Guild Wars 2

Amere.9607:

mtpelion.4562:

Gear treadmills are not progression. They create the illusion of progression in order to keep you paying a subscription fee. There is a reason they are called “carrot on a stick” and that reason is not complimentary.

In GW2, progression is what you make of it. You set your own goals and then try to achieve them. If you don’t feel like you are progressing it is because you’ve not set progressive goals for yourself. If you are incapable of setting progressive goals, then by all means, return to a game that tricks you into handing them money for no reason.

how come visiting 100% vistas is a more “progressive” goal than earning a new gloves?

now, don’t get me wrong, i don’t want new item tiers. but the magic about them is that they bring new content along.

but why are you trying to say, how this game should be played to people with diffrent expectations?

I’m saying that if you don’t feel like you are progressing in GW2, the problem is YOUR expectations, not the game.

If you are incapable of fixing your broken expectations to match reality, then you should find a game where your expectations already match reality and are thus not broken.

It’s pretty simple. Not every game is designed to appeal to every player. Coming into a game that appeals to people and demanding that it be changed so that it appeals to you is an incredibly selfish, arrogant, and ignorant thing to do considering how many THOUSANDS of games already exist that meet your requirements.

Vayne.8563:

Godzzila.3752:

Vayne.8563:

That’s funny because people list Tier 5 servers in the LFG tool you were so disparaging about. And people pulled together and communicated in map chat. Happened a bunch of times. And we almost always get to Tier 4 when I play, even at off hours. Do you know why we get to tier 4.

Because there are people like me and my wife who do the events most others don’t do. So yes, there are people who don’t care and people who do. It’s always that way in games. It doesn’t change the game.

You could be one of the people who push the envelope or you could run around on the champ train. But in my map we have people calling out we have enough people at this event, no one else come and most people don’t. They go to the next event. That’s how you get to Tier 5. It’s organized content for big guilds and people who really want to organize.

And for people who don’t, they can go kill champs. That’s freedom for you.

Absolutly no one cares! Tier 5 is a joke with no rewardful feeling to it what so ever. I’m playing on a server that for the last few days has been hitting tier 4 over and over, note: NOBODY IS EVEN TRYING, we once in a while hit 5 but from 4 to 5 people rarely notice and since getting tier 5 requires way more work and doesn’t even reward you properly for that, people just dont try…
It’s just like the Crown Pavillion, after a while we just started to hit Gold over and over again we got more crates (which is better reward then it is right now in Dry Top) but even then the RNG just ruined it for most people

EDIT:
SkiTz actually made a better comparison then mine: Feels a lot like Orr, not Frostgorge, but it’s pretty much the same way of thinking

You lose all credibility when you say no one cares. Because I know a guild (it’s not mine) that contacted me just a couple of days ago, and said, hey’re we’re going for tier five, you guys want to come? So someone must care.

They came to a map with five, six commanders and they split up and we got tier 5 repeatedly. They care.

I’m making insect weapons. The difference between Tier 4 and 5 for the recipes is 50 geodes per recipe. I’ve made five weapons so far. I won’t even buy the recipes unless we get to tier 5 now. They’re too expensive otherwise.

Don’t say no one cares, because you don’t speak for everyone.

They speak for 70% of the people.
In fact the great majority of people in dry top is just there for farming events and anything else.

Amere.9607:

mtpelion.4562:

Gear treadmills are not progression. They create the illusion of progression in order to keep you paying a subscription fee. There is a reason they are called “carrot on a stick” and that reason is not complimentary.

In GW2, progression is what you make of it. You set your own goals and then try to achieve them. If you don’t feel like you are progressing it is because you’ve not set progressive goals for yourself. If you are incapable of setting progressive goals, then by all means, return to a game that tricks you into handing them money for no reason.

how come visiting 100% vistas is a more “progressive” goal than earning a new gloves?

now, don’t get me wrong, i don’t want new item tiers. but the magic about them is that they bring new content along.

but why are you trying to say, how this game should be played to people with diffrent expectations?

Gear grind doesn’t bring “new” content. All it does is give the developers an easy way out. They recycle old encounters, old mechanics, slap on a new paint scheme and up the numbers involved. More hp and more defense does not make for a “new” more interesting encounter.

I’m not against having more skins added to the game, just the addition of more stat tiers. I know some people enjoy the hunt for rare, elusive looks and I’m perfectly ok with that. As long as that rare exclusive look is limited to the cosmetic aspect.

Godzzila.3752:

Vayne.8563:

Godzzila.3752:

Vayne.8563:

That’s funny because people list Tier 5 servers in the LFG tool you were so disparaging about. And people pulled together and communicated in map chat. Happened a bunch of times. And we almost always get to Tier 4 when I play, even at off hours. Do you know why we get to tier 4.

Because there are people like me and my wife who do the events most others don’t do. So yes, there are people who don’t care and people who do. It’s always that way in games. It doesn’t change the game.

You could be one of the people who push the envelope or you could run around on the champ train. But in my map we have people calling out we have enough people at this event, no one else come and most people don’t. They go to the next event. That’s how you get to Tier 5. It’s organized content for big guilds and people who really want to organize.

And for people who don’t, they can go kill champs. That’s freedom for you.

Absolutly no one cares! Tier 5 is a joke with no rewardful feeling to it what so ever. I’m playing on a server that for the last few days has been hitting tier 4 over and over, note: NOBODY IS EVEN TRYING, we once in a while hit 5 but from 4 to 5 people rarely notice and since getting tier 5 requires way more work and doesn’t even reward you properly for that, people just dont try…
It’s just like the Crown Pavillion, after a while we just started to hit Gold over and over again we got more crates (which is better reward then it is right now in Dry Top) but even then the RNG just ruined it for most people

EDIT:
SkiTz actually made a better comparison then mine: Feels a lot like Orr, not Frostgorge, but it’s pretty much the same way of thinking

You lose all credibility when you say no one cares. Because I know a guild (it’s not mine) that contacted me just a couple of days ago, and said, hey’re we’re going for tier five, you guys want to come? So someone must care.

They came to a map with five, six commanders and they split up and we got tier 5 repeatedly. They care.

I’m making insect weapons. The difference between Tier 4 and 5 for the recipes is 50 geodes per recipe. I’ve made five weapons so far. I won’t even buy the recipes unless we get to tier 5 now. They’re too expensive otherwise.

Don’t say no one cares, because you don’t speak for everyone.

They speak for 70% of the people.
In fact the great majority of people in dry top is just there for farming events and anything else.

Yes, the majority of people have no clue what’s going on. That’s why communties have leaders and followers. And that’s okay.

I know what’s going on and I try to push tier 5. That’s how it was designed. It was designed so some people could push the envelope and if you didn’t push it you could still get rewarded.

That’s a good thing not a bad thing.

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Amere.9607:

mtpelion.4562:

Gear treadmills are not progression. They create the illusion of progression in order to keep you paying a subscription fee. There is a reason they are called “carrot on a stick” and that reason is not complimentary.

In GW2, progression is what you make of it. You set your own goals and then try to achieve them. If you don’t feel like you are progressing it is because you’ve not set progressive goals for yourself. If you are incapable of setting progressive goals, then by all means, return to a game that tricks you into handing them money for no reason.

how come visiting 100% vistas is a more “progressive” goal than earning a new gloves?

now, don’t get me wrong, i don’t want new item tiers. but the magic about them is that they bring new content along.

but why are you trying to say, how this game should be played to people with diffrent expectations?

Gear grind doesn’t bring “new” content. All it does is give the developers an easy way out. They recycle old encounters, old mechanics, slap on a new paint scheme and up the numbers involved. More hp and more defense does not make for a “new” more interesting encounter.

I’m not against having more skins added to the game, just the addition of more stat tiers. I know some people enjoy the hunt for rare, elusive looks and I’m perfectly ok with that. As long as that rare exclusive look is limited to the cosmetic aspect.

They don’t have gear grind but still they are doing everything you say they usually do:
Recyle Old Encounters: CHECK;
Recycle Old Mechanics: CHECK;

The only thing they are missing right now is slapping new paint scheme, but I honestly think that they shouldn’t be far away from that

Godzzila.3752:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Amere.9607:

mtpelion.4562:

Gear treadmills are not progression. They create the illusion of progression in order to keep you paying a subscription fee. There is a reason they are called “carrot on a stick” and that reason is not complimentary.

In GW2, progression is what you make of it. You set your own goals and then try to achieve them. If you don’t feel like you are progressing it is because you’ve not set progressive goals for yourself. If you are incapable of setting progressive goals, then by all means, return to a game that tricks you into handing them money for no reason.

how come visiting 100% vistas is a more “progressive” goal than earning a new gloves?

now, don’t get me wrong, i don’t want new item tiers. but the magic about them is that they bring new content along.

but why are you trying to say, how this game should be played to people with diffrent expectations?

Gear grind doesn’t bring “new” content. All it does is give the developers an easy way out. They recycle old encounters, old mechanics, slap on a new paint scheme and up the numbers involved. More hp and more defense does not make for a “new” more interesting encounter.

I’m not against having more skins added to the game, just the addition of more stat tiers. I know some people enjoy the hunt for rare, elusive looks and I’m perfectly ok with that. As long as that rare exclusive look is limited to the cosmetic aspect.

They don’t have gear grind but still they are doing everything you say they usually do:
Recyle Old Encounters: CHECK;
Recycle Old Mechanics: CHECK;

The only thing they are missing right now is slapping new paint scheme, but I honestly think that they shouldn’t be far away from that

As I’ve pointed out there is NEW content. You’re saying it’s recycled and I’ve pointed out to you differences. You choose to ignore those differences, saying they’re not different enough. Which is fine. but that’s not what you’re saying.

Anyone saying Dry Top is recycled is being disingenuous. It shows a distinct lack of respect for the amount of thought and energy that went into putting it together.

Vayne.8563:

Godzzila.3752:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Amere.9607:

mtpelion.4562:

Gear treadmills are not progression. They create the illusion of progression in order to keep you paying a subscription fee. There is a reason they are called “carrot on a stick” and that reason is not complimentary.

In GW2, progression is what you make of it. You set your own goals and then try to achieve them. If you don’t feel like you are progressing it is because you’ve not set progressive goals for yourself. If you are incapable of setting progressive goals, then by all means, return to a game that tricks you into handing them money for no reason.

how come visiting 100% vistas is a more “progressive” goal than earning a new gloves?

now, don’t get me wrong, i don’t want new item tiers. but the magic about them is that they bring new content along.

but why are you trying to say, how this game should be played to people with diffrent expectations?

Gear grind doesn’t bring “new” content. All it does is give the developers an easy way out. They recycle old encounters, old mechanics, slap on a new paint scheme and up the numbers involved. More hp and more defense does not make for a “new” more interesting encounter.

I’m not against having more skins added to the game, just the addition of more stat tiers. I know some people enjoy the hunt for rare, elusive looks and I’m perfectly ok with that. As long as that rare exclusive look is limited to the cosmetic aspect.

They don’t have gear grind but still they are doing everything you say they usually do:
Recyle Old Encounters: CHECK;
Recycle Old Mechanics: CHECK;

The only thing they are missing right now is slapping new paint scheme, but I honestly think that they shouldn’t be far away from that

As I’ve pointed out there is NEW content. You’re saying it’s recycled and I’ve pointed out to you differences. You choose to ignore those differences, saying they’re not different enough. Which is fine. but that’s not what you’re saying.

Anyone saying Dry Top is recycled is being disingenuous. It shows a distinct lack of respect for the amount of thought and energy that went into putting it together.

Dry Top it IS being recycled tho…
You have no new mechanics what so ever in any of the events, the events are diffrent but nevertheless the same. “Dodge this or you fall / die!” / “Clear this zone!” / “Hit this champion!”

What is so diffrent about every other event-based maps?

Oh and by the way, while I was here notice what just happen (attachment), nobody cares, they just farm whatever they want because the kittenty reward system rewards you for that…

Godzzila.3752:

Vayne.8563:

Godzzila.3752:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Amere.9607:

mtpelion.4562:

Gear treadmills are not progression. They create the illusion of progression in order to keep you paying a subscription fee. There is a reason they are called “carrot on a stick” and that reason is not complimentary.

In GW2, progression is what you make of it. You set your own goals and then try to achieve them. If you don’t feel like you are progressing it is because you’ve not set progressive goals for yourself. If you are incapable of setting progressive goals, then by all means, return to a game that tricks you into handing them money for no reason.

how come visiting 100% vistas is a more “progressive” goal than earning a new gloves?

now, don’t get me wrong, i don’t want new item tiers. but the magic about them is that they bring new content along.

but why are you trying to say, how this game should be played to people with diffrent expectations?

Gear grind doesn’t bring “new” content. All it does is give the developers an easy way out. They recycle old encounters, old mechanics, slap on a new paint scheme and up the numbers involved. More hp and more defense does not make for a “new” more interesting encounter.

I’m not against having more skins added to the game, just the addition of more stat tiers. I know some people enjoy the hunt for rare, elusive looks and I’m perfectly ok with that. As long as that rare exclusive look is limited to the cosmetic aspect.

They don’t have gear grind but still they are doing everything you say they usually do:
Recyle Old Encounters: CHECK;
Recycle Old Mechanics: CHECK;

The only thing they are missing right now is slapping new paint scheme, but I honestly think that they shouldn’t be far away from that

As I’ve pointed out there is NEW content. You’re saying it’s recycled and I’ve pointed out to you differences. You choose to ignore those differences, saying they’re not different enough. Which is fine. but that’s not what you’re saying.

Anyone saying Dry Top is recycled is being disingenuous. It shows a distinct lack of respect for the amount of thought and energy that went into putting it together.

Dry Top it IS being recycled tho…
You have no new mechanics what so ever in any of the events, the events are diffrent but nevertheless the same. “Dodge this or you fall / die!” / “Clear this zone!” / “Hit this champion!”

What is so diffrent about every other event-based maps?

Oh and by the way, while I was here notice what just happen (attachment), nobody cares, they just farm whatever they want because the kittenty reward system rewards you for that…

So how is the clearing the mine recycled? How is rescuing the 12 people from south mine recycled? How is the light bridge event recycled?

And the whole theme of the zone is new, including the sand storm.

Vayne.8563:

Godzzila.3752:

Vayne.8563:

Godzzila.3752:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Amere.9607:

mtpelion.4562:

Gear treadmills are not progression. They create the illusion of progression in order to keep you paying a subscription fee. There is a reason they are called “carrot on a stick” and that reason is not complimentary.

In GW2, progression is what you make of it. You set your own goals and then try to achieve them. If you don’t feel like you are progressing it is because you’ve not set progressive goals for yourself. If you are incapable of setting progressive goals, then by all means, return to a game that tricks you into handing them money for no reason.

how come visiting 100% vistas is a more “progressive” goal than earning a new gloves?

now, don’t get me wrong, i don’t want new item tiers. but the magic about them is that they bring new content along.

but why are you trying to say, how this game should be played to people with diffrent expectations?

Gear grind doesn’t bring “new” content. All it does is give the developers an easy way out. They recycle old encounters, old mechanics, slap on a new paint scheme and up the numbers involved. More hp and more defense does not make for a “new” more interesting encounter.

I’m not against having more skins added to the game, just the addition of more stat tiers. I know some people enjoy the hunt for rare, elusive looks and I’m perfectly ok with that. As long as that rare exclusive look is limited to the cosmetic aspect.

They don’t have gear grind but still they are doing everything you say they usually do:
Recyle Old Encounters: CHECK;
Recycle Old Mechanics: CHECK;

The only thing they are missing right now is slapping new paint scheme, but I honestly think that they shouldn’t be far away from that

As I’ve pointed out there is NEW content. You’re saying it’s recycled and I’ve pointed out to you differences. You choose to ignore those differences, saying they’re not different enough. Which is fine. but that’s not what you’re saying.

Anyone saying Dry Top is recycled is being disingenuous. It shows a distinct lack of respect for the amount of thought and energy that went into putting it together.

Dry Top it IS being recycled tho…
You have no new mechanics what so ever in any of the events, the events are diffrent but nevertheless the same. “Dodge this or you fall / die!” / “Clear this zone!” / “Hit this champion!”

What is so diffrent about every other event-based maps?

Oh and by the way, while I was here notice what just happen (attachment), nobody cares, they just farm whatever they want because the kittenty reward system rewards you for that…

So how is the clearing the mine recycled? How is rescuing the 12 people from south mine recycled? How is the light bridge event recycled?

And the whole theme of the zone is new, including the sand storm.

If anything the new Theme is probably the only real New thing

And, there is TONS of events in GW2 that consist of clearing zone X, and there is TONs of events in GW2 that consist of saving people

Godzzila.3752:

Vayne.8563:

Godzzila.3752:

Vayne.8563:

Godzzila.3752:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Amere.9607:

mtpelion.4562:

Gear treadmills are not progression. They create the illusion of progression in order to keep you paying a subscription fee. There is a reason they are called “carrot on a stick” and that reason is not complimentary.

In GW2, progression is what you make of it. You set your own goals and then try to achieve them. If you don’t feel like you are progressing it is because you’ve not set progressive goals for yourself. If you are incapable of setting progressive goals, then by all means, return to a game that tricks you into handing them money for no reason.

how come visiting 100% vistas is a more “progressive” goal than earning a new gloves?

now, don’t get me wrong, i don’t want new item tiers. but the magic about them is that they bring new content along.

but why are you trying to say, how this game should be played to people with diffrent expectations?

Gear grind doesn’t bring “new” content. All it does is give the developers an easy way out. They recycle old encounters, old mechanics, slap on a new paint scheme and up the numbers involved. More hp and more defense does not make for a “new” more interesting encounter.

I’m not against having more skins added to the game, just the addition of more stat tiers. I know some people enjoy the hunt for rare, elusive looks and I’m perfectly ok with that. As long as that rare exclusive look is limited to the cosmetic aspect.

They don’t have gear grind but still they are doing everything you say they usually do:
Recyle Old Encounters: CHECK;
Recycle Old Mechanics: CHECK;

The only thing they are missing right now is slapping new paint scheme, but I honestly think that they shouldn’t be far away from that

As I’ve pointed out there is NEW content. You’re saying it’s recycled and I’ve pointed out to you differences. You choose to ignore those differences, saying they’re not different enough. Which is fine. but that’s not what you’re saying.

Anyone saying Dry Top is recycled is being disingenuous. It shows a distinct lack of respect for the amount of thought and energy that went into putting it together.

Dry Top it IS being recycled tho…
You have no new mechanics what so ever in any of the events, the events are diffrent but nevertheless the same. “Dodge this or you fall / die!” / “Clear this zone!” / “Hit this champion!”

What is so diffrent about every other event-based maps?

Oh and by the way, while I was here notice what just happen (attachment), nobody cares, they just farm whatever they want because the kittenty reward system rewards you for that…

So how is the clearing the mine recycled? How is rescuing the 12 people from south mine recycled? How is the light bridge event recycled?

And the whole theme of the zone is new, including the sand storm.

If anything the new Theme is probably the only real New thing

And, there is TONS of events in GW2 that consist of clearing zone X, and there is TONs of events in GW2 that consist of saving people

You have a lot to learn about MMO design methinks. Check out this article:

http://www.mmorpg.com/blogs/UnSub/022009/3303_Kill-10-Fedex-Princesses-The-10-Basic-Types-of-MMO-Quests

There are other ones, that’s the first one I came across.

Basically there are really only 4 types of quests even though this article breaks it down into 10. It’s like saying all stories are recycled, because there are only a certain number of major plots. That’s not what recycled means.

Assets can be recycled, but killing stuff? That’s not a recycled quest by any definition I know.

my IRL friends bought this game about 6 months ago.. within 2 weeks they got bored and quit.

within that time they leveled to 80, experienced Dungeons and WvW.

and guess what… the first thing they asked me was " sooo.. is that it?"

thats just an example ( id like to point out there was 4 of my friends… and they all felt the same)

Vayne.8563:

Godzzila.3752:

Vayne.8563:

Godzzila.3752:

Vayne.8563:

Godzzila.3752:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Amere.9607:

mtpelion.4562:

Gear treadmills are not progression. They create the illusion of progression in order to keep you paying a subscription fee. There is a reason they are called “carrot on a stick” and that reason is not complimentary.

In GW2, progression is what you make of it. You set your own goals and then try to achieve them. If you don’t feel like you are progressing it is because you’ve not set progressive goals for yourself. If you are incapable of setting progressive goals, then by all means, return to a game that tricks you into handing them money for no reason.

how come visiting 100% vistas is a more “progressive” goal than earning a new gloves?

now, don’t get me wrong, i don’t want new item tiers. but the magic about them is that they bring new content along.

but why are you trying to say, how this game should be played to people with diffrent expectations?

Gear grind doesn’t bring “new” content. All it does is give the developers an easy way out. They recycle old encounters, old mechanics, slap on a new paint scheme and up the numbers involved. More hp and more defense does not make for a “new” more interesting encounter.

I’m not against having more skins added to the game, just the addition of more stat tiers. I know some people enjoy the hunt for rare, elusive looks and I’m perfectly ok with that. As long as that rare exclusive look is limited to the cosmetic aspect.

They don’t have gear grind but still they are doing everything you say they usually do:
Recyle Old Encounters: CHECK;
Recycle Old Mechanics: CHECK;

The only thing they are missing right now is slapping new paint scheme, but I honestly think that they shouldn’t be far away from that

As I’ve pointed out there is NEW content. You’re saying it’s recycled and I’ve pointed out to you differences. You choose to ignore those differences, saying they’re not different enough. Which is fine. but that’s not what you’re saying.

Anyone saying Dry Top is recycled is being disingenuous. It shows a distinct lack of respect for the amount of thought and energy that went into putting it together.

Dry Top it IS being recycled tho…
You have no new mechanics what so ever in any of the events, the events are diffrent but nevertheless the same. “Dodge this or you fall / die!” / “Clear this zone!” / “Hit this champion!”

What is so diffrent about every other event-based maps?

Oh and by the way, while I was here notice what just happen (attachment), nobody cares, they just farm whatever they want because the kittenty reward system rewards you for that…

So how is the clearing the mine recycled? How is rescuing the 12 people from south mine recycled? How is the light bridge event recycled?

And the whole theme of the zone is new, including the sand storm.

If anything the new Theme is probably the only real New thing

And, there is TONS of events in GW2 that consist of clearing zone X, and there is TONs of events in GW2 that consist of saving people

You have a lot to learn about MMO design methinks. Check out this article:

http://www.mmorpg.com/blogs/UnSub/022009/3303_Kill-10-Fedex-Princesses-The-10-Basic-Types-of-MMO-Quests

There are other ones, that’s the first one I came across.

Basically there are really only 4 types of quests even though this article breaks it down into 10. It’s like saying all stories are recycled, because there are only a certain number of major plots. That’s not what recycled means.

Assets can be recycled, but killing stuff? That’s not a recycled quest by any definition I know.

In this game every “quest” feels the same except for very specific quests… and they don’t even try to do something new

the only reason i play is because im so willing for this game to improve and get better its ALMOST stubborn of me to quit

Zardul.3952:

my IRL friends bought this game about 6 months ago.. within 2 weeks they got bored and quit.

within that time they leveled to 80, experienced Dungeons and WvW.

and guess what… the first thing they asked me was " sooo.. is that it?"

thats just an example ( id like to point out there was 4 of my friends… and they all felt the same)

Yes I’m sure that’s true. I’m sure that in 2 weeks all your friends quit. Meaning you hang out with people who pretty much play the same game you are.

My guild was a prelaunch guild and more than 50% of the people who started the game with us are still playing. Some left and came back, some left and didn’t. But more than 50% of the guild is still here from launch (though some have moved onto other guilds as well).

See, we can all provide annecdotal evidence.

I also know a lot of people who tried to read Lord of the Rings and couldn’t get through it, though they enjoyed the movies. That doesn’t make Lord of the Rings a bad book however.

Vayne.8563:

Zardul.3952:

my IRL friends bought this game about 6 months ago.. within 2 weeks they got bored and quit.

within that time they leveled to 80, experienced Dungeons and WvW.

and guess what… the first thing they asked me was " sooo.. is that it?"

thats just an example ( id like to point out there was 4 of my friends… and they all felt the same)

Yes I’m sure that’s true. I’m sure that in 2 weeks all your friends quit. Meaning you hang out with people who pretty much play the same game you are.

My guild was a prelaunch guild and more than 50% of the people who started the game with us are still playing. Some left and came back, some left and didn’t. But more than 50% of the guild is still here from launch (though some have moved onto other guilds as well).

See, we can all provide annecdotal evidence.

I also know a lot of people who tried to read Lord of the Rings and couldn’t get through it, though they enjoyed the movies. That doesn’t make Lord of the Rings a bad book however.

I think that’s the first reaction of evrybody who reaches lvl 80 tbh. And then again it comes back:
This game as such a great leveling journey that there is still no justification for it to be so fast. They should have make it longer instead of rushing to a point in the game where you run out of objectives.

Vayne.8563:

Zardul.3952:

my IRL friends bought this game about 6 months ago.. within 2 weeks they got bored and quit.

within that time they leveled to 80, experienced Dungeons and WvW.

and guess what… the first thing they asked me was " sooo.. is that it?"

thats just an example ( id like to point out there was 4 of my friends… and they all felt the same)

Yes I’m sure that’s true. I’m sure that in 2 weeks all your friends quit. Meaning you hang out with people who pretty much play the same game you are.

My guild was a prelaunch guild and more than 50% of the people who started the game with us are still playing. Some left and came back, some left and didn’t. But more than 50% of the guild is still here from launch (though some have moved onto other guilds as well).

See, we can all provide annecdotal evidence.

I also know a lot of people who tried to read Lord of the Rings and couldn’t get through it, though they enjoyed the movies. That doesn’t make Lord of the Rings a bad book however.

it was just a personal example of mine.

like you’ve said “Some left and came back, some left and didn’t.”
that soon will just be " People Left"

what we are discussing is that time in which that would happen. and how to counter it.

i want to continue to play this game with lots of players, not a handful.

Zardul.3952:

Vayne.8563:

Zardul.3952:

my IRL friends bought this game about 6 months ago.. within 2 weeks they got bored and quit.

within that time they leveled to 80, experienced Dungeons and WvW.

and guess what… the first thing they asked me was " sooo.. is that it?"

thats just an example ( id like to point out there was 4 of my friends… and they all felt the same)

Yes I’m sure that’s true. I’m sure that in 2 weeks all your friends quit. Meaning you hang out with people who pretty much play the same game you are.

My guild was a prelaunch guild and more than 50% of the people who started the game with us are still playing. Some left and came back, some left and didn’t. But more than 50% of the guild is still here from launch (though some have moved onto other guilds as well).

See, we can all provide annecdotal evidence.

I also know a lot of people who tried to read Lord of the Rings and couldn’t get through it, though they enjoyed the movies. That doesn’t make Lord of the Rings a bad book however.

it was just a personal example of mine.

like you’ve said “Some left and came back, some left and didn’t.”
that soon will just be " People Left"

what we are discussing is that time in which that would happen. and how to counter it.

i want to continue to play this game with lots of players, not a handful.

I don’t think any of the people that I’m playing with now are even close to leaving. Many in my guild are really enjoying the living story and looking forward to the next part. They’re not leaving. Some people came back because of the Living Story Season 2.

The biggest objection people had to Season 1 was that the content was not permanent and that has been fixed.

Godzzila.3752:

They don’t have gear grind but still they are doing everything you say they usually do:
Recyle Old Encounters: CHECK;
Recycle Old Mechanics: CHECK;

The only thing they are missing right now is slapping new paint scheme, but I honestly think that they shouldn’t be far away from that

Side conversation, not precisely regarding the original topic.

However, yes there are instances where they have recycled / revamped / reused some existing content. All games are guilty of it, although I didn’t think it was so awful in episode 3. A couple of these I’ve never actually done / participated in previously and I’ve been here since beta and I have map completion in those areas. I’m not precisely the only one in this boat. So, in some instances, some recycled content with minor revamps aren’t too awful to have.

Still, if you look through my post history, you’ll see that I have pretty much always been an advocate for new bosses encounters with interesting mechanics. I do like a challenge, now and again, although I’m not one that feels it needs to be locked behind an instanced raid to make it worthwhile.

If they want to add more dungeons, sure, by all means do so, but also give me back my heroes so that I can do them as I please. Heroes never abandoned me because I wasn’t what they “thought” I should be. They never went afk without saying something, or not bothered to say sorry after the fact. They never treated me like garbage because I wasn’t running a cookie cutter build. Instanced content is fine, but it needs to be readily accessible, as it was in GW1. The only exceptions to that where FoW, UW, Urgoz, Deep, and DoA and then only until the 3 hero limit was removed at the tail end.

I’d love to see an area like FoW return as a type of end game play. I’ve tossed suggestions out there for just such a return of that zone; however, I also know that the return of FoW and UW make no logical sense in the lore while the human gods are cut off from Tyria, since they are god realms. Although, they could still come up with something similar as well, and that would be fine with me.

However, all that said, endgame is not limited to the traditional dungeon or raid set up that WoW and other previous games have brainwashed us into believing. Anet said before launch that the entire game was endgame, and for a lot of people that’s a true statement. They enjoy not having to be locked into the mind numbing repetition of dungeoning and raiding for that next better piece of armor. For them, they honestly enjoy that you can do everything at level 80 that you can do at basically every other level in the game. Some people enjoy the new trait system, have rolled new characters, and are doing that as some end game progression. Others play wvw. Some people, like Vayne, like the story progression. During the twitch stream that discussed the new journal, it was stated (don’t remember if it was Mike or Colin) that they were going to treat living world as a type of end game content. A “never ending story,” intended for progression for lvl 80 characters.

So, I guess back in the vein of the original question “Is endgame content being developed or what?” the very simple answer is “yes, every day.” However, it may not match your definition of endgame, and while that probably doesn’t make you happy, it does others.

Vayne.8563:

Zardul.3952:

Vayne.8563:

Zardul.3952:

my IRL friends bought this game about 6 months ago.. within 2 weeks they got bored and quit.

within that time they leveled to 80, experienced Dungeons and WvW.

and guess what… the first thing they asked me was " sooo.. is that it?"

thats just an example ( id like to point out there was 4 of my friends… and they all felt the same)

Yes I’m sure that’s true. I’m sure that in 2 weeks all your friends quit. Meaning you hang out with people who pretty much play the same game you are.

My guild was a prelaunch guild and more than 50% of the people who started the game with us are still playing. Some left and came back, some left and didn’t. But more than 50% of the guild is still here from launch (though some have moved onto other guilds as well).

See, we can all provide annecdotal evidence.

I also know a lot of people who tried to read Lord of the Rings and couldn’t get through it, though they enjoyed the movies. That doesn’t make Lord of the Rings a bad book however.

it was just a personal example of mine.

like you’ve said “Some left and came back, some left and didn’t.”
that soon will just be " People Left"

what we are discussing is that time in which that would happen. and how to counter it.

i want to continue to play this game with lots of players, not a handful.

I don’t think any of the people that I’m playing with now are even close to leaving. Many in my guild are really enjoying the living story and looking forward to the next part. They’re not leaving. Some people came back because of the Living Story Season 2.

The biggest objection people had to Season 1 was that the content was not permanent and that has been fixed.

Living story is not a solution.
if that was so.. id only log on every 2 weeks for 1 hour.

Zardul.3952:

Vayne.8563:

Zardul.3952:

Vayne.8563:

Zardul.3952:

my IRL friends bought this game about 6 months ago.. within 2 weeks they got bored and quit.

within that time they leveled to 80, experienced Dungeons and WvW.

and guess what… the first thing they asked me was " sooo.. is that it?"

thats just an example ( id like to point out there was 4 of my friends… and they all felt the same)

Yes I’m sure that’s true. I’m sure that in 2 weeks all your friends quit. Meaning you hang out with people who pretty much play the same game you are.

My guild was a prelaunch guild and more than 50% of the people who started the game with us are still playing. Some left and came back, some left and didn’t. But more than 50% of the guild is still here from launch (though some have moved onto other guilds as well).

See, we can all provide annecdotal evidence.

I also know a lot of people who tried to read Lord of the Rings and couldn’t get through it, though they enjoyed the movies. That doesn’t make Lord of the Rings a bad book however.

it was just a personal example of mine.

like you’ve said “Some left and came back, some left and didn’t.”
that soon will just be " People Left"

what we are discussing is that time in which that would happen. and how to counter it.

i want to continue to play this game with lots of players, not a handful.

I don’t think any of the people that I’m playing with now are even close to leaving. Many in my guild are really enjoying the living story and looking forward to the next part. They’re not leaving. Some people came back because of the Living Story Season 2.

The biggest objection people had to Season 1 was that the content was not permanent and that has been fixed.

Living story is not a solution.
if that was so.. id only log on every 2 weeks for 1 hour.

Living story isn’t a solution for you. Living story is most definitely a solution for me, and others like me. That’s what I keep trying to say.

You and those like you, ie your friends might not like it, but I seem to see a whole lot of people running around Dry Top at all hours of the day and night.

Vayne.8563:

Zardul.3952:

Vayne.8563:

Zardul.3952:

Vayne.8563:

Zardul.3952:

my IRL friends bought this game about 6 months ago.. within 2 weeks they got bored and quit.

within that time they leveled to 80, experienced Dungeons and WvW.

and guess what… the first thing they asked me was " sooo.. is that it?"

thats just an example ( id like to point out there was 4 of my friends… and they all felt the same)

Yes I’m sure that’s true. I’m sure that in 2 weeks all your friends quit. Meaning you hang out with people who pretty much play the same game you are.

My guild was a prelaunch guild and more than 50% of the people who started the game with us are still playing. Some left and came back, some left and didn’t. But more than 50% of the guild is still here from launch (though some have moved onto other guilds as well).

See, we can all provide annecdotal evidence.

I also know a lot of people who tried to read Lord of the Rings and couldn’t get through it, though they enjoyed the movies. That doesn’t make Lord of the Rings a bad book however.

it was just a personal example of mine.

like you’ve said “Some left and came back, some left and didn’t.”
that soon will just be " People Left"

what we are discussing is that time in which that would happen. and how to counter it.

i want to continue to play this game with lots of players, not a handful.

I don’t think any of the people that I’m playing with now are even close to leaving. Many in my guild are really enjoying the living story and looking forward to the next part. They’re not leaving. Some people came back because of the Living Story Season 2.

The biggest objection people had to Season 1 was that the content was not permanent and that has been fixed.

Living story is not a solution.
if that was so.. id only log on every 2 weeks for 1 hour.

Living story isn’t a solution for you. Living story is most definitely a solution for me, and others like me. That’s what I keep trying to say.

You and those like you, ie your friends might not like it, but I seem to see a whole lot of people running around Dry Top at all hours of the day and night.

then you agree that Gw2 will lose players.. like me
and 10000s of them who also think like me

its a lose in players at the end of the day and that effects EVERYONE

if you put a piechart of pvp vs pve

pve would only be winning slightly.

wvw and pvp are still a large amount of the playerbase

Zardul.3952:

Vayne.8563:

Zardul.3952:

Vayne.8563:

Zardul.3952:

Vayne.8563:

Zardul.3952:

my IRL friends bought this game about 6 months ago.. within 2 weeks they got bored and quit.

within that time they leveled to 80, experienced Dungeons and WvW.

and guess what… the first thing they asked me was " sooo.. is that it?"

thats just an example ( id like to point out there was 4 of my friends… and they all felt the same)

Yes I’m sure that’s true. I’m sure that in 2 weeks all your friends quit. Meaning you hang out with people who pretty much play the same game you are.

My guild was a prelaunch guild and more than 50% of the people who started the game with us are still playing. Some left and came back, some left and didn’t. But more than 50% of the guild is still here from launch (though some have moved onto other guilds as well).

See, we can all provide annecdotal evidence.

I also know a lot of people who tried to read Lord of the Rings and couldn’t get through it, though they enjoyed the movies. That doesn’t make Lord of the Rings a bad book however.

it was just a personal example of mine.

like you’ve said “Some left and came back, some left and didn’t.”
that soon will just be " People Left"

what we are discussing is that time in which that would happen. and how to counter it.

i want to continue to play this game with lots of players, not a handful.

I don’t think any of the people that I’m playing with now are even close to leaving. Many in my guild are really enjoying the living story and looking forward to the next part. They’re not leaving. Some people came back because of the Living Story Season 2.

The biggest objection people had to Season 1 was that the content was not permanent and that has been fixed.

Living story is not a solution.
if that was so.. id only log on every 2 weeks for 1 hour.

Living story isn’t a solution for you. Living story is most definitely a solution for me, and others like me. That’s what I keep trying to say.

You and those like you, ie your friends might not like it, but I seem to see a whole lot of people running around Dry Top at all hours of the day and night.

then you agree that Gw2 will lose players.. like me
and 10000s of them who also think like me

its a lose in players at the end of the day and that effects EVERYONE

Every single game loses players. Every…single…game.

There’s no game that doesn’t lose players. Even games that increase in the player base lose players. Losing a player that’s not compatible with the game isn’t really a problem.

Only Anet knows how many players they need to make this game viable. Spending time and effort to try to keep the wrong players might well affect the players already there.

Saying they’re going to lose players is like saying I’m going to have skin cells that die. Well yeah, but so what? That’s the nature of the industry.

If Anet’s strategy isn’t working they’ll do something to change it.

Zardul.3952:

my IRL friends bought this game about 6 months ago.. within 2 weeks they got bored and quit.

within that time they leveled to 80, experienced Dungeons and WvW.

and guess what… the first thing they asked me was " sooo.. is that it?"

thats just an example ( id like to point out there was 4 of my friends… and they all felt the same)

They ignored what the game can offer, okay. So what? This only classifies them, not the game imo. Or they disliked it, depends on what they even tried out, but rushing trough “everything” in 2 weeks seems to me they just you know, ignored everything.
Bad habits are bad, ’mkay? Leave it in [insert random MMO you dislike].

Zardul.3952:

my IRL friends bought this game about 6 months ago.. within 2 weeks they got bored and quit.

within that time they leveled to 80, experienced Dungeons and WvW.

and guess what… the first thing they asked me was " sooo.. is that it?"

thats just an example ( id like to point out there was 4 of my friends… and they all felt the same)

So what hyped MMO that was released after WoW didn’t had the same problem
that a lot of the initial players left after 1-2 months ? People play to max and then
they are done with the game .. or simply had to high hopes and left before they had
to pay a subscrition.

Today i was a little reading whats going on at the new Super-Hardcore game for
als those raiders out there .. and what do i see ? Servers are dead .. servers should
be merged … and that 2 months after release ..

So yeah .. give us that super mega hardcore stuff will surely save this game.

Beldin.5498:

Zardul.3952:

my IRL friends bought this game about 6 months ago.. within 2 weeks they got bored and quit.

within that time they leveled to 80, experienced Dungeons and WvW.

and guess what… the first thing they asked me was " sooo.. is that it?"

thats just an example ( id like to point out there was 4 of my friends… and they all felt the same)

So what hyped MMO that was released after WoW didn’t had the same problem
that a lot of the initial players left after 1-2 months ? People play to max and then
they are done with the game .. or simply had to high hopes and left before they had
to pay a subscrition.

Today i was a little reading whats going on at the new Super-Hardcore game for
als those raiders out there .. and what do i see ? Servers are dead .. servers should
be merged … and that 2 months after release ..

So yeah .. give us that super mega hardcore stuff will surely save this game.

I really recomend reading the topic, it’s been said over and over again that no one is asking for hardcore content

Godzzila.3752:

Beldin.5498:

Zardul.3952:

my IRL friends bought this game about 6 months ago.. within 2 weeks they got bored and quit.

within that time they leveled to 80, experienced Dungeons and WvW.

and guess what… the first thing they asked me was " sooo.. is that it?"

thats just an example ( id like to point out there was 4 of my friends… and they all felt the same)

So what hyped MMO that was released after WoW didn’t had the same problem
that a lot of the initial players left after 1-2 months ? People play to max and then
they are done with the game .. or simply had to high hopes and left before they had
to pay a subscrition.

Today i was a little reading whats going on at the new Super-Hardcore game for
als those raiders out there .. and what do i see ? Servers are dead .. servers should
be merged … and that 2 months after release ..

So yeah .. give us that super mega hardcore stuff will surely save this game.

I really recomend reading the topic, it’s been said over and over again that no one is asking for hardcore content

All you say is you miss “endgame” .. however everything in this game is not “endgame”
for you .. but you don’t said what exactly you think is endgame. So we can only
assume that you talk about the so called “endgame” in most other MMOs and thats
raiding / geargrind

In GW2 we either have no endgame .. or the whole game is endgame .. that has been
said already before release.

Beldin.5498:

Godzzila.3752:

Beldin.5498:

Zardul.3952:

my IRL friends bought this game about 6 months ago.. within 2 weeks they got bored and quit.

within that time they leveled to 80, experienced Dungeons and WvW.

and guess what… the first thing they asked me was " sooo.. is that it?"

thats just an example ( id like to point out there was 4 of my friends… and they all felt the same)

So what hyped MMO that was released after WoW didn’t had the same problem
that a lot of the initial players left after 1-2 months ? People play to max and then
they are done with the game .. or simply had to high hopes and left before they had
to pay a subscrition.

Today i was a little reading whats going on at the new Super-Hardcore game for
als those raiders out there .. and what do i see ? Servers are dead .. servers should
be merged … and that 2 months after release ..

So yeah .. give us that super mega hardcore stuff will surely save this game.

I really recomend reading the topic, it’s been said over and over again that no one is asking for hardcore content

All you say is you miss “endgame” .. however everything in this game is not “endgame”
for you .. but you don’t said what exactly you think is endgame. So we can only
assume that you talk about the so called “endgame” in most other MMOs and thats
raiding / geargrind

In GW2 we either have no endgame .. or the whole game is endgame .. that has been
said already before release.

I did say what I thought was endgame:
Rewardful and Challenging content

I even said it more than once

Godzzila.3752:

I did say what I thought was endgame:
Rewardful and Challenging content

I even said it more than once

Challenging = more HPs .. more damage … dying 1000 times before killing a boss = EQ2 raiding

rewarding = more better phat loot > raid loot with better stats

Thats what happens in any MMO when people ask for exactly these two things.

Beldin.5498:

Godzzila.3752:

I did say what I thought was endgame:
Rewardful and Challenging content

I even said it more than once

Challenging = more HPs .. more damage … dying 1000 times before killing a boss = EQ2 raiding

rewarding = more better phat loot > raid loot with better stats

Thats what happens in any MMO when people ask for exactly these two things.

Nice job distorting what I said…
From what I have heard you rather have end-game story in this game
Story → Cinematics → Trailers → Movies

You want this game to be a movie?!!

Of course endgame is still being developed. Didn’t you notice all of the new outfits in the gem store?

Godzzila.3752:

Beldin.5498:

Godzzila.3752:

I did say what I thought was endgame:
Rewardful and Challenging content

I even said it more than once

Challenging = more HPs .. more damage … dying 1000 times before killing a boss = EQ2 raiding

rewarding = more better phat loot > raid loot with better stats

Thats what happens in any MMO when people ask for exactly these two things.

Nice job distorting what I said…
From what I have heard you rather have end-game story in this game
Story -> Cinematics -> Trailers -> Movies

You want this game to be a movie?!!

The so called “endgame” has never existed at all. Endgame is always just repeat
content again and again. So in most MMOs that is mostly just run the same
dungeons 100 times until you have gear for the next dungeon, and that is what
you do until the next level cap makes your gear invalid and you start the same again.

Here i can do whatever i want .. do dungeons, run champtrains, farm even mobs in
low-level areas or go harvesting or do meta events ..

Beldin.5498:

Godzzila.3752:

Beldin.5498:

Godzzila.3752:

I did say what I thought was endgame:
Rewardful and Challenging content

I even said it more than once

Challenging = more HPs .. more damage … dying 1000 times before killing a boss = EQ2 raiding

rewarding = more better phat loot > raid loot with better stats

Thats what happens in any MMO when people ask for exactly these two things.

Nice job distorting what I said…
From what I have heard you rather have end-game story in this game
Story -> Cinematics -> Trailers -> Movies

You want this game to be a movie?!!

The so called “endgame” has never existed at all. Endgame is always just repeat
content again and again. So in most MMOs that is mostly just run the same
dungeons 100 times until you have gear for the next dungeon, and that is what
you do until the next level cap makes your gear invalid and you start the same again.

Here i can do whatever i want .. do dungeons, run champtrains, farm even mobs in
low-level areas or go harvesting or do meta events ..

So basically you just said: “IN OTHER GAMES YOU HAVE TO KILL MONSTERS OVER AND OVER AGAIN, HERE I CAN GO AND KILL MONSTERS OVER AND OVER AGAIN WHEREVER I WANT!”

Just put the Mad King’s Clock Tower in one of the pvp maps. If you can get to the top 5 times in an hour, you’ll get a full set of super-duper ascended gear and a flying pony mount.

There’s nothing harder than pvp against people you can’t out-gear. If you can’t be competitive with a particular class, build a new character.

Personally, I like the game the way it is. Anyone that is finishing the content in 2 hours is probably missing most of it. In GW2, it’s the journey that’s fun, not the destination.

Beldin.5498:

Challenging = more HPs .. more damage … dying 1000 times before killing a boss = EQ2 raiding

rewarding = more better phat loot > raid loot with better stats

Thats what happens in any MMO when people ask for exactly these two things.

I’m actually popping in partway through the discussion cause I saw someone say loot. LEWTS! <3

Not everyone who asks for endgame content are looking for a gear treadmill that gets refreshed every 6 months (see WoW raiding). Personally I’d like content where you get complex fights that require group effort (loving the new mob mechanics, cheers Anet!). So… more dungeons (WITH unique armor skins), not all of them as long as Aether path, but a slew of smaller ones maybe. Perhaps AC sized. I’d like to see more open-world events like Teq. And I’d like tons more jumping puzzles, preferably ones with a skin or mini or toy associated to the loot table of that specific puzzle.

Oh, and housing. Housing with a crafting profession devoted to housing and guild halls, and different housing pieces with chances to drop from specific dungeons and mobs. Maybe you can stuff the Howling King’s head and mount it over your fireplace?

And tons more skins that I can collect ingame.

I love fractals but I’d like to see them expanded since after several hundred runs they get stale. The cliffside fractal is still beautiful…

Long story short: endgame doesn’t need to be a treadmill and loot doesn’t need to be about stats. It can be toys, cool gimmicks, or that one awesome headpiece that looks like a crown of fire. It means different things to everyone, but I know for most of the people I play with this is what it means to us.

Godzzila.3752:

So basically you just said: “IN OTHER GAMES YOU HAVE TO KILL MONSTERS OVER AND OVER AGAIN, HERE I CAN GO AND KILL MONSTERS OVER AND OVER AGAIN WHEREVER I WANT!”

In other games i have to kill ultra hardcore mobs with a group of 24 to get better stuff
here i can even kill level 5 mobs solos in Quensdale and will get my stuff at some point.
Or i can harvest and kill no mobs at all.

THAT IS THE DIFFERENCE .. I’M NOT FORCED TO DO THINGS I HATE !!!

Beldin.5498:

Godzzila.3752:

So basically you just said: “IN OTHER GAMES YOU HAVE TO KILL MONSTERS OVER AND OVER AGAIN, HERE I CAN GO AND KILL MONSTERS OVER AND OVER AGAIN WHEREVER I WANT!”

In other games i have to kill ultra hardcore mobs with a group of 24 to get better stuff
here i can even kill level 5 mobs solos in Quensdale and will get my stuff at some point.
Or i can harvest and kill no mobs at all.

THAT IS THE DIFFERENCE .. I’M NOT FORCED TO DO THINGS I HATE !!!

In other games you have overchallenge here you have no challenge at all. And plus in other games most of the monsters you can’t kill in 1v1 are bosses (which you can’t do here also) and dungeon monsters (made to be killed in a group) just an FYI…

Godzzila.3752:

In other games you have overchallenge here you have no challenge at all. And plus in other games most of the monsters you can’t kill in 1v1 are bosses (which you can’t do here also) and dungeon monsters (made to be killed in a group) just an FYI…

Oh yeah, no challange, whatever. And absolutelly no 1v1 against bosses.

Godzzila.3752:

Zardul.3952:

well i can be certain to say if this game doesnt " up its game"
i will be moving to something that will.

and many players will follow.

all the new Skins and gemstore stuff wont save players..

we need Gameplay.

Gemstore is actually something that intreagues me…
How is it possible that every a couple of days or so they release TONS of new models for clothes and whatnot, but we are already going for year 2 of development of this game, and we barely have any new enemy model?
Just look at Dry Top, I don’t think there is a SINGLE NEW ENEMY MODEL in the entire map!
The only ones I remember where the Scarlet Invasion robots, that weren’t even that good… but at least were something

It is most certainly not every couple of days…………………………

Dalanor.5387:

Godzzila.3752:

In other games you have overchallenge here you have no challenge at all. And plus in other games most of the monsters you can’t kill in 1v1 are bosses (which you can’t do here also) and dungeon monsters (made to be killed in a group) just an FYI…

Oh yeah, no challange, whatever. And absolutelly no 1v1 against bosses.

Thanks for making my point even better by giving an example of how easy this game turns out to be.

These discussions always boil down to the same basic 2 positions.

Side A: I like the game the way it is. Any change to retain players would be negative. I dislike challenge. I dislike raids. I dislike PvP. I don’t want anything I dislike added to the game.

Side B: The game is boring. The game is dying. There is nothing to do. Everything is dull, repetitive, and unrewarding.

Both sides are equally myopic. My advice to those in group B; the game’s design direction is probably not going to change and you’re better off playing games you do find fun. My advice to side A: when everyone in side B leaves, you’ll see what the price of stagnation is.

Nice job Godzzila for trolling so much people for 6 pages

Lytalm.5673:

Nice job Godzzila for trolling so much people for 6 pages

Because not agreeing with me makes me a troll… I guess?

Zardul.3952:

Daily done.. time to log off.
Fractals done.. time to log off.
monthly done.. time to log off
Teq done.. time to log off

lets play a more interesting game,

if you did a poll you will find that most of our playerbase feels like this.

I kind of like having a nightly goal that is consistently achieveable in under 2 hours. They can only put out content so quickly. Thankfully there is no subscription fee so if you’ve played through the entire story on a character I think you’ve gotten your money’s worth. No matter what game you play, there will always be a newer one that’s “more interesting.” ArenaNet really has no financial incentive to compel their players to remain online 24/7, and I personally wouldn’t want to play a game that expected that of their player base (looking at WoW here).

Godzzila.3752:

Vayne.8563:

Godzzila.3752:

Vayne.8563:

Godzzila.3752:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Amere.9607:

mtpelion.4562:

Gear treadmills are not progression. They create the illusion of progression in order to keep you paying a subscription fee. There is a reason they are called “carrot on a stick” and that reason is not complimentary.

In GW2, progression is what you make of it. You set your own goals and then try to achieve them. If you don’t feel like you are progressing it is because you’ve not set progressive goals for yourself. If you are incapable of setting progressive goals, then by all means, return to a game that tricks you into handing them money for no reason.

how come visiting 100% vistas is a more “progressive” goal than earning a new gloves?

now, don’t get me wrong, i don’t want new item tiers. but the magic about them is that they bring new content along.

but why are you trying to say, how this game should be played to people with diffrent expectations?

Gear grind doesn’t bring “new” content. All it does is give the developers an easy way out. They recycle old encounters, old mechanics, slap on a new paint scheme and up the numbers involved. More hp and more defense does not make for a “new” more interesting encounter.

I’m not against having more skins added to the game, just the addition of more stat tiers. I know some people enjoy the hunt for rare, elusive looks and I’m perfectly ok with that. As long as that rare exclusive look is limited to the cosmetic aspect.

They don’t have gear grind but still they are doing everything you say they usually do:
Recyle Old Encounters: CHECK;
Recycle Old Mechanics: CHECK;

The only thing they are missing right now is slapping new paint scheme, but I honestly think that they shouldn’t be far away from that

As I’ve pointed out there is NEW content. You’re saying it’s recycled and I’ve pointed out to you differences. You choose to ignore those differences, saying they’re not different enough. Which is fine. but that’s not what you’re saying.

Anyone saying Dry Top is recycled is being disingenuous. It shows a distinct lack of respect for the amount of thought and energy that went into putting it together.

Dry Top it IS being recycled tho…
You have no new mechanics what so ever in any of the events, the events are diffrent but nevertheless the same. “Dodge this or you fall / die!” / “Clear this zone!” / “Hit this champion!”

What is so diffrent about every other event-based maps?

Oh and by the way, while I was here notice what just happen (attachment), nobody cares, they just farm whatever they want because the kittenty reward system rewards you for that…

So how is the clearing the mine recycled? How is rescuing the 12 people from south mine recycled? How is the light bridge event recycled?

And the whole theme of the zone is new, including the sand storm.

If anything the new Theme is probably the only real New thing

And, there is TONS of events in GW2 that consist of clearing zone X, and there is TONs of events in GW2 that consist of saving people

Please describe, to us, an example of a new and exciting event for you.
thanks.

Taygus.4571:

Godzzila.3752:

Vayne.8563:

Godzzila.3752:

Vayne.8563:

Godzzila.3752:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Amere.9607:

mtpelion.4562:

Gear treadmills are not progression. They create the illusion of progression in order to keep you paying a subscription fee. There is a reason they are called “carrot on a stick” and that reason is not complimentary.

In GW2, progression is what you make of it. You set your own goals and then try to achieve them. If you don’t feel like you are progressing it is because you’ve not set progressive goals for yourself. If you are incapable of setting progressive goals, then by all means, return to a game that tricks you into handing them money for no reason.

how come visiting 100% vistas is a more “progressive” goal than earning a new gloves?

now, don’t get me wrong, i don’t want new item tiers. but the magic about them is that they bring new content along.

but why are you trying to say, how this game should be played to people with diffrent expectations?

Gear grind doesn’t bring “new” content. All it does is give the developers an easy way out. They recycle old encounters, old mechanics, slap on a new paint scheme and up the numbers involved. More hp and more defense does not make for a “new” more interesting encounter.

I’m not against having more skins added to the game, just the addition of more stat tiers. I know some people enjoy the hunt for rare, elusive looks and I’m perfectly ok with that. As long as that rare exclusive look is limited to the cosmetic aspect.

They don’t have gear grind but still they are doing everything you say they usually do:
Recyle Old Encounters: CHECK;
Recycle Old Mechanics: CHECK;

The only thing they are missing right now is slapping new paint scheme, but I honestly think that they shouldn’t be far away from that

As I’ve pointed out there is NEW content. You’re saying it’s recycled and I’ve pointed out to you differences. You choose to ignore those differences, saying they’re not different enough. Which is fine. but that’s not what you’re saying.

Anyone saying Dry Top is recycled is being disingenuous. It shows a distinct lack of respect for the amount of thought and energy that went into putting it together.

Dry Top it IS being recycled tho…
You have no new mechanics what so ever in any of the events, the events are diffrent but nevertheless the same. “Dodge this or you fall / die!” / “Clear this zone!” / “Hit this champion!”

What is so diffrent about every other event-based maps?

Oh and by the way, while I was here notice what just happen (attachment), nobody cares, they just farm whatever they want because the kittenty reward system rewards you for that…

So how is the clearing the mine recycled? How is rescuing the 12 people from south mine recycled? How is the light bridge event recycled?

And the whole theme of the zone is new, including the sand storm.

If anything the new Theme is probably the only real New thing

And, there is TONS of events in GW2 that consist of clearing zone X, and there is TONs of events in GW2 that consist of saving people

Please describe, to us, an example of a new and exciting event for you.
thanks.

You could have let’s say an entire zone that required people to do events in order to evolve this zone (build a city and stuff, like we have now) except it’s permanent, as people go and help the zone to evolve it will grow with more npcs, stores, etc… in this place however there will be a sleeping dragon that requires that at the end of each set period of time (let’s say, a month for example) people have to donate him a set amount of money / goods, if they don’t the dragon would come and attack the city destroying a lot of the progress made by the players. So people either have the choice of making donations for the dragon or defend the city from that attack.
There you go. An event that IMO would be pretty good, and that would actually have something that they promised in the pre-release: Your decisions will make the diffrence.

EDIT:
This is just a quick example of off the top of my head, but this specific idea can be way more deep. Let’s say add guilds to it
The guild that donated / contribuited more becomes the owner of the city until the next month. By evolving the city they would also evolve their own guild as well as all the players that would go there.

Zardul.3952:

if you put a piechart of pvp vs pve

pve would only be winning slightly.

wvw and pvp are still a large amount of the playerbase

sry mate but www is losing more and more and more ppl same pvp ppl are sick of few maps on team arena and no updates completly none,zero,null (2 years=1 update)

Godzzila.3752:

You could have let’s say an entire zone that required people to do events in order to evolve this zone
(build a city and stuff, like we have now) except it’s permanent, as people go and help the zone to evolve it will grow with more npcs, stores, etc…

How permanent?
I can see this being possible spread over a month, example, long term reward tiers as they increase the place changes..and then at the end of the month it resets.
This would be ALOT of programming and map design, however.

in this place however there will be a sleeping dragon that requires that at the end of each set period of time (let’s say, a month for example) people have to donate him a set amount of money / goods, if they don’t the dragon would come and attack the city destroying a lot of the progress made by the players.

So if people donate and it doesn’t get destroyed…then what? it cant keep growing, there’s a limit, this isn’t sims city.

So people either have the choice of making donations for the dragon or defend the city from that attack.

ok

There you go. An event that IMO would be pretty good, and that would actually have something that they promised in the pre-release: Your decisions will make the diffrence.

Not really, being a majority thing.

And since it’s events that slowly progress the map, well, there’s no choices there..it will progress, ..

I think you also mentioned something about the guild that donated the most gets to “own” map?
How does that work?
that also increases competition, not working together, and means you must be in a large guild.

stupid thread.

is there an endgame? no.
are we, as community going to create a discussion and extract points from that? no, we just going to whine, and blame each other for stuff.
can we, as community do something? nope, we are to busy arguing with vayne at forums, because, uknow, that’s how things work

lots of kittening, very little sence. thats kinda ok theese times?

imho, they did journal, now we just need to force them to put 1 and 1+ person content there with multiple difficulties and cool rewards. i don’t thing we need to force them, anet will do it anyways.

but what’s wrong with forums? im not saying community, cause theres lots of videos and comments there, but forums.. my god, can you all grow up and talk like real people, not like whining children?