Guild Wars 2

forum bug.

You people should start seeing this as a problem. It’s going to come to a point where only farmers will be able to purchase anything from the gem store while the more casual set of players won’t. I play this game for fun, I try my best to get gold, but it takes time. Getting 160g for the old gem amount was already tough, but now it’s narly impossible.

RandomWolf.3986:

It’s going to come to a point where only farmers will be able to purchase anything from the gem store

What about accountants and lawyers?

Oh wait.. you mean with in-game gold, I see.
You can still a) do without yet another glider skin
Or you can b) use rl cash and support the game

Or you can wait until they level out again, they may even reduce a bit.
In the meantime the free gold from doing the daily should be worth a couple of gems a week at least.

General Health.9678:

RandomWolf.3986:

It’s going to come to a point where only farmers will be able to purchase anything from the gem store

What about accountants and lawyers?

Oh wait.. you mean with in-game gold, I see.
You can still a) do without yet another glider skin
Or you can b) use rl cash and support the game

Or you can wait until they level out again, they may even reduce a bit.
In the meantime the free gold from doing the daily should be worth a couple of gems a week at least.

140 gold for 400 gems / 2 gold per day from dailies = 70 days to buy 400 gems.

2 gold per day from dailies * 400 gems / 140 gold = 5.7 gems per day

5.7 gems per day * 7 days in one week = 40 gems per week

So yeah, technically you’re right, dailies will give a couple gems per week.

Of course, by the time you’ve saved up enough of that daily 2g the price will have gone up yet more so you will not have saved up enough at all ;p

Being able to convert gold to gems is a real bonus for the game and I’d really miss it but we have to accept that converting real $$$ to gems and/or gold is the priority for anet. They have a game to run.

I have no idea if the rate will ever come back down again.

mauried.5608:

The gem store contains nothing thats needed to play the game.
Its essentially all discressionary items that players want but dont need.
For games without monthly subs, Anet has to get its revenue from the gem store, and if people dont want to buy gems with real money, then the in game exchange rate between gems and gold must go up.

While most items on the gem store aren’t needed, bank expansion is essential for gathering and storage of materials needed for crafting. One bank slot and 250 material storage is hardly enough for materials needed to level in crafting. It would be difficult for a player to accumulate enough materials with such restrictions. Those don’t go on sale enough.

I’ve bought my share of gem cards to support the game. I wish bank expansion was somehow immune to the fluctuation in gem prices; maybe either swapping them to gold/karma/laurels or with it’s price going up and down with gem prices to keep it with in reach of those players that can’t afford to go out and purchase gem cards. The rest of the stuff on there isn’t critical for the game.

Ironically with the gathering tools on the gem store being so much more expensive relatively to gold now it’s better for players to just purchase orichalcum tools from vendors. They just need to be stackable. It would be nice if the unlimited gathering tools could be crafted and the animation effects purchased on the gem store a skins. I think they would sell more as skins at 500 gems.

Honestly, I think the price of gems is way to high, but I understand that’s what ANet wants so you buy gems with RL money.

I would be willing to accept that IF buying gems with RL money was somewhat fair. But come on, look at the prices:

- Bank tab – 7,5€
- Bag slot – 5€
- Shared inventory slot – 8,75€
- Storage expander (+250mats) – 10€
- Home Instance nodes – 10€
- Character slot – 10€
- Endless gathering tools – 12,5€
…

Am I the only one who thinks everything in the gem store is way too expensive in RL money? For example, someone who plays the game daily would want 2 character slots (let’s assume he got 2 from HoT +5 from vanilla), 2 bank tabs, 3 bag slots for one of his chars and 1 storage expander. That’s 60€ for some basic account upgrades, not even talking of maxing the whole account or cosmetic stuff.

If you wanted to max your account (3x char slots, 13x bank tabs, 10x shared inventory slots -buying at x5 sale-, 7x storage expanders, 3x bag slot expansions on 9 chars, and I won’t even include the instance nodes and the gathering tools), it would cost you 367,5€. And then add cosmetics, gathering tools…

I’m sure they have their own research on this, but I find hard to believe that they are maxing their Profit using these prices. It’s just not consistent with their target player (casual, comes and goes frequently…). Hardcore players could be willing to play that, since the game represents a huge amount of their play time, but that’s not the majority of GW2 community.

I think that if they lowered these drastically many more people would be buying stuff with RL money, especially with the actual gold-gem exchange rate. Cause let’s face it, gold-gem exchange won’t go down by 50% to previous levels, that’s what ANet wants. But rn I think many people are not buying neither through gold nor through RL money.

Hesacon.8735:

General Health.9678:

RandomWolf.3986:

It’s going to come to a point where only farmers will be able to purchase anything from the gem store

What about accountants and lawyers?

Oh wait.. you mean with in-game gold, I see.
You can still a) do without yet another glider skin
Or you can b) use rl cash and support the game

Or you can wait until they level out again, they may even reduce a bit.
In the meantime the free gold from doing the daily should be worth a couple of gems a week at least.

140 gold for 400 gems / 2 gold per day from dailies = 70 days to buy 400 gems.

2 gold per day from dailies * 400 gems / 140 gold = 5.7 gems per day

5.7 gems per day * 7 days in one week = 40 gems per week

So yeah, technically you’re right, dailies will give a couple gems per week.

All because they don’t want to spend $5€ for 400 gems. Of course you can only buy $10€ worth of gems at a time so that 400 gem goody and either save that other 400 gems for next time or convert it to 80-90 gold since it seems players can’t/won’t save gems.

Arkarian.1679:

Honestly, I think the price of gems is way to high, but I understand that’s what ANet wants so you buy gems with RL money.

I would be willing to accept that IF buying gems with RL money was somewhat fair. But come on, look at the prices:

- Bank tab – 7,5€
- Bag slot – 5€
- Shared inventory slot – 8,75€
- Storage expander (+250mats) – 10€
- Home Instance nodes – 10€
- Character slot – 10€
- Endless gathering tools – 12,5€
…

Am I the only one who thinks everything in the gem store is way too expensive in RL money? For example, someone who plays the game daily would want 2 character slots (let’s assume he got 2 from HoT +5 from vanilla), 2 bank tabs, 3 bag slots for one of his chars and 1 storage expander. That’s 60€ for some basic account upgrades, not even talking of maxing the whole account or cosmetic stuff.

If you wanted to max your account (3x char slots, 13x bank tabs, 10x shared inventory slots -buying at x5 sale-, 7x storage expanders, 3x bag slot expansions on 9 chars, and I won’t even include the instance nodes and the gathering tools), it would cost you 367,5€. And then add cosmetics, gathering tools…

I’m sure they have their own research on this, but I find hard to believe that they are maxing their Profit using these prices. It’s just not consistent with their target player (casual, comes and goes frequently…). Hardcore players could be willing to play that, since the game represents a huge amount of their play time, but that’s not the majority of GW2 community.

I think that if they lowered these drastically many more people would be buying stuff with RL money, especially with the actual gold-gem exchange rate. Cause let’s face it, gold-gem exchange won’t go down by 50% to previous levels, that’s what ANet wants. But rn I think many people are not buying neither through gold nor through RL money.

Imagine those that have to pay a monthly subscription to play a game…

I’m pretty sure that they didn’t just arbitrarily pick what to price various things. The existing prices could very well be at an optimum for them.

I just remembered something regarding the QoL items such as the bank tabs. I do feel bad for the newer players about it. Even if we say that those are optional, it really hurts your playtime when you don’t even have a few of those upgrades. With all the salvaging and endless variety of loot containers, a new player will spend majority of his time doing inventory.

Before the revamped guild upgrades, players have the option of creating a bank guild for themselves and purchase influence to obtain additional tabs. I for one have 3 bank guilds with full storage upgrades. That’s additional 250 slots per guild. I don’t think new players have that option now. In order to level up your guild, you need upgrades and those are heavily gated by gold and mats—and the level req’t to get the most basic storage is level 10! Not to mention it requires favors too. How will you do guild missions on your own?

Anyway, I just feel bad for this whole thing when we talk about bank tabs. With the gem prices so high, it really hurts new players.

It’s a combination of some things adding up.

For example:

There’s a large difference between the highest earners and the lesser earners, and many of the highest sources of income are rather repetitive behaviors that many people consider extremely boring and are willing to do, and some of them are even so passive they can be done while doing other things.

Also, when dailies give 2 gold now, that gave more people a bit more gold to use, which means more people willing to pay higher prices in the trading post for stuff, which results in higher earnings for those sucking wealth from other players out of transactions without actually producing anything through flipping. Flipping has a few good results, but it concentrates too much gold in a few individuals, and single individuals having too much gold only escalates, allowing them to go for more and higher value items until they have so much coin getting gems with coin is trivial for them even at these prices.

Then we have the ridiculous costs of things with real money. And how there’s just one currency for cash transactions. If there was a cash-only currency and then the ‘free’ currency you get with achievements rewards, buying with coin, contests, tournaments and the like, the cash-only currency could have better prices, and more people would be willing to buy stuff directly instead exchanging coin for gems. But as things are now, an armor skin set that should not cost more than 1 or 2 € costs 10€, and a full set of weapon skins that should never cost more than 5€ would go way over 50, and that being lucky with the stupid BL chests, since you can’t buy them directly, which is insane. So not that many people is willing to pay for that, and end up going for the unchecked money making schemes instead.

With two currencies and reduces prices for the cash-only currency, and additional payment methods that require no credit card like pay by SMS, they would make TONS of cash from smaller transactions from people willing to pay 1-5€ every now and then.

Whoever is managing the BL store must come from a background where things work very differently, because they are shooting themselves on the foot in the long term with all these shenanigans, and numbers for direct purchases will only go down over time if they keep at it.

I think you’re missing one thing and that’s any of the facts and all the psychology behind selling.
If anet were doing it wrong, they’d change it.

Tekoneiric.6817:

bank expansion is essential for gathering and storage of materials needed for crafting. One bank slot and 250 material storage is hardly enough for materials needed to level in crafting

And yet, when the game launched EVERY SINGLE PLAYER managed.
And I bet the majority are still managing.

If you feel something is really that essential and given there’s no monthly sub you should buy it with rl cash. It’s also still possible to use in-game gold. If you’re playing enough to be gathering and crafting enough to need expanders, you should be earning enough to pay for it with in-game gold. Can’t really have it both ways.

I was disappointed in guild bank tabs being locked behind progression when they were easier to access before. I’m in a position now where it would have been nice to have multiple guild banks.

… sigh … yet another “those kitten flippers”.

You want to stop flippers, stop selling immediately at the TP. Salvagers, container openers and yes flippers, all put in bids so a profit can be made from selling the salvage, contents or the item for a profit. This is coin other players for whatever reason decide they can’t be bothered to put in a sale order or understand the true value of the item they are dumping quickly. Those selling may see only a few silvers or coppers difference in price but for those who end up buying 100s daily, that difference adds up quickly.

Ayrilana.1396:

I was disappointed in guild bank tabs being locked behind progression when they were easier to access before. I’m in a position now where it would have been nice to have multiple guild banks.

I think it was a major unintended consequence of the old mechanic and something that ANet wished they had never allowed. (The old mechanic made it cheap to convert gold to influence and incredibly easy to obtain guild currency passively — both things that work against the guild-as-a-team philosophy they were aiming towards.)

That said, I definitely use guild banks as a ‘crutch’ for not managing my own inventory better. I’ve been gradually divesting my accumulated ‘stuff’ and will eventually sell them (or more likely: give them away to someone new to the game). They are certainly convenient; they just haven’t added any real value to my play time (probably decreased it, since I spend more time on keeping track of what’s in the g-bank).

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

Ayrilana.1396:

I was disappointed in guild bank tabs being locked behind progression when they were easier to access before. I’m in a position now where it would have been nice to have multiple guild banks.

I think it was a major unintended consequence of the old mechanic and something that ANet wished they had never allowed. (The old mechanic made it cheap to convert gold to influence and incredibly easy to obtain guild currency passively — both things that work against the guild-as-a-team philosophy they were aiming towards.)

That said, I definitely use guild banks as a ‘crutch’ for not managing my own inventory better. I’ve been gradually divesting my accumulated ‘stuff’ and will eventually sell them (or more likely: give them away to someone new to the game). They are certainly convenient; they just haven’t added any real value to my play time (probably decreased it, since I spend more time on keeping track of what’s in the g-bank).

Gw2efficiency is great for checking what’s in your storage guild bank. Just need to set it up and have an Internet connection. I’ve checked my storage on my iPad.

Arkarian.1679:

Honestly, I think the price of gems is way to high, but I understand that’s what ANet wants so you buy gems with RL money.

I would be willing to accept that IF buying gems with RL money was somewhat fair. But come on, look at the prices:

- Bank tab – 7,5€
- Bag slot – 5€
- Shared inventory slot – 8,75€
- Storage expander (+250mats) – 10€
- Home Instance nodes – 10€
- Character slot – 10€
- Endless gathering tools – 12,5€
…

Am I the only one who thinks everything in the gem store is way too expensive in RL money? For example, someone who plays the game daily would want 2 character slots (let’s assume he got 2 from HoT +5 from vanilla), 2 bank tabs, 3 bag slots for one of his chars and 1 storage expander. That’s 60€ for some basic account upgrades, not even talking of maxing the whole account or cosmetic stuff.

If you wanted to max your account (3x char slots, 13x bank tabs, 10x shared inventory slots -buying at x5 sale-, 7x storage expanders, 3x bag slot expansions on 9 chars, and I won’t even include the instance nodes and the gathering tools), it would cost you 367,5€. And then add cosmetics, gathering tools…

I’m sure they have their own research on this, but I find hard to believe that they are maxing their Profit using these prices. It’s just not consistent with their target player (casual, comes and goes frequently…). Hardcore players could be willing to play that, since the game represents a huge amount of their play time, but that’s not the majority of GW2 community.

I think that if they lowered these drastically many more people would be buying stuff with RL money, especially with the actual gold-gem exchange rate. Cause let’s face it, gold-gem exchange won’t go down by 50% to previous levels, that’s what ANet wants. But rn I think many people are not buying neither through gold nor through RL money.

I think that studies have shown that casual players are far more likely to pay real money than hardcore players. Cash rich time poor is the phrase that springs to mind.

Anything I buy in the gemstore I buy with real money. I have no pressing need for any more gold at the moment so I have no need to sell gems for gold.

Arkarian.1679:

Honestly, I think the price of gems is way to high, but I understand that’s what ANet wants so you buy gems with RL money.

I would be willing to accept that IF buying gems with RL money was somewhat fair. But come on, look at the prices:

- Bank tab – 7,5€
- Bag slot – 5€
- Shared inventory slot – 8,75€
- Storage expander (+250mats) – 10€
- Home Instance nodes – 10€
- Character slot – 10€
- Endless gathering tools – 12,5€
…

Am I the only one who thinks everything in the gem store is way too expensive in RL money? For example, someone who plays the game daily would want 2 character slots (let’s assume he got 2 from HoT +5 from vanilla), 2 bank tabs, 3 bag slots for one of his chars and 1 storage expander. That’s 60€ for some basic account upgrades, not even talking of maxing the whole account or cosmetic stuff.

If you wanted to max your account (3x char slots, 13x bank tabs, 10x shared inventory slots -buying at x5 sale-, 7x storage expanders, 3x bag slot expansions on 9 chars, and I won’t even include the instance nodes and the gathering tools), it would cost you 367,5€. And then add cosmetics, gathering tools…

I’m sure they have their own research on this, but I find hard to believe that they are maxing their Profit using these prices. It’s just not consistent with their target player (casual, comes and goes frequently…). Hardcore players could be willing to play that, since the game represents a huge amount of their play time, but that’s not the majority of GW2 community.

I think that if they lowered these drastically many more people would be buying stuff with RL money, especially with the actual gold-gem exchange rate. Cause let’s face it, gold-gem exchange won’t go down by 50% to previous levels, that’s what ANet wants. But rn I think many people are not buying neither through gold nor through RL money.

This is how I feel as well. The things that are actually pretty much required if you play the game a lot and want to enjoy all things about it(bank slots, bag slots, storage expander, char slots) are unreasonably priced, while costumes and glider skins and all cosmetic things are mega cheap and reasonably priced.

That’s the complete opposite of how it should be. I used to be able to buy all those overpriced things with gold, but with the current rate of gold – > gems I have no interest to. We need constant sales on those essentially mandatory items.

General Health.9678:

Tekoneiric.6817:

bank expansion is essential for gathering and storage of materials needed for crafting. One bank slot and 250 material storage is hardly enough for materials needed to level in crafting

And yet, when the game launched EVERY SINGLE PLAYER managed.
And I bet the majority are still managing.

If you feel something is really that essential and given there’s no monthly sub you should buy it with rl cash. It’s also still possible to use in-game gold. If you’re playing enough to be gathering and crafting enough to need expanders, you should be earning enough to pay for it with in-game gold. Can’t really have it both ways.

When the game launched there wasn’t 4 keys to keep in your inventory for HoT zones, SW shovels, and 2 more keys for drytops + silver wastes.(or bank)

When the game launched, champions didn’t drop loot bags, events didn’t give loot bags, your inventory wasn’t constantly filled with 50 different loot bags.

When the game launched. there wasn’t 30 different armor/weapon/jewelry books filling up your inventory(and bank).

When the game launched, there wasn’t 50 different coat/armor/glove/hat/etc boxes filling up your inventory(and bank).

When the game first launched, there wasn’t golden fractal relics, agony infusions, ascended t7 mats, experience scrolls, wits of experience, or many of the inventory -1 raid legendary unstorable items clogging up your invenryo(or bank).

When the game first launched, there wasn’t chak eggs, gifts of every HoT zone(fleet and stuff) just from finishing the zone clogging up your inventory.

When the game first launched, there wasn’t shimmering crystals, perfect mist cores, etc clogging up your inventory(and bank).

When the game first launched, there wasn’t ascended items that require 1k+ of materials for a full set of gear, and 250 storage was fine for crafting anything not a legendary.

When the game first launched, you weren’t given living story 2 rewards for mawdrey that take up like 6 inventory slots and can’t be stored anywhere but a bank/inventory.

Times have changed, the game has changed. The game now shoves so many items at you that playing without full 20 slots(100 total slots) or full bag slots unlocked is not bearable. Doing a single AB meta fills your inventory insanely fast, where you sometimes end up spending more time managing your inventory/visiting a mechant than actually playing the game. Doing any content does. This wasn’t the case before. There isn’t enough default bank space for all the stuff the game throws at you that you cannot store.

I have a tough time believing that 30 seconds at most between major fights to flush out their inventory is too much work or takes too long. Slow down, don’t speed run it.

This is the whole problem right here. Players who want cash shop items for free, so they only do the most gold/hour content to gather as much gold they can to exchange for gems which in turn raises the cost of conversion so they need to grind even more. So when they shut down dungeons you all left cause you couldn’t get the gold so you could avoid spending cash. Cut back on the energy drinks and coffee shop chain fancy coffees and use that cash to buy gems. Then you don’t have to care about only doing the content with the highest gold/hr.

I don’t want cash shop items for free.

I just don’t think $15 for 3 bag slots or nearly $10 for a single bank slot is reasonable.

I spent $50 on the cash shop last month. I am a supporter of buying things for real money and help anet fund the game.

I love the prices atm. As a supporter who doesn’t mind buying gems with rl money … the amount of gold you get now is great.

But I feel for those who buy gems from gold.

After figuring out the general attitude in the HoT threads AND the attitude of people today (talking about the retail business in real life) I really enjoy it the way it is right now.

I also buy Gems and I think it’s nice to have at least some advantage over the people that farm gold (and thus not supporting the game, actually just leeching off of the gem buyers).

The main reason we get these threads about gem prices is because people buy gems on an impulse. Something good appears in the gem store. The people who didn’t plan ahead all rush to buy gems. The ratio then shoots sky high and someone makes a thread about how high gold to gems are.

Make a habit of buying at regular intervals. Buy a set amount of gems per time period or when you reach a certain amount of gold. That way you won’t be buying gems when the prices are peaked. They’ll still be expensive of course but if you plan ahead you won’t be paying those premium prices.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Tumult.2578:

When there’s lot’s of comments saying this is natural, I like to ask questions.

How long before it becomes natural for a lot of players to no longer look at the Gem market?

How many players have already stopped even looking or considering gem purchases of any kind?

Sure there’s more readily available gold but that doesn’t mean it’s going towards gems, or will in the future, for many players. How many players have said to themselves “I simply can’t spend more than one gold for 4 gems”?

Doesn’t this make the division between the haves and the have nots, so much more obvious to players?

It’s not buy to win but can’t it look a whole lot like it?

I just don’t like the questions this all brings.

All of life looks like buy to win then if looking like buy to win is spending to buy fluff and convenience items.

If you have the gold and nothing you need or want on the trading post, why not convert it to gems? It’s not going to keep you warm at night or fund your retirement. Unless you like seeing your gold get higher and higher there’s no real reason not to convert gold to gems. You can even set up a regular purchase plan. Get X amount of extra gold and turn it into gems, or once a week buy X amount of gems. Gold in this game is not needed once you’re geared up and you have the skins you want.

I agree. You give sound advice that I have tried to follow from the start of the game.
But that doesn’t change the questions or my concern that more players are intentionally avoiding the purchase of gems with gold or for that matter with cash. At some point those players will stop looking, have less interest, become more easily drawn away. Just not good. At least with gems for gold, players were still investing more of themselves into the game. They could more easily last until new content reenergized the game and the market. Now, if they look back at some point, they will see an even bigger divide between where they are and where they see others are.

I’m fine with Anet making money. No money, no game. I just think it’s a bad time for this price increase for gems purchased with gold. I also am not an economist so I am not convinced that this isn’t being pushed heavily by a few well to do players, as I’ve heard others suggest in game.

Tumult.2578:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Tumult.2578:

When there’s lot’s of comments saying this is natural, I like to ask questions.

How long before it becomes natural for a lot of players to no longer look at the Gem market?

How many players have already stopped even looking or considering gem purchases of any kind?

Sure there’s more readily available gold but that doesn’t mean it’s going towards gems, or will in the future, for many players. How many players have said to themselves “I simply can’t spend more than one gold for 4 gems”?

Doesn’t this make the division between the haves and the have nots, so much more obvious to players?

It’s not buy to win but can’t it look a whole lot like it?

I just don’t like the questions this all brings.

All of life looks like buy to win then if looking like buy to win is spending to buy fluff and convenience items.

If you have the gold and nothing you need or want on the trading post, why not convert it to gems? It’s not going to keep you warm at night or fund your retirement. Unless you like seeing your gold get higher and higher there’s no real reason not to convert gold to gems. You can even set up a regular purchase plan. Get X amount of extra gold and turn it into gems, or once a week buy X amount of gems. Gold in this game is not needed once you’re geared up and you have the skins you want.

I agree. You give sound advice that I have tried to follow from the start of the game.
But that doesn’t change the questions or my concern that more players are intentionally avoiding the purchase of gems with gold or for that matter with cash. At some point those players will stop looking, have less interest, become more easily drawn away. Just not good. At least with gems for gold, players were still investing more of themselves into the game. They could more easily last until new content reenergized the game and the market. Now, if they look back at some point, they will see an even bigger divide between where they are and where they see others are.

I’m fine with Anet making money. No money, no game. I just think it’s a bad time for this price increase for gems purchased with gold. I also am not an economist so I am not convinced that this isn’t being pushed heavily by a few well to do players, as I’ve heard others suggest in game.

They did say that the price increases (on the trading post) were because of the wealthy few bidding up the prices of luxury goods. That’s why they added gold for dailies. To benefit the gold poor majority.

However I’m not sure what anyone expects ANet to do. Put more skins in game seems to be the best possibility for lowering the gold to gem ratio. However then it cuts into the profits of this non subscription game based heavily on micro transactions.

Personally I consider gold a tool for getting what I want. Not as a source of wealth. Unlike real money it has no value if you only hold on to it. There’s no monthly interest. No hedge against future real life needs. If someone is holding gold when they have nothing they are saving up to buy then maybe they need to reconsider why they are piling gold up higher and higher.

I was saving up gold once. Then I realized I was hoarding gold for no reason and my savings were without a point. Now I buy gems once a month with any gold I have above a set baseline and use those gems for my gemstore purchases.

/shrug. If people would rather hold on to ingame tokens (gold) rather than use them to get what they want then obviously they are happier holding on to these tokens than trading them in.

Id suggest that what people want Anet to do is reduce the price of everything in the gem store that is deemed by the player base to be “essential”, whatever that is.
Maybe make everything in the gem store free for “essential items”.
The game would fold very quickly, and then all the players would be looking for someone to blame.

The bottom line is
I want something in the Gem Store but I dont have enough gold and I dont want to spend any Real money.
This is unfair , and Anet should fix it.

Some of the items in the gemstore that seem to be expensive may be priced with the expectation that purchases will often involve a blend of gems attained through the gold exchange and some purchased with real money. The company may very well be assuming that many of their $10 items are actually being sold for $5 plus time spent farming for gold.

Behellagh.1468:

I have a tough time believing that 30 seconds at most between major fights to flush out their inventory is too much work or takes too long. Slow down, don’t speed run it.

This is the whole problem right here. Players who want cash shop items for free, so they only do the most gold/hour content to gather as much gold they can to exchange for gems which in turn raises the cost of conversion so they need to grind even more. So when they shut down dungeons you all left cause you couldn’t get the gold so you could avoid spending cash. Cut back on the energy drinks and coffee shop chain fancy coffees and use that cash to buy gems. Then you don’t have to care about only doing the content with the highest gold/hr.

No, this is not the problem at all. People don’t want things for free, people want things at a fair price. I want to support the game buying gems with RL money, but right now I’m not doing it, because there’s no way I’m willing to pay 15€ for a couple of bank tabs or almost 10€ for a shared inventory slot.

I’m not saying this out of greed, I honestly believe ANet could make much more money if these items looked cheaper in RL money compared to buying them through gold.

Shiyo.3578:

I don’t want cash shop items for free.

I just don’t think $15 for 3 bag slots or nearly $10 for a single bank slot is reasonable.

I spent $50 on the cash shop last month. I am a supporter of buying things for real money and help anet fund the game.

Just this. +1

Ashen.2907:

Some of the items in the gemstore that seem to be expensive may be priced with the expectation that purchases will often involve a blend of gems attained through the gold exchange and some purchased with real money. The company may very well be assuming that many of their $10 items are actually being sold for $5 plus time spent farming for gold.

It doesn’t work that way.
Those gems that are purchased with gold come from another player who bought them with RL money and exchanged them for gold so, in the end, $10 items are always sold for $10, with the variation of the gem gold exchange ratio aims for an equilibrium between gold->gem and gem->gold conversions.

For many players to purchase a $10 item with $5 and some gold farming, there has to be several others being milked.

Arkarian.1679:

No, this is not the problem at all. People don’t want things for free,

People in this thread have indicated that they do want things without spending real money.

Vargamonth.2047:

Ashen.2907:

Some of the items in the gemstore that seem to be expensive may be priced with the expectation that purchases will often involve a blend of gems attained through the gold exchange and some purchased with real money. The company may very well be assuming that many of their $10 items are actually being sold for $5 plus time spent farming for gold.

It doesn’t work that way.
Those gems that are purchased with gold come from another player who bought them with RL money and exchanged them for gold so, in the end, $10 items are always sold for $10, with the variation of the gem gold exchange ratio aims for an equilibrium between gold->gem and gem->gold conversions.

For many players to purchase a $10 item with $5 and some gold farming, there has to be several others being milked.

I expressed myself poorly, my apologies.

Essentially, many people will buy, with real money, more gems than they need for a direct gemstore purchase due to the way gems are packaged. This means that they have, potentially, extra gems lying around not being used for anything other than trading for gold.

A player that would, under ideal circumstances, spend real money to buy all of the gems needed for a desired gemstore item, might instead be able to buy fewer by trading gold for gems.

Ideally (for Anet):

Player A needs 1500 gems but buys 1600 ($20) due to packaging.
Player B needs 1500 gems but buys 1600 ($20) due to packaging.
Player C needs 1500 gems but buys 1600 ($20) due to packaging.
Player D needs 1500 gems but buys 1600 ($20) due to packaging.
Player E needs 1600 gems and buys 1600 ($20).
= $100 total income for Anet.

What happens instead:

Player A needs 1500 gems but buys 1600 ($20) due to packaging.
Player B needs 1500 gems but buys 1600 ($20) due to packaging.
Player C needs 1500 gems but buys 1600 ($20) due to packaging.
Player D needs 1500 gems but buys 1600 ($20) due to packaging.
Player E needs 1200 gems, buys 800 ($10) and trades gold for 100 gems each from players A-D.
= $90 total income for Anet.

So prices for items, and for gem packages, are set to offset lost income due to the ability of players to trade gold for other players’, “loose change.”

Arkarian.1679:

Behellagh.1468:

I have a tough time believing that 30 seconds at most between major fights to flush out their inventory is too much work or takes too long. Slow down, don’t speed run it.

This is the whole problem right here. Players who want cash shop items for free, so they only do the most gold/hour content to gather as much gold they can to exchange for gems which in turn raises the cost of conversion so they need to grind even more. So when they shut down dungeons you all left cause you couldn’t get the gold so you could avoid spending cash. Cut back on the energy drinks and coffee shop chain fancy coffees and use that cash to buy gems. Then you don’t have to care about only doing the content with the highest gold/hr.

No, this is not the problem at all. People don’t want things for free, people want things at a fair price. I want to support the game buying gems with RL money, but right now I’m not doing it, because there’s no way I’m willing to pay 15€ for a couple of bank tabs or almost 10€ for a shared inventory slot.

I’m not saying this out of greed, I honestly believe ANet could make much more money if these items looked cheaper in RL money compared to buying them through gold.

Shiyo.3578:

I don’t want cash shop items for free.

I just don’t think $15 for 3 bag slots or nearly $10 for a single bank slot is reasonable.

I spent $50 on the cash shop last month. I am a supporter of buying things for real money and help anet fund the game.

Just this. +1

But those prices haven’t changed in 3 1/2 years, other than going on sale once in a while. And it’s 600 gems for a bank slot not 800 so $15€ will buy you either 3 bag slots or 2 bank slots. Storage expanders and character slots on the other hand are 800 gems or $10€.

Shiyo.3578:

I don’t want cash shop items for free.

I just don’t think $15 for 3 bag slots or nearly $10 for a single bank slot is reasonable.

I spent $50 on the cash shop last month. I am a supporter of buying things for real money and help anet fund the game.

And you’re completely right. You don’t think it’s worth that much.
But Anet obviously does, and they are within their rights to charge what they feel thier product is worth. If you run your own business, you’ll know that always agreeing to low-ball offers isn’t the best way to prosper.

Obviously they benefit from a high gold to gem exchange rate, but remember, for a game that relies on microtransactions for ongoing revenue, they took quite a big risk in terms of commercial viability by even allowing a gold to gem exchange. We applauded them in 2012 for this, and I don’t see how the situation is any different now.

Shiyo.3578:

I don’t want cash shop items for free.

I just don’t think $15 for 3 bag slots or nearly $10 for a single bank slot is reasonable.

I spent $50 on the cash shop last month. I am a supporter of buying things for real money and help anet fund the game.

For me, it’s about small progression. For example, I set aside small amounts every week, like 10 dollars (not much), that I buy gems with. So every week I get my 800 gems. And I let it simmer until I want something. Now yes, that amounts to 40 a month, or roughly 520 a year, that I invest in this game, but it;s done at intervals of 10 dollars each, and it’s part of my fun money. Yes that means, the money I would put aside to go out drinking with my buds, or whatever frivolous thing I would spend it on, but for the hours that I play per week, 10 dollars is still cheaper then going out to the movies.

Anyway, most of the other people I know that have to play around life, do the same thing, and also set budgets with how much they can spend, often, like me, small amounts, and that is why they can have so much, from the gem store with so little effort, and not feel like they spent so much doing it. Yah. it maybe only 10 a week, or even 10 a pay check, and really, that’s not much to spend at any given time, but, that means every month they could get a new bank tab, or raise their collection limit by 250., or get an endless harvesting tool, and still have a few gems left over for later, and they will even out eventually.

So really, just write up a budget, and you will be amazed at how much you can amass with very little incremental investment.

I will say, side note, that since HoT, I have been less motivated to play, and thus less motivated to spend, so I;m not buy gems nor am I putting them up on the exchange, and while 1 person is just a drop in the bucket, if it’as a trend, then, it could mean a continual hike in the price of gems, if you plan to buy them for gold.

One of the worst and most overused phrases in this thread is
I think that something should sell for a “fair price”.
Whatever that means.
A fair price is differant for everyone , and in any economic model, in game or the real thing, nothing sells for a fair price.
Everything sells for what the seller wants for it.
If you dont like the price , you are free to not buy it .
If Anet is selling items for an unfair price, then they wont sell any, and will either have to drop the price or remove the item from sale.

I think it’s ridiculous that bag/bank space is unlock-able ONLY thro the game shop. I’ve always felt that inventory space should be obtained in game.

That was the main reason why my other gaming friends didn’t stay with this game shortly after launch.

I spend 10 or 20 dollars each month on this game- and i still haven’t obtained all the unlockers. I’m close- But still- It’s been a few years.

Hexinx.1872:

Some people refuse adamently to pay with RL money. They want accessibility or they will complain. Some kids may not have a CC and need an avenue to purchase items in the gem store to be even. With these prices to date, I generally don’t hesitate with the CC when I feel I ‘need’ something.

Atm I really want those aviator sunglasses, they finally returned, but I just spent 1200 of my 1500 gems, and maxed out my CC on pax tickets. So I’m S.O.L

From my understanding, this is how it goes:

• Exchanging gold for gems will raise the exchange rate.
• Exchanging gems for gold will lower the exchange rate.
• Buying gems with money does nothing, because those gems don’t get introduced to the pool if you hold onto them or spend them directly on gem store items.

So plenty of people could actually be spending real money on the gem store, but as long as they don’t convert those gems to gold it won’t affect the exchange rate.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

The main reason we get these threads about gem prices is because people buy gems on an impulse. Something good appears in the gem store. The people who didn’t plan ahead all rush to buy gems. The ratio then shoots sky high and someone makes a thread about how high gold to gems are.

Make a habit of buying at regular intervals. Buy a set amount of gems per time period or when you reach a certain amount of gold. That way you won’t be buying gems when the prices are peaked. They’ll still be expensive of course but if you plan ahead you won’t be paying those premium prices.

That’s a bigger problem. With A.net’s habit of removing things seemingly arbitrarily to create forced rarity, we almost have to buy things we want on impulse or risk losing the chance for months or years.

There are a lot of good points and the best I’ve seen in this topic is just how overpriced a lot of gem store items are in regards to real money. I agree with that, some items are just insanely overpriced for what they provide.

I’ve suggested elsewhere that A.net come up with a schedule for the Gem Store regarding items that they have put in there, when they will go away and when they will come back. That would go a long way into helping people plan better… but is that what they want?

Vyrulisse.1246:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

The main reason we get these threads about gem prices is because people buy gems on an impulse. Something good appears in the gem store. The people who didn’t plan ahead all rush to buy gems. The ratio then shoots sky high and someone makes a thread about how high gold to gems are.

Make a habit of buying at regular intervals. Buy a set amount of gems per time period or when you reach a certain amount of gold. That way you won’t be buying gems when the prices are peaked. They’ll still be expensive of course but if you plan ahead you won’t be paying those premium prices.

That’s a bigger problem. With A.net’s habit of removing things seemingly arbitrarily to create forced rarity, we almost have to buy things we want on impulse or risk losing the chance for months or years.

There are a lot of good points and the best I’ve seen in this topic is just how overpriced a lot of gem store items are in regards to real money. I agree with that, some items are just insanely overpriced for what they provide.

I’ve suggested elsewhere that A.net come up with a schedule for the Gem Store regarding items that they have put in there, when they will go away and when they will come back. That would go a long way into helping people plan better… but is that what they want?

We are not talking about the same things here. You’re talking about buying items on impulse when they appear. I’m talking about setting up a system to steadily buy gems on a schedule so that when those items do appear you have the gems in hand already and don’t need to exchange gold for gems when the price for them is the worse time for you.

Pandaman.4758:

From my understanding, this is how it goes:

• Exchanging gold for gems will raise the exchange rate.
• Exchanging gems for gold will lower the exchange rate.
• Buying gems with money does nothing, because those gems don’t get introduced to the pool if you hold onto them or spend them directly on gem store items.

So plenty of people could actually be spending real money on the gem store, but as long as they don’t convert those gems to gold it won’t affect the exchange rate.

Exactly, I like sometimes buy some gems, but I’ll never convert then for gold since isn’t worth: is easy to get gold ingame to buy what I want on TP and what I can’t afford even if I farm like a crazy (legendary weapons, permanent licenses like hair style one) I’ll need to spend my entire salary on gems to get a chance to buy something like that… And is cheaper craft/get a ascended weapon and but a total makeover kit anyways lol

You see, in general we don’t have much advantages to convert gems to gold, is better buy gems for buy what you want directly at Gem Store or simple farm gold ingame, no matter if what people want is in the Gem Store item or in the TP.

Maybe if things get more atractive for people buy gems for turn into gold can solve this problem*, but can put this in the pay to win line…

*is only a problem for people who hate farm anything and don’t want spend a penny on the game. While doubled the exchange prices, is 4x or more easy to get gold ingame right now no matter the game mode aside for people who do RP all day on the cities 24/7.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Vyrulisse.1246:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

The main reason we get these threads about gem prices is because people buy gems on an impulse. Something good appears in the gem store. The people who didn’t plan ahead all rush to buy gems. The ratio then shoots sky high and someone makes a thread about how high gold to gems are.

Make a habit of buying at regular intervals. Buy a set amount of gems per time period or when you reach a certain amount of gold. That way you won’t be buying gems when the prices are peaked. They’ll still be expensive of course but if you plan ahead you won’t be paying those premium prices.

That’s a bigger problem. With A.net’s habit of removing things seemingly arbitrarily to create forced rarity, we almost have to buy things we want on impulse or risk losing the chance for months or years.

There are a lot of good points and the best I’ve seen in this topic is just how overpriced a lot of gem store items are in regards to real money. I agree with that, some items are just insanely overpriced for what they provide.

I’ve suggested elsewhere that A.net come up with a schedule for the Gem Store regarding items that they have put in there, when they will go away and when they will come back. That would go a long way into helping people plan better… but is that what they want?

We are not talking about the same things here. You’re talking about buying items on impulse when they appear. I’m talking about setting up a system to steadily buy gems on a schedule so that when those items do appear you have the gems in hand already and don’t need to exchange gold for gems when the price for them is the worse time for you.

That’s what I do. I’m spending 5 gold a day on gems. If the price is low, I get more gems for the same amount of money. If the price is low, I get fewer gems for that amount of money. So, I end up buying more gems when the price is low. (This is the same thing as “dollar cost averaging.”)

I want to make sure I have gems for when, say, bag slots go on sale.

Shiyo.3578:

Times have changed, the game has changed. The game now shoves so many items at you that playing without full 20 slots(100 total slots) or full bag slots unlocked is not bearable.

I run 9 toons, none have full 100 slots, not a single one. Quite a few don’t even have all the bag slots unlocked. So this isn’t true.

If you’d been playing with so much loot for the last three years why haven’t you a) bought gems with gold and then bought bag slots.. b) spent some rl money to buy bag slots.

I’m just not seeing the issue. I salvage nearly everything after a meta next to a vendor and sell junk/runes/sigils etc. I drop rares or interesting things in guild (press g, drop off, press g.. back where you started) and deposit all mats on a regular basis. Totally bearable. And the solution if you’re not finding this is just to buy bag slots with all that loot you’ve mentioned.

If space is such as issue, the copper fed salvage item is the best investment. Just buy that and then use the free shared slot to store it. When your inventory is almost full during the middle of an event farm or whatever, salvage everything that isn’t in a bag. It takes less than 15 seconds to clear out a full inventory. When you’re at a vendor, sell the junk items.

RandomWolf.3986:

You people should start seeing this as a problem. It’s going to come to a point where only farmers will be able to purchase anything from the gem store while the more casual set of players won’t. I play this game for fun, I try my best to get gold, but it takes time. Getting 160g for the old gem amount was already tough, but now it’s narly impossible.

That’s the point.

The gold to gems conversion system wasn’t put there because Anet wants you to buy gems for gold. It’s there because it provides additional incentives for people that buy gems with money to do so, and so they can say “well you can acquire those items by playing the game”

Anet does not now, now will they ever care about the price of gems to gold conversion because they set that system up specifically to encourage buys to buy gems, not to encourage gold traders to avoid doing so.

It is a self adjusting system. When less people are selling gems, the price goes up, which encourages people to buy gems rather than trade gold for them. The fact that the gold price is increasing is an intended part of its design. If the number of gold traders versus gem buyers gets out of whack, the exchange rate is explicitly designed to make it unattractive to continue to trade gold for gems and extremely attractive to buy them for personal use or sale in stead. If the value of gems drops so low that they’re only attractive as gold trades, the system is designed to raise the price due to less supply so that people are, again, encouraged to buy gems.

Nothing in the cash shop was ever designed to be acquired by simply playing the game. That’s why nothing in the cash shop is, by the strictest definition, required to do so. This allows them to lean extremely heavily on the cash shop while still technically claiming that you don’t have to fork over your cash for those items.

They could be producing more expansion content and offering fair trade under the new model. It was a successful model for Anet for GW1. They chose to in stead rely even more heavily on the cash shop, release a lackluster expansion, and then double down again on the cash shop to make up for its poor sales.

Expecting a change in this behavior while financially supporting this model won’t make gems more accessible. Nor will it result in improved expansions going forward. Complaining about the gold price of gems while still encouraging others to buy gems, or buying them yourself will not change things.

Maybe there should be a vip option so anet can make more money, its hard for me to believe they make allot of money off the item shop, there isnt that many cosmetics, toys, and etc at once they do change them up, once people spend money on bag slots, bank spaces and etc what else is there to get other then cosmetics?

Ryou.2398:

Maybe there should be a vip option so anet can make more money, its hard for me to believe they make allot of money off the item shop, there isnt that many cosmetics, toys, and etc at once they do change them up, once people spend money on bag slots, bank spaces and etc what else is there to get other then cosmetics?

It isn’t that they need more money. It’s that they are hilariously fragmented for a studio of their size. At any given time they have far more projects under way than they have people to work on them, and for this reason they don’t push out updates for any part of their game fast enough.

More money won’t fix the underlying problem. Management of the studio, as a whole, has too many teams on too many projects with not enough people on any given team. Giving them more money in that environment without more cuts like the unpopular decision to halt legendaries won’t change a thing.

Everybody liked Colin’s smiling face, but he drove Arenanet in to the ground and Mo is trying to pick up his pieces.

Anet built a successful franchise by being realistic about its limitations, and focusing on leveraging existing systems with minimal systemic updates every expansion, and leaning on a core game that was well designed.

Anet damaged that franchise by spending years reinventing the wheel in all of the experimental gameplay, massive systemic updates, and multiple false starts since.

They don’t need more money. They need more agile management and a more realistic view of the limitations of the skilled staff they already employ. A money shaped band-aid will not fix the problems Anet has.

Mo is doing a good job filling Colin’s recently vacated shoes. He’s making logical cuts and actively engaging the player base. That needs to continue with whomever he hires to permanently fill that position.

PopeUrban.2578:

Ryou.2398:

Maybe there should be a vip option so anet can make more money, its hard for me to believe they make allot of money off the item shop, there isnt that many cosmetics, toys, and etc at once they do change them up, once people spend money on bag slots, bank spaces and etc what else is there to get other then cosmetics?

It isn’t that they need more money. It’s that they are hilariously fragmented for a studio of their size. At any given time they have far more projects under way than they have people to work on them, and for this reason they don’t push out updates for any part of their game fast enough.

More money won’t fix the underlying problem. Management of the studio, as a whole, has too many teams on too many projects with not enough people on any given team. Giving them more money in that environment without more cuts like the unpopular decision to halt legendaries won’t change a thing.

Everybody liked Colin’s smiling face, but he drove Arenanet in to the ground and Mo is trying to pick up his pieces.

Anet built a successful franchise by being realistic about its limitations, and focusing on leveraging existing systems with minimal systemic updates every expansion, and leaning on a core game that was well designed.

Anet damaged that franchise by spending years reinventing the wheel in all of the experimental gameplay, massive systemic updates, and multiple false starts since.

They don’t need more money. They need more agile management and a more realistic view of the limitations of the skilled staff they already employ. A money shaped band-aid will not fix the problems Anet has.

Mo is doing a good job filling Colin’s recently vacated shoes. He’s making logical cuts and actively engaging the player base. That needs to continue with whomever he hires to permanently fill that position.

Hmmm you have a point, I do think they might be in the right direction after all.

I wouldn’t be so quick to place all the blame on Colin. It could very well be that most of it he had no choice on. We just don’t know.