”
“But I don’t have points in Marksmanship.”
“So PUT points in Marksmanship. Screw the build that makes you happy, I want a 3% faster clear time! Switch the trait NOW. It’s not like you have to leave and find a Class Trainer for it!”

I will say, though, that “thankfully”, the shoddy system behind unlocking traits in the first place means that most people will never HAVE the traits they haven’t explicitly hunted for given that it’s such a ridiculous hassle to get them.

hmmm, i think some of the unlocks are good and some are bad. Overall the system seems like it was thought out only considering a few factors.
I like the unlocks like go do
an environmental challenge
Certain dynamic events
mini dunegon

I dont think they should have any pvp traits. or rather, there should be alternate method for pvp to get the traits.

zone completion is really bad.
i mean for first time player it may be ok, but after that? long boring/same. The only advantage i would say is, it does round out the exp from progression in combination with story.

I think its bad that all the traits are the same for every class, Makes new charachters a lot less new. I know they did it to encourage people to play together, but i think its ok to have personal goals.
while i tried it out with one charachter, and got it up to 50? i dont think it will be as fun doing the same thing on charachter 10, especially the map completes

Dear Guild Wars 2 Developers:

Having a lot of characters as I do, and (as a separate but relevant issue) the avowed desire on the part of GW 2 developers to have players experiment with trait builds, I have to ask, what the hell were you thinking to make people have to pay to unlock individual trait skills?

Yes, I know there are places you can go to get the drops that unlock them, but dear god, you have to be all over the map and don’t get all of them unlocked until you’ve pretty much repeatedly earned the “Been there, Done that” title – which isn’t retroactive to the characters you DO have who have done it.

I get that you folks want players to play the game, but this approach puts WAY too much emphasis on character development (goal-oriented looting of said places to get the manuals to unlock the individual trait skills) and made it way too kitten ed expensive to do it from the ground by buying the things.

One or the other, guys. Drop the cost, dump the skill point requirement, put the tomes where they can be found at level (all of the first tier in level 35-45 areas max because nothing says game killer by being killed just trying to get a trait you used to get unlocked with the tier) and make it attainable as you CAN unlock the trait skills. Some missions/personal stories/etc. NEED to have the trait skills just to survive and we can’t get them anymore at those levels.

So start up with traits at 24 with first tier trait manuals in level 15-25 areas and keep the same schedule as you have (only the two traits at a time would start at 54 instead of 60, and the second tier would unlock at 54 as well). This would unlock the third tier at 74. Go ahead and keep the Grandmaster unlock at 80.

Also drop the prices – they’re ridiculous. Solo/casual players have no way to make that much in a year of playing on ONE character, let alone several. Your whole implementation of making it easy to “experiment” with traits opened the door, then slammed it shut, barred it, locked it, barricaded it and hermetically sealed it. If ever there was a poster child for working at cross purposes, this implementation of the traits was it.

(Also, in an aside, the transformation charges are stupidly expensive – taking the equivalent of EIGHTEEN TRANSFORMATION STONES to re-do the armor appearances only? I used to use them to transfer my rune build to my next armor set as well as appearances, and you can’t do that anymore – thanks ever so much for messing that up for us, too!)

This was the most fun game I had ever played. Having burned out on mmo’s, GW2 and it’s play how you want and start having fun from the beginning got me back. Even though there are/were things in the game I had no interest in, this presented no issues. I just did what I liked! I can return to events all over the world…whatever I wanted! It was an awesome change.

This new trait system ended that. I simply will not do/play content I have no interest in. Making it so that I now “must”…or pay an absurd amount of skill points and gold to have traits has totally turned me off to the game. It does not compel me to do these things; it simply stops me from doing anything. It is not an inducement, it is an obnoxious turn off.

I have 7 level 80’s and will not be making any more alts, so long as this system exists.

I do not care what the required tasks are; I specifically started playing the game because none of this tedious “do as you’re told” nonsense existed.

I am here for fun and entertainment. Not to be made to grind or be told what to do.

How ironic that we now have field repec (which I love) yet if I make a new character, I will have no need for it as I would by level 80 have the wonderous 1/1/1/1/1 build.

That will not happen though, as I would not endure the tedious “do as you’re told” grind. If it is not fun for me, I will not do it, nor do I like being “schooled” in how I spend my free time.

Yes, there will be those who love it and ask for it to be even more tedious and irritating. However,I began playing (and continued) specifically because this was a game that did not follow this typical MMO grind method. The Manifesto seems a thing of the past with this patch.

I am here for fun and entertainment. Not to be made to grind or be told what to do.

This, right here (first sentence) is what were promised and in the first glorious month or two we actually had. What we now have is

“They want something to do, should we create new content?”

“Nah lets put a gate on existing content and call it new instead!”

“But they really want new skills, the elites for the most part suck!”

“Nah lets put a gate on existing content and call it new instead!”

“Guys you ruined the trait and hero panel, what the hell?”

“Nah lets put a gate on existing content and call it new instead!”

Y’know.

It would have been a good idea to have these unlocks work as they are if you just received a point for every thing you did.

And those points could be spent to unlock any given trait you want on any tier, and simply just all trait prices are changed to be like 50s each (50s x 13 = 6g50s x 5 = 32g50s).

So a player can complete a bunch of easy objectives, unlock a whole ton of low-tier ones to experiment with, and then move onto a newer, higher level zone, and repeat this process, ultimately then needing to complete objectives like 100% map completion on high level maps in order to unlock all of his traits for free.

I understand the gold price increase – it was done to offset the free repairs – but the dungeon gold decrease was what offset this. I even see the necessity in a sink. It’s just the means of acquisition for some traits is totally obscene and really destructive.

With 8 lvl 80’s sitting in cursed shore waiting for events to pop is kittened.

Yeah, I have to say that the lowbies I’ve been trying to level right now are going to pretty much have whatever traits unlock from me playing until level 80, and then after that, their build will be whatever it happens to be. Either that or they will be deleted before they even get there. This unlock system is too ridiculous and is forcing me to play a way i don[‘t want or pay monies I don’t have just so I can experiment with builds.

i guess its back to my level 80s and more of the standard grind and play in WvW until that too gets stale. Good job guys. Good job.

I’ve been playing this game since it came out but I’ve never felt motivated to post on the forums before; but then, I’ve never had a problem with it before. I have to say I preferred the old trait system.

Being able to change traits ‘on the fly’ is nice and seems like it would promote experimentation and build diversity if players had a variety of traits to choose from, but will they? I’ll probably be building from a circumscribed set of options with my post-April 15th characters. That’s disappointing.

I don’t understand the way the unlocking system has been designed: why am I suddenly required to play WvW when I prefer PVE? Before this change I could build my characters how I pleased by playing the way I enjoy. I’m willing to go outside my routine or comfort zone for shiny rewards, but for adept level traits? For each character?

I’m also confused by the pushback to level 30 to start unlocking traits. A friend of mine was just getting into the game, just getting his first character into the mid-20s before the change, and he’s lost his trait choices, he’s lost stats, and he’s lost some interest in the game. How is a prolonged delay before you can begin to really get into setting up your character better for new players? And, as someone who levelled up under the old system and who is now trying out the new, it feels like I’m not progressing as much, like there are these dull, sloggy levels to grind through where nothing much happens. I didn’t experience the game that way before. This compounds the disappointing feeling that I am now pressured to play in ways I don’t enjoy—either to unlock the trait or to grind out the gold and skill points to buy it—just to have as much fun as I used to.

Final United Chinese Kungfu Anut, great job on the newly designed trait system.. idk

are you tryin to fok with the new players? 50% sales on gw2 ffs?

its so unfair, new player now need unlock all the kitten traits one by one. how do you want us to introduce our friend to join us in this game? btw, my friend just bought this game yesterday, i feel ashamed to tell him about this new trait kitten.

its pointless and only cause dissatisfaction, i understand if you set certain traits locked but all from adept to grandmaster? doesnt foking make sense, 100% map completion for a single traits? good luck with that man..

and another point, now everyone will not group player with less achievement point for dungeon because they have no focking traits at all.

not to mention character below lv80 wont even have chance to get a group for instance.
so new player now can rot and die. thanks to Anut brilliant idea.

Right now, there are two critical problems with the new trait system. For those with new characters pre-patch, they don’t have to put up with the monstrosity of unlocking traits (Which everyone should have unlocked by default, not just us!), but they still have to put up with 70 dead levels. I thought it was only 66, before I realised four of the non-dead levels gave double trait points. I don’t mind that traits have been condensed to 1/5th the original number… but they need something to make those intervening levels actually feel like levels, and give something for the players to mess around with.

Trait access also needs to be dropped down to level 15 again, with every 5 levels giving a new trait (And something else stuffing the gaps). There is no reason that the high levels should grant double trait points – spread those out throughout the leveling experience, and at a predictable rate!

As it is, the only thing that’s holding me to the game right now is the awesome lore of the Charr, and the still-unmatched-by-any-other-MMO use of dynamic events providing an engaging gameworld, and ‘assistance threshold’ hearts system replacing the generic quests used in other MMOs.

Profession: Ranger

Skirmishing
Current

Strider’s Defense: You have a 15% chance to block ranged attacks while engaged in melee combat.

Concern:

Im just wondering how does the Team see this trait being used? I understand that as a Ranger you have the most defensive set in game with 3 dodges from sword and dagger alone reason why Strider’s only blocks projectile. But as another RNG, as low as 15% I can speak for most Rangers that this trait is not worth investing for a GM and it only block projectiles, statistics might be on me in this as well as to how many people actually used this in game. I really love Skirmishing because it involves your pet with it and weapon switching, now with that in mind…

Proposal:

1. Strider’s Defense – Switching weapons in battle gives you and your pet aegis for 3s (cooldown: 10s)

2. Strider’s Defense – Switching weapons in battle gives you and your pet retaliation for 3s (cooldown: 10s)

3. Strider’s Defense – Block incoming projectiles for 3s. Interval: 10s

4. Strider’s Defense – Switching weapons in battle gives you and your pet reflect for 3s (cooldown: 10s)

5. Strider’s Defense – Switching weapons in battle blocks next attack for you and your pet. You gain regeneration for 3s (cooldown: 10s)

6. Strider’s Defense – Deflect incoming attack for 3s. to damage nearby foes. Interval: 10s

please consider looking into this trait, other than that, I love all of them. Yes even Read the Wind it is actually surprising. Thanks.

Anet: Can we get SOME feed back about the things in this thread?! Someplace? Here? FAcebook even? I don’t care, I just want something that tells me someone is seriously reading this and not plugging their ears in a corner somewhere.

Well they just closed the thread “why no feedback” so i’m expecting no answer ever. Am enjoying gw1 a heck of a lot though, currently doing skill hunter having just finished hm missions in nf and cantha. Frankly having gone back to gw1 the difference in skill options etc is staggering. the festival cupcakes and cider drops are fun too.

I feel like the new trat system got some nice ideas—
its really cool that we can change our traits on the fly and its really cool that you designed hey do this or that to unluck a trait
BUT

it cant be true that most of the traits are really really crazy to archieve ..how the kitten shall you cmplete a map lvl 40-50 if you are lvl 35 and want a simple trait ? you really need to think about that .. It would be okay kill boss xy in area 35 oder do a dungeon thats all reasonable but what the hell did you think about complety maps where you cant go as low charackter ..aswell its to expensive to buy the trais ..

They basically threw their old “no grind” philosophy out the window & introduced multiple avenues of grind with the “Feature Pack”, which we may as well just call GW2: The Grind Wars Edition™

Guys, just get to end-game.

Just unlocked a new trait, have no clue what the heck it is because……I can’t use or even see it till lvl 30. So are you telling me I have to go get every single trait someplace, or pay 43g and an insane amount of skill points? This system is better how??

How about when you unlock a trait level in a certain trait line for one character, that same trait level and trait line unlocks account-wide since it’ll be the exact same thing for each character?

PookieDaWombat.6209:

Anet: Can we get SOME feed back about the things in this thread?! Someplace? Here? FAcebook even? I don’t care, I just want something that tells me someone is seriously reading this and not plugging their ears in a corner somewhere.

Remember that enormous thread about the mining pick that gave sprockets? There was never a reply nor any acknowledgement that it was an issue. They’re going to stay silent and hope this all passes.

PookieDaWombat.6209:

Yeah, I have to say that the lowbies I’ve been trying to level right now are going to pretty much have whatever traits unlock from me playing until level 80, and then after that, their build will be whatever it happens to be. Either that or they will be deleted before they even get there. This unlock system is too ridiculous and is forcing me to play a way i don[‘t want or pay monies I don’t have just so I can experiment with builds.

i guess its back to my level 80s and more of the standard grind and play in WvW until that too gets stale. Good job guys. Good job.

Yep I agree. I stopped playing my alts immediately after this patch. I had a level 34 Guardian and a new Mesmer I was going to max out but it’s just not worth it really.

Not much more to be brought to the table. I don’t really mind the trait every 6 level deal and the new UI, but unlocking the traits is confusing, expensive, unsatisfying, and completely against the “no grinding” ideal. And this is coming out of the mouth of a player who has played since launch. I shutter at the idea of watching a new player see this system.

Stop killing your own game. You’re approaching NGE levels of fundamental design undermining.

tigirius.9014:

PookieDaWombat.6209:

Yeah, I have to say that the lowbies I’ve been trying to level right now are going to pretty much have whatever traits unlock from me playing until level 80, and then after that, their build will be whatever it happens to be. Either that or they will be deleted before they even get there. This unlock system is too ridiculous and is forcing me to play a way i don[‘t want or pay monies I don’t have just so I can experiment with builds.

i guess its back to my level 80s and more of the standard grind and play in WvW until that too gets stale. Good job guys. Good job.

Yep I agree. I stopped playing my alts immediately after this patch. I had a level 34 Guardian and a new Mesmer I was going to max out but it’s just not worth it really.

A total departure from the Manifesto. I had noted my objections previously.

I was going to at the very least make an 8th level 80, the one class I do not have…and wanted to make more so I can have different races.

This stopped me dead in my tracks; I have 7 level 80’s and that is the end of line. If this system remains, I will do no more.

I love the idea of unlocking new traits by doing content. I think that’s a fantastic move that should be extended to more traits, and to slot skills as well. I was even on board with unlocking the original set as a fun way to add to the character progression feeling

However, I’ve just started a new character and the implementation is simply not fun or rewarding. I am still completely baffled as to why the traits didn’t start out at level 15 and then one point every five levels. The period before you hit 80 and buy all your gear is when you are most free to experiment, and I can’t do that because I have nothing to experiment with.

Moreover, as has been said, having traits awarded for such time consuming and specific things that don’t relate to the traits themselves doesn’t make sense. Especially the ones way above the average level for that point (Fireheart completion).

Why not make traits unlock for doing things that actually relate to them? To unlock a fall damage reduction trait, survive a fall with less that 30% health five times. To unlock an extra burn time trait, burn 100 enemies. To unlock a trait that improves the cooldown on greatsword skills, kill ten champs with a greatsword. That way traits will unlock naturally according to what a player actually does in the game, and don’t force the player to go to a specific location to do them.

(I do like the idea of going to specific locations, as in GW1, but use that for the newer skills and traits, as these are designed as end game content, not for the original set.)

AEFA.9035:

Profession: Ranger

Skirmishing
Current

Strider’s Defense: You have a 15% chance to block ranged attacks while engaged in melee combat.

Concern:

Im just wondering how does the Team see this trait being used? I understand that as a Ranger you have the most defensive set in game with 3 dodges from sword and dagger alone reason why Strider’s only blocks projectile. But as another RNG, as low as 15% I can speak for most Rangers that this trait is not worth investing for a GM and it only block projectiles, statistics might be on me in this as well as to how many people actually used this in game. I really love Skirmishing because it involves your pet with it and weapon switching, now with that in mind…

Proposal:

1. Strider’s Defense – Switching weapons in battle gives you and your pet aegis for 3s (cooldown: 10s)

2. Strider’s Defense – Switching weapons in battle gives you and your pet retaliation for 3s (cooldown: 10s)

3. Strider’s Defense – Block incoming projectiles for 3s. Interval: 10s

4. Strider’s Defense – Switching weapons in battle gives you and your pet reflect for 3s (cooldown: 10s)

5. Strider’s Defense – Switching weapons in battle blocks next attack for you and your pet. You gain regeneration for 3s (cooldown: 10s)

6. Strider’s Defense – Deflect incoming attack for 3s. to damage nearby foes. Interval: 10s

please consider looking into this trait, other than that, I love all of them. Yes even Read the Wind it is actually surprising. Thanks.

I have similar concerns with the AOE size of the mines in general. Since they added the trait for Engineers called Bunker Down, the mine explosion radius bug is more pronounced. There are enemies dancing all over these things not dying and these tiny mines do very little damage when they go off. The tooltip says they are indeed increased with the explosives line of enhancements for explosive abilities but I’m just not seeing it. You have to basically run enemies over them multiple times before they all go off. It’s very obvious underwater. Now not only can underwater mobs completely ignore minefield but they can also ignore these mines entirely as well when they come within melee range. Thanks alot.

I hope they make the mines larger (because the size of the Runes spells for staff wielders and traps on rangers are WAY larger than any explosive engineers have and this to me is a very big problem even without this trait.)

If you wanted to just make an alt for WvW, how the heck do you get traits now?

CrashTestAuto.9108:

I love the idea of unlocking new traits by doing content. I think that’s a fantastic move that should be extended to more traits, and to slot skills as well. I was even on board with unlocking the original set as a fun way to add to the character progression feeling

However, I’ve just started a new character and the implementation is simply not fun or rewarding. I am still completely baffled as to why the traits didn’t start out at level 15 and then one point every five levels. The period before you hit 80 and buy all your gear is when you are most free to experiment, and I can’t do that because I have nothing to experiment with.

Moreover, as has been said, having traits awarded for such time consuming and specific things that don’t relate to the traits themselves doesn’t make sense. Especially the ones way above the average level for that point (Fireheart completion).

Why not make traits unlock for doing things that actually relate to them? To unlock a fall damage reduction trait, survive a fall with less that 30% health five times. To unlock an extra burn time trait, burn 100 enemies. To unlock a trait that improves the cooldown on greatsword skills, kill ten champs with a greatsword. That way traits will unlock naturally according to what a player actually does in the game, and don’t force the player to go to a specific location to do them.

(I do like the idea of going to specific locations, as in GW1, but use that for the newer skills and traits, as these are designed as end game content, not for the original set.)

this actually makes a lot of sense.
I like the going around doing stuff to get traits, but as you say, tedious repetitive ones are going to suck (map completions) Also this is the type of system you generally apply to special things, not the normal run of the mill ones.

So yeah if your basic traits, unlocked in ways related to the traits, later on traits/skills can involve doing something like going into dungeons, mini dungeons, etc.

Another possibility was giving more options for unlocks.

I have a profession for every class. Luckily, all are 80 and one is 77, so no issue for me. But for the XIII-traits I have to fight some events which i can’t track, it is pure accident to find exactly this event active. This is very bad design. Do NOT lock such essential stuff like traits behind a time gate which may occur in an area.

I had to rely on guildies who told me if an event starts. The dragon timer pages don’t work anymore since we have megaservers. In fact you introduced a system which made it harder to get skills from the new system WITHIN the same update! That’s really bad design and shows that the Q&A is non-existend in this company.

Also another issue: when I finally managed to find an active Grenth temple event and also successfully finish the event the kitten trait didn’t unlock! What the kitten?

Review your update before it goes live for god’s sake!

It was very frustrating to log on to my level 67 character yesterday thinking I should finish levelling her up, only to face that her build has been nerfed to what it was when she was level 47. :P

This delayed trait acquisition makes no sense.

Level 60 to 80 should be about playing around with your endgame build on masterwork or rare gear, so that by the time you hit 80 you have a good idea of what you want to do with the character, can invest in exotics and start working toward ascended.

stayBlind.7849:

Guys, just get to end-game.

This should send a chill down ArenaNet’s spine.

One more way they’ve fallen into the same old MMORPG traps.

They originally touted their vision that there wouldn’t be a divide between “leveling” and “endgame”. GW2 was going to be different. They didn’t want the classic “just get to endgame where the game really starts”. They wanted to create a game that smoothly increases challenge from level 1 on up through to level 80 and the time beyond.

But so many changes since launch have drifted away from that philosophy, and now we have people advising other people on the forums to just push through and get to 80.

It’s been a truly sad thing to see the original vision for the game get dismantled, patch by patch.

Here’s the thing: I love the idea of going out into the world to get traits from doing things. I personally don’t mind having to do certain things in other game modes (but i don’t agree with it since i know others hate doing such things and forcing them into it is kinda rude). What i mind most here is the complete barrier to entry for people that wanted to make or were in the middle of making alts, and more importantly new players. They are already not liking this new system from what I’ve seen and heard and this is only going to hurt gw2 in the end. Its a poorly implemented system that frankly leeches away any fun there was in leveling before. shrug

Maybe I’ll do what someone else has done and play some gw1 some more. At least they aren’t actively trying to break that one.

Gibson.4036:

stayBlind.7849:

Guys, just get to end-game.

This should send a chill down ArenaNet’s spine.

One more way they’ve fallen into the same old MMORPG traps.

They originally touted their vision that there wouldn’t be a divide between “leveling” and “endgame”. GW2 was going to be different. They didn’t want the classic “just get to endgame where the game really starts”. They wanted to create a game that smoothly increases challenge from level 1 on up through to level 80 and the time beyond.

But so many changes since launch have drifted away from that philosophy, and now we have people advising other people on the forums to just push through and get to 80.

It’s been a truly sad thing to see the original vision for the game get dismantled, patch by patch.

The saddest part about that is that even if you did “push through” to get to level 80, you MIGHT have the gold for those traits, but you’re not going to have the skill points unless you took every single scroll you might have gotten along the way and burn them all, and even then you might not have enough to unlock all the traits or even most of them. This is even more true if you also wanted to get something like a legendary as a new player because you need a ton of skill points for that as well.

Marcus Greythorne.6843:

I love the new trait-implementation,… snip

Really?

What is there to love about it? What is there that in any way makes it better than what it was?

Ok yeah, going out and earning traits may seem like a good idea, but that could have been done without all the other things that have ruined the system.

I know you’re not a fanboy agreeing to everything A-net says (like some people on this forum) but I’d just really like to know, other than being able to trait hunt, what is better about this new system?

Old system with free respec anywhere and trait unlocks that remotely made sense would have been perfect but that’s not what we have…

I just came back to the game, excited about trying new stuff, i have a lot of 80s but missing a few, here i go make a new character, get to 30 and discover how things are now… I almost stopped playing when i saw what i needed to do to get my traits, i switched to another alt that was made under the old system and decided to just play that pretty much but it definitely made me not want to play this game much.

I mean, what the heck where they thinking?!?! What i loved about this game is that you made your own fun, i just wanted to wvw and did just that without having to run a single dungeon (find them very very boring) or grind stuff for legendaries, now if i want to play a char in wvw i need to go out and do a ton of stuff i HATE doing to get traits? or grind skill points and spend gold?!?!?

It is a terrible system and i truly don’t understand who could come up with such a bad thing and how it got approved…

• Run EoTM karma train until you’re 80.
• Look up a build on the web and with the gold you’ve earned, buy only the traits you need.
• Spend the rest of your gold on gear.
• Begin to play the game.

Lord Kuru.3685:

• Run EoTM karma train until you’re 80.
• Look up a build on the web and with the gold you’ve earned, buy only the traits you need.
• Spend the rest of your gold on gear.
• Begin to play the game.

And completely miss out on the part where you get to respec for free to test new builds as you play. So, the option now is zerg til you’re 80 then pick a meta build and zerg in your meta build.

Yup, sounds like tons of fun. :/

PookieDaWombat.6209:

Lord Kuru.3685:

• Run EoTM karma train until you’re 80.
• Look up a build on the web and with the gold you’ve earned, buy only the traits you need.
• Spend the rest of your gold on gear.
• Begin to play the game.

And completely miss out on the part where you get to respec for free to test new builds as you play. So, the option now is zerg til you’re 80 then pick a meta build and zerg in your meta build.

Yup, sounds like tons of fun. :/

The way the game is designed now, this is actually one of the better options for playing the game.

Except for those of us that hate EoTM and zerging there in. i might go in there for jollies on one of my level 80s to mess with people every now and then, but actually playing in there? Nope. Not fun at all. Still doesn’t address the issue with not really getting to play with all the traits on new characters or alts either.

Its sort of like buying a sports car then after getting used to driving it around a track, they take half the wheels off and make it only go 30 miles an hour, but they balanced it to drive on those 2 wheels. Well, that’s nice of them, but that’s not how I wanted to drive the thing.

I really don’t like the new update to unlock the traits by exploring or killing specific things. There’s no other option than to just explore very bit of the world to unlock them since every trait is way too expensive to buy from the trainer. What was wrong with the old system..? I can probably see that my character will never unlock some traits because of this which I hate, but I also hate the whole grind that is involved in unlocking the traits… It’s a lose – lose situation. Please reverse the update. Or only make us grind for the new grandmaster traits as a solution.

PookieDaWombat.6209:

Except for those of us that hate EoTM and zerging there in. i might go in there for jollies on one of my level 80s to mess with people every now and then, but actually playing in there? Nope. Not fun at all. Still doesn’t address the issue with not really getting to play with all the traits on new characters or alts either.

Its sort of like buying a sports car then after getting used to driving it around a track, they take half the wheels off and make it only go 30 miles an hour, but they balanced it to drive on those 2 wheels. Well, that’s nice of them, but that’s not how I wanted to drive the thing.

I think he’s agreeing with you. I’m pretty sure “play eotm until 80 before you get to have fun” isn’t something he’s saying is good.