Guild Wars 2

Ok so I’m hugely against gear grinding in games but in my honest opinion its a huge must. I know so many hate it but its also something that produces a more active player base and I suppose more compelling content. I am one of the biggest Guild Wars supporters as of the last 6 years and I got my juggernaught about a week ago. I havnt hardly logged in since I got it because its like the grind I had is now gone and when I log in I cant be bothered doing much. I’m burnt out levelling now because I have 6 level 80’s all with full exo sets some more then one, and 2 level 40ish toon I just cant be bothered levelling right now. This is the 2nd time I’ve found myself in this predicament. First time was after hitting level 80 on my main then after a month not too interested I got back into it and my goal was levelling alts, I got 5 more 80’s and 2 40’s and moved my focus to my legendary, got lucky with the forge and got my colossus which spared me into the legendary grind, now that’s over I’m over levelling my alts and not ever going to try get a second legendary ( F THAT) so I find myself bored again. Now the major issue with me posting this is I’m the sort of supporter/fan of GW1/2 that will always call it my number one game love but if I can get to this point then how are people that are not such avid GW supporters doing? All that said I think gear grind is a mmo necessary evil that supports a games player base and addictive nature.. What do you people think?

Take a break. Come back when something else catches your eye. You basically beat the game bro; you’re burnt out.

My take? Grind is necessary to developers who have to contend with a player-base which demands the game give them something to do for multiple hours seven days a week ad infinitum. As long as players insist on playing those long hours the developers are going to have to give them something to do. It doesn’t have to be gear grind, though. GW1, with no gear progression, was kept alive by grind of a different sort — the title grind which people wanted for GW2 but is now mostly forgotten. Gear grind is just the formula perfected by Blizzard, which had a massive financial stake in keeping players p(l)aying.

I have no plans to acquire a legendary or any other ‘hard grind’ weapon (Infinite Light, Volcanus etc. etc.) for the simple reason that I’m not all too fond of particle effects in weaponry. This is not to say I fear grind or long-term tasks, my latest was acquiring Chauncey and the Mystery Cat Tonic. I set my own goals and I enjoy having the freedom to do so.

Grinding for Ascended feels like a grind. I have two Fractal Backpieces (one fully upgraded and… usually hidden (xDD), one ready to be pushed to the second tier, a plethora of rings. Conversely, I’ve done map completion three, almost four times and that’s a feat many would claim is horribly tedious for them. I feel almost pressured to make the jump to Ascended, lest something come out that further requires it (gated content) but map completion is something I can just do at my leisure.

There are plenty of games that offer a significant degree of gear grind, I don’t feel that GW2 needs to become one of them.

So you want a gear treadmill like WoW?

Please, for the love of God, no.

As a counterpoint to the thread title, the day Guild Wars 2 turns into a gear treadmill is the day I leave Guild Wars 2.

Do what I do. Make more than one build and grind for that gear. My latest excursion had me grinding for 200g in sentinel gear. It’s fun, try new builds sometime.

Gear grind it tragic. There are plenty of games that have gear grind in them…we don’t need another one.

I don’t get why people think it’s not okay to have a game that has 300,000 people playing it regularly, instead of 7 million.

If the game has 7 million people playing it, because they’re addicted to grind, that doesn’t make it a better game. It makes it a worse game with more addicted people.

Why not just play the game less, instead of having some mechanic force people to have to play it?

NO!

One of guild wars 1 AND 2’s main selling points was NO gear grind, and a lot of people like it that way, including me. If you want one then go and play a game with a gear grind. It has been publicised from the start that there will not be a gear grind so don’t act surprised when it’s not there.

Ok just to point a few things out, I’ve never played WoW and don’t want to, I just tried Neverwinter and its funny, the combat is nothing compared to GW2 but I’m only level 2 and lastly it will do for a fully until I’m ready to put time back into GW. Oh and I don’t like grind i just thought it would keep a larger population. I feel that the population is dropping and that’s because I have played almost constant since 1st beta and none of my GW1 mates play at all anymore and my friend lists keep changing, not growing just people leave and people start. I would love to see the numbers for active players now.

As someone stated above, gear grind has no place in a competitive game.

Isn’t gear grind alive and well in GW2?

But instead of grinding for new equipment stats, you grind for a endless tonic or a weapon ticket or supply crate or a mini or a jetpack or another back item? Seems like a endless grind to me…

Ah, don’t let em get to ya. Anet will put in more gear to grind regardless of what anyone thinks when they want to keep more people playing their game. It happened before, and it will happen again. They tried their little living story bit and they have mostly admitted it was a mistake, just a matter of time now.

Just wait for the population to dip a bit and you will see it. Ascended armor and weapons next.

Jam.4521:

NO!

One of guild wars 1 AND 2’s main selling points was NO gear grind, and a lot of people like it that way, including me. If you want one then go and play a game with a gear grind. It has been publicised from the start that there will not be a gear grind so don’t act surprised when it’s not there.

I love gw1/2 for the same reasons, I hate gear grind too, it just seems its a necessary evil.

Jam.4521:

NO!

One of guild wars 1 AND 2’s main selling points was NO gear grind, and a lot of people like it that way, including me. If you want one then go and play a game with a gear grind. It has been publicised from the start that there will not be a gear grind so don’t act surprised when it’s not there.

It was never publicized that there would not be any gear progression. As a matter of fact many devs stated the opposite when ascended gear was released. That argument is 7 months dead.

Gear grind does not bring in new players though. It drives some players away, keeps some current players slightly longer and some hooked like a fish. The target for the company is fresh box sales and gems, not gems bought with online gold. If they keep players on a treadmill that means that players get gold from in-game which from a business standpoint is not a win.
They in my opinion will not put this in the game.

yakuza snowdragon.4639:

Jam.4521:

NO!

One of guild wars 1 AND 2’s main selling points was NO gear grind, and a lot of people like it that way, including me. If you want one then go and play a game with a gear grind. It has been publicised from the start that there will not be a gear grind so don’t act surprised when it’s not there.

I love gw1/2 for the same reasons, I hate gear grind too, it just seems its a necessary evil.

I see where you are coming from but I think there are ways around it, as in GW1 cosmetic items are a good way, plus achievements, I don’t think they have it right yet but I don’t believe adding a stat grind is the way to go.

Any feature that punishes casual players over hardcore players is a bad idea full stop.

I’m hoping they will keep the living story evolving, plus add more achievements and ways to work towards different skins etc.

Yargesh.4965:

Gear grind does not bring in new players though. It drives some players away, keeps some current players slightly longer and some hooked like a fish. The target for the company is fresh box sales and gems, not gems bought with online gold. If they keep players on a treadmill that means that players get gold from in-game which from a business standpoint is not a win.
They in my opinion will not put this in the game.

I would have agreed with this statement 7 months ago, but since they did actually add gear progression already…it’s sorta moot. The same thing was said with the addition of ascended gear when it was released, the game didn’t die, they didn’t remove the gear to get back any players who said they were going to leave (most in fact did not) or remove it because they all of a sudden started losing players. Ascended gear was a good move for the game overall apparently. They keep adding more.

killcannon.2576:

Yargesh.4965:

Gear grind does not bring in new players though. It drives some players away, keeps some current players slightly longer and some hooked like a fish. The target for the company is fresh box sales and gems, not gems bought with online gold. If they keep players on a treadmill that means that players get gold from in-game which from a business standpoint is not a win.
They in my opinion will not put this in the game.

I would have agreed with this statement 7 months ago, but since they did actually add gear progression already…it’s sorta moot. The same thing was said with the addition of ascended gear when it was released, the game didn’t die, they didn’t remove the gear to get back any players who said they were going to leave (most in fact did not) or remove it because they all of a sudden started losing players. Ascended gear was a good move for the game overall apparently. They keep adding more.

The company has stated that the items where to be in the game anyway. Ascended was a planned item that was implemented poorly. My biggest problem with this game is poor implementation, but overall I am very satisfied with it.

killcannon.2576:

Yargesh.4965:

Gear grind does not bring in new players though. It drives some players away, keeps some current players slightly longer and some hooked like a fish. The target for the company is fresh box sales and gems, not gems bought with online gold. If they keep players on a treadmill that means that players get gold from in-game which from a business standpoint is not a win.
They in my opinion will not put this in the game.

I would have agreed with this statement 7 months ago, but since they did actually add gear progression already…it’s sorta moot. The same thing was said with the addition of ascended gear when it was released, the game didn’t die, they didn’t remove the gear to get back any players who said they were going to leave (most in fact did not) or remove it because they all of a sudden started losing players. Ascended gear was a good move for the game overall apparently. They keep adding more.

Only because ascended gear is not a necessity, in the form that it’s in just now with minimal stat boosts and the main function of the gear (agony resist) being restricted to fractals, which are fine due to the repeating nature meaning the only gating is to more difficult fractals, not actual content, but if they open up parts of the open world to a genuine gear grind then you have a whole new ball game.

I believe ANet should avoid gear gating outside of fractals at all costs. There are ways of making games without mimicking every other MMO ever made.

Jam.4521:

killcannon.2576:

Yargesh.4965:

Gear grind does not bring in new players though. It drives some players away, keeps some current players slightly longer and some hooked like a fish. The target for the company is fresh box sales and gems, not gems bought with online gold. If they keep players on a treadmill that means that players get gold from in-game which from a business standpoint is not a win.
They in my opinion will not put this in the game.

I would have agreed with this statement 7 months ago, but since they did actually add gear progression already…it’s sorta moot. The same thing was said with the addition of ascended gear when it was released, the game didn’t die, they didn’t remove the gear to get back any players who said they were going to leave (most in fact did not) or remove it because they all of a sudden started losing players. Ascended gear was a good move for the game overall apparently. They keep adding more.

Only because ascended gear is not a necessity, in the form that it’s in just now with minimal stat boosts and the main function of the gear (agony resist) being restricted to fractals, which are fine due to the repeating nature meaning the only gating is to more difficult fractals, not actual content, but if they open up parts of the open world to a genuine gear grind then you have a whole new ball game.

I believe ANet should avoid gear gating outside of fractals at all costs. There are ways of making games without mimicking every other MMO ever made.

True, they shouldn’t gate content behind gear walls. But something the game lacks is progression, gear or otherwise. If the Living Story had been permanent content, that could have been a form of progression in and of itself, with no gear grind involved and something new players could have looked forward to when buying the game or something older players could have done with alts. But since they decided to go the route of temp content, there is still no progression which some players like to have to add a feeling of growth to their characters.

The game is sorely in need of some sort of progression mechanic outside of the personal story. With 7 months down the drain with temp content, new games on the horizon (better or not), and an aging player base, something new will need to be added. Whether that ends up being more gear or some other form of progression should be interesting to watch.

killcannon.2576:

Jam.4521:

killcannon.2576:

Yargesh.4965:

Gear grind does not bring in new players though. It drives some players away, keeps some current players slightly longer and some hooked like a fish. The target for the company is fresh box sales and gems, not gems bought with online gold. If they keep players on a treadmill that means that players get gold from in-game which from a business standpoint is not a win.
They in my opinion will not put this in the game.

I would have agreed with this statement 7 months ago, but since they did actually add gear progression already…it’s sorta moot. The same thing was said with the addition of ascended gear when it was released, the game didn’t die, they didn’t remove the gear to get back any players who said they were going to leave (most in fact did not) or remove it because they all of a sudden started losing players. Ascended gear was a good move for the game overall apparently. They keep adding more.

Only because ascended gear is not a necessity, in the form that it’s in just now with minimal stat boosts and the main function of the gear (agony resist) being restricted to fractals, which are fine due to the repeating nature meaning the only gating is to more difficult fractals, not actual content, but if they open up parts of the open world to a genuine gear grind then you have a whole new ball game.

I believe ANet should avoid gear gating outside of fractals at all costs. There are ways of making games without mimicking every other MMO ever made.

True, they shouldn’t gate content behind gear walls. But something the game lacks is progression, gear or otherwise. If the Living Story had been permanent content, that could have been a form of progression in and of itself, with no gear grind involved and something new players could have looked forward to when buying the game or something older players could have done with alts. But since they decided to go the route of temp content, there is still no progression which some players like to have to add a feeling of growth to their characters.

The game is sorely in need of some sort of progression mechanic outside of the personal story. With 7 months down the drain with temp content, new games on the horizon (better or not), and an aging player base, something new will need to be added. Whether that ends up being more gear or some other form of progression should be interesting to watch.

Yes I agree with you on this, I’m not sure how it could be added to the current build of GW2, maybe some of the open world areas being super hard to simply travel through (not just irritating like Orr), to the point where it requires a group to simply reach places, then open world bosses and etc. at the end of these areas, something that actually requires some serious coordination with people to get going, more of a Social Gate instead of a Gear gate.

I thought we were better than that

Aristio.2784:

Take a break. Come back when something else catches your eye. You basically beat the game bro; you’re burnt out.

I agree with what you’ve said here, but you really shouldn’t be able to say this about an MMO.

So yes, gear progression is necessary to keep players interested and playing past hitting 80 and getting that nice looking set you wanted.

Dangerkips.6035:

Aristio.2784:

Take a break. Come back when something else catches your eye. You basically beat the game bro; you’re burnt out.

I agree with what you’ve said here, but you really shouldn’t be able to say this about an MMO.

So yes, gear progression is necessary to keep players interested and playing past hitting 80 and getting that nice looking set you wanted.

Well an MMO is as far as they Developers have made it, MMO doesn’t stand for “M’never M’ending O’story”, so if you have played what you beleave is all content of an MMO you could say you have ‘Beat the game’ but in a month or as in GW2 each second week there is always something new to try.
You have bought GW2 and it is yours to play whenever you wan’t, you don’t have to pay each month or buy any needed gear so take a break and come back once every two weeks or something.

I would leave this game the instant I start to see level cap upped and a new gear grind.
GW1 has worked fine with 20 levels and no gear-grind why should GW2 do any worse?

Well I don’t know about you Edgar but I won’t bother logging in after getting max level, maybe map completion and a nice looking set.

As far as quitting and coming back a few months later goes, what is there now that wasn’t there 6 months ago? Dragon Bash event?

Lol.

yakuza snowdragon.4639:

Oh and I don’t like grind i just thought it would keep a larger population.

Actually it might just have the opposite effect.
I don’t like gear grind to the level that I don’t care how good the game is I will just leave it if I see it. I know that I’ll get busy with my studies, will want to play some other game and will fall behind everyone else just to eventually end up being locked out of the content. When you know that it ends up kind of depressing to log back into the game and try to keep up. Plus there’s already plenty of games out there that will lock you into gear progression, we don’t need yet another one, we need a wider market with more choice.

Dangerkips.6035:

Well I don’t know about you Edgar but I won’t bother logging in after getting max level, maybe map completion and a nice looking set.

As far as quitting and coming back a few months later goes, what is there now that wasn’t there 6 months ago? Dragon Bash event?

Lol.

Actually yes, the living story is one of the things that keep me logging in every month. You might find it funny, but I don’t. I find it exciting.

GW1 didn’t have a gear grind and it went just fine.

GW1 had a lot better, stronger and deeper skill/combat system though.

OP, Take a second to step back and evaluate what you are saying.

You said that you:

• can’t be bothered to level right now.
• were spared a grind due to being lucky with the mystic forge.
• have everything you could think of to ask for in terms of loot.
• You said you want a gear grind otherwise there is no incentive to log in.

The root of the problem is that you don’t have anything to do, and you are unsatisfied with the prospect of grinding more levels or gear.

Yet, now you are asking to for the game to give you new gear to grind.

When you get that new gear, you will run out of things to do again, so another set of gear will need to be released to keep you motivated. Hence the treadmill effect.

Remove gear as your incentive and replace it with another thing:

• Looks
• Wealth
• Power
• Fame

In fact, lets attack this problem from another angle…

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/60/Maslow%27s_Hierarchy_of_Needs.svg

In essence you have satisfied your physicalogical and saftey needs.

So in order to make you feel satisfied I think one or more of three things needs to happen:

• Your physiological needs have to resurface
  (introduction of new loot to gain)
• Your safety needs have to become threatened
  (harder content and which challenges your characters ability to survive)
• You need to move onto the next tier of needs and find a core group of friends in game which give you incentive to log in
  (find people you have a real connection with in game, not just random friends or guild mates you don’t talk to)

This can then continue on with

• Esteem
  Feel good about yourself and respected by others. Maybe even a public figure.
• Self Actualization
  Play the game simply for the sake of enjoyment and not have a need to play.

Now self actualization is one of those things that almost no one ever achieves, in real life or in game. Realistically these needs are in a state of flux at all times as we play a sort of “root beer tapper” game trying to satisfy them.

Some people also start to apply the needs of others around them onto their own personal needs. So if I feel that I am safe, but those around me that are in my person circle are not, their needs of safety become my needs as well. Until they are safe I am not satisfied.

So to sum it up, you have satisfied your needs and wants, but there are more ways to keep on “needing” something beyond a gear grind.

tldr: Gear treadmills are a means to an ends, but they are not the core of the problem.

Dangerkips.6035:

Well I don’t know about you Edgar but I won’t bother logging in after getting max level, maybe map completion and a nice looking set.

As far as quitting and coming back a few months later goes, what is there now that wasn’t there 6 months ago? Dragon Bash event?

Lol.

Well as you may have notice I wrote take a break and come back once every two weeks, there are this ‘living story’ you know and for those who seems to love grinding there are these RNG boxes that you can grind over the whole month.
And also this game isn’t for everyone, still GW1 made it ok with maxlevel 20 and no gear grinding, and that is what we are talking about isn’t it? So why shouldn’t GW2 make it without it? Well it’s up to the future to decide, atm this game is to my taste and aperently not to yours.

Let me ask you all who loves Gear Grinding.
Q: What is it that makes the game more interesting to compleate a hard task to gain gear that you won’t even use since when you have got the so called “end game gear” you are done and you are back to square one ‘This game needs an expansion’ with new gear that we can aim for and when we get it it’s time we go ‘This game needs and expansion’! Again!
What is the differens to do a dungeon to gain a gear you think looks neat and that you will use until you find another gear you think looks even cooler?

Is it bragging rights?
Is it the thought; yea I am might I can beat anything now!
Or what?

Well sorry for putting words in your mouths but I can’t understand the ‘Gear grind’ playstyle at all.

Considering the absence of a gear treadmill was one of the major selling points for this game I think adding one would lose a lot more players than it would gain or retain.

If you’ve run out of stuff to do then just take a break for a bit and come back later. Although remember we’re getting new Living Story content soon.

It’s simple.

Living Story doesn’t make my character better.

Baring the addition of harder content, more gear results in unbalanced game and characters that are too powerful.

With that in mind, developers add more difficult content to match the increase of players increase in strength. Thus matching the strength of the players making it so your new gear puts you on par with the game, and not better.

I do find it odd that people complain about being bored with a game they’ve spent over a year playing. Maybe it’s because I didn’t come to GW2 from an MMO background, but I find it difficult to believe that GW2 is the one and only game you are playing, non-stop, for a year? Most other games charge you more and you’re done in about 6 hours.

But that said, if it really is the only game you’ve played non-stop for a year, then don’t get mad when people suggest you might need a break. Doing ANYTHING non-stop for a year gets boring after a while. And when we’re bored, we no longer overlook minor issues with the thing we’re bored with, and actively hunt down any issues that offer the slightest dissatisfaction.

I won’t suggest you play another game, get over it, this game isn’t for you … that’s silly, imo. If this game was for you for a year, then obviously it’s a game you did like. Now that you’ve reached end-game and have been there a while, you find a lack of stimulating things to do. Fair enough. But maybe it’s not that there’s a lack, it’s just that you expect to enjoy something continuously for over a year. That is an unrealistic expectation.

And to address the “ANet need to put out new content” argument. They do. They put out new stuff the whole time. But sometimes they can’t meet the demands of a more hardcore playerbase, who consume new content (that can take a long time to create/develop) within a day or two. Content isn’t designed to be done in a day or two. If you play it like that, that’s fine, but don’t expect a developer to be able to put out anything of quality if they’re rushing stuff out to appease what is in fact a minority of their playerbase. Also, you might find the new content boring. Fair enough. But not everyone will. If everyone found everything boring then they’d stop doing it.

Seriously, “burned out” is what immediately springs to mind. Sometimes, just not playing for a week will reset the fun of the exact same thing you were bored of a week before.

And grinding laurels to get the ascended acc’s. Devs should find a way to make mmos with grindind for mostly all the cool stuff. People had very high expectations from the game….but that was almoust a year ago.I personally don’t hope for too much from this game anymore. Had the potential but is just another victim of grinding.

Dangerkips.6035:

It’s simple.

Living Story doesn’t make my character better.

If you need to be better than anyone else just to feel good about yourself then that’s kind of sad.

Mirta.5029:

Dangerkips.6035:

It’s simple.

Living Story doesn’t make my character better.

If you need to be better than anyone else just to feel good about yourself then that’s kind of sad.

I’ll clarify. I don’t desire to be better so I can look down my nose at other people. I want my character to increase in power as I play the game. Not for bragging rights or kitten, but for the most basic premise of any RPG ever made: PROGRESS.

Can you think of other ways to “progress” beyond gear?

Seeing as gear has all the stats on it, and stat increases are what makes your character quantifiably better, no. Like you say, it has to be in tandem with new, challenging content, of course.

open ended question… my mistake

For me, my progress is in understanding game/class mechanics, finding a new build that no one has done, exploration, pvp/competitive gameplay, maybe even become a recognized expert or respected member of the community.

All of that I can do without new gear tiers, if anything more gear would cause those things to be harder to achieve because it would hinder my attempts at doing those things without getting the new gear first.

Dangerkips.6035:

Mirta.5029:

Dangerkips.6035:

It’s simple.

Living Story doesn’t make my character better.

If you need to be better than anyone else just to feel good about yourself then that’s kind of sad.

I’ll clarify. I don’t desire to be better so I can look down my nose at other people. I want my character to increase in power as I play the game. Not for bragging rights or kitten, but for the most basic premise of any RPG ever made: PROGRESS.

Everything that has a beginning has an end. You can’t request to have endless progress, because then it would not be progress. In other news – there is also no such thing as perfection.

Dangerkips.6035:

I’ll clarify. I don’t desire to be better so I can look down my nose at other people. I want my character to increase in power as I play the game. Not for bragging rights or kitten, but for the most basic premise of any RPG ever made: PROGRESS.

But your character does increase in strength.
- it learns while traveling the land of Tyria (levels up)
- it gains allies
- it goes up in ranks (personal story and Spvp)
and then it takes on Zhaithan and beats one of the elder dragons.
The journey itself just to beat Zhaithan is very long. If anything it’s done more realistically than other MMOs – you repare and army, you prepare weaponry, you don’t get some sort of divine power that allows you to poke it once and it falls dead. Do you know how ridiculous people think WoW story is? Here’s a dragon that nobody can beat – you 20 mere mortals climb its back and poke it for a very long time.

If someone were to forcibly climb onto my back and poke me for a very long time, I think I might want to die too…..

Dangerkips.6035:

Seeing as gear has all the stats on it, and stat increases are what makes your character quantifiably better, no. Like you say, it has to be in tandem with new, challenging content, of course.

But what if this new challanging content came without new gear?
I mean the Fire and frost dungeon was awesome IMO (and it makes me sad that it was only a temporary dungeon but that’s another issue) it didn’t have any new stat’s gear but almost everyone did it.
What we lack is new challanging stuff, not gear grind.
Soon we will have another dungeon to do, I am realy looking farward to it!

Mirta.5029:

Dangerkips.6035:

I’ll clarify. I don’t desire to be better so I can look down my nose at other people. I want my character to increase in power as I play the game. Not for bragging rights or kitten, but for the most basic premise of any RPG ever made: PROGRESS.

But your character does increase in strength.
- it learns while traveling the land of Tyria (levels up)
- it gains allies
- it goes up in ranks (personal story and Spvp)
and then it takes on Zhaithan and beats one of the elder dragons.
The journey itself just to beat Zhaithan is very long. If anything it’s done more realistically than other MMOs – you repare and army, you prepare weaponry, you don’t get some sort of divine power that allows you to poke it once and it falls dead. Do you know how ridiculous people think WoW story is? Here’s a dragon that nobody can beat – you 20 mere mortals climb its back and poke it for a very long time.

Sure, while you’re leveling. Then you hit a ceiling at level 80, which is what the thread is about.

It’s been close to a year now. Most people have several level 80 characters, presumably for the very same reason that they simply ran out of relevant things to do on their main. Living Story updates alone aren’t going to be enough to keep day 1 players playing for long I don’t think.

Gear grind isn’t necessary, rewards are. What we’re seeing is a severe lack of rewards and they are working on that.

There does have to be a carrot on a stick so once the rewards revamp is in all should be good. There is also two other major updates needed and expected for the game, the UI update and the combat update to finally and at long last fix the glaring problems with CC, condition damage, and support.

Some how I am a day one player and I still play for hours on end with only one 80. I have one of each profession, but I stay on my Guardian the most because of the affinity I have for the character (been playing by that name since EQ1, so it is “me” in all intents and purposes).

I honestly have spent hours just testing things out in the mists breaking down weapon/skill stats or testing new builds for effectiveness.

Every time I try to grind for gear or money I immediately get bored. I do now have a couple of different full set of exotics for different builds.

I have done all the dungeons once or twice, and ran through fractals for a bit. Only up to 12 or 13, I don’t remember, but it became too repetitive for me and I don’t care about gear that much.

I completed leveling and 100% world completion pretty early on, then reverted to spvp for a while. I step toe in wvw every now and then, but i was deterred due to the impact gear had on that front. I feel that in wvw I do not have the proper knowledge/gear/build to be effective and I am a solo player, so fighting zergs by myself is really intimidating.

As far as achievements go I am motivated but not driven by them, so it is always nice to knock out an achievement that I think I can do without a lot of effort.

I really am surprised it has been a year and I have done so LITTLE, compared to how I used to play games. I am passively working for a legendary by stockpiling up materials and hitting up the mystic forge every now and then, but it is not a focus. Also back to wvw, I am jumping in there again because I want a bigger challenge, but I think I need to find a better core group of people to play with instead of my solo routine that I do.

I think this laid back casual gameplay that I have developed stemmed from a couple of things. I am much older now than when I started playing MMOs back with EQ. Just turned 33 this month.

Also as I quit playing WoW, the only thing I did was sit around town afk, while looking for arena teams or waiting for my team mates to log in so we could push rating. Majority of my time was afk and ignoring PvE content, as it was not compelling to me after Lich King story.

So for me, gear is not an answer, but more compelling content and challenges are. I have always been interested in pvp and competitive gameplay though, as I was big in leaderboards for FPS games like quake3 and jedi knight outcast no force power saber dueling.

Fighting computers based AI is less engaging to me versus fighting against a real person with different ways of thinking and moving than a bot. What turned me off from WoW pvp was the emphasis of gear making it so that skill was less of an issue and gear became a pretty large factor on who would win a fight or not. It always felt good to beat a better geared player though.

Currently what has kept me playing has actually been the living story and the limited time on them. I want to experience them all and complete the available achievements during those times.

Admittedly the living story is a different form of carrot and stick, as they do not really do much other than provide some limited time gear skins with a grind placed in front of them… mixed with a heavy dose of RNG

Yet it has worked for me at the moment and I am relieved when the event comes to a close for a bit so I can relax….at the moment they seem to be back to back and I don’t like it in ways, because it is taking up all my time.

Dangerkips.6035:

Mirta.5029:

Dangerkips.6035:

I’ll clarify. I don’t desire to be better so I can look down my nose at other people. I want my character to increase in power as I play the game. Not for bragging rights or kitten, but for the most basic premise of any RPG ever made: PROGRESS.

But your character does increase in strength.
- it learns while traveling the land of Tyria (levels up)
- it gains allies
- it goes up in ranks (personal story and Spvp)
and then it takes on Zhaithan and beats one of the elder dragons.
The journey itself just to beat Zhaithan is very long. If anything it’s done more realistically than other MMOs – you repare and army, you prepare weaponry, you don’t get some sort of divine power that allows you to poke it once and it falls dead. Do you know how ridiculous people think WoW story is? Here’s a dragon that nobody can beat – you 20 mere mortals climb its back and poke it for a very long time.

Sure, while you’re leveling. Then you hit a ceiling at level 80, which is what the thread is about.

It’s been close to a year now. Most people have several level 80 characters, presumably for the very same reason that they simply ran out of relevant things to do on their main. Living Story updates alone aren’t going to be enough to keep day 1 players playing for long I don’t think.

I have played this game since Headstart almost everyday since that.
I have 6 level 80 chars and all of them with atleast 80 gear, my main has more or less everything accept legendary and some RNG fluff.
I still have a few of dungeon paths to compleate or rather master (Yes I wan’t to be good at compleating a dungeon without skipping any content)

Last week I have done the Dragon Bash Event’s and I have even been away RL but done every achievement on Dragon Bash and got hold of a ticket and a pair of holo wings and also the shattered wings ofc.

Now while awaiting Aetherblade Living Story I am leveling my 7th char with my Fiancée, doing Daylies and Meta Event’s.
And ofc I join in on bounty hunts, dungeons and WvW with my Guild now and then.
I also do some sPvP when I don’t have enough time to sit by the computer to long.

Though I agree that some Headstart players left pretty early, I have alot of WoW-playing friends who bought this game and played it up to level 80 and now they havent bothered toching it again, some even have had their account hacked and I warned them and they go ‘Meh, who cares’.

But not all “day-1” players will quit just like that and not becouse of loss of Gear grind.

Dangerkips.6035:

Sure, while you’re leveling. Then you hit a ceiling at level 80, which is what the thread is about.

But how far do you want the characters to progress? Until it’s too ridiculous to go well with the story?

Well put it this way. Do you see yourself still playing 6 months from now?

Furthermore, you can put it any which way you like, improving in gear is an inescapable necessity if they ever do come out with new, challenging content. If it isn’t necessary, then clearly the new content wasn’t challenging.