Guild Wars 2

Coldtart.4785:

Faowri gets it. The game we were sold considered best-in-slot gear to not be a reward but rather the standard, and that assorted horizontal progression tracks would be the rewards. The game we have right now has only skins as horizontal progression and the vast majority of weapon skins and all armour skins take less effort to obtain than their best-in-slot equivalent.

Fortunately the stat gain from ascended isn’t as severe as it would be in another game and we do have a kinda-sorta promise that ascended is as high as tiers will ever go, but the entire premise and execution are so aggressively against the philosophy we were given pre-launch that it can’t help but leave a sour taste.

This is about where I’m at with regard to the Ascended business. Also, here’s a nod to Faowri for pointing out the seemingly confused design decisions.

As to the topic, it seems that whether GW2 seems alt-friendly or not depends on which aspects of the game matter most to each person. As far as I’m concerned, the base game sold at launch was alt friendly to my play style, and has become decidedly less so over the past year. After leveling 8 to 80, the existing zones and leveling content have reached diminishing returns as far as holding interest goes, and what’s being added is mostly all herd, all the time, which just does not cut it.

As to Ascended, crafting recipes with a raw materials list that long seems over the top.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

morrolan.9608:

Ah yes entitlement, the fallback position to demonise those who don’t want to grind.

But here’s the catch. You don’t have to grind.

Ah yes, another fallback position, used when there’s no real arguments addressing the problem. Yes, i don’t have to. It doesn’t change the fact that it is alt unfriendly. Extremely alt unfriendly, in fact.

Jrunyon.3012:

Asia Skyly.7198:

Do away with Soulbound items in favor of account bound items, and you have a point.

And destroy plenty of markets in the process?

No.

explain how that would ruin markets either you get tired of playing that weapon or character/profession and swap it you buy another weapon in its place it’s still bound to you just now you have the option of using it on any of your characters that can you just want to be able to charge all the players without it an arm and a leg like every other person out there I made it to my legendaries but some times I would rather be on my mesmer or guardian with twilight because warrior is undesirable with gs in WvW unless you come across a herd of scrubs.

Am I the only one feeling that with the fractal level having become account wide, agony resistance would benefit from being account wide too? Like the change they did for magic find. That would make the game a lot more alt-friendly in my opinion. For the other content it does not really matter if you are in exotic or ascended armor.

oh yea then we have as another said skins bought from the gem store dyes and heck why not things like the how to dance book? why cant that be a account bound purchase that you can turn on in your town clothes? basic stuff people the basics c’mon

Jrunyon.3012:

Asia Skyly.7198:

Do away with Soulbound items in favor of account bound items, and you have a point.

And destroy plenty of markets in the process?

No.

Who cares about markets. Capitalists. Your loss.

Astralporing.1957:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

morrolan.9608:

Ah yes entitlement, the fallback position to demonise those who don’t want to grind.

But here’s the catch. You don’t have to grind.

Ah yes, another fallback position, used when there’s no real arguments addressing the problem. Yes, i don’t have to. It doesn’t change the fact that it is alt unfriendly. Extremely alt unfriendly, in fact.

The fact that you bring up non-existent problems pretty much highlight my side of the argument. This game allows you to gear and play all the alts you have.

People want BiS gear, but don’t like the requirements. That’s fine. You can have the tier right below it. Exotics aren’t much different stat wise, and are much cheaper. Very alt friendly.

With every update they release now, I get further away from ever playing this game again.
Every update includes more grind, more pointless shiny baubles, and very little actual content, especially permanent.
Every release of goals that require a massive investment of time pushes me farther behind the curve hence lessening my desire to return as a second-class citizen of Tyria.

The longer I stay away, the less appealing the game becomes.

There is no initiative on ArenaNet’s behalf to tempt back relapsed players, and new players who do their research before buying will be confronted by a massively time-gated wall of “progression”.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Astralporing.1957:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

morrolan.9608:

Ah yes entitlement, the fallback position to demonise those who don’t want to grind.

But here’s the catch. You don’t have to grind.

Ah yes, another fallback position, used when there’s no real arguments addressing the problem. Yes, i don’t have to. It doesn’t change the fact that it is alt unfriendly. Extremely alt unfriendly, in fact.

The fact that you bring up non-existent problems pretty much highlight my side of the argument. This game allows you to gear and play all the alts you have.

People want BiS gear, but don’t like the requirements. That’s fine. You can have the tier right below it. Exotics aren’t much different stat wise, and are much cheaper. Very alt friendly.

Yes, yes, i understand your argument well. GW2 is very alt-friendly. Unless i actually want to have alts, and play the game. But hey, i don’t need to, so it’s okay.

You’re confusing newbie-friendly to alt-friendly.

The biggest problem with the game is that in one way it is alt friendly. It is easy to pick up on alts and it’s easy to get an alt in full exotics etc.

The problem is that it doesn’t reward you for your alts. You can have 8 characters fully decked out at every single dungeon entrance or you can have 1 of them, and you’ll be equally rewarded by the game for it. Because Anet is making content rewards account bound in order to make players do more varied stuff, which in a way is good, but it’s more damaging than it is helping.

If they made dungeon tokens rewards no longer account bound, or changed to weighting a bit (40-20 instead of 20-40) (don’t care about the daily gold reward) and removed the account bound from Fractal dailies, they would be a huge step ahead in being more alt-friendly.

morrolan.9608:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

I think the argument falls in the Entitlement category.

Ah yes entitlement, the fallback position to demonise those who don’t want to play the game.

Fixed that for you.

Yes, you are entitled if you feel like the game owes you something for doing nothing.

Astralporing.1957:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Astralporing.1957:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

morrolan.9608:

Ah yes entitlement, the fallback position to demonise those who don’t want to grind.

But here’s the catch. You don’t have to grind.

Ah yes, another fallback position, used when there’s no real arguments addressing the problem. Yes, i don’t have to. It doesn’t change the fact that it is alt unfriendly. Extremely alt unfriendly, in fact.

The fact that you bring up non-existent problems pretty much highlight my side of the argument. This game allows you to gear and play all the alts you have.

People want BiS gear, but don’t like the requirements. That’s fine. You can have the tier right below it. Exotics aren’t much different stat wise, and are much cheaper. Very alt friendly.

Yes, yes, i understand your argument well. GW2 is very alt-friendly. Unless i actually want to have alts, and play the game. But hey, i don’t need to, so it’s okay.

C’mon Astral, you know that you’re ignoring Exotics to suit your argument.

The game doesn’t offer Ascended gear without time and effort. That doesn’t make the game “alt-unfriendly.” It means that your alts either have to settle with -GASP- Exotics, or you have to play the game to earn BiS on every toon you want BiS on.

This isn’t unreasonable.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. Mine include the following:

1. Entitled is not a dirty word.
2. Any currency that is time gated by account but spent for the character is inherently alt-unfriendly. But, you can discuss the relative importance of the currency.
3. Most MMOs are bad games, with bad systems, saying this GW2 is better than other MMOs is not saying much.
4. We will never agree on this topic, so discussing it further is pointless.

Sirendor.1394:

Who cares about markets. Capitalists. Your loss.

A-net cares about the market, as it has the potential to reduce the money they make from the gem store.

If you make for example, a legendary account bound, they WILL at-least double in price(not exactly sure on eternity but I’ve been asking around and a lot of people would buy them now even i they cost 5k gold, if they stayed account bound).
Due to the people who are selling them realizing more people would easily be willing to spend 2k gold on an item they can now use on ALL the relevant alts they have.
With more demand comes higher prices.
its the same with dyes, if they made them account unlocked, the current ones with <100 currently for sale would skyrocket
(100g is their current price, imagine it doubling perhaps even quadrupling)
Just creating a massive market influx like that is something A-net wants to avoid, as it would be shifting HUGE masses of gold to specific players without them having to do anything other than canceling and re-posting the sale of an item.

YOU may not care about the market, YOU may not use it that often, but there IS a massive number of players that use the market, and most don’t even notice that you can make massive amounts of gold by doing tiny things.

One of the orginal selling points of GW2 was how alt friendly it was.

Since release this has been slowly changing.

Like it or not – GW2’s player base is made up of mostly casual player’s. This game does not offer enough depth or “power” gear progression to keep ‘hardcore" player’s happy.

So, my question would be then why release a system which is sole grind based (something this game said it wasn’t based on) and make’s it pretty much impossible and not enjoyable for most player’s to try and gear up more then one character?

Add into the fact the rewards are terrible and you are basically grinding so you can bring multiple characters to a fractal.

GrindWars has always had a TERRIBLE reward system as Season 1 WvW has proven but this is even going too far.

Most players will now be forced to chose a sole character to equip – which the end result of that will be less enjoyment for many and less people playing overall.

I find that GW2 is more alt friendly than GW1. In GW2 I didn’t have to grind out lightbringer and EOTN faction titles to become efficient in certain skill sets, areas, and hard mode.

Ascended armor is no where close to that level…

It is a +36 total stat difference and a 20-60 armor difference depending on the type. I have 3 other 80s, and in no way do I feel like I NEED ascended right away or feel incomplete from not having it, this is all in peoples heads as any other method other than the most fastest tedious grind becomes unacceptable, and is not a rational reason to change the game. Armor will come to my alts in its own time as long as I just continue to play like I have been, few hours a evening with friends doing group activities as I refuse to farm in this game.

Plus I have a hard time believe all these people that have 8-12 alts that had the time to get them all to level 80 and equip them, all of a sudden are too short on time to play those alts in various areas of the game to get them ascended armor.

After you get pass the 500 craft gate and the laurel gate, unless each toon requires unique stats, you can pretty much mass produce it at that point taking it day by day.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

I think the argument falls in the Entitlement category. Some players feel that they should be able to get all the BiS gear quickly and easily. Because Ascended gear takes time and effort to craft, you get the push back from players who don’t want to expend the time and effort.

Do you have this ready to paste in any topic that talks about Ascended?
Maybe you should read some of the topics you paste this into in a blind rush to defend something people aren’t even asking for. Very few, if any, are asking for it to be easy or quick.

MrRuin.9740:

Very few, if any, are asking for it to be easy or quick.

My feelings exactly. I have accepted the fact that ascended armor is here to stay. I have accepted the fact that without money, it will take a considerable amount to time to gear all my characters the way I like them (and had them).

What I am asking for is to make this game Alt-Friendly by making items which are currently soulbound into account bound.

I am not asking for legendaries to be unsellable.
I am not asking for less grind than anyone else.

In fact I will probably be motivated to make more legendaries and create additional armor sets so I can test various builds.

The current system is punish altoholics and it pigeon holes players into a build. What if that build changes?

My proposed solution is just one of many, allowing ascended armor to have selectable stats would be another, even if this comes at the expense of a gem shop item.

I do not understand how could anyone be against this idea.

MrRuin.9740:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

I think the argument falls in the Entitlement category. Some players feel that they should be able to get all the BiS gear quickly and easily. Because Ascended gear takes time and effort to craft, you get the push back from players who don’t want to expend the time and effort.

Do you have this ready to paste in any topic that talks about Ascended?
Maybe you should read some of the topics you paste this into in a blind rush to defend something people aren’t even asking for. Very few, if any, are asking for it to be easy or quick.

Let’s assume that they removed the time-gate.

Now we have threads about how those with more time to play are “getting catered to” because the grind can be done in marathon mode. Now the game is casual-unfriendly.

No way to win.

Shockwave.1230:

@ OP
Some of your points are valid. But they don’t address what makes the game not alt friendly.

• Vertical gear grind (promotes playing char with best build)
• Long grind for gear stats and look (promotes playing 1 char)
• Role locking based on gear (choice between build diversity or playing alts)
• Soul bound (promotes playing char with best soul bound gear)
• Long leveling process (it is long I played Gw1)
• the most interesting gameplay and most fun content is @ max level.
• Content encountered during the level up process does not have replay value, save story mode dungeons and some personal story (which can’t be replayed)
• others things not off the top of my head.

Both sides of this argument have valid points which is why there people that like the current state and people who don’t.

Gear grind? What gear grind? You can easily equip you char with exotics by lv 80. Are you talking about ascended? Have you seen the stat difference? All these people, talking about min-max’ing and then in game they put on something useless like Rune of the Dolyak 6# or run defensive builds in dungeons, just buy cof armor + weapon, put ruby orbs into it and you’re good to go, now if you want to go into WvW there are cheap pvt sets for badges, just put crests of the soldier into them and you’ll have all the items, which you could ever wish for. You obviously haven’t played any vertical progression MMO’s, where f.e. you need to buy a better weapon or you just do 0 damage at higher levels(literally 0).

If you use experience scrolls, some tomes of knowledge, level through dungeons and so on you can get to 80 in a week MAX, playing casually every day it will take you a month MAX. That’s not a lot and if you go into pvp/WvW you don’t need to level at all. Again, in many vertical progression games it takes a week to grind ONE level.

All content has replay value to me, so even that point is up to personal preference.

Asia Skyly.7198:

The current system is punish altoholics and it pigeon holes players into a build. What if that build changes?

Except it doesn’t do that unless you absolutely must have the best possible gear for all alts at level cap, for all builds.

I can’t be the only one who finds the above scenario preposterous.

I fractal, a lot, It would be nice if I could go into my FOTM 49’s with any character. I am currently only able to go with one character.

Prior to the changes to fractals I was able to take any character I wanted. The ascended gear (which played a part in the changes to FOTM), and its soul-bound nature, has totally forced me into playing a single character in high level fractals. I do not find that particularly fair.

So basically.. the only complaint I’ve seen to say it’s alt unfriendly is because of the Ascended gear?

meh. As a person who plays 5 characters and all are max level, I think this game is very alt friendly. Even though Ascended gear takes time to make, I find no issue in that. I plan on playing this game for years. I don’t have an issue if I take the next 12 months building my Ascended gear for these characters. What else am I going to do?

Delvoire.8930:

As a person who plays 5 characters and all are max level, I think this game is very alt friendly. Even though Ascended gear takes time to make, I find no issue in that. I plan on playing this game for years. I don’t have an issue if I take the next 12 months building my Ascended gear for these characters. What else am I going to do?

And therefore, no one else should? Right? Right??

Astralporing.1957:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Astralporing.1957:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

morrolan.9608:

Ah yes entitlement, the fallback position to demonise those who don’t want to grind.

But here’s the catch. You don’t have to grind.

Ah yes, another fallback position, used when there’s no real arguments addressing the problem. Yes, i don’t have to. It doesn’t change the fact that it is alt unfriendly. Extremely alt unfriendly, in fact.

The fact that you bring up non-existent problems pretty much highlight my side of the argument. This game allows you to gear and play all the alts you have.

People want BiS gear, but don’t like the requirements. That’s fine. You can have the tier right below it. Exotics aren’t much different stat wise, and are much cheaper. Very alt friendly.

Yes, yes, i understand your argument well. GW2 is very alt-friendly. Unless i actually want to have alts, and play the game. But hey, i don’t need to, so it’s okay.

Here’s your confusion. You’re mixing “NEED” and “WANT”. You can play GW2 with all Exotics just fine. You don’t “need” to have all Ascended gear, you “want” it. Thus your argument becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. It’s not alt friendly, because you can’t have what you want.

This is the same argument for all the complainers. People have this feeling that because they paid for this game, they should be entitled to getting the game to cater to their particular style of play. It’s ok to want things your way. Heck, I wish I could have Eternity, but you don’t see me complaining that it’s too hard to get.

Asia Skyly.7198:

Delvoire.8930:

As a person who plays 5 characters and all are max level, I think this game is very alt friendly. Even though Ascended gear takes time to make, I find no issue in that. I plan on playing this game for years. I don’t have an issue if I take the next 12 months building my Ascended gear for these characters. What else am I going to do?

And therefore, no one else should? Right? Right??

That’s my opinion. Never did I say that no else should.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

This is the same argument for all the complainers. People have this feeling that because they paid for this game, they should be entitled to getting the game to cater to their particular style of play. It’s ok to want things your way. Heck, I wish I could have Eternity, but you don’t see me complaining that it’s too hard to get.

I think you are mixing our concerns for the game we ALL love, for complaints without a base. We have listed many reasons why these concerns are valid. We have a different point of view and a different vision for the game: One that requires less pointless grind.

Some of you seem to be perfectly content with the grind. That is fine, but do not trivialize our concerns as invalid. They are valid, they have a base. The failure of the reader to understand the points does not make the point invalid.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Astralporing.1957:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Astralporing.1957:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

morrolan.9608:

Ah yes entitlement, the fallback position to demonise those who don’t want to grind.

But here’s the catch. You don’t have to grind.

Ah yes, another fallback position, used when there’s no real arguments addressing the problem. Yes, i don’t have to. It doesn’t change the fact that it is alt unfriendly. Extremely alt unfriendly, in fact.

The fact that you bring up non-existent problems pretty much highlight my side of the argument. This game allows you to gear and play all the alts you have.

People want BiS gear, but don’t like the requirements. That’s fine. You can have the tier right below it. Exotics aren’t much different stat wise, and are much cheaper. Very alt friendly.

Yes, yes, i understand your argument well. GW2 is very alt-friendly. Unless i actually want to have alts, and play the game. But hey, i don’t need to, so it’s okay.

Here’s your confusion. You’re mixing “NEED” and “WANT”. You can play GW2 with all Exotics just fine. You don’t “need” to have all Ascended gear, you “want” it. Thus your argument becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. It’s not alt friendly, because you can’t have what you want.

This is the same argument for all the complainers. People have this feeling that because they paid for this game, they should be entitled to getting the game to cater to their particular style of play. It’s ok to want things your way. Heck, I wish I could have Eternity, but you don’t see me complaining that it’s too hard to get.

No no no no no. Everything in this game is a “want”. We don’t “need” to play at all. We “want” to play it. All you are doing is saying that my wants are inferior to yours. No hard feeling though, I feel the same way about you.

If you want to maximize your toons then you need ascended gear.

The problem is that ascended gear serves absolutely no purpose in this game. It’s actually quite ridiculous. It’s a carrot that ANet dangles in from of the players (oooh… shiney stats!) Because some people can’t live without vertical progression.

So after the VP crowd whined, cried, and complained like entitiled brats until ANet caved on their core principles, you come here and say that we shouldn’t make our voices heard? That those of us who want to play the game ANet described before launch are acting “entitled.”

You like the word entitled but here’s another one you should look up. Hubris.

TooBz.3065:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Astralporing.1957:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Astralporing.1957:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

morrolan.9608:

Ah yes entitlement, the fallback position to demonise those who don’t want to grind.

But here’s the catch. You don’t have to grind.

Ah yes, another fallback position, used when there’s no real arguments addressing the problem. Yes, i don’t have to. It doesn’t change the fact that it is alt unfriendly. Extremely alt unfriendly, in fact.

The fact that you bring up non-existent problems pretty much highlight my side of the argument. This game allows you to gear and play all the alts you have.

People want BiS gear, but don’t like the requirements. That’s fine. You can have the tier right below it. Exotics aren’t much different stat wise, and are much cheaper. Very alt friendly.

Yes, yes, i understand your argument well. GW2 is very alt-friendly. Unless i actually want to have alts, and play the game. But hey, i don’t need to, so it’s okay.

Here’s your confusion. You’re mixing “NEED” and “WANT”. You can play GW2 with all Exotics just fine. You don’t “need” to have all Ascended gear, you “want” it. Thus your argument becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. It’s not alt friendly, because you can’t have what you want.

This is the same argument for all the complainers. People have this feeling that because they paid for this game, they should be entitled to getting the game to cater to their particular style of play. It’s ok to want things your way. Heck, I wish I could have Eternity, but you don’t see me complaining that it’s too hard to get.

No no no no no. Everything in this game is a “want”. We don’t “need” to play at all. We “want” to play it. All you are doing is saying that my wants are inferior to yours. No hard feeling though, I feel the same way about you.

If you want to maximize your toons then you need ascended gear.

The problem is that ascended gear serves absolutely no purpose in this game. It’s actually quite ridiculous. It’s a carrot that ANet dangles in from of the players (oooh… shiney stats!) Because some people can’t live without vertical progression.

So after the VP crowd whined, cried, and complained like entitiled brats until ANet caved on their core principles, you come here and say that we shouldn’t make our voices heard? That those of us who want to play the game ANet described before launch are acting “entitled.”

You like the word entitled but here’s another one you should look up. Hubris.

You must’ve missed the comments/posts from Anet that Ascended gear was supposed to be in the game at launch but wasn’t ready. So they slowly brought it out as they finished the details…

If Ascended gear was here on launch, would the same complaints be made?

Again, it is the only complaint I see from people that are saying the game is alt unfriendly. Remember, that is the original discussion.

Asia Skyly.7198:

Do away with Soulbound items in favor of account bound items, and you have a point.

This ^^ The entire concept of soulbound should be eliminated.

Delvoire.8930:

TooBz.3065:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Astralporing.1957:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Astralporing.1957:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

morrolan.9608:

Ah yes entitlement, the fallback position to demonise those who don’t want to grind.

But here’s the catch. You don’t have to grind.

Ah yes, another fallback position, used when there’s no real arguments addressing the problem. Yes, i don’t have to. It doesn’t change the fact that it is alt unfriendly. Extremely alt unfriendly, in fact.

The fact that you bring up non-existent problems pretty much highlight my side of the argument. This game allows you to gear and play all the alts you have.

People want BiS gear, but don’t like the requirements. That’s fine. You can have the tier right below it. Exotics aren’t much different stat wise, and are much cheaper. Very alt friendly.

Yes, yes, i understand your argument well. GW2 is very alt-friendly. Unless i actually want to have alts, and play the game. But hey, i don’t need to, so it’s okay.

Here’s your confusion. You’re mixing “NEED” and “WANT”. You can play GW2 with all Exotics just fine. You don’t “need” to have all Ascended gear, you “want” it. Thus your argument becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. It’s not alt friendly, because you can’t have what you want.

This is the same argument for all the complainers. People have this feeling that because they paid for this game, they should be entitled to getting the game to cater to their particular style of play. It’s ok to want things your way. Heck, I wish I could have Eternity, but you don’t see me complaining that it’s too hard to get.

No no no no no. Everything in this game is a “want”. We don’t “need” to play at all. We “want” to play it. All you are doing is saying that my wants are inferior to yours. No hard feeling though, I feel the same way about you.

If you want to maximize your toons then you need ascended gear.

The problem is that ascended gear serves absolutely no purpose in this game. It’s actually quite ridiculous. It’s a carrot that ANet dangles in from of the players (oooh… shiney stats!) Because some people can’t live without vertical progression.

So after the VP crowd whined, cried, and complained like entitiled brats until ANet caved on their core principles, you come here and say that we shouldn’t make our voices heard? That those of us who want to play the game ANet described before launch are acting “entitled.”

You like the word entitled but here’s another one you should look up. Hubris.

You must’ve missed the comments/posts from Anet that Ascended gear was supposed to be in the game at launch but wasn’t ready. So they slowly brought it out as they finished the details…

If Ascended gear was here on launch, would the same complaints be made?

Again, it is the only complaint I see from people that are saying the game is alt unfriendly. Remember, that is the original discussion.

No, they wouldn’t. But I’d only have 1 toon (and probably, but not necessarily, would have quit already). Also ascended gear acquisition is one of the most alt-unfriendly aspects of the game.

Other’s include daily boss chests, WvW ranks (soon to change), and dungeon tokens (40 token bonus / path is limited per account).

Edit; personally I believe that statement was marketing drivel. Matt Visual has a Q&A with Colin where he basically said it was added because they underestimated how quickly we’d burn though content.

TooBz.3065:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Astralporing.1957:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Astralporing.1957:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

morrolan.9608:

Ah yes entitlement, the fallback position to demonise those who don’t want to grind.

But here’s the catch. You don’t have to grind.

Ah yes, another fallback position, used when there’s no real arguments addressing the problem. Yes, i don’t have to. It doesn’t change the fact that it is alt unfriendly. Extremely alt unfriendly, in fact.

The fact that you bring up non-existent problems pretty much highlight my side of the argument. This game allows you to gear and play all the alts you have.

People want BiS gear, but don’t like the requirements. That’s fine. You can have the tier right below it. Exotics aren’t much different stat wise, and are much cheaper. Very alt friendly.

Yes, yes, i understand your argument well. GW2 is very alt-friendly. Unless i actually want to have alts, and play the game. But hey, i don’t need to, so it’s okay.

Here’s your confusion. You’re mixing “NEED” and “WANT”. You can play GW2 with all Exotics just fine. You don’t “need” to have all Ascended gear, you “want” it. Thus your argument becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. It’s not alt friendly, because you can’t have what you want.

This is the same argument for all the complainers. People have this feeling that because they paid for this game, they should be entitled to getting the game to cater to their particular style of play. It’s ok to want things your way. Heck, I wish I could have Eternity, but you don’t see me complaining that it’s too hard to get.

No no no no no. Everything in this game is a “want”. We don’t “need” to play at all. We “want” to play it. All you are doing is saying that my wants are inferior to yours. No hard feeling though, I feel the same way about you.

If you want to maximize your toons then you need ascended gear.

The problem is that ascended gear serves absolutely no purpose in this game. It’s actually quite ridiculous. It’s a carrot that ANet dangles in from of the players (oooh… shiney stats!) Because some people can’t live without vertical progression.

So after the VP crowd whined, cried, and complained like entitiled brats until ANet caved on their core principles, you come here and say that we shouldn’t make our voices heard? That those of us who want to play the game ANet described before launch are acting “entitled.”

You like the word entitled but here’s another one you should look up. Hubris.

Yes we all “want” to play. But the major difference here is that Anet made this game so that you could play it without being forced to gear a certain way. And no, you can’t use high level Fractals as an argument for gearing. Only my main is fully geared with Exotics and Ascendeds. The rest of my alts are Masterwork, Rare, and the occasional Exotic. I can play, beat Tequatl, do WvW, all just fine with my alts. Do I plan on gearing all my alts? Sure, because I want to, not because I have to.

If it takes 1 month or 1 year to gear my toons, that’s fine. There’s nothing that dictates a time frame for when I must do this. If I were impatient, and had to gear them all right away, I can still do that. People are selling “T7” mats already, but I would have to pay a high price for it.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

I think the argument falls in the Entitlement category. Some players feel that they should be able to get all the BiS gear quickly and easily. Because Ascended gear takes time and effort to craft, you get the push back from players who don’t want to expend the time and effort.

Entitlement =/= not wanting useless time gating.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

And no, you can’t use high level Fractals as an argument for gearing.
…

Are you serious? Why not? Because it invalidates your statement? Fractals is the sole reason for Ascended armor to be honest. Limiting you to one character is by definition NOT Alt Friendly.

style.6173:

Delvoire.8930:

TooBz.3065:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Astralporing.1957:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Astralporing.1957:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

morrolan.9608:

Ah yes entitlement, the fallback position to demonise those who don’t want to grind.

But here’s the catch. You don’t have to grind.

Ah yes, another fallback position, used when there’s no real arguments addressing the problem. Yes, i don’t have to. It doesn’t change the fact that it is alt unfriendly. Extremely alt unfriendly, in fact.

The fact that you bring up non-existent problems pretty much highlight my side of the argument. This game allows you to gear and play all the alts you have.

People want BiS gear, but don’t like the requirements. That’s fine. You can have the tier right below it. Exotics aren’t much different stat wise, and are much cheaper. Very alt friendly.

Yes, yes, i understand your argument well. GW2 is very alt-friendly. Unless i actually want to have alts, and play the game. But hey, i don’t need to, so it’s okay.

Here’s your confusion. You’re mixing “NEED” and “WANT”. You can play GW2 with all Exotics just fine. You don’t “need” to have all Ascended gear, you “want” it. Thus your argument becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. It’s not alt friendly, because you can’t have what you want.

This is the same argument for all the complainers. People have this feeling that because they paid for this game, they should be entitled to getting the game to cater to their particular style of play. It’s ok to want things your way. Heck, I wish I could have Eternity, but you don’t see me complaining that it’s too hard to get.

No no no no no. Everything in this game is a “want”. We don’t “need” to play at all. We “want” to play it. All you are doing is saying that my wants are inferior to yours. No hard feeling though, I feel the same way about you.

If you want to maximize your toons then you need ascended gear.

The problem is that ascended gear serves absolutely no purpose in this game. It’s actually quite ridiculous. It’s a carrot that ANet dangles in from of the players (oooh… shiney stats!) Because some people can’t live without vertical progression.

So after the VP crowd whined, cried, and complained like entitiled brats until ANet caved on their core principles, you come here and say that we shouldn’t make our voices heard? That those of us who want to play the game ANet described before launch are acting “entitled.”

You like the word entitled but here’s another one you should look up. Hubris.

You must’ve missed the comments/posts from Anet that Ascended gear was supposed to be in the game at launch but wasn’t ready. So they slowly brought it out as they finished the details…

If Ascended gear was here on launch, would the same complaints be made?

Again, it is the only complaint I see from people that are saying the game is alt unfriendly. Remember, that is the original discussion.

I don’t think this is true. I think I remember reading an article where they talked about needing to add this to satisfy people who wanted to progress.

Besides, ascended gear killed the GW2 manifesto. I really doubt they would have created a manifesto that would have been outdated before the game launched.

Yeah sorry. I was confused on this. It was from an interview Colin did back in March. Here is the quote.

Though Johanson accepts the huge outcry and accusations of betrayal from the playerbase were unavoidable, he admits the situation could have been handled better. In actual fact, Ascended Gear isn’t the most powerful gear in the game; it’s just as good as Legendary gear, but takes a fraction of the time to earn. “I think that ascended gear was something we should have had at launch,” Johanson says. “We didn’t have something above that exotic level that you put in a lot of time and earn it, but you don’t have to put in your whole life to earn it like a legendary weapon.

Asia Skyly.7198:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

And no, you can’t use high level Fractals as an argument for gearing.
…

Are you serious? Why not? Because it invalidates your statement? Fractals is the sole reason for Ascended armor to be honest. Limiting you to one character is by definition NOT Alt Friendly.

Because it’s an invalid argument. Fractals are elite dungeons. If you want to do the elite content, you gear yourself appropriately. If you want to be able to play the other 99% of the game, you don’t need Ascended.

Just because you can’t afford to do one dungeon, does not mean the game is alt unfriendly.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Asia Skyly.7198:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

And no, you can’t use high level Fractals as an argument for gearing.
…

Are you serious? Why not? Because it invalidates your statement? Fractals is the sole reason for Ascended armor to be honest. Limiting you to one character is by definition NOT Alt Friendly.

Because it’s an invalid argument. Fractals are elite dungeons. If you want to do the elite content, you gear yourself appropriately. If you want to be able to play the other 99% of the game, you don’t need Ascended.

Just because you can’t afford to do one dungeon, does not mean the game is alt unfriendly.

If you do WvW, full ascended is also required to play to the best of your classes capabilities. Min/Max baby, min/max

honestly, I could maybe see making legendarys account bound.

but to make ascended account bound just seem like a bit much.

Aeonblade.8709:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Asia Skyly.7198:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

And no, you can’t use high level Fractals as an argument for gearing.
…

Are you serious? Why not? Because it invalidates your statement? Fractals is the sole reason for Ascended armor to be honest. Limiting you to one character is by definition NOT Alt Friendly.

Because it’s an invalid argument. Fractals are elite dungeons. If you want to do the elite content, you gear yourself appropriately. If you want to be able to play the other 99% of the game, you don’t need Ascended.

Just because you can’t afford to do one dungeon, does not mean the game is alt unfriendly.

If you do WvW, full ascended is also required to play to the best of your classes capabilities. Min/Max baby, min/max

I play in all Exotics (except accessories), and can WvW just fine. What determines wins in WvW is size and coverage. If that didn’t matter, Maguuma would be wiping all servers due to our skill level.

Aeonblade.8709:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Asia Skyly.7198:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

And no, you can’t use high level Fractals as an argument for gearing.
…

Are you serious? Why not? Because it invalidates your statement? Fractals is the sole reason for Ascended armor to be honest. Limiting you to one character is by definition NOT Alt Friendly.

Because it’s an invalid argument. Fractals are elite dungeons. If you want to do the elite content, you gear yourself appropriately. If you want to be able to play the other 99% of the game, you don’t need Ascended.

Just because you can’t afford to do one dungeon, does not mean the game is alt unfriendly.

If you do WvW, full ascended is also required to play to the best of your classes capabilities. Min/Max baby, min/max

Actually, you have to be good at the game to play to the best of your class’s abilities.

All the gear in the world won’t save you from chain CC.

Mackdose.6504:

Aeonblade.8709:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Asia Skyly.7198:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

And no, you can’t use high level Fractals as an argument for gearing.
…

Are you serious? Why not? Because it invalidates your statement? Fractals is the sole reason for Ascended armor to be honest. Limiting you to one character is by definition NOT Alt Friendly.

Because it’s an invalid argument. Fractals are elite dungeons. If you want to do the elite content, you gear yourself appropriately. If you want to be able to play the other 99% of the game, you don’t need Ascended.

Just because you can’t afford to do one dungeon, does not mean the game is alt unfriendly.

If you do WvW, full ascended is also required to play to the best of your classes capabilities. Min/Max baby, min/max

Actually, you have to be good at the game to play to the best of your class’s abilities.

All the gear in the world won’t save you from chain CC.

I didn’t say it was the only thing you needed, but if you want to be truly competitive and not just another of the herd, you need the best gear on top of personal skill imo.

Quizotic.2815:

honestly, I could maybe see making legendarys account bound.

but to make ascended account bound just seem like a bit much.

Why is it a bit much? There is only one thing that needs to be done: remove soulbinding from the game in favor of account bound. Done. No need to distinguish Legendary vs. Ascended vs. anything else.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Aeonblade.8709:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Asia Skyly.7198:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

And no, you can’t use high level Fractals as an argument for gearing.
…

Are you serious? Why not? Because it invalidates your statement? Fractals is the sole reason for Ascended armor to be honest. Limiting you to one character is by definition NOT Alt Friendly.

Because it’s an invalid argument. Fractals are elite dungeons. If you want to do the elite content, you gear yourself appropriately. If you want to be able to play the other 99% of the game, you don’t need Ascended.

Just because you can’t afford to do one dungeon, does not mean the game is alt unfriendly.

If you do WvW, full ascended is also required to play to the best of your classes capabilities. Min/Max baby, min/max

I play in all Exotics (except accessories), and can WvW just fine. What determines wins in WvW is size and coverage. If that didn’t matter, Maguuma would be wiping all servers due to our skill level.

Lots of WvW isn’t about zerg versus zerg or player versus door.

Mireles Lore.5942:

I find that GW2 is more alt friendly than GW1. In GW2 I didn’t have to grind out lightbringer and EOTN faction titles to become efficient in certain skill sets, areas, and hard mode.

Ascended armor is no where close to that level…

It is a +36 total stat difference and a 20-60 armor difference depending on the type. I have 3 other 80s, and in no way do I feel like I NEED ascended right away or feel incomplete from not having it, this is all in peoples heads as any other method other than the most fastest tedious grind becomes unacceptable, and is not a rational reason to change the game. Armor will come to my alts in its own time as long as I just continue to play like I have been, few hours a evening with friends doing group activities as I refuse to farm in this game.

Plus I have a hard time believe all these people that have 8-12 alts that had the time to get them all to level 80 and equip them, all of a sudden are too short on time to play those alts in various areas of the game to get them ascended armor.

After you get pass the 500 craft gate and the laurel gate, unless each toon requires unique stats, you can pretty much mass produce it at that point taking it day by day.

you clearly did not play gw1 it was so alt friends it’s not even funny you claim you NEEDED titles to be efficient that’s not true I was rank 2 or 3 lb doing DoA and doing better than max lb players the titles had very little impact yes they did help a bit but it mostly depended on the players playstyle and knowledge of the area which OMG you did it 1800 times on a dif character and you bring another there you know the roles and you know the mob spawns/locations boom great player. and alts yes it is costly to gear 8-12 I have 11 and it’s not persay hard to level just meaningless i get nothing for doing it there is no trinity system so it’s not like I can roll a nuke and enjoy it for certain aspects or a healer. everything is exactly the same making it a grind after your first couple characters then you have to appeal to your sense of style which adds more grind if you like a dungeon armor or gold grind because you have to buy the armor skin etc. then you have dyes because yea starter dyes suck lord the list goes on and on I have 5 lvl 80s 3 full ascended trinkets others everything exotic and only really play 1 or 2 of them now because there is no diversity

Smooth Penguin.5294:

If that didn’t matter, Maguuma would be wiping all servers due to our skill level.

You lost all credibility with that statement lol

Delvoire.8930:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

If that didn’t matter, Maguuma would be wiping all servers due to our skill level.

You lost all credibility with that statement lol

I don’t agree with maguuma statement but I do agree that WvW is in terms of winning the biggest zerg and the ability to maintain a zerg during off hours wins no question anyone who denies it is lieing to themself and everyone else i mean heck you put mag against some of the rank 10-14 worlds and mag wins because of their numbers (on yaks we refer to you guys as the death ball because you que every bl and zerg ball the map until the week ends) and they usually have a 300k point lead on second place or more

The current LS system makes this the MOST Alt-unfriendly game I know of. Nothing is really repeatable on many alts given the time gating and account based achievement system.

One small example. In GW1 I was able to do WIK 14 times, for the same reward, on all characters. The “meta” reward was not by account, but by character. The content was/is permanent, and available to be played eventually by any new character created.

Permanent content is alt-friendly. Temporary is not, and you can’t spin it any other way.

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

The current LS system makes this the MOST Alt-unfriendly game I know of. Nothing is really repeatable on many alts given the time gating and account based achievement system.

One small example. In GW1 I was able to do WIK 14 times, for the same reward, on all characters. The “meta” reward was not by account, but by character. The content was/is permanent, and available to be played eventually by any new character created.

Permanent content is alt-friendly. Temporary is not, and you can’t spin it any other way.

Well said sir, I agree with this comment.

Seveleniumus.5973:

I’m really tired of reading all these threads of endless complains how gw2 is not alt friendly. All currencies are account bound, you don’t need to level for pvp, you’re up scaled in WvW, we have down scaling system in PvE, we have experience scrolls, we have tomes of knowledge, we have scrolls of knowledge, now we got account bound fractal level and soon – account bound WvW levels, how is that not alt friendly?
In many MMO’s when you create a new character, you start from SCRATCH, sure it can always be more alt friendly and it is definitely getting there, in any case, at least for me, this is one of the most alt friendly games I have ever played.

Make it so Laurels are acquired on a per character basis, not an acquirement per account over time, and I’ll stop complaining