Guild Wars 2

This is just a technical question, because many people argue that costume brawling could easily be retooled into dueling.

And this idea seems to make sense to an extent, I mean, costume brawling itself with its new abilities and “damage” system seems like it would have been even more complex to program than basic dueling. The idea stems from the fact that basic dueling would just utilize the abilities we already have and denote each participant as attackable so that their HP would actually drop.

Anyone have any insight or ideas into how the process of creating dueling/retooling costume brawling would actually work?

The only issue I’d imagine Anet has with implementing dueling is the scaling in world PvE. The game is balanced around level 80, so how would a duel work in say, Queensdale? Would the be upscaled to level 80 for the duel? Would the duel while downscaled?

Other than that I don’t see why Anet hasn’t implemented dueling. Every MMO has dueling, infact it’s a staple of MMO’s to right click someone’s name and select that duel option.

I would love the addition of dueling. It gives players something to do while waiting around for a dungeon group. Duels in the open world should have downscaling applied while dueling in cities could be upscaled 80.

One thing I never liked of some other MMO was that dueling could not be turned off, so people came and wanted to duel while you were doing something else, so you were clicking something and suddenly you clicked, inadvertently, a request for duel that popped up. I personally don’t like duelling, so the fact has been so annoying that I left that MMO because it wasn’t up to my liking. It included zones where PVP was mandatory. I think the philosophy of GW2 is different.

Dueling could be fine, but it’s prone to abuse if not implemented correctly. It’s a very delicate issue. GW and GW2 solved this issue with strucured PVP. I understand your desire but unless it can be implemented without griefing, I think it’s better if it’s left out of the game entirely. I know there’re a lot of possible solutions to avoid griefing, but in this case I trust the developers entirely (and I’m not that hopeful generally).

Costume brawling was just costume brawling. I think you’re underestimating the emotional impact of being defeated while wearing a costume versus the emotional impact of duelling with the real abilites of your character. It’s a completely different thing, in my opinion, and it’s something that, always in my opinon, has already been considered by the developers.

So, as long as there’s a way to appease and protect all kind of players, seeing what ArenaNet is doing at the moment, let me say: I think you’ll have it sooner or later, unless it could amount to griefing. Maybe I’m an optimist and since I’ve been let down for a long time before I shouldn’t be, but let’s not give up hope. It’s not the kind of thing ArenaNet can overlook. I just hope they put it in the right context.

Yes! Dueling is a must… Please impliment soon!

I think dueling should only be an option in the Mists.

No dueling. Then I’ll have to add more to the block list

Good grief no. It’s so obnoxious in other games to have to wade through people dueling all over the place.

Already in game..

Pick ANY of the lower Spvp games and duel away..

What else do you need?

They need more reason to irritate everyone I guess.

We need dueling in every major outlet for our kittens!

Dueling would increase interaction between players which is exactly what an MMO is about.

Lysico.4906:

Already in game..

Pick ANY of the lower Spvp games and duel away..

What else do you need?

That’s kind of true, but being able to duel with a friend in the PvE setting would be much more helpful, considering there’s considerable stat and gameplay differences between PvE and PvP in this game. It would be very nice to try out different builds to use in WvW and see what works and what doesn’t.

It’s not like a dueling feature would be detrimental to the game in any way. I’m pretty surprised there isn’t one already, and it would give my friend and I something to do while we wait in queue.

Are you guys actually serious? You don’t want dueling because it’s “annoying”? Wow… WOW…… What, you really think you’ll get spammed with duel invites every 2 minutes of gameplay? How is it that every other MMO has this feature then, and there aren’t people clamoring to have it removed because it is “annoying”?

An MMO I used to play many years ago had an ‘instanced’ area called the Colosseum in which players could battle each other and face no penalties. This would be very easy to implement considering the fact GW2 has WvW. Just take the ‘world rules’ from WvW, make each player be on their own team and create free waypoints.

Dueling will not be in the game. Anet COULD put it in if they want to. However they are making this game how they believe it should be made and don’t care what you think even though it’s logical/beneficial for the game. I’ve been following Anet since the release of GW1 and whilst they make good games they are also a notoriously stubborn bunch.

Edit: They could add in an option to automatically reject any duel requests but of course Anet doesn’t believe dueling should be in the game…

Afyael.1740:

Dueling will not be in the game. Anet COULD put it in if they want to. However they are making this game how they believe it should be made and don’t care what you think even though it’s logical/beneficial for the game. I’ve been following Anet since the release of GW1 and whilst they make good games they are also a notoriously stubborn bunch.

Edit: They could add in an option to automatically reject any duel requests but of course Anet doesn’t believe dueling should be in the game…

Do you have a source for this? Because I heard it was on their to do list. Not their immediate list, but eventually.

How about a system where you put up a flag stating you wish to duel. Then they can accept or decline. It can be the LFG flag lol.

Another problem with adding dueling is the duelers start demanding that everything be balanced around 1v1.

No… I doubt it is all that hard to add.

The question you should have asked, though, is if they haven’t added it because they didn’t want it.

Classes in guild wars are balanced around group pvp.

I heard they are adding custom maps to pvp that you can rent, with a pword you can give to your friends and you can do anything you want in there from dueling to working on strategies.

Not sure when it’s coming though.

It IS really hard to implement Duelling.
And that goes to Character Name Change too.
Changing text is harder than i thought.
Hey even Rangers speed buff still show 10% instead 25%.

Its really hard tbh. Almost like Rocket Science.

I’d love dueling, my most memorable moments from other games and WvW come from dueling. When you face that opponent you know is good and you have a nice 1v1 that pumps up your adrenaline and you know just a tiny mistake could end up with you losing. Priceless.

I remember in Archlord there used to be a particular part where people gathered up for duels which was Imo the most fun in that game.

Here’s some ideas on how it could work out:

Duel Mode
Hidden in options is a Duel mode in which you can turn on or off (default: off). This will only be available once you reach level 60 (or at the appropriate level you see fit)and a hint box will pop up about it then.
When it’s on, you get a tiny skull (same spot as the LFG) and anyone with duel mode on can right click him and choose ‘Duel’. A pop up appears for the other guy ‘X guy wishes to duel you, do you want to accept [Yes] [No]’.

You can only accept if you’re currently safe and if you’re attacked by a monster or you damage a monster, the duel cancels itself (you don’t recover the hp lost so it’s wise to pick a safe spot). Which means it would be wise to pick a spot where there are no monsters, which also means you won’t interfere with regular players as ideal spots would be a place with no monsters.

Winning and Losing
You cannot kill a player in Duel mode and it will stop at 100HP left. So you gain nothing and lose nothing. Winning will give you a skull above your character in the same fashion as costume brawl and the more you win. The bigger it gets. Achievement could be included as well if wanted.

Level Scaling
You remain the same level and have the same stats as the zone / area permits you.

Amos.8760:

Afyael.1740:

Dueling will not be in the game. Anet COULD put it in if they want to. However they are making this game how they believe it should be made and don’t care what you think even though it’s logical/beneficial for the game. I’ve been following Anet since the release of GW1 and whilst they make good games they are also a notoriously stubborn bunch.

Edit: They could add in an option to automatically reject any duel requests but of course Anet doesn’t believe dueling should be in the game…

Do you have a source for this? Because I heard it was on their to do list. Not their immediate list, but eventually.

I wouldn’t take this completely as fact but I do remember reading in several instances where they’ve stated dueling isn’t something they think fits in the game. Maybe I’m completely mistaken though, this is just a basic quote saying that it won’t be in sPvP/WvWvW: http://www.guildwars2guru.com/topic/4661-interview-new-info-jeuxonline/#entry204499

I can say with 100% certainty that they have not put dueling on any ‘to do’ list unfortunately. Several Anet members have said that if there is enough demand for it, they MAY add it but they’ve ignored all the people asking for it thus far. I’m sure that they would add it if half the playerbase left because it was missing but you could say that about practically anything.

Have so you can turn off dueling.

Ta da!

inb4 classes aren’t balanced around 1v1 blah blah blah. Who cares? It’s still fun, and a great way to pass time.

I dont get it either but w/e

would love dueling

Have it in one location, far from anyone. If its in the world, Give me an Auto-decline duel request setting.

We don’t need it happening in the cities.

In GW you had to invite to a GH, which were PvP zones for PvP settings on skills. That was a good system. Having a dueling area would set both level of
players and any pvp only adjustments to it.

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Have it in one location, far from anyone. If its in the world, Give me an Auto-decline duel request setting.

We don’t need it happening in the cities.

And why not? Because YOU would find it “annoying?”

Shizzlenit.7648:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Have it in one location, far from anyone. If its in the world, Give me an Auto-decline duel request setting.

We don’t need it happening in the cities.

And why not? Because YOU would find it “annoying?”

I think many players would find it annoying
Dueling is fine if it is added to an arena- heck you can even have an arena in all the cities.
Keep it out of the open world though- it doesn’t fit in with the game philosophy of co-operation.

It’s a complete and utter joke that dueling has not been added yet. An easy step-by-step process that would satisfy anyone:

Step one: Create duel toggle, have it in the party window at the top left. This allows you to toggle whether or not it should be possible for anyone to even challenge you to a duel. When it’s toggled off, no one can even challenge you and as such, they can’t annoy you.

Step two: Add a bog-standard dueling system that allows you to challenge your target to a duel. Have it stop at 1% health as normal so repair & waypoint costs don’t even have to be considered. Allow it to be done in all areas outside cities and perhaps in designed spots in cities (the beach in LA would be a nice duel area, but it would be annoying to have people dueling around the TP / Mystic Forge / Bank area). If that’s too hard then simply block it in all cities and have the community set up dueling areas themselves outside (Bloodtide / Gendarran).

Step three: Watch as all your players rejoice, leading to them playing more often and using more money on the game.

It is honestly extremely disappointing that this has not yet been added to the game. The only reason I can think of that they haven’t done this yet is because they want to milk us when it comes to custom arenas – which is a complete and utterly stupid thing to do, because people will want to duel in their PvE gear too.

ArenaNet, please get a grip and get on this.

Shizzlenit.7648:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Have it in one location, far from anyone. If its in the world, Give me an Auto-decline duel request setting.

We don’t need it happening in the cities.

And why not? Because YOU would find it “annoying?”

For scaling purpose, for any future pvp only balances, and yes, because I know what bored duelists are capable of doing in banks, at crafting stations, on top of Roleplayers, and any other way they can think of griefing a ’’carebear". Were it up to me, I would disable all combat skills in towns, just to cut the particle and shout spam.

GW1 never had dueling, or combat spam in towns. It didn’t hurt the game at all.

Oh, and not “all” players would rejoice. IMO, dueling is a joke, and few “dewlists” ever amount to much in actual PvP. Dueling, in most cases, is getting the first hit in a challenge/accept scenario. Go someplace that puts you in PvP mode, and actually duel with a fair start.

Guessing they’re not doing the dueling until they idiot proof the toggle.
Hopefully.

Which SHOULD be a default to OFF, without any type of popups.

Could be that they add something like …if you decline while you’re in combat or engaged, they lose 90% their health ? and are flagged for anyone to attack them … or flag them from trying to duel anyone for …say 15min.

I imagine if they added it, your level would be based on the zone you were in and would only be downscaled/upscaled if you were already. You would probably be able to duel on a zone border and hop between downscales (ie, level 50 vs level 45), which would make the duel unfair, but that’s ok, because you chose to duel there.

For the win condition, it would probably be the first person to get downed, then on duel completion, the person would rally. They could make the condition just before defeated, but on downed would probably be simpler for them to do.

Amos.8760:

Do you have a source for this? Because I heard it was on their to do list. Not their immediate list, but eventually.

It’s on their list of things they want to add: http://i.imgur.com/inYDU.jpg (from the BWE)

Healix.5819:

I imagine if they added it, your level would be based on the zone you were in and would only be downscaled/upscaled if you were already. You would probably be able to duel on a zone border and hop between downscales (ie, level 50 vs level 45), which would make the duel unfair, but that’s ok, because you chose to duel there.

For the win condition, it would probably be the first person to get downed, then on duel completion, the person would rally. They could make the condition just before defeated, but on downed would probably be simpler for them to do.

Amos.8760:

Do you have a source for this? Because I heard it was on their to do list. Not their immediate list, but eventually.

It’s on their list of things they want to add: http://i.imgur.com/inYDU.jpg (from the BWE)

Holy KITTEENSSS! I have never seen that!! Let’s hope they follow through!

Being able to duel anywhere in this giant world they’ve created is like giving us near-infinite map variability due to the terrain! ^^

I have no objection to them adding dueling as long as they at the same time implement an option to toggle dueling off. People are asking for the dueling feature for their enjoyment, so it is only right that those who don’t want to duel also be accommodated.

It’d be nice if they had an arena in each race city that allowed people to duel or deathmatch. There could be server-wide leaderboards for achievements and prowess in these arenas. Whether instanced or open, that’s up to ArenaNet. It would certainly get people out of LA. Or maybe just locate it at the Black Citadel battle pit to avoid spreading people too thin. The more i think about it, the more i feel that the idea is better served by being located in a single, solitary place in the world. It’ll bring more life to certain areas to have specific features there, something that i feel they haven’t really gotten right with their living world design yet.

Plus, id really rather not see people spamming abilities all over towns, anywhere they please to kill each other.

nalovas.5961:

How about a system where you put up a flag stating you wish to duel. Then they can accept or decline. It can be the LFG flag lol.

Was about the post the same idea. This would remove any of the harassment problems people associate with a dueling system whilst letting those keen for it have fun. In my view it can only make the game better.

For goodness sake… keep PvP and PvE seperate. Please.

Zeefa.3915:

For goodness sake… keep PvP and PvE seperate. Please.

Too late, there’s WvW.

Zeefa.3915:

For goodness sake… keep PvP and PvE seperate. Please.

For goodness sake… A system that gives PvPers the option to duel in the PvE world will not effect you, the greatest impact it could ever have on you would be clicking decline and walking away; even then Anet could create an option for auto-decline in which case it won’t impact you AT ALL.

Amos.8760:

Afyael.1740:

Dueling will not be in the game. Anet COULD put it in if they want to. However they are making this game how they believe it should be made and don’t care what you think even though it’s logical/beneficial for the game. I’ve been following Anet since the release of GW1 and whilst they make good games they are also a notoriously stubborn bunch.

Edit: They could add in an option to automatically reject any duel requests but of course Anet doesn’t believe dueling should be in the game…

Do you have a source for this? Because I heard it was on their to do list. Not their immediate list, but eventually.

Do you have a source to verify that it is on their to do list?

Is it really hard to add dueling?
No.
ANet are just lazy, incompetent and/or ignorant and have little interest in the wants of their customers. They are giving us content that they want us to have instead of what we want.

Dueling has got to be the single most frequent request I see for this game, yet it is nowhere to be seen.

There was even a dueling arena in Lion’s Arch. You see that big circle outside on the ground outside of the Vigil Centerhouse that the asura gates are positioned along the edge of? One of the nearby NPCs (a charr I think) says that that used to be a dueling arena.

Morrigan.2809:

Shizzlenit.7648:

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

Have it in one location, far from anyone. If its in the world, Give me an Auto-decline duel request setting.

We don’t need it happening in the cities.

And why not? Because YOU would find it “annoying?”

I think many players would find it annoying
Dueling is fine if it is added to an arena- heck you can even have an arena in all the cities.
Keep it out of the open world though- it doesn’t fit in with the game philosophy of co-operation.

Then rename it to Sparring, you’re not killing eachother, think of it as training between 2 heroes to improve their skills (which it pretty much is).

lothefallen.7081:

…Plus, id really rather not see people spamming abilities all over towns, anywhere they please to kill each other.

Lol, are you serious? People already do this, especially the ones with legendaries and weapon summons (elementalists). Why are all the reasons opposed to this feature so stupid?

Every online MMO is balanced around group-play, yet they all have dueling systems and none of them do any harm to the game.

Dueling helps people learn and understand other classes, it allows friends to have fun or to coach them, right now the only way to fight my friends is to use sPVP (which takes the fun away of fighting with your hard-earned exotic skins) and play in the maps and being constantly harassed and interrupted by people that join to play the conquest mode legit.

God knows why they didnt implement dueling, along with other standard features that you would expect from an mmorpg on this age

Costume brawl and dueling are mechanically different, with dueling needing more complex rules than C-brawl currently offers.

What happens in costume brawl from a technical PoV is that you switch your allegiance from being on the same team with every other player in PvE to being in a team that can only be attacked by monsters and other members of their team. There’s no limit to how many different players in costume brawl can attack you, and I doubt there code to support that.

What you can do with costume brawling is unrestricted, unbalanced open world PvP, if you strip away the transformation and skillbar change. Open world dueling would need code to allow people to set a state in which they are both considered enemies to one another but not other players, even if they are in dueling mode themselves. Add to that wishes for dueling titles and some sort of progression, and things are growing a lot more complex. The simplest approach adding dueling would be to modify SPvP games to create an instance for two people to fight in. But ANet doesn’t want or just throw something out there without being able to build upon it later, they want to do it right.

There’s many factors to consider. Do they want to allow it anywhere but in closed off 2 man instances? What if people want to duel in their guild halls/towns/open world? Do they want to add some form of progression? Is it necessary to protect carebears from duel spamming in any way?

Right now the easiest way taking the least amount of work to implement some sort of PvP in PvE is to take the costume brawl mechanic and turn it into an open world PvP flag mechanic. It wouldn’t be dueling, but it would satisfy people somewhat until the framework for dueling could be implemented.

kokocabana.8153:

I would love the addition of dueling. It gives players something to do while waiting around for a dungeon group. Duels in the open world should have downscaling applied while dueling in cities could be upscaled 80.

agreed, this was what I was thinking

I’ve played many games that allowed unrestricted challenge dueling. In all cases, it was a very, very thin slice of the population. Most times the serious PvP people I knew laughed at it, or dueled privately solely to check builds.

In my experience, this small population of “dewlists” had a core group that enjoyed being as annoying as they possibly could. Sometimes not actually dueling, in SWG it was popular to duel with level 1 launcher pistols, which generated insane amounts of lag, were used solely to produce that lag, and never damage each other.. Sometimes enough would get in on the act to actually cause zone crashes.

Roleplayers and people just attempting to converse were prime targets. If you asked the duelists to just move… you ended up with 6 of their guildies showing up to duel on top of you as well. Any minor difference in opinion led to the “yah, dewl meh, then” followed by the usual epithets and cat calling if someone declined to.

People will duel in any area, unconcerned of anyone else there. I don’t want this at the Trading Post, Bank, Crafting area, etc. I don’t want it in towns, period.

If it is indeed such a valuable pastime, surely it would not be an imposition to travel to a dueling venue. Make it have a free WP even.

And even if it comes in, never, ever establish KvDs, Leaderboards, track numbers in any way. Dueling kill counts and KvDs are the most cheesed statistic, in any game that tracks numbers and allows unrestricted open world dueling. Too many places to hide and exploit.

GW1 never allowed it except in Guild halls. I think it was a wise decision then, and a model to be followed IF they allow it here.

I don’t get the lack of compromise. Dueling in a venue would allow dueling, and still show some respect for people who feel it has no place in towns, banks, craft areas, etc.
But, I guess its “let me dewl anywhere, anytime, I don’t care if it annoys people, they can log if they don’t like it”

Latorn.4209:

Are you guys actually serious? You don’t want dueling because it’s “annoying”? Wow… WOW…… What, you really think you’ll get spammed with duel invites every 2 minutes of gameplay? How is it that every other MMO has this feature then, and there aren’t people clamoring to have it removed because it is “annoying”?

Because “every other MMO” does not have unrestricted dueling. One notable one being GW1.

Teofa Tsavo.9863:

I’ve played many games that allowed unrestricted challenge dueling. In all cases, it was a very, very thin slice of the population. Most times the serious PvP people I knew laughed at it, or dueled privately solely to check builds.

In my experience, this small population of “dewlists” had a core group that enjoyed being as annoying as they possibly could. Sometimes not actually dueling, in SWG it was popular to duel with level 1 launcher pistols, which generated insane amounts of lag, were used solely to produce that lag, and never damage each other.. Sometimes enough would get in on the act to actually cause zone crashes.

Roleplayers and people just attempting to converse were prime targets. If you asked the duelists to just move… you ended up with 6 of their guildies showing up to duel on top of you as well. Any minor difference in opinion led to the “yah, dewl meh, then” followed by the usual epithets and cat calling if someone declined to.

People will duel in any area, unconcerned of anyone else there. I don’t want this at the Trading Post, Bank, Crafting area, etc. I don’t want it in towns, period.

If it is indeed such a valuable pastime, surely it would not be an imposition to travel to a dueling venue. Make it have a free WP even.

And even if it comes in, never, ever establish KvDs, Leaderboards, track numbers in any way. Dueling kill counts and KvDs are the most cheesed statistic, in any game that tracks numbers and allows unrestricted open world dueling. Too many places to hide and exploit.

GW1 never allowed it except in Guild halls. I think it was a wise decision then, and a model to be followed IF they allow it here.

I don’t get the lack of compromise. Dueling in a venue would allow dueling, and still show some respect for people who feel it has no place in towns, banks, craft areas, etc.
But, I guess its “let me dewl anywhere, anytime, I don’t care if it annoys people, they can log if they don’t like it”

Oh thank you!
I wish you could hear me clapping
very well said.

ASB.4295:

Right now the easiest way taking the least amount of work to implement some sort of PvP in PvE is to take the costume brawl mechanic and turn it into an open world PvP flag mechanic. It wouldn’t be dueling, but it would satisfy people somewhat until the framework for dueling could be implemented.

And in a sense by doing just that, two players could meet up in a secluded area of the map and “duel”. It wouldn’t be perfect, but it’d be a hell of a great quick fix.

I’d be in favor of dueling as long as there was an option to deny all requests.

I think another option would be to have duels in a specific area…the charr arena in the Black Citadel, for instance. It would also fit the lore.