How Can ANet Improve Average Player Skills

How Can ANet Improve Average Player Skills

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Posted by: Conncept.7638

Conncept.7638

Okay because soooo many people seem to have addresses my post on improving improving dodge by making it more mechanically and visually varied, with ‘No mo particle ’ffects’.

A) I did not say only particle affects, but animations. Simple fact, nobody plays this game and says “Oh look, did you see that dodge roll! It was exactly the same as the one six seconds before it, and the one six seconds before that, and the ten million I’ve done and seen since launch!”

B) We already know the existing particle affects and animations are being worked on. Putting more in for better and more varied telegraphs, and the efficacy of the current ones, are two completely unrelated issues. This is a non-argument.

Just because they are “working” on it, doesn’t mean that massive particle effects doesn’t make it difficult to see telegraphs.

No, but that problem is with overall particle effects in the game, not any specific one. Therefore, adding a few specific effects is not going to affect the fix to overall effects when it comes. Plus this is only a problem with large event bosses, how does that even affect more varied dodge gameplay? It doesn’t, quit harping on a non-issue.

(edited by Conncept.7638)

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Posted by: chemiclord.3978

chemiclord.3978

The problem with studies, is that with enough of the ‘right’ candidates, they can be swayed to show pretty much anything. I do admit (see my other post to Mirta) that they should all be taken with a grain of salt. From my personal experience, I am apt to learn towards the average iq dropping. Or perhaps, people just prefer to act like idiots. I honestly don’t know.

I dunno if it’s an example of more people are acting like idiots or that people as a whole are less intelligent as much as it is our society has advanced to the point that a much larger sample size of humanity have the opportunity to express their ignorance more often.

For example, during the Victorian Era, when you were assessing the intelligence of people, chances are you weren’t grabbing the illiterate janitor across town, or the maize farmer 50 miles away from Cambridge. You were assessing your contemporaries, students, people who had reason to learn and expand their knowledge. What remains of that era tend to be the most learned, the most accomplished, the most recognized (ie the creme de le creme). I’m betting if you were to give a Facebook like means of letting EVERYONE of that era have a voice you’d find that it’d be no better as a whole than now, if not far far worse.

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Posted by: TooBz.3065

TooBz.3065

All PvE in this game is based soley off DPS as stated prior.

It’s a VERY VERY VERY simplistic combat system and design.

The entire model also rewards those who do as much damage as possible as fast as possible.

Once again look at the latest living story if you need proof.

What type of player do you people honestly think a shallow design like this will attract?

I’d say simplistic AI, but you say tomato…

Anything I post is just the opinion of a very vocal minority of 1.

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Posted by: Azreell.1568

Azreell.1568

The problem with studies, is that with enough of the ‘right’ candidates, they can be swayed to show pretty much anything. I do admit (see my other post to Mirta) that they should all be taken with a grain of salt. From my personal experience, I am apt to learn towards the average iq dropping. Or perhaps, people just prefer to act like idiots. I honestly don’t know.

I dunno if it’s an example of more people are acting like idiots or that people as a whole are less intelligent as much as it is our society has advanced to the point that a much larger sample size of humanity have the opportunity to express their ignorance more often.

For example, during the Victorian Era, when you were assessing the intelligence of people, chances are you weren’t grabbing the illiterate janitor across town, or the maize farmer 50 miles away from Cambridge. You were assessing your contemporaries, students, people who had reason to learn and expand their knowledge. What remains of that era tend to be the most learned, the most accomplished, the most recognized (ie the creme de le creme). I’m betting if you were to give a Facebook like means of letting EVERYONE of that era have a voice you’d find that it’d be no better as a whole than now, if not far far worse.

We aren’t gauging intelligence.

This is more a design problem that Anet has successful made the easiest MMORPG ever.

In saying that and I will be polite it attracted a very “odd” audience of players.

Azreell – Mesmer
Loyalty To None

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Posted by: TooBz.3065

TooBz.3065

Okay because soooo many people seem to have addresses my post on improving improving dodge by making it more mechanically and visually varied, with ‘No mo particle ’ffects’.

A) I did not say only particle affects, but animations. Simple fact, nobody plays this game and says “Oh look, did you see that dodge roll! It was exactly the same as the one six seconds before it, and the one six seconds before that, and the ten million I’ve done and seen since launch!”

B) We already know the existing particle affects and animations are being worked on. Putting more in for better and more varied telegraphs, and the efficacy of the current ones, are two completely unrelated issues. This is a non-argument.

Just because they are “working” on it, doesn’t mean that massive particle effects doesn’t make it difficult to see telegraphs.

No, but that problem is with overall particle effects in the game, not any specific one. Therefore, adding a few specific effects is not going to affect the fix to overall effects when it comes. Plus this is only a problem with large event bosses, how does that even affect more varied dodge gameplay? It doesn’t, quit harping on a non-issue.

Didn’t harp. First time I posted anything about it. Stop harping on me about my posts. :P

Anything I post is just the opinion of a very vocal minority of 1.

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Posted by: laharl.8435

laharl.8435

I would love to play a GW2 where people used consumables, (…)

I use food and oil in WvW extensively (i.e. if I’m not using them, it’s cause I forgot to refresh them.) Never ever felt the need to use the in PVE, though. It feels like adding a pistol on top of the tank that’s about to shoot fish in a barrel.

I’ll never understand people that say they only like to play optimally in one game mode. Makes me think they probably aren’t playing optimally in pvp either, probably using bad builds, bad tactics etc. just like they do in pve.

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Posted by: Rainweaver.7302

Rainweaver.7302

Some people are complaining about others who don’t use the rally system properly, but in my opinion the whole rally mechanic contributes to the “noob bubble”.

What I see in most speed-run dungeon/fractals groups are people spamming their DPS rotations and not caring about getting downed, and still managing to successfully clear the content, simply because they keep rallying. This game already has an almost non-existent death penalty, so why make death even harder to happen?

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Posted by: SkyShroud.2865

SkyShroud.2865

Some people are complaining about others who don’t use the rally system properly, but in my opinion the whole rally mechanic contributes to the “noob bubble”.

What I see in most speed-run dungeon/fractals groups are people spamming their DPS rotations and not caring about getting downed, and still managing to successfully clear the content, simply because they keep rallying. This game already has an almost non-existent death penalty, so why make death even harder to happen?

Aww, I love the rally system. There are times when I get surrounded and thanks to the rally system, I managed to clear all.

However, there are people who didn’t take advantage of the rally system. When they are down, they didn’t take the initiative to hit a dying mobs or players to rally themselves up. They continue to allow themselves to remain down. I guess this also draw the lines between skilled and unskilled players.

Founder & Leader of Equinox Solstice [TIME], a Singapore-Based International Guild
Henge of Denravi Server
www.gw2time.com

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Posted by: laharl.8435

laharl.8435

Some people are complaining about others who don’t use the rally system properly, but in my opinion the whole rally mechanic contributes to the “noob bubble”.

What I see in most speed-run dungeon/fractals groups are people spamming their DPS rotations and not caring about getting downed, and still managing to successfully clear the content, simply because they keep rallying. This game already has an almost non-existent death penalty, so why make death even harder to happen?

Ok, so complain about the rally system in the forum and make better suggestions. But you may as well use the system while it’s in place.

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Posted by: laharl.8435

laharl.8435

Some people are complaining about others who don’t use the rally system properly, but in my opinion the whole rally mechanic contributes to the “noob bubble”.

What I see in most speed-run dungeon/fractals groups are people spamming their DPS rotations and not caring about getting downed, and still managing to successfully clear the content, simply because they keep rallying. This game already has an almost non-existent death penalty, so why make death even harder to happen?

Aww, I love the rally system. There are times when I get surrounded and thanks to the rally system, I managed to clear all.

However, there are people who didn’t take advantage of the rally system. When they are down, they didn’t take the initiative to hit a dying mobs or players to rally themselves up. They continue to allow themselves to remain down. I guess this also draw the lines between skilled and unskilled players.

Exactly. If I down, I target a close mob that is almost dead. Some players will kill the mob, some will stop dps to res….

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Posted by: Xia.3485

Xia.3485

What I see in most speed-run dungeon/fractals groups are people spamming their DPS rotations and not caring about getting downed, and still managing to successfully clear the content, simply because they keep rallying. This game already has an almost non-existent death penalty, so why make death even harder to happen?

The rally system is also present in borderlands, a first person shooter. Also, you can’t rally indefinitely.. eventually you get defeated without any down state.

I’m not a big fan of a death penalty. I do feel bosses should stomp players dead when they go down. Same with normal mobs, they should know how to stomp you.

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Posted by: NeuroMuse.1763

NeuroMuse.1763

How do you make them better? You don’t. They are completely immobile on this score. You have one of two options; dumb down everything so they can participate happily, or gate difficult content into its own instance where they won’t be offended by its presence.

As much as I would prefer non-gated / open content. I have to agree with this and given what I’ve seen in recent events especially when people actually cause problems intentionally for personal amusement. I understand a lot better why it’s done so much in other games now.

Something like this could be accomplished through a panel similar to the guild mission system but open and linked to living story content accessible to all players of appropriate level or scaled up where acceptable where one can select varying difficulty modes. You could also accomplish this by having the option appear when attempting to zone into the related content area and could select from the difficulty modes or other related options. This could co-exist with normal open world content and simply spawn an overflow with these settings and place the players in it that selected similar options. Allowing guilds to select specific overflow IDs would be ideal so they could actually play together and land in the same instance/overflow or try to automatically and intelligently place as many from the same guild into the same spawned instance. This could still give you a good mix of players in a semi-open environment without necessarily become a full-blown classic raid.

(edited by NeuroMuse.1763)

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Posted by: Embrace The Bold.7619

Embrace The Bold.7619

My main is a guardian so i never had any problem with the lack of reflect, aegis, stability, etc. But for the last couple month i play more on my Warrior and Ele for the speed clear.

It always frustrating to see people not using the the strength of the profession.

You don’t bind Malrona to the wall in TA before using your wall to reflect her AoE? Ok, if you are the only one with reflect it can be dangerous wihtout enough DPS.

But if you go melee the final Tree in the UP path and don’t bring neither wall of SoA, then you make me sad.

If you rush to stack for Golems or Bomber in SE, but don’t put a Wall of reflection. My little guardian heart broke a little more each time.

My personal fav is when I ask the guardian to use WoR on malorana so we can melee her. He puts it in front of himself as he continues spamming staff 1. GUARDIANS FOR THE LOVE OF GOD STOP THAT! the only time you should EVER use staff is to be a lawnmower THAT’S IT. Seriously! Stop its painful to watch like an ele using ice bow for its auto attack (if you do that I will cry irl).

Rant aside at the current state of the game the best you can do is run pugs tell people what to use and when and if they refuse kick them. If everyone were to do this they would either quit or get better. Unfortunately this will never happen.

The Sickest Guild NA

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Posted by: wolfpaq.7354

wolfpaq.7354

It really bothers me that you are listing the 25% knight health decrease as something arising from a lack of skill. That decrease has nothing to do with skill. It has everything to do with the design flaws which include…

1) Reflecting conditions. For at least half the fight, usually longer, knights not only are immune to conditions, but REFLECT THEM TO YOU. This is horrific design for a lot of reasons. Condition builds / classes are completely ineffective. Vulnerability isn’t stacked.

2) Knights have significantly higher toughness than… most of the game. I literally am dealing half damage to them than anything else in lion’s arch.

3) Unlike most group events, knights health doesn’t scale. If 10 people are working on red, red will not go down, period.

4) Knights go immune to all damage, evading all attacks and becoming untargettable, followed by an AoE sweeping damage frequently throughout the fight. That causes massive problems for classes like mesmers who rely on their phantasms to have regular uptime.

5) Consistent melee of any kind is impossible given the constant, untelegraphed 360 arc sweeps with no walls to dodge into and the constant AoE detargetting (see point #4).

So let’s review. To succeed at knights you need to have minimum 90 people working on the knights since the health doesn’t scale & they have absurdly high toughness. You need the 90+ evenly split. You need them all to be ranged. You need them to have zero condition damage on gear. You need them to be using skills that don’t apply conditions. You need none of them to be mesmers.

It’s awful. It was WoW raid levels of difficulty except requiring 4x the players with 1/4th the communication potential and zero meaning of communication beyond spamming map chat.

It has nothing to do with skill. It’s a stupidly designed encounter, plain and simple.

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Posted by: Azreell.1568

Azreell.1568

It really bothers me that you are listing the 25% knight health decrease as something arising from a lack of skill. That decrease has nothing to do with skill. It has everything to do with the design flaws which include…

1) Reflecting conditions. For at least half the fight, usually longer, knights not only are immune to conditions, but REFLECT THEM TO YOU. This is horrific design for a lot of reasons. Condition builds / classes are completely ineffective. Vulnerability isn’t stacked.

2) Knights have significantly higher toughness than… most of the game. I literally am dealing half damage to them than anything else in lion’s arch.

3) Unlike most group events, knights health doesn’t scale. If 10 people are working on red, red will not go down, period.

4) Knights go immune to all damage, evading all attacks and becoming untargettable, followed by an AoE sweeping damage frequently throughout the fight. That causes massive problems for classes like mesmers who rely on their phantasms to have regular uptime.

5) Consistent melee of any kind is impossible given the constant, untelegraphed 360 arc sweeps with no walls to dodge into and the constant AoE detargetting (see point #4).

So let’s review. To succeed at knights you need to have minimum 90 people working on the knights since the health doesn’t scale & they have absurdly high toughness. You need the 90+ evenly split. You need them all to be ranged. You need them to have zero condition damage on gear. You need them to be using skills that don’t apply conditions. You need none of them to be mesmers.

It’s awful. It was WoW raid levels of difficulty except requiring 4x the players with 1/4th the communication potential and zero meaning of communication beyond spamming map chat.

It has nothing to do with skill. It’s a stupidly designed encounter, plain and simple.

You never raided in Wow I assume by your underlined statement.

The knights use the most basic and rudimentary mechanics I have ever seen.

Their difficulty is not even close to “raid” based.

1)Conditions – While I may not agree at all with the reasoning nor current place conditions are in, If you haven’t figured out conditions are horrid and lack luster in pve after over a year then there is no point in reading the rest of my response. Bottom line – conditions are terrible in pve currently. Don’t use them.

2)Knights would be considered tanky type mobs I would agree. But how is this problematic? They simply take longer to kill and once again force the dps meta in terms of damage them has hard as fast as possible. Once again after a year of the same thing – Why are you suprised?

3)I’ll give you this one – its poorly designed for sure.

4)Pets are generally bad in this game – I will give you that. But as a mesmer part of your mechanic is figuring out how / when/ and which type of illusion or phant to use. <shrug> I didnt have as much issues as you apparently playing my mesmer on them.

5)I’ve melee’d them on my mesmer, ranger, guardian and necro with absolutely zero problems. So am I not sure what your issue is. It’s not that difficult to see the their telegraphed moves at all – even in melee. Perhaps it’s time for your yearly eye check-up?

Trust me – I am no fan of this encounter as it’s nothing more then a boring DPS check with a few basic mechanics tossed in .

But, it is also so simplistic it isn’t even funny.

Azreell – Mesmer
Loyalty To None

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Posted by: laharl.8435

laharl.8435

My main is a guardian so i never had any problem with the lack of reflect, aegis, stability, etc. But for the last couple month i play more on my Warrior and Ele for the speed clear.

It always frustrating to see people not using the the strength of the profession.

You don’t bind Malrona to the wall in TA before using your wall to reflect her AoE? Ok, if you are the only one with reflect it can be dangerous wihtout enough DPS.

But if you go melee the final Tree in the UP path and don’t bring neither wall of SoA, then you make me sad.

If you rush to stack for Golems or Bomber in SE, but don’t put a Wall of reflection. My little guardian heart broke a little more each time.

My personal fav is when I ask the guardian to use WoR on malorana so we can melee her. He puts it in front of himself as he continues spamming staff 1. GUARDIANS FOR THE LOVE OF GOD STOP THAT! the only time you should EVER use staff is to be a lawnmower THAT’S IT. Seriously! Stop its painful to watch like an ele using ice bow for its auto attack (if you do that I will cry irl).

Rant aside at the current state of the game the best you can do is run pugs tell people what to use and when and if they refuse kick them. If everyone were to do this they would either quit or get better. Unfortunately this will never happen.

You can melee just fine without a reflect.

The proper way to reflect that encounter is to let yourself get hit with her poison spit first. Do not Condi cleanse it (guard should run shelter, not signet). Then reflect the next attack which will be aoe circle projectiles. Huge damage and can insta-kill.

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Posted by: Rangersix.1754

Rangersix.1754

There are several main reasons why this happened. First off, there’s the lack of guiding new players. A perfect example of this are combo fields and finishers. Most players are simply oblivious to these because the only way to really find out about them, is reading the wikipedia. Most people simply think the rings are there to only show the area in which the buff is active.

The second major problem is that Anet keeps designing zerg/large group content. This content so far, apart from the marionette, puts little focus on the individual player. You can basically participate naked while blowing soap bubbles and you still wouldn’t have a clue about how much you actually participate in the end. This causes a lot of people to not even bother improving because their build works and never try anything different. I saw a video earlier today detailing a full cleric/staff build for fractals where the author talked down about damage builds in such a way that it was clear that he never even bothered trying to go damage oriented. And why would he? He’s never confronted with having to perform well individually (apart from the marionette, where builds like his caused problems if they were grouped together on a platform).

Finally, there’s also the lack of unique rewards for skillful play or dedication. Almost all the rewards you can get in this game are completely (and absurdly) RNG based or require you to do an effortless task (like doing a daily several times in a row). It’s also one of the reasons why Liadri is the only miniature that I bother keeping in my bags at all times and even pull out. The miniature wasn’t tossed on everyone’s lap and shows at least some accomplishment.

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Posted by: Rainweaver.7302

Rainweaver.7302

I’m not a big fan of a death penalty. I do feel bosses should stomp players dead when they go down. Same with normal mobs, they should know how to stomp you.

I was not advocating death penalty, I just dont think you should have both the rally system and a non-existent penalty. As it stands, the only risk you have of dying is losing like 3 silver and a minute or two of your time walking back (maybe more if it’s WvW).

I really like your idea though. Being required to stomp toxic alliance mobs was a good start, hopefully they elaborate it more, both for stomping mobs and getting stomped by them.

Ok, so complain about the rally system in the forum and make better suggestions. But you may as well use the system while it’s in place.

There have been several complains about the rally system in this forum, specially regarding spvp. Yeah, you should use it while it’s in place (I do that, after all), but I don’t think it makes much sense to call people unskilled for not using a system that, in my opinion, trivializes skill in the first place (as in not getting downed).

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Posted by: laharl.8435

laharl.8435

I’m not a big fan of a death penalty. I do feel bosses should stomp players dead when they go down. Same with normal mobs, they should know how to stomp you.

I was not advocating death penalty, I just dont think you should have both the rally system and a non-existent penalty. As it stands, the only risk you have of dying is losing like 3 silver and a minute or two of your time walking back (maybe more if it’s WvW).

I really like your idea though. Being required to stomp toxic alliance mobs was a good start, hopefully they elaborate it more, both for stomping mobs and getting stomped by them.

Ok, so complain about the rally system in the forum and make better suggestions. But you may as well use the system while it’s in place.

There have been several complains about the rally system in this forum, specially regarding spvp. Yeah, you should use it while it’s in place (I do that, after all), but I don’t think it makes much sense to call people unskilled for not using a system that, in my opinion, trivializes skill in the first place (as in not getting downed).

I wouldn’t necessarily say they’re unskilled for not using the system, just ignorant of mechanics or possibly has bad combat awareness (which could be considered unskilled).

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Posted by: Naetell.3815

Naetell.3815

Gaming moved away from the hardcore concept even though what you are talking about sounds casual. Games nowadays are directed towards the casual player-base who play for fun rather than learning anything, it is a game afterall, you can’t start blaming anyone for being bad!

Anet wanted their world to be explorable, they wanted the players to explore the world themselves and while it is good in theory and I am pretty sure many enjoyed it, they didn’t keep in mind that the current player-base of MMOs won’t bother doing alot of that leading to inexperienced players reaching 80 with zergs, ending up without understanding what the game is about.

I disagree with your punishing strategy though, this hardcore concept is gone and shouldn’t be implemented back, we don’t have to be punished for playing games. It is just like going back to the old-day schools where students gets punished physically, building the fear to not do future mistakes. This method leans towards a dictatorship, something that the modern society will never accept even if it is a simple game.

Anet should have implemented a hint/tips system during the personal story, building your experience and mechanics rather than only leading you to the right maps. It maybe still avaiable to implement this system otherwise but it is too late for the personal story at least, as they would need to totally change it to fit the concept.

Am I the only one who’s enjoying myself with this post knowing Dark Souls 2 is releasing this week?

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Posted by: wolfpaq.7354

wolfpaq.7354

I raided many times in wow. Technically, you’re right. The pre hp nerf knights weren’t anywhere close to WoW raiding difficulty. They were much harder. Arenanet made the correct decision and nerfed them.

1) Right, conditions in pve are useless, and this event reinforces that fact. That is HORRIFIC design. Glad we agree.

2) I mean, isn’t it obvious? Super high condition immunity uptime, super high health, and super high toughness. How is the damage supposed to be dealt? It’s not and it wasn’t. One of those factors had to be toned down. Arenanet went with health.

4) Mesmer damage is designed around their phantasms doing damage more than once. If you played a mesmer in this event, you were doing subpar dps. All of your phantasms got reset the second she jumped, or much sooner if you used anything but the duelist phantasm, which is one of the lower dps phantasms unless you trait specifically for it, which is a waste on the rest (yes, I’m talking about buggy as kitten phantasmal haste).

5) I’m highly skeptical of this. I’m guessing you moved out of melee range for at least part of the fight which is not melee’ing the boss. It’s partial melee, which is still less dps than actual melee, which is my entire point.

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Posted by: Azreell.1568

Azreell.1568

Gaming moved away from the hardcore concept even though what you are talking about sounds casual. Games nowadays are directed towards the casual player-base who play for fun rather than learning anything, it is a game afterall, you can’t start blaming anyone for being bad!

Anet wanted their world to be explorable, they wanted the players to explore the world themselves and while it is good in theory and I am pretty sure many enjoyed it, they didn’t keep in mind that the current player-base of MMOs won’t bother doing alot of that leading to inexperienced players reaching 80 with zergs, ending up without understanding what the game is about.

I disagree with your punishing strategy though, this hardcore concept is gone and shouldn’t be implemented back, we don’t have to be punished for playing games. It is just like going back to the old-day schools where students gets punished physically, building the fear to not do future mistakes. This method leans towards a dictatorship, something that the modern society will never accept even if it is a simple game.

Anet should have implemented a hint/tips system during the personal story, building your experience and mechanics rather than only leading you to the right maps. It maybe still avaiable to implement this system otherwise but it is too late for the personal story at least, as they would need to totally change it to fit the concept.

Am I the only one who’s enjoying myself with this post knowing Dark Souls 2 is releasing this week?

I’ve played and beat the original one quite a few times.

I enjoyed it initially but what I soon found was it did some things for no other reason then to be annoying to the user.

The idea behind a “hard” game is good. But, when it becomes hard for no other reason then just being “hard” I will pass.

The game has to be enjoyable as well as hard. What I found after playing Dark Souls was it was simply annoying – not difficult per say which took away from the experience. At least for me …..

Azreell – Mesmer
Loyalty To None

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Posted by: Azreell.1568

Azreell.1568

I raided many times in wow. Technically, you’re right. The pre hp nerf knights weren’t anywhere close to WoW raiding difficulty. They were much harder. Arenanet made the correct decision and nerfed them.

1) Right, conditions in pve are useless, and this event reinforces that fact. That is HORRIFIC design. Glad we agree.

2) I mean, isn’t it obvious? Super high condition immunity uptime, super high health, and super high toughness. How is the damage supposed to be dealt? It’s not and it wasn’t. One of those factors had to be toned down. Arenanet went with health.

4) Mesmer damage is designed around their phantasms doing damage more than once. If you played a mesmer in this event, you were doing subpar dps. All of your phantasms got reset the second she jumped, or much sooner if you used anything but the duelist phantasm, which is one of the lower dps phantasms unless you trait specifically for it, which is a waste on the rest (yes, I’m talking about buggy as kitten phantasmal haste).

5) I’m highly skeptical of this. I’m guessing you moved out of melee range for at least part of the fight which is not melee’ing the boss. It’s partial melee, which is still less dps than actual melee, which is my entire point.

Pre Nerf Knights were even easier but obviously we differ on what we see as difficult. I raided in Eq1 and Wow for quite a bit of time(years) and GW2 has yet to even come close to a LFR difficulty in anything they have released let alone normal raid difficulty.

1)Until they remove the 25 cap on conditions they will always be sub par. That would be the initial step with more required. But, After a year I don’t forsee anything being done to them int he near future. So, Yes we agree.

2)It’s a dps check. You stated you had difficulty doing melee in the fight. Where I do not nor do a lot of people I know. Ranged by nature in this game is a SUBSTANTIAL dps loss vs melee. So there is your problem. Pretty obvious tbh. While I don’t agree with the discrepancy between melee and ranged – that is a completely different debate.

4)You obviously realize that there are different mesmer specs. Also, Part of the knowledge of a class is knowing when one spec doesn’t work properly due to how an encounter is designed. While your phantasm mesmer may be the go to higher dps spec out of this encounter during it – it is sub par for the reasons you yourself listed. Also, If you weren’t using a sword and in melee you were doing 2x;’s less dps then you could have. I assume you were using ranged weapons by your comments. So overall between your lack of knowledge to change specs or at least illusion/phantasm make-up you were not preforming anywhere near were you could have.

5)Movement is required of all classes in this event obviously. But, the majority of my dmg is melee not ranged which is where we differ.

Both pre and post Knights are laughably easy.

Azreell – Mesmer
Loyalty To None

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Posted by: wolfpaq.7354

wolfpaq.7354

I am surprised you consider LFR to be “hard” seeing as how everything in GW2 comes so easily to you. In less than 1 week I had a character tanking the “hardest” LFR instance in the game – successfully. When people have clearly defined roles, and there are only 25 of them, it is just so much easier to coordinate things. Post zerg, pre nerf knights were substantially more difficult.

Also, so your expectation that people go grind out a new set of gear, and change specs for 1 temporary 2 week encounter is mindboggling. Maybe if it didn’t take 3 months to grind a full set of gear, you’d have a point, but it does so you don’t. True, it could be done much faster with exotics, but it is still a significant investment for something that is very temporary. The bottom line is ArenaNet needed to make the event work for all classes and specs. They didn’t, and so they adjusted it. If the event was laughably easy, it wouldn’t have been nerfed.

>5)Movement is required of all classes in this event obviously

The obvious difference is that ranged can continue dps while moving outside of melee range. Thanks for clarifying that you didn’t actually melee the bosses, I expected as much.

(edited by wolfpaq.7354)

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Posted by: Shockwave.1230

Shockwave.1230

As far as food goes, it’d be nice if ANet introduced a togglable feature that while in dungoens if you had no nourishment buffs, you would automatically consume whatever potion in your inventory that matched the type of enemies you get into combat with.

Sylvari Elementalist – Mystree Duskbloom (Lv 80)
Norn Guardian – Aurora Lustyr (Lv 80)
Mia A Shadows Glow – Human Thief (Lv 80)

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Posted by: kgptzac.8419

kgptzac.8419

It’s pretty funny that people are still not getting use to this.

4 letters: HTFU. People who refuse to get better are part of the intended demographics of this game, like you and I and a wide range of players.

a shard of crystal in the desert.

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Posted by: Mad Queen Malafide.7512

Mad Queen Malafide.7512

I think what more people should try to understand is that it is not a crime to be bad at a boss. Not even after doing the Marionette for a week straight. It’s not lazy if you are bad, nor is it your fault. It’s just unfortunate. I don’t blame other players when they die at a boss, especially one that is temporary. Some people need more time to become familiar with a fight.

“Madness is just another way to view reality”
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-On3Ya0_4Y)

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Posted by: Ravenmoon.5318

Ravenmoon.5318

I think what more people should try to understand is that it is not a crime to be bad at a boss. Not even after doing the Marionette for a week straight. It’s not lazy if you are bad, nor is it your fault. It’s just unfortunate. I don’t blame other players when they die at a boss, especially one that is temporary. Some people need more time to become familiar with a fight.

Give that man a freaking gold medal. Common sense at its finest….

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Posted by: Nabuko Darayon.9645

Nabuko Darayon.9645

I love the ideas what OP suggested and I can see this being added as a mandatory Personal Story instance. Reached lvl 60.. here, you need to successfully dodge and evade this boss for (10?) times before you weaken him enough to do damage, ect…

I think it became clear to everyone how much general players lack skill, and I’m not talking about newbies (They’re forgiven, I’m talking about people who play this game for a while now and are to lazy to do anything but go afk while auto-attacking).

Instead of spending 10 hours AFKING in Gendarrian Field/LA go join a hot spot and other PvPers will make you learn your skills faster.
I remember when I got a new Mouse and Keyboard and played with Elementalist and my mouse had like 12 buttons. I was a newb there but it didn’t stop me to master it. Once your BRAIN learns the mechanics later it becomes easier, but it takes time. For some a short time, for others longer time…

Also, take your time and read up on your Skills, see what they do. Read up on TRAIT, on UTILITY, see/learn what they do… At least do this for your main character…

~ King Arian and Isabella of [EG] ~

(edited by Nabuko Darayon.9645)

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Posted by: wolfpaq.7354

wolfpaq.7354

There was just one more thing I wanted to say about difficulty before I bow out of this thread. Dodging the orange circles, standing in the knight specific circles to get attuned, yeah that’s all easy. “advanced” users sure can dart in and out of melee range for a mediocre dps increase (I still think my sb / p/p thief did more damage than any of your characters, I’ve lost track of how many “dungeon masters” I’ve seen laying at the feet of these knights).

But the part you’re seriously missing as you’re zooming in on the micro is the overall picture. You absolutely have to have x number of people to succeed. And that x is probably closer to 80/90 people. It can literally be impossible to get that x number. That is part of event difficulty! If you’re on a low pop server or get dumped into a low pop overflow, you’re kittened – there is absolutely nothing you can do about it. All your “pro” melee damage won’t amount to squat.

Or even worse, and this is the part I’ve experienced, it can be possible to have wayyy more than x people and still fail, if people don’t distribute properly. And thanks to the Anet removal of all the knight HP bars, there’s no good way to tell which knight is falling behind. Usually there’s at least one vocal person at each of the knights saying “hey, we have 15/20/30 spots left” and then you can sort of respond. But coordinating 80+ people is a nightmare, and moving your small party from one knight to another may not even be enough to fix the problem.

Logistics, coordination, these are important aspects of group play, and as your group size approaches triple digits with no real chain of command or structure or penalty for failure, those logistics turn into a nightmare. Compounded with the micro design flaws I pointed out in my original post, this was an absolutely necessary nerf, that has nothing to do with a noob bubble as the OP of this thread is insinuating.

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Posted by: linuxotaku.4731

linuxotaku.4731

It has been shown that the human IQ has slowly been lowering since the Victorian age.

No. Just no. Bad statement. Insults a whole bunch of physicists, engineers, researchers, etc. Also glorifies the poor class in Victorian Era that weren’t even allowed education.

The statement was simply that, a statement. There have been several studies into the matter. Does it mean that there aren’t still smart people? Not at all. However, Einstein and his ilk were rarities, not the rule. Today, really smart people are still rarities, and seem to becoming more so due to the general nature of society (general loss or lack of common sense, loss of basic virtues, etc). It was not intended as an insult to those that are smart, nor was it ‘glorifying’ anything. It was simply a statement regarding the general population.

Saying that this is established is simply not true.

I see one study — it is hardly conclusive: http://lezgetreal.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/were-the-victorians-smarter-than-us.pdf

Have you read that study, or just popular reporting of it? Even the later makes it clear that their methodology was to use only a single measure — reaction time. There is a correlation between that and general intelligence in a fixed population (comparing individuals with a similar background), but that’s different from saying that it can be used to compare unrelated populations. In general, people become more skilled at tasks they do often; it’s entirely plausible that cognitive tasks in the Victorian age were different from those today.

The Flynn effect is based on a shorter (still long — from the 1930s) timeframe — but it uses much more complete measures of intelligence. It’s well documented: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flynn_effect

The article about the Victorians mentions the Flynn effect, and then attempts to excuse the failure of other facts to support their theory of dysgenic IQ effects by finding a single measure which does support their theory … this is only going to convince someone who wants to find dysgenic effects.

(I’m perfectly willing to believe in the possibility of dysgenic effects … but unconvinced by this study.)

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Posted by: Rangersix.1754

Rangersix.1754

I think what more people should try to understand is that it is not a crime to be bad at a boss. Not even after doing the Marionette for a week straight. It’s not lazy if you are bad, nor is it your fault. It’s just unfortunate. I don’t blame other players when they die at a boss, especially one that is temporary. Some people need more time to become familiar with a fight.

Whoa, whoa, whoa, let’s take a step back here for a second. I don’t care how you play the game for most of the time, since I personally seek out like minded people that suit my playstyle. However, this does not in any shape or form apply for the marionette. It was a fight where you were unable to determine the group composition and a champion was required to be killed within a short time limit, a DPS check in other words.

Due to the random nature of group compositions, it was very possible (and happened from time to time) that only full cleric/staff guardians (or similar builds) were in a single platform. This caused the entire chain to fail for everyone. If you refused to adapt to the strict requirements in that fight, then you were putting your own selfish needs in front of everyone else’s and actively sabotaging and undermining the game for all other players out there. Simply because you chose to make it possible for a full non-damage oriented platform to happen.

Talk about dungeons, WvW, zerging, etc… and “do what you want” as much as you like for all I care. But not the marionette fight, because you are 100% wrong in putting those two together.

(edited by Rangersix.1754)

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Posted by: Mad Queen Malafide.7512

Mad Queen Malafide.7512

Due to the random nature of group compositions, it was very possible (and happened from time to time) that only full cleric/staff guardians (or similar builds) were in a single platform. This caused the entire chain to fail for everyone. If you refused to adapt to the strict requirements in that fight, then you were putting your own selfish needs in front of everyone else’s and actively sabotaging and undermining the game for all other players out there. Simply because you chose to make it possible for a full non-damage oriented platform to happen.

It’s only sabotage if you are actively seeking to fail it for other players. But most players were simply playing the game with the build they felt most comfortable with. That is not a crime. If this causes the entire event to fail for everyone, then the game is at fault, not it’s players.

Besides, how can anyone in their right mind claim that someone bringing a support build to a boss battle is being selfish?

“Madness is just another way to view reality”
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-On3Ya0_4Y)

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Posted by: Rangersix.1754

Rangersix.1754

Because you had no control over what group you’d end up with. You chose to roll the dice and accept the possible outcome of a group composition where no one was a damage dealer in a fight that, by design, did not support that outcome and would adversely affect all other players.

You are free to criticize the fight for it, but do not ignore the eventual reality of it.

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Posted by: voidwater.2064

voidwater.2064

GW2 with it’s current combat system and fight mechanics has attracted probably the least skilled players I have ever come across in ALL mmorpgs I have ever played.

Keep in mind – While not trying to give away my age , I have been playing these type of games since Merridian 59, EQ1, Uo and the sort.

A key note as to why this game attracted the player base it did is simple:

1)No resource management system – Aka smash buttons till you win with no recourse in terms of bad rotation.

2)AI – GW2 has the worst PvE AI I have ever seen. Stacking in a corner and dpsin everything down is used far to often and pretty much does but make it easy enough for monkeys to do most dungeon content.

3)Lack Of A Trinity – The games biggest selling point and most problematic ideal. When you base a game off 1 aspect with absolutely no depth and everything is a one dimensional dps race – it tends to attract players who are not looking for any diversity or challenge.

4)Zerker Meta – This ties in with the above statement. In this game the best strategy for 99.9% off all content is to kill it as fast as possible before it kills you. Look at the new LS update – It was nothing more then a DPS race also. There is little to no option for any type of play beyond dps as hard as fast as possible.

The game as a whole lacks depth and all PvE in this game is as basic and rudimentary in terms of mechanics as you can get. So it would of course attract a ton of low skilled players to it.

Let me give you an alternate vision for “challenge”, where only #2 is a true flaw in the game:

I am indifferent to rotations, resource management, trinities, team roles. I like twitchy action gameplay. FPS, fighting games, action games, danmaku. I value lightning reflexes and precision far more than fulfilling team roles. I have a heavy bias towards offense. Glass cannons, dodging artfully, taking no damage at all, are beautiful. Tanking and healing are ugly. This doesn’t preclude complex mechanics beyond “do damage to the boss”, but the idea is that survival should depend almost entirely on the individual’s reflexes and ability, not on stats or teammates. It should not be possible for someone to keep taking hits and survive, no tanking allowed.

My ideal is a bunch of individuals, playing essentially a very twitchy fighting/action game, with RPG-style stats and equipment, not a traditional rotation/trinity RPG.

So, from this perspective, I think 1 and 3 are irrelevant. And for point 1, there are still skill cooldowns in the game, you can’t go into PvP and expect to win by randomly mashing buttons.

4 is a feature, if you can get away with max DPS in action games, more power to you, you deserve it.

The core problem is #2, the AI and PvE combat in the game is generally too simplistic and easy.

For a recent example of action RPG gameplay that I liked, if you’ve played a glass cannon Demon Hunter in Diablo 3 while not being overgeared, that’s something I had quite a bit of fun with.

(edited by voidwater.2064)

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Posted by: Algreg.3629

Algreg.3629

Why the hell all you "pro"’s and “elitists” and stuck up kittenbags don’t make constant parties with the likes of you, and leave people to enjoy the game the way they want to? After all they payed the same price to play it. Stop being such an ignorant people and respect people’s opinion regardless of how stupid they may seem to you.

If you review my post history you’ll notice that I made a thread about “What happened with party play?” and quite frankly that’s the only thing that Gw2 is missing. You can’t possibly organize 100+ people with different mindsets to do the same thing

It’s much better to make party play, “force” people to party with other like-minded people that they like to play and finish this bloody conversations.

Yes … your pixels are better than mine….so freaking what? Get real…

because we are forced into content with you. And I doubt I am in the upper 40 percent skillwise – and it still is frustrating.

(edited by Algreg.3629)

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Posted by: Kumu Honua.2751

Kumu Honua.2751

I think what more people should try to understand is that it is not a crime to be bad at a boss. Not even after doing the Marionette for a week straight. It’s not lazy if you are bad, nor is it your fault. It’s just unfortunate. I don’t blame other players when they die at a boss, especially one that is temporary. Some people need more time to become familiar with a fight.

No it’s not a crime to be bad at a boss. Failure happens. The issue is consistent failure without learning and without improving. The issue is that Guild Wars does not teach basic mechanics and instead reinforces poor habits. The issue is that any lump on a log failure of a player is rewarded the exact same amount as the perfect execution of an elite player.

How much time do these people require to become even slightly competent at the most basic of boss mechanics?

Sylvari Guardian. – Dragonbrand.

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Posted by: Mad Queen Malafide.7512

Mad Queen Malafide.7512

How much time do these people require to become even slightly competent at the most basic of boss mechanics?

As long as it takes. And there’s nothing wrong with that.

Because you had no control over what group you’d end up with. You chose to roll the dice and accept the possible outcome of a group composition where no one was a damage dealer in a fight that, by design, did not support that outcome and would adversely affect all other players.

You are free to criticize the fight for it, but do not ignore the eventual reality of it.

The reality is that the fight itself is 100% to blame. Yes, you did not have any control over who you ended up with on a platform. Maybe you ended up with some amazing DPS’ers, and killed the warden on your platform in seconds. Or maybe you were stuck with an unbalanced assortment of support builds, that lacked enough damage. Or maybe some people on your platform were inexperienced, and died instantly…. or even more common, some were experienced, but got hit due to an unforeseen charge or knockback attack by the Warden, knocking them straight into a bomb, and killing them instantly. I’ve had that happen to me, and it’s unfortunate when it happens.

That does not make these players lazy.

“Madness is just another way to view reality”
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-On3Ya0_4Y)

(edited by Mad Queen Malafide.7512)

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Posted by: Lydell.8713

Lydell.8713

This thread is about as horrible as American Democrats and Republicans arguing over social policies.

Actually it might even be worse.

-Blackgate-

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Posted by: Heraldusluminare.2946

Heraldusluminare.2946

Firstly, I can’t help but wonder if some of the difficulty in reading instructions is caused because not everyone’s first language is English.

Secondly, I think a tutorial would only be useful to a certain extent. Learning how to rally yourself, cast a healing spell and whacking a foe to bits are really the only combat basics you can teach a player.

For example, stacking to defeat a boss is a player-made strategy – something ANet didn’t originally plan for. The original players to discover the method probably found out that standing close to each other meant group members would receive buffs, and being in close proximity meant easy reviving.

Zerging is another strategy, probably unintended by ANet, that players came up with to provide strength in numbers. Ressing at a waypoint instead of lying about waiting for others is another strategy.

The beauty of such human creativity is that players will find ways to exploit a situation no matter what battle tactic ANet employs (for a good idea, see the neverending battle between law and crime). In that same vein, in would be nearly impossible for ANet to teach players the myriad tactics it takes to successfully defeat the different kinds of foes in the open world, and in fact, helps players develop their own cunning.

I think players should be versatile and smart enough (given enough time) to learn that not every red circle in the game represents a threat or a boon.

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Posted by: SkylightMoon.1980

SkylightMoon.1980

This thread sure did do a good job of validating the previous one. Oh, the irony…

People who are better than noobs are not elitists. They are simply better. Some better players would like for noobs to join the ranks of good players. Some don’t care and would rather see you leave their game space.

THAT is the difference between the threads. Your post only validates this one more…

No hes pointing out that the OP pretty much proved he’s an elitists at the point where he suggested Anet force players learn to play the game in a certain way, and punish them if they didn’t. I think we should probably go the next step and have Anet implement guides that lead you to a zerk build and take you through tutorials that show you have to use a FGS on a mob stuck in a corner. Sounds quite good actually.

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Posted by: Algreg.3629

Algreg.3629

This thread sure did do a good job of validating the previous one. Oh, the irony…

People who are better than noobs are not elitists. They are simply better. Some better players would like for noobs to join the ranks of good players. Some don’t care and would rather see you leave their game space.

THAT is the difference between the threads. Your post only validates this one more…

No hes pointing out that the OP pretty much proved he’s an elitists at the point where he suggested Anet force players learn to play the game in a certain way, and punish them if they didn’t. I think we should probably go the next step and have Anet implement guides that lead you to a zerk build and take you through tutorials that show you have to use a FGS on a mob stuck in a corner. Sounds quite good actually.

there is a wide range between stack behind pillar X and asking yourself if you are doing something wrong after being pulled in by a Legendary Knight the 20th time.

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Posted by: Azreell.1568

Azreell.1568

I am surprised you consider LFR to be “hard” seeing as how everything in GW2 comes so easily to you. In less than 1 week I had a character tanking the “hardest” LFR instance in the game – successfully. When people have clearly defined roles, and there are only 25 of them, it is just so much easier to coordinate things. Post zerg, pre nerf knights were substantially more difficult.

Also, so your expectation that people go grind out a new set of gear, and change specs for 1 temporary 2 week encounter is mindboggling. Maybe if it didn’t take 3 months to grind a full set of gear, you’d have a point, but it does so you don’t. True, it could be done much faster with exotics, but it is still a significant investment for something that is very temporary. The bottom line is ArenaNet needed to make the event work for all classes and specs. They didn’t, and so they adjusted it. If the event was laughably easy, it wouldn’t have been nerfed.

>5)Movement is required of all classes in this event obviously

The obvious difference is that ranged can continue dps while moving outside of melee range. Thanks for clarifying that you didn’t actually melee the bosses, I expected as much.

First off please quote ANYWHERE I said LFR was hard?

I used LFR as a reference point. That is all.

LFR is simple as well – Yet it has 10x’s the fight mechanics of anything that arena net has released to date.

Do you understand now what I was saying or do you need me to dumb it down even further?

Also, Your obvious inability to have gear required to do an event is no ones fault but your own. To play any class effectively you need options to play said class under all circumstances. This simple concept obviously evades you.

In terms of movement. Let me explain something as simple as possible so you understand it and perhaps this will help your melee. As a melee class you HAVE TO MOVE 10x’s as much as ranged. You have to be more aware of your surroundings, by moving that does not necessitate that you are not doing dps in a melee fashion , but you are trying to avoid things with active defense that will harm you.

The difference from ranged DPS in this game to melee is tremendous. The gap is so large it isn’t even worth trying to explain it to you as you seem to not understand simple game mechanics.

It sounds like to me you were trying to face tank everything while in melee without moving out of harmful effects. Which would explain why you had difficulty in melee range which also is a common novice mistake.

Between Aegis , Protection, dodging and Evades( which you have access to tons of between sword and f4)your survivability as melee is very good and your dps as melee will far out weighs the small up time advantage ranged might have.

It’s very obvious you have no understanding of the mesmer class let alone any type of raiding or content mechanics.

There is no point in further debating this with you as it’s basically boiled down to a battle of the wits and you have come unarmed.

Azreell – Mesmer
Loyalty To None

(edited by Azreell.1568)

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Posted by: Sylv.5324

Sylv.5324

I have lost count on how many times I have seen Mesmers facehugging a boss twanging away on GS 1-

I will sometimes do this if all of my sword skills are on cooldown (especially with a boss whose cc slows down skill recharge) and I swap to GS to drop an iZerker; other mesmers do as well. I’m not going to bother to charge out of melee range when I’ll be using my sword again in a few seconds. Considering there aren’t that many mesmers (we’re one of the least-played classes) at level 80, you can’t see this THAT often.

Many of us also don’t bother to swap to sword if we’re just killing single trash, even if they close into melee range, since a few pewpews and a shatter is enough.

Ardeth, Sylvari Mesmer
Tarnished Coast

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Posted by: risa.1382

risa.1382

It’s not very complicated. If you want people to learn how to play then make the focus for new content solo and group. Nobody is going to learn how to play when they have 150 other people to carry them.

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Posted by: cranos.5913

cranos.5913

It’s not very complicated. If you want people to learn how to play then make the focus for new content solo and group. Nobody is going to learn how to play when they have 150 other people to carry them.

This is was it boils down to. The only way for people to learn is to force feed them content harder than zerging. Problem then is you get so much qq as seen with the marionnette which was still incredibly easy and since casuals are the biggest income of Anet you won’t see this happen.

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Posted by: guardian.6489

guardian.6489

Also, spoon-feed players by having NPCs shout out instructions on how to defeat bosses:

[Assault Knights appear]
Rox: “Looks like Scarlet’s getting annoyed. Don’t forget to use your Scarlet’s Army Slaying Potion if you have any.”

[Assault Knight takes a flying leap]
Majory: “The Assault Knight is going to pull you in, dodge, now!”

[Assault Knights throw up their defensive shields]
Heal-o-Tron: Enemy-unit-has-engaged-shields. Suggest-cessation-of-condition-based-skills.

Better if said warnings appear as large flashing text in front of their screens consisting of no more than two words and an exclamation “Drink Potion!”, “Dodge Now!”, “No Conditions!”

Because players are becoming too impatient (and possibly lazy) to read a long string of text on their right.

Hmm I’m getting flashbacks I could have sworn they’ve done this before…..

“Avoid the shockwave!”

“Tendrils, fall back and attack at range!”

“Watch the Tendrils or you’ll get poisoned”

“STAY AWAY FROM THE WHIRLPOOL!”

“Stay clear of his feet!”

Ya they did that during the Tequatl fight but people still struggled :P

Retired Leader of TTS

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Posted by: Dalanor.5387

Dalanor.5387

>yesterday, lvl49 fractal
>lfg, port in, Bloomhunger waiting for being killed
>full signet warr, oh boy, i have a bad feeling
>okay lets start, no banners, how surprising
>woosh woosh, what the hell?, other guardian started staff camping
>suddenly a chaos storm lands from the mesmer and start GS camping
>bleeds skyrockets on boss
>“ele, are you zerker?”
>links ascended dire set
>leave party

And i have similar experiences this week. I’m not a pro player, decent at best, but it’s frustrating that even at lvl49 i see these type of players. Bah …
———————————————————————————-

on topic:
First wheb you start to fight against the Knights there are HUGE aoe circles. The pull aoe is as big as the grand plaza cmon and people still can’t grasp the situation that they should dodge it? It’s okay if they are colorblind or something, but seriously? And the boss has a unique buff, it takes literally less than 5 seconds to realize you should apply conditions to it. Same at the burst phase.
Also, its just a personal opininon, i find it not only selfish but offensive and disrespectfull against other players if you play a MMO if you can’t even understand the language it was writen. Maybe i should try an eastern game to understand why it could be good.
I hope they implement the new tutorial in the very first instance after you create your character and stop with hints inpop up windows. They are annoying.

edit: tried now to melee Red Knight in zerker gear with a warrior. It even hits behind itself. Oo What did i wrong? Max melee didnt worked me neither.

(edited by Dalanor.5387)

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Posted by: Mad Queen Malafide.7512

Mad Queen Malafide.7512

First wheb you start to fight against the Knights there are HUGE aoe circles. The pull aoe is as big as the grand plaza cmon and people still can’t grasp the situation that they should dodge it? It’s okay if they are colorblind or something, but seriously?

People get hit by it, because they dodge it. They’ve been conditioned by the game to dodge when a red circle appears. But when the knights do their pull attack, you must actually wait and dodge after the circle has disappeared. With all the lag and visibility issues, is it really surprising that a lot of players are struggling to understand the timing of this attack? It’s inconsistent design.

And the boss has a unique buff, it takes literally less than 5 seconds to realize you should apply conditions to it.

Or not apply conditions to it, which changes several times during the fight, and is indicated by a very small icon underneath it’s health bar. -The description of which I might add, is really hard to read, because it jumps all over the place as new buffs appear.

Also, its just a personal opininon, i find it not only selfish but offensive and disrespectfull against other players if you play a MMO if you can’t even understand the language it was writen. Maybe i should try an eastern game to understand why it could be good.

So players aren’t allowed to pick up GW2 as their first MMO? Which game should they start with then?

edit: tried now to melee Red Knight in zerker gear with a warrior. It even hits behind itself. Oo What did i wrong? Max melee didnt worked me neither.

The knights, like many bosses (Scarlet’s Hologram included) have a range that extends far beyond what they are visibly hitting, if you can see their animations at all that is. That is part of the frustration for many people I think.

“Madness is just another way to view reality”
(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-On3Ya0_4Y)

How Can ANet Improve Average Player Skills

in Guild Wars 2 Discussion

Posted by: Dalanor.5387

Dalanor.5387

1. Agree, but its a trial and error issue. You dodge, you fail, you realize that it pulls after the circle appears on the ground and it fly into the air. You are able to do it second time. The boss is big enough to see this animation even when there are a lots of effects. And Aurora Glade isn’t that populated anyway.

2. My bad, i meant to not apply conditions to it, but still it’s easy to read. Can be made more easier, like with a second bar for unique conditions or force these buffs / debuffs to the beginning of the condition bar.

3. They are allowed if they are older than 12 year (not if anyone cares about this tbh), but i can’t understand whats the point in this. The game is even translated in multiple languages like german, french and spanish. If you can’t speak neither of them, why on earth you play? (im not speaking personally to you)

4. Yep, thats why i tried the max melee range, but while i didn’t get hit i couldn’t see any damage floater. You know, camera issues and stuff. Hmm, maybe i should watch the combat log. Oh well, next time.
And again, the boss is big enough that you can see his swinging, even if its covered in blue / orange flames and Sigil of Fire proc tries to blind you. There is still an option to reduce graphic setting that its less frustrating and it can give some performance boost too which is needed to the well timed dodges.

(edited by Dalanor.5387)