Guild Wars 2

Now i feel like one of those kids crying as they come back home. “sobs* Guild Wars 2, take me back! I don’t want to visit ESO anymore *tears”

Bad community, horrible pvp systems, lullaby quests, and to top it all off, there was no way to keybind any combo keys! (shift+q for example)

<3 Guild wars 2, never again shall i leave you for another MMO

ESO is a bit of fun now that the sub is gone and most of the major launch bugs are fixed. However, the things that keep me from playing are these…

1. Cyrodiil is the only PvP in the game, and if you’re a lower level, you’re useless. No structured, battleground, or arena PvP is unforgivable, especially when Cyrodiil is so huge, and it takes forever to find good fights. As a big time PvP player in MMOs, this won’t do for me.
2. Level grinding, so I have to get to lvl 50, okay, that’s fine, but then there’s a bunch of other veteran rank levels that are even harder to get? What? I want to be competitive, not feel like I need to grind PvE for a couple hundred hours just to be useful.

In short, ESO is great if you LOVE PvE (dungeons and raids are good, questing is as awful as any other game), but it’s the worst MMO out there if you like PvP. That’s why I’m sticking with GW2 as well. Little grind to be useful, great SPvP, easy to get around in WvW, and hell even the questing here is the best I’ve seen!

No Walking.6349:

In short, ESO is great if you LOVE PvE

Problem is that ESO is not great if you love PvE. The PvE is only barely adequate but mostly just tedious.

No Walking.6349:

In short, ESO is great if you LOVE PvE (dungeons and raids are good, questing is as awful as any other game), but it’s the worst MMO out there if you like PvP. That’s why I’m sticking with GW2 as well. Little grind to be useful, great SPvP, easy to get around in WvW, and hell even the questing here is the best I’ve seen!

I remember ESO during beta to have some of the WORST PVE experience in any MMORPG to date, phasing everywhere to prevent players from playing together. If they haven’t fixed that yet and made the game full dynamic then I would never call it good for those who love PVE. Maybe a more specific subset of PVE, dungeons and raid lovers sure, but not PVE as a whole, because in ESO it was pure garbage.

maybe because you’re not a TES player?
i love ESO, the lore is interesting, the quests are dynamic, the world is alive all the time.
it even has a battle system that can be used by your self, unlike GW2 it’s not all autopilot.

it’s still to each their own but to say it’s a bad game shows ignorance, clearly there are plenty of ppl saying the exact same thing about GW2 and do like ESO.
i like both, GW2 for the fantasy settings and fast battles and ESO for the lush world and self control of battles.

if anything, GW2 is less what GW1 is while ESO is more so, based on player skill not time and gear.

sorudo.9054:

maybe because you’re not a TES player?
i love ESO, the lore is interesting, the quests are dynamic, the world is alive all the time.
it even has a battle system that can be used by your self, unlike GW2 it’s not all autopilot.

it’s still to each their own but to say it’s a bad game shows ignorance, clearly there are plenty of ppl saying the exact same thing about GW2 and do like ESO.
i like both, GW2 for the fantasy settings and fast battles and ESO for the lush world and self control of battles.

if anything, GW2 is less what GW1 is while ESO is more so, based on player skill not time and gear.

You may be right, but I just don’t think ESO is that popular. At this moment the Elder Scrolls Online reddit has 160 people online compared to the Guild Wars 2 reddit which has 737 Online. Now of course reddit doesn’t mean everything, but when you realize that this game JUST went free to play, that’s a shockingly low turnout for their reddit.

Looking at this Xfire page http://classic.xfire.com/cms/stats/ we see that Guild Wars 2 is at the moment in the top ten, where as ESO isn’t even in the Top 20.

It might not be a bad game, but there is plenty about it that is problematical. Because if they could have kept charging a sub, they would have.

It may be that when the game is out on consoles it’ll do better, but it hasn’t really captured the public imagination, and considering that it should have soared, piggybacking off Skyrim was it did, well, it’s just a kitten ed shame.

The game felt completely generic to me, and even though quests were all voiced, most of the ones in the early going were so mundane, I can’t imagine how anyone stayed around long enough to find out if the game got better. I know I couldn’t.

sorudo.9054:

maybe because you’re not a TES player?
i love ESO, the lore is interesting, the quests are dynamic, the world is alive all the time.
it even has a battle system that can be used by your self, unlike GW2 it’s not all autopilot.

it’s still to each their own but to say it’s a bad game shows ignorance, clearly there are plenty of ppl saying the exact same thing about GW2 and do like ESO.
i like both, GW2 for the fantasy settings and fast battles and ESO for the lush world and self control of battles.

if anything, GW2 is less what GW1 is while ESO is more so, based on player skill not time and gear.

Actually “alive world” is thing that wins in GW2. Dynamic events are huge thing, but sadly I noticed it only after trying ESO. I mean, some anchor? Really? Then I log to GW2 and see events everywhere – it really feels alive!

And gear not skill? Idk how you played ESO, but gearing there is much more grindy and “unfair” compared to GW2, where you easily get full set as soon as you ding 80. Unless you want to argue about this few stat points difference from ascended armor :P

Personally I like few things in ESO. One of them would be interesting quests (compared to other MMO quests). Character creator is cool too. AvA has (had?) potential, but right now WvW is better imho. Generally ESO is ok for casual coop-like RPG, but for MMO GW2 wins hands down. Again, imho.

There are also small details: no big logos when I start GW2 (god I hate those things), better animations in GW2 (like when you stand on stairs one leg can be on higher one and one on lower, while in ESO one will just fly), collectibles tab/deposit all collectibles, jumping puzzles/vistas, trading post (call it casual, but I hate ESO trading).

maddoctor.2738:

I remember ESO during beta to have some of the WORST PVE experience in any MMORPG to date, phasing everywhere to prevent players from playing together. If they haven’t fixed that yet and made the game full dynamic then I would never call it good for those who love PVE. Maybe a more specific subset of PVE, dungeons and raid lovers sure, but not PVE as a whole, because in ESO it was pure garbage.

They actually fixed that pretty well a while ago. I play ESO occasionally with my husband (he’s big into that game), and the phasing really works fine these days.

That said, personally I’ll stick with GW2 as my main MMO since it suits my needs so much more. I vastly prefer account-based progression to character-based progression these days. ESO is starting to move towards account-based, too, but the sheer amount of vertical progression required to get anywhere no longer suits me.

Both are good games by now, but cater to very different kinds of players. To each their own.

On the bright side now that ESO is B2P you don’t have to feel any sort of compulsion to play it. You can always wait until more exciting content is released.

Invoker.5462:

Now i feel like one of those kids crying as they come back home. “sobs* Guild Wars 2, take me back! I don’t want to visit ESO anymore *tears”

Bad community, horrible pvp systems, lullaby quests, and to top it all off, there was no way to keybind any combo keys! (shift+q for example)

<3 Guild wars 2, never again shall i leave you for another MMO

You know you can download mods?

I’m gonna give ESO a shot when it’s on a 75% sale on steam.
I actually just started playing Diablo 3 Reaper of Souls, and haven’t played gw2 in 2 weeks. I’m surprised I got addicted to that game, since it was such a huge dissapointment at launch.
I doubt that I will find ESO to be very interresting, but with no sub fee its worth a shot though, if I can grab it on a sale.

ESO is NOT for the average GW2 player.
Plain & simple.
The art style is gothic/realistic, “mature” if you will, while GW2 is pretty much the exact opposite ( childish? :p ).

The PvE is more old fashioned thus structured and takes place INSIDE the actual world. Unlike GW2 chaotic and disjointed FAUX “living world”.
Come on, guys.
Nobody can be that stupid believing this living world crap after actually leveling in a map that has the event daily running.
And I hope nobody here seriously tries to argue with the failed Living Story as an example for a good “living world”.

I´m not arguing about the PvP part. Haven´t tried it in both games much
In GW2 the WuwWuw bored me to tears after a week, while I left ESO too early to get a good handle on it. But ESO at least had an actual PvP MAP instead of GW2´s Zerg racetracks. I could care less about eSports ( actually no I can´t ).

HawkMeister.4758:

ESO is NOT for the average GW2 player.
Plain & simple.
The art style is gothic/realistic, “mature” if you will, while GW2 is pretty much the exact opposite ( childish? :p ).

The PvE is more old fashioned thus structured and takes place INSIDE the actual world. Unlike GW2 chaotic and disjointed FAUX “living world”.
Come on, guys.
Nobody can be that stupid believing this living world crap after actually leveling in a map that has the event daily running.
And I hope nobody here seriously tries to argue with the failed Living Story as an example for a good “living world”.

I´m not arguing about the PvP part. Haven´t tried it in both games much
In GW2 the WuwWuw bored me to tears after a week, while I left ESO too early to get a good handle on it. But ESO at least had an actual PvP MAP instead of GW2´s Zerg racetracks. I could care less about eSports ( actually no I can´t ).

So those people saying the living world exists here are stupid? Okay then.

Vayne.8563:

So those people saying the living world exists here are stupid? Okay then.

Yup.
http://i.imgur.com/QZFq2vj.webm
Okay.

I’d like to try Fifty Shades of Muddy Brown (ESO) just to cross it off my Try And Reject list, but wondered how Trinity based it is. If it is Trinity, I will cross it off right now.

HawkMeister.4758:

Unlike GW2 chaotic and disjointed FAUX “living world”.
Come on, guys.
Nobody can be that stupid believing this living world crap after actually leveling in a map that has the event daily running.

Well actually daily running events are just " dynamic events " repeatable – sometimes boring – quests by given the world imo. By saying living world they mean Bazaar of the Four Winds, Shadow of the Mad King or Escape from Lion’s Arch etc. Comparing these two is wrong in a way but the living world stories are ok not too bright not too bad.

sorudo.9054:

maybe because you’re not a TES player?
i love ESO, the lore is interesting, the quests are dynamic, the world is alive all the time.
it even has a battle system that can be used by your self, unlike GW2 it’s not all autopilot.

it’s still to each their own but to say it’s a bad game shows ignorance, clearly there are plenty of ppl saying the exact same thing about GW2 and do like ESO.
i like both, GW2 for the fantasy settings and fast battles and ESO for the lush world and self control of battles.

if anything, GW2 is less what GW1 is while ESO is more so, based on player skill not time and gear.

I love Elder scrolls games and ESO is rubbish, skill bars dont belong in an elder scrolls game, AOE’s dont belong in an elder scrolls game, level gating content does not belong in an elder scrolls game. The world is so static its sad.

NPC’s do not have routines, lives they just stand there or walk back and forth..

ESO scratches a different itch for me than GW2 does. If I want to run around doing repeatable content, I play GW2. The crafting and story in ESO are way more engaging than the story or crafting in GW2. I am enjoying the Dominion story line with Kate Beckinsale’s voice as the Queen.

sorudo.9054:

maybe because you’re not a TES player?

Pretty sure that I’ve spent more hours in the TES universe than most other games combined. If you try to whisper a character named Vivec in GW2, you’ll get me. No I’m just about as hardcore of a TES fan as it gets…

That being said, ESO doesn’t deserve to be called a TES game.

The games are just two very different cups of tea.

GW2:

- fast paced combat, that feels chaotic and spammy from time to time
- DE’s make the world feel alive, which is the biggest plus
- no trinity
- simplistic and easy

ESO:

- in-depth combat mechanics
- more freedom in character development
- great and immersive stories
- trinity
- challenging content

I play them both and I love them both. It just really depends on my mood which game I start up.
If I want some well written story and challenge I go with ESO, if I want non-stop action, GW2 all the way.

No Walking.6349:

sorudo.9054:

maybe because you’re not a TES player?

Pretty sure that I’ve spent more hours in the TES universe than most other games combined. If you try to whisper a character named Vivec in GW2, you’ll get me. No I’m just about as hardcore of a TES fan as it gets…

That being said, ESO doesn’t deserve to be called a TES game.

Yeah, I don’t think TES players would necessarily enjoy/like TESO, it’s just way too different from the other TES games because it’s an MMORPG.

Also, TES games were always about their mods that fundamentally change the game, I seriously doubt Skyrim would’ve been such a success without all those amazing mods. But since TESO is an online game, it must remain balanced, so there are no actual mods in the game (only UI “mods”/addons), therefore the highest selling point of a TES game is removed.

Kaiyanwan.8521:

If I want some well written story and challenge I go with ESO, if I want non-stop action, GW2 all the way.

I found the story of ESO to be worse than any of the RPGs and even worse than Guild Wars 2’s personal story. It felt a little bit like the game thought that you won’t have the ability to concentrate on the same person for more than 10 seconds so it needs to cram as much as possible into a sentence and send you off to a completely different plot point.

Even how the game starts. Some wizard dude that we completely don’t know. We need to save him. Fair enough. However when you save him he immediately sends you off to a woman in a village, that doesn’t give you a real backstory either, but rather sends you off to perform some menial tasks and then oh no! Her village is under attack! Then you save the village and they once again bounce you off to another quest hub.

They could have benefited so much from less people in the main story, but with more time to get to know them.

maddoctor.2738:

No Walking.6349:

sorudo.9054:

maybe because you’re not a TES player?

Pretty sure that I’ve spent more hours in the TES universe than most other games combined. If you try to whisper a character named Vivec in GW2, you’ll get me. No I’m just about as hardcore of a TES fan as it gets…

That being said, ESO doesn’t deserve to be called a TES game.

Yeah, I don’t think TES players would necessarily enjoy/like TESO, it’s just way too different from the other TES games because it’s an MMORPG.

Also, TES games were always about their mods that fundamentally change the game, I seriously doubt Skyrim would’ve been such a success without all those amazing mods. But since TESO is an online game, it must remain balanced, so there are no actual mods in the game (only UI “mods”/addons), therefore the highest selling point of a TES game is removed.

More recent TES games have sold heavily on consoles, infact they make pc sales look tiny.. you cannot mod on console.

Ricky Da Man.5064:

More recent TES games have sold heavily on consoles, infact they make pc sales look tiny.. you cannot mod on console.

Do they count digital sales in the statistics though? Or only boxed? Because majority of PC gamers just buy digital by now.

Ricky Da Man.5064:

maddoctor.2738:

No Walking.6349:

sorudo.9054:

maybe because you’re not a TES player?

Pretty sure that I’ve spent more hours in the TES universe than most other games combined. If you try to whisper a character named Vivec in GW2, you’ll get me. No I’m just about as hardcore of a TES fan as it gets…

That being said, ESO doesn’t deserve to be called a TES game.

Yeah, I don’t think TES players would necessarily enjoy/like TESO, it’s just way too different from the other TES games because it’s an MMORPG.

Also, TES games were always about their mods that fundamentally change the game, I seriously doubt Skyrim would’ve been such a success without all those amazing mods. But since TESO is an online game, it must remain balanced, so there are no actual mods in the game (only UI “mods”/addons), therefore the highest selling point of a TES game is removed.

More recent TES games have sold heavily on consoles, infact they make pc sales look tiny.. you cannot mod on console.

http://www.kotaku.com.au/2011/11/skyrim-sales-estimated-at-3-4-million-in-two-days/

14% on launch is not tiny.

Mirta.5029:

Ricky Da Man.5064:

More recent TES games have sold heavily on consoles, infact they make pc sales look tiny.. you cannot mod on console.

Do they count digital sales in the statistics though? Or only boxed? Because majority of PC gamers just buy digital by now.

Majority of this “PC sales statistics” are boxed copies only.

TheRandomGuy.7246:

Mirta.5029:

Ricky Da Man.5064:

More recent TES games have sold heavily on consoles, infact they make pc sales look tiny.. you cannot mod on console.

Do they count digital sales in the statistics though? Or only boxed? Because majority of PC gamers just buy digital by now.

Majority of this “PC sales statistics” are boxed copies only.

Bethesda isn’t a public company so they don’t have to (and usually don’t) share their data at all. Which means we might know what percentage of sales were retail boxed (seems to be about 14%) but we don’t know how many were bought directly from them for download.

From other games we know that 3-4 times the amount of boxes sales are often sold as downloads. How that affects the final percent, no one can tell you, except Bethesda…and they haven’t said.

Ricky Da Man.5064:

maddoctor.2738:

No Walking.6349:

sorudo.9054:

maybe because you’re not a TES player?

Pretty sure that I’ve spent more hours in the TES universe than most other games combined. If you try to whisper a character named Vivec in GW2, you’ll get me. No I’m just about as hardcore of a TES fan as it gets…

That being said, ESO doesn’t deserve to be called a TES game.

Yeah, I don’t think TES players would necessarily enjoy/like TESO, it’s just way too different from the other TES games because it’s an MMORPG.

Also, TES games were always about their mods that fundamentally change the game, I seriously doubt Skyrim would’ve been such a success without all those amazing mods. But since TESO is an online game, it must remain balanced, so there are no actual mods in the game (only UI “mods”/addons), therefore the highest selling point of a TES game is removed.

More recent TES games have sold heavily on consoles, infact they make pc sales look tiny.. you cannot mod on console.

From the wiki:
Regarding sales on the PC, Todd Howard stated in an interview with Rock, Paper, Shotgun that “Skyrim did better than we’ve ever done on PC by a large, large number. And that’s where the mods are. That feeds the game for a long time."

I doubt those “PC sales” count Steam, Skyrim was the most played game on Steam for a long time after it was released, dwarfing the second best by a very very large margin.

Vayne.8563:

TheRandomGuy.7246:

Mirta.5029:

Ricky Da Man.5064:

More recent TES games have sold heavily on consoles, infact they make pc sales look tiny.. you cannot mod on console.

Do they count digital sales in the statistics though? Or only boxed? Because majority of PC gamers just buy digital by now.

Majority of this “PC sales statistics” are boxed copies only.

Bethesda isn’t a public company so they don’t have to (and usually don’t) share their data at all. Which means we might know what percentage of sales were retail boxed (seems to be about 14%) but we don’t know how many were bought directly from them for download.

From other games we know that 3-4 times the amount of boxes sales are often sold as downloads. How that affects the final percent, no one can tell you, except Bethesda…and they haven’t said.

Good points all. A cursory look at sites like Nexus that host mods and have millions of downloads tells a story as well. Same with the Steam Workshop. Lots of people play the single player games on PC because the modding community offers such a robust experience with the game. I have played more hours of the single player TES games than almost any other franchise and a big part of that is the modding community’s work.

I power tested ESO, reached lvl 30 in 1 week and finsihed 3 areas and did many hours PvP.

I just need to tell for those who want to try the game :

Community is TERRIBLE. I am serious. Most of the time PvE Players in ESO turn off the chat. There are many Elder Scroll Fans who try to get some Single Player experience by doing this.

Besides, ESO lacks aTrading Post and its LFG tool is bugged and people dont use it.
that leads people spamming the /zone Chat with trading, grouping and recuiting messages.

That again leads to PvE players turning off their chat.

So If you are in a public dungeon or in general zone, nobody answers or helps yo because nobody hears you. /Say & /Yell are completely useless.

You get outright ignored and helped only in %5 of the time. And if you complain, people just mute you.

ESO’s has no open Cooperation, every spawn, every chest or every event needs to be fight over.

It is like other players are disturbing you in your playthrough, and if you need someone in the rarest occasions no body answers you.

GW2 please welcome me back! I will enver go again!

I had the same feeling with archeage when it just got released.Played it for 3 weeks…what a mistake…I ran back to gw2.

So what is the point of this thread? bashing ESO? Eso done a lot of things right and wrong just like GW2, no point in bashing it. I think ESO is a decent game and a good alternative for GW2, so I play them both.
Things ESO done better than GW2::
*looting
*Skill system
*mount
*questing
*dungeon
Things GW2 done better than ESO
*pvp
*exploration
*combat
*graphic
No game is better than another, stop making thread like this.

warbignime.4610:

So what is the point of this thread? bashing ESO? Eso done a lot of things right and wrong just like GW2, no point in bashing it. I think ESO is a decent game and a good alternative for GW2, so I play them both.
Things ESO done better than GW2::
*looting
*Skill system
*mount
*questing
*dungeon
Things GW2 done better than ESO
*pvp
*exploration
*combat
*graphic
No game is better than another, stop making thread like this.

I would argue that shared loot is better than competing for loot.

Wow they still don’t let you add modifiers to hotkeys? That’s like MMO basics nowadays. What noobs. That was something I mentioned in my long list of bugs and suggestions on their beta forums.

Eso is still new mmo compare with Guild Wars 2: 3 years

Next time before attack new game: do research first. Also, by the time Eso is 3 years: you will see huge diference.

Also: do you know Final Fantasy 14 have more players than Guild Wars 2? How old is Final Fantasy 14 compare to Guild Wars 2?

The lesson is: it is not about compare who is that and what is this to that? it is about having a vision for challenge and fun for your game include your players.

Square Enix know that: that is why they redo Final Fantasy 14 because they now know how important player value challenge and fun. Including working with their player to find solution to problems and to give their players fun and good challenge things.

More evidence: how long did it take for Square Enix to make stealth (Ninja Prof.) challenge and fun in their game and for their players compare to Arena net Guild Wars 2 Thief Prof. stealth who offer No challenge, and offer no fun. I will not even talk about Final Fantasy pvp vs Guild Wars 2 pvp.

Again, same reason and explanation.

Square Enix is still learning to work with their players to make game fun and challenge: they are not perfect but trying hard

Eso will soon be like Square Enix because Zenimax Online Studios is learning from mistake and improve from bad experience. Again, give ESO 3 years and see challenge and fun how Zenimax Online Studios will make it be

It is about learning from mistake and improve to be better. No learning, Never change, same old mistake, Same thing over, Repeat again

Last- Edit: “Before you judge another game take a look at your game first and and make sure it is perfect with no flaw”

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/pvp/Verbal-abuse-is-getting-worse-and-worse/page/2#post4927205

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Verbal-abuse-because-of-good-drop/first#post4875142

DarkSyze.8627:

Also: do you know Final Fantasy 14 have more players than Guild Wars 2? How old is Final Fantasy 14 compare to Guild Wars 2?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_massively_multiplayer_online_role-playing_games

not according to Wiki. Unless you have some newer information.

Not to say that your post is invalid, or that I’m disagreeing with you. It’s just that if you talk numbers you should give us citations as from where

Mirta.5029:

warbignime.4610:

So what is the point of this thread? bashing ESO? Eso done a lot of things right and wrong just like GW2, no point in bashing it. I think ESO is a decent game and a good alternative for GW2, so I play them both.
Things ESO done better than GW2::
*looting
*Skill system
*mount
*questing
*dungeon
Things GW2 done better than ESO
*pvp
*exploration
*combat
*graphic
No game is better than another, stop making thread like this.

I would argue that shared loot is better than competing for loot.

I meant the loot it self and not the method of looting.

Mirta.5029:

DarkSyze.8627:

Also: do you know Final Fantasy 14 have more players than Guild Wars 2? How old is Final Fantasy 14 compare to Guild Wars 2?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_massively_multiplayer_online_role-playing_games

not according to Wiki. Unless you have some newer information.

Not to say that your post is invalid, or that I’m disagreeing with you. It’s just that if you talk numbers you should give us citations as from where

My investigation and my research result:

(not include china sales-could be more? could be less?)

January 8, 2015 update: Arena net Guild Wars 2- 3 million+ copies (US+Europe)
http://kdbdw.com/bbs/download/192028.pdf?attachmentId=192028

Feb 26, 2015 update: Square Enix: Final Fnatasy 14 Reborn- 4 million registered+ world wide. (not counting un-registered)
http://www.polygon.com/2015/2/26/8116703/final-fantasy-14-free-login-4-million-players-pc-ps4-playstation-4-mmo-ps3

Square Enix will be releasing a new expansion this year: spring.
Arena net will be releasing a new expansion: not sure if this year

In result: sale will increase for the 2 game companies.

I will admit I played eso myself. The thing about eso was it could of been so amazing.

Skills…..ok I LOVED that as you use skills you can morph them. Gave each skill it’s own uniqueness. Unlike gw2 your 2 skills always your 2 skill. I also really enjoyed the fact that I could pick my own 5 skills.

Champion system……they are removing vet levels and focusing just on champion system. I love this. Once you hit max level it actually does give you something to do in the game, yes these points give you very small advantages but still give you the feeling of leveling and playing towards something which I think gw2 failed in.

Other then that though the games kinda a flop. Even gw2 has a better crafting system I think even though many may disagree with that. But gw2 should of had a similar feel I think with the skills or similar to gw1 at least, and the game still does have 0 end game

So, could anyone who bought and hated ESO give me their account for a few days to test-drive?

I’d like to try ESO, but they don’t have a trial version.

warbignime.4610:

So what is the point of this thread? bashing ESO? Eso done a lot of things right and wrong just like GW2, no point in bashing it. I think ESO is a decent game and a good alternative for GW2, so I play them both.
Things ESO done better than GW2::
*looting
*Skill system
*mount
*questing
*dungeon
Things GW2 done better than ESO
*pvp
*exploration
*combat
*graphic
No game is better than another, stop making thread like this.

-ESO’s looting system is terrible, period. Not even gonna bother arguing this.
-Skill system? So vague.
-GW2 doesn’t really “need” mounts, but it’d be awesome nonetheless.
-Questing is, in many respects to typical Elder Scrolls games, are outright terrible too. “Questing”(hearts and events) in GW2 are far more compelling for players.
- Dungeons? Haven’t tried ’em, but if they contain the same terrible loot competition scheme going on, its not gonna be something most people want to be apart of.

DarkSyze.8627:

Eso is still new mmo compare with Guild Wars 2: 3 years

Next time before attack new game: do research first. Also, by the time Eso is 3 years: you will see huge diference.

Being a new game(or new studio), is no get free pass(excuse) for terrible mechanics, experiences, etc. GW2 was an amazing game from its release and still is, 3 years later, today. While ESO still has the same dealbreaking problems since it was released, that should have been priority number one, even over new content.

DarkSyze.8627:

Also: do you know Final Fantasy 14 have more players than Guild Wars 2? How old is Final Fantasy 14 compare to Guild Wars 2?

Its amazing what Halo-level popularity can do. /s

But seriously what would anyone expect? Its Final Fantasy. We all know that IP name holds as much weight as the literal term itself.

DarkSyze.8627:

The lesson is: it is not about compare who is that and what is this to that? it is about having a vision for challenge and fun for your game include your players.

So we can’t criticize, when it’s needed?(Which is all the time.)

DarkSyze.8627:

Square Enix know that: that is why they redo Final Fantasy 14 because they now know how important player value challenge and fun. Including working with their player to find solution to problems and to give their players fun and good challenge things.

Square Enix took MAJOR heat in FFXIV’s original release. They, iirc, FIRED the original game director, and placed a new one. Now this director basically took a huge gamble and had the game almost rewritten from scratch. The ‘heat’ the first game took was molded ad reforged into the glorious miracle that became ARR:FFXIV.

DarkSyze.8627:

More evidence: how long did it take for Square Enix to make stealth (Ninja Prof.) challenge and fun in their game and for their players compare to Arena net Guild Wars 2 Thief Prof. stealth who offer No challenge, and offer no fun. I will not even talk about Final Fantasy pvp vs Guild Wars 2 pvp.

Define stealth. Because clearly these two games have different definitions in both design, art style, and pure combat mechanics.

DarkSyze.8627:

Square Enix is still learning to work with their players to make game fun and challenge: they are not perfect but trying hard

So Anet doesn’t listen to its players?

DarkSyze.8627:

Eso will soon be like Square Enix because Zenimax Online Studios is learning from mistake and improve from bad experience. Again, give ESO 3 years and see challenge and fun how Zenimax Online Studios will make it be

Part of what made FF:XIV’s success story was the sheer amount of resources and talent SE has at their fingertips. This is NOT something you just ‘do’. We should simply be thankful games like GW2, ESO, and FFXIV even exist, let alone what can be done to improve these games vs development time, bug patching, art team development, etc.

DarkSyze.8627:

Eso will soon be like Square Enix because Zenimax Online Studios is learning from mistake and improve from bad experience. Again, give ESO 3 years and see challenge and fun how Zenimax Online Studios will make it be

Nothing will change. The core game of ESO will be forever flawed, just like the core flaws of GW2 still exist. There are always people that wish for what they think are “improvements” but in reality they are wishing for another game because the devs arent going to change it that much. You see it on this forum too, change this, change that, the game would be much better without this or with that, blablablabla.

ESO is a fun game for a while if one look at it as a mediocre addition to the Elder Scrolls series with some degree of online play. That’s it. If you want to go deeper into the lore and get maybe a month of gameplay out of it, go for it. For an MMO, its actually not that bad open world PvE wise. The storyline is dull but so is every ES game, lol. The quests themselves can actually be quite involving but only one time. That’s pretty much it IMO. It does little new, other than trying to expand the size of WvW. Its boring as hell but sure, it does it. Theoretically its superior there. Practically, not so much.

ESO is one of those games where I wish they’d just blatantly stolen stuff from other games that came before it, such as GW2. Just dynamic events and downleveling could have made the whole ESO world come alive. The design is just so, so bad. When I look at ESO, its almost like they didnt want it as a sandbox world you could live out your Elder Scrolls fantasy in. They just wanted a quick WoW clone with mouse control. So they just slapped it together on the SWTOR engine. Uuuuuuugh… That is why ESO will never be the game that I want.

Mirta.5029:

DarkSyze.8627:

Also: do you know Final Fantasy 14 have more players than Guild Wars 2? How old is Final Fantasy 14 compare to Guild Wars 2?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_massively_multiplayer_online_role-playing_games

not according to Wiki. Unless you have some newer information.

Not to say that your post is invalid, or that I’m disagreeing with you. It’s just that if you talk numbers you should give us citations as from where

It shows 2.5 mil users, though just little over month ago or so FFXIV celebrated having now 4 million users. Thus info in that wikipedia link is outdated.

http://blog.eu.playstation.com/2015/02/27/final-fantasy-xiv-racks-4-million-users-celebrates-free-log-week/

EDIT: had quoted wrong comment from Mirta, thus edit.

Geneaux.9547:

warbignime.4610:

So what is the point of this thread? bashing ESO? Eso done a lot of things right and wrong just like GW2, no point in bashing it. I think ESO is a decent game and a good alternative for GW2, so I play them both.
Things ESO done better than GW2::
*looting
*Skill system
*mount
*questing
*dungeon
Things GW2 done better than ESO
*pvp
*exploration
*combat
*graphic
No game is better than another, stop making thread like this.

-ESO’s looting system is terrible, period. Not even gonna bother arguing this.
-Skill system? So vague.
-GW2 doesn’t really “need” mounts, but it’d be awesome nonetheless.
-Questing is, in many respects to typical Elder Scrolls games, are outright terrible too. “Questing”(hearts and events) in GW2 are far more compelling for players.
- Dungeons? Haven’t tried ’em, but if they contain the same terrible loot competition scheme going on, its not gonna be something most people want to be apart of.

DarkSyze.8627:

Eso is still new mmo compare with Guild Wars 2: 3 years

Next time before attack new game: do research first. Also, by the time Eso is 3 years: you will see huge diference.

Being a new game(or new studio), is no get free pass(excuse) for terrible mechanics, experiences, etc. GW2 was an amazing game from its release and still is, 3 years later, today. While ESO still has the same dealbreaking problems since it was released, that should have been priority number one, even over new content.

DarkSyze.8627:

Also: do you know Final Fantasy 14 have more players than Guild Wars 2? How old is Final Fantasy 14 compare to Guild Wars 2?

Its amazing what Halo-level popularity can do. /s

But seriously what would anyone expect? Its Final Fantasy. We all know that IP name holds as much weight as the literal term itself.

DarkSyze.8627:

The lesson is: it is not about compare who is that and what is this to that? it is about having a vision for challenge and fun for your game include your players.

So we can’t criticize, when it’s needed?(Which is all the time.)

DarkSyze.8627:

Square Enix know that: that is why they redo Final Fantasy 14 because they now know how important player value challenge and fun. Including working with their player to find solution to problems and to give their players fun and good challenge things.

Square Enix took MAJOR heat in FFXIV’s original release. They, iirc, FIRED the original game director, and placed a new one. Now this director basically took a huge gamble and had the game almost rewritten from scratch. The ‘heat’ the first game took was molded ad reforged into the glorious miracle that became ARR:FFXIV.

DarkSyze.8627:

More evidence: how long did it take for Square Enix to make stealth (Ninja Prof.) challenge and fun in their game and for their players compare to Arena net Guild Wars 2 Thief Prof. stealth who offer No challenge, and offer no fun. I will not even talk about Final Fantasy pvp vs Guild Wars 2 pvp.

Define stealth. Because clearly these two games have different definitions in both design, art style, and pure combat mechanics.

DarkSyze.8627:

Square Enix is still learning to work with their players to make game fun and challenge: they are not perfect but trying hard

So Anet doesn’t listen to its players?

DarkSyze.8627:

Eso will soon be like Square Enix because Zenimax Online Studios is learning from mistake and improve from bad experience. Again, give ESO 3 years and see challenge and fun how Zenimax Online Studios will make it be

Part of what made FF:XIV’s success story was the sheer amount of resources and talent SE has at their fingertips. This is NOT something you just ‘do’. We should simply be thankful games like GW2, ESO, and FFXIV even exist, let alone what can be done to improve these games vs development time, bug patching, art team development, etc.

Fan boy level over 9000.

Dawdler.8521:

They just wanted a quick WoW clone with mouse control. So they just slapped it together on the SWTOR engine. Uuuuuuugh… That is why ESO will never be the game that I want.

SWTOR runs off the HeroEngine. ESO was not developed on that(in the end).

warbignime.4610:

Geneaux.9547:

warbignime.4610:

So what is the point of this thread? bashing ESO? Eso done a lot of things right and wrong just like GW2, no point in bashing it. I think ESO is a decent game and a good alternative for GW2, so I play them both.
Things ESO done better than GW2::
*looting
*Skill system
*mount
*questing
*dungeon
Things GW2 done better than ESO
*pvp
*exploration
*combat
*graphic
No game is better than another, stop making thread like this.

-ESO’s looting system is terrible, period. Not even gonna bother arguing this.
-Skill system? So vague.
-GW2 doesn’t really “need” mounts, but it’d be awesome nonetheless.
-Questing is, in many respects to typical Elder Scrolls games, are outright terrible too. “Questing”(hearts and events) in GW2 are far more compelling for players.
- Dungeons? Haven’t tried ’em, but if they contain the same terrible loot competition scheme going on, its not gonna be something most people want to be apart of.

DarkSyze.8627:

Eso is still new mmo compare with Guild Wars 2: 3 years

Next time before attack new game: do research first. Also, by the time Eso is 3 years: you will see huge diference.

Being a new game(or new studio), is no get free pass(excuse) for terrible mechanics, experiences, etc. GW2 was an amazing game from its release and still is, 3 years later, today. While ESO still has the same dealbreaking problems since it was released, that should have been priority number one, even over new content.

DarkSyze.8627:

Also: do you know Final Fantasy 14 have more players than Guild Wars 2? How old is Final Fantasy 14 compare to Guild Wars 2?

Its amazing what Halo-level popularity can do. /s

But seriously what would anyone expect? Its Final Fantasy. We all know that IP name holds as much weight as the literal term itself.

DarkSyze.8627:

The lesson is: it is not about compare who is that and what is this to that? it is about having a vision for challenge and fun for your game include your players.

So we can’t criticize, when it’s needed?(Which is all the time.)

DarkSyze.8627:

Square Enix know that: that is why they redo Final Fantasy 14 because they now know how important player value challenge and fun. Including working with their player to find solution to problems and to give their players fun and good challenge things.

Square Enix took MAJOR heat in FFXIV’s original release. They, iirc, FIRED the original game director, and placed a new one. Now this director basically took a huge gamble and had the game almost rewritten from scratch. The ‘heat’ the first game took was molded ad reforged into the glorious miracle that became ARR:FFXIV.

DarkSyze.8627:

More evidence: how long did it take for Square Enix to make stealth (Ninja Prof.) challenge and fun in their game and for their players compare to Arena net Guild Wars 2 Thief Prof. stealth who offer No challenge, and offer no fun. I will not even talk about Final Fantasy pvp vs Guild Wars 2 pvp.

Define stealth. Because clearly these two games have different definitions in both design, art style, and pure combat mechanics.

DarkSyze.8627:

Square Enix is still learning to work with their players to make game fun and challenge: they are not perfect but trying hard

So Anet doesn’t listen to its players?

DarkSyze.8627:

Eso will soon be like Square Enix because Zenimax Online Studios is learning from mistake and improve from bad experience. Again, give ESO 3 years and see challenge and fun how Zenimax Online Studios will make it be

Part of what made FF:XIV’s success story was the sheer amount of resources and talent SE has at their fingertips. This is NOT something you just ‘do’. We should simply be thankful games like GW2, ESO, and FFXIV even exist, let alone what can be done to improve these games vs development time, bug patching, art team development, etc.

Fan boy level over 9000.

kitten level is rising.

Vayne.8563:

sorudo.9054:

maybe because you’re not a TES player?
i love ESO, the lore is interesting, the quests are dynamic, the world is alive all the time.
it even has a battle system that can be used by your self, unlike GW2 it’s not all autopilot.

it’s still to each their own but to say it’s a bad game shows ignorance, clearly there are plenty of ppl saying the exact same thing about GW2 and do like ESO.
i like both, GW2 for the fantasy settings and fast battles and ESO for the lush world and self control of battles.

if anything, GW2 is less what GW1 is while ESO is more so, based on player skill not time and gear.

You may be right, but I just don’t think ESO is that popular. At this moment the Elder Scrolls Online reddit has 160 people online compared to the Guild Wars 2 reddit which has 737 Online. Now of course reddit doesn’t mean everything, but when you realize that this game JUST went free to play, that’s a shockingly low turnout for their reddit.

Looking at this Xfire page http://classic.xfire.com/cms/stats/ we see that Guild Wars 2 is at the moment in the top ten, where as ESO isn’t even in the Top 20.

It might not be a bad game, but there is plenty about it that is problematical. Because if they could have kept charging a sub, they would have.

It may be that when the game is out on consoles it’ll do better, but it hasn’t really captured the public imagination, and considering that it should have soared, piggybacking off Skyrim was it did, well, it’s just a kitten ed shame.

The game felt completely generic to me, and even though quests were all voiced, most of the ones in the early going were so mundane, I can’t imagine how anyone stayed around long enough to find out if the game got better. I know I couldn’t.

LOL…..

Dude, that’s Guild Wars 1. That chart is 6 years old. Heck, Warhammers been shutdown for 2.5 years. Hahahabahahab………

Yah, no wonder ESO ain’t on the chart. Bahahahahaba….

Geneaux.9547:

Dawdler.8521:

They just wanted a quick WoW clone with mouse control. So they just slapped it together on the SWTOR engine. Uuuuuuugh… That is why ESO will never be the game that I want.

SWTOR runs off the HeroEngine. ESO was not developed on that(in the end).

Yeah, that’s what they said in 2012. When the game was released, it said “Powered by Hero Engine” in big letters. Either way, they managed to make it rather generic with no standout features.

When I was doing the ESO beta, I did some bug reporting, but it was clear that changes and suggestions were some something they were going to file away to be looked at later.
I had concerns about the loot management system being clunky (instanced, storage, crafting, selling). GW2 players got what I meant, while others used to WoW, found it just fine.
The biggest flaw I found with the game is that as a much as I love the Elder Scrolls franchise, I despised how ESO handled it. I understand that making a single player experience in a multiplayer game is difficult, but there isn’t enough encouragement to play socially. Other players just seem like annoying environmental obstacles, and the game rewards you for it.
They used a lot of dated concepts and executed many poorly. There are many that will enjoy that in the game, or fall over themselves because it has mounts, but it fell flat for me then and as my spouse still plays on occasion, they haven’t changed enough to bring me back as more than a casual observer,

Dawdler.8521:

Geneaux.9547:

Dawdler.8521:

They just wanted a quick WoW clone with mouse control. So they just slapped it together on the SWTOR engine. Uuuuuuugh… That is why ESO will never be the game that I want.

SWTOR runs off the HeroEngine. ESO was not developed on that(in the end).

Yeah, that’s what they said in 2012. When the game was released, it said “Powered by Hero Engine” in big letters. Either way, they managed to make it rather generic with no standout features.

Agreed.