Guild Wars 2

Kuldebar.1897:

No, Ascended will remain acquirable via narrowly proscribed ways. If ANet does open up on the acquisition it will because they know they screwed the pooch and will need to backpedal.

Well, they promised Ascended gear would come via a variety of ways. However, they also promised no gear progression, so you may well be right. Unfortunately, there are two groups of players who want BIS gear. One group wants the content gated to limit who can get it, the other wants it available via more means, so that it can be obtained by doing what they find fun. GW2 was supposed to cater to the latter group.

As for using the term locusts… well, the gear grinders race through gearing-up content as fast as possible, mostly ignoring all other content that does not feed them better drops. Once they’ve fed (gotten BIS), they look for more new content and better gear so they can continue to race to get it. That behavior sure reminds me of locusts.

Gele.2048:

i dont get the stupid people do u like to play teh same game whit the same gear for 10 years same statc no progres where is the fun in that i was gona leave gw if they didnt put progres and no its no grind the new dungeons iS FUN to do and there are BILIONS MORONS how does not know to play or got kittenkill to play and tehy cry

Wow, you are actually calling other people morons?

Read this whole thread and literally laughed out loud at Gele’s post. XD

MorceluLebeau.5109:

Guild Wars…not sure what to expect anymore..and after bringing several friends from WoW to Guild Wars…I am afraid I may have done them a disservice.

I know that feel bro. I convinced one of my friends and my girl friend who is not a big gamer to get in on GW2. Seemed like a good idea at the time, but feel bad about it now.

Gele is the type of player that gear grinds attract. Exhibit A of the type of crowd that loves the new patch. congrats!

Eveningstar.6940:

Guys, the OP isn’t exactly complaining about the game or recent changes, but expressing regret over the dramatic change in attitude in the General Forums over the last weekend.

He has a credible point. Whatever you might think about Ascended armor, the forums have been objectively nastier and more hostile lately, much more argumentative and far less constructive.

The OP is talking about how the forum community went from relatively civil to almost exclusively flooded with a front page of angry, baffled or hostile threads. Frankly I agree. It’s depressing.

Yes. One of the factors that drew me to GW2 was the community. It was refreshing after my experience on another companies site. The other was the manifesto. In one weekend both appear to be flushed down the toilet. I suppose the forum response was predictable, but I’d love to know more about the reversal on the manifesto. I’m not a conspiracy theorist and usually defer speculation until I have enough info. I would really like a non-PR recounting of the thought process that led to this.

Raine.1394:

I would really like a non-PR recounting of the thought process that led to this.

I can give you my best guess, but I don’t know how much that’s worth without solid evidence. The justification for Ascended armor is to bridge the reward gap between Exotic and Legendary—one is relatively easy to get; the other is going to take months.

I’m going to give them the benefit of the doubt and assume they’re telling the truth. That’s probably why they added Ascended in the first place. So why did they make Ascended armor one tier higher? This time I’m just deferring to Occam’s Razor; the simplest explanation is most probably the correct one, and to me the simplest explanation is this:

They just didn’t think it was a big deal to add another item tier—one they felt was missing from the game. They felt that a relatively small stat bump would deflect fears of introducing a gear grind, and just did not anticipate as large and angry a response as they got.

Of course this explanation assumes that the Manifesto was never a sacred document but more of a combination of vision and PR spin. ANet always intended to take the pragmatic route and design a game that’s supposed to be inclusive and fun for everyone, casual and hardcore alike. Therefore the inclusion of Ascended gear is actually consistent with the overall design of the game, but not the Manifesto.

In short: They honestly thought a tier was missing from the game. They honestly thought it wouldn’t be a big deal if they added a new one with a modest stat upgrade to bridge a rarity gap. They honestly thought Ascended gear is something that could benefit the game in the long run, which wouldn’t alienate casual players but would also appeal to hardcore players, which wouldn’t result in a grind but would create a sense of progression.

They just didn’t anticipate such a massive outcry. And now that it’s happening, there’s nothing they can say that won’t lead to yet -another- outcry because their credibility is shot.

The Manifesto is idealistic, but ANet is being pragmatic. They did what they did with perfectly good intentions, and did not anticipate the response they got.

No conspiracy theories. No Under New Management interpretations. No Nexon Overlords. This is my sincere and honest guess at what happened behind the scenes, just based on what little evidence and patterns I can discern.

(P.S: This is roughly more or less what happened with LOTRO and Radiance. The Devs wanted to be bold and honestly had good intentions with it. They tried hard to sell it despite outrage. It didn’t work. So there is precedence for this kind of thing.)

The tone has changed radically since the weekend and, as I see it, for the foreseeable future. Here’s my take, as generalizing and speculative as it may be:

The developers/public relations people presented Guild Wars 2 as a true alternative to what many acknowledged as a tired genre. And they were right, the genre is tired. Many disaffected players were looking for just this kind of game and embraced this one whole-heartedly. It was a relief, a refuge. And, as a rule, innovative products that work well have a tendency to create a particularly evangelical, deeply committed form of fan who will defend it to Earth’s end, warts and all (for reference, see: Apple) .

The flip side of this is obvious. Betrayal (real or imagined) of this group is an usually nasty business. Especially when it looks as though the people who bought into GW2’s well documented philosophy were scorned for the very people they’ve spent the past few weeks defending this game against. And, warranted or not in this case, betrayal is something that elicits a very strong response.

The real problem is not just the forums, although they are a real problem, but the very real chance this bitterness may begin to leak into the game itself affecting the majority who do not frequent forums. Again, a nasty, nasty business with relief nowhere in sight.

panzer.6034:

Read this whole thread and literally laughed out loud at Gele’s post. XD

I am laughing so hard now at the post I have tears in my eyes.

I know the post insulted me (a supporter of no gear stat progression). I just am not sure exactly what the insults were.

Eveningstar.6940:

Raine.1394:

I would really like a non-PR recounting of the thought process that led to this.

In short: They honestly thought a tier was missing from the game. They honestly thought it wouldn’t be a big deal if they added a new one with a modest stat upgrade to bridge a rarity gap. They honestly thought Ascended gear is something that could benefit the game in the long run, which wouldn’t alienate casual players but would also appeal to hardcore players, which wouldn’t result in a grind but would create a sense of progression.

They just didn’t anticipate such a massive outcry. And now that it’s happening, there’s nothing they can say that won’t lead to yet -another- outcry because their credibility is shot.

(P.S: This is roughly more or less what happened with LOTRO and Radiance. The Devs wanted to be bold and honestly had good intentions with it. They tried hard to sell it despite outrage. It didn’t work. So there is precedence for this kind of thing.)

You may be right.

But that means they also did not understand their core customer base and the reason people bought their product. They never advertised this game as similar to the WOW or gear stat progression model. In fact, their marketing even said if “you hate MMOs” give us a try.

This a major marketing blunder. So if they reversed it, it may retain what is left of the core customer base. It may also get that part of the base buying in the cash shop again. However, every day that they do not explain their change in direction ensures that the anger and negative talk about this will continue.

I offer up again – Bioware. Bioware’s PR nightmare should have been a marketing case study for every major gaming company. I see them repeating the same mistakes that Bioware’s marketing team made.

Arsenal.2601:

The tone has changed radically since the weekend and, as I see it, for the foreseeable future. Here’s my take, as generalizing and speculative as it may be:

The developers/public relations people presented Guild Wars 2 as a true alternative to what many acknowledged as a tired genre. And they were right, the genre is tired. Many disaffected players were looking for just this kind of game and embraced this one whole-heartedly. It was a relief, a refuge. And, as a rule, innovative products that work well have a tendency to create a particularly evangelical, deeply committed form of fan who will defend it to Earth’s end, warts and all (for reference, see: Apple) .

The flip side of this is obvious. Betrayal (real or imagined) of this group is an usually nasty business. Especially when it looks as though the people who bought into GW2’s well documented philosophy were scorned for the very people they’ve spent the past few weeks defending this game against. And, warranted or not in this case, betrayal is something that elicits a very strong response.

The real problem is not just the forums, although they are a real problem, but the very real chance this bitterness may begin to leak into the game itself affecting the majority who do not frequent forums. Again, a nasty, nasty business with relief nowhere in sight.

Agree and well said.

I have been trying to explain this in numerous posts but you have done it so much better.

Maz.8604:

Zynthetic.2954:

The TLDR of the past week is;

=>Vocal minority locusts QQ they have nothing to do, even though they probably haven’t done most of the content yet anyway.

=> Anet introduces the Ascended gear treadmill to shut them up.

=> Vocal majority, also the legit fans of the game go WTF?!?!

=> Legit fans explain in detail why it’s a bad idea, what’s wrong with it, and what they could have done instead of adding grind.

=> Apologists don’t understand the consequences, nor the other group’s viewpoint, and tell the legit fans to leave the game.

=> So the legit fans leave when Anet makes no attempt to respond to the PR disaster.

And now there’s a 50 / 50 chance this will go down as one of the biggest mistakes in the history of gaming. Well, I think anyway.

I can picture John Smedley going “Oh dear” in a stuttering Piglet fashion. Mind you, YEARS later, Smedley admits that the Star Wars Galaxies NGE was a bad idea and apologized. Damage was done, however. The game never recovered, and only the IP kept it alive.

…How strong do you think your IP is, Anet, compared to Star Wars?

We complain and make posts like these because we care about the game.

Learn from other’s mistakes, don’t repeat them.

Let me add to the list LotRO and radiance(agony). Interesting how ‘agony gating’ is giving so many of us agony.

Kuldebar.1897:

It’s a pattern that plays out far too often, their willingness to do this now with so little community involvement speaks volumes. I left Rift, a good game, but a game with gear progression. I came to GW2 because I knew upon reaching 80, I’d not be chasing gear, I could just play the game. Horizontal progression allowed a variety of ways to acquire the best gear in the game. Ascended gear will not.

But, for the sake of argument let’s say they do allow a variety of ways to acquire Ascended like exotics are now:

• Buy Ascended for Karma.

• Buy Ascended for Gold.

• Earn Ascended through Dungeon tokens in any of 8 different dungeons.

• Earn Ascended through WvW badges.

• Craft Ascended through mob drops / mining.

• Throw Exotics into Mystic Forge.

We would then be exactly where we were before ANet decided to add Ascended thus completely nullifying the entire purpose they sought to achieve.

No, Ascended will remain acquirable via narrowly proscribed ways. If ANet does open up on the acquisition it will because they know they screwed the pooch and will need to backpedal.

Before GW2 i played Rift. I highly enjoyed their major events, i am not a fan of dungeons and raids, however i did them in Rift to acquire gear. GW2 came and i didn’t have to chase it anymore and it became quite the relief .
With this new gear tier, i can just go back to Rift and continue where i left off. At least there i don’t have to be stressed out about what the economy is like today or tomorrow, and i can chase gear through repeating the same dungeon rotation for hundreds of hours to get a few +numbers.
Not to mention that all the money i spent on gems, would probably get me months of events done right, guild system that works, and a developer that fixes things much more quickly. The only thing i’d have to deal with is the clunky combat, which if i played it for a week i’d probably get right used to it.

After i hear the official response from Anet regarding this travesty of a weekend, i will make my move to either stay here, go to Rift, or just quit MMORPGs entirely and focus on SP games which i can play at my own pace without being shunned by some dude only because i am not FOTM LVL X

ckeeton.4907:

…because they added a new tier of gear. Yeah sure lol

Really? You think it’s only the new gear that’s the problem?

What about the event that received so much hype, which ended up being unplayable due to lag and dc’s, and most of the time enemies appeared out of nowhere, right on top of you.

How about ANet promoting the new zone for players to explore, meanwhile it appears to be dull, even when compared to Orr. The veterans drop no loot. The events rarely occur and often feel nonexistent. Plus, there isn’t even a single meta-event to drive players, something that every zone in the game has. Suncove just feels unfinished.

Or what about the FotM situation that’s causing some elitist behavior and is very successful at separating the playerbase from the content, something that no other dungeon does.
And on top of that there’s also the LA chat being bombarded with constant “LFG FotM level 6” or “LF2M FotM 5, no noobs pls”. LA is supposed to be a social hub and it’s being spammed because there’s no decent group finder in the works.

People’s reactions to the ascended gear are because they had no idea that anything like this was coming. Most of all this bombshell dropped on them three days before it was implemented. And say what you want, people are throwing ANet quotes all around of how they don’t want gear to become work, they want aesthetics to be the main drive of the game. So yeah, exotics are easy to get, which is why people thought more gear will be appearing for their looks, not for their stats.

So no, this is not just about a new tier. People feel that this attempt was lackluster, and overall they feel lied to and that they’re purposefully being kept in the dark. This is clearly not just about the new tier, this is ANet not telling people what they’re doing to the game, and now fans have grown afraid of what may come next.

dalendria.3762:

Eveningstar.6940:

Raine.1394:

I would really like a non-PR recounting of the thought process that led to this.

In short: They honestly thought a tier was missing from the game. They honestly thought it wouldn’t be a big deal if they added a new one with a modest stat upgrade to bridge a rarity gap. They honestly thought Ascended gear is something that could benefit the game in the long run, which wouldn’t alienate casual players but would also appeal to hardcore players, which wouldn’t result in a grind but would create a sense of progression.

They just didn’t anticipate such a massive outcry. And now that it’s happening, there’s nothing they can say that won’t lead to yet -another- outcry because their credibility is shot.

(P.S: This is roughly more or less what happened with LOTRO and Radiance. The Devs wanted to be bold and honestly had good intentions with it. They tried hard to sell it despite outrage. It didn’t work. So there is precedence for this kind of thing.)

You may be right.

But that means they also did not understand their core customer base and the reason people bought their product. They never advertised this game as similar to the WOW or gear stat progression model. In fact, their marketing even said if “you hate MMOs” give us a try.

I agree. The simplest explanation is that they’re being honest about why they implemented Ascended armor and that they really do think it’s a good idea for the game. But this explanation is predicated on a failure to anticipate the backlash owing to a failure to properly appreciate their demographic.

In other words, the simplest explanation also strongly suggests that, for them, the Manifesto is actually pretty flexible, more a combination of PR spin and genuine idealism. They probably just didn’t expect so many players to feel as strongly about the principle of “no more gear progression after Exotic.”

(Conversely, it’s arguable that they did anticipate the backlash but believed the trade-off worth it in the end. A calculated risk seems like a sinister motivation, and I’ll give them the benefit of the doubt on this.)

For my own curiosity, could you explain what you mean by Bioware’s PR nightmare? I regretfully admit ToR is probably the one major MMO title released in the last six years that I haven’t played at all, so I have no real experience here.

Ozbaab.5021:

I feel terrible for everyone who can’t seem to see any difference between GW2 and WoW, I really do. I mean what if I too were naive and blind?

You do realize that WOW was far from the first MMO, right? WOW took that aspect from much older MMO’s. Endgame gear progression is a staple in MMO’s. It works, some of us like it. Even battlefield and cod first person shooters have progression as it’s good for the games longevity.

Anet is smart to have gear progression, if not 80 would be a boring place.

Ozbaab.5021:

I feel terrible for everyone who can’t seem to see any difference between GW2 and WoW, I really do. I mean what if I too were naive and blind?

No there is a difference. GW2 isn’t quite WoW yet but give it time! It’s trying so hard!

what some fail to understand it isnt the introduction of new gear in the gear its that they put that gear accessible in only one area of the game ….. if after a month of grinding the dungeon and getting the gear they put the next set of gear in pvp and you for the most part only pve would you be upset ….. the main issue isnt there gear its that the gear is only accessible in one part of the game which according to anet all gear would be accessible to all players no matter their gaming prefrence

This thread illustrates the sum of my concerns as to the direction this game is apparently heading at. Once my main character reached lvl 80 and I completed his personal storyline I did kinda feel my momentum decreasing sharply so I was really looking forward to new content. A new tier of gear is not what I had in mind however.

Grinding fractals or any other dungeon/map for better gear or gold/tokens is not something I see myself doing so hopefully not getting ascended gear will not render my character noticeably weaker than full-ascended players in pve or WvWvW.

I really hope releasing a new tier every few months will not become a thing. I’d rather future expansions focus on stuff like adding new weapon types (greataxes, crossbows, chakrams whatever) or similar mechanics that will get me working on devising new strategies or builds again. Anything that would provide serious alternatives or challenges to my ranger’s shortbow/axe+warhorn build that has remained unchanged since the early weeks of the game and works 99.99999% of the time.

A new tier of gear that you have to grind for, who the hell wants to WORK in a GAME? They’re supposed to be fun, and Anet promised there’d be no grind, that everyone will be equal in gear & it would be easy to obtain max gear.

Sigh, if this gets any worse, I’m out. I really hope not though, since I spent $2000 bucks on a new PC to play this game since I LOVED GW1.

MorceluLebeau.5109:

… I would then come back to the GW2 forums, read the civilized and constructive posts and how everyone was for the most part happy with the game. It was great …

What forums were you reading? These ones have been full of the normal grumblefest all along.

I agree with the players who oppose power creep and the introduction of a gear grind, but they are simply the ones complining now – prior to the introduction of ascended gear, we had complaints from people demanding gear progression.

What do you expect?

A lot of people like myself purchased this game because some of it’s big selling points were things like no grind & no gear treadmill.

A couple months after release ANet is totally changing what they marketed the game as. Very deceiving and they should be called out for it.

Eveningstar.6940:

For my own curiosity, could you explain what you mean by Bioware’s PR nightmare? I regretfully admit ToR is probably the one major MMO title released in the last six years that I haven’t played at all, so I have no real experience here.

Bioware had a PR disaster earlier this year related to Mass Effect 3. I will not go into the details because I do not want to derail this discussion.

But here is how Bioware handled their situations. Some of this sounds similar to the current Arenanet GW2 situation.

1. Bioware did not deliver on its pre-release statements about its product.
2. People finished the game and then shared various feedback about this. Questioned what had happened to Bioware’s stated vision for the game. A vision they had been promoting for at least a year.
3. Bioware said nothing for at least a month. But the press attacked these people and basically said “shut up you entitled whiners.” Bioware never defended their customer base nor upheld what they had been saying for years (“we listen to our customers. it is your game as well as ours”).
4. Between Bioware’s continued silence and the attacks on the customers dissatisfied with the product, the whole thing became a firestorm.
5. People protested in various ways. Some creative (one guy sent them cupcakes which made fun of the crappy ending they made to the game). 80,000 people even donated to a charity to signify that they wanted Bioware to fix the ending (one of several major complaints with ME3).

After months of continued vocal customer dissatisfaction, Bioware finally agreed to fix the game by modifying the ending. They only focused on a partial fix though and never addressed some of the core issues – some of which began long before the end of the game. So only time will tell if the loyal customer base will buy their next game.

In the meantime, they have had a financial disappointment with SWTOR (EA’s words to its investors not mine), continued talk on the Net about the issues with ME3, 2 major layoffs of employees working on SWTOR and the resignation of the 2 founders of the company.

At this point, the Bioware brand is tainted and has a stink on it that may not go away anytime soon, if ever.

These forums have been haunted with negativity for weeks. “No end game”, “no progression”, “I hate orr”, “enemies too weak”, “dungeons too easy”, “boring combat”, “omgz not enough skills for me to have fun”, ..to which most of the people were told something like “haha this is our game, you can leave if you want”. I saw a post where a guy said “This is GW2, it should cater to Gw1 fans first” and that’s just silly…Anet is going to cater to whatever gives them money. If Gw1 fans could support a game this big, they would not have had to take on partners.

dalendria.3762:

Eveningstar.6940:

For my own curiosity, could you explain what you mean by Bioware’s PR nightmare? I regretfully admit ToR is probably the one major MMO title released in the last six years that I haven’t played at all, so I have no real experience here.

Bioware had a PR disaster earlier this year related to Mass Effect 3. I will not go into the details because I do not want to derail this discussion.

But here is how Arenanet and Bioware handled their situations.

1. Bioware did not deliver on its pre-release statements about its product.
2. People finished the game and then shared various feedback about this. Questioned what had happened to Bioware’s stated vision for the game. A vision they had been promoting for at least a year.
3. Bioware at first said nothing. But the press attacked these people and basically said “shut up you entitled whiners.” Bioware never defended their customer base nor upheld what they had been saying for years (“we listen to our customers. it is your game as well as ours”).
4. Between Bioware’s continued silence and the attacks on the customers dissatisfied with the product, the whole thing became a firestorm.
5. People protested in various ways. Some creative (one guy sent them cupcakes which made fun of the crappy ending they made to the game). 80,000 people even donated to a charity to signify that they wanted Bioware to fix the ending (one of several major complaints with ME3).

After months of continued vocal customer dissatisfaction, Bioware finally agreed to fix the game by modifying the ending. They only focused on a partial fix though and never addressed some of the core issues – some of which began long before the end of the game. So only time will tell if the loyal customer base will buy their next game.

Does any of the above sound similar to the Arenanet GW2 situation?

There is a fantastic video of a fan talking about bioware and what they have become Tasteful Understated Nerdrage on youtube.

IndigoSundown.5419:

One group wants the content gated to limit who can get it, the other wants it available via more means, so that it can be obtained by doing what they find fun. GW2 was supposed to cater to the latter group.

This comports with my understanding of the dichotomy that necessarily exists in every MMO. Every MMO has something fun about it. Whether it be interesting boss fights, or getting to play dress up with your avatar. To make sure you’re forced to sit and work to earn your fun, they’ve come up with some rules. So the way I see it, all MMOs have fun content on one end and rules on the other. Problem is finding the proper balance.

The ascended gear seems like new content with access mitigated by new rules. I think they mean for the new content to exist parallel to the game’s existing ecosystem. As I understand it, There’s a new stat only relevant to the new content, and that new stat is the only way in which the new gear is better. (that could be a misstatement, I haven’t kept up to speed on it.)

So there is new content, but the new rules that come with it are limited to that new content as I understand it. Comparing it to other exotics seems like apples and oranges. But I take the point that at least for now, until there are other paralel systems that dole out like-content elsewhere in the game, it does seem like a subset of players are getting what they wanted, and that it wasn’t what the bulk of players wanted.

But I think they’ve done enough to separate the two paralel content mechanisms in such a way that it gives on group what they want without hurting other groups. Seems like the typical maximin you go for in such balancing situations.

Anet seems smart enough to do this right, even if their first pass attempt falls short. So I think all the fuss is a little premature.

Im sorry to say but GW2 has become a "filler for me until ESO now

Pirhana.8935:

Im sorry to say but GW2 has become a "filler for me until ESO now

Indeed. I never planned to jump games, but the lasted forced dungeon death march sickens me.

Fatalbert.5476:

IndigoSundown.5419:

One group wants the content gated to limit who can get it, the other wants it available via more means, so that it can be obtained by doing what they find fun. GW2 was supposed to cater to the latter group.

This comports with my understanding of the dichotomy that necessarily exists in every MMO. Every MMO has something fun about it. Whether it be interesting boss fights, or getting to play dress up with your avatar. To make sure you’re forced to sit and work to earn your fun, they’ve come up with some rules. So the way I see it, all MMOs have fun content on one end and rules on the other. Problem is finding the proper balance.

The ascended gear seems like new content with access mitigated by new rules. I think they mean for the new content to exist parallel to the game’s existing ecosystem. As I understand it, There’s a new stat only relevant to the new content, and that new stat is the only way in which the new gear is better. (that could be a misstatement, I haven’t kept up to speed on it.)

So there is new content, but the new rules that come with it are limited to that new content as I understand it. Comparing it to other exotics seems like apples and oranges. But I take the point that at least for now, until there are other paralel systems that dole out like-content elsewhere in the game, it does seem like a subset of players are getting what they wanted, and that it wasn’t what the bulk of players wanted.

But I think they’ve done enough to separate the two paralel content mechanisms in such a way that it gives on group what they want without hurting other groups. Seems like the typical maximin you go for in such balancing situations.

Anet seems smart enough to do this right, even if their first pass attempt falls short. So I think all the fuss is a little premature.

Fwiw, an Ascended ring, in addition to the infusion slot, will have ~15 more stat points thsn sn exotic one, so they are not equal to exotics. Across the current three pieces, that’s ~45 stat points. Eventually, if those numbers remain consistent, across 6 armor, weapon (or 2) and 6 accessories, it will be over 200 points.

In the final analysis, that ~200 points might mean a little, or a lot. However, let’s say for the sake of argument that one subset of the player-base were to just get another 20 trait points. These points boosted stats but did not open up any of the 5/10 point talents. How would people in the group that did not get those points feel? Would the players who got them have an advantage in: getting credit in massive event DE’s, ease in getting around areas to farm; having an easier time in “normal” dungeons, and in Wv3? Probably.

Pirhana.8935:

Im sorry to say but GW2 has become a "filler for me until ESO now

I’m starting to feel the same way, but about Marvel Heroes.

If you think this is hostile, I’ve seen worse. The actual official D&D forums were pretty nasty for a time a couple years ago, and there was this one game where the atmosphere was just plain toxic to everyone involved. So bad the server owner decided “why do I keep sticking my hand in the burning?” and decided to start severing ties and stop paying for the hosting. And we’re not getting into on the other shoe how players of M:tG would react to every expansion or odd mechanic ever.

The thing that gets me? In the end this just feeds the corporate perception that we don’t want other games than WoW . . . after all, if the player base gets so violently in an uproar then why support GuildWars 2? It’d be better to go fund something else than what nearly the entire forum is saying is now a failure.

The review bombing, the rampant talk about how the game failed and there’s no trust for the company anymore . . . the venom and sarcasm heaped on what could be frank attempts to talk between working shifts?

Why would ANYONE continue to fund such a thing? Especially if it’s true and there is a downturn in activity and stock prices? We’re starting a self-fulfilling prophecy here, folks. If you repeat something long enough you start making it true.

Please make your voice heard. flood all online buying sites with comments and reviews. If you don’t like this patch, say so. If they don’t sell anything over the holidays, someone will get fired and the direction will change.

the game had changed from having 12 full servers at 3 am in the morning during weekday to 3 full servers at 11 pm on a tuesday night as we speak…. so ya…. pretty bad

Kaizer.7135:

A new tier of gear that you have to grind for, who the hell wants to WORK in a GAME? They’re supposed to be fun, and Anet promised there’d be no grind, that everyone will be equal in gear & it would be easy to obtain max gear.

Sigh, if this gets any worse, I’m out. I really hope not though, since I spent $2000 bucks on a new PC to play this game since I LOVED GW1.

You weren’t the only one. I even got 3d glasses with my new laptop and this game looks great in 3d.

This reminds me of how the diablo3 forum blew up when the players got to Inferno. Players hated it so much they would rather spend time on the forums than playing the game. Many players also started asking for refunds at the time also.

ckeeton.4907:

…because they added a new tier of gear. Yeah sure lol

LoTRo did the same thing with Radiance – it near wrecked the game. Don’t assume that a perceived small change cannot have huge consequences.

Kaizer.7135:

A new tier of gear that you have to grind for, who the hell wants to WORK in a GAME? They’re supposed to be fun, and Anet promised there’d be no grind, that everyone will be equal in gear & it would be easy to obtain max gear.

Sigh, if this gets any worse, I’m out. I really hope not though, since I spent $2000 bucks on a new PC to play this game since I LOVED GW1.

i dropped 2000 bucks on a new computer just for this game too…… then 200 bucks on the collector’s edition and 100 bucks during the halloween event…

then Anet pull this kitten on me… I was really hoping that this would be a different mmo from WoW, and that it would change the direction of the future mmos by showing people you DONT need to always increase the max item stats every 3 months…

then we have this…..

Columba.9730:

Please make your voice heard. flood all online buying sites with comments and reviews. If you don’t like this patch, say so. If they don’t sell anything over the holidays, someone will get fired and the direction will change.

. . . you know, if the game doesn’t sell, someone may get fired. (By the way, great choice, someone does deserve to lose their career because the Internet has decreed it so.) Or it could be taken as a much more severe problem with the forums busy saying the game is dying and the company is a bunch of lying liars who lie . . . and the game is axed completely.

I am not sure I like the odds here.

jojojoon.8607:

This reminds me of how the diablo3 forum blew up when the players got to Inferno. Players hated it so much they would rather spend time on the forums than playing the game. Many players also started asking for refunds at the time also.

This actually reminds me a lot of what happened with D3. Even though the game sold well, after the severe backlash Blizzard has been sprawling to get things right, and has made strides to achieve that goal.

Now I view ANet in much higher regard than I do Blizzard. So, I’m really eager to see how ANet reacts to everything that’s happened.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Columba.9730:

Please make your voice heard. flood all online buying sites with comments and reviews. If you don’t like this patch, say so. If they don’t sell anything over the holidays, someone will get fired and the direction will change.

. . . you know, if the game doesn’t sell, someone may get fired. (By the way, great choice, someone does deserve to lose their career because the Internet has decreed it so.) Or it could be taken as a much more severe problem with the forums busy saying the game is dying and the company is a bunch of lying liars who lie . . . and the game is axed completely.

I am not sure I like the odds here.

Going on sites that sell GW2 and leaving bad reviews isn’t going to make the situation better. I do not want GW2 to take this new path, but Tobias has a point. Just look at what is happening to Hostess… The protests have put Hostess out of business and we will have no more twinkies. =(

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

Columba.9730:

Please make your voice heard. flood all online buying sites with comments and reviews. If you don’t like this patch, say so. If they don’t sell anything over the holidays, someone will get fired and the direction will change.

. . . you know, if the game doesn’t sell, someone may get fired. (By the way, great choice, someone does deserve to lose their career because the Internet has decreed it so.) Or it could be taken as a much more severe problem with the forums busy saying the game is dying and the company is a bunch of lying liars who lie . . . and the game is axed completely.

I am not sure I like the odds here.

I do. most games aren’t retired…and if they are too thick headed to listen, then perhaps the game should be closed.

carson yuen.6739:

Kaizer.7135:

A new tier of gear that you have to grind for, who the hell wants to WORK in a GAME? They’re supposed to be fun, and Anet promised there’d be no grind, that everyone will be equal in gear & it would be easy to obtain max gear.

Sigh, if this gets any worse, I’m out. I really hope not though, since I spent $2000 bucks on a new PC to play this game since I LOVED GW1.

i dropped 2000 bucks on a new computer just for this game too…… then 200 bucks on the collector’s edition and 100 bucks during the halloween event…

then Anet pull this kitten on me… I was really hoping that this would be a different mmo from WoW, and that it would change the direction of the future mmos by showing people you DONT need to always increase the max item stats every 3 months…

then we have this…..

LOL. Sorry to hear that. I was planning to build a new pc for this game. thankfully, before I bought the components, I saw the announcement of this disaster. stopped me from wasting $1200.

Columba.9730:

Please make your voice heard. flood all online buying sites with comments and reviews. If you don’t like this patch, say so. If they don’t sell anything over the holidays, someone will get fired and the direction will change.

Totally agree. All those “leave a review form” are there for a reason.

Steely Phil.3952:

MorceluLebeau.5109:

Guild Wars…not sure what to expect anymore..and after bringing several friends from WoW to Guild Wars…I am afraid I may have done them a disservice.

I know that feel bro. I convinced one of my friends and my girl friend who is not a big gamer to get in on GW2. Seemed like a good idea at the time, but feel bad about it now.

It’s almost like I wrote that post.

On the plus side I managed to get her into AC too. As for the weekend, and the new tier of gear I kind of expected it. After the Halloween event it seemed painfully obvious the direction they were headed in.

Still wish we could get the team from GW1 back.

Columba.9730:

carson yuen.6739:

Kaizer.7135:

A new tier of gear that you have to grind for, who the hell wants to WORK in a GAME? They’re supposed to be fun, and Anet promised there’d be no grind, that everyone will be equal in gear & it would be easy to obtain max gear.

Sigh, if this gets any worse, I’m out. I really hope not though, since I spent $2000 bucks on a new PC to play this game since I LOVED GW1.

i dropped 2000 bucks on a new computer just for this game too…… then 200 bucks on the collector’s edition and 100 bucks during the halloween event…

then Anet pull this kitten on me… I was really hoping that this would be a different mmo from WoW, and that it would change the direction of the future mmos by showing people you DONT need to always increase the max item stats every 3 months…

then we have this…..

LOL. Sorry to hear that. I was planning to build a new pc for this game. thankfully, before I bought the components, I saw the announcement of this disaster. stopped me from wasting $1200.

well… i can still use my computer for other games…so it’s not a complete waste… althought the only games in the market that still holds my interests in the market right now are tf2 and lol since my investment in those 2 games won’t be diminish over time…

Heck.. I think my tf2 accounts has gears that could sell up to 500 bucks usd right now..

Zynthetic.2954:

The TLDR of the past week is;

=>Vocal minority locusts QQ they have nothing to do, even though they probably haven’t done most of the content yet anyway.

=> Anet introduces the Ascended gear treadmill to shut them up.

=> Vocal majority, also the legit fans of the game go WTF?!?!

=> Legit fans explain in detail why it’s a bad idea, what’s wrong with it, and what they could have done instead of adding grind.

=> Apologists don’t understand the consequences, nor the other group’s viewpoint, and tell the legit fans to leave the game.

=> So the legit fans leave when Anet makes no attempt to respond to the PR disaster.

And now there’s a 50 / 50 chance this will go down as one of the biggest mistakes in the history of gaming. Well, I think anyway.

Add to that the One Time Event wherein they gave out shinies and people who attended got to roll the dice, then some of them got extremely lucky by getting precursors, but most of the Oceanic and Asian players weren’t able to get the chance of rolling that dice because of timezone differences. xD

Everyone’s got their own opinions
There’s nothing they don’t know about
But in the end nobody’s winning
‘Cause nobody’s got it figured out~

Oh the things we think we know
But honestly we really don’t
Save the worry, stop the hate
It doesn’t matter anyway

Doo rooo~ Doo rooo~

Belteshazzar.6307:

Everyone’s got their own opinions
There’s nothing they don’t know about
But in the end nobody’s winning
‘Cause nobody’s got it figured out~

Oh the things we think we know
But honestly we really don’t
Save the worry, stop the hate
It doesn’t matter anyway

Doo rooo~ Doo rooo~

I agree that the community should stop the hate… erm more like complaining. Maybe expressing ourselves is just way over the top. Maybe GW2 fans should not spam the forums in an attempt to give Anet another chance. Maybe all of us complainers should just go ahead and ask for a refund and never look back at the game.

Columba.9730:

I do. most games aren’t retired…and if they are too thick headed to listen, then perhaps the game should be closed.

It’s not the developers you have to worry about, it’s the funding behind the developers. Investors can be very fickle these days. It won’t matter if they got the message, if all the negative buzz created scares off the funding. If you hit them in the wallet, the wallet makes the decision, not the head.

Loosifah.4739:

Also they have said multiple times that ascended will be available via other means(such as WvW and crafting). They just haven’t released it yet.

I very hope so, because I refuse to do that dungeon over and over and over and over nonstop in order to get to lvl 7-10…. there’re plenty of things to do to be stuck in this dungeon… it’s fun though, but doing it because I have to, to get something is simply not my type. I rather do it because it’s fun and not because I have to…