Guild Wars 2

The damage reduction that zerk builds are getting isn’t 10%

Now assuming valk legs will have 67 power 48 vit 48 ferocity add up how much ferocity your zerk build has, assuming we get 300 ferocity from 30 points in the crit damage trait, My zerk thief that has 101% cd as of now. After the patch it will have roughly 966 Feroicty and since 15 ferociry is 1% cd my cd will be 64%.

Now assuming my non crits are 1000 my crits are 2510 currently
After the patch my crits will be 2140.

The damage reduction is closer to 15%.

In order for the damage reduction to be 10%, 1% cd needs to be roughly 13 ferocity

Do the math yourself, Add up your potential ferocity assuming that it will be the same value as the lower stat of your gear.

So althea’s ashes for an example:
(pre-patch) – 91 power 60 precision 7% CD
(post-patch) – 91 power 60 precision 60 ferocity

I know an extra 5% doesn’t sound like much but test it out yourself and do the math.

Clarification :I just wanted to make this so people who use Crit Damage as their primary source of dps know that the their damage may be reduced more than 10% (varying on their builds) My Thief loses 15%, my Ele 13% I’m sure some one out there is going to lose more.

Also Celestial gear needs a bit more than a 6% boost. There is a lovely long comment with calculations on the dulfy website (http://dulfy.net/2014/03/21/gw2-critical-damage-changes/) by Cynar Valdyr showing how 6% is nowhere near enough.

The problem with an unsupported statement such as that made by Anet when first discussing the Ferocity change is that they didn’t share their assumptions. In order to make the Ferocity change come out to ~10% overall reduction in damage, the critical chance used in the calculation has to be much lower than it would be for anything close to what I would consider a “top DPS build.”

you guys do realise that with the new traits/sigil/rune changes that we get some of the lost damage back right?

No added damage from the traits. Possibly some from the runes, but that remains to be seen. Losing more damage from the sigil change.

lZoranl.6859:

Now assuming my non crits are 1000 my crits are 2510 currently
After the patch my crits will be 2140.

The damage reduction is closer to 15%.

what is that supposed to prove? all you did was calculating the reduced damage of ONE hit. it’s pointless without knowing your crit chance aswell

They never said Zerker damage reduction was 10%, they said critical damage would be reduced by 10%.

Eskarina Tigress.3785:

They never said Zerker damage reduction was 10%, they said critical damage would be reduced by 10%.

“At level 80, it will take 15 points of ferocity to gain 1% bonus critical damage, which means that there will about a 10% decrease in overall damage for a full “berserker” build.”

In all fairness to ArenaNet, they never actually strictly said “10%” they said “About 10% with a full zerker build" To be honest though, if we Bezerker & Assasin players all as good players as we say we are, we should actually welcome the extra challenge!

(I’m assassin build myself and would like more time killing an enemy! )

The damage difference is nothing. Nothing wrong with a challenge…

Dusty Moon.4382:

The damage difference is nothing. Nothing wrong with a challenge…

Condi-bunker cheese will only become better with these changes.

Sure, you guys don’t have to deal with this in PvE and fractal farming, but it’s very obnoxious when you’re roaming in WvW and everyone is playing Terrormancer or Perplexity Thief.

lZoranl.6859:

My zerk thief that has 101% cd as of now. After the patch it will have roughly 966 Feroicty and since 15 ferociry is 1% cd my cd will be 64%.

Now assuming my non crits are 1000 my crits are 2510 currently
After the patch my crits will be 2140.

The damage reduction is closer to 15%.

That is some wrong math right there. First of all your number for ferocity is just wrong.

Exotic Armor = 224 ferocity
Ascended Trinket = 376 ferocity
Exotic Weapons = 128 ferocity
Superior rune of the Scholar = 100 ferocity
30pts in Trait = 300 ferocity

Total = 1128 ferocity not 966. So 75%

Your second mistake is about the math itself. You calculated like if you had 100% crit. But you should probably be more around 60% on a zerker thief. So with you 1000dmg that give you.

Right now you would do on average = 1000 × 2.51 × 0.6 = 1506 dmg
After path you would do on average = 1000 × 2.25 × 0.6 = 1350 dmg

So 10.35% less dmg.

Anet didn’t bullkitten us. They said that its gonna be a 10% nerf on full dps toons and it is. BUT, you can also speculate on buff, sigil, boost, etc. All those things that a lot of people are using in dungeon and wvw. When we take into account everything and not only the basic full dps build. Then you get a nerf of between 15-20%.

Of course this is not the actual numbers for 2 reasons.
1) Speculation on some buff. How many ferocity will the banner of discipline will give us, how many from Buttersquash? What with the crit dmg in the traits? Etc. We don’t know, we speculated. Don’t think that most of us are in the wrong, but Anet could surprise us.
2) We didn’t min-max the builds post patch yet. Ya its a 15-20% nerf with the current meta, but the meta could change. I can use more power and less pecision post patch and this change in buff, food, trait, etc could decrease the nerf a bit.

It’s a 10% nerf on a non-disclosed zerker build. Your mileage may vary.

It’s a good thing :P Zerkers are OP anyway and they are killing this game
Zerker only dungeons and fractal groups are full of elitist players

quitting the dungeon if one person gets downed and refusal to take players who are either new or not set up the way they want them to be

Im glad Zerkers are getting a little nerf
maybe it will teach the elitist players how to dodge and stop blaming other people for getting them killed

chuckle

So not only are we calling them incompetent in general….

… we’re also now saying that they can’t do math…..

kitten it, I’m out of popcorn.

Your inability to do math does not make Anet wrong, it just means you need to pay more attention in class.

The actual math can be seen other places in this thread so I won’t bother repeating it, but your OVERALL damage will be reduced 10% just as Anet said.

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

chuckle

So not only are we calling them incompetent in general….

… we’re also now saying that they can’t do math…..

kitten it, I’m out of popcorn.

This comment made my morning…. Kudos mate

noobs crying about not being able to burn players and bosses in 3 seconds. cute

Sweet when did you get access to the build before everyone else?

If you do not have access, then do not pull out numbers you have no concept of.

People complained you gained 10% more damage when Ascended Gear was introduced.
Not people complain that you lose 10% damage when Ferocity will be introduced.

People complain.

I’m all for the 10% OVERALL damage reduction on zerk builds. Zerk are WAY OP, and if asking for any advice on a build the only answer was “zerk”. Always. I’m by no means a math guru, or fully understand what and how all the numbers work, I do know that the math doesn’t quite make sense. We also forget the new trait system. So 30pts in ferocity doesn’t really mean anything post patch, and we don’t know what traits are going to be available. We’ve only seen a few from the blog.

Yet, there will always be hardcore zerker only people who think that this is unfair and will whine about it.

As long as there isn’t a reduction in the over all power in armor traits, I’m okay with it. Like valk for example, my ele wears it for the vitality & the fact it’s power is the highest like zerk & a few other armors- It’s way to expensive for me & probably other people as well to just find another armor set :/

Except that when people ask for a PvE build the answer still be “zerk”. This reduction changes nothing.

Nage.1520:

In all honesty, I’m extremely disappointed with the zerker nerf.

It should have been much more.

I know, right? I always thought that the best way to do dungeons successfully is to get people to use healing, buffs and stuff that will support their entire team, but my friend proved to me that full zerker party will always do things better and faster. I’m not sure how this works, or why it works this way, but I’m extremely happy with this update. I dislike cheapness, and so I’m glad. =D

Turtle Dragon.9241:

People complained you gained 10% more damage when Ascended Gear was introduced.
Not people complain that you lose 10% damage when Ferocity will be introduced.

People complain.

Is exotic going to be losing damage too though?

Yoroiookami.3485:

Nage.1520:

In all honesty, I’m extremely disappointed with the zerker nerf.

It should have been much more.

I know, right? I always thought that the best way to do dungeons successfully is to get people to use healing, buffs and stuff that will support their entire team, but my friend proved to me that full zerker party will always do things better and faster. I’m not sure how this works, or why it works this way, but I’m extremely happy with this update. I dislike cheapness, and so I’m glad. =D

I know right? I love not having to use dodge, use blocks, invulnerability, evades, or blinds and instead just put a full set of Sentinel’s or Cleric’s gear and stand still while I let my character auto attack the boss. My teammates die so quickly, but I can pause from my autoattacking of the boss to res all four teammates one by one next to the checkpoint in Fractals. They complain that I’m messing up their combo fields, but my Symbol of Faith gives enough Regeneration for me to survive forever AND blast Retaliation. I tried using Berserker once, but I couldn’t stand next to Kholer as he spun around, what am I, a peasant that needs to move away from the boss occasionally?

The active playstyle, learning of boss mechanics, and teamwork that Berserker require are cheap, and I’m glad the damage is being reduced, even though it will still be the statistically best gear in the game, and everyone will still kick me from dungeons for using Sentinel’s gear.

I personally want Anet to stop calculating on a curve. Just show the real amount. Why should I have to get 1000 of something to get 60% of something else? And they wonder why people are confused and constantly complain and argue. They have made their build system convoluted. Plus i completely dislike diminishing returns concept. How about just make it impossible for me to put too much of something in my build instead of allowing me to create a broken build?

I’m still waiting for the other shoe to drop when all the “non-zerker” types that are laughing right now realize that the offensive jewelry that they were getting most of their damage from is getting hit hardest of all.

Da Sonic.6521:

Yoroiookami.3485:

I know, right? I always thought that the best way to do dungeons successfully is to get people to use healing, buffs and stuff that will support their entire team, but my friend proved to me that full zerker party will always do things better and faster. I’m not sure how this works, or why it works this way, but I’m extremely happy with this update. I dislike cheapness, and so I’m glad. =D

I know right? I love not having to use dodge, use blocks, invulnerability, evades, or blinds and instead just put a full set of Sentinel’s or Cleric’s gear and stand still while I let my character auto attack the boss. My teammates die so quickly, but I can pause from my autoattacking of the boss to res all four teammates one by one next to the checkpoint in Fractals. They complain that I’m messing up their combo fields, but my Symbol of Faith gives enough Regeneration for me to survive forever AND blast Retaliation. I tried using Berserker once, but I couldn’t stand next to Kholer as he spun around, what am I, a peasant that needs to move away from the boss occasionally?

The active playstyle, learning of boss mechanics, and teamwork that Berserker require are cheap, and I’m glad the damage is being reduced, even though it will still be the statistically best gear in the game, and everyone will still kick me from dungeons for using Sentinel’s gear.

The first post made me facepalm, but you kind sir made me laugh. Thank you!

Kadin.2356:

I’m still waiting for the other shoe to drop when all the “non-zerker” types that are laughing right now realize that the offensive jewelry that they were getting most of their damage from is getting hit hardest of all.

REALLY?? Oh kitten i never saw that coming. Oh my god.

If only we figure out that ascended trinket were the best way to gain crit dmg.
If only a month ago we could had see that ferocity remove that efficiency for the trinket
If only when we all did our math 1 week ago we could had saw that we gonna lost a big part of dps from the trinket and a small part of our dps from our armor.
If only it would change sometime and not only be at the end the same % of dps that we lose.

If only wait what. Oh ya we already did all that. Old news.

i know its more then 10% arena net is lying to us again so sad i did the calculations as well

This thread is full of people who are ignorant and spreading false statements, ironically enough they can’t point at theirselves. I guess i’m the bringer of last laughs, “fools”… I seriously hate the human race and i sincerely hope this kind of people will never invade my humble life. Peace

Thaddeus.4891:

lZoranl.6859:

My zerk thief that has 101% cd as of now. After the patch it will have roughly 966 Feroicty and since 15 ferociry is 1% cd my cd will be 64%.

Now assuming my non crits are 1000 my crits are 2510 currently
After the patch my crits will be 2140.

The damage reduction is closer to 15%.

That is some wrong math right there. First of all your number for ferocity is just wrong.

Exotic Armor = 224 ferocity
Ascended Trinket = 376 ferocity
Exotic Weapons = 128 ferocity
Superior rune of the Scholar = 100 ferocity
30pts in Trait = 300 ferocity

Total = 1128 ferocity not 966. So 75%

Your second mistake is about the math itself. You calculated like if you had 100% crit. But you should probably be more around 60% on a zerker thief. So with you 1000dmg that give you.

Right now you would do on average = 1000 × 2.51 × 0.6 = 1506 dmg
After path you would do on average = 1000 × 2.25 × 0.6 = 1350 dmg

So 10.35% less dmg.

Anet didn’t bullkitten us. They said that its gonna be a 10% nerf on full dps toons and it is. BUT, you can also speculate on buff, sigil, boost, etc. All those things that a lot of people are using in dungeon and wvw. When we take into account everything and not only the basic full dps build. Then you get a nerf of between 15-20%.

Of course this is not the actual numbers for 2 reasons.
1) Speculation on some buff. How many ferocity will the banner of discipline will give us, how many from Buttersquash? What with the crit dmg in the traits? Etc. We don’t know, we speculated. Don’t think that most of us are in the wrong, but Anet could surprise us.
2) We didn’t min-max the builds post patch yet. Ya its a 15-20% nerf with the current meta, but the meta could change. I can use more power and less pecision post patch and this change in buff, food, trait, etc could decrease the nerf a bit.

First off my math isn’t wrong, I calculated for my personal build where I use divinity runes and 2 celestial rings which in fact give me a total of 966 ferocity ( assuming divinity runes lose their cd addition and just get a total of 60 ferocity for all 6, and without the massive 6% boost celestial gear is getting) moreover I never said I was a balls to the walls zerk build if i was my cd would be much higher than 101% so you are wrong there as well. Lastly adding in crit rate is unnecessary because of how math works.

So as I said pre patch crits are 2510
Post patch crits ate 2140

2140/2510 = 0.852 which means that post patch my crits are 85% compared to pre patch.

Now with your genius idea to incorporate crit rate (my crit rate is 52% btw)
2510 * 0.52 = 1305.2
2140 * 0.52 = 1112.8

1112.8/1305.2 = 0.852 = 85%

Crit rate is negligible in the calculations because it remains static.

So in fact I personally lose 15% damage maybe its just my build but either way its more than expected.

Zypher.7609:

Sweet when did you get access to the build before everyone else?

If you do not have access, then do not pull out numbers you have no concept of.

This is all speculation as it should be taken as, and the numbers that I have no concept of I got to logically since if they are changing CD to ferocity I would assume it would be the same as the lesser stat in pieces of gear. (seeing as there is no gear with CD as the main/higher stat yet)

This isn’t just zerker people “crying” that we’re losing our damage or whatever its just that if it was 10% I wouldn’t care, but the fact that my current build is rendered basically crap I am kittened seeing as I have worked to get my ascended trinkets and my infused rings.

Moreover the 6% boost celestial gear is getting is absurd if they really wanted to boost it and make it a viable option now that the CD is getting nerfed they should at least boost it so that Runes of divinity give +15 to each stat, the rings give + 68 to each stat and the trinkets give +60 to each stat.

Da Sonic.6521:

Yoroiookami.3485:

Nage.1520:

In all honesty, I’m extremely disappointed with the zerker nerf.

It should have been much more.

I know, right? I always thought that the best way to do dungeons successfully is to get people to use healing, buffs and stuff that will support their entire team, but my friend proved to me that full zerker party will always do things better and faster. I’m not sure how this works, or why it works this way, but I’m extremely happy with this update. I dislike cheapness, and so I’m glad. =D

I know right? I love not having to use dodge, use blocks, invulnerability, evades, or blinds and instead just put a full set of Sentinel’s or Cleric’s gear and stand still while I let my character auto attack the boss. My teammates die so quickly, but I can pause from my autoattacking of the boss to res all four teammates one by one next to the checkpoint in Fractals. They complain that I’m messing up their combo fields, but my Symbol of Faith gives enough Regeneration for me to survive forever AND blast Retaliation. I tried using Berserker once, but I couldn’t stand next to Kholer as he spun around, what am I, a peasant that needs to move away from the boss occasionally?

The active playstyle, learning of boss mechanics, and teamwork that Berserker require are cheap, and I’m glad the damage is being reduced, even though it will still be the statistically best gear in the game, and everyone will still kick me from dungeons for using Sentinel’s gear.

Good job assuming that this only affects guardians. FYI I did dungeons on all classes(except engiee). My warrior is currently running as a support/tank with decent dps. My elementalist is a healer, but is extremely squishy herself. Even my mesmer is at the moment focused around using mantras. Berserker isn’t the only gear that requires active dodging, if you don’t believe so then I invite you to try and do tequatl. It doesn’t matter if you’re high dps or a tank. His poison will kill you in seconds, UNLESS you dodge. Also while I agree that most guardians are easy to use, I don’t think there’s anything wrong with using buffs. And yes, Berserker gear sounds pretty cheap to me, especially since dungeons are supposed to be based around teamwork. I don’t see any in mindlessly hitting your opponent and dodging, that’s all you’re doing, boring&cheap imo.
Berserker =/= better players, just more mindless.

Come back when you understand the game please.

lZoranl.6859:

snip

Thief burst needs way more than a 10% nerf in WvW anyway. Obviously, since it’s percentage based, the higher you scale, the more numerical loss. Though, full Zerker will still scale greater than any balanced build.

Yoroiookami.3485:

Good job assuming that this only affects guardians. FYI I did dungeons on all classes(except engiee). My warrior is currently running as a support/tank with decent dps. My elementalist is a healer, but is extremely squishy herself. Even my mesmer is at the moment focused around using mantras. Berserker isn’t the only gear that requires active dodging, if you don’t believe so then I invite you to try and do tequatl. It doesn’t matter if you’re high dps or a tank. His poison will kill you in seconds, UNLESS you dodge. Also while I agree that most guardians are easy to use, I don’t think there’s anything wrong with using buffs. And yes, Berserker gear sounds pretty cheap to me, especially since dungeons are supposed to be based around teamwork. I don’t see any in mindlessly hitting your opponent and dodging, that’s all you’re doing, boring&cheap imo.
Berserker =/= better players, just more mindless.

You are clearly immune to sarcasm and common sense.

Yoroiookami.3485:

Good job assuming that this only affects guardians. FYI I did dungeons on all classes(except engiee). My warrior is currently running as a support/tank with decent dps. My elementalist is a healer, but is extremely squishy herself. Even my mesmer is at the moment focused around using mantras. Berserker isn’t the only gear that requires active dodging, if you don’t believe so then I invite you to try and do tequatl. It doesn’t matter if you’re high dps or a tank. His poison will kill you in seconds, UNLESS you dodge. Also while I agree that most guardians are easy to use, I don’t think there’s anything wrong with using buffs. And yes, Berserker gear sounds pretty cheap to me, especially since dungeons are supposed to be based around teamwork. I don’t see any in mindlessly hitting your opponent and dodging, that’s all you’re doing, boring&cheap imo.
Berserker =/= better players, just more mindless.

First of all, I am shocked and offended that you think I was singling out Guardians. I play full Sentinel or Cleric gear on every profession. My teammates love it when I bring a Cleric venom Thief into the Crucible of Eternity. I can get up to forty thousand health on my Necromancer and heal my allies for OVER 4000 HEALTH with Life Transfer! I went to Tequatl as you suggested, and I learned that the statistically best gear for it was Soldiers, because you can’t crit Tequatl. I wasn’t having any of that, because honestly, why would I play Soldiers when I can run Settler’s, I’m sure my Burning will do massive damage to Tequatl. I went to Fractals with a group of Berserker’s, and we just threw a bunch of random professions together with no regard for the dungeon or what we could do as a team to excel in it. I mean, I suppose we could have brought a Guardian or Mesmer with area Stability to prevent the 23 times we were knocked off platforms by harpies in the Uncategorized Fractal, or we could have brought reflects to prevent the Elementals from killing us 12 times in the Grawl Fractal, or we could have brought group stealth so we could run the bombs in the Dredge Fractal, or for damage we could have brought a Warrior with banners or a Ranger with Spirits or an engineer with AoE Vulerability, but hey, we were all running berserker so we don’t need to think about what utilities and traits would be useful for the team. I completely agree with you, it’s a much more fun experience to have 5 people filled to the brim with healing so that we can sustain each other through the 45 minute fight that is the Spider Queen in AC. I much like my 4% crit chance that makes my Dagger Backstab do 1500 damage instead of 1000. I much prefer when nobody runs Berserker because I have this notion that having less inherent defense makes me less skilled at the game. Saying that people should use dodges or kill things in under half an hour is a farce. Long live the Sentinels.

Da Sonic.6521:

Yoroiookami.3485:

Good job assuming that this only affects guardians. FYI I did dungeons on all classes(except engiee). My warrior is currently running as a support/tank with decent dps. My elementalist is a healer, but is extremely squishy herself. Even my mesmer is at the moment focused around using mantras. Berserker isn’t the only gear that requires active dodging, if you don’t believe so then I invite you to try and do tequatl. It doesn’t matter if you’re high dps or a tank. His poison will kill you in seconds, UNLESS you dodge. Also while I agree that most guardians are easy to use, I don’t think there’s anything wrong with using buffs. And yes, Berserker gear sounds pretty cheap to me, especially since dungeons are supposed to be based around teamwork. I don’t see any in mindlessly hitting your opponent and dodging, that’s all you’re doing, boring&cheap imo.
Berserker =/= better players, just more mindless.

First of all, I am shocked and offended that you think I was singling out Guardians. I play full Sentinel or Cleric gear on every profession. My teammates love it when I bring a Cleric venom Thief into the Crucible of Eternity. I can get up to forty thousand health on my Necromancer and heal my allies for OVER 4000 HEALTH with Life Transfer! I went to Tequatl as you suggested, and I learned that the statistically best gear for it was Soldiers, because you can’t crit Tequatl. I wasn’t having any of that, because honestly, why would I play Soldiers when I can run Settler’s, I’m sure my Burning will do massive damage to Tequatl. I went to Fractals with a group of Berserker’s, and we just threw a bunch of random professions together with no regard for the dungeon or what we could do as a team to excel in it. I mean, I suppose we could have brought a Guardian or Mesmer with area Stability to prevent the 23 times we were knocked off platforms by harpies in the Uncategorized Fractal, or we could have brought reflects to prevent the Elementals from killing us 12 times in the Grawl Fractal, or we could have brought group stealth so we could run the bombs in the Dredge Fractal, or for damage we could have brought a Warrior with banners or a Ranger with Spirits or an engineer with AoE Vulerability, but hey, we were all running berserker so we don’t need to think about what utilities and traits would be useful for the team. I completely agree with you, it’s a much more fun experience to have 5 people filled to the brim with healing so that we can sustain each other through the 45 minute fight that is the Spider Queen in AC. I much like my 4% crit chance that makes my Dagger Backstab do 1500 damage instead of 1000. I much prefer when nobody runs Berserker because I have this notion that having less inherent defense makes me less skilled at the game. Saying that people should use dodges or kill things in under half an hour is a farce. Long live the Sentinels.

That’s exactly why I think berserkers have it the easiest. I’m saying how it should be, not how it is. I get your point, but I’m still happy that they nerfed berserkers.

You clearly don’t understand him … ( ._.)

Dalanor.5387:

You clearly don’t understand him … ( ._.)

No, no, I do. I get that he likes to joke around and use sarcasm a lot, but I’m not this easily convinced. I get what he means, but I still think making berserker the best option to go through dungeons isn’t that great. If someone is skilled enough to survive with berserker gear – awesome, but I don’t want this group of ‘elitists’ who are looking only for people with zerker gear because it’s faster.

Back when the change was first announced, ANet made the statement that “top DPS builds” would lose ~10% overall damage. Calculating damage with exotics — which are not the gear worn by players using the top DPS builds — while interesting, does not address the point that the original estimation was fuzzy, to say the least.

lZoranl.6859:

So as I said pre patch crits are 2510
Post patch crits ate 2140

2140/2510 = 0.852 which means that post patch my crits are 85% compared to pre patch.

Now with your genius idea to incorporate crit rate (my crit rate is 52% btw)
2510 * 0.52 = 1305.2
2140 * 0.52 = 1112.8

1112.8/1305.2 = 0.852 = 85%

Crit rate is negligible in the calculations because it remains static.

So in fact I personally lose 15% damage maybe its just my build but either way its more than expected.

Crit rate is not negligible cause its important for your total damage.

1000*0.48 + 2540*0.52 = 1785.2

1000*0.48 + 2140*0.52 = 1592.8

1592.8/1785.2=0.8922

thats 10.78%, which, to me, is close to 10% than your 15%

I think the bottom line here is that most sane players can agree that Zerk damage is the highest and needs to be reduced to bring it more in line with other build damage types.

Squabbling over the exact percentages before the changes are even available for testing is unproductive and borderline petty and nit-picky in the extreme.

My take on this is that after the change, if Zerkers can prove they are not longer near the top of the DPS output in the game, then these complaints have some merit and should be taken seriously. Otherwise, Anet is doing what needs to be done to try and promote some build diversity into the game. Period.

I’ve seen a lot of people campaigning about on patch day making “zerker only LFG advertisements”, I bet you there will be plenty of zerker only groups failing dungeons and getting all over each others throats pointing fingers at each other accusing one another of not being in zerker.

15% sounds about right.

Berzerker gear and Power/Precision builds are too strong, and it’s killing the game. If you’re not smart enough to realize that, sorry, but you’re just wrong.

Brother Grimm.5176:

My take on this is that after the change, if Zerkers can prove they are not longer near the top of the DPS output in the game, then these complaints have some merit and should be taken seriously. Otherwise, Anet is doing what needs to be done to try and promote some build diversity into the game. Period.

Just curious… what constitutes not being “near the top of the DPS output in the game” to all of you?

Let’s say we have a person who uses the exact same trait setup, but uses 2 different sets, Zerker and X (where X could be Soldiers, Valk, Rabid, etc.). How far “ahead” would people say Zerker should be in compared to X in terms of DPS?

Yoroiookami.3485:

Dalanor.5387:

You clearly don’t understand him … ( ._.)

No, no, I do. I get that he likes to joke around and use sarcasm a lot, but I’m not this easily convinced. I get what he means, but I still think making berserker the best option to go through dungeons isn’t that great. If someone is skilled enough to survive with berserker gear – awesome, but I don’t want this group of ‘elitists’ who are looking only for people with zerker gear because it’s faster.

If you invest time and effort in the game and get some encounter knowledge, PvE actually becomes way more easy.
Using berserker gear and optimised builds allows you to burn mobs so fast that you can move on. Every other MMO has this somehow. More damage = faster killing times = profit. However GW2 has no punishment for fail. No enrage timer, no lockout from istance, even item damage will go away soon, so there is actually no point to run only berserker. Hell, you can even waypoint back for free in the dungeons.
Sure, you can killing bosses AFK, pressing 1 with clerics gear as seen >HERE<, but honestly, do you enjoy a 30 minute fight instead a 20 second one?

My problem with this mindset is the following. You are a casual. You don’t have time. Why not run a faster build? Oh, you don’t care or actually have time. Doesn’t matter, people are people. But why you join in a zerker group? Oh, you don’t care. Sure. Okay. Play how you want. But they want to play how they want.
Make your own group and stop complaining.

ps: Zerker will be still the best dps option and anything else with Ferocity will be more inferior to Berserker. End of story.

Dalanor.5387:

Yoroiookami.3485:

Dalanor.5387:

You clearly don’t understand him … ( ._.)

No, no, I do. I get that he likes to joke around and use sarcasm a lot, but I’m not this easily convinced. I get what he means, but I still think making berserker the best option to go through dungeons isn’t that great. If someone is skilled enough to survive with berserker gear – awesome, but I don’t want this group of ‘elitists’ who are looking only for people with zerker gear because it’s faster.

If you invest time and effort in the game and get some encounter knowledge, PvE actually becomes way more easy.
Using berserker gear and optimised builds allows you to burn mobs so fast that you can move on. Every other MMO has this somehow. More damage = faster killing times = profit. However GW2 has no punishment for fail. No enrage timer, no lockout from istance, even item damage will go away soon, so there is actually no point to run only berserker. Hell, you can even waypoint back for free in the dungeons.
Sure, you can killing bosses AFK, pressing 1 with clerics gear as seen >HERE<, but honestly, do you enjoy a 30 minute fight instead a 20 second one?

My problem with this mindset is the following. You are a casual. You don’t have time. Why not run a faster build? Oh, you don’t care or actually have time. Doesn’t matter, people are people. But why you join in a zerker group? Oh, you don’t care. Sure. Okay. Play how you want. But they want to play how they want.
Make your own group and stop complaining.

ps: Zerker will be still the best dps option and anything else with Ferocity will be more inferior to Berserker. End of story.

Those are actually some good points. The only point I disagree with is
“… and stop complaining.”
Neverrrrr.

I definitely don’t dislike the berserker for the reasons you pointed out. It’s mostly that this game REWARDS going berserker more than anything else. This guy did waste over 30 mins to kill that spider queen, even though it was extremely ‘noobish’. I just think that teamwork in this game should be rewarded no matter what. I don’t see much teamwork in running 5 zerkers, except, that maybe – you respect other people’s time more. Thanks for showing me your point of view.

Oh dear, instead of taking 10 seconds to defeat that boss, now you need 11-11.5 seconds. Shocking, really. How will we ever adapt to this change?