Guild Wars 2

killcannon.2576:

My point is, vaguely, that devs need to pick a direction…a flow….an overarching philosophy and stick with it. As you said earlier in the thread, the game was designed around DE’s; exploration; personal story; and active, skill based combat.

They don’t need the CDI threads. They just need to watch their own marketing material and do what it says. Games start shedding players when they can no longer follow a binding design philosophy.

They have picked a direction. For nearly a year now, they have concentrated on the LS and rapid release of content in small bits that collectively tell a story. It’s just not the direction that you want.

They’ve had a year to collect data about player habits, and it’s pretty obvious that while everything isn’t perfect, they are satisfied with the way the game is going. If it wasn’t working, they’d be doing something else.

Dark Catalyst.1028:

killcannon.2576:

Dark Catalyst.1028:

killcannon.2576:

Dark Catalyst.1028:

killcannon.2576:

Vayne.8563:

Dante.1508:

azizul.8469:

manifestos are the things of the past….

Sadly so is Guildwars 2 it seems, especially with 2014 just around the corner..

I’m not saying this in malice, i feel their manifesto was the right direction and listening to the “end gamers” back then was misdirection.

One of which has had repercussions to this day..

See this is particularly the kind of comment this forum doesn’t need. You don’t know how healthy the game is. You don’t know how many people are actually enjoying it. But you say that the game will be a thing of the past, with no evidence whatsoever.

This is not a post that’s helpful or constructive. It is, in fact, just a future prediction based on the fact that some people don’t like this game. Well some people don’t like WoW, but they seem to be doing okay.

It’s so easy to make comments like this, but they’re usually based on people assuming that more people share their opinion than is actually the case.

WoW is shedding players pretty quickly. What is sad though? Their fix is to copy game mechanics from GW2 which the players don’t want in that game. Timeless Isle is a bit of a joke. And they plan to produce their next expansion around those ideas. smh.

Starting to think there is just one big water cooler that all mmo devs drink out of.

Such as? What’s wrong with Timeless Isle? It allows new players or players who’ve come back after a significant break from the game (like me) to experience the current raid content.

Sigh. When they decided to start being “nice” to all the casual weekenders, and instituted the lfr system, and the lfg system, and welfare epics is when the game started shedding players.

There’s a timeline some poster made up over on their forums. It’s pretty telling that when WoW started being casual friendly was when their sub numbers tanked.

The moral here is that instead of chasing players, just design a quality game and stay true to your design philosophy….whatever that may be.

WoW started being “casual friendly” during Lich King and subs were at an all time high.

And? They didn’t remove anything. They added tools and ways for more people to see the content. You know, those things called raids that the vast majority of people never even set foot in during Burning Crusade. Raids, which they spend significant resources in order to create.

By the way, WoW, a 9 year old game, has more active players than this one does.

lol, all you have to do is look at sub numbers historically. The more casual friendly? the worse the numbers. And they continue to go down that road, it boggles.

Lich was BIG, and it was good content (most of it) and they were riding the wave of TBC. They didn’t add much during Lich that was overtly casual, although they did dumb down the instances and started homogenizing the classes. As the whine grew, and the devs added more and more casual friendly content, they lost their core player base.

I don’t have to defend the statement. It speaks for itself. The more casual friendly WoW has become, the fewer players it has. Of course the casuals would blame it on something else.

Maybe they’re leaving because it’s a 9 year old game that they’ve spent a lot of time on, and now that there are other options they want to try them out? It’s pretty simplistic to say sub numbers are dropping because it got “more casual” where there could be a variety of reasons as to why subs are dropping.

Also, much of what made vanilla and burning crusade “hardcore” was just pointless difficulty and time gating. There’s the challenge that comes with defeating a well designed encounter with functioning classes, and then there’s the “challenge” that comes with defeating an encounter because you stacked the right classes (and pigeon holed the weaker ones into a singular role) and spent a couple of weeks grinding mats so you could craft the resist armor needed to trivialize said encounter.

Whatever helps you sleep at night.

tolunart.2095:

killcannon.2576:

My point is, vaguely, that devs need to pick a direction…a flow….an overarching philosophy and stick with it. As you said earlier in the thread, the game was designed around DE’s; exploration; personal story; and active, skill based combat.

They don’t need the CDI threads. They just need to watch their own marketing material and do what it says. Games start shedding players when they can no longer follow a binding design philosophy.

They have picked a direction. For nearly a year now, they have concentrated on the LS and rapid release of content in small bits that collectively tell a story. It’s just not the direction that you want.

They’ve had a year to collect data about player habits, and it’s pretty obvious that while everything isn’t perfect, they are satisfied with the way the game is going. If it wasn’t working, they’d be doing something else.

……..Right. Is the CDI threads, the promise of adding permanent content, and trashing Scarlet not a clue for you there? They are doing “something else”. The LS isn’t retaining or growing their player base.

killcannon.2576:

I don’t have to defend the statement. It speaks for itself. The more casual friendly WoW has become, the fewer players it has. Of course the casuals would blame it on something else.

Nothing lasts forever. A person who began playing in its early years while in high school or college had time to devote several hours a day to playing, and the flexibility to join raids at the same time every week. Several years later, those same people are working extra hours at their jobs, raising families, and can’t always be online at 6 pm on Wed nights to join the raid.

So they play less, join a different guild, and eventually move on to other interests. There are more options now than a few years ago, so newer, younger players are spread out among several different MMOs instead of just playing WoW. Blizzard’s devs know they won’t replace the hardcore players as fast as they leave, so they need to attract casuals to keep the game alive. But the game is outdated and at the lower end of the graphics scale, and will probably fade away in a few more years.

killcannon.2576:

……..Right. Is the CDI threads, the promise of adding permanent content, and trashing Scarlet not a clue for you there? They are doing “something else”. The LS isn’t retaining or growing their player base.

I’ve browsed the threads and seen official word that Scarlet isn’t going away until the story is finished, the two-week release schedule is working just fine, and they have plans in place for next years LS.

The forums represent a tiny, vocal minority of players who think they speak for everyone. It simply isn’t true, and the devs have a lot more data on player behavior than we do, and thus a better view of the big picture.

tolunart.2095:

killcannon.2576:

……..Right. Is the CDI threads, the promise of adding permanent content, and trashing Scarlet not a clue for you there? They are doing “something else”. The LS isn’t retaining or growing their player base.

I’ve browsed the threads and seen official word that Scarlet isn’t going away until the story is finished, the two-week release schedule is working just fine, and they have plans in place for next years LS.

The forums represent a tiny, vocal minority of players who think they speak for everyone. It simply isn’t true, and the devs have a lot more data on player behavior than we do, and thus a better view of the big picture.

lol, gotta love that response. It’s sorta like “I’m taking my toys home”. Seems like the CDI initiative would prove that statement incorrect, but whatever.

If the forums don’t matter, then why bother taking the time to tell us how wrong and insignificant we are? lol, I love people.

I often wonder that myself. I guess I’ve been bored lately, I gave up on pointing out the obvious here months ago.

Such as, if everything the devs are doing is wrong, why are they still doing it? Because they don’t want to work for Anet any more, so they figure they’ll keep messing up the game until they get fired?

Or perhaps, just perhaps, you don’t have all the information you need to understand where the game is going, how many people log on every day, how well they are doing in meeting sales targets, etc. Maybe things are going pretty well, aside from the .0001% of players who constantly complain on the forums.

tolunart.2095:

I often wonder that myself. I guess I’ve been bored lately, I gave up on pointing out the obvious here months ago.

Such as, if everything the devs are doing is wrong, why are they still doing it? Because they don’t want to work for Anet any more, so they figure they’ll keep messing up the game until they get fired?

Or perhaps, just perhaps, you don’t have all the information you need to understand where the game is going, how many people log on every day, how well they are doing in meeting sales targets, etc. Maybe things are going pretty well, aside from the .0001% of players who constantly complain on the forums.

I suppose the proof — one way or the other — will come in six months to a year, when we see whether the CDI influenced ANet to make changes to their approach. We’ve already seen them start to introduce more permanent content with the LW, who knows what other changes will be made.

tolunart.2095:

I often wonder that myself. I guess I’ve been bored lately, I gave up on pointing out the obvious here months ago.

Such as, if everything the devs are doing is wrong, why are they still doing it? Because they don’t want to work for Anet any more, so they figure they’ll keep messing up the game until they get fired?

Or perhaps, just perhaps, you don’t have all the information you need to understand where the game is going, how many people log on every day, how well they are doing in meeting sales targets, etc. Maybe things are going pretty well, aside from the .0001% of players who constantly complain on the forums.

I know what I need to know.

I know that new game sales are down constantly over each quarter from the one before.

I know that the devs want feedback from the forums (gasp!), you know…those people who are unimportant and negative and are always wrong?

I know that gem sales are not keeping up with gold to gem conversion cause the rate keeps going up.

I know they (the devs) are asking for input about the LS, character progression, and prolly some other things I haven’t came across. From (gasp!) the forums.

I know that the low pop servers are getting lower in pop everyday because people keep transferring to higher pop ones to have a better experience.

I know that media sites and you tube views for gw2 have been going down over the last few months.

Anywho, done here. Way off topic, and this thread need to be gone anyway.

As far as I can tell, the CDI came about because of a private forum message that was leaked a few months back, to the effect that the forums were mostly “noise” that isn’t worth paying attention to. So they had to come up with a way to say “hey guys, we really do value your input!”

It was acknowledged at the beginning that while they were interested in collecting ideas and feedback, it’s not an excuse to order around the devs to your own benefit. When people posted complaints about Scarlet and the two-week release schedule, they were flat out told that these items were not up for discussion and they have no plans to change things.

Now, a good company does listen to their customers and makes changes based on the feedback. But they don’t listen to the loudest voices alone. If “everyone” hated ascended trinkets, they never would have continued with plans to release the rest of the gear. If no one wanted content to come every two weeks, they would have changed the release schedule.

At the same time, there are things people clearly wanted – they experimented with different ways to introduce new weapon skins before settling on the tickets/scraps system. They are using the LS to gradually make permanent changes to the game world, and bringing back popular content as fractals or in a rotation. They’re adding a new option for people working towards Legendaries.

The biggest problem with the forums is that people exaggerate and throw tantrums because their pet issues are not addressed in the manner they want them to be. The devs are definitely paying attention to what people are saying, here and elsewhere. It’s just that posting the same complaints over and over isn’t going to get you anywhere when the devs already know that most of their players don’t want the things you want.

killcannon.2576:

I know what I need to know.

I know that new game sales are down constantly over each quarter from the one before.

True, but that happens when box sales drop and you switch to cash shop. 3.5 million box sales is a pretty big chunk of change.

I know that the devs want feedback from the forums (gasp!), you know…those people who are unimportant and negative and are always wrong?

Well what do you suggest? Talking to players who initiate the conversation or do a mass mailing of a poll to the entire registered database? Their mail isn’t getting through reliably as it is, just imagine when a couple million people mark the poll as spam.

I know that gem sales are not keeping up with gold to gem conversion cause the rate keeps going up.

Not quite since likely most gem sales go directly toward purchasing items, not gold. Sales is still above the equivalent of 1/2 a million $15 a month subscriptions.

I know they (the devs) are asking for input about the LS, character progression, and prolly some other things I haven’t came across. From (gasp!) the forums.

See previous mass mailing comment.

I know that the low pop servers are getting lower in pop everyday because people keep transferring to higher pop ones to have a better experience.

That happens normally. Here we have WvW and you don’t want to be on the low pop server. Looking now in the wee hours of the East Coast only two servers are marked High with the rest marked Very High. Europe however is worse off. 3 Medium, 12 High and the rest Very High.

I know that media sites and you tube views for gw2 have been going down over the last few months.

Yea but the game is over a year old and I’m guessing most of those vids were created by players who were hyped up about GW2 and have grown dissatisfied with the game. There may me lots of players who enjoy the game, they just don’t bother throwing up a video about it.

Anywho, done here. Way off topic, and this thread need to be gone anyway.

At least for a couple of months before someone trots it out again.

Dark Catalyst.1028:

killcannon.2576:

Dark Catalyst.1028:

killcannon.2576:

Vayne.8563:

Dante.1508:

azizul.8469:

manifestos are the things of the past….

Sadly so is Guildwars 2 it seems, especially with 2014 just around the corner..

I’m not saying this in malice, i feel their manifesto was the right direction and listening to the “end gamers” back then was misdirection.

One of which has had repercussions to this day..

See this is particularly the kind of comment this forum doesn’t need. You don’t know how healthy the game is. You don’t know how many people are actually enjoying it. But you say that the game will be a thing of the past, with no evidence whatsoever.

This is not a post that’s helpful or constructive. It is, in fact, just a future prediction based on the fact that some people don’t like this game. Well some people don’t like WoW, but they seem to be doing okay.

It’s so easy to make comments like this, but they’re usually based on people assuming that more people share their opinion than is actually the case.

WoW is shedding players pretty quickly. What is sad though? Their fix is to copy game mechanics from GW2 which the players don’t want in that game. Timeless Isle is a bit of a joke. And they plan to produce their next expansion around those ideas. smh.

Starting to think there is just one big water cooler that all mmo devs drink out of.

Such as? What’s wrong with Timeless Isle? It allows new players or players who’ve come back after a significant break from the game (like me) to experience the current raid content.

Sigh. When they decided to start being “nice” to all the casual weekenders, and instituted the lfr system, and the lfg system, and welfare epics is when the game started shedding players.

There’s a timeline some poster made up over on their forums. It’s pretty telling that when WoW started being casual friendly was when their sub numbers tanked.

The moral here is that instead of chasing players, just design a quality game and stay true to your design philosophy….whatever that may be.

WoW started being “casual friendly” during Lich King and subs were at an all time high.

And? They didn’t remove anything. They added tools and ways for more people to see the content. You know, those things called raids that the vast majority of people never even set foot in during Burning Crusade. Raids, which they spend significant resources in order to create.

By the way, WoW, a 9 year old game, has more active players than this one does.

Wow is a game that was released to almost no competition with a war chest a mile high from sales of other games. They spent more money on advertising than Anet could hope to.

So this comparison is beyond meaningless. A game comes out with no competition, and a fortune to advertise and does well. No big surprise there.

If WoW was released today, no one would care.

killcannon.2576:

tolunart.2095:

killcannon.2576:

My point is, vaguely, that devs need to pick a direction…a flow….an overarching philosophy and stick with it. As you said earlier in the thread, the game was designed around DE’s; exploration; personal story; and active, skill based combat.

They don’t need the CDI threads. They just need to watch their own marketing material and do what it says. Games start shedding players when they can no longer follow a binding design philosophy.

They have picked a direction. For nearly a year now, they have concentrated on the LS and rapid release of content in small bits that collectively tell a story. It’s just not the direction that you want.

They’ve had a year to collect data about player habits, and it’s pretty obvious that while everything isn’t perfect, they are satisfied with the way the game is going. If it wasn’t working, they’d be doing something else.

……..Right. Is the CDI threads, the promise of adding permanent content, and trashing Scarlet not a clue for you there? They are doing “something else”. The LS isn’t retaining or growing their player base.

They said from the beginning the VERY beginning they’d add more permanent content as time went on. That wasn’t something they only recently decided. People are simply impatient.

The Scarlet story was planned to run as long as it’s running. They’re not cutting it short.

You have no idea whether or not the living story is retaining it’s player base or not. I don’t either.

Behellagh.1468:

Someone needs to come up with an equivalent picture for what happened to MMOs the way this illustrates what happened to FPS.

That picture could also be used for other game types. The left one is like a map of part of the early Resident Evil games and the right picture is pretty much exactly what Resident Evil 5 is (haven’t played 4 or 6).

Paul.4081:

That picture could also be used for other game types. The left one is like a map of part of the early Resident Evil games and the right picture is pretty much exactly what Resident Evil 5 is (haven’t played 4 or 6).

RE4 was a lot of fun, you should play it. :P All I have to add to this conversation.

Sigh. Is this still going on?

Can we have a CDI dedicated to this very topic? It seems to be on everyones mind, including my own from time to time, for the last year+ and is not going away.

Vayne.8563:

Dark Catalyst.1028:

killcannon.2576:

Dark Catalyst.1028:

killcannon.2576:

Vayne.8563:

Dante.1508:

azizul.8469:

manifestos are the things of the past….

Sadly so is Guildwars 2 it seems, especially with 2014 just around the corner..

I’m not saying this in malice, i feel their manifesto was the right direction and listening to the “end gamers” back then was misdirection.

One of which has had repercussions to this day..

See this is particularly the kind of comment this forum doesn’t need. You don’t know how healthy the game is. You don’t know how many people are actually enjoying it. But you say that the game will be a thing of the past, with no evidence whatsoever.

This is not a post that’s helpful or constructive. It is, in fact, just a future prediction based on the fact that some people don’t like this game. Well some people don’t like WoW, but they seem to be doing okay.

It’s so easy to make comments like this, but they’re usually based on people assuming that more people share their opinion than is actually the case.

WoW is shedding players pretty quickly. What is sad though? Their fix is to copy game mechanics from GW2 which the players don’t want in that game. Timeless Isle is a bit of a joke. And they plan to produce their next expansion around those ideas. smh.

Starting to think there is just one big water cooler that all mmo devs drink out of.

Such as? What’s wrong with Timeless Isle? It allows new players or players who’ve come back after a significant break from the game (like me) to experience the current raid content.

Sigh. When they decided to start being “nice” to all the casual weekenders, and instituted the lfr system, and the lfg system, and welfare epics is when the game started shedding players.

There’s a timeline some poster made up over on their forums. It’s pretty telling that when WoW started being casual friendly was when their sub numbers tanked.

The moral here is that instead of chasing players, just design a quality game and stay true to your design philosophy….whatever that may be.

WoW started being “casual friendly” during Lich King and subs were at an all time high.

And? They didn’t remove anything. They added tools and ways for more people to see the content. You know, those things called raids that the vast majority of people never even set foot in during Burning Crusade. Raids, which they spend significant resources in order to create.

By the way, WoW, a 9 year old game, has more active players than this one does.

Wow is a game that was released to almost no competition with a war chest a mile high from sales of other games. They spent more money on advertising than Anet could hope to.

So this comparison is beyond meaningless. A game comes out with no competition, and a fortune to advertise and does well. No big surprise there.

If WoW was released today, no one would care.

Interesting thoughts, but not sure I agree or disagree yet.

WoW had a few things going for it: no competition, cartoony dull graphics that could work on a myriad of machines, and they jacked some core concepts from other games.

While WoW did not have competition at its release, they have been “tested” over the years with many releases claiming to be the WoW killer and all of these games bounced off of WoW like a rubber ball.

The last sentence, I have to ask a question:

‘If WoW were released today, no one would care.’

My question is this.. Is that before during or after WoW stamped its mark into MMO history? By your statement, no one would care if WoW were released today. But if it were released today, was there an MMO giant that would have filled its shoes for the last 8+ yrs? Or would people look at a game like WoW, compare it to all the predecessors in aion, warhammer, swtor, etc..and say “woah, polished gameplay, lots of things to do at end game, huge raiding capacity..I like”.

Curious to think about it the other way. By the way, the last sentence in the above paragraph describes what Wildstar is/might be. I dub it, WoW 2.0 in space with all the trimmings of the modern day MMO style.

cesmode.4257:

Vayne.8563:

Dark Catalyst.1028:

killcannon.2576:

Dark Catalyst.1028:

killcannon.2576:

Vayne.8563:

Dante.1508:

azizul.8469:

manifestos are the things of the past….

Sadly so is Guildwars 2 it seems, especially with 2014 just around the corner..

I’m not saying this in malice, i feel their manifesto was the right direction and listening to the “end gamers” back then was misdirection.

One of which has had repercussions to this day..

See this is particularly the kind of comment this forum doesn’t need. You don’t know how healthy the game is. You don’t know how many people are actually enjoying it. But you say that the game will be a thing of the past, with no evidence whatsoever.

This is not a post that’s helpful or constructive. It is, in fact, just a future prediction based on the fact that some people don’t like this game. Well some people don’t like WoW, but they seem to be doing okay.

It’s so easy to make comments like this, but they’re usually based on people assuming that more people share their opinion than is actually the case.

WoW is shedding players pretty quickly. What is sad though? Their fix is to copy game mechanics from GW2 which the players don’t want in that game. Timeless Isle is a bit of a joke. And they plan to produce their next expansion around those ideas. smh.

Starting to think there is just one big water cooler that all mmo devs drink out of.

Such as? What’s wrong with Timeless Isle? It allows new players or players who’ve come back after a significant break from the game (like me) to experience the current raid content.

Sigh. When they decided to start being “nice” to all the casual weekenders, and instituted the lfr system, and the lfg system, and welfare epics is when the game started shedding players.

There’s a timeline some poster made up over on their forums. It’s pretty telling that when WoW started being casual friendly was when their sub numbers tanked.

The moral here is that instead of chasing players, just design a quality game and stay true to your design philosophy….whatever that may be.

WoW started being “casual friendly” during Lich King and subs were at an all time high.

And? They didn’t remove anything. They added tools and ways for more people to see the content. You know, those things called raids that the vast majority of people never even set foot in during Burning Crusade. Raids, which they spend significant resources in order to create.

By the way, WoW, a 9 year old game, has more active players than this one does.

Wow is a game that was released to almost no competition with a war chest a mile high from sales of other games. They spent more money on advertising than Anet could hope to.

So this comparison is beyond meaningless. A game comes out with no competition, and a fortune to advertise and does well. No big surprise there.

If WoW was released today, no one would care.

Interesting thoughts, but not sure I agree or disagree yet.

WoW had a few things going for it: no competition, cartoony dull graphics that could work on a myriad of machines, and they jacked some core concepts from other games.

While WoW did not have competition at its release, they have been “tested” over the years with many releases claiming to be the WoW killer and all of these games bounced off of WoW like a rubber ball.

The last sentence, I have to ask a question:

‘If WoW were released today, no one would care.’

My question is this.. Is that before during or after WoW stamped its mark into MMO history? By your statement, no one would care if WoW were released today. But if it were released today, was there an MMO giant that would have filled its shoes for the last 8+ yrs? Or would people look at a game like WoW, compare it to all the predecessors in aion, warhammer, swtor, etc..and say “woah, polished gameplay, lots of things to do at end game, huge raiding capacity..I like”.

Curious to think about it the other way. By the way, the last sentence in the above paragraph describes what Wildstar is/might be. I dub it, WoW 2.0 in space with all the trimmings of the modern day MMO style.

I’m excited for WildStar. Just hope they stay true to their own design philosophy over time and not try to be all things to all players.

It seems like people would be excited if WoW released today based on the hype I see for stuff like WildStar (WoW style MMO.)

It’s not really important either way, because we have no way of knowing, but just on the ip alone they would get 2-4 million right off the bat from warcraft fans in general. I think it’s silly to say no one would play one of the biggest franchises in gaming.

This discussion is evolving into a general gaming discussion. Ive suggested in the suggestion forums for a general off-topic discussion forum to talk about this stuff.

But this thread will be locked soon because it is deviating from GW2, and non-gw2 discussions are not allowed hence the need for one of these forums.

cesmode.4257:

Can we have a CDI dedicated to this very topic? It seems to be on everyones mind, including my own from time to time, for the last year+ and is not going away.

No need, I can tell you what the CDI would entail.

Unhappy Players: “But the ManifestO!111!!ONE1!! You lied >:-(”

Happy Players: “That was a long time ago, things change, move on!”

This goes on for several pages before:

ArenaNet: “We still believe in the ideas expressed in the manifesto and are working to live up to them. We believe we have been true to them. Thank you for your feedback, we’ll discuss it among ourselves, there has been some good discussion here. We’re not at liberty to tell you what is currently in the works or what to expect in the future. kthanksbye!”

Followed by more pages of the player discussion above, before the whole thing gets locked and stickied.

Vayne.8563:

Wow is a game that was released to almost no competition with a war chest a mile high from sales of other games. They spent more money on advertising than Anet could hope to.

So this comparison is beyond meaningless. A game comes out with no competition, and a fortune to advertise and does well. No big surprise there.

If WoW was released today, no one would care.

WoW actually didn’t do much of any advertising at launch. And ArenaNet had quite a warchest based on all of those sales numbers.

The comparison is pretty sound, especially when coupled with Mike O’Brien’s pre-launch statements about beating WoW.

It seems like developers are afraid to stick to their original vision and let “metrics” dictate too much of what’s happening. I think it happened with SW:TOR (that ended up being a VERY different game than it was going to be.) and I think it happened here w./ GW2.

Gibson.4036:

cesmode.4257:

Can we have a CDI dedicated to this very topic? It seems to be on everyones mind, including my own from time to time, for the last year+ and is not going away.

No need, I can tell you what the CDI would entail.

Unhappy Players: “But the ManifestO!111!!ONE1!! You lied >:-(”

Happy Players: “That was a long time ago, things change, move on!”

This goes on for several pages before:

ArenaNet: “We still believe in the ideas expressed in the manifesto and are working to live up to them. We believe we have been true to them. Thank you for your feedback, we’ll discuss it among ourselves, there has been some good discussion here. We’re not at liberty to tell you what is currently in the works or what to expect in the future. kthanksbye!”

Followed by more pages of the player discussion above, before the whole thing gets locked and stickied.

Hahaha. Well, the nerdraging might happen, but it also could have happened in the current CDI and it really didnt. We were all pretty civil.

cesmode.4257:

Hahaha. Well, the nerdraging might happen, but it also could have happened in the current CDI and it really didnt. We were all pretty civil.

True. I probably should have left out an exclamation mark or two.

Still, I wouldn’t expect much would be gained from it. Just the same circular “discussion” with the only change being Chris popping in to confirm that he’s reading.

Gibson.4036:

cesmode.4257:

Hahaha. Well, the nerdraging might happen, but it also could have happened in the current CDI and it really didnt. We were all pretty civil.

True. I probably should have left out an exclamation mark or two.

Still, I wouldn’t expect much would be gained from it. Just the same circular “discussion” with the only change being Chris popping in to confirm that he’s reading.

True. We agree with each other, haha.

But, maybe it would put an end to the constant existance of these threads. Every few weeks theres a manifesto pesto thread. If arenanet confronted this head on and said “Hey, heres a forum for you guys to have it, vioce your opinions and thoughts on the subject…but do it in accordance with forum rules”..give us a place to vent where they come in and chime their thoughts.. maybe after all is said and done, we will be spent on the topic.

Hell, give a warning.. “We will give a thread dedicated to this topic. We will participate in it much like we do in the CDI. Vent your feelings and thoughts, but keep it civil and abide by the forum rules. After this discussion is done, we will close the thread and any thread that follows it that is strictly about the manifesto will be closed immediatley because you have had you chance to discuss this issue at length for a year and in a forum dedicated to it. You have been warned.”

We then go at it for a few days or a week or two..and then, poof. No more talking about it on the forums. Maybe we get some answers maybe we dont.

Gibson.4036:

cesmode.4257:

Can we have a CDI dedicated to this very topic? It seems to be on everyones mind, including my own from time to time, for the last year+ and is not going away.

No need, I can tell you what the CDI would entail.

Unhappy Players: “But the ManifestO!111!!ONE1!! You lied >:-(”

Happy Players: “That was a long time ago, things change, move on!”

This goes on for several pages before:

ArenaNet: “We still believe in the ideas expressed in the manifesto and are working to live up to them. We believe we have been true to them. Thank you for your feedback, we’ll discuss it among ourselves, there has been some good discussion here. We’re not at liberty to tell you what is currently in the works or what to expect in the future. kthanksbye!”

Followed by more pages of the player discussion above, before the whole thing gets locked and stickied.

I feel like CDIs have served me pretty well and I still think this assessment is dead on .

IndigoSundown.5419:

Xae Isareth.1364:

The thing everyone seems to imply in this thread is that Anet just made Ascebded stuff to screw over their own manifesto and annoy everyone.

As a fairly large studio with hundreds of staff, working with millions in budget, in sure they probably weighed the benefits and costs of adding Ascended gear before introducing it.

FWIW, I agree that cost-effectiveness was a major factor in considering how to respond to the complaints of “nothing to do/work for.” It was a lot more cost effective to create a shallow stat grind than to fix cosmetic progression to enable an ongoing, robust cosmetic endgame.

However, I think that the initial negative reaction to Ascended prompted a shift in how Ascended was rolled out. After all, this gear type started as “available in fractals only,” and has since evolved into “put time into the game in a way that utilizes the content that was already developed.”

I’m not talking about that kind of cost. I’m talking about the benefit of giving the game enough sticking power to retain the mass market vs the cost of annoying people like those on the forums.

The players deserve to know what shape the game will take from this very moment up until an expansion is announced as its our time invested here.

The CDI is trying to achieve this collaboratively in a positive way but its weirdly retrospective.

Its as though GW2 should not have been released yet as we really are having a discussion about what the game should be before we play it.

In the mean time we are stuck bang in the middle of a game that has gone off on a tangent.

Essentially GW2 is a great game, but I feel like I am waiting for it to become something that it promised it already was.

tolunart.2095:

killcannon.2576:

My point is, vaguely, that devs need to pick a direction…a flow….an overarching philosophy and stick with it. As you said earlier in the thread, the game was designed around DE’s; exploration; personal story; and active, skill based combat.

They don’t need the CDI threads. They just need to watch their own marketing material and do what it says. Games start shedding players when they can no longer follow a binding design philosophy.

They have picked a direction. For nearly a year now, they have concentrated on the LS and rapid release of content in small bits that collectively tell a story. It’s just not the direction that you want.

Thats not an overarching philosophy, thats a content direction. An overarching philosophy would be a set of design principles that all content is developed under and follows. Arenanet are all over the place in this regard, no coherent overarching design philosophy, different teams making their respective content in isolation. The overall project management of the game as a whole is lacking.

Vayne.8563:

Dark Catalyst.1028:

killcannon.2576:

Dark Catalyst.1028:

killcannon.2576:

Vayne.8563:

Dante.1508:

azizul.8469:

manifestos are the things of the past….

Sadly so is Guildwars 2 it seems, especially with 2014 just around the corner..

I’m not saying this in malice, i feel their manifesto was the right direction and listening to the “end gamers” back then was misdirection.

One of which has had repercussions to this day..

See this is particularly the kind of comment this forum doesn’t need. You don’t know how healthy the game is. You don’t know how many people are actually enjoying it. But you say that the game will be a thing of the past, with no evidence whatsoever.

This is not a post that’s helpful or constructive. It is, in fact, just a future prediction based on the fact that some people don’t like this game. Well some people don’t like WoW, but they seem to be doing okay.

It’s so easy to make comments like this, but they’re usually based on people assuming that more people share their opinion than is actually the case.

WoW is shedding players pretty quickly. What is sad though? Their fix is to copy game mechanics from GW2 which the players don’t want in that game. Timeless Isle is a bit of a joke. And they plan to produce their next expansion around those ideas. smh.

Starting to think there is just one big water cooler that all mmo devs drink out of.

Such as? What’s wrong with Timeless Isle? It allows new players or players who’ve come back after a significant break from the game (like me) to experience the current raid content.

Sigh. When they decided to start being “nice” to all the casual weekenders, and instituted the lfr system, and the lfg system, and welfare epics is when the game started shedding players.

There’s a timeline some poster made up over on their forums. It’s pretty telling that when WoW started being casual friendly was when their sub numbers tanked.

The moral here is that instead of chasing players, just design a quality game and stay true to your design philosophy….whatever that may be.

WoW started being “casual friendly” during Lich King and subs were at an all time high.

And? They didn’t remove anything. They added tools and ways for more people to see the content. You know, those things called raids that the vast majority of people never even set foot in during Burning Crusade. Raids, which they spend significant resources in order to create.

By the way, WoW, a 9 year old game, has more active players than this one does.

Wow is a game that was released to almost no competition with a war chest a mile high from sales of other games. They spent more money on advertising than Anet could hope to.

So this comparison is beyond meaningless. A game comes out with no competition, and a fortune to advertise and does well. No big surprise there.

If WoW was released today, no one would care.

If there was no blizzard there would be no gw, we owe our game to blizzard as gw founders are ex blizzard employes.

GW2 used the same strategy WoW did to Everquest. WoW made MMORPG’s more accessible by making the inconvenient into convenient.

GW2 took that strategy into overdrive by looking for and identifying every possible inconvenience in WoW and making it convenient. Look at death and travel for example. Death is so inconvenient that they added downstate and rally systems. Travel is so inconvenient that they added waypoints, health regeneration and speed boost while out of combat.

As if the secret strategy to making a game successful is by making it convenient. Lets make sure our players aren’t even using their brains. That’s obviously too much work.

Then again, designing a game for a crowd of people that just want rewards might prove to be more annoying than worth while.

Might as well just sell keys so that players can have a chance to win something cool in treasure chests. Oh wait…

cesmode.4257:

Vayne.8563:

Dark Catalyst.1028:

killcannon.2576:

Dark Catalyst.1028:

killcannon.2576:

Vayne.8563:

Dante.1508:

azizul.8469:

manifestos are the things of the past….

Sadly so is Guildwars 2 it seems, especially with 2014 just around the corner..

I’m not saying this in malice, i feel their manifesto was the right direction and listening to the “end gamers” back then was misdirection.

One of which has had repercussions to this day..

snip

It’s so easy to make comments like this, but they’re usually based on people assuming that more people share their opinion than is actually the case.

WoW is shedding players pretty quickly. What is sad though? Their fix is to copy game mechanics from GW2 which the players don’t want in that game. Timeless Isle is a bit of a joke. And they plan to produce their next expansion around those ideas. smh.

Starting to think there is just one big water cooler that all mmo devs drink out of.

Such as? What’s wrong with Timeless Isle? It allows new players or players who’ve come back after a significant break from the game (like me) to experience the current raid content.

Sigh. When they decided to start being “nice” to all the casual weekenders, and instituted the lfr system, and the lfg system, and welfare epics is when the game started shedding players.

There’s a timeline some poster made up over on their forums. It’s pretty telling that when WoW started being casual friendly was when their sub numbers tanked.

The moral here is that instead of chasing players, just design a quality game and stay true to your design philosophy….whatever that may be.

WoW started being “casual friendly” during Lich King and subs were at an all time high.

And? They didn’t remove anything. They added tools and ways for more people to see the content. You know, those things called raids that the vast majority of people never even set foot in during Burning Crusade. Raids, which they spend significant resources in order to create.

By the way, WoW, a 9 year old game, has more active players than this one does.

Wow is a game that was released to almost no competition with a war chest a mile high from sales of other games. They spent more money on advertising than Anet could hope to.

So this comparison is beyond meaningless. A game comes out with no competition, and a fortune to advertise and does well. No big surprise there.

If WoW was released today, no one would care.

Interesting thoughts, but not sure I agree or disagree yet.

WoW had a few things going for it: no competition, cartoony dull graphics that could work on a myriad of machines, and they jacked some core concepts from other games.

While WoW did not have competition at its release, they have been “tested” over the years with many releases claiming to be the WoW killer and all of these games bounced off of WoW like a rubber ball.

The last sentence, I have to ask a question:

‘If WoW were released today, no one would care.’

My question is this.. Is that before during or after WoW stamped its mark into MMO history? By your statement, no one would care if WoW were released today. But if it were released today, was there an MMO giant that would have filled its shoes for the last 8+ yrs? Or would people look at a game like WoW, compare it to all the predecessors in aion, warhammer, swtor, etc..and say “woah, polished gameplay, lots of things to do at end game, huge raiding capacity..I like”.

Curious to think about it the other way. By the way, the last sentence in the above paragraph describes what Wildstar is/might be. I dub it, WoW 2.0 in space with all the trimmings of the modern day MMO style.

What games came out? Warhammer, that was so buggy at launch it was almost unplayable?

Do you know why so many people go back to WoW? Because they’re already at max level or close to it, with a ton of gold and they’ve put all that time and energy into it. Most of the games have have come out were released too early, were too buggy, were too small, or were just plain too poor to advertise.

So tell me, how many MMOs have William Shatner and Chuck Norris advertising for them?

People got into the game early. they played it, there was STILL no competition probably until Rift came out, and by then, it was already too late.

People go where their friends are and where they have history. If it was reversed, if any other game came out then that was relatively playable, backed by an advertising budget like Blizzard’s and it would probably be in the same place now.

Well WoW was earning upwards of a BILLION dollars a year in subscriptions at one point and with cash flow like that, you can have TV commercials starting Capt Kirk and Walker Texas Ranger and Mr T and a Toyota pickup truck. In the 5 reported quarters for GW2 they have yet to break a quarter of that. Money matters when it comes to advertising and when you have Scrooge McDuck piles of money to swin in, it’s a lot easier to do.

Behellagh.1468:

Well WoW was earning upwards of a BILLION dollars a year in subscriptions at one point and with cash flow like that, you can have TV commercials starting Capt Kirk and Walker Texas Ranger and Mr T and a Toyota pickup truck. In the 5 reported quarters for GW2 they have yet to break a quarter of that. Money matters when it comes to advertising and when you have Scrooge McDuck piles of money to swin in, it’s a lot easier to do.

Long before WoW was running those ads, it could afford to advertise heavily and it DID advertise heavily.

Lest you forget Warcraft 2 was wildly successful and WoW was piggybacking off that. Those who were actually there at WoW’s launch would remember what a complete and total disaster it was. The amount of server downtime was legendary. Why did people stay?

Because there was nothing else to play, because there was little competition and WoW kept advertising.

They made zillions of dollars later, sure, but they already had a huge budget for advertising even in the beginning. That’s what big companies can do that smaller companies can’t.

Vayne.8563:

Behellagh.1468:

Well WoW was earning upwards of a BILLION dollars a year in subscriptions at one point and with cash flow like that, you can have TV commercials starting Capt Kirk and Walker Texas Ranger and Mr T and a Toyota pickup truck. In the 5 reported quarters for GW2 they have yet to break a quarter of that. Money matters when it comes to advertising and when you have Scrooge McDuck piles of money to swin in, it’s a lot easier to do.

Long before WoW was running those ads, it could afford to advertise heavily and it DID advertise heavily.

Lest you forget Warcraft 2 was wildly successful and WoW was piggybacking off that. Those who were actually there at WoW’s launch would remember what a complete and total disaster it was. The amount of server downtime was legendary. Why did people stay?

Because there was nothing else to play, because there was little competition and WoW kept advertising.

They made zillions of dollars later, sure, but they already had a huge budget for advertising even in the beginning. That’s what big companies can do that smaller companies can’t.

WoW did not advertise much at all at launch. Maybe the standard print ad in PC Gamer. It was… maybe 5 years before they started a real active campaign? Not until WotLK.

I was there at WoW’s launch and it was nowhere near as bad… the only issue I had? Loot lag… because there were so many players. And some login queues that lasted for months because there were so many players coming to the game.

WoW’s success was due to two things: 1) an incredible game and 2) incredible word of mouth.

Zeldain.5710:

Vayne.8563:

Behellagh.1468:

Well WoW was earning upwards of a BILLION dollars a year in subscriptions at one point and with cash flow like that, you can have TV commercials starting Capt Kirk and Walker Texas Ranger and Mr T and a Toyota pickup truck. In the 5 reported quarters for GW2 they have yet to break a quarter of that. Money matters when it comes to advertising and when you have Scrooge McDuck piles of money to swin in, it’s a lot easier to do.

Long before WoW was running those ads, it could afford to advertise heavily and it DID advertise heavily.

Lest you forget Warcraft 2 was wildly successful and WoW was piggybacking off that. Those who were actually there at WoW’s launch would remember what a complete and total disaster it was. The amount of server downtime was legendary. Why did people stay?

Because there was nothing else to play, because there was little competition and WoW kept advertising.

They made zillions of dollars later, sure, but they already had a huge budget for advertising even in the beginning. That’s what big companies can do that smaller companies can’t.

WoW did not advertise much at all at launch. Maybe the standard print ad in PC Gamer. It was… maybe 5 years before they started a real active campaign? Not until WotLK.

I was there at WoW’s launch and it was nowhere near as bad… the only issue I had? Loot lag… because there were so many players. And some login queues that lasted for months because there were so many players coming to the game.

WoW’s success was due to two things: 1) an incredible game and 2) incredible word of mouth.

I disagree. I remember seeing ads. Not television ads, but they advertised plenty. The spent plenty of money on advertising. You don’t have to believe it, but that’s pretty much what Blizzard has always done.

And if you say it wasn’t bad, shrugs. Too many people have had other experiences, very publicly. For the first two months the game was down completely almost as much as it was up.

Edit: Anyway who tries to compare Anet’s coffers or even NcSoft’s coffers with Blizzzards is just being disingenuous. A much bigger company can afford to put much more into advertising and every company advertises.

But this is getting really off topic, which is the manifesto and I think we should steer it back there.

Calae.1738:

GW2 used the same strategy WoW did to Everquest. WoW made MMORPG’s more accessible by making the inconvenient into convenient.

GW2 took that strategy into overdrive by looking for and identifying every possible inconvenience in WoW and making it convenient. Look at death and travel for example. Death is so inconvenient that they added downstate and rally systems. Travel is so inconvenient that they added waypoints, health regeneration and speed boost while out of combat.

As if the secret strategy to making a game successful is by making it convenient. Lets make sure our players aren’t even using their brains. That’s obviously too much work.

Then again, designing a game for a crowd of people that just want rewards might prove to be more annoying than worth while.

Might as well just sell keys so that players can have a chance to win something cool in treasure chests. Oh wait…

Now, I have to disagree with most of this. I don’t think making a game more convenient requires that players switch their brains off; convenience is a factor that we don’t see in many MMOs.

In GW2, I don’t have to spend ten minutes on a travel route, only to spend twenty minutes going to the bank and back because I forgot to bring something. I don’t have to wait for an hour while a proper ‘healer-tank-mage’ party gathers, and then curse when everyone gets tired of waiting and leaves.

And I don’t have to wait until level 80 to be useful to my dungeon party.

In GW2, I am a participant, not a spectator.

TheDaiBish.9735:

I think when people talk about the manifesto (a statement of intention, not a promise like a lot of people make it out to be) they forget about things like resources available to the devs, or the fact that they have the concurrency numbers.

This isn’t defending every decision they make (IMO, Ascended and LS is poorly implemented, and the lack of communication regarding the implementation of Ascended), but it’s something to consider as to why they didn’t stick with their original intentions.

As for the ‘everything you love about GW1…’ line, who are they aiming that at? Everyone has different things they loved and disliked about the game.

A manifesto by all accounts can be considered a promise, the severe contradiction to anything in this declaration can be considered false advertisment that was used to lure the masses to buy their game under false pretense.

Im Mudbone.1437:

A manifesto by all accounts can be considered a promise, the severe contradiction to anything in this declaration can be considered false advertisment that was used to lure the masses to buy their game under false pretense.

No it can’t.

THIS is the definition of manifesto:

a written statement declaring publicly the intentions, motives, or views of its issuer

Nowhere in that definition does it say anything at all about it being set in stone and an absolute promise about the end-product.

But then again, if you are so sure it is considered false advertisement, feel free to sue them. If you are correct you would win and get quite a bit of money for your troubles.

A manifesto isn’t a promise, but it is supposed to be a meaningful statement about someone’s core intentions. Abruptly departing from a public manifesto rightfully causes people to question the integrity of a person doing so.

People unhappy with the way things turned out want to make a manifesto some sort of contract, and people who are happy want to water it down to something meaningless. The truth is somewhere between them.

Gibson.4036:

A manifesto isn’t a promise, but it is supposed to be a meaningful statement about someone’s core intentions. Abruptly departing from a public manifesto rightfully causes people to question the integrity of a person doing so.

People unhappy with the way things turned out want to make a manifesto some sort of contract, and people who are happy want to water it down to something meaningless. The truth is somewhere between them.

To me, this is the crux of the matter. You can parse the wording all you want but what they said, what they meant, what they let people believe, and what they did all matter. But none of it was set in stone or contractual.

I dont even care about the manifesto, after 10 years of mmos i dont trust what ppl advertise about their games. I will play the game and decide if i like it or not.

What do i like about gw2? well the graphics, how the character moves, b2p and thats it.

How about the rest? its kitten stupid …
No endgame , its all about looks and achievments, pvp is more or less a joke( i cant see myself playing just that mode of the game), balance its worse than in most of the games that made me leave cus of it (and wtf is this balance made after 2w – 1 month again and again), all the stuff made for casuals (most of them even want a legendary wep in a week or two), even the grind is dumb LOL – in other games ppl would need to play some good pve to farm the crazy mobs not this spam 1 buff speed champ dead oO.

Then why ppl still play it.. well i think for 80% of the player base its alts. I think alts eat a ton of time, and alts buy time for Anet atm + there is no other new decent game that comes close to GW2. I know that might sound crazy but it is what it is. And lets not forget the casuals with a nice credit card + ppl that think Anet will do smthing in the right direction.

A game that i would relate to when it comes to succes in mmo world ? EVE ONLINE
It has hardcore pvp, a more easy version for nabs – blob vs blob, it has plenty of room for famers/grinders ( some ppl just like to grind ), it has an awesome economy, it has a nice community, a true sandbox mmo and on a final note IT ALL MAKES SENSE – not this gw2 FARM THE NEW SKIN/ACHIEVMENT. Geez i regret selling my EVE account oO

Some of u talk advertising. Cmon i wont deny that advertising brings new ppl in but if u make an awesome game + all the game reviewers we have out there, the game would sell like crazy. U dont have to spend billions to sell a good game , but u have to when the game sucks. Its just like the real world out there.

Ofc the state of GW2 atm is sad, but we cant do much to change it, and seems Anet wont do either – t3 revamped on store its the lowest scam i could think off and doesnt give us much hope (i guess its that hard to make some new armor ).

So LOL at the Manifesto ( some guys said it right- u would think ANet will cure cancer) and keep dreaming.
Most of us wanted a perfect game to call home for a few years, but perfect doesnt exist and this isnt even close to it.

In GW2, I don’t have to spend ten minutes on a travel route, only to spend twenty minutes going to the bank and back because I forgot to bring something.

Imagine….

You had to spend 10 minutes to get to your destination while watching your back for creatures that want to eat you and an environment so dangerous that every breath you take brings you closer to death. Unfortunately, half way through your journey, you forgot your shiny glowing stick at the bank in Divinties reach. After arriving at Divinities reach, your possessions at the bank were stolen by pirates, including all your gold.

The journey is what makes the experience; not the reward. Unfortunately players like me are no longer the target market. Players like you are. Players that just want the reward and get frustrated every time there is an inconvenient obstacle in the way.

lordkrall.7241:

Shadow Blade.1324:

you mean like how you cant do fractals 50 till you grind through fractals 1-49? and grind your resistance gear?

Technically you can do lvl 50 Fractals without ever joining a fractal over lvl 1,, and the infusions can be bought on the TP.

how do i put these tp infusions in my exotic armour?
also by “do fractals” i mean play the game and not get carried while spending 90% of the time facedown.

Shadow Blade.1324:

how do i put these tp infusions in my exotic armour?
also by “do fractals” i mean play the game and not get carried while spending 90% of the time facedown.

Well since you can’t put said infusions in anything other than Rings and Backpacks currently I don’t really see the issue, since both of those can be obtained outside of fractals of high level fractals.

cesmode.4257:

Sigh. Is this still going on?

Can we have a CDI dedicated to this very topic? It seems to be on everyones mind, including my own from time to time, for the last year+ and is not going away.

They’re not going to touch this subject publicly. It will only go from bad to worse if they do.

Guild Wars 2 may not be perfect, but they have got a lot of thing right and have vastly improved various features common to MMO’s. The Manifesto had 3 main points:

Making the MMO more RPG
Making Guild Wars 2 more social
Rethinking Combat

Making the MMO more RPG
While this is not the most successful of the 3 points (in my opinion), they have made some good attempts at achieving this. Along with the personal story, which I feel could be improved upon, they have also brought us the Living Story content, which is supposed to be an ongoing ever changing story of Tyria. While they may not have got these things spot on, they have made a good attempt and I can see that they are focused on improving these things even further. Hopefully, at some point in the near future, we will get an expansion or continuation of the personal story. Until then we will receive an ever (hopefully) improving living story.

Making GW2 more social
To me, I feel Anet has done an outstanding job on this front. While we may not currently have things like a decent LFG tools, the base mechanics throughout the game promote a cooperative PvE experience beyond anything any other MMO has, that I have played. The fact that you do not compete against other players to tag mobs first or fight for the loot is an awesome step in the right direction and I applaud Anet for it.

Rethinking Combat
While the combat in GW2 has many common MMO elements, the feel of it is the best I have experienced. Now, whenever I look into any other MMO, if the combat does not feel as fun, or nearly as fun, as the combat in GW2 I tend to ignore it. Yes there are balancing problems (there will be in every game for the rest of time), but I feel they have got the feel and the fun factor of the combat spot on.

So, while there may be some details in the manifesto that have not been lived up to, I think Anet has done a grand job and continue to find ways to improve things. Don’t forget, Anet are experimenting with a lot of things in this game and they accept the fact that they may not always get it right, but at least they are willing to take the risk to try something new and to work with the players to get it right. This new CDI for example is a great step in the right direction if you ask me.

I may have got frustrated with many aspects of GW2 and flamed with the best of them, but I understand that making a game is not an exact science, nor is it an easy task. But the progress made so far and the latest discussions show me that Anet is very passionate about their game and are very keen to make it as awesome as they can.

As a last note, no game will suit everyone. There will always be players that will be unhappy with the game and will find something to complain about, because at the end of the day, we all want that one perfect game. But unless you are willing and able to make it yourself, you just have to accept whats on offer and find the game that suits you best. For me, Guild Wars 2 is still alive and kicking and has some great prospects that I am very much looking forward to.