Guild Wars 2

wmtyrance.3571:

Freaking HOT was bad because of the map navigation. Some people call that challenging others say its annoying. It comes down to what the person thinks it means. I myself like challenging content not bad map design which HOT was to me. I hated the game everytime i went on that map. And it changed the players attitude toward each other to be more selfish. GW2 was a really great game with a equally great community and HOT even changed that.

I see. If a map isn’t completely kittening flat it’s bad map-design. The only map that was a cluster-kitten to navigate was Tangled Depths, the other maps were fine. Verdant Brink takes some getting used to maybe, but if you can’t even put in that much effort, I have a feeling you’re just going to complain no matter what obstacle is put infront of you.

Other than those definitions that just aren’t applicable to games in general I seem to fit the various definitions of casual listed on dictionary sites such as dictionary.com, Cambridge, Oxford, and Webster’s.

I don’t feel that Anet forgot about me, as a casual, with HoT or the LS3 chapters.

That isn’t to say that I liked HoT or the LS3 (good and bad points in each for me), but not liking it, or elements of it, doesn’t mean that it wasn’t casually accessible to me.

ESO started out making the content pretty hard as they wanted every boss and mini boss battle to be epic. Most casuals didn’t like it and the place became a ghost town. A hard fight is good every once in awhile but it’s different when every fight is a challenge.
So they made content a lot easier and the casuals came back. When-ever I’m on I see lots of people. GW2 is moving towards making every fight epic and we will see how their numbers do. But others have done it and the most successful MMO’s aren’t the ones with the hardest content.

wmtyrance.3571:

Freaking HOT was bad because of the map navigation. Some people call that challenging others say its annoying. It comes down to what the person thinks it means. I myself like challenging content not bad map design which HOT was to me. I hated the game everytime i went on that map. And it changed the players attitude toward each other to be more selfish. GW2 was a really great game with a equally great community and HOT even changed that.

People just like different things it seems. I LOVED the maps in HoT. I had so much fun exploring everything and finding my way through those maps. One of the most enjoyable things for me is exploring the world in GW2. And the multilayered maps were awesome! Gimme more!

mbhalo.1547:

STIHL.2489:

The above is why I do it.. too many posers come in to topics like this, and try to pretend to be something they are not.

Now you’re being toxic elitist just the other way around.

At first I was going to disagree with you, but you know what, Fair enough. far be it from me to turn people away, so, lets open that box shall we.

Lets accept this as “Casual”

mbhalo.1547:

I consider myself a casual player – 4000 hours played, 16k AP, 5 legendary weapons + legendary backpack, do T4 fractals almost every day and here and there dabble into raiding.

Now the longest a player can be playing is 5 years, so lets set this as a benchmark.

1 legendary weapon for every year played.

Average 800 Hours a Year Played, or roughly a little over 2 hours a day, every single day.

16K AP.

and a legendary backpack.

Seems excessive to me.. but.. others chimed in, to defend this as a typical Casual achievement.

AliamRationem.5172:

15 hours per week is pretty casual, honestly. That translates into a couple of hours per day…less than most people spend watching TV or BS’ing on the internet daily.

TCFactory.1473:

Seconding this. Casual means a lot of things to a lot of people.

You can be casual if you only play a couple of hours a week (and 15 hours a week easily translates into like, only doing the dailies and the occasional afternoon during the weekend).

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

There are all sorts of people who have that sort of resume and consider themselves to be casual.

Ok.. soo lets roll with that is the bse line of a casual, after all, it’s been made clear, that should be pretty easy to do by more then one person.

And what was said about casuals?

Oh right..

Casuals ruin games.

So.. well.. yah.. 5 legendary weapons, legendary back item, 16K AP , should be stupid easy that any casual can do it .. so.. how many of you have done better?

Just gonna wait now for the show of hands.

octagon.6504:

ESO started out making the content pretty hard as they wanted every boss and mini boss battle to be epic. Most casuals didn’t like it and the place became a ghost town. A hard fight is good every once in awhile but it’s different when every fight is a challenge.
So they made content a lot easier and the casuals came back. When-ever I’m on I see lots of people. GW2 is moving towards making every fight epic and we will see how their numbers do. But others have done it and the most successful MMO’s aren’t the ones with the hardest content.

There is a reason why WoW became popular and opened up the MMO genre to the general public. Before WoW, 99% of people were not going to play MMOs the old-fashioned way where you lost everything and every mob was a champion-level fight. The money is not with the hardcores. It never was.

STIHL.2489:

mbhalo.1547:

STIHL.2489:

The above is why I do it.. too many posers come in to topics like this, and try to pretend to be something they are not.

Now you’re being toxic elitist just the other way around.

At first I was going to disagree with you, but you know what, Fair enough. far be it from me to turn people away, so, lets open that box shall we.

Lets accept this as “Casual”

mbhalo.1547:

I consider myself a casual player – 4000 hours played, 16k AP, 5 legendary weapons + legendary backpack, do T4 fractals almost every day and here and there dabble into raiding.

Now the longest a player can be playing is 5 years, so lets set this as a benchmark.

1 legendary weapon for every year played.

Average 800 Hours a Year Played, or roughly a little over 2 hours a day, every single day.

16K AP.

and a legendary backpack.

Seems excessive to me.. but.. others chimed in, to defend this as a typical Casual achievement.

AliamRationem.5172:

15 hours per week is pretty casual, honestly. That translates into a couple of hours per day…less than most people spend watching TV or BS’ing on the internet daily.

TCFactory.1473:

Seconding this. Casual means a lot of things to a lot of people.

You can be casual if you only play a couple of hours a week (and 15 hours a week easily translates into like, only doing the dailies and the occasional afternoon during the weekend).

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

There are all sorts of people who have that sort of resume and consider themselves to be casual.

Ok.. soo lets roll with that is the bse line of a casual, after all, it’s been made clear, that should be pretty easy to do by more then one person.

And what was said about casuals?

Oh right..

Casuals ruin games.

So.. well.. yah.. 5 legendary weapons, legendary back item, 16K AP , should be stupid easy that any casual can do it .. so.. how many of you have done better?

Just gonna wait now for the show of hands.

As I said, my understanding of “casual” from WoW was an unwillingness to schedule my life around the game. Specifically, it meant not participating in organized group content (raids).

You seem to suggest that it means that along with not putting in much time or being technically proficient at the gameplay. And then using that narrow definition, you suggest that you belong here while players like myself don’t because I put in too much time and am too proficient at the gameplay to meet your definition.

You asked why I (and others like me) aren’t playing other games? It’s pretty simple. I signed on after HoT and was very impressed with the HoT open world content. I spent more than a year basically doing nothing else. I play mostly solo and mostly in open world, and GW2 is a great game for that. HoT just brought an increase in challenge along with amazing exploration maps, all of which I really loved.

So maybe I don’t belong here, but I’d rather be playing this game than WoW or any of the others I’ve tried. I guess it’s too bad they made HoT and attracted players like me who are apparently neither hardcore nor casual.

STIHL.2489:

TexZero.7910:

STIHL.2489:

TexZero.7910:

STIHL.2489:

Griever.8150:

Casuals ruin games.

No, whiners ruin games.. no matter what their playstyle.

IRONY.

No really, pot meet kettle here.

No, see, unlike some people that puttered around for years crying about the game and how it needed to be harder to suite their playstyle, or fussed endlessly for raids, when the game was no longer to my liking… I left.

What is truly ironic, is that some people would say “if you don’t like it, leave!” and yet they remain and fuss incessantly that the game needs to be change, as opposed to you know, following their own advice and leaving.

and coming here making a thread asking about how this casual game somehow forgot casuals isn’t whining ?

Right….

Nope, it was, an honest question, I have been away, and I have a new computer, and was wondering if it was worth it to even bother to do the download. As far as this little stop in goes, either I will find the expansion fun, or I’ll move on again.

No loss on my part either way, and most assuredly, I am not asking for any changes to be made on my part.

Been a good year for me, I found a lot of fun other games, and games I am excited to try as well, but as I said, this expansion piqued my interest.. Nothing more, and nothing for you to get worked up about.

I’ll make it easy for you:

No it isn’t going to be worth it to you. If you struggled with HoT you are likely to struggle with PoF. Follow your own advice and move on.

Sykper.6583:

STIHL.2489:

LOL, Did I ever claim to own the game or the term casual?

At the very least you seem to want to own the word ‘casual’ since you’ve mentioned:

To everyone that asked or called me on using the line “Real casual”

The above is why I do it.. too many posers come in to topics like this, and try to pretend to be something they are not.

Care to enlighten us what you think ‘casual’ means?

No, I’ll let someone else do that. if you don’t like what they have to say, take it up with them.

IndigoSundown.5419:

Perhaps because there is a specific definition of the word casual as it is used in video games which states that either skill, time commitment or both are defining factors.

http://www.dictionary.com/browse/casual

Words evolve. We either adapt and use them as they are being used in specific contexts or we don’t. Stick with your definition if you like, but you will continue to be misunderstood by some posters and some of the information you get will be unhelpful as a result.

AliamRationem.5172:

Oh, you only wanted to hear from people who hated HoT? Why didn’t you say so? I’ll just see my way out of it then.

I made it pretty clear what I was looking for in the OP, in case you missed this.

STIHL.2489:

Well, it’s been a while since I posted, or played for that matter, I hope things have been going well for all of you , that populations are tip top, pugs for dungeons and meta events are plentiful, and that WvW and sPvP are brimming with players. I know most people would dream that a game would collapse behind them when they left, but, I had no such dream, in fact, I hoped things would go well enough to justify a whole new expansion, and it seems it has. So. ta da.. I’m back to check it out .

Now, I left because I was unhappy with the HoT expansion and as opposed to playing a game past its’ point of fun, I simply took my own advice and moved on to other games.

HoT made it clear that Anet was moving away from it’s casual base to cater to other gamer demographics, which is fine, it’s their game, and they have every right to do whatever they want with it, my only option is play or not play , so I opted out, but, I am piqued about PoF, however before I download the game, I am wondering if PoF is more like the Core game, or is it more like HoT.

But thanks for posting. Enjoy the other topics!

I’m kind of worried with the expansion maps and that there may not be anymore map-wide metas. Granted, these could have just been turned off for the demo, but with how the LS3 maps went, it wouldn’t be a shock. It seems like they went too far to appease the self-proclaimed casual players that it leaves a lot of other players with much less to do.

How long before the PoF maps will be like the LS3 map in terms of active population? One month? Two months? Well I guess we have the regular content updates of LS4 to look forward to in January.

STIHL.2489:

So.. well.. yah.. 5 legendary weapons, legendary back item, 16K AP , should be stupid easy that any casual can do it .. so.. how many of you have done better?

Just gonna wait now for the show of hands.

It may be the casual in me, but spending my limited game time hunting down items that I would not use seems silly to me.

My AP is slightly lower than his, but I have fewer hours as well. Then again I think that casual encompasses a range of players.

If I had desired to do so I certainly could have spent my time and gold acquiring legendaries. For that matter, since legendaries can be purchased with real money via the exchange I could have just bought the legendary weapons.

Personally, I think that, especially in an MMO, 15 hours per week is well within the realm of casual.

Iozeph.5617:

Sarpan.9074:

If you don’t like the game, don’t play it. Simple.

Not attacking you personally here, but this attitude is why we’ve bled so many players. Rather than adhering to the promise of their initial offering, Anet gave their devs a free hand to squander funds on tangential and unnecessary experiments.

GW2 was sold as the ‘game for the rest of us.’ And it delivered. Nothing trying on overland maps. Amazing visuals, puzzles and platforms, a bit of crafting, and all of it with the non-gamebreaking, opt in and out flavour coined by Warhammer. Game modes to please everyone that weren’t ‘necessary’ to take part in to ‘succeed.’

There was a personal story arc and a living world element tying it all together(similar to Lotro’s Books- once they’d been made solo friendly.) The story was woven into the dungeons so there was instant familiarity and a sense of purpose when you played. All of these were good.

HoT broke faith. Rather than saying, ‘Play how and wherever you wish,’ there was one path to mastery and elite spec lines. There was WvW for some, but if neither a WvW player, or a jumping enthusiast, or someone who enjoyed the world boss train you were out of luck. As it was HoT meta maps seemed to be a passive aggressive middle finger to world train crowd who cried when rewards were cut. ‘Love trains? Here’s four maps that are endless trains with steep

snip

They had one job: stay the course, deliver an ongoing experience consistent to what came before. They didn’t. And not only did they not deliver, but they aggressively ignored their players in doing so.(Go ahead. Drop the mic again- see how that works.)

That consistency equaled:

-A new, easily navigable, overworld map section divided by mini hubs(hearts).

-A new, story-relevant, dungeon hub with attendant cosmetics for weapons and armours.

-A new, story relevant, wvw map consistent thematically to the newly opened zones.

-A new pvp tournament event.

-A new chapter of living story, furthering the story which came before; with the end goal of eventually besting the world dragons as the zones where their respective domains exist were opened up.

-A new fractal.

And they could have added raids to that. There’s your new addition.

That’s right, raids weren’t the problem either. They have a place in GW2 beside dungeons for providing additional story progression. And as such, they could have been one of many reasons to call friends over from other games- so long as Anet kept consistent with the other modes. They didn’t and it’s that simple.

And this is why it’s so grating whenever players, satisfied with their experiences, feel free to tell others to quit playing. The alienated player base is just as invested. Perhaps even more if it comes down to moneys spent.

So that said, I’d probably agree with them, provided Anet refunded them the moneys spent for dyes, toys, cosmetics, pets, and other gems purchases bought with actual world moneys. These were purchased in good faith with the understanding that the GW2 experience going forward would keep consistent. It would be a world they would continue to want to play in. But that wasn’t happening, was it? Nor is it.

Saying, ‘No, you still have them, and you’re free to enjoy them for as long as you stay in Tyria.’ was -and is- a bunch of mealy-mouthed, weasel-worded, coward speak. How does players enjoy themselves if their guild has jumped ship to another game? They don’t.

Anet is irresponsible with the moneys given to them. They need someone more in tune with business and brand consistency riding herd to make certain that what they deliver isn’t going to alienate half or more of a loyal following. Afterwards there needs to be an apology.

And in light of that, the open letter to the community before the preview of PoF was just insulting. Don’t hold a knife to my throat in a blind alley, violate me, then have the gall to paste an open letter on the wall of the alley a year and a half later, whingeing about not having found enough money in my wallet when you’d mugged me afterwards. Telling me not to reflect on the ‘bad times’ but instead to look ahead(possibly to another violation in the making)doesn’t play well. Especially when there wasn’t a sincere apology anywhere within the letter.

Take up painting on your own dime if you want to seek challenge or artistic fulfillment. If your intent is to make money and to have a product that doesn’t end up at the bottom of the heap, then you suck it up, show up every day, leave your ego at the door, and continue to please your customers.

Right now, PoF seems to be another debacle in the making- yet another instance of telling us how to play the way we want. Or rather -‘Play however you want, so long as it’s here and it’s this way.' with nothing but another year or so of silence to follow as the devs go to ground and nurse their wounded egos.

There’s a bit of revisionist history in this post. A lot of people came to this game, played it till they got max gear and walked away too. According to Colin, there was also poor uptake from free weekends into paid accounts, which is why the NPE came out before the game went free to play

You’re making an assumption that the game would have done better if it had stayed completely true to it’s original plan. But that’s only a theory with no way to prove it. It’s possible the game would have done as well, it’s possible the game would have done worse.

It’s my opinion that Anet introduced ascended gear in the first place because they saw how many people were getting top gear and walking away (including both of my sons).

Ayrilana.1396:

I’m kind of worried with the expansion maps and that there may not be anymore map-wide metas. Granted, these could have just been turned off for the demo, but with how the LS3 maps went, it wouldn’t be a shock. It seems like they went too far to appease the self-proclaimed casual players that it leaves a lot of other players with much less to do.

How long before the PoF maps will be like the LS3 map in terms of active population? One month? Two months? Well I guess we have the regular content updates of LS4 to look forward to in January.

Worst case scenario those who loved HoT and kept the game going won’t like PoF, while those who didn’t enjoy HoT left and won’t be coming back anyway despite these forum posts.

Hopefully the other zones will be much more complex to navigate, and it’s only the first zone that is so barren and boring. Even better, the first zone wasn’t shown as is, but it is actually more content-full but for some reason they had it disabled.

We’ll know in a month

Iozeph.5617:

GW2 was sold as the ‘game for the rest of us.’

It depends on what you think “the rest of us” is.
If you mean self-proclaimed casual players then it wasn’t sold as a game for them.
If you mean players that do not want a challenge, it wasn’t for them either.

The game was sold to players asking for a dynamic combat experience, a game that has no subscription fees, a game without a gear treadmill, a game with a cooperating open world experience, a game where skill defines the winner in PvP, a game with a more “balanced” world PvP setting based on worlds instead of same-server factions, with an emphasis on sieges, a game with challenging events and encounters and of course a game with hard dungeons to put that dynamic combat system to good use.

Since the game failed in many aspects of the above, they tried over the years to solve the main problems with varying degrees of success

There were some posts I really enjoyed in this thread, from the OP and others, but it’s gotten too long for me to quote/respond to/find them now.

Leaving aside the term casual, I’m not sure how our tastes match up but here’s a rough breakdown of mine:
I loved open world content in the base game, never really got into dungeons because of grouping and the attitudes of some in there, have done some fractals with friends/guildies but only very rarely since our timetables and my mood have to be in alignment, love the festivals and the living story, got into wvw because your gear/build etc mattered a whole lot less to other people in there and I felt free to play my own way, got really excited for HoT coming up to release, hated dry top, loved silverwastes, took part in the beta weekends and when HoT released I…. stopped. Couldn’t get into it, don’t know why.
Love of the festivals kept me coming back to the game, and after they would end I would stick around for a bit longer and retry getting into HoT and each time I would get a little further into the story and the zones would seem a little bit more intuitive. Then I would default back to wvw but inevitably quit because of the big looming chore of a to do list I felt HoT was. When LS3 released I managed to make myself finish the HoT story so I could try it and… all of the undefined stuff that kept me from enjoying the HoT maps just melted away and I felt like it was a return to the game I loved again.

I have no idea why I love the silverwastes metaevent chain but the other map-wide event chains don’t work for me. Even now I’ve only done Dragons Stand like twice.

But I do feel like LS3 is a good sign that Anet have learned how to strike a happy middle ground between the two extremes of their playerbase. I’m optimistic going into PoF, the main difference being this time I’m not going to be taking part in any of the beta weekends, just in case.

Iozeph.5617:

Rather than adhering to the promise of their initial offering, Anet gave their devs a free hand to squander funds on tangential and unnecessary experiments.

GW2 was sold as the ‘game for the rest of us.’ And it delivered. Nothing trying on overland maps. Amazing visuals, puzzles and platforms, a bit of crafting, and all of it with the non-gamebreaking, opt in/out flavor coined by Warhammer. Game modes to please everyone that weren’t ‘necessary’ to take part in to ‘succeed.’

There was a personal story arc and a living world element tying it all together(similar to Lotro’s Books- once they’d been made solo friendly.) The story was woven into the dungeons so there was instant familiarity and a sense of purpose when you played. All of these were good.

HoT broke faith. Rather than saying, ‘Play how and wherever you wish,’ there was one path to mastery and elite spec lines. There was WvW for some, but if neither a WvW player, or a jumping enthusiast, or someone who enjoyed the world boss train you were out of luck. As it was HoT meta maps seemed to be a passive aggressive middle finger to world train crowd who cried when rewards were cut. ‘Love trains? Here’s four maps that are endless trains with steep victory conditions tossed in.’

From the beginning devs have talked out of both sides of their mouths, saying, ‘play as you want,’ in order to sucker us in and then afterwards making punitive changes- either to classes, or to the game modes. GW2 has the more the feeling of a behavioral science experiment, one we’ve somehow failed without even knowing it. Why?

Because apparently we weren’t playing how they wanted us to play as we wanted to play. If that was confusing, good, because it was just as confusing whenever the changes were made. Still is.

They made a brand, built expectations, then broke them by trying to be something they weren’t. Rather than letting us play ala cart, gw2 became a study in ala cart games development. Devs expected customers to pre-purchase based on previously established brand identity/expectations, but in truth they ended up subsidising their failed experiments. You want spoiled? You want entitlement? There you have it.

They had one job: stay the course, deliver an ongoing experience consistent to what came before. They didn’t. And not only did they not deliver, but they aggressively ignored their players in doing so.(Go ahead. Drop the mic again- see how that works.)

That consistency equaled:

-A new, easily navigable, overworld map section divided by mini hubs(hearts).
-A new, story-relevant, dungeon hub with attendant cosmetics for weapons and armors.
-A new, story relevant, wvw map consistent thematically to the newly opened zones.
-A new pvp tournament event.
-A new chapter of living story, furthering the story which came before; with the end goal of eventually besting the world dragons as the zones where their respective domains exist were opened up.
-A new fractal.

And they could have added raids to that. There’s your new addition.

That’s right, raids weren’t the problem either. They have a place in GW2 beside dungeons for providing additional story progression. And as such, they could have been one of many reasons to call friends over from other games- so long as Anet kept consistent with the other modes. They didn’t and it’s that simple.

And this is why it’s so grating whenever players, satisfied with their experiences, feel free to tell others to quit playing. The alienated player base is just as invested. Perhaps even more if it comes down to moneys spent.

So that said, I’d probably agree with them, provided Anet refunded them the moneys spent for dyes, toys, cosmetics, pets, and other gems purchases bought with actual world moneys. These were purchased in good faith with the understanding that the GW2 experience going forward would keep consistent. It would be a world they would continue to want to play in. But that wasn’t happening, was it? Nor is it.

Saying, ‘No, you still have them, and you’re free to enjoy them for as long as you stay in Tyria.’ was -and is- a bunch of mealy-mouthed, weasel-worded, coward speak. How does players enjoy themselves if their guild has jumped ship to another game? They don’t.

Anet is irresponsible with the moneys given to them. They need someone more in tune with business and brand consistency riding herd to make certain that what they deliver isn’t going to alienate half or more of a loyal following. Afterwards there needs to be an apology.

And in light of that, the open letter to the community before the preview of PoF was just insulting. Don’t hold a knife to my throat in a blind alley, violate me, then have the gall to paste an open letter on the wall of the alley a year and a half later, whingeing about not having found enough money in my wallet when you’d mugged me afterwards. Telling me not to reflect on the ‘bad times’ but instead to look ahead(possibly to another violation in the making)doesn’t play well. Especially when there wasn’t a sincere apology anywhere within the letter.

Take up painting on your own dime if you want to seek challenge or artistic fulfillment. If your intent is to make money and to have a product that doesn’t end up at the bottom of the heap, then you suck it up, show up every day, leave your ego at the door, and continue to please your customers.

Right now, PoF seems to be another debacle in the making- yet another instance of telling us how to play the way we want. Or rather -‘Play however you want, so long as it’s here and it’s this way.' with nothing but another year or so of silence to follow as the devs go to ground and nurse their wounded egos.

Finally. That’s everything I’ve been trying to figure out how to put into words for far too long now. Thank you for finding a way to say it and taking the time to do so.

STIHL.2489:

No, I’ll let someone else do that. if you don’t like what they have to say, take it up with them.

IndigoSundown.5419:

Perhaps because there is a specific definition of the word casual as it is used in video games which states that either skill, time commitment or both are defining factors.

http://www.dictionary.com/browse/casual

Words evolve. We either adapt and use them as they are being used in specific contexts or we don’t. Stick with your definition if you like, but you will continue to be misunderstood by some posters and some of the information you get will be unhelpful as a result.

So by your own concession you admit according to the poster you just linked that you may in fact be using a definition of casual that isn’t conforming to the standard many posters accept. Ergo you’ve given up on any general information said by many posters who consider themselves ‘casual’ enough that might be helpful to you because they aren’t your kind of casual because ultimately what you really want to hear is from someone who is your specific kind of casual that fits a definition no one here has likely fit as criteria.

The only thing I can say that you might be able to universally accept is that it would be wise for you to watch previews, play the betas, see where GW2 has moved since HoT especially with the release of LS3 and make your own judgment. I’ll leave that to your own discretion naturally.

STIHL.2489:

mbhalo.1547:

STIHL.2489:

But, if you really had not idea of the many thing that were done that made HoT unfriendly towards casual players, so much so that you needed to ask this question, I am going to wager that you are nowhere near close to being a casual player yourself, so, no offence to you in any way, but it would be impossible for you to gauge if PoE was in fact casual friendly or not, thus you really could not answer my question.

I consider myself a casual player – 4000 hours played, 16k AP, 5 legendary weapons + legendary backpack, do T4 fractals almost every day and here and there dabble into raiding.

With that resume.. you are very much alone in thinking you are a casual player.

The same can be said about you.

You’re Parked at around 9k AP
I am sitting around 6k AP.
Does this make me more than a casual player than you?

However, from one casual player to another I am and I continue to enjoy GW2 despite your so called casual player respresentation.

Sykper.6583:

STIHL.2489:

No, I’ll let someone else do that. if you don’t like what they have to say, take it up with them.

IndigoSundown.5419:

Perhaps because there is a specific definition of the word casual as it is used in video games which states that either skill, time commitment or both are defining factors.

http://www.dictionary.com/browse/casual

Words evolve. We either adapt and use them as they are being used in specific contexts or we don’t. Stick with your definition if you like, but you will continue to be misunderstood by some posters and some of the information you get will be unhelpful as a result.

So by your own concession you admit according to the poster you just linked that you may in fact be using a definition of casual that isn’t conforming to the standard many posters accept. Ergo you’ve given up on any general information said by many posters who consider themselves ‘casual’ enough that might be helpful to you because they aren’t your kind of casual because ultimately what you really want to hear is from someone who is your specific kind of casual that fits a definition no one here has likely fit as criteria.

The only thing I can say that you might be able to universally accept is that it would be wise for you to watch previews, play the betas, see where GW2 has moved since HoT especially with the release of LS3 and make your own judgment. I’ll leave that to your own discretion naturally.

He meant to grab this

8.
noting or relating to video games that do not require much skill or time commitment, or noting a player of such games:
casual gamers.
Compare hard-core (def 6).

6.
noting or relating to video games that can only be mastered with advanced skill and are played in longer sessions, or noting a player of such games:
hard-core gaming.
Compare casual (def.

He must be comparing to real TIME SINK MMOs that are out in the market.

Rhanoa.3960:

STIHL.2489:

mbhalo.1547:

STIHL.2489:

But, if you really had not idea of the many thing that were done that made HoT unfriendly towards casual players, so much so that you needed to ask this question, I am going to wager that you are nowhere near close to being a casual player yourself, so, no offence to you in any way, but it would be impossible for you to gauge if PoE was in fact casual friendly or not, thus you really could not answer my question.

I consider myself a casual player – 4000 hours played, 16k AP, 5 legendary weapons + legendary backpack, do T4 fractals almost every day and here and there dabble into raiding.

With that resume.. you are very much alone in thinking you are a casual player.

The same can be said about you.

You’re Parked at around 9k AP
I am sitting around 6k AP.
Does this make me more than a casual player than you?

However, from one casual player to another I am and I continue to enjoy GW2 despite your so called casual player respresentation.

Going to bet my WvW rank is higher then yours as well, but, I could have been playing longer then you, I have no idea. When did you start?

I find it very odd that WoW is considerably more casual friendly than GW2 at the time being. Odd because this was the exact opposite before HoT and Legion/WOD.

Maybe if there was difficulty modes or queue for Raids. The Fractal system could be smoother and also have queue. Asc Viper armor could be a bit easier to get. Mastery XP could also be increased for getting the higher level ones. Some of the HoT and S3 mobs are clearly over-tuned to be handled by the over-played god classes.

Substatic.6958:

I find it very odd that WoW is considerably more casual friendly than GW2 at the time being. Odd because this was the exact opposite before HoT and Legion/WOD.

Yeah this is really surprising, but tbh GW2 wasn’t that “casual” at release either. The sheer dedication you need to get ~anything in GW2, plus all the hoops you have to jump through for entirely normal things like clearing your inventory… ugh.

wmtyrance.3571:

TwiceDead.1963:

wmtyrance.3571:

Freaking HOT was bad because of the map navigation. Some people call that challenging others say its annoying. It comes down to what the person thinks it means. I myself like challenging content not bad map design which HOT was to me. I hated the game everytime i went on that map. And it changed the players attitude toward each other to be more selfish. GW2 was a really great game with a equally great community and HOT even changed that.

I see. If a map isn’t completely kittening flat it’s bad map-design. The only map that was a cluster-kitten to navigate was Tangled Depths, the other maps were fine. Verdant Brink takes some getting used to maybe, but if you can’t even put in that much effort, I have a feeling you’re just going to complain no matter what obstacle is put infront of you.

Again give players better content then wasting your time trying to make it hard to get to the content. You may have like the map but you are out numbered by many others that didn’t like it. You logic and reply is lame.

There’s room for both types of map. Majority rules doesn’t produce the best MMO. It produces the most generic one. A defining feature of GW2 is that it isn’t a generic MMO. It’s supposed to have areas of the game that aren’t going to appeal to everyone (see vertical maps, jump puzzles, adventures, SAB , etc.).

If you want to say that going all one way with vertical maps the way HoT did was a mistake, I 100% agree with you. But my concern is that they’ll make the exact same mistake in PoF by swinging the pendulum the other way. LS3 seemed like a successful model that gave us a little of both. I’m hoping it’s that middle ground that offers something for everyone that they’ll try for and not just what you believe the “majority” wants.

STIHL.2489:

Rhanoa.3960:

STIHL.2489:

mbhalo.1547:

STIHL.2489:

But, if you really had not idea of the many thing that were done that made HoT unfriendly towards casual players, so much so that you needed to ask this question, I am going to wager that you are nowhere near close to being a casual player yourself, so, no offence to you in any way, but it would be impossible for you to gauge if PoE was in fact casual friendly or not, thus you really could not answer my question.

I consider myself a casual player – 4000 hours played, 16k AP, 5 legendary weapons + legendary backpack, do T4 fractals almost every day and here and there dabble into raiding.

With that resume.. you are very much alone in thinking you are a casual player.

The same can be said about you.

You’re Parked at around 9k AP
I am sitting around 6k AP.
Does this make me more than a casual player than you?

However, from one casual player to another I am and I continue to enjoy GW2 despite your so called casual player respresentation.

Going to bet my WvW rank is higher then yours as well, but, I could have been playing longer then you, I have no idea. When did you start?

Been playing on and off since Beta 2012!
When the game use to be hard, but folks like you ruined it. Rather than figuring it and exploring you all needed to be directed where to go or how to do things. Then complaining it was too hard.

Then HOT dropped forcing folks to EXPLORE mazes of maps in which the game was originally intended. Now we have POF folks claiming it will be more of the same.
I’m ok if it is more of the same it weeds out the same folks and I am ok without that kind of crowd.

wmtyrance.3571:

TwiceDead.1963:

wmtyrance.3571:

Freaking HOT was bad because of the map navigation. Some people call that challenging others say its annoying. It comes down to what the person thinks it means. I myself like challenging content not bad map design which HOT was to me. I hated the game everytime i went on that map. And it changed the players attitude toward each other to be more selfish. GW2 was a really great game with a equally great community and HOT even changed that.

I see. If a map isn’t completely kittening flat it’s bad map-design. The only map that was a cluster-kitten to navigate was Tangled Depths, the other maps were fine. Verdant Brink takes some getting used to maybe, but if you can’t even put in that much effort, I have a feeling you’re just going to complain no matter what obstacle is put infront of you.

Again give players better content then wasting your time trying to make it hard to get to the content. You may have like the map but you are out numbered by many others that didn’t like it. You logic and reply is lame.

Why not just request a GPS automation system that will get you to your current destination.? Why even bother trying to do anything in a video game anymore, just let the game play for you.

Rhanoa.3960:

I’m ok if it is more of the same it weeds out the same folks and I am ok without that kind of crowd.

Are you OK if the game population drops so low that the game is no longer financially viable? Games have to cater to all levels of ability. In that respect, HoT failed horribly.

DoctorDing.5890:

Rhanoa.3960:

I’m ok if it is more of the same it weeds out the same folks and I am ok without that kind of crowd.

Are you OK if the game population drops so low that the game is no longer financially viable? Games have to cater to all levels of ability. In that respect, HoT failed horribly.

Yeah, you say that, but it’s not going to happen, even less likely to happen when PoF drops. Even after HoT, there’s still a kittenton of people playing the game, and they will still be playing the game after PoF. If the game had failed as hard as you people claim, it would be out of commission ages ago.

STIHL.2489:

TwiceDead.1963:

STIHL.2489:

TexZero.7910:

STIHL.2489:

TexZero.7910:

STIHL.2489:

Griever.8150:

Casuals ruin games.

No, whiners ruin games.. no matter what their playstyle.

IRONY.

No really, pot meet kettle here.

No, see, unlike some people that puttered around for years crying about the game and how it needed to be harder to suite their playstyle, or fussed endlessly for raids, when the game was no longer to my liking… I left.

What is truly ironic, is that some people would say “if you don’t like it, leave!” and yet they remain and fuss incessantly that the game needs to be change, as opposed to you know, following their own advice and leaving.

and coming here making a thread asking about how this casual game somehow forgot casuals isn’t whining ?

Right….

Nope, it was, an honest question, I have been away, and I have a new computer, and was wondering if it was worth it to even bother to do the download. As far as this little stop in goes, either I will find the expansion fun, or I’ll move on again.

No loss on my part either way, and most assuredly, I am not asking for any changes to be made on my part.

Been a good year for me, I found a lot of fun other games, and games I am excited to try as well, but as I said, this expansion piqued my interest.. Nothing more, and nothing for you to get worked up about.

I’ll make it easy for you:

No it isn’t going to be worth it to you. If you struggled with HoT you are likely to struggle with PoF. Follow your own advice and move on.

I’ve read your other posts, You’re not the kind of person I would be taking advice from. beyond that, I have already gotten much better and more informative answers, from people that share my playstyle, feel free to move on another topic, there is nothing here for you.

I’ve read your posts, and to be frank I cannot fathom why you’re even here. You are essentially here, complaining about a game, that you are simultaneously claiming not to be playing anymore, on behalf of the “Casuals”. You’re also saying you won’t be playing unless Anet caters to you, not the casuals as you claim, You, because you put very strict but completely arbitrary restrictions on what makes a casual or not and completely disregard anyone who consider themselves casual unless they completely align with your opinion of it.

I’m just going to treat you like a general troll, and move on.

Please go back to page 4 and look at lozeph.5617’s post. If you ever read a wall of text post, read this one. It is the most accurate description of this games first year I have ever seen.

Many of us have stayed because the game play and potential shown in the first year hooked us. This was truly an amazing stand alone game in an industry full of Wow clone wanna be’s. Since then however, each successive year I have felt the hooks withdrawing as it more and more closely conforms to WoW’s methods.
This casual, should reach my long term goal of 5 legendary weapons sometime next month and that will likely do it for me. I’ve spend about 130 mastery points in HoT and feel I have given it a fair try. I just don’t find it fun. I really hope the game can continue for all those who can enjoy riding around on Disney characters. Just be aware though, PoF will totally block progress for those who don’t buy it. That will definitely have an impact on the PvE players who didn’t buy it and those who didn’t buy Hot as well. Add trolls with mounts in Core Tyria PvE to that and I believe a major correction is coming. For the game’s sake I hope I’m wrong.

DoctorDing.5890:

Rhanoa.3960:

I’m ok if it is more of the same it weeds out the same folks and I am ok without that kind of crowd.

Are you OK if the game population drops so low that the game is no longer financially viable? Games have to cater to all levels of ability. In that respect, HoT failed horribly.

HOT didn’t fail, the Players DID!

Those who couldn’t bare actually making an effort on trying find their own way around even with all the hand holding the game already provided. Everything needs to go in a straight line for these folks. It was a significant change and the players failed to learn and adapt to the new content.

TLDR;

Unless something drastically changes, some classes can solo, some cannot. It usually comes down to build and wrench time in learning your class. That said, if you do not have the masteries (MP/HP) for the transportation skills, gliding, thermal prop, oakheart? You may feel left behind. It really comes down to the amount of time you are willing to invest now to be ready. If you feel the old walk everywhere is good enough, then cya when it launches

Rhanoa.3960:

It was a significant change

Bingo.

STIHL.2489:

Well I can’t, and to be honest, I have no urge to respond to everyone, to be blunt, I am just going to flat out ignore anyone that opens with something like “’I’m casual, you need to L2P noob1!1!!!” or some such similar nonsense.

If you thought that would endear me to what you have to say, you are very mistaken.

IndigoSundown.5419:

OP, while you may self-identify as casual, there is little agreement among all who so identify. Some think of the word as meaning preference for easy content; others for limited time spent playing; still others for solo-only play. There may be as many understandings of what “casual” means as there are people using the term.

“Casual” is a mindset, or more aptly put, an approach on how someone plays the game. In simple terms, “casual” defines their motive and drive, as opposed to being serious about the game, or hardcore. Truth is, being “Casual” is irrespective of skill or time played. As how many hours someone invests into a game or how skilled they are at playing a game, have no bearing the mindset they have or how they approach the game.

In short, a “Casual” is not looking for a something serious that they have to work at or treat like a job, they are looking to escape into a fantasy world as someone might take a casual stroll in the woods to escape the daily grind of life.

Thank you. It is really rare to find people on this community to know the key differences.

It as you have said, casual or semi-casual/hardcore or hardcore are mainly the differences in mindset. A lot of people used “time” as a gauge, that might be relative in the past because in the past there are mostly only semi-hardcore or hardcore games. However, game evolved, likewise, our understanding also evolved. “Time” isn’t a relative unit of measurement anymore. Likewise skill as a gauge, but that isn’t accurate either because there are simply people who have the talents to be good at something while putting in lesser efforts.

If people do put in a bit of effort, they will find articles of people from gaming industry talking about the differences of casuals, core and hardcore.

Rhanoa.3960:

HOT didn’t fail, the Players DID!

Nah. It was Anet’s fail – a failure to consider what kind of players form the basis for their game.

Rhanoa.3960:

It was a significant change and the players failed to learn and adapt to the new content.

No. The players decided not to change, but it was their decision to make. The failure was on Anet’s side in not expecting players to make that choice.

TL/DR; if you try to sell something to your clients, and they happen to not be interested, it’s your mistake, not theirs. Any business that thinks otherwise is going to fail eventually.

DoctorDing.5890:

Rhanoa.3960:

It was a significant change

Bingo.

As always taking it out of its original context far from it being the nail in coffin.
This is just as bad as folks with Guesstimates and their own Interpretations.

Glad to see you ignored everything else.

Let me guess it’s far less challenging than the Champion Mushroom Queen!

Tumult.2578:

This casual, should reach my long term goal of 5 legendary weapons sometime next month and that will likely do it for me. I’ve spend about 130 mastery points in HoT and feel I have given it a fair try.

“Casual”.

Uh huh. 5 legendaries casual.

That’s the biggest problem I have with a lot of comments in this thread, I bet they’re from the ultra diehard players with lots of of legendaries and tons of achievements farmed. Because they’re so “casual”.

Astralporing.1957:

Rhanoa.3960:

HOT didn’t fail, the Players DID!

Nah. It was Anet’s fail – a failure to consider what kind of players form the basis for their game.

Rhanoa.3960:

It was a significant change and the players failed to learn and adapt to the new content.

No. The players decided not to change, but it was their decision to make. The failure was on Anet’s side in not expecting players to make that choice.

TL/DR; if you try to sell something to your clients, and they happen to not be interested, it’s your mistake, not theirs. Any business that thinks otherwise is going to fail eventually.

Game released the 3rd Qtr of 2012.
Look at us now in 2017 and a second Xpac 5 yrs later.

Has the game really failed? Far from it.

Carighan.6758:

Tumult.2578:

This casual, should reach my long term goal of 5 legendary weapons sometime next month and that will likely do it for me. I’ve spend about 130 mastery points in HoT and feel I have given it a fair try.

“Casual”.

Uh huh. 5 legendaries casual.

That’s the biggest problem I have with a lot of comments in this thread, I bet they’re from the ultra diehard players with lots of of legendaries and tons of achievements farmed. Because they’re so “casual”.

Dude, I do not have one legendary, and I really do not care. His/her comment is nothing more than entitlement issue.

“My first job out of high school I want to do very little as possible. Corner office, 25 paid vacation days, med & dental 100% covered, company car, laptop, and cell phone.
In 5 years I want to already own 5 different vintage Ferraris. And I expect to be promoted every 6 months.”

TwiceDead.1963:

You’re also saying you won’t be playing unless Anet caters to you,

Why would I play a game I don’t find fun?

I mean, not to be rude, but many of the things you are saying, are so nonsensical, it’s comical at this point.

Rhanoa.3960:

HOT didn’t fail, the Players DID!

A player is under no obligation to play or support game they don’t find fun. Leaving is always a viable and proper response to any game that not your liking.

When a company makes a game, the people that don’t find it fun either leave or stay around and whine that the game needs to change.

So lets get this clear, if players left the game.. then HoT failed to be fun to them.

Rhanoa.3960:

Been playing on and off since Beta 2012!
When the game use to be hard, but folks like you ruined it. Rather than figuring it and exploring you all needed to be directed where to go or how to do things. Then complaining it was too hard.

Well I didn’t start till 2014 and only actually played for 2 years. Looks like being directed worked out pretty good for me.

STIHL.2489:

Rhanoa.3960:

HOT didn’t fail, the Players DID!

A player is under no obligation to play or support game they don’t find fun. Leaving is always a viable and proper response to any game that not your liking.

When a company makes a game, the people that don’t find it fun either leave or stay around and whine that the game needs to change.

So lets get this clear, if players left the game.. then HoT failed to be fun to them.

Without doubt you’re not obligated. However, as a customer your experience overall is subjective as you and I do not experience it the same way. Do they both matter? Of course.

Though, claiming to represent the voices of all casual players is false and misleading.

Your problem is with HOT not being casual enough for you. My problem is which of the 9 Professions and Builds to use with so many available options.

Rhanoa.3960:

STIHL.2489:

Rhanoa.3960:

HOT didn’t fail, the Players DID!

A player is under no obligation to play or support game they don’t find fun. Leaving is always a viable and proper response to any game that not your liking.

When a company makes a game, the people that don’t find it fun either leave or stay around and whine that the game needs to change.

So lets get this clear, if players left the game.. then HoT failed to be fun to them.

Without doubt you’re not obligated. However, as a customer your experience overall is subjective as you and I do not experience it the same way. Do they both matter? Of course.

Though, claiming to represent the voices of all casual players is false and misleading.

Your problem is with HOT not being casual enough for you. My problem is which of the 9 Professions and Builds to use with so many available options.

Well, I never said ALL. There are always those the exceptions, but.. from what this topic has wrought, my views align with a substantial portion of the casual community. If you want to be some lone voice, by all means, go ahead, I won’t stop you, and I’ll gladly not speak up for you.

Feel better?

DoctorDing.5890:

Rhanoa.3960:

It was a significant change

Bingo.

Games without significant changes often die faster than games with them The six guys that would still be playing core Tyria if is stayed at that difficulty would be happy as clams. Most of us would have played a lot less, because too easy is as bad as too hard. HoT kept me in the game. And I know for a fact I’m not alone.

STIHL.2489:

Rhanoa.3960:

STIHL.2489:

Rhanoa.3960:

HOT didn’t fail, the Players DID!

A player is under no obligation to play or support game they don’t find fun. Leaving is always a viable and proper response to any game that not your liking.

When a company makes a game, the people that don’t find it fun either leave or stay around and whine that the game needs to change.

So lets get this clear, if players left the game.. then HoT failed to be fun to them.

Without doubt you’re not obligated. However, as a customer your experience overall is subjective as you and I do not experience it the same way. Do they both matter? Of course.

Though, claiming to represent the voices of all casual players is false and misleading.

Your problem is with HOT not being casual enough for you. My problem is which of the 9 Professions and Builds to use with so many available options.

Well, I never said ALL. There are always those the exceptions, but.. from what this topic has wrought, my views align with a substantial portion of the casual community. If you want to be some lone voice, by all means, go ahead, I won’t stop you, and I’ll gladly not speak up for you.

Feel better?

We will all feel better when POF is out then you realize that this is as casual as the game gets for you. There are still a handful of MMOs for you to try maybe it will help you find what you are looking for.

Here are a list of games for you to check out.
Final Fantasy XI..
Elder Scrolls On..
Black Desert Onl..
Rift
AD2460
Warframe
Path of Exile
Darkfall: Unholy..
WildStar
SMITE
Neverwinter
TERA
Blade & Soul
EVE Online
Elite: Dangerous
EverQuest II
Lord of the Ring..
Guild Wars
Final Fantasy XI
Dark Age of Came..
Guild Wars Facti..
Ryzom
Perpetuum
Aika
Atlantica Online
Destiny
Fallen Earth
PlanetSide 2
Guild Wars Night..
Dungeons & Drago..
Ultima Online
EverQuest
Lineage 2
Wizard101

Rhanoa.3960:

STIHL.2489:

Rhanoa.3960:

STIHL.2489:

Rhanoa.3960:

HOT didn’t fail, the Players DID!

A player is under no obligation to play or support game they don’t find fun. Leaving is always a viable and proper response to any game that not your liking.

When a company makes a game, the people that don’t find it fun either leave or stay around and whine that the game needs to change.

So lets get this clear, if players left the game.. then HoT failed to be fun to them.

Without doubt you’re not obligated. However, as a customer your experience overall is subjective as you and I do not experience it the same way. Do they both matter? Of course.

Though, claiming to represent the voices of all casual players is false and misleading.

Your problem is with HOT not being casual enough for you. My problem is which of the 9 Professions and Builds to use with so many available options.

Well, I never said ALL. There are always those the exceptions, but.. from what this topic has wrought, my views align with a substantial portion of the casual community. If you want to be some lone voice, by all means, go ahead, I won’t stop you, and I’ll gladly not speak up for you.

Feel better?

We will all feel better when POF is out then you realize that this is as casual as the game gets for you. There are still a handful of MMOs for you to try maybe it will help you find what you are looking for.

Here are a list of games for you to check out.
Final Fantasy XI..
Elder Scrolls On..
Black Desert Onl..
Rift
AD2460
Warframe
Path of Exile
Darkfall: Unholy..
WildStar
SMITE
Neverwinter
TERA
Blade & Soul
EVE Online
Elite: Dangerous
EverQuest II
Lord of the Ring..
Guild Wars
Final Fantasy XI
Dark Age of Came..
Guild Wars Facti..
Ryzom
Perpetuum
Aika
Atlantica Online
Destiny
Fallen Earth
PlanetSide 2
Guild Wars Night..
Dungeons & Drago..
Ultima Online
EverQuest
Lineage 2
Wizard101

That read like a copy past from some list off MMORPG.com, but really, You list a bomb like Wildstar and archaic games like Everquest, but fail to mention some nifty gems like Archeage and BlackGold?

I would hope that If you’re going to suggest a game, you have at least some vested knowledge of them, (Which I am going to doubt is true with this list of yours), but, with that put out, I have one for you. See I have been playing other MMO’s for the last year, so.. Give this one a whirl, it might be more your liking if you can’t settle well on one character.

Trove.

Vayne.8563:

DoctorDing.5890:

Rhanoa.3960:

It was a significant change

Bingo.

Games without significant changes often die faster than games with them The six guys that would still be playing core Tyria if is stayed at that difficulty would be happy as clams. Most of us would have played a lot less, because too easy is as bad as too hard. HoT kept me in the game. And I know for a fact I’m not alone.

This is not true at all. Case in point, EQ didn’t significantly change their game, they merely added to it. In essence, they added levels, which progressed the game, but did do while keeping with the established systems and style of play that the base game was built off of, there were no major system shocks, or massive overhauls on how the game felt from one expansion to the next, the transition from Norrath to Kunark, felt smooth, the Kunark Expansion felt like it belonged in the world of Norrath, making a fitting addition to the game.

Whereas, HoT was an abject change to how the game felt when you played, it didn’t feel like a smooth transition at all.

Ergo, games may need to grow, but they don’t in effect need to overhaul level changes to stay alive, in fact.. subtle small changes are what keep games alive, additions keep games alive.. substantial shocking changes have historically always done more harm then good.

Well, After getting to play the demo for a bit (and I really wish they had given us a HoT demo like this), I am willing to openly admit that it is much more palatable then HoT ever was, the maps seemed much easier to transverse, and it felt very close to how Core felt, which is a great thing. From the limited bit I played, this truly felt like what their first expansion should have been like, a nice smooth addition that feels like a continuation of the Core game, just a bit harder with some added new things going on.

It’s a beautiful game, and I can see why some people still plat it.

But, to be honest, I am just not feeling any urgency to invest, still feeling a bit burned by HoT.. so, gonna let this one simmer for a bit.

Thank you to the people that took the time to give me insight and answers.

Endest.5729:

Does not matter what you call them “casual”, low intesnsity", “noob”, etc. What really matters is that HoT was a massive failure. Never before has a AAA MMO had it first xpac fail utterly. EQ, WOW, FFXIV, etc all of these did not see a drop in players/income until they were three or four or more xpacs in.

These are public facts. Any one can look at the financial reports and see how GW2 income plunged. The lead designer was fired because HoT was such a failure.

So for the tens of thousands of ex-GW2 players who left because HoT was annoying (hard or easy is not the question). It failed because people did not like playing the zones. The vast majority of players did not care about hardcore raiding or eSports.

So question is did they learn their lesson. Will we get back to the orginal GW2 that sold by the truck loads. I am still not sure. But so far it seems like they are doing a few things right.

I came back to GW2 after a long absence and was really enjoying the base game. Then I hit the HoT content and not only did not enjoy it, actively disliked it. I thought, if this is where they are taking GW2, then I’m done. Really done.

So the question of whether GW2 is heading back to their original game concepts with PoF is very pertinent. I’m sure I’m not the only former-GW2 player trying to get a sense of whether PoF is more HoT or not, whether to be hopeful or simply resigned.

Anyway, I tried the demo but there wasn’t enough of it to make a conclusion about what direction the content is going or what the maps outside of the first city may look like.

The sad fact is that I so disliked HoT that I’m not going to be easily wooed back to GW2. PoF is going to have to be reviewed extensively and well-received by the community before I seriously consider it.

Djinn.9245:

mbhalo.1547:

I consider myself a casual player – 4000 hours played, 16k AP, 5 legendary weapons + legendary backpack, do T4 fractals almost every day and here and there dabble into raiding.

I’m honestly curious: why do you list all those things and call yourself “casual”? I mean what version of “casual” allows you to accomplish all that and still think you are “casual”?

Flatley.1620:

mbhalo.1547:

Djinn.9245:

I’m honestly curious: why do you list all those things and call yourself “casual”? I mean what version of “casual” allows you to accomplish all that and still think you are “casual”?

Because i don’t tryhard and farm, i play on my own laid-back pace.

I wish I could accomplish all that by not trying hard :/

I agree. mbhalo’s experience is not what I or anyone I know would call “casual” lol.