Guild Wars 2

Niko Stark.8932:

(…)

It’s pretty easy to gain levels and top-tier items in GW2 in comparison with other MMOs. You have no idea what a real “grind” is XD

I dont see myself getting a ascended weapon or armor if i want to use the best tier.

The mats and cashto reach it and craft that gear might be a pain, ill wait for ascended gear hit the laurel vendor in wvw….

Niko Stark.8932:

Lol. Took me 5 weeks to make a legendary from nothing. That includes getting map completion and about 1M karma and running dungeons/events for the gold. I have a full-time job and I go out on some of my days off. It’s not a grind and even if it was, it’s a Legendary — they’re not supposed to just fall into your lap when you make a wish for it.

It’s pretty easy to gain levels and top-tier items in GW2 in comparison with other MMOs. You have no idea what a real “grind” is XD

You would be completely right if it was only about legendaries.

Not grindy at all, you are creating your own grind. I play to have fun and if I happen to have the materials needed for something I craft it…

ObsidianSaint.1079:

Not grindy at all, you are creating your own grind. I play to have fun and if I happen to have the materials needed for something I craft it…

What do you, personally, do while you’re ‘playing to have fun’?

Draknar.5748:

Everyone in this thread that has claimed GW2 is the grindiest game ever just seem to dislike GW2 in general. Playing GW2 is like work to them and unenjoyable. Which certainly begs the question: why the heck are you still here? And if you’ve stopped playing, why the heck are you on the forums?

Multiple reasons but don’t forget that this whole game is marketed around those people. It’s all about skins, the main item to go for is a skin and so on.

Thats probably also why they make exactly that part (cosmetics) a grind (monetizing that) because they want to make money that way. What is the whole problem. Making money is fine but don’t make your game (optional cosmetics) a grind for that goal. Just sell expansions.

I did buy this game.. (yes buy, now download for free like a F2P game) to not have that sort of F2P type of crap.

A game where cosmetics are the main goal and is B2P so has no negative effects from cash-shop focused F2P game. Sounds like a great deal except if they then going to base there income on a cash-shop anyway and monetize those cosmetics to do so. Turning exactly that part of the game in a ‘grind or buy’ deal.

I will put it this way:

1. People don’t want hard content because it is punishing.
2. People don’t want easy content because it is not rewarding.
3. People don’t want repitive content becasue it isn’t fun.
4. People don’t want one-time content becasue you can’t play it again.

What people want is the perfect picture of fun in their imagination, which varies for every player in this game. All I have to say is good luck and enjoy discussing, even if you are just wasting your time here because if this isn’t the game you want to play, uninstall and play another, it is more simple than what you think.

FF11 was a very grindly game i am not sure if was the most but it comply blows GW2 out of the water for the “Most gridly game” out there. The big thing in FF11 is that you did not get gold and items (for the most part) when you leveled up you had to farm before you could level up and the game was nearly a pure pt type of game. What GW2 has is about one of the least gridly game play out there i think its less gridly then most single player rpgs.

Peeachxd.3786:

So I have slowly been creating Twilight over the past wee while and now looking at the 1k gold pile that I need to raise to afford Dusk at its current Trade Post price im starting to feel like Gw2 is a grind, I know that the developers said that they wanted to make the game feel like it wasnt a grind but I think some of the recent changes and perhaps lack of change has made it into one of the most grindy games I have ever played. does anybody else think that the whole Idea of needing a precurser or puting so much focus on gold has made Gw2 into a grind? because all I seem to be doing when I play is earning gold by grinding different dungeon paths or doing pvp which is kind of a grind aswell to level… :L perhaps ii play wrong.

This game is not a grind – want grind Allods Online was the biggest grinder of them all.

lol GW2 most grindy game ever? Such joke. Right, and you must be starving if you miss one meal too.

This game is so lenient.

Dark Catalyst.1028:

Um, it’s pretty simple. If I want to remain competitive, and be the best I could be, I have to have max stats in WvW. I have to have max stats in PvE as well, because I’m one of those people who actually CARE about doing very well, and I hate dragging the team down.

Like I said, other people can special snowflake it all they want, but don’t go calling me “bad” or my gear a “crutch” just because I enjoy improving my character.

Nothing you have stated in this thread has in any way PROVEN you need Ascended gear to be “competative” (certainly not in WvW). Having BiS equipment does not make you best at anything (other than jumping on the grind bandwagon for BiS gear). There is NOTHING wrong with you wanting to improve your stats by crafting Ascended gear and I applaud your efforts, but who are actually trying to convince that it is absolutely necessary to play end game content? (because it is NOT required).

BTW some Elitist (yeah, I used the word) ideal that you MUST have Ascended gear or you are a “noob” or a 2nd rate player is NOT a valid “requirement” but a prejudicial viewpoint (that you have every right to fool yourself into believing).

I will caveat my statements by saying if your desire is to play high level Fractals, then Ascended gear IS needed (but for the ability to slot AR, not for the minor stat increases).

Why do you want a legendary so you can look like everyone else?

Dark Catalyst.1028:

Um, it’s pretty simple. If I want to remain competitive, and be the best I could be, I have to have max stats in WvW. I have to have max stats in PvE as well, because I’m one of those people who actually CARE about doing very well, and I hate dragging the team down.

I will simply have to disagree. What you are calling being competitive in WvW is a real niche area (small group roaming for equivalent small groups, which rarely happens). Why do I say that? Because, for example, last night I took my level 33 character into WvW to level (and also for the AP of course), ended the night with 244 kills, 10+ tower captures, 2 SMC captures, something like 22 camps captured, don’t know how many dolyaks killed, etc. Compared to the guy running with me with full Ascended/Legendary? Exactly the same. We both left WvW with exactly the same results. If anything I had more kills because I could range AoE and he was melee.

I’m not saying there aren’t specific scenarios when being BiS for everything wouldn’t be a benefit, but to say it is even remotely required to be competitive is a complete lie and you know it. WvW is a numbers game, it always has been and it always will be. To base your argument around the rare 1v1 encounter in WvW (which if you are searching for 1v1s in WvW then you are doing your server a disservice because its a complete was of time and energy) is simply a weak argument.

Let’s talk FoTM/dungeons now. The majority of players won’t play above FoTM30 and absolutely no dungeon requires Ascended gear. I’ve run countless dungeons in full Exotic gear and never dragged my group down. I’ve run FoTM up to 30 in full Exotic/Ascended Acc and never dragged the group down. The only reason you even need Ascended armor passed FoTM30 is to get your AR higher, not because of the damage boost. If you could get 55+ AR on Exotic gear I guarantee you people would clear all FoTM in Exotic gear without issue. I know I would.

Fact is, you are grinding because you feel like grinding. For some reason you’ve convinced yourself you absolutely need these things to be competitive and/or not to drag your group down when that simply isn’t the reality, hate to break it to you.

High level fractals is the only argument you can make as to needing to get Ascended, because of the AR. For everything else it is completely unnecessary and has no bearing on your success whatsoever. If you want to do that niche content, then yes you will have to work harder than everyone else for it. They added content like this specifically for people that want to work harder for it.

Brother Grimm.5176:

Nothing you have stated in this thread has in any way PROVEN you need Ascended gear to be “competative” (certainly not in WvW). Having BiS equipment does not make you best at anything (other than jumping on the grind bandwagon for BiS gear). There is NOTHING wrong with you wanting to improve your stats by crafting Ascended gear and I applaud your efforts, but who are actually trying to convince that it is absolutely necessary to play end game content? (because it is NOT required).

BTW some Elitist (yeah, I used the word) ideal that you MUST have Ascended gear or you are a “noob” or a 2nd rate player is NOT a valid “requirement” but a prejudicial viewpoint (that you have every right to fool yourself into believing).

I will caveat my statements by saying if your desire is to play high level Fractals, then Ascended gear IS needed (but for the ability to slot AR, not for the minor stat increases).

Draknar.5748:

I will simply have to disagree. What you are calling being competitive in WvW is a real niche area (small group roaming for equivalent small groups, which rarely happens). Why do I say that? Because, for example, last night I took my level 33 character into WvW to level (and also for the AP of course), ended the night with 244 kills, 10+ tower captures, 2 SMC captures, something like 22 camps captured, don’t know how many dolyaks killed, etc. Compared to the guy running with me with full Ascended/Legendary? Exactly the same. We both left WvW with exactly the same results. If anything I had more kills because I could range AoE and he was melee.

I’m not saying there aren’t specific scenarios when being BiS for everything wouldn’t be a benefit, but to say it is even remotely required to be competitive is a complete lie and you know it. WvW is a numbers game, it always has been and it always will be. To base your argument around the rare 1v1 encounter in WvW (which if you are searching for 1v1s in WvW then you are doing your server a disservice because its a complete was of time and energy) is simply a weak argument.

Let’s talk FoTM/dungeons now. The majority of players won’t play above FoTM30 and absolutely no dungeon requires Ascended gear. I’ve run countless dungeons in full Exotic gear and never dragged my group down. I’ve run FoTM up to 30 in full Exotic/Ascended Acc and never dragged the group down. The only reason you even need Ascended armor passed FoTM30 is to get your AR higher, not because of the damage boost. If you could get 55+ AR on Exotic gear I guarantee you people would clear all FoTM in Exotic gear without issue. I know I would.

Fact is, you are grinding because you feel like grinding. For some reason you’ve convinced yourself you absolutely need these things to be competitive and/or not to drag your group down when that simply isn’t the reality, hate to break it to you.

High level fractals is the only argument you can make as to needing to get Ascended, because of the AR. For everything else it is completely unnecessary and has no bearing on your success whatsoever. If you want to do that niche content, then yes you will have to work harder than everyone else for it. They added content like this specifically for people that want to work harder for it.

Both quoted for complete, accurate truth! Great posts, Draknar and Grimm….I completely agree.

Niko Stark.8932:

Lol. Took me 5 weeks to make a legendary from nothing. That includes getting map completion and about 1M karma and running dungeons/events for the gold. I have a full-time job and I go out on some of my days off. It’s not a grind and even if it was, it’s a Legendary — they’re not supposed to just fall into your lap when you make a wish for it.

It’s pretty easy to gain levels and top-tier items in GW2 in comparison with other MMOs. You have no idea what a real “grind” is XD

5 weeks means nothing. If I spent an hour a day, I’d be no where near in 5 weeks. Saying all the other things you do, doesn’t mean you don’t spend 8hours a day in game. or do 24hour runs on weekends.

Don’t say weeks, tell us how many hours it took you to get the legendary, for an actual measurement of time spent.

OP has literally no experience with online MMOs it seems…

I’m not going to bother arguing with people who claim that a 10-15% damage increase is “irrelevant”.

“I have absolutely no experience in mmorpgs and made a baseless statement reflecting that” -OP

I think Ascended and Legendary grind is dumb. They don’t prove anything related to skill, but dude, REALLY? Go to NCsofts website and pick a Korean MMO and go see the world. LOL.

This guy obviously hasn’t played Runescape

Phadde.7362:

Peeachxd.3786:

perhaps ii play wrong.

Yeah, I’m fairly convinced that you do. It’s entirely subjective, though.

I barely ever do anything in GW2 that I feel isn’t fun. This mean that I usually play a maximum of 3 hours a day. I don’t complete my daily if I I don’t feel like it’s enjoyable.
I do the dungeons I want to; Even if it may be more gold-efficient dungeons to run, the game isn’t about making money (it’s not a job). The game is about having fun.
I sure would like to have an Incinerator, but that will take a few months since I don’t grind in this game. Grind is optional. There’s no hurry but the one you make.

OMG you sound like me.

If you think this is the most grindy game ever, you’ve clearly not played a single Asian MMO.
It takes a hell of a crazy work ethic to be able to view your video games as work as well and still enjoy it. And forget getting paid to do it, they’re actually paying someone else for the privilege of doing it.

I remember back in Lineage II, I hit a plateau around level 20 (very low end) and stopped playing, because I’d spend like 2 hours grinding for EXP, die once, and lose all of it.

Ascended gear is fairly optional unless you want the best possible stats and/or to do high level fractals. GW2 is still primarily about cosmetics, like it’s predecessor. You can grind if you want to, but you don’t have to.

Zomaarwat.3912:

Phadde.7362:

Peeachxd.3786:

perhaps ii play wrong.

Yeah, I’m fairly convinced that you do. It’s entirely subjective, though.

I barely ever do anything in GW2 that I feel isn’t fun. This mean that I usually play a maximum of 3 hours a day. I don’t complete my daily if I I don’t feel like it’s enjoyable.
I do the dungeons I want to; Even if it may be more gold-efficient dungeons to run, the game isn’t about making money (it’s not a job). The game is about having fun.
I sure would like to have an Incinerator, but that will take a few months since I don’t grind in this game. Grind is optional. There’s no hurry but the one you make.

OMG you sound like me.

Raising my hand, too. I have played previous mmos in the past like they were a job. And that’s no longer fun to me. The grind in this game is only there if you want it to be there. jmo, of course.

Beldin.5498:

Then it will take you maybe 20 or 50 years in PWI to level to 105.

I doubt it. If it is attainable through game play then I expect I would get it in a time frame similar to others’ experiences. If it requires crafting then I would never get it.

In order to get a full set of ascended gear I am likely to need several years worth of appropriate kill rewards. Sure I could get lucky and get the drops one after another in a single day of play, but the odds are very much stacked against that.

mooty.4560:

Ascended gear is fairly optional unless you want the best possible stats and/or to do high level fractals. GW2 is still primarily about cosmetics, like it’s predecessor. You can grind if you want to, but you don’t have to.

Except if those cosmetics are your goals in the game, then grinding (or buying, but that not playing) is pretty much your only option. Obviously it depends on your personal game-play preference.

People who keep defending there is no grind (or not a lot) mainly point to stats (because according to them cosmetics are optional, funny for me stats are optional) but it’s an MMORPG that is in fact focusing mainly on cosmetics and fluff. So they very much are part of the game-play for many people.

Astral Projections.7320:

Guild Wars 1 has a grind to get max titles and Guild Wars 2 has a grind to get the end vanity items. It’s set up as the core of both games. They want you to earn them. Granted they didn’t do a very good job with the Legendaries in this game, but the no grind only referred to leveling not going after one of the end game goals.

You don’t need Legendaries GW2 and you did not (do not) need the titles in GW1. They are completely optional.

Ashen.2907:

Beldin.5498:

Then it will take you maybe 20 or 50 years in PWI to level to 105.

I doubt it. If it is attainable through game play then I expect I would get it in a time frame similar to others’ experiences. If it requires crafting then I would never get it.

In order to get a full set of ascended gear I am likely to need several years worth of appropriate kill rewards. Sure I could get lucky and get the drops one after another in a single day of play, but the odds are very much stacked against that.

Are you sure? I havent played that game so I dunno…
I don’t like the idéa that I have to craft ascended iether but I would rather do that then fighting the same enemies over and over and over again to level up my character. But as you are able to obtain Ascended via drops you are likely to get a full set ascended in less than 5 years if you just play the game.

Skan.5301:

ObsidianSaint.1079:

Not grindy at all, you are creating your own grind. I play to have fun and if I happen to have the materials needed for something I craft it…

What do you, personally, do while you’re ‘playing to have fun’?

That is a hard question to answer and it wont do much different to aswer since we all have different tastes. But if you had asked me:
- I Explore the world with my alts together with friends and guild.
- I do Guild Missions.
- I help friends and Guild with stuff they need help with.
- I do Dungeons, mostly with my friends who only play on weekends.
- I try to figure out new build for PvP, WvW, PvE and Dungeons.
- I try to find nice deals on TP to earn gold.
- Most of all I play the Living Story when there is one.
- I do sPvP.
- I do WvW with my Guild.

(Most of the stuff here is not super-fun doing for yourself but I realy enjoy playing with friends and Guild. It is an MMO after all).

There has been a little less playtime for me in Guild Wars 2 now due to absence of Living World, but whenever my friends are playing or my Guild is doing something fun I am more or less always online. sPvP is something I do a little everyday though I am just a Hotjoin-hero.

—
Still nothing you have to do but…
I have been thinking. This game may be grindy afterall…
I mean almost every Living Story part has been about doing the events over and over again to get the neat new stuff that is hidden inside the corpses :P

But on the other hand in my opinion the Grinding LS is realy fun and it is not forever.

Ionut.2307:

You are playing the wrong genre of games, no game will stay fun forever but MMO’s tempt you to keep playing and inevitably you’ll be repeating content.

Play single player (or cooperative), story based games. No grind ever.

Every single item I have equipped on my toon now is ascended. And I didn’t grind at all, ever. Just casual world boss runs there, a few fractals/dungeons sometimes, wvw, spvp etc. Took some time but I got everything I need.

Legendaries are just skins.

Useless imo for the effort you have to put in.

Read a number of posts. If any of you want to experience grind, which GW 2 eminently is NOT, go play STO, NW or CO all PW games. WoW is the king of grind, I’ve got friends who play it and that I convinced to try GW 2. They play a lot more GW 2 now for some reason. Or if you’ve been around a while, City of Heroes got grindy at endgame when they created that whole new above 50 system. Only ever got a couple of lvls for one toon myself, it was such a pain.

Many people here have said correctly, IMHO, that the only “grind” is to make Legendaries and Ascended. Pretty much true. Especially since the devs have never allowed the core ascended mat’ls to be bought, sold or traded. If you’re a crafter trying to get Grandmaster in all six current disciplines, you’re gonna spend some serious time in WvW etc. to get Bloodstone etc.

But as is also true, and many people have also pointed out, this is NOT NECESSARY TO PLAY THE GAME. All of my three main toons run around w/ exotic gear and a few ascended trinkets I bought off the vendors. I have a blast, I play PvE, PvP, and WvW all and enjoy. I should have cut the quote, but as someone here said, you should just let a Legendary happen. Unless the devs finally let Grandmasters craft Precursors, that’s the smart way to play.

EdgarMTanaka.7291:

Ashen.2907:

Beldin.5498:

Then it will take you maybe 20 or 50 years in PWI to level to 105.

I doubt it. If it is attainable through game play then I expect I would get it in a time frame similar to others’ experiences. If it requires crafting then I would never get it.

In order to get a full set of ascended gear I am likely to need several years worth of appropriate kill rewards. Sure I could get lucky and get the drops one after another in a single day of play, but the odds are very much stacked against that.

Are you sure? I havent played that game so I dunno…
I don’t like the idéa that I have to craft ascended iether but I would rather do that then fighting the same enemies over and over and over again to level up my character. But as you are able to obtain Ascended via drops you are likely to get a full set ascended in less than 5 years if you just play the game.

Skan.5301:

ObsidianSaint.1079:

Not grindy at all, you are creating your own grind. I play to have fun and if I happen to have the materials needed for something I craft it…

What do you, personally, do while you’re ‘playing to have fun’?

That is a hard question to answer and it wont do much different to aswer since we all have different tastes. But if you had asked me:
- I Explore the world with my alts together with friends and guild.
- I do Guild Missions.
- I help friends and Guild with stuff they need help with.
- I do Dungeons, mostly with my friends who only play on weekends.
- I try to figure out new build for PvP, WvW, PvE and Dungeons.
- I try to find nice deals on TP to earn gold.
- Most of all I play the Living Story when there is one.
- I do sPvP.
- I do WvW with my Guild.

(Most of the stuff here is not super-fun doing for yourself but I realy enjoy playing with friends and Guild. It is an MMO after all).

There has been a little less playtime for me in Guild Wars 2 now due to absence of Living World, but whenever my friends are playing or my Guild is doing something fun I am more or less always online. sPvP is something I do a little everyday though I am just a Hotjoin-hero.

—
Still nothing you have to do but…
I have been thinking. This game may be grindy afterall…
I mean almost every Living Story part has been about doing the events over and over again to get the neat new stuff that is hidden inside the corpses :P

But on the other hand in my opinion the Grinding LS is realy fun and it is not forever.

“But on the other hand in my opinion the Grinding LS is realy fun and it is not forever.”
No it’s against the time. Isn’t that even worse?

The LS does have more specific rewards from an event or an boss (mostly achievements with is a little less, but ok) and I do like that. I want to see that more in this game. But then the LS makes it temporary making it (for me) even worse. It’s a grind against time. And it does keep repeating, LS after LS after LS.

Nightshade.5924:

Read a number of posts. If any of you want to experience grind, which GW 2 eminently is NOT, go play STO, NW or CO all PW games. WoW is the king of grind, I’ve got friends who play it and that I convinced to try GW 2. They play a lot more GW 2 now for some reason. Or if you’ve been around a while, City of Heroes got grindy at endgame when they created that whole new above 50 system. Only ever got a couple of lvls for one toon myself, it was such a pain.

Many people here have said correctly, IMHO, that the only “grind” is to make Legendaries and Ascended. Pretty much true. Especially since the devs have never allowed the core ascended mat’ls to be bought, sold or traded. If you’re a crafter trying to get Grandmaster in all six current disciplines, you’re gonna spend some serious time in WvW etc. to get Bloodstone etc.

But as is also true, and many people have also pointed out, this is NOT NECESSARY TO PLAY THE GAME. All of my three main toons run around w/ exotic gear and a few ascended trinkets I bought off the vendors. I have a blast, I play PvE, PvP, and WvW all and enjoy. I should have cut the quote, but as someone here said, you should just let a Legendary happen. Unless the devs finally let Grandmasters craft Precursors, that’s the smart way to play.

Lets take your WoW example simply because I did not play all of your other examples and most people are known with there system.

Now lets say I want to hunt down 2 specific mini’s. In WoW I might need to do one dungeon multiple time for one dungeon and for another I need to do a quest. Drop-change from the dungeon is 1/10 (one again just for the sake of argument) and a run takes you 1 hour. So on average you should have it around 5 hours but at least in 10.

Now Gw2. You want two specific mini’s. One is very rare, another is not. You can not really hunt it down because it does not drop in the world or does not drop in a specific place. So you grind gold. Lets say it cost between 5 and 10 gold and you can earn 1 gold per hour (also on average because drops can be better and worse) by champ-farming (what is gold grinding). In time it would take me about the same time to get the two mini’s.

And while this are just examples I think looking at mini’s overall time consumes is similar. There are many very cheap mini’s in GW2 and so there are in WoW. Difference is that the cheap once in WoW are mainly sold by vendors. However there are also very expensive mini’s in GW2 and there are very hard to get mini’s in WoW.

The difference is the way you get them, not the time.

In WoW you are playing specific content to get your item, needing to do different types of content to get it. That is also part of the fun of redoing that content. Every time the rush of “ will it drop”.

In GW2 everything is currency based so you are grinding currency (mainly gold) for everything you need.

That is why GW2 is so much of a grind. It’s grind for everything. WoW, just like any mmo does require a lot of farming but way less grind.. maybe only for the top tier stuff, not sure never been doing that as that is not required.. for my gameplay.

Astralporing.1957:

Beldin.5498:

Stats matter of course .. but having an increase of 0,5-1% in stats because of a FULL set of ascended armor, isn’t really THAT big.

5% dps increase for only weapon, and about 20% dps increase for full set of zerker gear however are significant.

there is no 20% DPS increase…
and 5% stat increase is not equal 5% DPS increase.
and even 4.9% weapon damage increase does not automatically increase your actual damage by 5%.

Lalangamena.3694:

Astralporing.1957:

Beldin.5498:

Stats matter of course .. but having an increase of 0,5-1% in stats because of a FULL set of ascended armor, isn’t really THAT big.

5% dps increase for only weapon, and about 20% dps increase for full set of zerker gear however are significant.

there is no 20% DPS increase…
and 5% stat increase is not equal 5% DPS increase.
and even 4.9% weapon damage increase does not automatically increase your actual damage by 5%.

Try telling people that a 10% performance increase doesn’t make a difference as you ping your non-berserker’s gear and they laugh and kick you out of the party.

The point is that full berserker’s seems to be a free pass into parties but yet other gear is frowned upon. Also, don’t deny what you cannot prove. It’s easy to deny but it’s very unproductive. This is a forum. You’re supposed to continue the discussion, not kill it dead.

5% stat increase for power gives you 5% more damage. It’s a LINEAR damage increase. Numerically, a base 916 power stat would deal double damage if the stat was raised to 1832( an additional 916). Don’t give me crap about damage PER SECOND as berserker’s gear would increase critchance, giving your PER SECOND average a better number due to criticals coming into play. Now that I have proven you wrong, can you please tell me how you thought that you were correct?

Give ESO a try and you’ll know the true meaning of grindfest. With no TP and time gates on “researching” traits for gear, it’s a hot mess and I regret every penny I spent on the game.

Lalangamena.3694:

Astralporing.1957:

Beldin.5498:

Stats matter of course .. but having an increase of 0,5-1% in stats because of a FULL set of ascended armor, isn’t really THAT big.

5% dps increase for only weapon, and about 20% dps increase for full set of zerker gear however are significant.

there is no 20% DPS increase…
and 5% stat increase is not equal 5% DPS increase.
and even 4.9% weapon damage increase does not automatically increase your actual damage by 5%.

weapon damage directly increases dps for direct damage builds (as opposed to condi builds). And it was about 22% dps increase between exotics and ascended for full zerker set. Calculations were done several times on the forum.
Now, that’s true, it may be slightly less, due to ferocity change (it was mostly result of synergy between weapon damage stat, power, precision and critical damage).
It was also about 11% for PVT builds (and, if i remember correctly, about 7% for cleric) – and this was not affected by ferocity change.

Dark Catalyst.1028:

I’m not going to bother arguing with people who claim that a 10-15% damage increase is “irrelevant”.

It’s not that it is irrelevant, it’s that it will rarely come into play. sPvP it obviously doesn’t come into play, in dungeons it doesn’t come into play (unless you speed run and are looking to shave off 2min from your run…), WvW it doesn’t come into play except in the rarest of circumstances.

That’s the point we are trying to make. That 10-15% that is OMGSOMUCH, will rarely be utilized for benefit. How often do you come upon content that has a gear check for Ascended (outside of high level FOTM for the AR course)? Never. In WvW, solo roaming will get you killed more often than not because the vast majority of players understand there is safety in numbers. 2 good players in Rares will kill 1 guy in Ascended. Your stats can’t keep up with Rare stats x2 and x2 the damage skills being used on you, they just can’t.

You may think you need that extra 10-15%, but in reality you do not.

It depend how you play the game.

Many people enjoy GW2 because it is casual. But at the same time, there are just as much if not more people complaining about grinding in GW2.

Many people just start pointing to other games and call them grindy, but I can tell you there are just as much if not more people complaining on the GW2 forum.

People call GW2 casual because the grind is “more optional”, but if you want those “more optional” items, there are just as much grind.

I haven’t played many MMOs, but I don’t find GW2 to be all that grindy. As others have pointed out, it will depend on what you like to do and how you like to play.

For me, I enjoy leveling characters. I’m only half way through my 24 characters right now, and still enjoying it. I do the same things on them – map clearing, champ training in QD, dungeoning when they are high enough, even karma train running in eotm. Not bored yet, but that’s just me. I know to a lot of others that would be considered boring, repetitive, grind. Just depends on your perspective…

carabidus.6214:

Give ESO a try and you’ll know the true meaning of grindfest. With no TP and time gates on “researching” traits for gear, it’s a hot mess and I regret every penny I spent on the game.

Time gated stuff is indeed also very bad, just like temporary (a form, maybe the worst form of time-gated) but it’s something else as grind.

Devata.6589:

carabidus.6214:

Give ESO a try and you’ll know the true meaning of grindfest. With no TP and time gates on “researching” traits for gear, it’s a hot mess and I regret every penny I spent on the game.

Time gated stuff is indeed also very bad, just like temporary (a form, maybe the worst form of time-gated) but it’s something else as grind.

Temporary also means that there going to be more replacing it i am not sure if that is worst and not sure how that related to “grind.”

I kind of like timed gate.

Rather than grinding for 10 hours straight, developer reminded you we only allow you to play for 1 hours, please go take a rest.

Jski.6180:

Devata.6589:

carabidus.6214:

Give ESO a try and you’ll know the true meaning of grindfest. With no TP and time gates on “researching” traits for gear, it’s a hot mess and I regret every penny I spent on the game.

Time gated stuff is indeed also very bad, just like temporary (a form, maybe the worst form of time-gated) but it’s something else as grind.

Temporary also means that there going to be more replacing it i am not sure if that is worst and not sure how that related to “grind.”

You need to do stuff within a limited time or lose it forever. That’s why it’s worse. Besides, non-temporary would not mean there would not be new content.

Anyway, my comment was exactly to say that time-gated content (like temporary content) is not related to grind.

Devata.6589:

Jski.6180:

Devata.6589:

carabidus.6214:

Give ESO a try and you’ll know the true meaning of grindfest. With no TP and time gates on “researching” traits for gear, it’s a hot mess and I regret every penny I spent on the game.

Time gated stuff is indeed also very bad, just like temporary (a form, maybe the worst form of time-gated) but it’s something else as grind.

Temporary also means that there going to be more replacing it i am not sure if that is worst and not sure how that related to “grind.”

You need to do stuff a limited time or lose forever. That’s why it’s worse. Besides, non-temporary would not mean there would not be new content.

Anyway, my comment was exactly to say that time-gated content (like temporary content) is not related to grind.

Yes it dose mean new content becase the way temporary things works is that it free up spaces for a game to keep adding in new things as old things are switched out. At a point mmorpgs become to big for ppl to run on pc. Yes you can keep added things in that ppl do for a month and then stop doing it after they get what they want but what the point of that content if no one is doing it any more?

It dose not changes how much work you need to do to get something you want even if there is a set time if any thing it will keep things less grindy because the game makers are saying you have a set time to do this in so we are going to make it much less time consuming vs adding in something that will be there forever where the game makers can say well we can make it super hard to do this and take a lot of time because we need this to pad our game.

Baine.9650:

5% stat increase for power gives you 5% more damage. It’s a LINEAR damage increase. Numerically, a base 916 power stat would deal double damage if the stat was raised to 1832( an additional 916). . Now that I have proven you wrong, can you please tell me how you thought that you were correct?

well, i looked again at the formula, and you are correct.
increase of 5% in weapon damage stat will increase the damage of the same skill on the same target by 5%.

it just when i looked at all the posts that calculated ascended gear damage increase, the damage increase was mainly because of inflated critical damage stat on some pieces which was balanced with ferocity.

edit:
anyway , crafting a set of ascended armor is not a real “grind”…
when gw2 released i was surprised how easy it was to obtain endgame gear, ascended feels more like “endgame” difficulty gear rather than “grind”.

legendaries are grind (IMO), and yet i see plenty of people running with full sets of legendaries… and the TP is full with them.

Dark Catalyst.1028:

I’m not going to bother arguing with people who claim that a 10-15% damage increase is “irrelevant”.

Correct. “A 10-15% increase in damage is not irrelevant…”

but I will qualify that statement with “…depending on what you’re killing”

If you’re talking about a 1v1 encounter, that advantage will slaughter whatever it is that you’re attacking, whether it be an NPC mob or another player.

However, if you’re talking about a zerg (and face it, the boss encounters in the game are zergfests as is a lot of WvW) you’re not going to even notice the extra punch.

In fact, someone who has “regular” exotics gains the exact same result as someone who is in full ascended with all the bells and whistles.

I am not saying that they will do more damage, but that no matter how much damage one does, the result is the same. Therefore, in those circumstances, the 10-15% advantage is irrelevant.

Ever play Final Fantasy XI? Out of all games I’ve played, that takes the cake.

WoW comes pretty close, though. I can’t really call GW2 “grindy” at all by comparison.

Brother Grimm.5176:

Dark Catalyst.1028:

Um, it’s pretty simple. If I want to remain competitive, and be the best I could be, I have to have max stats in WvW. I have to have max stats in PvE as well, because I’m one of those people who actually CARE about doing very well, and I hate dragging the team down.

Like I said, other people can special snowflake it all they want, but don’t go calling me “bad” or my gear a “crutch” just because I enjoy improving my character.

Nothing you have stated in this thread has in any way PROVEN you need Ascended gear to be “competative” (certainly not in WvW). Having BiS equipment does not make you best at anything (other than jumping on the grind bandwagon for BiS gear). There is NOTHING wrong with you wanting to improve your stats by crafting Ascended gear and I applaud your efforts, but who are actually trying to convince that it is absolutely necessary to play end game content? (because it is NOT required).

BTW some Elitist (yeah, I used the word) ideal that you MUST have Ascended gear or you are a “noob” or a 2nd rate player is NOT a valid “requirement” but a prejudicial viewpoint (that you have every right to fool yourself into believing).

I will caveat my statements by saying if your desire is to play high level Fractals, then Ascended gear IS needed (but for the ability to slot AR, not for the minor stat increases).

Sorry but just no. He doesn’t have to “prove” anything. The gear is out there, it gives better stats, period. Unless you want to debate that “fact,” prove to my satisfaction that stats don’t matter.

New gemstore musical instrument needed: organ grinder with monkey.

Play the organ grinder while standing around complaining about the grind. The monkey can get tips from sympathetic listeners.

Jski.6180:

Devata.6589:

Jski.6180:

Devata.6589:

carabidus.6214:

Give ESO a try and you’ll know the true meaning of grindfest. With no TP and time gates on “researching” traits for gear, it’s a hot mess and I regret every penny I spent on the game.

Time gated stuff is indeed also very bad, just like temporary (a form, maybe the worst form of time-gated) but it’s something else as grind.

Temporary also means that there going to be more replacing it i am not sure if that is worst and not sure how that related to “grind.”

You need to do stuff a limited time or lose forever. That’s why it’s worse. Besides, non-temporary would not mean there would not be new content.

Anyway, my comment was exactly to say that time-gated content (like temporary content) is not related to grind.

Yes it dose mean new content becase the way temporary things works is that it free up spaces for a game to keep adding in new things as old things are switched out. At a point mmorpgs become to big for ppl to run on pc. Yes you can keep added things in that ppl do for a month and then stop doing it after they get what they want but what the point of that content if no one is doing it any more?

It dose not changes how much work you need to do to get something you want even if there is a set time if any thing it will keep things less grindy because the game makers are saying you have a set time to do this in so we are going to make it much less time consuming vs adding in something that will be there forever where the game makers can say well we can make it super hard to do this and take a lot of time because we need this to pad our game.

You don’t have to worry about space on the PC. Storage is the least expensive and most people have space enough. And even if they did not it’s a very easy and cheap upgrade.

Less people might do it but for sure not nobody. With that idea you could just as well remove all starter zones as soon as most people get past that.

Also the time-restrain per item might be shorter because you also have a shorter time but you do have to do it in that time and 2 weeks later there is new stuff you need to do if you don’t want to miss out on it forever and two weeks later again and again and again.

Anyway, my comment was there to say it was not related to grind and then you reacted on that and now we are talking about temporary content. I have no problem talking more with you about that subject but not in this thread.

TooBz.3065:

Brother Grimm.5176:

Dark Catalyst.1028:

Um, it’s pretty simple. If I want to remain competitive, and be the best I could be, I have to have max stats in WvW. I have to have max stats in PvE as well, because I’m one of those people who actually CARE about doing very well, and I hate dragging the team down.

Like I said, other people can special snowflake it all they want, but don’t go calling me “bad” or my gear a “crutch” just because I enjoy improving my character.

Nothing you have stated in this thread has in any way PROVEN you need Ascended gear to be “competative” (certainly not in WvW). Having BiS equipment does not make you best at anything (other than jumping on the grind bandwagon for BiS gear). There is NOTHING wrong with you wanting to improve your stats by crafting Ascended gear and I applaud your efforts, but who are actually trying to convince that it is absolutely necessary to play end game content? (because it is NOT required).

BTW some Elitist (yeah, I used the word) ideal that you MUST have Ascended gear or you are a “noob” or a 2nd rate player is NOT a valid “requirement” but a prejudicial viewpoint (that you have every right to fool yourself into believing).

I will caveat my statements by saying if your desire is to play high level Fractals, then Ascended gear IS needed (but for the ability to slot AR, not for the minor stat increases).

Sorry but just no. He doesn’t have to “prove” anything. The gear is out there, it gives better stats, period. Unless you want to debate that “fact,” prove to my satisfaction that stats don’t matter.

That’s not the point. The point is this: is the difference between Ascended and Exotic really worth the effort? Does the end justify the means? Nobody’s denying that Ascended offers better stats, but are the stats even that much of an improvement to strive for?

Think of it like car selection in a racer. One of those cars will be the fastest, and can outrun everything else on a straightforward sprint, but all that speed isn’t much good on a winding loop. In much a similar way, that edge you’ve got from your Ascended armour might not make a jot of difference when every factor comes into play.